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XP parties and leveling in generalFollow

#1 Aug 01 2013 at 11:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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I was thinking about my experiences during Phase 3 and was curious how the community feels about XP parties and leveling in general. My first taste of FFXIV was Phase 3 so with that being stated for the record; these are my experiences.

It seems that every starting city offered enough quests to level at least one class beyond the early levels. However upon subsequent classes, the ability to level off quests was less feasible. Fates were a great way to level from my experiences though. Dungeons and Guildeves/hests were also very useful in the leveling process. I started to see that the bonus to those small parties would only last one session so repeat playthoughs didn't yield the same results. So I'm curious, how do you guys think we'll level to lv50 once the game goes live?

Will we do Guildeves in parties? SE will add more and more missions? Will group parties chain off random mobs? I'm not sure honestly so I'm hoping for feedback.
#2 Aug 01 2013 at 11:36 AM Rating: Excellent
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Don't forget hunting log/leves/GC leves also. The hunting log actually rewards a pretty sizable amount of XP if you complete it on-level.

I think the majority of players will level 1-15 with FATEs, hunting log, and leves, then add in dungeons. Guildhests are great, but only the first time through, so I plan to save them for secondary or tertiary classes.

I doubt there will be many XP parties, since there isn't any bonus for grouping up and it actually hurts your XP gain outside of dungeons, FATEs, and behest. However, grouping for FATE spam was actually quite enjoyable when I tried it in beta, so that is an alternative as well.

Edited, Aug 1st 2013 1:38pm by BartelX
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#3 Aug 01 2013 at 11:40 AM Rating: Excellent
Step 1: queue up in duty finder for a dungeon.

Step 2: find FATES to do.

Step 3: accept duty finder dungeon invite.

Step 4: beat dungeon, get exp and gear.

Rinse and repeat!
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#4 Aug 01 2013 at 12:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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Grouping for Guildleves is actually really fun, and also lucrative if you crank the difficulty to max.
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#5 Aug 01 2013 at 12:42 PM Rating: Good
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My wife, son, and I PTed at low levels and it was very difficult. We actually found it easier to "solo" as a group. Many mobs that don't link when solo, will link as a party. It's a shame, we like being in a party. We can see each other on the map and there were other benefits, too.
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#6 Aug 01 2013 at 1:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'd say the first two sections of BartelX's assessment are spot on. Not only do you have the linking change as AngusX pointed out, but (when I tried) you cannot go into solo instances in a party. So depending on your pacing, you may end up having to disband and reform groups multiple times in succession.

That being said, you will definitely want to do some things as a group, as people have mentioned. In particular, completing leves with leve-linking (Both you and the initiator have the leve) and leve-sharing (you do not have the leve) is significantly more efficient as a group, even with linked groups being pulled. It's a lot less risky to turn up the difficulty and squeeze out more XP from the leve while keeping the kill chain going. However, that does mean that it's probably better to do them at specific levels than others. Also, if a coffer pops, as far as I've seen, everyone gets their own loot table for it.
#7 Aug 01 2013 at 6:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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AngusX wrote:
My wife, son, and I PTed at low levels and it was very difficult. We actually found it easier to "solo" as a group. Many mobs that don't link when solo, will link as a party. It's a shame, we like being in a party. We can see each other on the map and there were other benefits, too.

The linking behavior in a party appears to be tied to the level of the mob you're attacking. You only get adds if you attack a mob that's the same level as you when in a party. From what I understand, if you attack a mob that's higher level than you, then you won't get any adds. The game is trying to scale the level of challenge to the size of your party.
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#8 Aug 01 2013 at 6:47 PM Rating: Good
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svlyons wrote:
AngusX wrote:
My wife, son, and I PTed at low levels and it was very difficult. We actually found it easier to "solo" as a group. Many mobs that don't link when solo, will link as a party. It's a shame, we like being in a party. We can see each other on the map and there were other benefits, too.

The linking behavior in a party appears to be tied to the level of the mob you're attacking. You only get adds if you attack a mob that's the same level as you when in a party. From what I understand, if you attack a mob that's higher level than you, then you won't get any adds. The game is trying to scale the level of challenge to the size of your party.


That's good to know. I did experience the same linking AngusX did, but admittedly the group was higher level than the stuff we were clearing out.
#9 Aug 01 2013 at 9:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks for the wonderful responses so far. This really gives me a good idea of what to expect in Phase 4 and beyond. I'm glad there are so many avenues to level in FFXIV ARR.
#10 Aug 02 2013 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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BartelX wrote:


I doubt there will be many XP parties, since there isn't any bonus for grouping up and it actually hurts your XP gain outside of dungeons, FATEs, and behest.

Edited, Aug 1st 2013 1:38pm by BartelX



Let me ge tthis right. Are you are saying is that I can solo a *Weak* monster and receive the same experience I would get if I formed a party of six and battled an *Incredibly Tough* Mob (or the equivalent)? Is the XP penalty so much that it favors soloing, or is the XP so much better in dungeons, FATEs, and behest that these are going to default as the optimum way to party?
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#11 Aug 02 2013 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
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Valkayree wrote:
BartelX wrote:


I doubt there will be many XP parties, since there isn't any bonus for grouping up and it actually hurts your XP gain outside of dungeons, FATEs, and behest.

Edited, Aug 1st 2013 1:38pm by BartelX



Let me ge tthis right. Are you are saying is that I can solo a *Weak* monster and receive the same experience I would get if I formed a party of six and battled an *Incredibly Tough* Mob (or the equivalent)? Is the XP penalty so much that it favors soloing, or is the XP so much better in dungeons, FATEs, and behest that these are going to default as the optimum way to party?


Unfortunately from what I saw in phase 3, yes. Also, small group is 4, not 6. I suppose you could try an 8 man group, but I don't think it would be any different. When I did a 4-man group and tried an XP party on mobs 4-5 levels above us, it just wasn't worth it. We could kill the stuff at an ok rate, but the XP was incredibly lackluster compared to soloing.
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#12 Aug 02 2013 at 9:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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BartelX wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
BartelX wrote:


I doubt there will be many XP parties, since there isn't any bonus for grouping up and it actually hurts your XP gain outside of dungeons, FATEs, and behest.

Edited, Aug 1st 2013 1:38pm by BartelX



Let me ge tthis right. Are you are saying is that I can solo a *Weak* monster and receive the same experience I would get if I formed a party of six and battled an *Incredibly Tough* Mob (or the equivalent)? Is the XP penalty so much that it favors soloing, or is the XP so much better in dungeons, FATEs, and behest that these are going to default as the optimum way to party?


Unfortunately from what I saw in phase 3, yes. Also, small group is 4, not 6. I suppose you could try an 8 man group, but I don't think it would be any different. When I did a 4-man group and tried an XP party on mobs 4-5 levels above us, it just wasn't worth it. We could kill the stuff at an ok rate, but the XP was incredibly lackluster compared to soloing.


Hmm, well I like it, because I like to solo in general, but I see now why that fellow on Eorzea Reborn is fuming and his supporters are calling the game a MSORPG (Massively SinglePlayer Online RPG). Hard to tell why they are mad when all the experience I have is 6 years trying to find a party to beat the Promyvions in FFXI.
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#13 Aug 02 2013 at 9:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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Probably a little bit of both.

Whether some like the opinion or not, open world grinding is an RMT friendly activity. Give them a camp with plenty of non-aggro mobs and a good bot could go indefinitely. If a bit over-leveled but still EXP friendly, aggro/linking might not even be a concern. Pair this with the inevitable chat log parsing and you could potentially see full parties functioning solely off the input of one player, which is something you'll probably see the "legit" multi-boxers using, too. Since this can probably never be stopped, the end result is making open world mobs less lucrative on the EXP front.

On the other hand, it's harder to automate the more varied objectives of quests or FATEs. My primary concern is once quests dry up for people on their xth job. I tried doing what FATEs I could in beta, but my big issues was actually getting to them before they'd ended. Possibly an overcrowding issue with inappropriate scaling, but hard to say. I know I'll be annoyed if the "best" way to EXP means dungeon grinding because it'll also mean the best level appropriate gear, too. Just strikes me as a bit lop-sided and partially trivializing questing since EXP and loot might not compare. Even with the duty finder, waiting in queue (and most likely as a DPS job) can also mean lost or inefficiently spent time for the player.

Despite my concerns, I do want to get a few jobs under my belt come launch before giving a final say on the design choice.
#14 Aug 02 2013 at 9:50 AM Rating: Good
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Seriha wrote:
Probably a little bit of both.

Whether some like the opinion or not, open world grinding is an RMT friendly activity. Give them a camp with plenty of non-aggro mobs and a good bot could go indefinitely. If a bit over-leveled but still EXP friendly, aggro/linking might not even be a concern. Pair this with the inevitable chat log parsing and you could potentially see full parties functioning solely off the input of one player, which is something you'll probably see the "legit" multi-boxers using, too. Since this can probably never be stopped, the end result is making open world mobs less lucrative on the EXP front.

On the other hand, it's harder to automate the more varied objectives of quests or FATEs. My primary concern is once quests dry up for people on their xth job. I tried doing what FATEs I could in beta, but my big issues was actually getting to them before they'd ended. Possibly an overcrowding issue with inappropriate scaling, but hard to say. I know I'll be annoyed if the "best" way to EXP means dungeon grinding because it'll also mean the best level appropriate gear, too. Just strikes me as a bit lop-sided and partially trivializing questing since EXP and loot might not compare. Even with the duty finder, waiting in queue (and most likely as a DPS job) can also mean lost or inefficiently spent time for the player.

Despite my concerns, I do want to get a few jobs under my belt come launch before giving a final say on the design choice.


Good post.
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#15 Aug 02 2013 at 9:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
Hmm, well I like it, because I like to solo in general, but I see now why that fellow on Eorzea Reborn is fuming and his supporters are calling the game a MSORPG (Massively SinglePlayer Online RPG). Hard to tell why they are mad when all the experience I have is 6 years trying to find a party to beat the Promyvions in FFXI.


While I'm a bit upset at not having open world XP parties, the guy on Eorzea Reborn couldn't be farther from the truth. It it absolutely required to group up for dungeons, behests, and many story quests such as primals/boss fights. You can't even advance the storyline or unlock a chocobo without grouping up for 3 dungeons and the Ifrit battle. The game is actually very party-centric once you hit 15+. The first 15 levels are almost all solo, but I actually think that's a good thing. Learn a bit about your class, what your skills do, and how to function (through the class and storyline quests which will definitely hone your skills), then start the group-based content to further progress. I'm actually a big fan of the way it's set up.
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#16 Aug 02 2013 at 9:58 AM Rating: Good
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Seriha wrote:
Probably a little bit of both.

Whether some like the opinion or not, open world grinding is an RMT friendly activity. Give them a camp with plenty of non-aggro mobs and a good bot could go indefinitely. If a bit over-leveled but still EXP friendly, aggro/linking might not even be a concern. Pair this with the inevitable chat log parsing and you could potentially see full parties functioning solely off the input of one player, which is something you'll probably see the "legit" multi-boxers using, too. Since this can probably never be stopped, the end result is making open world mobs less lucrative on the EXP front.

On the other hand, it's harder to automate the more varied objectives of quests or FATEs. My primary concern is once quests dry up for people on their xth job. I tried doing what FATEs I could in beta, but my big issues was actually getting to them before they'd ended. Possibly an overcrowding issue with inappropriate scaling, but hard to say. I know I'll be annoyed if the "best" way to EXP means dungeon grinding because it'll also mean the best level appropriate gear, too. Just strikes me as a bit lop-sided and partially trivializing questing since EXP and loot might not compare. Even with the duty finder, waiting in queue (and most likely as a DPS job) can also mean lost or inefficiently spent time for the player.

Despite my concerns, I do want to get a few jobs under my belt come launch before giving a final say on the design choice.


FATEs require a little bit of recognition as well to make the most of them. For example, if I see multiple FATEs up near Quarrymill and they are 1) One at the Redbelly (?) bandit hideout, 2) One near the goblin camp, and 3) One other one near the Coeurl poacher camp, I'm skipping #2 and heading straight to 3 if lower level and straight to 1 if higher level. Why? Because I know both 1 and 3 are part of a chain of FATEs, so even if I miss one, I can still make the next one as long as the one I'm running towards is not the very last one.

#17 Aug 02 2013 at 10:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, there is the FATE chain element. I'd only mucked about in Gridania since I didn't want to level too much due to P3 wipe, and of the ones I bumped into, they all seemed to be independent. It's possible a couple had early steps I missed for whatever reason, though.
#18 Aug 02 2013 at 11:09 AM Rating: Excellent
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BartelX wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
Hmm, well I like it, because I like to solo in general, but I see now why that fellow on Eorzea Reborn is fuming and his supporters are calling the game a MSORPG (Massively SinglePlayer Online RPG). Hard to tell why they are mad when all the experience I have is 6 years trying to find a party to beat the Promyvions in FFXI.


While I'm a bit upset at not having open world XP parties, the guy on Eorzea Reborn couldn't be farther from the truth. It it absolutely required to group up for dungeons, behests, and many story quests such as primals/boss fights. You can't even advance the storyline or unlock a chocobo without grouping up for 3 dungeons and the Ifrit battle. The game is actually very party-centric once you hit 15+. The first 15 levels are almost all solo, but I actually think that's a good thing. Learn a bit about your class, what your skills do, and how to function (through the class and storyline quests which will definitely hone your skills), then start the group-based content to further progress. I'm actually a big fan of the way it's set up.


Me too, wholeheartedly. I think they did a great job with duty finder. From what I am reading, the supporters of the old system feel that it eliminates a sense of community by auto seeking parties across all servers. Those are the same folks that craved the six person mob pulling festivals. I love it because I will never have to wait agan and shout "Party <Promyvion> <Do you need it?>" in the equivalent of Jeuno ever again.
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#19 Aug 02 2013 at 12:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Valkayree wrote:
BartelX wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
Hmm, well I like it, because I like to solo in general, but I see now why that fellow on Eorzea Reborn is fuming and his supporters are calling the game a MSORPG (Massively SinglePlayer Online RPG). Hard to tell why they are mad when all the experience I have is 6 years trying to find a party to beat the Promyvions in FFXI.


While I'm a bit upset at not having open world XP parties, the guy on Eorzea Reborn couldn't be farther from the truth. It it absolutely required to group up for dungeons, behests, and many story quests such as primals/boss fights. You can't even advance the storyline or unlock a chocobo without grouping up for 3 dungeons and the Ifrit battle. The game is actually very party-centric once you hit 15+. The first 15 levels are almost all solo, but I actually think that's a good thing. Learn a bit about your class, what your skills do, and how to function (through the class and storyline quests which will definitely hone your skills), then start the group-based content to further progress. I'm actually a big fan of the way it's set up.


Me too, wholeheartedly. I think they did a great job with duty finder. From what I am reading, the supporters of the old system feel that it eliminates a sense of community by auto seeking parties across all servers. Those are the same folks that craved the six person mob pulling festivals. I love it because I will never have to wait agan and shout "Party <Promyvion> <Do you need it?>" in the equivalent of Jeuno ever again.


Let's face it, the community in FFXI wasn't based on grinding parties, it was the content. Static groups and the like. While I did meet people in FFXI through parties that wasn't really how I got to know a bunch of people. The true "community" in my opinion was the endgame community.

I love the duty finder, lets me grab a few friends and if we need a healer just que up and wait for one, we get our party, I play with friends and I don't wait all day shouting for something. And it allows me to continue doing stuff without "searching" for a party.

I foresee me using dungeons to level, that is what I did in WOW and SWTOR. With taking breaks to do story content when I get bored of dungeons and hitting the FATES while running around for that.
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#20 Aug 02 2013 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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Techsupport wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
BartelX wrote:
Valkayree wrote:
Hmm, well I like it, because I like to solo in general, but I see now why that fellow on Eorzea Reborn is fuming and his supporters are calling the game a MSORPG (Massively SinglePlayer Online RPG). Hard to tell why they are mad when all the experience I have is 6 years trying to find a party to beat the Promyvions in FFXI.


While I'm a bit upset at not having open world XP parties, the guy on Eorzea Reborn couldn't be farther from the truth. It it absolutely required to group up for dungeons, behests, and many story quests such as primals/boss fights. You can't even advance the storyline or unlock a chocobo without grouping up for 3 dungeons and the Ifrit battle. The game is actually very party-centric once you hit 15+. The first 15 levels are almost all solo, but I actually think that's a good thing. Learn a bit about your class, what your skills do, and how to function (through the class and storyline quests which will definitely hone your skills), then start the group-based content to further progress. I'm actually a big fan of the way it's set up.


Me too, wholeheartedly. I think they did a great job with duty finder. From what I am reading, the supporters of the old system feel that it eliminates a sense of community by auto seeking parties across all servers. Those are the same folks that craved the six person mob pulling festivals. I love it because I will never have to wait agan and shout "Party <Promyvion> <Do you need it?>" in the equivalent of Jeuno ever again.


Let's face it, the community in FFXI wasn't based on grinding parties, it was the content. Static groups and the like. While I did meet people in FFXI through parties that wasn't really how I got to know a bunch of people. The true "community" in my opinion was the endgame community.

I love the duty finder, lets me grab a few friends and if we need a healer just que up and wait for one, we get our party, I play with friends and I don't wait all day shouting for something. And it allows me to continue doing stuff without "searching" for a party.

I foresee me using dungeons to level, that is what I did in WOW and SWTOR. With taking breaks to do story content when I get bored of dungeons and hitting the FATES while running around for that.



Right on, I couldn't agree more. I guess because I started on the 360 and tried to level blue mage as my first main to 75 I got frustrated in my mid 60s and quit. I never got to end game. All my friends had quit or were on end game by then and I couldn't level to save my life. I ended up waiting all day then just about to log off when I would get a /tell to play with a party that was starting at 1am. I wold hop on the chocobo and run all the way out there, then be waiting 30 minutes for everyone to arrive (and to get the guy who alwasy inevitably gets lost). We would start and 30 minutes in would fall asleep and get booted. I love how duty finder just throws everyone into the action.

Edited, Aug 2nd 2013 3:25pm by Valkayree
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#21 Aug 02 2013 at 2:36 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, it really sucked when you finally formed a party then you had to wait for everyone to get there, get situated, etc. And there wasn't really enough solo content to get you by when you were waiting for a party. I got my NIN, WAR and BLM up but after that just refused to level anything unless it was with friends.

I personally think they did a great job of allowing you to level AND keep a great story going. that way you can enjoy the world of FF and still get to endgame. And it looks like they will keep the story going with endgame content even better than FFXI had.
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#22 Aug 05 2013 at 5:49 AM Rating: Default
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That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.
#23 Aug 05 2013 at 6:09 AM Rating: Good
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Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


I'm just curious, what about his post turned you off from the game? I ask, because FFXIV is completely different from XI, which is the point everyone is making. You don't HAVE to wait for a static party. You can queue in the dungeon finder, and do any content at any time. You don't have to wait for anything. Yes, there will be an endgame, but it's not going to be like FFXI. It won't be "elitist" only mentality. Half the endgame won't revolve around waiting 24-72 hours for a mob to spawn and then praying your LS somehow gets claim over the 50-100 botters. There is an open beta coming. I'd encourage you to try that out before writing the game off, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the results.
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#24 Aug 05 2013 at 8:05 AM Rating: Good
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BartelX wrote:
Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


I'm just curious, what about his post turned you off from the game? I ask, because FFXIV is completely different from XI, which is the point everyone is making. You don't HAVE to wait for a static party. You can queue in the dungeon finder, and do any content at any time. You don't have to wait for anything. Yes, there will be an endgame, but it's not going to be like FFXI. It won't be "elitist" only mentality. Half the endgame won't revolve around waiting 24-72 hours for a mob to spawn and then praying your LS somehow gets claim over the 50-100 botters. There is an open beta coming. I'd encourage you to try that out before writing the game off, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the results.


It's probably someone with bad social experiences in FFXI who has misread the post.
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#25 Aug 05 2013 at 8:31 AM Rating: Good
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Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


wait, you're deciding not to try the game based on a stranger's dubious ZAM post? I mean, it doesn't matter to me one way or the other, I just find it really odd.
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#26 Aug 05 2013 at 11:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


Drama is all a human element, has nothing to do with the game.
#27 Aug 05 2013 at 11:35 AM Rating: Good
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As more of a generalization, MMO players treating these games as endgame is where the game begins can be perceived as an issue. If a given game's dev embraces this philosophy, then the leveling experience can, in turn, wind up being quite shallow. Socially, there's also the trickle down factor where people blankly assume that what does or doesn't work at endgame levels will or will not work prior. There's also a sect that refuses to party with first-timers to content as it might mean actually having to explain something or slowing their precious speed runs down by a couple minutes. Essentially, it's the toxic elements of elitist mentalities that can and do worsen these communities if left unchecked or even encouraged by game mechanics.

From my perspective of XIV, the first time up and a little bit after shouldn't be too much of an issue on non-legacy servers while people are still feeling things out. You'll still have the sheepish can't-think-for-themselves parroting some guide/video they saw on the net somewhere and treat is gospel, but there's honestly not much you can do to screen that in the PUG environment. And if SE embraces the philosophy that there should be no singular path to equal progression, then hopefully people won't have to tolerate working with grating personalities only looking out for themselves within the forced group sphere. Unfortunately, I still worry about how people will take to leveling their second+ jobs due to the first run of quests being exhausted. Things may prove more lenient than the beta did, but that's pretty much wait and see status for me.
#28 Aug 05 2013 at 1:55 PM Rating: Good
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Seriha wrote:


From my perspective of XIV, the first time up and a little bit after shouldn't be too much of an issue on non-legacy servers while people are still feeling things out. You'll still have the sheepish can't-think-for-themselves parroting some guide/video they saw on the net somewhere and treat is gospel, but there's honestly not much you can do to screen that in the PUG environment. And if SE embraces the philosophy that there should be no singular path to equal progression, then hopefully people won't have to tolerate working with grating personalities only looking out for themselves within the forced group sphere. Unfortunately, I still worry about how people will take to leveling their second+ jobs due to the first run of quests being exhausted. Things may prove more lenient than the beta did, but that's pretty much wait and see status for me.


Exactly. Do your own thing. It builds character and gives a greater appreciation as to what it took to get to where you are. There will always be those people who want to bring you down because you aren't moving along with the status quo, but hey, who is to say that what they do is "normal" anyway. To me, individualism is in the majority, and those who follow the crowd to keep up with the Joneses, well, have fun bumping elbows in that line full of greedy stinky sardines. I'll just smile from outside the dogpile.
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#29 Aug 05 2013 at 6:48 PM Rating: Good
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BartelX wrote:
Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


I'm just curious, what about his post turned you off from the game? I ask, because FFXIV is completely different from XI, which is the point everyone is making. You don't HAVE to wait for a static party. You can queue in the dungeon finder, and do any content at any time. You don't have to wait for anything. Yes, there will be an endgame, but it's not going to be like FFXI. It won't be "elitist" only mentality. Half the endgame won't revolve around waiting 24-72 hours for a mob to spawn and then praying your LS somehow gets claim over the 50-100 botters. There is an open beta coming. I'd encourage you to try that out before writing the game off, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the results.


Why would you even bother responding to his post. Kind of reminds me of when my wife says "do I look fat in these pants....", the poster is just seeking attention.

"Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you." Really? That's dramatic even for the internet LOL

We all had great experiences leveling and those profoundly impacted the people we played with endgame. I went endgame but never to the extent I wanted, but I don't whine about it on the internet.

The fact remains that every MMO has to be tailored to endgame content, you can only spend so much time leveling and questing. Endgame is basically like leveling, it is a continuation of the story through expansions, nothing more. You have to get a good group of friends in this type of game, it is an MMO after all.

Now the FFXI endgame was like that, its just the camping of NM's and that crap that ruined it. Most endgame LS's weren't even endgame per se, that were camping and doing events that were LS based. That pert is me being bitter because my schedule would never permit me to camp Faf and the likes, I just did Sky, Sea etc.
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#30 Aug 06 2013 at 6:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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Techsupport wrote:
BartelX wrote:
Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


I'm just curious, what about his post turned you off from the game? I ask, because FFXIV is completely different from XI, which is the point everyone is making. You don't HAVE to wait for a static party. You can queue in the dungeon finder, and do any content at any time. You don't have to wait for anything. Yes, there will be an endgame, but it's not going to be like FFXI. It won't be "elitist" only mentality. Half the endgame won't revolve around waiting 24-72 hours for a mob to spawn and then praying your LS somehow gets claim over the 50-100 botters. There is an open beta coming. I'd encourage you to try that out before writing the game off, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the results.


Why would you even bother responding to his post. Kind of reminds me of when my wife says "do I look fat in these pants....", the poster is just seeking attention.

"Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you." Really? That's dramatic even for the internet LOL


Mainly because it seemed like the poster was completely misunderstanding the jist of the posts, and I was hoping he/she would read it and realize that basing an opinion off of a post someone makes about the game isn't always the best course of action, especially when it wasn't even being accurately assessed.

Also, I'd very much like for ARR to succeed, and every person who tries it out is one more person who might sub and add to the community.
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#31 Aug 06 2013 at 12:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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BartelX wrote:
Techsupport wrote:
BartelX wrote:
Zaleshea wrote:
That wasn't always true. The community was definitely NOT keen to being ONLY an endgame community until a few years after the game been out. And unfortunately, through my own eyes, this was not a good transition. All it did was destroy friendships, breakup linkshells and sprout a lot of drama, as well as flatout unhelpfulness and overall elistist attitudes. That being said, your post scares me, and has discouraged me from wanting to play FFXIV now, as I had got away from FFXI after 8yrs of playing because I was tired of all that. All my good memories of FFXI do not include anything from endgame(just all my bad memories..)

And I hated static groups, because I could never get in them because I was not in their little endgame clique.

Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you.


I'm just curious, what about his post turned you off from the game? I ask, because FFXIV is completely different from XI, which is the point everyone is making. You don't HAVE to wait for a static party. You can queue in the dungeon finder, and do any content at any time. You don't have to wait for anything. Yes, there will be an endgame, but it's not going to be like FFXI. It won't be "elitist" only mentality. Half the endgame won't revolve around waiting 24-72 hours for a mob to spawn and then praying your LS somehow gets claim over the 50-100 botters. There is an open beta coming. I'd encourage you to try that out before writing the game off, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by the results.


Why would you even bother responding to his post. Kind of reminds me of when my wife says "do I look fat in these pants....", the poster is just seeking attention.

"Thanks for saving me whatever this game was going to cost. And good luck to all of you." Really? That's dramatic even for the internet LOL


Mainly because it seemed like the poster was completely misunderstanding the jist of the posts, and I was hoping he/she would read it and realize that basing an opinion off of a post someone makes about the game isn't always the best course of action, especially when it wasn't even being accurately assessed.

Also, I'd very much like for ARR to succeed, and every person who tries it out is one more person who might sub and add to the community.


Very valid point.
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WAR has access to enough enmity gear and enough hate-inducing JA to aggro baby jesus.


Quote:
When I'm trying to decide what spell to cast I look at the mobs' weaknesses, check the day, check the weather and then calmly cast Thunder IV.
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