This thread isn't to discuss moralities/issues/personal opinions on why we should/shouldn't bot. It's a way of address why "I" personally think people bot.
In my own opinion, there was never a need to craft bot in FFXI. It was a pain in the ass to select the ingredients over and over again, but you didn't have to worry about the HQ's, game took care of it for you.
I liked crafting in XI and leveling was to me, not really a pain. I got cooking 96 in 2 weeks and 800k back in 2006 :)
In FFXIV I believe there was a statement that they wanted you to be able to level a craft job just like you could a melee. >.> Getting 50-100sp a shot on mining @ 36 is VERY slow, and sitting there even spamming the standard synth is a pain in the toosh.
So I propse this:
copy Aions crafting system to a point. There you have to buy recipes (Opened up a new market, but we don't need that in 14).
After you learn a recipe its in your list to use. When you have all the mats in your inventory the craft window tells you what you can craft, and how much:
example:
http://www.tentonhammer.com/image/view/71010
I liked this so so much because you had the option to Craft 1, X number, or ALL
example:
http://static.na.aiononline.com/powerbook/aion/47/80/b85d79b5b8aab0a2560ea111.jpg
I really wish FFXIV sort of went this route. Honestly I want to do other things while I have to skillup on 500 walnut masks ^^; I don't care if the game takes care of HQ or not. Maybe even give us a weight system
20% Normal
50% Rapid
30% Bold
I can say that if they gave us this option, and let our game craft itself while AFK, people wouldn't use a craft bot as much.
FFXIV so far is the only game that has ever made me actually want to bot for crafting... but I can't because I don't want to get banned because of a stupid choice.
What do you all think of this?
I hope they improve crafting to make it better and less time consuming.
as an added note I was level 37 ranger/archer in there with level 421 cloth crafting :P
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 9:01am by Elionara
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A way to possibly stop people wanting craft bots (mostly)Follow
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=18309
Quote:
Like Final Fantasy XI, the game specs will be extremely high for the time, but in about 5 years, an average machine can run it on max settings with little to no issues. Tanaka also expressed interest in making a benchmark program available.
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I endorse this thread.
Well, your solution isnt really a solution most of us can agree to.
Basicly, as i understand it, you want to eliminate botting on crafting by pretty much removing crafting and having it be done automatically? Which basicly comes down to wrecking out half of the game, and replacing it with (legal) automatic-botting.
We are kinda looking for a solution to keep crafting, while at the same time removing botting.
Step one would be actually permitting the GM's to do something about it, and upping the reaction times to calls. And even they cannot do anything about most of the things due to the game's coding.
Basicly, as i understand it, you want to eliminate botting on crafting by pretty much removing crafting and having it be done automatically? Which basicly comes down to wrecking out half of the game, and replacing it with (legal) automatic-botting.
We are kinda looking for a solution to keep crafting, while at the same time removing botting.
Step one would be actually permitting the GM's to do something about it, and upping the reaction times to calls. And even they cannot do anything about most of the things due to the game's coding.
KojiroSoma wrote:
Well, your solution isnt really a solution most of us can agree to.
Basicly, as i understand it, you want to eliminate botting on crafting by pretty much removing crafting and having it be done automatically? Which basicly comes down to wrecking out half of the game, and replacing it with (legal) automatic-botting.
We are kinda looking for a solution to keep crafting, while at the same time removing botting.
Step one would be actually permitting the GM's to do something about it, and upping the reaction times to calls. And even they cannot do anything about most of the things due to the game's coding.
Basicly, as i understand it, you want to eliminate botting on crafting by pretty much removing crafting and having it be done automatically? Which basicly comes down to wrecking out half of the game, and replacing it with (legal) automatic-botting.
We are kinda looking for a solution to keep crafting, while at the same time removing botting.
Step one would be actually permitting the GM's to do something about it, and upping the reaction times to calls. And even they cannot do anything about most of the things due to the game's coding.
Perhaps a hybrid of the two? A quick browseable craft list like aion, where when you click "craft" on an item it automatically takes you into crafting instead of:
Recipe>Select Item>Prepare>Main/Off Hand>select item again>select.
Just to many steps to craft imho.
Edited, Feb 28th 2011 11:58am by Elionara
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=18309
Quote:
Like Final Fantasy XI, the game specs will be extremely high for the time, but in about 5 years, an average machine can run it on max settings with little to no issues. Tanaka also expressed interest in making a benchmark program available.
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I endorse this thread.
I think if you want HQ, you actually do the synth ... for "grinding" SP ... there should be an auto function for mass producing masks etc.
This would level the playing field between honest crafters and ones who bot.
I haven't met one person who enjoyed the DoH grind .. it is boring and tedious .. and might lead to carpel tunnel!
On top of all of that, DoH jobs are needed in almost every aspect of the game. From making HQ gear (some of which is better than NM drops), making the NM drop items, and of course fixing all of that gear!
This would level the playing field between honest crafters and ones who bot.
I haven't met one person who enjoyed the DoH grind .. it is boring and tedious .. and might lead to carpel tunnel!
On top of all of that, DoH jobs are needed in almost every aspect of the game. From making HQ gear (some of which is better than NM drops), making the NM drop items, and of course fixing all of that gear!
[center][img]http://ff14sp.com/tools/lodestone_data/imgs/Aleister Crowley Bodhum 3 Legacy.png[/img][/center]
SpelunkerOne wrote:
I think if you want HQ, you actually do the synth ... for "grinding" SP ... there should be an auto function for mass producing masks etc.
This would level the playing field between honest crafters and ones who bot.
I haven't met one person who enjoyed the DoH grind .. it is boring and tedious .. and might lead to carpel tunnel!
On top of all of that, DoH jobs are needed in almost every aspect of the game. From making HQ gear (some of which is better than NM drops), making the NM drop items, and of course fixing all of that gear!
This would level the playing field between honest crafters and ones who bot.
I haven't met one person who enjoyed the DoH grind .. it is boring and tedious .. and might lead to carpel tunnel!
On top of all of that, DoH jobs are needed in almost every aspect of the game. From making HQ gear (some of which is better than NM drops), making the NM drop items, and of course fixing all of that gear!
Ooooh, mass production = no hq, ever. :) Considering on average of 325sp/synth which I currently get, (780 on high, 180) on low, it would take 5500+ synths to get 1-50 /wrists.
My hands hurt enough as it is doing banner designs all day long in flash.
Ctrl+c, Ctrl+v, shift, alt, tab... the agony o.O
5500 synths @ 1minute a synth = 90 hours of pure straight synthing, with no fatigue ^^
... must hit 50 CRP
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=18309
Quote:
Like Final Fantasy XI, the game specs will be extremely high for the time, but in about 5 years, an average machine can run it on max settings with little to no issues. Tanaka also expressed interest in making a benchmark program available.
FilthMcNasty wrote:
I endorse this thread.
There are many games that allow mass production via one click, and its never ruined the player-base or the economy.
It is limited by the raw materials you have (and obviously you can't use that character for anything else) ... although people do multi-client, and would craft on alts a lot more.
But hey ... means more accounts for SE!
It is limited by the raw materials you have (and obviously you can't use that character for anything else) ... although people do multi-client, and would craft on alts a lot more.
But hey ... means more accounts for SE!
[center][img]http://ff14sp.com/tools/lodestone_data/imgs/Aleister Crowley Bodhum 3 Legacy.png[/img][/center]
I think SE wanted to have crafts be a possible candidate for a character's "main" class. Something you can put the same amount of time in as a DoW or DoL.
You can tell that FFXIV had the crafting system the most complete when it was launched, aside from needing UI changes and tweaks to SP/EXP formulas (which they have worked on, and are still working on).
Because of this, I don't feel that batch-crafting would be something SE wants, however convenient it is for players who don't feel like leveling a crafting class.
A "repeat last synth" would be awesome, though.
You can tell that FFXIV had the crafting system the most complete when it was launched, aside from needing UI changes and tweaks to SP/EXP formulas (which they have worked on, and are still working on).
Because of this, I don't feel that batch-crafting would be something SE wants, however convenient it is for players who don't feel like leveling a crafting class.
A "repeat last synth" would be awesome, though.
You are right about the DoH job as an intended main. Not sure if they thought it through though ...
The system of needing 500 masks for a rank etc just kills someone's ambition to rank up. Add the fact you need a sub-job for your main DoH and most likely the DoL class that gathers your needed material.
I am used to a very talkative community and an auction house lol, both of which would have made it so much easier to be "connected" and have various jobs interacting. (the insane amount of "r21 BSM item for my r9 synth" stuff that made us all rank everything to begin with)
I get that they wanted to make it take awhile to hit r50 in a craft, because if that was your sole focus, it would just leave "end-game" which I guess is crafting NM drops into gear. Akin to hitting r50 in your chosen combat job.
The system of needing 500 masks for a rank etc just kills someone's ambition to rank up. Add the fact you need a sub-job for your main DoH and most likely the DoL class that gathers your needed material.
I am used to a very talkative community and an auction house lol, both of which would have made it so much easier to be "connected" and have various jobs interacting. (the insane amount of "r21 BSM item for my r9 synth" stuff that made us all rank everything to begin with)
I get that they wanted to make it take awhile to hit r50 in a craft, because if that was your sole focus, it would just leave "end-game" which I guess is crafting NM drops into gear. Akin to hitting r50 in your chosen combat job.
[center][img]http://ff14sp.com/tools/lodestone_data/imgs/Aleister Crowley Bodhum 3 Legacy.png[/img][/center]
When group/party crafting is introduced I believe this problem will be greatly mitigated.
I just don't think autocraft would work in FFXIVs system because its a primary class.
Mats are cheap, and with how easy you can get gil, whats to stop me from clearing out my inventory, buying 999 of a mat, and hitting autocraft and coming back a few hours later?
It worked great in LOTRO because it wasn't your main class it was just a skill, and nobody cares about skills.
Mats are cheap, and with how easy you can get gil, whats to stop me from clearing out my inventory, buying 999 of a mat, and hitting autocraft and coming back a few hours later?
It worked great in LOTRO because it wasn't your main class it was just a skill, and nobody cares about skills.
http://www.prismaticllama.com/
http://www.sologensystems.com
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7 posts
Personally, I love the crafting system in XIV. I'm primarily a crafter and if it were automatic I would have quit long ago. So, to me, an automatic system is not a solution to botting.
In fact, I would argue it was much easier and more prevalent to see people botting in XI than XIV simply because of the monotonous and simplistic crafting system in the former game.
XIV's crafting system is engaging. True, you can just standard your way through everything, with plenty of blow ups along the way, but if you use the crafting system the way it was intended it is actually quite good. Really, the only people that want to bot it are the ones who really don't want to craft to begin with.
Pretty much all the real crafters that I have spoken to, meaning people who spend most of their leisure time playing the game as a crafter job, are very happy with the way crafting works. (Myself included, of course)
In fact, I would argue it was much easier and more prevalent to see people botting in XI than XIV simply because of the monotonous and simplistic crafting system in the former game.
XIV's crafting system is engaging. True, you can just standard your way through everything, with plenty of blow ups along the way, but if you use the crafting system the way it was intended it is actually quite good. Really, the only people that want to bot it are the ones who really don't want to craft to begin with.
Pretty much all the real crafters that I have spoken to, meaning people who spend most of their leisure time playing the game as a crafter job, are very happy with the way crafting works. (Myself included, of course)
WoW had it right...
I mean, you have ingredients in your pack, you select how many you wanna make, and let the game spend the 15min to craft them all.
I woudn't mind FF14 taking even 60min to complete all the automatic crafting, as I would talk to my LS and friends. As for different option for quality... you pick what is going to be used for the 60x times ou're going to craft.
I dont mind lenghty animations, it add to the immertion of the game, but manually ctafting one at a time gets annoying really quick.
-- FrancoisX
I mean, you have ingredients in your pack, you select how many you wanna make, and let the game spend the 15min to craft them all.
I woudn't mind FF14 taking even 60min to complete all the automatic crafting, as I would talk to my LS and friends. As for different option for quality... you pick what is going to be used for the 60x times ou're going to craft.
I dont mind lenghty animations, it add to the immertion of the game, but manually ctafting one at a time gets annoying really quick.
-- FrancoisX
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Interesting Quote :
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Samuriko -> http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/cluster/sig.pl?char=91959
Mesmira -> http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/cluster/sig.pl?char=173688
Quote:
Interesting Quote :
All of you should not forget FF11 is supposed to be a game, not an olympic competition.
Necro Warning: This post occurred more than thirty days after the prior, and may be a necropost.
this is simple and doesn't need to be automated, just player interactive. crafting sucks because you are never in control success is based on some sort of luck or imaginary modifier. the only thing you can control is which type of synth you want to perform this is not interactive it is dull boring and very uninteresting. I would be much more interested in a Fable 2~3 crafting type system where interaction is a must. to sate those that like the crafting system as it is leave it, and instead incorporate this new interactive system in each appropriate guild call them workrooms or something instancing is a must for workrooms. instancing isolates you from any additional bandwidth choke allowing the interactivity to be smooth and the animation camera focused on you.
on another note.
i loved fishing in XI because it was interactive very basic, but none the less it left you with a sense of accomplishment for reeling in the big one or embarrassment when you fished up that pug or crabby that would kick your ass.
on another note.
i loved fishing in XI because it was interactive very basic, but none the less it left you with a sense of accomplishment for reeling in the big one or embarrassment when you fished up that pug or crabby that would kick your ass.
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