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"Human or not" a letter to Yoshi-P & SEFollow

#27 Nov 05 2016 at 8:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Private servers have existed since forever, why get riled over them now?

If SE is bothered by them, they'll do something like Blizzard did against Nostalrius. What's the point of players discussing the "legality" of fan works?
#28 Nov 05 2016 at 8:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Holhorse wrote:
What's the point of players discussing the "legality" of fan works?


There is no point.

Nostalrius got shutdown because it had gotten too popular and Blizzard probably has their own classic server plan in the works. Otherwise private servers hurt no one.

Edited, Nov 5th 2016 10:31pm by BrokenFox
#29 Nov 05 2016 at 8:56 PM Rating: Good
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Private servers have existed since forever, why get riled over them now?

If SE is bothered by them, they'll do something like Blizzard did against Nostalrius. What's the point of players discussing the "legality" of fan works?


By that logic, what's the point of discussing anything?

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Otherwise private servers hurt no one.


That's arguable. You can certainly argue that people playing on a private server wouldn't be subscribing to the normal service anyway so there's no actual lost money, but you'd never be able to prove that 100% of private server players fall into that category. Even if you could it wouldn't matter because the copyright violation is pretty in-your-face in this case. Even "victimless" crimes are still crimes.
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#30 Nov 05 2016 at 9:13 PM Rating: Decent
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You're sounding like the kid that reminds the teacher they forgot to hand out homework
#31 Nov 05 2016 at 9:17 PM Rating: Good
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I've been a game developer and designer. I'm sorry that respect for people's hard work is so uncool and inconvenient.
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#32 Nov 05 2016 at 9:23 PM Rating: Decent
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Callinon wrote:
I've been a game developer and designer. I'm sorry that respect for people's hard work is so uncool and inconvenient.


How is it disrespect and how is it hurting anyone? Most private servers are versions of the game that no longer exist. Vanilla WoW, old school FFXI, SWG, etc

No one's playing a private server version of Legion.

Edited, Nov 5th 2016 11:32pm by BrokenFox
#33 Nov 06 2016 at 12:25 AM Rating: Good
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You can bet people would if they could, though. When it comes to any private server scene, what usually keeps things "behind" is the ability to either reverse engineer or recreate systems. Or in some cases, hosts being set in their ways and not wanting the game to evolve past their prescribed period of greatness.

As some have pointed out, however, there's no grey area. It is theft of intellectual property regardless of whether or not a portion of code is present. Maybe not the end of the world relative to other possible crimes, but it does convey a certain degree of disrespect to those who did work on the project in particular. Realistically, those coders/artists/musicians aren't getting kickbacks nowadays relative to subs/sales unless they're still actually working on the game today, but the potential lack of revenue could affect future works, be it actual creation or overall implementation.

It's kind of sad how desperate we are to consume art, but are so quick to treat creators terribly and further justify those indiscretions as long as it convenient for the consumer. At the very least, I do like to give people the benefit of the doubt in that they'll pay for things they appreciate. That's kinda the root of F2P models other games/companies have ran with and not all have sunk in consequence.
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#34 Nov 06 2016 at 11:23 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah. I mean, as much as I like the artistic concept of keeping games in certain areas alive and relevant - it literally is a black-and-white law.

A stupid law, but a clear one.
#35 Nov 06 2016 at 9:14 PM Rating: Decent
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BrokenFox wrote:
Nostalrius got shutdown because it had gotten too popular and Blizzard probably has their own classic server plan in the works. Otherwise private servers hurt no one.

Perhaps it was popular, but Blizz stated just this weekend at Blizzcon that there are no plans for any classic server. Then again, the current expansion is full of fan service including dungeons and raids that players loved from back then being given new life.

BrokenFox wrote:
How is it disrespect and how is it hurting anyone?

Stealing isn't disrespectful and doesn't hurt anyone? You really don't think so?

Again, there's next to nothing in FFXI that you can't do from 'Vanilla' so there's not much point to private servers. I know a lot of people who would like to play an FFXIV that had continued to build from 1.0, but would anyone want 'vanilla' XIV?
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#36 Nov 07 2016 at 11:12 AM Rating: Decent
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Ok.. I did not even think about them being illegal I have just heard about them a few times. I didn't know even if SE was running one that way.


But since we are going there I doubt at this stage SE give a rats behind because I am betting FFXI is pretty close to done.
This would be a honor to them having the game go on because once they close the FFXI severs down this may be the only place to play the game anymore is private servers. I can see blizzard going after them because their game is going to continue on and it would hurt profits.

I think we will see server closures this year as servers drop. I noticed the server we are on has issues allot more lately and I doubt they want to keep fixing them. The server is near dead. I bet they either close the game down in 2017 or they are down to a NA server and a Japanese server.

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#37 Nov 07 2016 at 1:38 PM Rating: Good
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I'd take that action since people have been making that bet for like a decade.
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#38 Nov 07 2016 at 6:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Heh actually, once XIV's "expansion" finishes, the few devs left on XI will be able to do more, which is why matsui said we're getting the "repeats" until 2017. Same happened with Heavensward, since they only realistically have one branch working on the 3 MMOs that end up being pulled to the "main" MMO.
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#39 Nov 08 2016 at 4:35 AM Rating: Good
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Nashred wrote:
But since we are going there I doubt at this stage SE give a rats behind because I am betting FFXI is pretty close to done.

While I'm sure the game's age is a factor, I'd also posit the language barrier works to our benefit. Nonetheless, sicking legal teams on guys is an expense they need to weigh the pros and cons on, as well as the potential publicity it would garner for better or worse. So, while you may occasionally see some server boast having a few hundred unique players, the reality is you'd be lucky to see 1/3rd of them on at once, as well as the sheer impossibility of recreating those olden days where prime times saw 3000+ people on.
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This would be a honor to them having the game go on because once they close the FFXI severs down this may be the only place to play the game anymore is private servers. I can see blizzard going after them because their game is going to continue on and it would hurt profits.

While I wouldn't call it an honor, it does highlight a flaw of games restricted to multiplayer. When/if servers go down, they're effectively gone, and with that whatever investment a player made. With that said, I do believe there's actually been some recent legal rumblings involving this matter and what could be called fan revivals. Basically, a judge ruled in their favor since the official means was no longer available/being supported. Yet even if this is to be XI's fate, I'd hope one day that full game is recreated or at least officially released, because for some people, things were better WotG and later.
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#40 Nov 08 2016 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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I cant wait til this comes out

https://chroniclesofelyria.com

It looks like itll be better than even FFXI was.

Dying of old age (which can take 12-14 irl months, corpse looting, PvP just about anywhere, pick pocketing and assassination, being able to break into and steal from peoples homes, EVERYTHING being player controlled (including the shops are run by other players, if those players log out then their character remain in the world and its controlled by AI) that includes YOUR character to so you have to set good AI scripts so it can stay alive an just in case it ever has to defend itself when youre not physically online to do it, OR you can hire other layers as guards to keep you alive when youre not online.


Being in a family thats also all player run, can build and own houses and land, can become a king or queen of an entire player filled country, that games sounds way too **** good, its basically what EVE online would be if it if it went from space to Fantasy. Only down side is there is no end game which of course makes sense after all your character DOES grow old and die sooo what good would engdame be? There WILL be raid though not in the traditional sense but more in an if you wanna steal from a Kings castle or a VERY good players house it will require great skill and a lot of help, families can go after other families too and there can and will be wars etc etc.

Glad to see there is a dev who knows there are still people out there who want an MMO with SOME degree of depth, and this one seems like its gonna overdo it (in a good way) in the depth department. Too bad it probably wont be done til 2020
#41 Nov 08 2016 at 1:57 PM Rating: Decent
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That definitely is a great concept and design, I just hate the aspect of having to buy a new character essentially, so while it technically would be a charge of $30 every year+2 there's other things you'd likely end up buying.

But I do agree, it's nice to see there are still some developers around that recognize MMOs still deserve depth in their game.
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#42 Nov 08 2016 at 2:03 PM Rating: Good
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It's an ambitious design goal for sure. It's going to have a fairly narrow appeal though, so it needs to also be a game that can survive with a niche audience.

Also yeah, not a fan of my character aging to death. I recognize the "realism" argument, but I think that's going to end up being more frustrating than anything else.
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#43 Nov 08 2016 at 2:34 PM Rating: Decent
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Callinon wrote:
It's an ambitious design goal for sure. It's going to have a fairly narrow appeal though, so it needs to also be a game that can survive with a niche audience.

Also yeah, not a fan of my character aging to death. I recognize the "realism" argument, but I think that's going to end up being more frustrating than anything else.



Well considering your new character inherits all your skills and abilities.. with some limits due to his age and experience, then youre really not losing anything in the end
#44 Nov 08 2016 at 2:37 PM Rating: Decent
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That does sound cool
#45 Nov 09 2016 at 1:24 PM Rating: Decent
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All I could think about was the idea of people returning to the library to learn about their past lives in effort to correct their mistakes. If only SE had applied that concept to it's game development.

I think I'm more excited for XV and VII remake to be honest. XV to see where the genre is going and VII to see just how much SE can milk from it's fans.
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30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#46 Nov 09 2016 at 8:33 PM Rating: Good
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Seeing how people got incredibly testy about losing their names in world merges in XI, I honestly can't see a forced death system boding well even if people just become Joe Blow Jr., III, X, etc. So, while it's true that time tends to play a minimal role in the actual roleplaying aspect of MMOs, I don't really feel this is the right way to go about changing that. Especially if someone takes a break for any sort of extended period.

And good luck actually paying people to guard someone AFK/offline. That **** just reeks of ultimate trollbait waiting to happen.
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#47 Nov 11 2016 at 1:58 AM Rating: Decent
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Seriha wrote:
Seeing how people got incredibly testy about losing their names in world merges in XI, I honestly can't see a forced death system boding well even if people just become Joe Blow Jr., III, X, etc. So, while it's true that time tends to play a minimal role in the actual roleplaying aspect of MMOs, I don't really feel this is the right way to go about changing that. Especially if someone takes a break for any sort of extended period.

And good luck actually paying people to guard someone AFK/offline. That **** just reeks of ultimate trollbait waiting to happen.



Well dying in combat doesnt kill you outright. Otherwise like you said that WOULD be stupid, especially if you can get killed while offline. Instead dying (and it all depend on how you die and what you do to resurrect yourself) in combat just lowers your lifespan, so if you were gonna live 1 year now since you died youll like 11 months and 3 weeks or something to that effect.

Also Im pretty sure you can keep your name, if not like you suggested just add Jr at the end or something its not like you lose any skills or abilities so I wouldnt have a problem with it.


And your absolutely right about the trollbait. But thats the magic of it.. I mean thats whats so great about EVE (cause it surely isnt the gameplay) Ppl can kill/backstab you at anytime and the entire world and economy is controlled/effected by the players. So you gotta make friends and make sure youve vetted them and know who you can trust before you trust them. Im pretty sure there are completely safe places or at least places you are less likely to get attacked at (like your house, clan/guild base/a castle etc etc) that you can log out in and not worry about it cause your clan/guild or family could watch out for you while youre offline. I mean lets say you pay someone to watch you while youre offline, ok maybe you had to go to sleep or work thats probably gonna be 8+ hours, do we really expect them to stay online guarding you 8+ hours? What if THEY have to go to sleep/work? So yeah there would have to be ways around that. Also PVP/PKing can be done anywhere but its "illegal" to do outside of times of War so if someone did literally backstab you or kill you while you were offline, they could go to jail or have other things happen to them and you can put bounties or contracts on someone so for the right price you could have half the town hunting them down. (which is another feature I like the sound of, too many times Ive seen ppl get scammed or ninja looted in FFXI and XIV and nothing could be done about it other than informing ppl on message boards. In this game however you can have those sorts of people dealt with... or do it yourself, and theirs corpse looting (again in the right situations) so if they stole from you you can take your **** back or have someone else get it back for you). So yeah I doubt ppl will go around randomly killing ppl and doing trollish/griefing things unless they REALLY had to.

Edited, Nov 11th 2016 2:12am by DuoMaxwellxx
#48 Nov 11 2016 at 4:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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You've got a greater faith in people not being jerkwads about it than I do.
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#49 Nov 11 2016 at 11:47 AM Rating: Decent
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Seriha wrote:
You've got a greater faith in people not being jerkwads about it than I do.



I dont have faith but i would think the consenquenes for thei actions would make them less inclined to do things as opopsed to a game where you can do stuff like that and get away with it WoWE
#50 Nov 13 2016 at 11:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
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want to experience some adventures like "Sword art online"
To be held hostage and either killed or digitally raped? Smiley: dubious


Only 48k posts gaxe? I am disappoint.
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#51 Nov 15 2016 at 10:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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I am, too. These lands are no longer fertile for farming.
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