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#302 Apr 01 2013 at 9:11 AM Rating: Default
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catwho wrote:
In this whole P2P vs F2P argument I completely forgot I was Legacy. Smiley: laugh I was totally prepared to pay $15 a month, in fact.

Legacy vs non Legacy has no bearing on my preference. SE gets $18 a month for my FFXI account already. I've paid that fee month in and month out because it's the cheapest entertainment value I can get outside of piracy.


Some people are more frugal. Just because you are willing to pay $18 monthly for a Final Fantasy game doesn't mean it's worth it.
#303 Apr 01 2013 at 9:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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Killua125 wrote:
catwho wrote:
In this whole P2P vs F2P argument I completely forgot I was Legacy. Smiley: laugh I was totally prepared to pay $15 a month, in fact.

Legacy vs non Legacy has no bearing on my preference. SE gets $18 a month for my FFXI account already. I've paid that fee month in and month out because it's the cheapest entertainment value I can get outside of piracy.


Some people are more frugal. Just because you are willing to pay $18 monthly for a Final Fantasy game doesn't mean it's worth it.


Sure it is. I know this is difficult for you to understand, but some people are genuinely excited for this game and it only has to be worth it to them to get their money. Just because you don't think it's worth it doesn't mean others agree with you.
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#304 Apr 01 2013 at 9:22 AM Rating: Default
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That's kind of my point. It's great if he wants to spend $18 a month on a game, but a lot of people won't.

He's in a position where he doesn't even know or care how much his subscription is going to cost. It could cost $10 or $18 and he wouldn't even care or notice.

Judging from his previous posts, he was even paying the subscription fee when he was not playing (I guess he forgot about it?) so I get the sense that maybe money doesn't mean that much to him.

For a lot of people, FFXIV will have to be really great if it wants $13 a month...

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 11:25am by Killua125
#305 Apr 01 2013 at 9:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Catwho is a girl, she's said it several times.

What you don't know is how many people will and won't. Do you have any hard facts to back your scientific "a lot of people" claim"? They don't need 10 million subs to be successful. Anything at this point is speculation at best, you really have no idea how many people are going to play and subscribe. Only time will tell. You seem to want to write the game off before it's even launched.
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#306 Apr 01 2013 at 9:37 AM Rating: Default
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So am I, but I don't feel the need to correct people over it. Your gender doesn't really even matter online.

For some people it will be worth it, for some people it won't.

I was saying that for someone like catwho who paid for the game while she was not even playing it, and was not sure if her FFXIV: ARR is going to cost $10 or $15, maybe ARR doesn't need to do much to be 'worth' a monthly fee, for her.

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 11:39am by Killua125
#307 Apr 01 2013 at 9:42 AM Rating: Good
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You know, I'm normally an amazingly tolerant person, but deliberately getting my gender pronoun wrong is one of the few things that really sticks in my craw. Smiley: mad

Respect has to be earned online. Deliberately being rude to someone is not a good way to go about earning it.
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#308 Apr 01 2013 at 9:43 AM Rating: Default
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I didn't do it deliberately. I honestly just don't have a very good memory.

My friends who like My Little Pony are all men (lol) so maybe that's why I got confused.
#309 Apr 01 2013 at 9:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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Killua125 wrote:
Some people are more frugal. Just because you are willing to pay $18 monthly for a Final Fantasy game doesn't mean it's worth it.


"It's not worth something because you say it is, it's worth nothing because I say it is!"
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#310 Apr 01 2013 at 9:57 AM Rating: Default
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I didn't say that, but for some people, every dollar counts, every dollar is budgeted and matters.

If you don't care whether the game is $10, $15, or $18, I can see why you would be totally fine with a subscription model over a free-to-play model.

For some people, the difference between free and subscription is a big deal to them (whether they're short on money or simply frugal; don't be judgemental), and the option to pay as much as you want versus a forced flat fee may be the deciding factor in whether they gave this game a moment of their time.

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 11:58am by Killua125
#311 Apr 01 2013 at 9:59 AM Rating: Good
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If $20 a month entertainment budget is a big deal, you're heading to live in your parent's basement soon enough.
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#312 Apr 01 2013 at 10:05 AM Rating: Default
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lolgaxe wrote:
If $20 a month entertainment budget is a big deal, you're heading to live in your parent's basement soon enough.


People who are financially successful generally are of the opinion that every dollar counts, and considering my social life, Final Fantasy will only account for a small portion of my monthly entertainment...

You're paying monthly for ZAM, so something tells me you don't really understand the importance of money.

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 12:06pm by Killua125
#313 Apr 01 2013 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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Killua125 wrote:
You're paying monthly for ZAM, so something tells me you don't really understand the importance of money. (If you want to act condescending, I can do it also)
Says the dude crying about a $20 a month entertainment budget. You're right though, you can act condescending. But you're not much of an actor. Smiley: frown
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#314 Apr 01 2013 at 10:12 AM Rating: Good
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Killua125 wrote:
... for some people, every dollar counts, every dollar is budgeted and matters.


If that's someone's situation, he or she should be investing money in better ways than MMORPGs (and a computer on which to play them). >_>
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#315 Apr 01 2013 at 10:15 AM Rating: Default
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lolgaxe wrote:
Killua125 wrote:
You're paying monthly for ZAM, so something tells me you don't really understand the importance of money. (If you want to act condescending, I can do it also)
Says the dude crying about a $20 a month entertainment budget. You're right though, you can act condescending. But you're not much of an actor. Smiley: frown


Final Fantasy would not be my entire entertainment budget.

KaneKitty wrote:
Killua125 wrote:
... for some people, every dollar counts, every dollar is budgeted and matters.


If that's someone's situation, he or she should be investing money in better ways than MMORPGs (and a computer on which to play them). >_>


It's not so much a matter of that. I'm not talking about people who are in a situation that the difference between $10 and $20 will break them. Those people likely shouldn't even be wasting any time or money on MMORPGs.

I'm just making the point that some people are frugal/careful about how they spend their money... that doesn't make them poor, it makes them smart.

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 12:18pm by Killua125
#316 Apr 01 2013 at 10:18 AM Rating: Decent
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Killua125 wrote:
Final Fantasy would not be my entire entertainment budget.
Too expensive? Maybe buckle down, work hard, and your boss at McDonalds will notice and give you a raise.
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#317 Apr 01 2013 at 10:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm just making the point that some people are frugal/careful about how they spend their money... that doesn't make them poor, it makes them smart.


How does only playing games that are free make you smarter than someone who pays to play a different game? Or am I missing something?
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#318Killua125, Posted: Apr 01 2013 at 11:00 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I don't work at McDonalds, and I would say that your posts are unnecessarily vile. I guess your monthly subscription here just gives you license to be an ******* with no repercussions, and I don't want to be a member of a "pay-to-troll" forum model.
#319 Apr 01 2013 at 11:03 AM Rating: Good
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Killua125 wrote:
I don't work at McDonalds, and I would say that your posts are unnecessarily vile.
So people that work at McDonalds are vile now? That's a bit harsh.
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#320 Apr 01 2013 at 11:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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I got the feeling, and correct me if i am wrong that the only reason you say don't believe ARR is worth the P2P is because of 1.0 right?

Because seriously from the info at my hand i don't see a reason why they shouldn't try a P2P model.

But then again someone might say i am gullible, but we will see i guess.
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#321 Apr 01 2013 at 11:36 AM Rating: Excellent
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Killua125 wrote:
Thayos wrote:
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I'm just making the point that some people are frugal/careful about how they spend their money... that doesn't make them poor, it makes them smart.


How does only playing games that are free make you smarter than someone who pays to play a different game? Or am I missing something?


I didn't say that. I have paid plenty of subscriptions (for MMORPGs and other services) over the years.

I think someone who makes sure something is up to par and worth their money before spending is smart, though.

So far I'm not sure if ARR is worth a subscription versus free-to-play, but I'm reserving judgement until the later phases of the beta and stuff.

lolgaxe wrote:
Killua125 wrote:
Final Fantasy would not be my entire entertainment budget.
Too expensive? Maybe buckle down, work hard, and your boss at McDonalds will notice and give you a raise.


I don't work at McDonalds, and I would say that your posts are unnecessarily vile. I guess your monthly subscription here just gives you license to be an @#%^ with no repercussions, and I don't want to be a member of a "pay-to-troll" forum model.


People can troll for free too I see.

I know having your argument pulled apart mercilessly hurts, but welcome to the internet. lolgaxe hasn't done anything ban worthy yet.
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Guide to Setting Up Mumble on a Raspberry Pi
#322 Apr 01 2013 at 1:16 PM Rating: Good
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And again I find myself in need of a :popcorn: emoticon...

Edit: Smiley: popcorn

I had been forgetting the brackets this whole time...

Edited, Apr 1st 2013 3:25pm by KaneKitty
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#323 Apr 01 2013 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Smiley: popcorn
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#324 Apr 01 2013 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Theonehio wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
DamienSScott wrote:
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I wouldn't exactly call F2P a cash grab. That term implies that you're trying to generate a quick profit and sacrificing the longevity of the product to do so. Many F2P models do generate profit quickly yes, but that also sets them up in a better position to funnel some of that profit back into the game and I would argue that this would bolster the sustained profit through having more funds to develop and implement more content. Seems more like a matter of player preference to me.


The problem is.. other than League of Legends no F2P game pumps out content anywhere near as fast as WoW. Pretty much every small F2P game is a cash grab with little content and a pay to win attitude. With as little as these companies comparatively spent on game development they probably make great profit. However you never see any content updates, or if you do it's after 3-5 years. I played a blatant WoW-clone called Fiesta off and on for 3+ years and they never released anything new other than cash shop garbage. Guild Wars 2 has been out for 6+ months and still hasn't released any new content either. This is a game where you could get to max level in a week or less with no end game content. F2P looks nice on paper but it just doesn't work that way.


When did WoW go F2P? The comparison doesn't make sense because WoW charges more than 10 million people a subscription fee. With that kind of income it's easy to see how they are able to manufacture so much content.


Now the question is..how much of that content is actually GOOD content?


Better than anything SE has ever released for either XI or XIV.
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#325 Apr 01 2013 at 2:19 PM Rating: Good
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Wow has great content, if you can get past the graphics anyway. I couldn't. I just couldn't get past the deliberate avoidance of realism in favor of the cartoony style. I deleted my gnome before I ever left the free trial.

I went walking in the botanical gardens with my husband today. Something about the feeling of the woods was really familiar, like it was deja vu. Then I took another look around, and realized that it looked exactly how they've redone the Shroud. I literally stopped in my tracks and just stood there in wonder, that they did such a damn good job replicating a forest in a video game that I got deja vu from standing in the actual location it was modeled off (or a forest just like it.)

***** content, I want a nice place I can take a virtual picnic lunch and enjoy the view sometimes Smiley: lol FFXI had quite a few amazing spots like that, like the waterfall in Misareaux Coast, or Empyreal Paradox.
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#326 Apr 01 2013 at 3:44 PM Rating: Good
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I guess it is just a really hard concept to grasp, but if people don't think the game will be worth paying for then they don't have to pay for it. There is plenty of other stuff out there to play/do. If someone has enough money to pay for DSL+ then they have enough money to pay for an MMO each month. If they don't want to pay for one they don't have to. There are 100s of games out there that they can play online for free. There are also more than enough people to sustain FFXIV in a subscription model in fans alone so long as the game doesn't suck. If people feel like the game is worth playing then they will freaking pay for it. The only people that might not be able to afford it are younger kids. Arguing over $15 is pointless as all one would have to do is not go out to eat 2-3 times a month to save enough to pay for it. If you're hurting that much for cash then you probably shouldn't be paying for the internet, let alone the game.

Just because some people don't want to pay for a game doesn't mean that this one has to cater to them.

Also THIS GAME IS NOT GOING TO BE F2P!!!!! RAWRGLFLARGENBLURFGLURG!! so what the farque does it matter anyway...

oh yeah... trolling hurdur....
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