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Avengers: Infinity WarFollow

#1 Apr 28 2018 at 10:32 PM Rating: Good
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Just went and saw it in the local theater with my wife. I honestly don't know what to think about it. I enjoyed it a lot. Sure. It was what I would consider a good movie. Sure. I think it would have been a lot better if I had seen ALL of the movies leading up to it, and not just a couple of said movies.

I've seen the first Avengers movie, and I watched Age of Ultron yesterday in a last ditch attempt to catch up on everything. I have never seen Dr. Strange. I have never seen the Guardians of the Galaxy 1 or 2. I've seen the first Thor movie but that's all. So there were a lot of characters I still wasn't terribly familiar with. I've seen most of the Iron Man films... and I'm not sure what else I'm missing.

Basically the movie was everything I expected it to be. Heroes from across various Marvel franchises battle against Purple Shrek as he gathers the pieces of the Dragon Balls Triforce to become omnipotent so he can instantaneously enforce his incredibly simplistic ideology on the whole of the universe. Purple Shrek wins, but at what cost? At what cost Purple Shrek? You has a sad now. Roll credits.

Well, that was depressing. But I don't really think there could have been any different ending to that. I kinda sort of agree with Thanos. I think that is kind of the point of the movie. It's like he's the protagonist all along. It's a movie about him, really.
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#2 Apr 29 2018 at 1:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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Note: I'm not spoiler tagging anything because if you're reading an Infinity War thread expecting not to see spoilers, you're due for an education.

Thanos has a stupid plan anyway. Population growth increases exponentially. We've doubled the population of Earth from 1950 to today. Unless his plan is to dust 50% of the universe every fifty years (a blink of an eye in cosmic time), he accomplished nothing worthwhile. He would have been better off going around the universe handing out condoms and teaching people about renewable energy and recycling.

Had fun with the movie though. Was fun to see the Guardians of the Galaxy interacting with the Avengers and splitting the GotG was a good move to have more interactions. Some entertaining action, lots of quips, standard fun comic movie stuff. I sort of feel like the Earth people should have reacted to Rocket a little more. I mean, you see some obvious alien two headed thing talking and you're like "Ok, so I guess this guy can talk". You see a raccoon talking and carrying a gun and you'd be more "Wtf?"

By the way, you should see at least the first GotG movie. Good times.

Was hard to worry much about the ending deaths since half of those people already have solo MCU movies in the hopper set to be released. That's fine, I watch this type of movie for the journey so seeing the next one to see how they'll be brought back is why I go. I predict that Ant-Man will save the entire universe. Prove me wrong!
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#3 Apr 29 2018 at 2:55 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm actually slightly more interested in seeing Antman and the Wasp now. Half of the people on the planet just got wiped out. That has to have more of an effect on the the movie than a couple of references tossed in to remind everyone that this is all happening in the same universe.
#4 Apr 30 2018 at 6:26 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
Thanos has a stupid plan anyway. Population growth increases exponentially. We've doubled the population of Earth from 1950 to today. Unless his plan is to dust 50% of the universe every fifty years (a blink of an eye in cosmic time), he accomplished nothing worthwhile. He would have been better off going around the universe handing out condoms and teaching people about renewable energy and recycling.


I don't think anyone really ever says a person advocating universal genocide has a well thought out plan. But I think there's a difference between established population growth and growth after catastrophic population death. He did have the example of what Gamora's home planet was like (doing very well) vs what his home planet was like (desert wasteland).

Also his finger snap didn't seem to care about race. Technically wasn't Quill the last of his kind? So he shouldn't have been wiped out of existence.

I'm curious to see if SHIELD will be in the same time as the movie universe, or if they'll keep them separated and allow the TV show to continue unaffected by Infinity War.
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#5 Apr 30 2018 at 7:39 AM Rating: Excellent
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TirithRR wrote:
I don't think anyone really ever says a person advocating universal genocide has a well thought out plan. But I think there's a difference between established population growth and growth after catastrophic population death.

Well, population recovered within 150 years following the Black Death that wiped out ~40% of Europe and results were actually worse for the environment. Because labor was in short supply, crop farming was more difficult and expensive so, instead, they just cut down all the forests and converted the land to pasture to raise livestock. That's probably the best real life corollary we have. His example is Gamora's planet but, uh, that was only around twenty years earlier. Not exactly playing the long game there.

I suppose some alien race may breed like pandas and take 40,000 years to recover but I live here on Earth so I don't care about them.

However, yes, Thanos' issue wasn't that he had a workable idea that just needed some tinkering with the numbers, it's that he was evil and had a stupid evil idea. I mainly pointed it out because I've been reading people who are at least sympathetic to his plan if not the execution. It's a dumb, unworkable plan.
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#6 Apr 30 2018 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
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Turin wrote:
I'm actually slightly more interested in seeing Antman and the Wasp now.
I'm betting that the post credit scenes has at least Hope turning to ash, and Avengers 4 starts with Hawkeye's kids turning to dust. Actually, I thought Clint's family would be some of the casualties in this movie but I sat there and sat there and it never happened. But I still think they're dust; What other reason would he really have to come back into the fold after how disastrous his return was to his life in Civil War?
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Also his finger snap didn't seem to care about race.
He says his original plan for Titan was that the choice would have been completely random, regardless of social standing so I imagine he applied that on a cosmic scale. Like you said, he's already witnessed his genocide working to better planets so Thanos really has no reason to believe otherwise, and even if some worlds just fall back into overpopulation he can just snap his fingers and course correct.

The two biggest problems with the movie was things that no one could really solve, and one that maybe could have. As mentioned, it's just not as enjoyable if you haven't been following the rest of the movies for the last decade so without that it would be easy to get lost. The movie just couldn't hold your hand and reintroduce the characters, or explain there past exploits and adventures. And the second is that it's a two parter and now we have to wait a freakin' year before the next one and that is cruel beyond compare. I almost feel like I'd be happier if I'd just skipped Infinity War, waited for the next movie and marathon them together. That's some Empire Strikes Back downer ending there and probably the one time a movie has ever made me angry having to wait for more. My theater went dead quiet the last ten or so minutes.

Thanos is definitely a top-tier villain and a lot of attention was given to his story to flesh him out. One major complaint these movies have is weak villains, but the last few years we've seen some really great ones in Vulture, Zemo, Ego, and now Thanos. Admittedly I'm a little annoyed at how much the movie deviated from the source material, like the complete absence of Death, but nowhere near enough to really care since it was so well done. But that leads me to that third problem: The Children of Thanos were pretty meh. They just weren't all that interesting, and spent most of the movie jobbing. I liked Ebon Maw, the one in charge of fighting wizards, but even he seemed pretty ineffectual in the long run.

Going in my biggest concern was that the Russos wouldn't be able to control Gunn and Waititi with their contributions to the movie, but I have to say they did an excellent job reining them in. You can tell where their influences are (The Milano first showing up with Ruberband Man playing and the humor, Peter Dinklage as a giant dwarf), but unlike Guardians 2 and Ragnarok the Russos knew where the line was and made certain to keep on the right side of it. Like, Drax was just horrible in Guardians 2, but here he's back to form where he just seems clueless instead of a complete imbecile. And Mantis was adorable. Likewise, I'd have liked to see Korg but as hilarious as he was in Ragnarok he'd have definitely unbalanced the movie.

This is the first movie I've ever seen that felt like an event.

Edited, Apr 30th 2018 10:13am by lolgaxe
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#7 Apr 30 2018 at 9:21 AM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
even if some worlds just fall back into overpopulation he can just snap his fingers and course correct.

He also thinks that people will be grateful which probably won't be the case if half of everyone you know (or you) gets dusted twice in a lifetime. I'm not convinced that he can just snap a second time -- his Nintendo Power Glove (and arm) looked pretty jacked up in the end.

But, again, sure. If he had a good, sane plan then we wouldn't need two movies worth of people trying to stop him.

I'm not in love with Thanos as a villain, partially because I still think he looks like a dork, but that didn't detract much. I did like how they sidelined Hulk. I remember hearing that he was left out of Civil War because whichever side had him would just roll over the second side. But if he was Hulkin' it up through IW then he either trivializes the issues or else has the Worf Problem of constantly getting his ass kicked until he's not really The Hulk as we know and love. But having him getting his ass kicked once by Thanos set the stakes without making Hulk out to be a chump and having Hulk pout through the movie after his first ever unquestioned ass kicking was believable.

Edited, Apr 30th 2018 10:23am by Jophiel
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#8 Apr 30 2018 at 9:29 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
TirithRR wrote:
Also his finger snap didn't seem to care about race.
He says his original plan for Titan was that the choice would have been completely random, regardless of social standing so I imagine he applied that on a cosmic scale. Like you said, he's already witnessed his genocide working to better planets so Thanos really has no reason to believe otherwise, and even if some worlds just fall back into overpopulation he can just snap his fingers and course correct.


Well, I meant more like... his current plan had been traveling to each planet individually and eliminating 50% of that particular planets intelligent life. Assumed his finger snap would do the same. I mean, on the scale of the Universe, seems like a 50/50 coin flip for the entire Universal population could easily leave 100% of Earth empty.


I really liked the (I have no idea what names are what for all of Thanos's people) magic user fighting Strange. He was probably my favorite of all the enemies. And I kept remembering the Ben 10 episode with the planet-tick, and the two aliens that were worshiping it as a god. I'd imagine that Man of Action got inspiration for those two from these characters.

I wish Strange hadn't said "One" when asked how many different outcomes had them winning. So now we know that Strange knew what steps to take to ensure they have a winning outcome (even if steps in the middle were not "good").

Here I had thought (foolishly on my part) that Infinity War would end and then something new would happen going forward. But it seems that Inifinity War is the new forward, the new arc for the movie universe. I was actually surprised that it ended where it did. Though, again, just because I hadn't paid attention.
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#9 Apr 30 2018 at 9:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah, I thought the Thanos thing would be resolved as well but I also wasn't paying a ton of attention. Honestly, I think half the reason for the silence at the end was a general "Wait, that was it?" impression when the credits started. Like I said, you already know as an audience member that Marvel isn't going to say "Boy, shame about that Spidey, huh? And just after we finally got the reboot working. And that Black Panther was pretty popular. But more like Wakanda For A While though, am I right?"

Edit: Someone elsewhere put it well: Since anyone with half a brain knew that most of what happened would be undone, it didn't really feel like a cliffhanger so much as feeling like half a movie.

Two things that felt to me like they were going somewhere but nope (at least not yet):

After Iron-Man lays into Thanos and Thanos wipes his cheek and says "All that for a drop of blood", I really thought Stark had let some nano-whatevers loose into Thanos. The fact that the fight was all suit morphing only strengthened that impression. But... nope?

I assumed that Thor's new eye would be high tech (beyond being a working eye) or magic or something. But I guess the studio heads were just tired of seeing Hemsworth in an eye patch and decided "reset!"

Edited, Apr 30th 2018 11:14am by Jophiel
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#10 Apr 30 2018 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
I assumed that Thor's new eye would be high tech (beyond being a working eye) or magic or something. But I guess the studio heads were just tired of seeing Hemsworth in an eye patch and decided "reset!"


The whole scene seemed to be just so that they could have Rocket crack a joke about how he really should have washed it, since he smuggled it out in his butt.


I was also kind of expecting to see Ant Man at least a little in the film. I'm sure Paul Rudd's a bit disappointed that he doesn't get a paycheck from this film.

My brother doesn't think Loki's really dead. For no other reason than, "It's Loki". And not in a "It will all get undone in the near future" way, but in a "He didn't really die when Thanos broke his neck" way. Speaking of Loki I did like him reusing the "We have a Hulk" line.


I agree on the whole " it didn't really feel like a cliffhanger so much as feeling like half a movie. ". I know I was kind left speechless at the end, but definitely not because of what happened but a "Is that really the end?" It may not be Infinity War Part 1 and Part 2 by title, but Avengers 4 seems like it is going to be Part 2 in actuality.
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#11 Apr 30 2018 at 6:48 PM Rating: Good
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If I were to pretend Thanos was not a fictional character for a minute-- it might seem to me that his ideas are dumb and unworkable. But like... who am I, a mere mortal, to argue with something that obviously knows a great deal more about life and the universe than I do?
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#12 Apr 30 2018 at 6:58 PM Rating: Good
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I saw THIS posted on Reddit today. And got a laugh. Steven Universe, the end of Infinity War.
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#13 May 01 2018 at 7:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Kuwoobie wrote:
But like... who am I, a mere mortal, to argue with something that obviously knows a great deal more about life and the universe than I do?

The action-adventure genre is built upon powerful and presumably intelligent evil people having really stupid ideas, e.g. "Ok, but what if we make an even bigger Death Star?"

Edited, May 1st 2018 10:44am by Jophiel
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#14 May 01 2018 at 7:27 AM Rating: Good
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TirithRR wrote:
My brother doesn't think Loki's really dead. For no other reason than, "It's Loki".
Wouldn't be surprised, truth be told. Loki already "died" at least twice in the first two Thor movies.
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#15 May 01 2018 at 4:34 PM Rating: Decent
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My theater went dead quiet the last ten or so minutes.


Same. It was a pretty decent sized theater, and it was sold out. A good 250 to 300 people in the room and at the end when Thanos smiles and the screen went black, you could have heard a pin drop. Normally, I take a sick delight in ruining movies for people (what can I say, we all need a hobby), but I won't tell anyone that I know that cares at all about the Marvel movies a damn thing about this one. I'd say that the film makers got the reaction they were looking for.

I've seen and enjoyed (for the most part) every movie leading up to it, so I'm probably a bit biased towards liking the movie in the first place. That said, it was exactly what I wanted out of the movie. Lot's of action right from the get go. A couple of deaths that I'm pretty sure a going to be permanent to set the tone. A few good laughs with some great interaction between characters that normally would never even share the same screen.I just wish that Disney/Marvel had the balls to not undo the whole thing. Sadly, there's just too much money on the line for them to abandon four of their major franchises due to the leads all being dead.
#16 May 03 2018 at 2:11 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
This is the first movie I've ever seen that felt like an event.
ME.

1977.

STAR WARS.


Smiley: thumbsup

Smiley: nod
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Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#17 May 03 2018 at 7:37 AM Rating: Good
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Friar Bijou wrote:
lolgaxe wrote:
seen
[lg]ME.
Lies.

Edited, May 3rd 2018 9:37am by TirithRR
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#18 May 03 2018 at 10:44 AM Rating: Good
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Did Thanos Kill You?

I was spared. Smiley: thumbsup
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#19 May 03 2018 at 12:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:



On the plus side, this means I don't have to live through the aftermath and can sit pretty while the rest of y'all rescue me.

Edited, May 3rd 2018 1:06pm by Jophiel
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#20 May 03 2018 at 11:45 PM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
.
With all sincerity, Jophiel, thank you. I never heard this stuff (never heard of the band, for that matter).

youtube commenter wrote:
she sings like she's casting a spell on you.


Love it. Thank you.Smiley: bowdown


Edited, May 3rd 2018 11:49pm by Bijou
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Jophiel wrote:
Last week, I saw a guy with an eyepatch and a gold monocle and pointed him out to Flea as one of the most awesome things I've seen, ever. If I had an eyepatch and a gold monocle, I'd always dress up as Mr. Peanut but with a hook hand and a parrot.
#21 May 04 2018 at 7:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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Friar Bijou wrote:
With all sincerity, Jophiel, thank you. I never heard this stuff (never heard of the band, for that matter).

Hey, thanks! Glad to hear it. I almost didn't post it but when I was looking for the video I saw it was used in a Gears of War promo years ago. I figured if it was good enough for a video game promo, it's good enough for a comic book movie joke.
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#22 May 04 2018 at 8:03 AM Rating: Good
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Friar Bijou wrote:
I never heard this stuff (never heard of the band, for that matter).
You probably heard "Fade Into You", which is in like every tv soundtrack. I remember "Into Dust" from an episode of House. Mostly remember thinking that there wasn't enough adrenaline in the world to wake me up after hearing it. Not that I think it's bad, just slooooooow. Like acoustic valium.
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#23 May 04 2018 at 9:02 AM Rating: Excellent
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Hope Sandoval would have been my Manic Pixie Dream Girl during my college days if the trope had existed back then. Except she'd be more of a Lethargic Pixie Dream Girl.

She also puts on the worst live performances you have ever seen. And I've seen other "atmospheric" singers who are nevertheless witty, chatty and engaging between songs but Hope just drapes herself over the mic, stares at the floor and does her thing. I've heard that she has anxiety and stage fright which is a fair excuse but it doesn't make the show any more fun to watch.
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#24 May 04 2018 at 9:46 AM Rating: Good
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Jophiel wrote:
He would have been better off going around the universe handing out condoms and teaching people about renewable energy and recycling.
Or snapping his fingers and dropping fertility rates or something.
#25 May 04 2018 at 6:49 PM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
Did Thanos Kill You?

I was spared. Smiley: thumbsup


I was dusted, but I'll be back once Adam Warlock gets a hold of the infinity gauntlet.
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#26 May 08 2018 at 2:24 PM Rating: Decent
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Ok. Finally got to see this. Yay for waiting a week, and ducking my head in the sand so as not to run into spoilers.

TirithRR wrote:
I agree on the whole " it didn't really feel like a cliffhanger so much as feeling like half a movie. ". I know I was kind left speechless at the end, but definitely not because of what happened but a "Is that really the end?" It may not be Infinity War Part 1 and Part 2 by title, but Avengers 4 seems like it is going to be Part 2 in actuality.


Pretty much this as well. Knowing the original storyline, and the differences in comic book paced stories versus film stories, I'd expected them to have Thanos get to like 4 stones (maybe 5, giving us the dramatic "loss" by the heroes against Thanos over the time stone as the final event), leaving the cliffhanger being Thanos heading to Earth to get the last stone from Vision. I'm just not sure how the pacing is going to work in terms of filling an entire film with the remaining story. In the comics Thanos wins, and then basically doubts what he's doing/done and more or less defeats himself, undoing his previous actions. There's obviously some other stuff as well (something something Adam Warlock, blah blah), but basically not a whole lot for the primary heroes to really do here. It's almost the denouement of the story, with all the lead up and conflict being trying to stop him from getting the stones, failing, and then "winning" via more or less deus ex machina. It was always kind of a "strange" ending, with most folks just assuming that the writers realized 3/4ths of the way through that they'd written themselves into a corner, and had to knee jerk out. Kinder assessments put the whole thing into the context of "once you have the power to actually do the things you always wanted to, you find they aren't such great ideas after all". So more of a grand moral play on the ultimate conflict of man vs nature. Neither one would make just that part of the story into a very good film though..

So obviously they aren't going in that direction (I hope not). Well, at least not entirely. They've already laid the seeds of Thanos doubting his own actions and convictions. When I watched the scene where Strange has Thanos promise to spare Stark, I assumed he meant right then in that fight. But a friend of mine pointed out that it's possible that he spared him not just from immediate death, but perhaps from the "snap my fingers and half of everyone dies". I suspect that may be correct, and may play a key point going forward. Given how much value Thanos placed on the fact that the deaths would be totally random, ignoring wealth, power, station, class, etc, if he injected his own wishes into the process then it would be "tainted" in his own mind. Which might be the leverage used to have him choose to undo things (or allow it to be undone). It's possible that this was the one success that Strange saw in the future. Given that he initially seemed willing to sacrifice pretty much anything to prevent the time stone from being taken (and frankly given the stones powers, and the events in his own film, he could have eternally stale mated Thanos if he wanted to), his sudden willingness to hand it over, for apparently nothing other than to save one single life, seems to point to Stark living being key. I can't imagine it's just something special about Stark himself, so it's probably the way he was spared.


Dunno. Just a theory. The question still remains about what else they'll put in there. I had assumed the whole Adam Warlock thing will come into play (and likely still will). But I'm unsure if he'll have a direct role in "defeating" Thanos, or will be introduced in some kind of cut scene at the end (merging with the soul stone after Thanos choses to give them up or something maybe?. Just from a storytelling point of view, you kinda have to have the main characters be directly involved in the "win", and aside from the coincidentally lined up original Avengers (plus Rhodes), that's all that left. Also, assuming the rumors/hints are true, Warlock is more of a GotG side story (the "perfect being" mentioned at the end of GotG2), so it would be strange to have him show up despite none of them existing anymore. I'm not sure if Ant Man and Wasp will take place after the events in this film (nothing in the previews suggest this), or if the affect of the events will be some kind of end scene thing. Ditto with Captain Marvel. Could have it be origin story with the end being the other side of the cut scene in this film, or could have origin be just part and some carry on the storyline going on here.


On a side note: I didn't have an issue with Strange having only found one way to win. I just assumed he looked through all the possibilities until he found "one" that worked, and then picked that one. Or it was just dramatic dialog or something. Yeah, probably that too.

In general though, I loved the film. The character interactions were great. Little things like Parker's comment about Dr. Strange meaning they were using their code names. Several good laugh points along the way. And they actually managed to keep the personalities of each of the characters (which is hard to do when you've got one team directing one film, with multiple characters from different film series with often different directing teams involved). The pacing was excellent. Handling 3-4 different sets of characters in their own parallel story lines is hard to do, and they managed it very well. From a technical point of view it was very very good.

Just one VFX issue though. And I'm not the only one (based on my quick asking around) who noticed it. Anyone else notice how abnormally large Banner's head was when they were all standing around at the end, and he's in the hulk buster suit (with the helmet off/open)? It's like they scaled his head to the suit, but had everyone else standing in the same scene. His head was like 5 feet across or something. It was glaring. He was like this giant floating head. Everything else in the film was beautifully done. That one bit? Not so much.

Edited, May 8th 2018 3:09pm by gbaji
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