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#27 Jul 13 2016 at 11:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quite honestly and this does go back towards Thordan EX days - they already create content for "non-hardcore players", the problem is, as seen with Weeping City with...well, it's not about hardcore/midcore/casual, it's about player skill and willingness to actually want to be good at your job/the content. Remember, the content designed "for hardcore players" is the content the team designs FIRST, then REDESIGNS (which is actually taking more time) for the more casual orient crowd.

The game sadly doesn't create a progression of "get gud" in order to tackle even the easy "hard" content. Much like Thordan and Sephirot Ex, it's universally accepted that Nidhogg Ex is painfully easy...disappointingly easy, it's just "pay attention to mechanics". There's a less DPS check for Nidhogg Ex than there is Sephirot Ex, something released ages ago, which is a problem on its own for a different topic because a big downer is the fact anything you "work hard for" is worthless very soon after. So why do anything that takes an iota of skill? Why not just wait for the catchup patches and do easy content for the halfsteps?


First, I'm not seeing any widespread problems with Weeping City. Players are clearing this pretty easily now and have been since about a week after the content came out.

Second, it's not universally accepted that Nidhogg Ex is "painfully easy." Quite the opposite. You could say it's universally accepted that Nidhogg Ex is easier than Thordan Ex or Sephirot Ex, but most people I encounter in game describe those battles as extremely difficult. Also, I've yet to encounter a single person (until now) describe Nidhogg Ex as anything but hard. People in my FC who are competent, dedicated players have made it clear that Nidhogg Ex is no joke.

As for Thordan Ex... man, my static needed five weeks and stacks of echo to get through that fight, and that's even with some of us being overgeared for it. Those mechanics are just punishing, and there are so many to memorize. And I've played MMOs long enough to know the folks in my group are actually pretty good players -- we don't have any weak links. To say that fight is just "easy" or "painfully easy" is just LOL.

Edited, Jul 13th 2016 10:28am by Thayos
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#28 Jul 13 2016 at 6:45 PM Rating: Decent
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Personally, while I dislike the current raid/trial model (I'd rather have more, but simpler bosses), I disagree with feeding the "salary" style of gameplay, where you put in x time and get y reward every day. There should be some risks of failing and coming home without nothing, or else it's just a skinnerbox, isn't it?

The problem is that right now the risk isn't worth it, since players knows that everything will lose value once the next expansion launches, like OP's example with ponies.

I think WoW had a good idea with this. Content at current patches always drops the mount, and then its drop rate is lowered to 1% or something once the content becomes obsolete.
#29 Jul 14 2016 at 5:33 PM Rating: Decent
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From what I've heard about Nid EX, it's not as... crazy, as Thordan and Sephirot were, which is why some people are labeling it as easy. That's not to say that it's EASY overall for anybody to complete, just probably EASIER than those two fights (and after seeing videos of all three, I'm inclined to believe that; other than a vastly different 2nd phase but yet not nearly as elaborate as the one in Thordan EX, the fight doesn't do THAT much different other than up the numbers and remove the AoE markers for several attacks, while mostly leaving the way these attacks work unchanged; you just have to keep a better eye on what he's doing instead of relying on the markers).

A group that has mastered Thordan and Sephirot by now probably will find Nid EX to be an "easy" fight.

Edited, Jul 14th 2016 7:42pm by Fynlar
#30 Jul 15 2016 at 7:55 AM Rating: Decent
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Fynlar wrote:
From what I've heard about Nid EX, it's not as... crazy, as Thordan and Sephirot were, which is why some people are labeling it as easy. That's not to say that it's EASY overall for anybody to complete, just probably EASIER than those two fights (and after seeing videos of all three, I'm inclined to believe that; other than a vastly different 2nd phase but yet not nearly as elaborate as the one in Thordan EX, the fight doesn't do THAT much different other than up the numbers and remove the AoE markers for several attacks, while mostly leaving the way these attacks work unchanged; you just have to keep a better eye on what he's doing instead of relying on the markers).

A group that has mastered Thordan and Sephirot by now probably will find Nid EX to be an "easy" fight.

Edited, Jul 14th 2016 7:42pm by Fynlar


Exactly this. None of the primals are "easy" to the point you will one shot it on your first attempt, because there's a lot of instant death mechanics in all of the "hard" fights if you're not careful, but compared to what SE tossed at us in the last few patches? It is pretty easy, that's why no one wants to do it because largely people already farmed it and new players into the fight tend to have trouble with the tether mechanic more than anything.

NidEX is literally one of the few fights that didn't change that much between normal/hard/extreme modes in a very long time. It's similar to Ramuh Ex being extremely similar to the "hard" mode where the main change is the fact there's water you don't want anything to do with.

So if you don't do relic and want a fairly easy to obtain weapon to last you until 3.4/4.0 you definitely want to get in on the nid if your weapon has good stats because ilvl 235 isn't bad and the deep dungeon glamour weapon is said to be under augmented lore, meaning it's likely 230, so if you're holding out for that..
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#31 Jul 15 2016 at 10:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Exactly this. None of the primals are "easy" to the point you will one shot it on your first attempt, because there's a lot of instant death mechanics in all of the "hard" fights if you're not careful, but compared to what SE tossed at us in the last few patches? It is pretty easy, that's why no one wants to do it because largely people already farmed it and new players into the fight tend to have trouble with the tether mechanic more than anything.

NidEX is literally one of the few fights that didn't change that much between normal/hard/extreme modes in a very long time. It's similar to Ramuh Ex being extremely similar to the "hard" mode where the main change is the fact there's water you don't want anything to do with.


This, I can get behind. Totally agree.

My static is about to start Sephy Ex, and yesterday I watched fight vids for the first time. Sephy Ex looks much more simple than Thordan Ex. Last week, I watched some Nidhogg vids, and it does also look less complicated than Sephy, although I'd say the gap between Sephy and Nidd isn't as wide as the gap between Thordan and Sephy -- though perhaps my perspective will change one I get my hands dirty.
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#32 Jul 15 2016 at 11:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Yep..once you get into it the fight is going to literally feel like Titan (aside the obvious fact the guy who designed Titan fight did Seph.)
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