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#77 Jun 22 2016 at 9:06 PM Rating: Decent
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Kuwoobie wrote:
I bought a car from a coworker once for $200, then sold it a year later to a junk yard for $300. The cheapest insurance I could get on it was $175 a month. This was back when gas was $4 a gallon. I'd have given anything for something that resembled public transit. Sadly it's not an option for everybody.


Gez. How old are you and/or where are you living that insurance is that expensive? Especially on what I can assume is an old junker. Comprehensive coverage for my car costs about $1000/year (I think it's exactly $512 every six months). So not terribly expensive in the grand scheme of things. If I just went with collision, it would probably be about half that I think.
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#78 Jun 22 2016 at 9:17 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Kuwoobie wrote:
I bought a car from a coworker once for $200, then sold it a year later to a junk yard for $300. The cheapest insurance I could get on it was $175 a month. This was back when gas was $4 a gallon. I'd have given anything for something that resembled public transit. Sadly it's not an option for everybody.


Gez. How old are you and/or where are you living that insurance is that expensive? Especially on what I can assume is an old junker. Comprehensive coverage for my car costs about $1000/year (I think it's exactly $512 every six months). So not terribly expensive in the grand scheme of things. If I just went with collision, it would probably be about half that I think.


Yeah >2k a year is brutal. Do you have a lot of accidents? Also please tell me you weren't insuring the value of the car.
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#79 Jun 22 2016 at 9:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Friar Bijou wrote:
gbaji wrote:
Mass transit is disempowering and stupid until I need an airplane; then it's awesome!!!


ITT: Bijou shows us that he does not know that mass transit is a system for moving people around within a metropolitan area, while airplanes are used to move people from one metropolitan area to another and are thus completely different things.

But for the record, I actually dislike flying and will also avoid it when possible. It's just that when you need to travel great distances, it's generally by far the best option. But yeah, if I've got the time for a leisurely 5-6 day drive across the country, I'll take that option over flying. Heck. Might just see some stuff along the way. Heaven forbid we live our lives instead of rushing from place to place all the time.
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#80 Jun 22 2016 at 10:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
You could make 3 or 4 car payments a month on the difference in just average rental price between San Diego and NYC. So that wonderful mass transit system does come with a high cost. And it's also kind of a cart leading the horse too, right?

Well, no. You're not paying more to live in an area with a robust mass transit system, you're paying more to live in an extremely popular place to live. Thus, property is at more of a premium. The mass transit system helps make that population density possible but the root cause of the property costs is the fact that eight million other people want to live in the same place.

I don't care about the "lifestyle you've chosen", I just found it funny that you'd be smug about having lots of roads. San Diego is a glorified suburb, of course it has lots of roads. There's a lot of roads and parking lots out here in suburbia where I live too, I just never thought that they were noteworthy.
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#82 Jun 22 2016 at 11:54 PM Rating: Good
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Average rent in San Diego is $1,630, NYC is $2,000, and the average per month cost of a car is $430 a month. Average collision insurance in San Diego is $440, and California's gas prices are about $2.80 gallon. Thirty day unlimited Metro Card is $113.

So $2,113 a month in NYC, $2,500 $2,096* (not including gas) for San Diego. So not really impressive, considering one is still New York and the other is San Diego.

(* It's late, I did the math wrong.)

Edited, Jun 23rd 2016 2:36am by lolgaxe
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#83 Jun 23 2016 at 1:27 AM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
Kuwoobie wrote:
I bought a car from a coworker once for $200, then sold it a year later to a junk yard for $300. The cheapest insurance I could get on it was $175 a month. This was back when gas was $4 a gallon. I'd have given anything for something that resembled public transit. Sadly it's not an option for everybody.


Gez. How old are you and/or where are you living that insurance is that expensive? Especially on what I can assume is an old junker. Comprehensive coverage for my car costs about $1000/year (I think it's exactly $512 every six months). So not terribly expensive in the grand scheme of things. If I just went with collision, it would probably be about half that I think.


It's funny. I wrote a lot about the things that happened back then on here already years ago and in much more detail. I know nobody can remember but it still feels ****** having to repeat everything. Thing is, I don't much remember either. It was some time back around 2007-2008ish. It was a pretty decent car for the price. Got me from point A to point B pretty effectively, despite having virtually no interior save for the front and passenger seat. I guess being a new driver in Florida is expensive insurance wise. A lot of really bad **** happened. I learned to deal with it the same way as everything else-- by not going anywhere or doing anything. Things like car insurance are now completely out of my jurisdiction and I won't even pretend to know how all that **** works now.
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#84 Jun 23 2016 at 10:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
There's a lot of roads and parking lots out here in suburbia where I live too, I just never thought that they were noteworthy.
Never take parking lots for granted. My workplace got banned from adding new ones a couple of decades ago, now there's 1 parking space for every 2.5 employees. Smiley: frown
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#85 Jun 23 2016 at 12:47 PM Rating: Good
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Eh, Portland has great mass transit, I didn't have a car the entire time I lived there, which was about 14 years.
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#86 Jun 23 2016 at 1:00 PM Rating: Good
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someproteinguy wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
There's a lot of roads and parking lots out here in suburbia where I live too, I just never thought that they were noteworthy.
Never take parking lots for granted. My workplace got banned from adding new ones a couple of decades ago, now there's 1 parking space for every 2.5 employees. Smiley: frown


Banned from building parking lots? For what reason?
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#87 Jun 23 2016 at 1:03 PM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
Banned from building parking lots? For what reason?

Storm water mitigation is my immediate guess. A lot of places around here you need so much greenspace to act as detention areas so the storm water system doesn't get overwhelmed by parking lot runoff.
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#88 Jun 23 2016 at 1:23 PM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
someproteinguy wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
There's a lot of roads and parking lots out here in suburbia where I live too, I just never thought that they were noteworthy.
Never take parking lots for granted. My workplace got banned from adding new ones a couple of decades ago, now there's 1 parking space for every 2.5 employees. Smiley: frown


Banned from building parking lots? For what reason?
Road capacity mainly.

Basically it's a hospital in a relatively wealthy area that's fed by small roads that have to go up a steep hill side. Improving the roads isn't really possible without a massive construction project which would involve significantly reworking the hillside and whatnot. Traffic levels were high enough that they were snarling the roadways and upsetting the wealthy neighbors who had the political means to place restrictions in the neighborhood, so they did. Note: not that I blame the city council for agreeing with the wealthy neighbors, frankly it was probably the best decision.

On the plus side the solution has made my morning commute more pretty. Smiley: grin

Really should snap some better pictures myself at some point; all mine were super tiny and from an old cellphone.

Edited, Jun 23rd 2016 12:26pm by someproteinguy
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#89 Jun 23 2016 at 1:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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Professor stupidmonkey wrote:
Eh, Portland has great mass transit, I didn't have a car the entire time I lived there, which was about 14 years.
Its saving grace to be sure. They really did a good job here. There are still times I wish I could drive to work though. Every time we look at potential places to live we're constantly restricted to being within walking distance of a bus stop, which is fine until you get out into the suburbs a ways and the bus lines thin out. In which case being within a mile or so of the bus stop tends to restrict you to neighborhoods the wife doesn't want to live in. Smiley: frown
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#90 Jun 23 2016 at 2:56 PM Rating: Decent
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lolgaxe wrote:
Average rent in San Diego is $1,630, NYC is $2,000, and the average per month cost of a car is $430 a month. Average collision insurance in San Diego is $440, and California's gas prices are about $2.80 gallon. Thirty day unlimited Metro Card is $113.

So $2,113 a month in NYC, $2,500 $2,096* (not including gas) for San Diego. So not really impressive, considering one is still New York and the other is San Diego.

(* It's late, I did the math wrong.)


Your math is way off. Median 2 bedroom apartment rent in San Diego is $1795/month. Median 2 bedroom apartment in NYC is $3500/month. Average car payment per month for a new car is $479. A used car will be much less expensive (but may have other expenses attached). Gas depends on how much you drive, obviously. But if we assume an average of 12,000 miles per year, that's 1000 miles per month, which at 22 average mpg works out to about 45.5 gallons of gas, which at $2.80/gallon works out to about $127/month for gas (um... not much more than the metro card, but usable 24 hours a day and not just until midnight).

Insurance should bake out to less than $100/month. Driving in San Diego is still much much less expensive than taking the bus/rail in NYC. And this assumes that all of your transportation needs can be met with the metro system.

Of course, one you've paid of your car, the only expense is gas, insurance, and maintenance. Which, while certainly more expensive than the cost of a monthly metro pass, is far far more convenient. I'll gladly pay an extra hundred bucks a month or so to have a 10 minute commute rather than 1 hour, and be able to bop over to any store or restaurant or whatever whenever I want for any reason I want. Or run over to a friends house at any time of the night or day without having to think about bus schedules and transfers or worrying about how I'm going to get home afterwards.
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#91 Jun 23 2016 at 5:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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While everything you posted may be true, you left out the number one negative! You have to live in San Diego!
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#92 Jun 23 2016 at 5:18 PM Rating: Good
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Mass Transit doesn't shut down in major cities at night here on the east coast. Some lines may shut down at night, but they tend to be ones that only go into upper class neighborhoods that only want buses, so their housekeepers can get to and from work. Many people who work in NYC take trains from the suburbs also. My uncle rode a van service to and from home to the train station in White Plains. The car was used mostly by my aunt for shopping and for traveling.

My sister works in Washington D.C. and gets to work by train from Philadelphia, which she get to by a commuter train from a parking lot in Cherry Hill N.J. Course the fact that she works for Amtrak does have something to do with her choice to commute that far to work. But then many people on the east coast from the suburbs of Boston to Washington D.C, take the train to get between major cities, to get to work each day.

I used to take a bus that went through one neighborhood once in the morning and again once in the afternoon. Each morning I would ride the bus with several women, who would get pick up at the one bus stop in the neighborhood by the women they worked for. The same neighborhood worked hard to prevent a light rail stop being built where it ran through the area.

Another bus line only operates limited hours, because of the fact that city school students need to get to the best public elementary/middle school in the city. Also so the retirees can go downtown to museums and a few bankers can commute to work. No need to ride a bus into the pricey neighborhood in the evening or overnight. Everyone that lives there own cars. Oh and the kids that go to the privates school on scholarship also do use the bus to get to the exclusive school that surround the one public school.

Another option we have here are more bike routes to work and buses and trains that allow you to take your bike with you.

Then we live in places that where developed way before horseless carriages and were trains lines in the USA were first built. With lots of hills, mountains and waterways to plan around too. Guess that why the only city that has decent public transit in California is San Fransisco.
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#93 Jun 23 2016 at 5:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, Gbaji's perceptions are obviously based around having limited to no experience with a real mass transit system. Which is fine but not really worth arguing about when one party has no frame of reference.
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#94 Jun 24 2016 at 7:41 AM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
(um... not much more than the metro card, but usable 24 hours a day and not just until midnight).
What? ... Wait, no, okay, I see. The card works until midnight of the thirtieth day. As in it expires on the thirty-first day. It's 25/8 the rest of the time. And if I really need it at 0001 of the thirty-first day then I just buy a new one from the vending machine since I'm going to anyway. I mean, I understand the mistake. Country bumpkins that visit do it all the time.
gbaji wrote:
Driving in San Diego is still much much less expensive than taking the bus/rail in NYC.
$227 (gas and insurance, your numbers)/month is "much much" less than $113/month? Smiley: dubious
gbaji wrote:
I'll gladly pay an extra hundred bucks a month or so to have a 10 minute commute rather than 1 hour, and be able to bop over to any store or restaurant or whatever whenever I want for any reason I want. Or run over to a friends house at any time of the night or day without having to think about bus schedules and transfers or worrying about how I'm going to get home afterwards.
It takes me five minutes to walk to the station, maybe fifteen~twenty minutes to my stop, and another five to my office, but during that time I'm getting a ten minute walk and during that ride I read. I can "bop" over to any store or restaurant or whatever whenever I want for any reason I want, run over to a friend's house at any time day or night without thinking about bus schedules and transfers or worrying about getting home afterwards as well. Kind of why they're called "schedules."
Jophiel wrote:
Which is fine but not really worth arguing about when one party has no frame of reference.
Either this or vacuum my own office and I would never rob my minions of the grand experience of doing menial labor.
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#95 Jun 24 2016 at 7:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
It takes me five minutes to walk to the station, maybe fifteen~twenty minutes to my stop, and another five to my office, but during that time I'm getting a ten minute walk and during that ride I read. I can "bop" over to any store or restaurant or whatever whenever I want for any reason I want, run over to a friend's house at any time day or night without thinking about bus schedules and transfers or worrying about getting home afterwards as well. Kind of why they're called "schedules."

Or, you know, for those occasions where a direct A to B route in a car would be helpful they have these things now called "cabs" or "Uber" or, ****, bike rental stations depending on the city.
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#96 Jun 24 2016 at 8:01 AM Rating: Good
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And since it's a city, most everything is relatively close so walking is viable. Having options is such a wonderful thing.
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#97 Jun 24 2016 at 9:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jophiel wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
It takes me five minutes to walk to the station, maybe fifteen~twenty minutes to my stop, and another five to my office, but during that time I'm getting a ten minute walk and during that ride I read. I can "bop" over to any store or restaurant or whatever whenever I want for any reason I want, run over to a friend's house at any time day or night without thinking about bus schedules and transfers or worrying about getting home afterwards as well. Kind of why they're called "schedules."

Or, you know, for those occasions where a direct A to B route in a car would be helpful they have these things now called "cabs" or "Uber" or, ****, bike rental stations depending on the city.
Let's be honest, no one wants to ride one of those ugly bikes.
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#98 Jun 24 2016 at 2:01 PM Rating: Good
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I never really looked at the pricing for those bikes because I don't have a beard and wear pants that crush my balls, but it's kind of ridiculous. The Citibike is $12 for twenty-four hour pass for unlimited thirty minute rides, with each additional half hour being more and more expensive (2.50, 6.00, 9.00 Wrong pass. 4.00 per each additional 15 minutes after the initial half hour.) So ride for 29 minutes, put it up, pick up another bike for another 29 minutes, repeat .... It's like one big hipster tax.

Edited, Jun 24th 2016 4:13pm by lolgaxe
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#99 Jun 24 2016 at 2:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Looks like it's $10 a month here for an annual subscription (or $10 for a 24hr pass) -- free 30min trips, $2 for 30-60, $6 for 60-90 and $8 each additional half hour.

I can't imagine wanting to take a two hour bike ride through the city. Whatever is 120 biking minutes away, I'm reaching by some other means. If it's just 30min away, you get there, check in the bike and you're done. Looking at it, you could probably take longer trips just by docking/releasing the bike along the way at the various stations since docking a bike resets the clock.

But I can't say that I ever used the service so I can't speak for it in practice. I assume the bikes are "distinctive" to reduce the attractiveness of theft.

Edited, Jun 24th 2016 3:18pm by Jophiel
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#100 Jun 24 2016 at 4:38 PM Rating: Good
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I don't like bikes in general. Not something I'd be comfortable taking on the road.
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#101 Jun 24 2016 at 5:31 PM Rating: Good
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They have a pretty effective system for stopping people from riding bikes here. Basically, they're very strict about people not riding them on the sidewalk(in any of the few places there are such sidewalks). You must ride them on the 1 foot of space between busy traffic and the curb they call the "bicycle lane" where you will almost assuredly be clipped or run over by motored vehicles or cause an accident should they actually try to not run you over.

Traffic here is a serious problem. They'd rather pay to expand the main roads every couple of years than invest in any sort of public transit. I mean, technically there is a bus route but it is extremely low quality compared to what one would expect. It only runs on very specific hours, and not at all on Sundays. I used to try and ride them to work but they frequently did not show up at all causing me to be very late for my ****** Walmart job at the time. It's as if they made it that way on purpose so they could say "See? Public transportation sucks. Buy more cars."

--also, if you use Uber around here, the drivers will murder you.
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