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The Civic Lesson every American should need.Follow

#1 Sep 06 2016 at 8:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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Jim Wright wrote a great essay on his Facebook page that was share far and wide over the last week. He got lots of praise for it and also the normal amount of hate mail which he share some of the funnies ones over the course of the week. With his permission it got publish over on AmericanX also.

Well he expanded on the original essay over on his Blog, StoneKettle Station.

This is what my mother and father taught me growing up. Respect for America and it's Flag must be earn and when it isn't we have a Right in this country to sit down, walk out or raise our fists in protest, while it is sung or played , when ever and where ever.

When they came to watch me walk across my High School stage and receive my HS diploma, they didn't stand for either the Nation Anthem or Pledge of alliance. They lived through too much of their lives seeing how hateful and ugly America can be to it's citizens to be able to respect either. They love America and spent all their lives working to make life better for all of us. They taught me how important it is to vote in each election and if your candidate didn't win the primary, to vote for the better of the two that did. Most of all, though they were against going to war, for most reasons, they taught me there where times when we must go into battle. They honor military service of others, while hoping none of their children would have to serve.

So please read Jim Wright's essay and think about why Colin Kaepernick has exercised his right of Free Speech.
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This Post is written in Elnese, If it was an actual Post, it would make sense.
#2 Sep 06 2016 at 8:26 AM Rating: Good
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Why is an illiterate man working as a political essayist? That's the question I'll be pondering.
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#3 Sep 06 2016 at 8:33 AM Rating: Good
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If he was a woman, would she be getting the same amount of shares as him? Classic Elne misogyny.
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#4 Sep 06 2016 at 8:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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ElneClare wrote:
Kaepernick has exercised his right of Free Speech.
Meh, he sat during a two minute song. Get back to me when he actually does something. Like taking the money from the increase in merchandise sales and gives it to organizations he says he's sitting down for.
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#5 Sep 06 2016 at 8:37 AM Rating: Good
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Well, it's cost him in the sense that there's a massive backlash against him and it's (maybe?) helped in that he's caused a massive national conversation. I mean, that these things are true is ******* stupid, but they are.
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#6 Sep 06 2016 at 8:39 AM Rating: Good
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Did you even take the time to read the whole essay? He's human and I wish I was able to write a sentence with less spelling and grammar mistakes, then he may make in one essay. He doesn't have someone edit them before hand. It's what we minions do, and he always respects those who point out his mistakes and corrects them, while thanking us.

BTW if you hadn't realize, I didn't quote any of his essay in my post.
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This Post is written in Elnese, If it was an actual Post, it would make sense.
#7 Sep 06 2016 at 9:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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If you want a better nation, you have to be better citizens.
That's crazy talk. Smiley: rolleyes
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#8 Sep 06 2016 at 10:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Did you even take the time to read the whole essay? He's human

Certainly his highest qualification.

Yeah, I read the article. Your parents must have used you as a yo-yo if you think sentimental appeals to Americans' self perception as the 'the good guys' travel an inch beyond your borders. I'm glad he's not as much of a war-mongering child killer as your other hero, but his clumsy, sappy tripe is about as relevant and appealing to me as a Backstreet Boys reunion tour.

You don't need an editor to produce a professional piece of content that doesn't look like it was drafted in crayon. You just need to give a ****.
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#9 Sep 06 2016 at 11:39 AM Rating: Good
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More of an NSYNC guy I take it?


Edited, Sep 6th 2016 12:39pm by Allegory
#10 Sep 06 2016 at 12:00 PM Rating: Good
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They're just on hiatus!
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#11 Sep 07 2016 at 9:06 AM Rating: Good
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Those boybands need to make another direct-to-ScyFy movie.
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#12 Sep 07 2016 at 5:38 PM Rating: Good
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Be the nation he can respect.

No one person, especially a mediocre QB riding the reputation of one good season, is the moral arbiter of America.
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#13 Sep 07 2016 at 5:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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ElneClare wrote:
So please read Jim Wright's essay and think about why Colin Kaepernick has exercised his right of Free Speech.


Kaepernick is entitled to his speech, and Mr. Wright is entitled to his opinion, but those facts don't make them correct on the issue, nor in line with how most people feel about the issue itself. I think that the essay misses a key point. Yes, respect has to be earned, but that's not the issue here. When standing and showing respect for the flag during the national anthem, you are not showing respect to the piece of cloth flapping in the breeze, nor to the person singing the song, nor to the current state of the country itself, it's policies, laws, etc. You are showing respect to the ideals that the country strives to achieve, as represented by the very constitution he speaks of. He got it in the first part, that the founding fathers were not perfect and knew that the nation they were creating was not perfect (they allowed for the institution of slavery, after all, despite it being clearly in opposition to the most basic concept of rights that they were using as the founding principle of the nation).

It's the ideal that the flag represents. It's the ideal that you are saluting when you salute it. And it's the ideal that you are respecting when you stand for the anthem. My issue with Kaepernick is that by refusing to show that respect, he isn't making a statement about the current state of the US but essentially saying that the ideals are wrong. This is essentially "giving up" on the concept of a nation based on the rights of individuals ever being able to be "good" in his eyes. And the problem with that is that when you don't care about something, you're not likely to spend any effort fixing it or maintaining it. When people say they love their country, they aren't idiots who are unaware of the flaws, but rather that they believe that if they work to make the country better, it can come as close as possible to the ideals that we all (presumably) hold. If you hate your country, then what? Are you going to work to fix it? Why? You've just stated, quite emphatically that you don't just dislike the country, but the ideals that the country is founded on.

Because that's what the flag really represents. And yeah, you have the freedom to disrespect it. To burn it in effigy if you want. To stomp on it if you want. But you can't do that and then claim you are trying to make things "better". You're just making a show. And mostly you're showing your own misunderstanding of what the flag and anthem really are about. Again, how can you possibly strive to make the US a better country, if you don't know what the ideals of the country are, nor seem to care about them? Now maybe he's just misinformed and he thinks that standing for the anthem means accepting the status quo of the nation as it is now, and that's something he doesn't want to do. And I can even understand that. But that is his own misunderstanding of things. If that was what it was about then you'd have to conclude that the founders didn't really think slavery was wrong, because they thought respect for the symbols of the nation was important, even while knowing quite well that the nation they had built was far from perfect.


It's the ideals that matter in this case. Because it's a symbol of those ideals. And that's what Kaepernick is disrespecting when he refuses to stand for the anthem. And yeah, I have an issue with that.
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#14 Sep 07 2016 at 7:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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Demea wrote:
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Be the nation he can respect.
No one person, especially a mediocre QB riding the reputation of one good season, is the moral arbiter of America.

Tell that to all the people who spontaneously orgasmed whenever Tebow would take a knee in prayer.
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#15 Sep 07 2016 at 7:24 PM Rating: Good
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He's not a mediocre QB anymore; he's a shitty, god-awful baseball wannabe.
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#16 Sep 07 2016 at 8:07 PM Rating: Decent
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Jophiel wrote:
Demea wrote:
Quote:
Be the nation he can respect.
No one person, especially a mediocre QB riding the reputation of one good season, is the moral arbiter of America.

Tell that to all the people who spontaneously orgasmed whenever Tebow would take a knee in prayer.


Fair or not, anyone with celebrity status tends to have an impact on other people, and at least in the case of most sport figures, are viewed by many as role models. I don't think that makes them the "arbiters" of anything, but others do look up to them, and thus expect a degree of reasonable behavior from them. At the very least, the NFL makes a decent portion of its earnings on things like ticket sales and merchandise (like say, player's numbers on shirts and hats). These are driven in large part by people's desires to see their favorite teams and their favorite players play the game. When players behave badly, it hurts the franchise. And yes, "badly" is a subjective term. But for a whole lot of people, when their kids ask them why Kaepernick didn't do what they were taught you're supposed to do during the anthem, it's going to be a blow to their desire to continue supporting said franchise with their ticket purchases. At the very least, a lot of people aren't going to buy anything with his name or number on it as a direct result of his choice.

If he's cool with that, then that's fine. It's his choice, and he's free to make it. I just think it's an incredibly misguided method of protest. He's not drawing attention to anything other than himself. And not in a good way.
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#17 Sep 07 2016 at 9:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
ElneClare wrote:
So please read Jim Wright's essay and think about why Colin Kaepernick has exercised his right of Free Speech.


Kaepernick is entitled to his speech, and Mr. Wright is entitled to his opinion, but those facts don't make them correct on the issue, nor in line with how most people feel about the issue itself. I think that the essay misses a key point. Yes, respect has to be earned, but that's not the issue here. When standing and showing respect for the flag during the national anthem, you are not showing respect to the piece of cloth flapping in the breeze, nor to the person singing the song, nor to the current state of the country itself, it's policies, laws, etc. You are showing respect to the ideals that the country strives to achieve, as represented by the very constitution he speaks of. He got it in the first part, that the founding fathers were not perfect and knew that the nation they were creating was not perfect (they allowed for the institution of slavery, after all, despite it being clearly in opposition to the most basic concept of rights that they were using as the founding principle of the nation).

It's the ideal that the flag represents. It's the ideal that you are saluting when you salute it. And it's the ideal that you are respecting when you stand for the anthem. My issue with Kaepernick is that by refusing to show that respect, he isn't making a statement about the current state of the US but essentially saying that the ideals are wrong. This is essentially "giving up" on the concept of a nation based on the rights of individuals ever being able to be "good" in his eyes. And the problem with that is that when you don't care about something, you're not likely to spend any effort fixing it or maintaining it. When people say they love their country, they aren't idiots who are unaware of the flaws, but rather that they believe that if they work to make the country better, it can come as close as possible to the ideals that we all (presumably) hold. If you hate your country, then what? Are you going to work to fix it? Why? You've just stated, quite emphatically that you don't just dislike the country, but the ideals that the country is founded on.

Because that's what the flag really represents. And yeah, you have the freedom to disrespect it. To burn it in effigy if you want. To stomp on it if you want. But you can't do that and then claim you are trying to make things "better". You're just making a show. And mostly you're showing your own misunderstanding of what the flag and anthem really are about. Again, how can you possibly strive to make the US a better country, if you don't know what the ideals of the country are, nor seem to care about them? Now maybe he's just misinformed and he thinks that standing for the anthem means accepting the status quo of the nation as it is now, and that's something he doesn't want to do. And I can even understand that. But that is his own misunderstanding of things. If that was what it was about then you'd have to conclude that the founders didn't really think slavery was wrong, because they thought respect for the symbols of the nation was important, even while knowing quite well that the nation they had built was far from perfect.


It's the ideals that matter in this case. Because it's a symbol of those ideals. And that's what Kaepernick is disrespecting when he refuses to stand for the anthem. And yeah, I have an issue with that.
A rare occasion where I agree with gbaji.

Rate-ups for you, you nut.
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#18 Sep 07 2016 at 11:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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Edited, Sep 8th 2016 12:16am by Jophiel
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#19 Sep 07 2016 at 11:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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gbaji wrote:
Jophiel wrote:
Demea wrote:
Quote:
Be the nation he can respect.
No one person, especially a mediocre QB riding the reputation of one good season, is the moral arbiter of America.
Tell that to all the people who spontaneously orgasmed whenever Tebow would take a knee in prayer.
Fair or not, anyone with celebrity status...

It was a joke. I don't give a fuck about either of them. The only reason I know either of their names is from the batshit, over the top reactions to their "thing".
gbaji wrote:
But for a whole lot of people, when their kids ask them why Kaepernick didn't do what they were taught you're supposed to do during the anthem, it's going to be a blow to their desire to continue supporting said franchise with their ticket purchases. At the very least, a lot of people aren't going to buy anything with his name or number on it as a direct result of his choice.
USA Today wrote:
ESPN’s Darren Rovell reports that Colin Kaepernick jerseys have flown off the shelves following his initial protest during the 49ers preseason game against Green Bay in August. A source confirmed to ESPN that more Kaepernick merchandise sold last week off the 49ers site than it did in the past eight months combined.
NBC wrote:
Kaepernick's No. 7 was the fifth-highest selling jersey among league members over the weekend and was slowly creeping toward the pinnacle when it locked down the top-selling spot Tuesday morning, according to NFLShop.com.

Both of Kaepernick's home and away jerseys are also the top sellers among 49ers players, according to Shop49ers.com.


Edited, Sep 8th 2016 12:23am by Jophiel
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#20 Sep 08 2016 at 8:49 AM Rating: Good
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Friar Bijou wrote:
]A rare occasion where I agree with gbaji.
Too bad he mucked it up with his follow up post. It's actually pretty common for merchandising sales to increase after quote unquote controversies. In fact a lot of idiots buy things they normally wouldn't just to publicly destroy them.
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#21 Sep 08 2016 at 9:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
Friar Bijou wrote:
]A rare occasion where I agree with gbaji.
Too bad he mucked it up with his follow up post. It's actually pretty common for merchandising sales to increase after quote unquote controversies. In fact a lot of idiots buy things they normally wouldn't just to publicly destroy them.
This was always my favorite kind of protester. Same kind that shows up to an anti-globalization rally wearing clothes made in Singapore, talking on a cell phone assembled in China, while nursing a Starbucks Peppermint Mocha.
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#22 Sep 08 2016 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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That's not ironic, though, is it? You can't choose not to participate in globalisation as a single person, the infrastructure makes those decisions for you. I wouldn't have limited consumer choices if I said nuts to globalisation, I'd have none. I'd show up to the rally starving, with no clothes and drinking a watery acorn mash I'd made myself.

It's like saying it's hypocritical to protest Nazism because you're doing it in **** Germany. Yeah, no ****.

P.S. Anyone who cares, even slightly, whether someone kneels for the flag or not is absolutely ****** in the head.
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#23 Sep 08 2016 at 10:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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Kavekkk wrote:
You can't choose not to participate in globalisation as a single person, the infrastructure makes those decisions for you. I wouldn't have limited consumer choices if I said nuts to globalisation, I'd have none. I'd show up to the rally starving, with no clothes and drinking a watery acorn mash I'd made myself.
If I wanted to buy "made in America" stuff, stick to locally grown foods, only support homegrown businesses, etc it wouldn't be too difficult. There's a good number of options for those things here. I'd just be paying 25% more.
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#24 Sep 08 2016 at 10:45 AM Rating: Good
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Don't be disingenuous. A made in America sticker doesn't mean something wasn't produced as a result of global manufacturing and supply chains. Most small businesses don't actually make all their own ****, either, I should point out. Most own brand goods are mass produced on one of the lines of a large multinational company. The vast majority of products anywhere will have been designed or partially (the main part if you catch my drift) assembled in another country, or will use raw materials from another country/be made by a multinational (not sure which of these makes Starbucks fall foul in your view).

You wouldn't be using a ******* computer to argue with me right now, I'll tell you that.
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#25 Sep 08 2016 at 10:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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#26 Sep 08 2016 at 11:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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Kavekkk wrote:
A made in America sticker doesn't mean something wasn't produced as a result of global manufacturing and supply chains. Most small businesses don't actually make all their own ****, either, I should point out. Most own brand goods are mass produced on one of the lines of a large multinational company.
Which is why you get that information from them. If you can't get it, move on to someone who's open with that information. It's not hard to get local stuff, you just have to be not lazy about it. If you can't bother to be not lazy about it, I'd wonder why you were bothering to protest. Actions speaking louder than words and such. How the heck are you going to fight globalization if you can't even be bothered to track down which products are actually local?

Kavekkk wrote:
You wouldn't be using a ******* computer to argue with me right now, I'll tell you that.
Nope wouldn't. Also wouldn't be going to an anti-globalization rally either, so at least I'm consistent in that regard.

Edited, Sep 8th 2016 10:15am by someproteinguy
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