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#1 Jan 10 2017 at 5:51 PM Rating: Good
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Haven't posted in a while, but thought I'd come read an old tanking guide I wrote for nostalgia's sake (http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=255&mid=1259874727263463448#1). Apparently it has high abuse count? And so does Kao's Forum rules and Sticky Request Information thread?

I think something's bugged, but in case it's not, can I get an admin review on the content? It's just a tanking guide, so I'm not really sure what could be abusive about it.
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Aliekber
RDM BLU SCH DRG PLD BLM NIN WHM
Linkshell: CrimsonMercenaries Server: Carbamesh

Sandinmygum the Stupendous wrote:
Human (?) females look ugly.
Post in /K/ where the orbital laser system is now online.
#2 Jan 10 2017 at 5:55 PM Rating: Excellent
Can you send me a PM of what you were trying to post? We made a change recently and it's not working as intended.
#3 Jan 10 2017 at 6:01 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
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16,847 posts
There are numerous posts in the Asylum that have triggered this, what ever its cause.

A handful of my posts in a single thread have, and from what I can tell by going back and clicking Edit to view them, there isn't even a single case of a word being caught by the filter.
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Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
#4 Jan 10 2017 at 6:07 PM Rating: Good
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Gidono wrote:
Can you send me a PM of what you were trying to post? We made a change recently and it's not working as intended.


I tried, but it gave me the same message in the PM. Hopefully it actually sent the raw markup and not just the error message.
____________________________
Aliekber
RDM BLU SCH DRG PLD BLM NIN WHM
Linkshell: CrimsonMercenaries Server: Carbamesh

Sandinmygum the Stupendous wrote:
Human (?) females look ugly.
Post in /K/ where the orbital laser system is now online.
#5 Jan 10 2017 at 6:36 PM Rating: Excellent
Take the asterisks * out of your post and try again. Let me know if it works for you.

Edited, Jan 10th 2017 6:37pm by Gidono
#6 Jan 10 2017 at 7:04 PM Rating: Excellent
Everthing you ever wanted to know about RDM tanking (but were afraid to ask)

Introduction: Why I wrote this guide

Ever since I got my Duelist's Tabard last month, I've been itching to tank something on RDM/NIN, but haven't really been sure of myself being ready for the endeavor; the hardest thing I've tanked to date is Scythefang Liger (I once showed up to tank Proto-Omega RDM/NIN, but accidentally left my Shihei in my mog house--this was pre-Satchel days). Looking around, I've seen snippets of advice given here and there, but haven't seen it all pooled in one location to compare my knowledge against and make sure it all meshed together in my head properly, so I took it upon myself to create this guide to display to the best of my ability how I understand RDM tanking to work. I did this in the hope that any factual inaccuracies will be pointed out so they can be fixed and the correct knowledge passed on to everyone who reads this. Reflecting this, I sent out a copy of this to Rog in advance of posting it, and I have added in some of his commentary, marked in red text, where I felt it was more beneficial to hear exactly why he said something should be changed, rather than just change it. Other changes have been made from his suggestions as well.

In short, I wanted to create a resource for up-and-coming RDM tanks that they can read, implement, and feel confident that they are using the right approach for their RDM tank. For now, this guide aims to focus on RDM/NIN tanking as a natural complement to the current #1 preferred endgame tank: PLD/NIN. In the future, I wouldn't mind expanding it to RDM/WAR lower-level tanking (for level-capped events and XP parties) and RDM/PLD bloodtanking if the RDM/NIN guide works out well.

Section 1: Why tank on RDM?

You may be wondering why you should bother putting together a tanking set on RDM at all. If you have PLD75 or NIN75, it may not be that appealing, and it may not be for you. When you get down to it, though, it's because RDM tanking is fun. Secondly, RDM excels as a tank in low-support situations: a sufficiently-geared RDM can hit the recast cap for shadows with only a single outside March spell (everthing else is native to the RDM), we can self-cure, self-refresh, self-haste, and Slow (II) + Paralyze (II) the mob being tanked, meaning that a BRD/WHM + RDM/NIN is an absolute powerhouse when it comes to holding mobs. RDM also does well in situations where reducing magic damage taken is a real concern (Proto-Ultima, for example), and in situations where low-to-no TP feed is important (since engaging/damage-dealing is not a significant source of RDM enmity, unlike PLD).

It offers an exciting change of pace for RDMs normally stuck in the Refresh/Haste/Cure rut, and if you choose to do put in the effort, you can excel as a tank.

PLD/NIN vs. RDM/NIN: a quick rundown

There are obviously advantages to using PLDs as main tanks, since it's such a common occurance in LSs from the newest of the new to the most elite endgame shells, but before I dive into how it all works, I thought I'd break down the advantages/disadvantages of both jobs in tanking in an easy-to-understand bullet list.

PALADIN:

+ Most PLDs are already geared to tank, and have been doing it for 75 levels
+ Top-tier PLDs have access to Aegis
+ Atonement deals consistent damage against any foe, regardless of level differences
+ Invincible makes PLD temporarily immune to any melee or ranged attacks, while giving a giant VE boost.
- Requires significant support to make it work effectively/dependent on outside Refresh
- Most PLDs' tank gear is from 2004 (this is not an issue for smart DD PLD/NINs)
- Feeds TP to the mob (may or may not be an issue depending on mob)

RED MAGE:

+ Requires very little support to make it work effectively/can regenerate own MP
+ Feeds 0 TP to the mob
+ Can provide debuffs to help with tanking (Slow/Paralyze), while tanking
+ Chainspell + Utsusemi makes RDM basically untouchable by any single-target move for the duration of the 2hour (including magic, unlike PLD's Invincible)
+ Has ridiculously good defensive capability
- Ridiculously good defensive capability is usually overkill
- Does not contribute to killing speed
- Most RDMs are not geared to tank, may take convincing to even be allowed to try


Section 2: Enmity

While I would like to jump right into tanking gearsets, and macro suggestions, but I would be remiss if I didn't start out with the mechanics behind how it all works, which is FFXI's Enmity system. I realize it may be tempting to skim over this section, but I highly recommend reading it before moving on to the later sections if you are not already familiar with Kaeko's enmity model and PLD's + RDM's enmity tools.

First of all, there are two types of enmity in FFXI: Volatile Enmity (VE), and Cumulative Enmity (CE). Both cap at a value of 10,000, and are added together to determine your total enmity. Whoever on a mob's hate list has the highest total enmity is who the mob will attempt to attack. Volatile Enmity decays at a rate of 60 VE per second, or 3600 VE/min. Cumulative Enmity, on the other hand builds up and stays (it does not normally decay). As a PLD/NIN or RDM/NIN tank, there are 2 main ways to lose CE; take damage (variable by amount of damage taken) or lose an Utsusemi shadow (-25 CE). Additionally, Enmity+ and Enmity- gear/merits work by taking enmity numbers from the below tables and increasing them as a percentage (i.e. Enmity+5 will increase the enmity of an action by 5%, while Enmity-5 will decrease the enmity of an action by 5%. As a note, all Enmity numbers, research, and tables used in this guide were taken from Kaeko's enmity guide (kanican.livejournal.com), I take no credit for them.

Now that we know how enmity works as a model, let's review PLD's enmity tools, followed by RDM's enmity tools. For the sake of simplicity, we will ignore enmity tools of /NIN because they are both negligible for the purpose of tanking, and usable by both PLD and RDM (which means they have no place in a comparative guide). /NIN's most important tool (Utsusemi shadows which drastically reduce CE loss) will already be in use by both to reduce damage taken.

PALADIN

Job Ability	CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Shield Bash	1	900	15	0	0.00 
Sentinel	1	1800	30	0	0.00 
 
Spells		CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Cure		-- C --	-- C --	5	8	2.00 
Cure II		-- C --	-- C --	17	24	2.25 
Cure III	-- C --	-- C --	30	46	2.50 
Flash		180	1280	37	25	0.50 
Cure IV		-- C --	-- C --	55	88	2.50 
 
 
Weapon Skill	CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Atonement	-- D --	-- D --	Mythic	0	0.00



RED MAGE

Spells		CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 
Cure		-- C --	-- C --	3	8	2.00 
Blind		1	640	8	5	2.00 
Bind		1	640	11	8	2:00 
Cure II		-- C --	-- C --	14	24	2.25 
Sleep		320	320	25	19	2.50 
Cure III	-- C --	-- C --	26	46	2.50 
Dispel		320	320	32	25	3.00 
Sleep II	480	480	46	29	3.00 
Cure IV		-- C --	-- C --	48	88	2.50


C and D mean the amount of enmity varies depending on the amount cured/damage dealt. For more information, please read Kanican's livejournal, where he explains how C and D work more in-depth than I will cover here. For the purposes of this guide, just note that while RDM has 3 very good enmity spells to generate CE, PLD is very reliant on C-and-D-derived enmity as a source of CE.

I have cropped the enmity tables from Kanican's livejournal to include only spells/abilities that are significant to the generation of enmity. As the above note says, you can see that PLD is reliant on cure-cheats and Atonement damage to consistently rack up CE, while RDM has a comparatively easy time of it with only magic. What this means is that as a RDM, when you need to generate CE, you should stick to Sleep/Dispel/Sleep II instead of spending more MP on less MP-efficient cures for enmity. The one obvious exception to this is post-Convert cures, which provide a nice enmity spike after you refill your MP.

An argument can be made for the inclusion of Poison as an enmity-generating spell, but because it costs the same as Blind, which also shares a short recast, and gives double the enmity, I chose not to include it. Poison also renders the tanking target unsleepable, which may be undesirable in some cases.

Rog Commentary: There really is no reason to ever use poison for hate. The recast on blind is low enough to spam it, with little delay. Same thing with bind (though it's even worse than poison because of the long recast, blind's low mp cost, and ridiculously fast recast make it irrelevant).

VE, on the other hand, comes to PLDs very easily. Flash alone gives 1280 VE (which is increased to 2560 VE under the effects of Sentinel, which itself generates 1800 VE). Added up, a PLD using Sentinel + Flash with no Enmity+ gear will generate 4360 VE, nearly halfway to the VE cap in just a few seconds. When Sentinel is down, though, a PLD with capped Flash recast (22 seconds) will typically generate 4147 VE per minute from spells (from 2.7 Flash casts per minute and assuming +20 Enmity gear/merits), for a gain of ~600 VE per minute, after negating natural VE loss (-3600 VE per minute). This means that any actions taken beyond casting Flash (such as cure-cheating) contribute to a net gain in VE for the PLD (again, assuming his Flash recast is capped).

As a RDM, you will need to cast 6.5 Blinds/Binds (they both give the same VE gain) per minute to keep up with a capped-recast PLD's Flashes, and bypass normal VE loss. Unlike PLD, you are not restricted by the recast time on Blind (Bind's recast can be somewhat restrictive), so any Blinds you cast beyond the usual 6.5 per minute contribute to a net gain in VE. This means you should be aiming to cast Blind/Bind at the very least every 9 seconds.

When we break down the mechanics of this, a RDM casting Blind every 8 seconds will eventually cap VE, and a RDM casting Blind every 7 seconds will cap it faster. Obviously, time needs to be taken to increase CE as well, so make sure not to neglect your Sleeps and Dispels to counteract the 25CE loss every time a shadow is lost, because you will want to hit the CE cap before your healers do (and they will, given a long enough fight). If you're solo-tanking, feel free to try to hit the enmity cap as quickly as possible, but if you're duo-tanking you will generally want to match your partner's enmity gain so the mob will bounce between the two of you, making it easier to keep up shadows.

Rog Commentary: Tbh, i'd have to disagree with that. Solo tanking is not particularly hard for rdm, and when your cotank realizes he has not pulled hate off you for awhile, he's probably going to pick up the pace.

Section 3: Gearsets

The Shadows Cast/Recast Set

At last, past the mechanics of how enmity works under the hood, we now come to talking about gearsets. Your first goal as a RDM tank should be to cap your Utsusemi recasts (15 seconds for Ichi, 22 seconds for Ni), since it doesn't really matter if you can keep hate if your healers have to curebomb you just to keep you alive because you can't spam shadows fast enough. You naturally have an advantage over other jobs in this category due to RDM's delicious signature job trait: Fast Cast. Every 2% of Fast Cast you have reduces your recast times by 1%, meaning every 75 RDM will natively have only 90% of the normal recast time on every spell they cast (due to 20% native Fast Cast). Your native Haste spell will cut recasts by 15% whenever it is on, as well. This means that all spells cast by a RDM with haste will have 75% of their normal recast, right? Well, not quite.

You see, while Haste and Fast Cast both decrease recast time of a spell, they act independently of each other. What this means is that instead of calculating recast time as: Normal Cast Time (100% - (Fast Cast%/2 + Haste%), it's calculated as: Normal Cast Time (100% - Fast Cast%/2) (100% - Haste%). So, in actuality, a 75 RDM with Haste active will have a native recast time on all spells of (100% - 20%/2) (100% - 15%) = (90%) (85%) = 76.5%. So, it's close to the 75% you'd expect, but it's not quite there.

For a more dramatic example, 25% Haste + 50% Fast Cast should cap recasts down to 50%, right? Let's calculate it and find out. (100% - 50%/2) (100% - 25%) = (75%) (75%) = 56.25% recast. So, while you'd think off the top of your head that 50% Fast Cast + 25% Haste would cap your recasts, you'd actually need a Victory March (9% Haste) on top of that to cap your recast for real. (75%) (66%) = 49.5% which rounds to 50%, the recast cap.

This, however, brings up a dilemma: your trusty Warlock's Chapeau will decrease recasts by 5% (as it gives 10% Fast Cast), and a Walahra Turban will also decrease recasts by 5%, so which do you choose? Well, in this case the answer will diverge depending on whether you use SpellCast (a Windower plugin) or not. If you do, you'll start casting in Warlock's Chapeau to speed up your cast (cast time is determined at the beginning of the cast), and then macro in Walahra Turban mid-cast (recast time is determined when the spell fires). A non-SpellCast user will likely just use Warlock's Chapeau for the cast time reduction, because while the Walahra Turban is slightly better for recast (explained below), that advantage is negated by Warlock's Chapeau speeding up the cast itself. Of course, it is possible for a player to hit a macro mid-cast to switch from Chapeau to Turban, giving the same net effect; it's really up to the player how far they want to go with their macros.

An interesting thing about Fast Cast and Haste, is that they each individually get better as you stack more of them, while reducing the relative effectiveness of the other. That is to say, 25% Haste + 50% Fast Cast will not cap recasts (as was previously shown), but 50% Haste (currently possible) or 100% Fast Cast (currently impossible) by themselves will. Back to Walahra Turban being slightly better than Warlock's Chapeau for recasts: why is this the case? Let's imagine for a second that you have the best Fast Cast gear possible for RDM. This means 20% in Job Traits, 10% from Warlock's Chapeau, 10% from Duelist's Tabard, and 2% from Loquacious Earring. That's a total of 42% Fast Cast, for a 21% Recast reduction, before the effects of Haste. We have a native Haste spell, which gives 15% Recast reduction normally, so it requires 6% Haste in gear to match Fast Cast's 21% reduction, a pathetically easy benchmark for any RDM seriously considering tanking (after all, Turban gives 5% so if you have any other Haste gear at all, you can match Fast Cast). However, let's do the math to prove this, and not just take it as an assumption. I'm going to assume an Auction-House available Haste build for the RDM (Dusk Gloves + Dusk Ledelsens + Headlong Belt = 8% Haste), and compare the effectiveness of Chapeau vs. Turban.

Warlock's Chapeau: (100% - (20% JT + 10% Chapeau)/2) (100% - (15% Spell + 8% Gear)) = (85%) (77%) = 65.45% Recast.
Walahra Turban: (100% - (20% JT)/2) (100% - (15% Spell + 8% Gear + 5% Turban)) = (90%) (72%) = 64.48% Recast.
As you can see, the race is close, but Walahra Turban is slightly better for recasts, but the difference is small enough for non-SpellCast users not to bother with swapping gear mid-spell (although the difference becomes larger as more Haste gear is added). 29% total Haste is the turning point for Goliard Saio (4% Haste), at which it matches, and past which it outperforms, Duelist's Tabard (10% Fast Cast) for recast.

Now that it's established how the two stats you want to focus on for Utsusemi (Haste and Fast Cast) work, let's look at the options for each of them. Bolded selections are the best for recast, and italicized selections are the best for starting the spell in.

Quote:
Main: None
Sub: Sentinel's Shield (1% Haste)
Ranged: None
Ammo: None
Head: Walahra Turban (5% Haste), Selenian Cap (up to 5% Haste), Warlock's Chapeau (10% Fast Cast)
Neck: None
Ear: Loquacious Earring
Body: Nashira Manteel (3% Haste), Goliard Saio (4% Haste), Royal Redingote (5% Fast Cast), Duelist's Tabard (10% Fast Cast)
Hands: Dusk Gloves (3% Haste), Dusk Gloves +1 (4% Haste)
Rings: Technically there is one, but it's ridiculously rare, and only works in Assault (Imperial Ring). Wouldn't bother with it.
Back: None
Waist: Ninurta's Sash/Speed Belt/Velocious Belt (6% Haste), Tempest Belt (6% Haste; Only in Windy Weather), Swift Belt (4% Haste), Headlong Belt (3% Haste), Quick Belt (2% Haste)
Legs: Nashira Seraweels (2% Haste), Tatsumaki Sitagoromo (3% Haste), Augmented Clown's Subligar (up to 3% Haste)
Feet: Dusk Ledelsens (2% Haste), Dusk Ledelsens +1 (3% Haste)

Technically Selenian Cap can match Walahra Turban, but it would be pretty dumb to waste your mission reward making one like that.
These will run you a lot of gil, they are the best, so they got bolded, but don't consider them necessary by any means. You will still need a BRD to cap your recasts, with NQ or HQ.


Put this all together, and you'll find the ideal Utsusemi Cast set (to be worn as the spell begins) is:
--/--/--/--
Warlock's Chapeau/--/Loquacious Earring/--
Duelist's Tabard/--/--/--
--/--/--/--

+22% Fast Cast


And the ideal Utsusemi Recast set (to be swapped in mid-cast) is:
--/Sentinel's Shield/--/--
Walahra Turban/--/Loquacious Earring
Goliard Saio/Dusk Gloves +1/--/--
--/Speed Belt/Tatsumaki Sitagoromo/Dusk Ledelsens +1

2% Fast Cast, 26% Haste (25% is the Haste Cap, but generally requires 26% to actually hit it due to the fractional way Haste is calculated in-game)


Even with the best Recast set, you will still need 1 March spell to cap your recasts, but you should always aim for at least 20% gear Haste so that it will only take 1 March to cap you, leaving you open to get Mage's Ballad. You probably won't hit this at first, but the closer you get, the better.

The +Enmity Set

Contrary to what you may believe, the +Enmity set isn't as important for RDM as it is for PLD. While PLD has great Enmity-generaing Job Abilities (which are affected by +Enmity but not Haste), RDM relies on magic (which is affected by Haste) for enmity generation. This means your +Enmity set for spells is going to look a lot like your Recast set, with a few notable exceptions. First off, Duelist's Tabard and Nashira Manteel will always beat Goliard Saio in the +Enmity set, due to lacking Goliard Saio's -5 Enmity. Secondly, you can macro in things like Resentment Cape, Eris's Earring (+1), Mermaid Ring, and Harmonia's Torque. Since +Enmity is a lot more straightforward than Haste/Fast Cast, let's get down to brass tacks and list the gear + optimal set.

Quote:
Main: Macuahuitl +1 (+4 Enmity)
Sub: Shark Strap (+3 Enmity, only with 2handed Main weapon)
Ranged: None
Ammo: Aumoniere (+1 Enmity), Aumoniere +1 (+2 Enmity)
Head: Use Haste
Neck: Harmonia's Torque (+3 Enmity), Ritter Gorget (+3 Enmity), Hateful Collar (+1 Enmity)
Ear: Nemesis Earring (+1 Enmity), Eris's Earring (+2 Enmity), Eris's Earring +1 (+3 Enmity), Hades Earring (Enmity +1), Hades Earring +1 (Enmity +2)
Body: Use Haste/Fast Cast
Hands: Use Haste
Rings: Mermaid Ring (+2 Enmity), Sattva Ring (+3 Enmity)
Back: Resentment Cape (+2 Enmity), Breath Mantle (+3 Enmity: Enchantment), High Breath Mantle (+5 Enmity: Enchantment), Cerberus Mantle (+3 Enmity), Cerberus Mantle +1 (+4 Enmity)
Waist: Use Haste
Legs: Use Haste
Feet: Use Haste

Optimal Set:
Macuahuitl +1/Sentinel's Shield/Aumoniere +1
Walahra Turban/Ritter Gorget/Loquacious Earring/Eris's Earring +1
Duelist's Tabard/Dusk Gloves +1/Mermaid Ring/Sattva Ring
Cerberus Mantle +1/Speed Belt/Tatsumaki Sitagoromo/Dusk Ledelsens +1


I can not stress enough that this set is not as important as the other sets. It's nice to have good +Enmity on your spells, but realistically, if you're gimping your other sets to build this one (especially something drastic, like changing Rajas or Tamas to Sattva, merely for RDM), you're doing yourself a disservice.

The -Interruption Set

Here's an interesting set that I only learned about recently. -Spell Interruption % gear doesn't work as labeled; a -15% piece won't make you see 15% fewer interruptions, as I'm sure any mage has become familiar with. However, apparently hitting the magic number of 102% in -Interruption gear makes you literally uninterruptable other than by movement (and, therefore, knockback), Paralyze, Sleep, Silence, and Stun. The general idea of the -Interruption Set is to (like the +Enmity set) stack as much of the stat as you can without using slots you already have Haste gear in. There are figurative tons of -Interruption Gear, so I will not list it all. Instead, I will list the optimal set, and let each reader work their own set out for themself. Note: The spell Aquaveil counts as 25% Spell Interruption rate towards the 102% goal.

Quote:
Spell: Aquaveil (25%)
Main: Eremite's Wand (25%)
Sub: Eremite's Wand (25%)
Head: Use Haste
Neck: Willpower Torque (5%)
Ear: Magnetic Earring (8%), Use Fast Cast
Body: Use Haste
Hands: Use Haste
Rings: None
Back: Solitaire Cape (8%)
Waist: Use Haste (Alternatively, Ninurta's Sash for 6% Haste and 6% Spell interruption, but if you have Ninurta's and wouldn't use it here, you're stupid enough that you don't deserve to have it)
Legs: Use Haste
Feet: Use Haste
Merits: 3 Interrupt Merits (6%)

Total -Interruption: 102%


The above set sacrifices 1% Haste for Utsusemi recast in order to make the spell uninterruptable, but requires a specific Apocalypse Nigh reward, and 3 merits in -Interruption. This set is primarily used when shadows are down, and hits are causing interruption to attempts to get the Shadows back up. I recommend only using this set with Utsusemi: Ichi, partially because it will affect its shorter recast less, and partially because Utsusemi: Ni is quite easy to fit between mob swings, particularly for RDM, and the fact that this set increases its recast more than it should have to makes it undesirable for Ni. The exception, obviously, being if you have the above ideal set (or at least 20% Gear Haste), with March and Haste on (which will cap your recasts as long as you have 20% Gear Haste + 15% Haste Spell), since you'll have capped recasts anyway and this set will make you uninterruptable in the case of a double/triple attack from the mob breaking through your shadows as you try to recast. If you're not willing to spend merits/Apocalypse Nigh reward on your -Interrupt set, though, you can use something like the below.

Quote:
Spell: Aquaveil (25%)
Main: Eremite's Wand (25%)
Sub: Eremite's Wand (25%)
Head: Use Haste
Neck: Willpower Torque (5%)
Ear: Use Fast Cast
Body: Use Haste
Hands: Use Haste
Rings: None
Back: Solitaire Cape (8%)
Waist: Use Haste
Legs: Use Haste
Feet: Karasutengu Kogake (15%)

Total -Interruption: 103%



The -Magical Damage Set

This set and the next set are pretty straightforward. The purpose of each is to reduce a specific type of damage, in this case, magical damage. To use this set, generally, I just have a macro to swap into it when I need to, though it's possible to have different macro sets for Magical/Physical/Idle and use them as needed. In this case, you'll want to switch into this set to survive special moves such as Citadel Buster (Proto-Ultima), Mega Flare (Bahamut), or AoE nukes used against you (single target nukes will be absorbed by your shadows). The primary stats to focus on in this case are Magic Defense Bonus (MDB), and -Magic Damage Taken (-MDT%) which caps at -50%. INT also helps, but I mainly put it in slots where you can't get a lot of MDB/-MDT%. Like -Interruption and -Physical Damage sets, there are many options for this set, so I will not list them all, instead listing the ideal set.

Note on Defending Ring: if you have this ring and don't use it for this set, the Physical Damage set, and the Idle set, I will personally come to your house and hack your account myself.

Quote:
Spell: Shellra V (-24% MDT)
Main: Kebbie (5 MDB)
Ranged: Lamian Kaman +1 (2 MDB)
Head: Storm Turban (2 MDB)
Neck: Prudence Torque (+5 INT)
Ear: Merman's Earring x2 (-2% MDT Each)
Body: Dalmatica +1 (6 MDB)
Hands: Duelist's Gloves (2 MDB)
Rings: Defending Ring (-10% Damage Taken), Minerva's Ring (-8% Magic Damage Taken); (Most players will cap out at Mermans Ring x2 for -4% MDT each)
Back: Resentment Cape (-5% MDT)
Waist: Resolute Belt (2 MDB)
Legs: Morrigan's Slops (+10 INT)
Feet: Mahant Sandals (2 MDB)

Total -50% MDT, 21 MDB


You may avoid the Mahant Sandals if you need to move around (they have -Movement on them), and if that's the case you should probably include Crimson Cuisses for their Movement+ (it never hurts), which also have Elemental Resistances on them, which can help depending on the element of damage you're getting hit with (if you're stacking elemental resistance/have barspell + carol up on you). Just don't try to cast against Dragons (or cure Dragoons) while wearing them.


The -Physical Damage Set

The Physical Damage set is primarily used when you're getting pummeled and shadows are down (and you can't get them up for one reason or another). Examples would be while tanking a MNK that used Hundred Fists (so your shadows are down and so are your recast timers), while silenced, out of shadows, and out of Echo Drops. Basically, in a situation where things are going really bad are the times this set will see use. The stat to focus on is -Physical Damage Taken (-PDT%), and the ideal set is as follows:

Quote:
Main: Terra's Staff (-20% PDT)
Head: Darksteel Cap +1 (-2% PDT)
Neck:
Ear:
Body: Darksteel Harness +1 (-4% PDT)
Hands: Darksteel Mittens +1 (-2% PDT)
Rings: Patronus Ring (-2% PDT), Jelly Ring (-5% PDT)
Back: Umbra Cape (-6% PDT, -12% PDT at night)
Waist:
Legs: Goliard Trews (-3% PDT), Crimson Cuisses (+12% Movement Speed)
Feet: Darksteel Leggings (-2% PDT)

Total -46%/-50% PDT (Day/Night)


One thing to note about this set is the inclusion of Crimson Cuisses. They will not be useful in every case, but if you are, for example, tanking for a manaburn kill (so kiting won't be an issue) and get silenced, it may cause less enmity loss to simply kite the mob until you are not silenced anymore (providing the mob does not have enhanced movement speed).


The Idle Set

The purpose of the idle set is to wear when you're not doing anything. It should include Refresh, Regen, -Damage%, +Movement Speed, and +MP never killed anyone. Generally, just swap into this set when you're done casting, and wear it while you're running around. If you do Assaults, the Yigit Set is a prime example of Idle set gear, although there is much better (and much more highly-contested) gear out there for this same purpose. The ideal set is as follows:

Quote:
Main: Terra's Staff
Sub: Elemental Grip (any, it's for the +MP)
Ranged: Arco de Velocidad (Regen)
Head: Duelist's Chapeau (Refresh)
Neck: Orochi Nodowa (Regen)
Ear: Ethereal Earring, Reraise Earring
Body: Dalmatica/Morrigan's Robe (Refresh)
Hands: Garden Bangles (Regen)
Rings: Defending Ring, Balrahn's Ring (Refresh, when latent is active)/Jelly Ring
Back: Umbra Cape
Waist: Lycopodium Sash (Regen)
Legs: Crimson Cuisses
Feet: Cobra Crackows


During daytime only
For the sake of the idle set, they're basically the same, though Morrigan's is better for nuking and actually casting in.


While technically the Daytime-latent Regen items ARE the best for the idle set when they are active, I don't consider them worth the inventory space they use up, so I would probably just replace them with +MP gear (I would still keep the Orochi Nodowa, though). You should already have a similar setup for your RDM, even if you don't tank; it's just good sense to at least macro in a Vermillion Cloak, a Terra's Staff, and a Reraise Earring when you're not doing anything.


Section 4: Tying it all together

Ok, so you have your macros set up, your gear collected, and you understand how Enmity works. Now what? First of all, I'd recommend you try your hand at RDM tanking on something your LS is used to fighting, and show up as a backup tank. Scythefang Liger would be a good choice, since he's what I cut my teeth on, but realistically he's so easy you might not learn anything at all from him. Primary things to look for in a mob to start your career as a RDM tank against: 1) Does it double-attack? 2) Is it primarily evasion-tanked (think Charybdis)? 3) Is it kited? I'd recommend against making your maiden voyage into RDM tanking against any foe who fulfills one of these 3 conditions, saving them for when you have at least a little bit of experience and know that you can count on having your macros/gear set up properly. Something like Byakko is a lot less forgiving than Proto-Ultima or Proto-Omega, both of which look to be ideal starting mobs to tank. I realize not everyone has Sea access, so I will attempt to update this guide with my experiences with different mobs as I actually get a chance to tank them.

Rog Commentary: Any non-byakko sky god is a good starting place. They do DA, but so do 99% of mobs, so i think it IS best to start there. Mobs that do not DA are simply too easy to tank, that it's hard to learn anything by practicing against them.

A note about Composure:

Composure was added earlier this year, and has great potential for a tanking RDM, but can also ***** you up really bad if you handle it improperly. It makes your White and Black magic enhancing spells on yourself last 3 times as long, but adds a 25% Slow to spell recasts. You should aim to pop Composure while 3 shadows are up, cast Refresh, Haste, and Aquaveil on yourself, then cancel it before you re-cast either of your Utsusemi spells. Realistically, you probably won't have enough time to cast all 3 spells under just 3 shadows, so you can probably get away with casting Utsusemi: Ichi once to give you enough time to put up Aquaveil after Refresh and Haste, but I strongly recommend against ever casting Utsusemi: Ni under Composure. Remember, it's nice to have your buffs last 3 times as long, but it's nicer to not be ripped to shreds by the mob you're tanking. RDM tanking was completely do-able before Composure ever existed, so when in doubt, you can always drop Composure, cast your shadows, and live with casting Refresh/Haste/Aquaveil a little more often. Stoneskin will last 3 times as long under Composure, but since it has a 5 minute duration, it's not too much of a pain to just re-cast it every time it wears.

A side note rant about RDM's responsibilities as a tank:

This should be obvious, but seems to come as a shock to some event planners who are looking into using RDM tanks. When a RDM is a tank, treat the RDM like a tank. You wouldn't expect a PLD or NIN to cure/haste DDs while keeping hate and keeping themselves alive, would you? No! So don't expect your RDM to!

Once upon a time someone, who shall remain nameless (you know who you are if you're reading this), wanted me to A) hold/kite a secondary mob, while B) healing DDs, and C) debuffing the mob being fought. Surprise, surprise, we all died. I'm not bitter about it, it happened a while ago, but the lesson was learned: when RDM tanks, it's a tank. It needs less outside support than a PLD or NIN usually, but outside of maybe Refreshing your PLD co-tank or tossing a Cure to keep them from dying when they're in the red, you should expect a RDM tank to focus on keeping hate, and staying alive; thereby keeping your alliance alive. If you do not include a dedicated healer in your tank party ("because RDM is a healer") when you normally would for a PLD or NIN (i.e. not low-man situations), you're doing it wrong and will probably die.

Rog Commentary: This is situational. With 2 rdm tanks (or solo tanking most things), you really should NOT need any support at all, except for the brd. Trying to babysit a pld who cannot haste/refresh himself, and doesn't have enough mp (and damage mitigation) to handle keeping himself alive on the other hand is obviously ridiculous, but rdm can handle themselves just fine.

---

Finally, if you have something to add/something to correct, please let me know and I'll fix it to the best of my ability. Good luck in your RDM tanking endeavors!

Edit: Removed Chainspell, Composure, and Convert from Enmity table.

Edited, Dec 9th 2009 4:15pm by Aliekber

Edited, Dec 9th 2009 4:17pm by Aliekber
#7 Jan 10 2017 at 7:05 PM Rating: Excellent
Ya something else in the post is flagging the spam. I've contacted the developer that was working on this. Hopefully we'll get this sorted out soon.
#8 Jan 10 2017 at 7:54 PM Rating: Good
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49,660 posts
The going theory is post length, as this whole sticky of mine triggered it, and this one about the similarities and differences between FF6 and FF7, yet I can't really find any examples of word filter breaking triggering it. And believe you me, I break the poop out of that filter.
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#9 Jan 10 2017 at 8:28 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,847 posts
Ya, at first I thought it was going to be triggered by breaking the filter. But I'm pretty sure all mine are pretty much no filtered words and no breaking.

I thought maybe it was markup related. More use = higher count. I do have some relatively short messages being flagged too. Mostly in the Electoral College thread in Asylum. Quotes and stuff.
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#10 Jan 11 2017 at 8:25 AM Rating: Good
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49,660 posts
I thought markups, but then I was digging through the MCU thread looking for more examples and I've made some heavily marked up posts there and they've remained intact. Like the one with all the AMC Lucille Promos has something like thirty, while the FF6vFF7 one had less than ten.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#11 Jan 11 2017 at 3:30 PM Rating: Excellent
Our developer is looking into this.
#12 Jan 11 2017 at 4:43 PM Rating: Excellent
Everthing you ever wanted to know about RDM tanking (but were afraid to ask)

Introduction: Why I wrote this guide

Ever since I got my Duelist's Tabard last month, I've been itching to tank something on RDM/NIN, but haven't really been sure of myself being ready for the endeavor; the hardest thing I've tanked to date is Scythefang Liger (I once showed up to tank Proto-Omega RDM/NIN, but accidentally left my Shihei in my mog house--this was pre-Satchel days). Looking around, I've seen snippets of advice given here and there, but haven't seen it all pooled in one location to compare my knowledge against and make sure it all meshed together in my head properly, so I took it upon myself to create this guide to display to the best of my ability how I understand RDM tanking to work. I did this in the hope that any factual inaccuracies will be pointed out so they can be fixed and the correct knowledge passed on to everyone who reads this. Reflecting this, I sent out a copy of this to Rog in advance of posting it, and I have added in some of his commentary, marked in red text, where I felt it was more beneficial to hear exactly why he said something should be changed, rather than just change it. Other changes have been made from his suggestions as well.

In short, I wanted to create a resource for up-and-coming RDM tanks that they can read, implement, and feel confident that they are using the right approach for their RDM tank. For now, this guide aims to focus on RDM/NIN tanking as a natural complement to the current #1 preferred endgame tank: PLD/NIN. In the future, I wouldn't mind expanding it to RDM/WAR lower-level tanking (for level-capped events and XP parties) and RDM/PLD bloodtanking if the RDM/NIN guide works out well.

Section 1: Why tank on RDM?

You may be wondering why you should bother putting together a tanking set on RDM at all. If you have PLD75 or NIN75, it may not be that appealing, and it may not be for you. When you get down to it, though, it's because RDM tanking is fun. Secondly, RDM excels as a tank in low-support situations: a sufficiently-geared RDM can hit the recast cap for shadows with only a single outside March spell (everthing else is native to the RDM), we can self-cure, self-refresh, self-haste, and Slow (II) + Paralyze (II) the mob being tanked, meaning that a BRD/WHM + RDM/NIN is an absolute powerhouse when it comes to holding mobs. RDM also does well in situations where reducing magic damage taken is a real concern (Proto-Ultima, for example), and in situations where low-to-no TP feed is important (since engaging/damage-dealing is not a significant source of RDM enmity, unlike PLD).

It offers an exciting change of pace for RDMs normally stuck in the Refresh/Haste/Cure rut, and if you choose to do put in the effort, you can excel as a tank.

PLD/NIN vs. RDM/NIN: a quick rundown

There are obviously advantages to using PLDs as main tanks, since it's such a common occurance in LSs from the newest of the new to the most elite endgame shells, but before I dive into how it all works, I thought I'd break down the advantages/disadvantages of both jobs in tanking in an easy-to-understand bullet list.

PALADIN:

+ Most PLDs are already geared to tank, and have been doing it for 75 levels
+ Top-tier PLDs have access to Aegis
+ Atonement deals consistent damage against any foe, regardless of level differences
+ Invincible makes PLD temporarily immune to any melee or ranged attacks, while giving a giant VE boost.
- Requires significant support to make it work effectively/dependent on outside Refresh
- Most PLDs' tank gear is from 2004 (this is not an issue for smart DD PLD/NINs)
- Feeds TP to the mob (may or may not be an issue depending on mob)

RED MAGE:

+ Requires very little support to make it work effectively/can regenerate own MP
+ Feeds 0 TP to the mob
+ Can provide debuffs to help with tanking (Slow/Paralyze), while tanking
+ Chainspell + Utsusemi makes RDM basically untouchable by any single-target move for the duration of the 2hour (including magic, unlike PLD's Invincible)
+ Has ridiculously good defensive capability
- Ridiculously good defensive capability is usually overkill
- Does not contribute to killing speed
- Most RDMs are not geared to tank, may take convincing to even be allowed to try


Section 2: Enmity

While I would like to jump right into tanking gearsets, and macro suggestions, but I would be remiss if I didn't start out with the mechanics behind how it all works, which is FFXI's Enmity system. I realize it may be tempting to skim over this section, but I highly recommend reading it before moving on to the later sections if you are not already familiar with Kaeko's enmity model and PLD's + RDM's enmity tools.

First of all, there are two types of enmity in FFXI: Volatile Enmity (VE), and Cumulative Enmity (CE). Both cap at a value of 10,000, and are added together to determine your total enmity. Whoever on a mob's hate list has the highest total enmity is who the mob will attempt to attack. Volatile Enmity decays at a rate of 60 VE per second, or 3600 VE/min. Cumulative Enmity, on the other hand builds up and stays (it does not normally decay). As a PLD/NIN or RDM/NIN tank, there are 2 main ways to lose CE; take damage (variable by amount of damage taken) or lose an Utsusemi shadow (-25 CE). Additionally, Enmity+ and Enmity- gear/merits work by taking enmity numbers from the below tables and increasing them as a percentage (i.e. Enmity+5 will increase the enmity of an action by 5%, while Enmity-5 will decrease the enmity of an action by 5%. As a note, all Enmity numbers, research, and tables used in this guide were taken from Kaeko's enmity guide (kanican.livejournal.com), I take no credit for them.

Now that we know how enmity works as a model, let's review PLD's enmity tools, followed by RDM's enmity tools. For the sake of simplicity, we will ignore enmity tools of /NIN because they are both negligible for the purpose of tanking, and usable by both PLD and RDM (which means they have no place in a comparative guide). /NIN's most important tool (Utsusemi shadows which drastically reduce CE loss) will already be in use by both to reduce damage taken.

PALADIN

Job Ability	CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Shield Bash	1	900	15	0	0.00 
Sentinel	1	1800	30	0	0.00 
 
Spells		CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Cure		-- C --	-- C --	5	8	2.00 
Cure II		-- C --	-- C --	17	24	2.25 
Cure III	-- C --	-- C --	30	46	2.50 
Flash		180	1280	37	25	0.50 
Cure IV		-- C --	-- C --	55	88	2.50 
 
 
Weapon Skill	CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 	 	 	  
Atonement	-- D --	-- D --	Mythic	0	0.00



RED MAGE

Spells		CE	VE	Level	MP	Casting 
 	 	 
Cure		-- C --	-- C --	3	8	2.00 
Blind		1	640	8	5	2.00 
Bind		1	640	11	8	2:00 
Cure II		-- C --	-- C --	14	24	2.25 
Sleep		320	320	25	19	2.50 
Cure III	-- C --	-- C --	26	46	2.50 
Dispel		320	320	32	25	3.00 
Sleep II	480	480	46	29	3.00 
Cure IV		-- C --	-- C --	48	88	2.50


C and D mean the amount of enmity varies depending on the amount cured/damage dealt. For more information, please read Kanican's livejournal, where he explains how C and D work more in-depth than I will cover here. For the purposes of this guide, just note that while RDM has 3 very good enmity spells to generate CE, PLD is very reliant on C-and-D-derived enmity as a source of CE.

I have cropped the enmity tables from Kanican's livejournal to include only spells/abilities that are significant to the generation of enmity. As the above note says, you can see that PLD is reliant on cure-cheats and Atonement damage to consistently rack up CE, while RDM has a comparatively easy time of it with only magic. What this means is that as a RDM, when you need to generate CE, you should stick to Sleep/Dispel/Sleep II instead of spending more MP on less MP-efficient cures for enmity. The one obvious exception to this is post-Convert cures, which provide a nice enmity spike after you refill your MP.

An argument can be made for the inclusion of Poison as an enmity-generating spell, but because it costs the same as Blind, which also shares a short recast, and gives double the enmity, I chose not to include it. Poison also renders the tanking target unsleepable, which may be undesirable in some cases.

Rog Commentary: There really is no reason to ever use poison for hate. The recast on blind is low enough to spam it, with little delay. Same thing with bind (though it's even worse than poison because of the long recast, blind's low mp cost, and ridiculously fast recast make it irrelevant).

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 4:54pm by Gidono
#13 Jan 11 2017 at 4:48 PM Rating: Excellent
The above is part of a post that was given the error message. I had to trim off quite a bit in order to get this to show up.

The above is 92 lines, 1725 words, 9314 characters. Adding the next paragraph results in the error message which puts the character count over 10000. There is not special character that paragraph that would trigger a filter. So I'm thinking the character limit is right at 10000 characters.

The post this originated from is 323 lines, 6135 words, 33746 characters.

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 4:56pm by Gidono
#14 Jan 11 2017 at 4:59 PM Rating: Excellent
Screenshot

Gear: 01-20
Gear: 20-40
Gear: 40-60
Gear: 60-75
Beginner and Advanced End Game Gear Sets

The stuff I'm writing up is a guideline, and much like guidelines, they're not laws. If you don't want to take the routes I suggest, don't. I'm one of the biggest voices towards Warriors leveling all the weapons. Not for some desire for efficiency+1 (Outside Axe/Great Axe. Those are mandatory.), but because it's fun to be able to use different weapons. Bored with Rampage or Raging Rush? Switch to Vorpal Blade. Bored with that? Evisceration. Penta Thrust. There are very few weapon skills Warrior can't use, and seeing the same ones day in and day out can drive you insane.

Luckily, most gear choices aren't going to change between weapon choices, so there's little gear swapping involved.

Please, please, please, don't turn yourself into one of those "MUST GET ONE MORE PERCENT ON THE PARSER" drones. That's the fastest way to drain the fun out of the game.

Also, Warrior's main strength comes from being able to switch between weapons. While you're more than welcome to pick a single weapon / build and be done with it, you'll be a gimp Warrior over all. If you want a job that specializes in single weapons, there are several jobs that do it so much easier. Don't waste your time here. I'll always advocate that people that wish to level Warrior to keep at least a feasible Axe and Great Axe build available on them at all times, and I'll always regard people who so choose not to as people who are actively nerfing their own potential. I'll answer their questions, and help where I can, but just know that WARRIOR IS NOT A SINGLE WEAPON JOB.

Now, with the start of the guide ...

Most HQs won't be mentioned, and up to the individual to figure if the cost is worth it. There are a few exceptions, and will be explained. Items in GOLD are basically manditory items. There are few, but they are key items, and should be sought after at all costs, even if it requires you to stop exping and start farming. There are no exceptions for these. Items in RED are in place for people that happen to have them, and not available to first time through people. I mean, at all. Usually not even to people going through a few times. They're added for completion's sake. Also note gear in RED does not mean it is better than available choices. They're just the harder to obtain items that have some use. That's not to say they're not the best, but I digress.

The first section is just gear by level, and in no way meant to be taken as what you upgrade for level for level. You have to take the stats into account before choosing what you want to upgrade. Luckily, at the end of the guide there will be an explanation on how to go about doing so.

[ 01 - 04 ]
Truthfully, this short range of levels is inconsequential when it comes to choosing your gear. You can basically use the Onion Sword you start the game with, the racial start gear, and be done with it in short order. One thing that will make a nice difference isn't gear, but an Au Luit. The monsters you'll be fighting are too weak, there are no weapon skills until about level 3, and the gear itself you could buy just isn't much, if any, upgrade at all from the things you start the game with. Just slaughter the things outside, and use the drops to start funding your job. Also consider Light Crossbow +1. Having Marksmanship leveled can, and will, help you out when you want to solo, and debuffing/pulling. HQs are preferable on your ranged weapon because they tend to be cheap and worth the slight increase in cost from the NQ.

[ 05 - 09 ]
Another level range where there is little necessity to buy anything, except a Butterfly Axe. This is the first step in being a Warrior, and not just the job you started the game with, or whatever your reason is for leveling this job happens to be (Like of, sub job, et cetera) Soon this will give access to one of the best low level weapon skills in the game, SHIELD BREAK. It lowers the monster's evasion by up to 40 points, which is a MASSIVE amount that not only helps you, but everyone taking a swing at the monster. It should NOT be over looked. Note: Here on out, this guide will be more list like than prose. The first ten levels are pretty sparse as far as all this stuff, and I felt an explanation would help more than just put "N/A" or just the two items I mentioned. Also note, you don't have to go item by item. You can skip here and there, depending how you feel. Explanations will be given where I (Or someone else) feels necessary.

Weapons


[ 10 - 20 ]
Weapons
  • 12 - Greataxe
  • 12 - Hydro Axe + Hydro Pumps: Not something to look at if this is your first time through and you're just starting off, but if you've found a niche for making money, the proc rate on the Hydro Pumps is actually fairly decent, so you should consider it. *
  • 16 - Moth Axe
  • 20 - Neckchopper

Ranged

* Not applicable if using Marksmanship.

Armor (Back)
  • 1-20 - Nothing to write home about. Get what you can afford or quest.


Armor (Body)


Armor (Ear)


Armor (Feet)


Armor (Finger)

* Vision / Balance Rings aren't nearly as big a boost to your stats as Mighty/Courage Rings at this level range.[quote=milich's explanation]suppose you have 100ATT, and you add 2x mighty rings to that, fighting a mob 7 levels above you that just checks low DEF. you have...

100ATT:
100/80-.35= .9

111ATT (2 m.rings, +10ATT, +2STR)
110/80-.35= 1.025

for a 15% melee damage increase.

[sm]Edited, Jan 11th 2017 5:09pm by Gidono
#15 Jan 11 2017 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,847 posts
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=4&mid=1478621677144867839&h=50&p=7#318

I don't think this post reached 10,000 characters. It was relatively small compared to the ones in that topic. I haven't done an actual word count, but it's no where near the size of your post above. It's only about 4 paragraphs.
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#16 Jan 11 2017 at 5:10 PM Rating: Excellent
My above post was flagged right after 9369 characters, 93 lines, 1678 words. Just one more letter flagged the post.

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 5:10pm by Gidono
#17 Jan 11 2017 at 5:11 PM Rating: Excellent
Well it isn't particular words in the post you linked. It just seems to cut off early for some reason.

It gets all the way to "States with 2 or more reps may need something to allow 1 Rep to go to minority voter choice under" and then it won't allow circumstances at the end of the sentence. I posted just that word and it allows me to post it so it's not filtered.

I know the developer told me that it was looking for 10 instances of something being filtered and then it would trigger the error message. I'm trying to figure out what is filtered. I may have to get him to send me a list of these filters so I can figure it out.

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 5:22pm by Gidono
#18 Jan 11 2017 at 5:23 PM Rating: Excellent
k, I see why it's filtering me spamming Circumstances 6 times in a row, however it should allow you to post the word as often as you like. It's for some reason looking into the word and taking 3 letters from it and thinking you are posting those 3 letters as a word.

So we got 2 different things going on, a character limit and some wonky filtering.

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 5:36pm by Gidono
#19 Jan 11 2017 at 5:41 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,847 posts
Gidono wrote:
k, I see why it's filtering me spamming Circumstances 6 times in a row, however it should allow you to post the word as often as you like. It's for some reason looking into the word and taking 3 letters from it and thinking you are posting those 3 letters as a word.

So we got 2 different things going on, a character limit and some wonky filtering.


I'm looking at that word, and the word that is inside of it. But don't really see any other partial words hidden inside that post that would likely trigger anything else. And only one instance of that word.

Of course, I know that this google filter they are using flags some very strange words to filter. Who knows... maybe it thinks I'm begging for "rep". Even though this forum doesn't use the term "rep".
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Can't sleep, clown will eat me.
#20 Jan 11 2017 at 5:44 PM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,847 posts
So maybe if Rep is Repeated ten times in a post. Even if Rep is part of a word like Repair or Represent or Representative.

So Repair the Representative so they can Rep the people they are supposed to Represent.

Rep
Rep
Rep


Rep Rep.


Nope. (And I know that Rep wasn't the three letter word referred to earlier. It was just an odd word I used a lot in that post.)

Edited, Jan 11th 2017 6:44pm by TirithRR
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#21 Jan 11 2017 at 6:10 PM Rating: Good
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49,660 posts
Six regular ****s triggers it. Break the filter and ...

poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop
poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop poop

INFINITE POOP. This was a stupid filter before. Guess that's half of the equation, though I don't think the other posts in question really had six oh so naughty words like "poop" in them to warrant it being basically nuked.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#22 Jan 12 2017 at 7:16 AM Rating: Excellent
P 0.0000, 3000.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 1._Black_Spot_-_PH=a_goblin_slave
P 0.0000, 3200.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 2._Blood_of_Droga_-_PH=a_blightcaller_bloodtender
P 0.0000, 3400.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 3._Bore_-_PH=mudman_dredger
P 0.0000, 3600.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 4._Chief_Dronan_-_PH=Dronan_bodyguard
P 0.0000, 3800.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 5._Cook_Eepvibles_-_PH=a_goblin_cook
P 0.0000, 4000.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 6._Cook_Jexnait_-_PH=a_devout_goblin_cook
P 0.0000, 4200.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 7._Home_Master_Kaziql_-_PH=a_homesafe_goblin_sentry
P 0.0000, 4400.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 8._Izisyl_Peppershiv_-_PH=a_goblin_caveshadow
P 0.0000, 4600.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 9._Jailor_Muxfan_-_PH=a_goblin_jailor,_a_stalwart_goblin_jailor
P 0.0000, 4800.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 10._Master_Kizzixik_-_PH=a_goblin_slave_master,_a_goblin_slave_dealer
P 0.0000, 5000.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 11._Merchant_Triala_(Goblins_and_Fools)_-_PH=a_goblin_slinker
P 0.0000, 5200.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 12._Miner_Groundfuse_-_PH=a_goblin_dredger
P 0.0000, 5400.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 13._Most_Devout_Sentry_-_PH=a_devout_goblin_sentry
P 0.0000, 5600.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 14._Overseer_Vakov_-_PH=a_hearty_goblin_taskmaster
P 0.0000, 5800.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 15._Sentry_Rixzeel_-_PH=a_expert_goblin_sentry
P 0.0000, 6000.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 16._Spirit_Master_Wigaue_-_PH=a_goblin_fanatic
P 0.0000, 6200.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 17._Spiritwatcher_Scrollhallow_-_PH=a_goblin_mystic,_a_goblin_adept_mystic
P 0.0000, 6400.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 18._War_Leader_Callex_-_PH=a_goblin_forerunner_sentry
P 0.0000, 6600.0000, 0.0000, 240, 0, 0, 3, 19._Whip_Cracker_Krassex_-_PH=_a_goblin_whip_lord
P 0.0000, 6800.0000, 0.0000, 127, 64, 0, 3, A._Taken_Tokens_-_
P 0.0000, 7000.0000, 0.0000, 127, 64, 0, 3, B._Mountain_Death_Trinkets_-_ground_spawn_
P 0.0000, 7200.0000, 0.0000, 127, 64, 0, 3, C._Memories_of_Nurga_-_ground_spawn_
P 0.0000, 7400.0000, 0.0000, 127, 64, 0, 3, D._Stinkin`_Badges_-_

P 967.8911, 1232.9344, -174.3399, 0, 0, 240, 1, storage_containers
P 1034.9819, 1022.4257, -174.3317, 0, 0, 240, 1, storage_containers
P 212.6507, 139.8557, -173.9337, 0, 0, 240, 1, storage_containers
P 387.5265, 690.5578, -172.9634, 0, 0, 240, 1, storage_containers
P -1801.8281, -273.3923, -270.3367, 0, 0, 240, 1, storage_containers
P 337.0616, -401.8065, -174.3890, 0, 0, 240, 2, Ambassador_Tidoki_Mok`ele
P -51.4603, 440.3019, -174.3469, 0, 0, 240, 2, Deepredator_Overlord_Boilwart

P 213.4372, -416.7786, -139.6974, 240, 0, 0, 3, Home_Master_Kaziql_(roamer)
P 315.4230, -331.0820, -174.1146, 240, 0, 0, 3, Home_Master_Kaziql
P 214.2207, -633.2585, -126.4051, 240, 0, 0, 3, Sentry_Rixzeel_(roamer)
P -376.0496, -1107.2711, -62.4285, 240, 0, 0, 3, Sentry_Rixzeel
P -89.1939, -910.6046, -44.4372, 240, 0, 0, 3, Sentry_Rixzeel
P -1789.0831, -6.9842, -270.3481, 240, 0, 0, 3, Black_Spot
P -1821.7665, 32.4060, -270.3273, 240, 0, 0, 3, Black_Spot
P -1791.3029, 78.2972, -270.3128, 240, 0, 0, 3, Black_Spot
P -1954.8618, -484.7297, -266.6568, 240, 0, 0, 3, Blood_of_Droga
P 812.6353, 309.0291, -174.3843, 240, 0, 0, 3, Bore
P 769.1740, 798.2368, -174.3663, 240, 0, 0, 3, Bore
P 979.6943, 1173.8243, -174.3448, 240, 0, 0, 3, Bore
P -459.4962, 330.8136, -206.3773, 240, 0, 0, 3, Chief_Dronan
P -532.4525, 515.4521, -206.3667, 240, 0, 0, 3, Cook_Eepvibles
P -617.8842, 423.4186, -206.3626, 240, 0, 0, 3, Cook_Eepvibles
P -1636.3905, -122.7077, -254.3768, 240, 0, 0, 3, Cook_Jexnait
P -1791.7643, -291.8978, -270.3605, 240, 0, 0, 3, Cook_Jexnait
P -1743.6594, -366.0856, -270.3520, 240, 0, 0, 3, Cook_Jexnait
P -847.1312, 584.3283, -190.3924, 240, 0, 0, 3, Izisyl_Peppershiv_(roamer)
P -874.3969, 696.3525, -190.3884, 240, 0, 0, 3, Izisyl_Peppershiv
P -1044.8143, 893.4919, -190.3802, 240, 0, 0, 3, Izisyl_Peppershiv
P -1066.0044, 672.7701, -190.3734, 240, 0, 0, 3, Izisyl_Peppershiv
P -1086.3726, 84.6505, -254.3729, 240, 0, 0, 3, Jailor_Muxfan
P -1044.3635, 9.7662, -254.3695, 240, 0, 0, 3, Jailor_Muxfan
P -1217.7860, 178.0090, -254.3596, 240, 0, 0, 3, Jailor_Muxfan
P -1258.5449, 286.3879, -254.3546, 240, 0, 0, 3, Jailor_Muxfan
P -322.3642, 600.5361, -190.3298, 240, 0, 0, 3, Master_Kizzixik
P 68.8676, 505.3215, -174.4073, 240, 0, 0, 3, Master_Kizzixik
P -17.4879, 472.8980, -174.3873, 240, 0, 0, 3, Master_Kizzixik
P -1759.5768, 23.5129, -270.3383, 240, 0, 0, 3, Merchant_Triala
P 457.2361, 652.1302, -172.3529, 240, 0, 0, 3, Miner_Groundfuse
P 653.9999, 511.2281, -172.3326, 240, 0, 0, 3, Miner_Groundfuse
P 624.4907, 878.1718, -172.3100, 240, 0, 0, 3, Miner_Groundfuse
P 513.2663, 894.1696, -172.3045, 240, 0, 0, 3, Miner_Groundfuse
P -845.5073, -115.7222, -222.3513, 240, 0, 0, 3, Most_Devout_Sentry
P -877.6398, -283.1598, -219.1747, 240, 0, 0, 3, Most_Devout_Sentry
P 191.2051, 54.0366, -174.3715, 240, 0, 0, 3, Overseer_Vakov_(roamer)
P 226.9337, 116.7385, -172.3720, 240, 0, 0, 3, Overseer_Vakov
P -512.3712, -777.1022, -153.2514, 240, 0, 0, 3, Sentry_Rixzeel_(roamer)
P -2077.6633, 154.1143, -333.1735, 240, 0, 0, 3, Spirit_Master_Wigaue
P -2043.2286, 426.6647, -350.3120, 240, 0, 0, 3, Spirit_Master_Wigaue
P -2111.4897, 589.9229, -334.2849, 240, 0, 0, 3, Spirit_Master_Wigaue
P -1908.6799, -718.8333, -265.3505, 240, 0, 0, 3, Spiritwatcher_Scrollhallow
P -541.1087, -295.8369, -190.3636, 240, 0, 0, 3, War_Leader_Callex
P -567.7223, -85.9145, -190.3243, 240, 0, 0, 3, War_Leader_Callex
P -210.7822, -352.5836, -174.3647, 240, 0, 0, 3, War_Leader_Callex
P 1345.0748, 256.9368, -174.2902, 240, 0, 0, 3, Whip_Cracker_Krassex

Edited, Jan 12th 2017 7:22am by Gidono
#23 Jan 12 2017 at 7:22 AM Rating: Excellent
Adding in

P 1144.8042, 767.1546, -174.2245, 240, 0, 0, 3, Whip_Cracker_Krassex_(roamer)

to the above post flags the post.
#24 Jan 12 2017 at 8:32 AM Rating: Excellent
The developer told me the only thing he changed was if the filter sees more than 5 occurrences of "bad word" in a post, it will be filtered.

So in my above post there are 5 (roamer) words and then trying to add in another line with (roamer) triggers the filter.

Now I'm trying to figure out why that word is filtered.

(roamer)
(roamer)
(roamer)
(roamer)
(roamer)
(roamer)

.... I don't know what its doing.

If you guys want to save those posts, you might try putting them into wiki pages and linking them into the threads until we can get this filtering sorted out.

Edited, Jan 12th 2017 8:46am by Gidono
#26 Jan 12 2017 at 8:55 AM Rating: Good
Worst. Title. Ever!
*****
16,847 posts
So what is this new post filter supposed to accomplish that the individual word filter didn't? The word filter was buggy in it's current form, picking up completely legitimate words like bloody and ****, which are words used in the vocabulary of the games this site at one time supported (and still kind of does). And so far all the posts I've seen that are actually caught by this new whole post filter don't actually contain any words that were filtered. Not even words that would have been filtered and were "bypassed" by breaking the filter.

Edit:
I see they did remove Bloody from the google filter. **** is still in there.

Edited, Jan 12th 2017 9:56am by TirithRR
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