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#1 Jun 03 2009 at 1:32 AM Rating: Good
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Hello! Hopefully some one from Square Enix will be reading this, sooner or later. I would like to compile a list, of commonly agreed upon things that we dislike, and are not implemented correctly in Final Fantasy XI online, and need improvement for Final Fantasy XIV online. This will also be a list of things we enjoy, and would like to see more of.

As I said, I would like to keep this thread limited to things that you think are VERY important and need addressing and attention to either be redone, or not redone in the new Final Fantasy XIV online game. So please try to leave random idea's out, but express your opinions on common issues and how you feel about them. But more importantly, Please list what you want to see in Final Fantasy XIV online, and what you do NOT want to see in Final Fantasy XIV online.


I will start off by addressing some of the most common issues myself. Here is a list of things we do NOT want to see in Final Fantasy XIV. (After this list, I will follow up with a list of things we DO want to see.)

Less ways to lose hard earned work, effort, and time.

There are many systems in Final Fantasy XI online where you can easily lose a lot of work, effort, and time. This is real people's real time, real life, and real effort they put forth into a game, so it should not be taken so lightly. The main reason for this, is because a lot of systems are left up to a players discretion. This is bad, because many people are anonymous online, and will take the opportunity to manipulate others for their own selfish gain. They will also kick others, and do wrong doings to others at their own discretion whether it is right or wrong, and there are no implications for this.

Real people can lose thousands of hours, and years of time out of their real lives over this. The playerbase no longer wants to see systems like this, where they are left so random and openly, and where the player has no insurance that their hard work and effort won't be in vein.

Less Random Reward, and Less Hard Work going Unrewarded.

There are to many times in Final Fantasy XI, where some one can get something out of pure luck, when they might not even appreciate it, or have earned it, all while some one who has put much effort in, can not obtain the said reward. Some times, people will hunt for a Notorious Monster for a long time, and kill it many times over, waiting and waiting, and hoping to obtain a certain drop from it, but because of the random luck factor (on most of the Notorious Monsters) they may not get it. All the while, some one might wander through, at the right time, kill the Notorious Monster, and get the spoils. I see this as a unfair, and majorly flawed system, and know many others do as well.

There are also many end game events, where a player will work very hard for a long time to obtain something. But they might not see it fall, and there might be many people who need it as well, who will get it before them because they have been in the particular group for a long period of time, and have build senority. Again, when it's left up to player discretion, there is nothing protecting them. The group could simply disband, or the person could get removed for no good reason at all, losing all their hard work and effort. All the while, many people will go to the right group at the right time, and obtain all the spoils they want very quickly, not having to work hard or earn it much at all. We need less systems like this in Final Fantasy XIV.


Less Life Consuming Events that take far too much Time and Effort.

It's fine to have large scale systems that take some one a long time and much effort, but it must be done in a way that people are not sacrificing their real lives, or having to cheat to accomplish it, which many do have to in Final Fantasy XI. These Systems include things like Dynamis Relic Weapons, and Mythic Weapons.

Less Long Session Events, which take too long at a single sitting

A very big complaint people have is how long some events take in game. You have to allow and figure in time for everyone to gather together, time to do the event, time to enter, time for people to gather supplies they might need, and time for many people who end up late. You also have to remember, not everyone will be in the same time zone, so if an event takes too many hours at a single time, it excludes a lot of people from doing the event together. A long event is good some times, but only if it is every so often, and really worth the effort. It should not be a means to an end though. And should not be a common practice.

No More Sub Jobs!

It seems to be a pretty common theory that people do not want the sub job system anymore. They want ways to specialize their jobs, and be versatile at them, however they don't want to have to level other jobs to be complete on the job they wish to play. It allows for too much confusion, and also takes away from the uniqueness and feel of some jobs. Each job should be good at what it does in it's own way, and with it's own abilities and trade marks. You should have ways to do different things differently, but the use of sub jobs seems to be something that people no longer wish to have to bother with. It simply has too many drawbacks and problems.

Less Grind, in the same area, for too long, in the exact same way.

Grinding is just fine, it's part of any Massive Multiplayer Online Game. But with grinding, you also need variety. In Final Fantasy XI online, there is very little variety as far as grinding goes. Most of this is attributed to the fact that certain monsters will yield a much more decent amount of experience points than others. It needs to be more even across the boards, and perhaps allow different types of monsters to be killed better with different setups, and many to be killed with all kinds of setups.

Less time being Idle (Standing around doing nothing)

This is a very major flaw and upset within the Final Fantasy XI community. Having to stand around for what can be hours and hours, and some times even DAYS, just for a CHANCE to be able to fight something is Ludicrous. People want to play a game, and have fun fighting things and conquering tough foes, traveling, adventuring, and exploring. They do not want to sit in one spot, for a very long period of time, doing absolutely nothing.

Less Job Exclussion

No job should be laughed at, or made fun of, all jobs should do things differently in different ways, and should exceed at different things individually. But at the same time, for many missions, and quests in Final Fantasy XI, there are only certain job combinations that people will use. This leaves many people excluded, and feeling disgruntled because they are not able to accomplish many things, or progress as what they are.

No More Gear Swapping (changing gear mid battle).

Situational Gear is fine, and having different gear for different events is fine as well. But there should be some sort of penalty for changing your gear, and should not be something that is done every few seconds in the midst of a battle. It makes things very confusing, very hard on people, and very stressing on your inventory. Again, different gear for different situations is a good thing, but changing gear every few seconds to maximize performance during a battle is simply troublesome and annoying.




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Now, with that being said, let's move on to the next part. The things we DO want to see in Final Fantasy XIV online. These things include most commonly, but are not limited to...


More In Game Point Systems!

For many years people have been trying to figure out how to implement point systems properly in Final Fantasy XI online. It becomes a whole other job just figuring it out, and it is never fair, not can it ever please Everyone. There needs to be point systems already setup in the game, to distribute rewards to players, that Square Enix sets up themselves. This will keep things a lot less stressful, especially for leaders, and keep things a lot more fair. It will also alleviate a lot of "Drama" in the game.

More Places to Gain Experience Points, with Variety and Adventure

As mentioned before, "Grinding" or gaining experience points, is suppose to take awhile, but there also has to be variety to it to keep people from getting too bored. There should also be more than one way to gain it, and perhaps ways to gain is solo at some levels and at some points, without hurting the dynamics of working together as a team. Meaning, you should be able to do it for a lesser reward to your experience points, but still enough to make small progress if you are unable to group together at a certain time for any certain reason.

More Systems like Assault/Einherjar, and more point systems in General

I'm sure Square Enix knows themselves, how widely agreed it is that these systems are far more fun, more rewarding, more fair, and more favored these systems are than any other in the game. It's because people know that for their hard work, they will eventually be rewarded. It does not make the items any less rare, or any less valued. They can be hard to obtain, or take a long time, but knowing you are making progress makes people feel very happy and content, and feel less like they are going to lose hard work and effort.

More Systems like Campaign/Fields of Valor.

Systems like this, where you can just sporadically go with a friend, or a few friends, and enjoy yourself, make some progress, and do something fun together on your own time, is HIGHLY desired and appreciated. This kind of system allows people to have fun on their own time, or with a friend (or several!).

More Systems like BCNM/KSNM/ISNM/ANNM

Which stands for Burning Circle Notorious Monsters, Kindred Seal Notorious Monsters, Imperial Standing Notorious Monsters, and Assault Note Notorious Monsters. These battles can yield great rewards and are fun to do on your own time with friends or random company you might pick up along the way, and really test your skills and abilities.

A bigger inventory, and more storage space.

One of the biggest flaws in Final Fantasy XI online, is the inventory and storage space issue. Once you acquire so many items, especially many that cannot be stored by a NPC, it gets very intensive and stressful on a player on where to keep all their stuff. For people like me, who have 10+ level 75 jobs on Final Fantasy XI online, and with all the situational gear, and all the gear that you cannot send some where else, or cannot be stored by a npc, it means you have to "mule". Muling means you have to put gear on other characters, and if you wish to change jobs, you have to retrieve it from them. This can take upwards of an hour at times, and takes a huge chunk of time away from the game you should be enjoying, just because you wanted to change your job.

The Ability to Change Jobs.

With the inventory Issue out of the way, I think it is widely agreed that one of the greatest things about Final Fantasy XI is that you are able to change your job or profession on a single character. This allows people to have so much more fun and personalize who they are so much greater. I do not want to see people having to make different characters just because they wish to level a different job. This is one of many things Final Fantasy XI did right!

Player Vs. Player (PvP)

I very much agree with the Square Enix view that a MMORPG should be more focused on storyline/conquering foes together/player vs. environment (PvE) than PvP. However it is a aspect that you need at least a small amount of. The PvP system in FFXI was sadly not very well done. I think there should be some small scale scenario's to it, and possible some larger scale scenario's to it if the time called for it, sort of like a instanced event either way.

I've always though one neat idea, would be sort of like an Arena, maybe more than one, where people could go, sign up, and test their skills against one another. Perhaps in one of the main towns, so other people could watch the fights. It could turn out to be very entertaining!



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Well, that's just about all I can think of for now! I will most likely update this post, but again, I want others to share what they want and don't want in the upcoming Square Enix Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game, "Final Fantasy XIV Online". So please share your suggestions, and keep them professional and coherent. Again, this is not a thread for random idea's people may have, but rather large idea's that you feel strongly about and know others feel strongly about as well.

Below, I will add some links to common topics that have been coming up about people's suggestions and feelings towards what they think Square Enix should do for Final Fantasy XIV online. I will post the links and topics to these discussions and suggestions as I find them. Feel free to submit them with a link to this thread in this thread as well.

Further Discussions about the general idea of what people want and do not want can be found here.

Further Discussions on things people like about Final Fantasy XI online and would like to see in Final Fantasy XIV online can be found here.

Further Discussions on the sub job issue can be found here.

Further Discussions on the gear changing/swapping issues can be found here.

Further Discussions on PvP can be found here.



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And once more, thank you for your time and for reading this!

(If possible, I would like to request this thread be made into a sticky, so that square enix can check in easily to see our general idea's on what we want and don't want in Final Fantasy XIV online, while keeping people's heavy thoughts and opinions on what needs to be done, all in one thread.)

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 1:09am by EndlessJourney

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 1:13am by EndlessJourney
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#2 Jun 03 2009 at 2:07 AM Rating: Excellent
My main suggestion is still to not try to make direct competitor to WoW, know their audience.
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#3 Jun 03 2009 at 2:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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This will most likely mark my return to the game world I enjoyed the most, if it is at least 50% of what I'm hoping for. My wife and I saw the announcement last night and both huddled close to the screen to watch the trailer. Having had been a FFXI player for over 5 years before finally giving in and leaving the game until a successor showed up, this definately is tantalizing news and I'll be constantly digging for more information.

My suggestion? Like what digitalcraft said, SE needs to remember to know their audience, and not attempt to create a WoW killer because it's not possible. There are things about games like WoW that every MMO developer can learn from, and I hope SE picks up on those points. But as for the core of FFXIV itself? It needs to remain very much Final Fantasy, and they need to retain a certain amount of charm that FFXI had that kept players for so long.
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#4 Jun 03 2009 at 3:41 PM Rating: Good
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I've updated the OP, and would like to add a few more suggestion threads that seem to have popped up.

It seems people want some decent PvP Content. While I agree that PvE is more important for a Final Fantasy Game. Some type of End game PvP, or a way for friends to just dual eachother would be very welcomed. The discussion on that issue can be found here.

Please add anymore threads you find that have suggestions and discussions regarding what people want or do NOT want to see in FFXIV to this thread. I'm trying to compile all the info on what people want and do not want, so Square Enix does not have to sift through all the threads, and miss anything. If the information is compiled, then perhaps when they come here, they can easily look it up and know better about what we want.

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#5 Jun 03 2009 at 4:32 PM Rating: Good
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I always thought a chess board on one of the tables in upper jeuno where you could challenge your friends would have been a good addition. Wouldn't hurt to place one in a city somewhere in FFXIV.
#6 Jun 03 2009 at 4:38 PM Rating: Good
You know what I want? More than any sort of PvP is some non combat stuff altogether! The chessboard is a good idea, but for instance FFXI has chocobo racing and mog houses. If you're playing a MMORPG what you really want is world depth, it would be wonderful if they had a team devoted to making stuff to do in game that didn't require you to stab things. Cooking contest please!
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#7 Jun 03 2009 at 4:59 PM Rating: Good
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Yogtheterrible wrote:
I always thought a chess board on one of the tables in upper jeuno where you could challenge your friends would have been a good addition. Wouldn't hurt to place one in a city somewhere in FFXIV.


Exactly, I myself think there should be more fun little mini games in a MMO that you can just randomly do and have fun with with your friends. Chocobo racing could have been AMAZING for this sort of thing in FFXI, but they didn't allow you to actually control your chocobo so it didn't get very popular...

But yes, little Mini Games would be great!
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#8 Jun 03 2009 at 5:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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More brainstorming, here's another idea.

Better User Interface.

I know you might not agree with them Square Enix, but the people who create windower were never supporters of hacks or cheats, they were just trying to make the user interface (UI) better. Please learn from them, and add things like status timers, recast timers, and things to show our distance from something if we need to know. There are many things the windower crew have developed that greatly increased the play-ability for FFXI, learn from them and add what they have done to FFXIV.
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#9 Jun 03 2009 at 6:02 PM Rating: Decent
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I loved having subjobs when I first started FFXI. However I started to see all of the shortcomings when it came to endgame content. Not only were SE's hands completely tied and unable to let anybody level further without breaking the game... Some jobs got stuck with only 1 or 2 viable subjobs to choose from or you were worthless.

I hope SE really balances out EVERY THING this time around so there are no worthless jobs. I played as a THF, and it became one of the most worthless jobs created. There really wasn't a point to take a THF with you for "treasure hunting" purposes... because the drop rate was so minimal. **** do you know how many times things would drop when I couldn't be with the LS that night? They started thinking I was a jinx and my TH was broken. I spent probably 200 plus hours to kill for that knife with TH plus 1(which is now 500x easier to get), and it seemed completely pointless.

Not to mention that THF's best skills had so many requirements to effectively pull off... You can't possibly pull them off when the fight was very chaotic and party situation not standard. If you have to kite a mob around because it's instand death if you don't... ***** bringing a THF with you.
#10 Jun 03 2009 at 6:16 PM Rating: Good
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I think loot distribution should be left entirely up to the group. A basic rolling system is important with a quartermaster option for more structured distribution. If SE doesn't make good gear so limited and so uncommon that players are scrambling over it on those exceptionally rare cases when it drops, you get less loot drama. Loot drama divides groups and instead of a cohesive team working together, you get a bunch of people who will happily turn their backs on the team if it means that they get to walk away with the shinies.
#11 Jun 03 2009 at 6:52 PM Rating: Decent
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Two very simple suggestions that may not even need to be suggested ^^:

- Housing system featuring a neighborhood: you would have a section of the major cities that look like a housing neighborhood with instanced apartments. While this is somewhat present in FFXI you don't actually get to walk into the neighborhood and see different doors and porches, you just see an empty tunnel. See EQ2 for what I mean though I'd expect a better implementation then that.

- Barber shops, I have no doubt the character creation will be a 100 times better then FFXI and will allow for more diversity, but as time goes on players may get tired of their old look, a barber shop is a very good way to beat fashion tedium and discourage dat mods.. *cough*

Edited, Jun 3rd 2009 8:52pm by CindyL
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#12 Jun 03 2009 at 7:06 PM Rating: Decent
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OMG How could I forget about this...

SE PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THINGS HOLY... make it so much easier to reinstall this game onto a new pc, or after reformatting a pc... or what have you. Let us easily back up our old information before moving it to a new pc or reformatting.


#13 Jun 03 2009 at 7:55 PM Rating: Decent
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1.) Put extra effort into making all jobs equally useful in endgame... this is very important

2.) Keep the same server names please so whole communities can transfer to the new game intact

3.) Put more explanations in-game as to how to complete quests, missions and how to participate in events

4.) More blood tanking, less Utsusemi

5.) Make sure macros are perfectly responsive

6.) Make endgame less repetitive and more interesting

7.) Offer a wider variety of exp camps, especially merit camps (assuming there will be merits)

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 12:17am by TauuOfSiren
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#14 Jun 03 2009 at 9:47 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
No More Sub Jobs!

It seems to be a pretty common theory that people do not want the sub job system anymore. They want ways to specialize their jobs, and be versatile at them, however they don't want to have to level other jobs to be complete on the job they wish to play. It allows for too much confusion, and also takes away from the uniqueness and feel of some jobs. Each job should be good at what it does in it's own way, and with it's own abilities and trade marks. You should have ways to do different things differently, but the use of sub jobs seems to be something that people no longer wish to have to bother with. It simply has too many drawbacks and problems.
I disagree wholeheartedly, here. I really enjoyed the subjob system; there isn't anything confusing about it. *However* it should be viable not to have a subjob. If I want to level Monk, but like the idea of increased DEF and STR, I can sub Warrior. But if I want to level Monk and just be a fast hitting, evading type of dude without any other classes mingled in, I think I should be able to do that too.

Quote:
More Places to Gain Experience Points, with Variety and Adventure

As mentioned before, "Grinding" or gaining experience points, is suppose to take awhile, but there also has to be variety to it to keep people from getting too bored. There should also be more than one way to gain it, and perhaps ways to gain is solo at some levels and at some points, without hurting the dynamics of working together as a team. Meaning, you should be able to do it for a lesser reward to your experience points, but still enough to make small progress if you are unable to group together at a certain time for any certain reason.
This to an extent, but I don't think people realize there were at least 3 places to go each level in FFXI. The thing is, there is always going to be an easiest, most efficient place to go and almost everyone is going to go there.

Quote:
A bigger inventory, and more storage space.

One of the biggest flaws in Final Fantasy XI online, is the inventory and storage space issue. Once you acquire so many items, especially many that cannot be stored by a NPC, it gets very intensive and stressful on a player on where to keep all their stuff. For people like me, who have 10+ level 75 jobs on Final Fantasy XI online, and with all the situational gear, and all the gear that you cannot send some where else, or cannot be stored by a npc, it means you have to "mule". Muling means you have to put gear on other characters, and if you wish to change jobs, you have to retrieve it from them. This can take upwards of an hour at times, and takes a huge chunk of time away from the game you should be enjoying, just because you wanted to change your job.

Storage, yes. On character inventory, no. I maxed out all my characters inventories and I always thought it was weird how much **** I could carry. 60 slots seems like the max you should be able to hold on your person. I think the Mogs could use over 120 slots, though.
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#15 Jun 03 2009 at 10:17 PM Rating: Decent
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More races... I want to be something other than Hume and all the other races are kinda unappealing. To me at least. I say we need some sort of new midsized race that is non-gender specific. That would be one of the things to put me in a happy place. *prays to the unholy gaming gods for more races*

Some Tweaks to the battle system, Personally from what I saw on the FFXIII trailer I think a battle system like that in an Online Game would be something breathtaking and massively awesome. (Though I know it will never happen due to lag issues etc.) So just tweak the battle system so its a little more fun than "Engage.... sit back and watch, Press macro1, macro3,and macro 8 in sequential order... watch and wait"

NO LEVEL SYNC! For the love of the unholy gaming gods allowing a person to level to max without ever having to leave the lower level zones is one of the most unpleasing things my mind can not comprehend.

Keep FoV and Caskets. This is great for the solo aspect of the game and helps a lot in the areas for people who actually want to solo.

No more /NIN. @-@ always hated the fact that if I wanted to level almost any job passed 65 /NIN is pretty much Required. Scrap the subjob system. Sure it was cool until people were so focused on only the cookie cutter job/subjob combo's.

No more Hate on Certain jobs.
I remember back in the day when you were the most hated person in the world just because you leveled DRG. And PUP is still catching a lot of hate just because it plays different.

No 6hour Chocobo quest @-@ I remember doing this twice and I wanted to remove the head of the Chocobo both times with a rusty spoon.

A reduce in time sinks sure I don't mind sinking my time into something worthwhile. But FFXI is full of time sinks whether its xp, farming, NM camping, Waiting on boats, traveling to a party.

Seamless Game play I know it isnt FF w/o zones but seamless game play is the future of MMOs.

That is pretty much it... save for some of my ideas that are way out there. But yeah I'm hoping that this game blows all other MMOs out of the water. It already looks amazing with the trailer and the fact that some of it was in engine.
#16 Jun 03 2009 at 10:20 PM Rating: Good
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I really honestly want to keep this thread to simply suggestions and try to keep arguing and things of that nature out of it. But I will address the few things you said.



EndlessJourney wrote:
No More Sub Jobs!

It seems to be a pretty common theory that people do not want the sub job system anymore. They want ways to specialize their jobs, and be versatile at them, however they don't want to have to level other jobs to be complete on the job they wish to play. It allows for too much confusion, and also takes away from the uniqueness and feel of some jobs. Each job should be good at what it does in it's own way, and with it's own abilities and trade marks. You should have ways to do different things differently, but the use of sub jobs seems to be something that people no longer wish to have to bother with. It simply has too many drawbacks and problems.


ShadowWalker wrote:
I disagree wholeheartedly, here. I really enjoyed the subjob system; there isn't anything confusing about it. *However* it should be viable not to have a subjob. If I want to level Monk, but like the idea of increased DEF and STR, I can sub Warrior. But if I want to level Monk and just be a fast hitting, evading type of dude without any other classes mingled in, I think I should be able to do that too.


The reason this is a bad idea is, if some one wants to level, play, and be a Paladin, they shouldn't also have to level, play, and be a ninja and learn the ways of that job. If they want to gain abilities a Ninja has, there should be specialization in that department of the job. For example, utsusemi. Say you want to have a ability like this, that normally only the Ninja's have. They could have one similar, but not as powerful. It could be quested, or gained through a certain type of skilling and specialization system. It might even be a gained ability through the levels. One way or another, it should have to do with the job you are, and learning that job better.

Sub jobs are an out dated system that do not allow for good job customization and allow for to much confusion as to what to sub, when, how, and leads to ultimately for some jobs having to level MANY other jobs that you have no interest in, instead of simply specializing in the job you are interested in. Please try to think deeper than just what sub jobs do for FFXI, because FFXIV will be a completely new game with new mechanics.

In my opinion, each job should NEEDS some things that only they can do, that make them special, that is the beauty of it. If people want to focus a little more on one thing or another on a particular job, that should be able to specialize themselves in that area, not have to level many jobs they have no interest in. That would also go against the character "Growth" Square Enix has been talking about, and would be more along the lines of backtracking so you can be efficient in something, and restraining if you do not have a particular sub job leveled.

One way or another, it's pretty commonly agreed that the system like this needs to be done away with. Personally I just don't like the Role-playing aspect of it as well. If you are a Paladin, you are a Paladin, you AREN'T a Half-Paladin-Mini-Ninja.

EndlessJourney wrote:
More Places to Gain Experience Points, with Variety and Adventure

As mentioned before, "Grinding" or gaining experience points, is suppose to take awhile, but there also has to be variety to it to keep people from getting too bored. There should also be more than one way to gain it, and perhaps ways to gain is solo at some levels and at some points, without hurting the dynamics of working together as a team. Meaning, you should be able to do it for a lesser reward to your experience points, but still enough to make small progress if you are unable to group together at a certain time for any certain reason.
ShadowWalker wrote:
This to an extent, but I don't think people realize there were at least 3 places to go each level in FFXI. The thing is, there is always going to be an easiest, most efficient place to go and almost everyone is going to go there.


No, see, this doesn't have to be true... This is what we're asking them to NOT do. If in FFXI most all camps yielded close to the same EXP for their level in all locations for that level, it would reduce so many problems. There are many unused zoned in FFXI where people do not even go or kill the monsters for any reason. Some of the zones have monsters that are so tough, even for their level, that they are not worth bothering with at all.

In FFXIV, in my opinion, monsters should be different of course, but should also be close to the same level of difficulty for their levels, and perhaps some do better with different setups, but they need to be more evened out.

There is no reason there needs to be "One best leveling spot" because this causes and creates congestion, which is nothing but stress on people.

EndlessJourney wrote:
A bigger inventory, and more storage space.

One of the biggest flaws in Final Fantasy XI online, is the inventory and storage space issue. Once you acquire so many items, especially many that cannot be stored by a NPC, it gets very intensive and stressful on a player on where to keep all their stuff. For people like me, who have 10+ level 75 jobs on Final Fantasy XI online, and with all the situational gear, and all the gear that you cannot send some where else, or cannot be stored by a npc, it means you have to "mule". Muling means you have to put gear on other characters, and if you wish to change jobs, you have to retrieve it from them. This can take upwards of an hour at times, and takes a huge chunk of time away from the game you should be enjoying, just because you wanted to change your job.
ShadowWalker wrote:

Storage, yes. On character inventory, no. I maxed out all my characters inventories and I always thought it was weird how much sh*t I could carry. 60 slots seems like the max you should be able to hold on your person. I think the Mogs could use over 120 slots, though.


I have no idea what you like about these limitations but it confuses me. Let me give you an example of one of the problems I face in FFXI, that many many other jobs face as well. One of my jobs is Bard. For Bard it is physically impossible for me to carry all the things on me I need at one time.

I have many instruments, pieces of gear for several different occasions, medications, and a few random things here and there. It makes it to where if I want to carry some random items for questing or adventuring I simply can't. For instance, if I want to carry some soloing gear with me (evasion gear, weapon skill gear, accuracy gear) there is no way for me to do so, and it is very frustrating. The sad part is, this is with 80 inventory slots.

Some times you might also need to carry random things, like coffer keys, or certain items you might need for questing. Some times you might need to hold some items for other people, and things become such a huge headache. I hate going through it, and seeing others go through it as well...

As far as the mog house / storage issue goes. I have 12 level 75 Jobs. And over the years I have collected many many rare/ex (non transferable to other characters) items, of which npc's won't store. Weapons, Armors, Keys, Quest Items, Upgrade Items, and the list goes on. As it stands, with all the things I have I have had to throw many of them, which made me very sad. Even at that, I can only keep 2 of my level 75 jobs equipped at any 1 time. If I want to switch to another job, it requires an average of 30 minutes to 1 hour of muling (transfering items from one character to another for storage purposes). First you have to mule items that are currently on you to another character, then retrieve the items for the job you wish to switch to. Doing this just ONCE a day can eat an hour out of your playtime easily. Why put these kinds of limitations on people?

This is the kind of stress, and limitations I think Square Enix is trying to get away from, some of the problems that they've wanted to fix with FFXI for a long time, but have been unable to because of things such as Playstation 2 limitations. One way or another, I don't think mindless things that restrict players for no good reason will be welcomed.

Edited, Jun 3rd 2009 11:26pm by EndlessJourney
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#17 Jun 03 2009 at 10:41 PM Rating: Decent
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801 posts
OK.. first of all I'd like to say that personally, I find subjobs
to be awesome, they just need to be implemented better; maybe a Warrior
subbing Black Mage gets different bonuses and abilities than a Red Mage
Subbing it, or if that's too complicated at least make all of the jobs
give Something compelling when subbed. Yeah.. that's not going to be
easy to balance, but Imo, it's one of the most important things. Also, I
don't know why same job traits don't stack, but they should.
#18 Jun 03 2009 at 11:19 PM Rating: Decent
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1,353 posts
Quote:

The reason this is a bad idea is, if some one wants to level, play, and be a Paladin, they shouldn't also have to level, play, and be a ninja and learn the ways of that job. If they want to gain abilities a Ninja has, there should be specialization in that department of the job. For example, utsusemi. Say you want to have a ability like this, that normally only the Ninja's have. They could have one similar, but not as powerful. It could be quested, or gained through a certain type of skilling and specialization system. It might even be a gained ability through the levels. One way or another, it should have to do with the job you are, and learning that job better.
I think if you want tools similar to a Ninjas, you should have to learn how to be a Ninja, and apply them to your Paladin job. I don't see how being a Paladin regularly would teach you anything about Utsusemi, or the Boosting Monks have, or Black Magic, etc.
EDIT: I just reread your post and I liked the idea of Paladin's being able to skill up/specialize/quest other abilities. I had initially thought you were saying more of a tree type idea were you just get these abilities as you progress, which I wouldn't like.
Quote:
There is no reason there needs to be "One best leveling spot" because this causes and creates congestion, which is nothing but stress on people.
It's the player base that decides which becomes the "best." I think there were a number of better spots that people didn't want to try in FFXI because they weren't used to it or they were too hard to get to. Now, this wasn't every situation, so they should improve it a degree, but there were some instances where people just didn't go to certain XP sites, and not because of their suckiness.

Quote:

I have no idea what you like about these limitations but it confuses me. Let me give you an example of one of the problems I face in FFXI, that many many other jobs face as well. One of my jobs is Bard. For Bard it is physically impossible for me to carry all the things on me I need at one time.
I never dealt with this problem as a Monk or Warrior. If this is the case, they should implement a weight system, I think. Maybe you should be able to carry 100 flutes, but I don't think you should also be able to carry 100 Great Swords.

I will say thanks for not trying to slit my throat for disagreeing with some of your points. Man, I haven't been on these forums in a while and everyone seems to get *really* ****** when you state an opinion.



Edited, Jun 4th 2009 3:22am by TheShadowWalker
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#19 Jun 03 2009 at 11:39 PM Rating: Good
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TheShadowWalker wrote:
Quote:

The reason this is a bad idea is, if some one wants to level, play, and be a Paladin, they shouldn't also have to level, play, and be a ninja and learn the ways of that job. If they want to gain abilities a Ninja has, there should be specialization in that department of the job. For example, utsusemi. Say you want to have a ability like this, that normally only the Ninja's have. They could have one similar, but not as powerful. It could be quested, or gained through a certain type of skilling and specialization system. It might even be a gained ability through the levels. One way or another, it should have to do with the job you are, and learning that job better.
I think if you want tools similar to a Ninjas, you should have to learn how to be a Ninja, and apply them to your Paladin job. I don't see how being a Paladin regularly would teach you anything about Utsusemi, or the Boosting Monks have, or Black Magic, etc.
EDIT: I just reread your post and I liked the idea of Paladin's being able to skill up/specialize/quest other abilities. I had initially thought you were saying more of a tree type idea were you just get these abilities as you progress, which I wouldn't like.
Quote:
There is no reason there needs to be "One best leveling spot" because this causes and creates congestion, which is nothing but stress on people.
It's the player base that decides which becomes the "best." I think there were a number of better spots that people didn't want to try in FFXI because they weren't used to it or they were too hard to get to. Now, this wasn't every situation, so they should improve it a degree, but there were some instances where people just didn't go to certain XP sites, and not because of their suckiness.

Quote:

I have no idea what you like about these limitations but it confuses me. Let me give you an example of one of the problems I face in FFXI, that many many other jobs face as well. One of my jobs is Bard. For Bard it is physically impossible for me to carry all the things on me I need at one time.
I never dealt with this problem as a Monk or Warrior. If this is the case, they should implement a weight system, I think. Maybe you should be able to carry 100 flutes, but I don't think you should also be able to carry 100 Great Swords.

I will say thanks for not trying to slit my throat for disagreeing with some of your points. Man, I haven't been on these forums in a while and everyone seems to get *really* ****** when you state an opinion.



Edited, Jun 4th 2009 3:22am by TheShadowWalker


You're entitled to your opinion, and while I will disassemble it, it is in no way malicious. I do it with my best friends all the time. I just figure it as two people talking and conversing *shrug* lol

Anyhow~

About the sub jobs, what I'm saying is, the game should be built that if you want to play like a Ninja, you should be a Ninja, if you want to play like a Paladin, you should be a Paladin. The thing about sub jobs is they turn jobs into Hybrids, instead of keeping them pure to what they are. As I said, I'm all for different kinds of abilities for different situations, I just don't think you should have to level a bunch of other jobs to do so, and it should some how specialize on your current job.

Let me explain what I mean. Let's say in FFXIV Ninja gets a spell like Utsusemi, and there are no sub jobs. Well, for certain bosses, let's say blink tanking is recommended. How can we combat this for our Paladin tanks? Well, let's say at a certain level they are able to quest a ability. Perhaps it's a semi long quest involving fighting a bunch of monsters in a certain way. They then unlock a skill called "Shield Mastery" shield mastery will work to where you would be able to completely block 3 consecutive attacks with your shield when you used it. Now, of course this is overpowered, but I'm just using it as an example for lack of better terms. They would also need to add ways other jobs could balance themselves out as well. But to a degree, even in FFXI, some jobs are unique in how they do things. We just need a better way to specialize, so we aren't a Half-one-job/Half-another-job hybrid, and instead focus on being your current job better, and with more versatility.

Think of it this way. A system like the sub job system, but instead of a sub job, more abilities that you learn as your main job through certain ways, that remain unique to your main job.

As far as the EXP camps go, I will use a few examples. Let's say you are in the level 58 range. There are several places you could go, but everyone seems to go to Wajaom Woodlands on FFXI, because there are Lesser Colibri which are very weak, die fast, and yield large EXP. Another option would be to fight Crabs in Cape terrigan. Now, the camp, is much harder to get to, takes much more time, is much more dangerous, and once you get there, you must fight crabs. These particular crabs are very high in defense, and very resistant to most melee types of damage. They also have a move that greatly increases their defense. This means that with just about any party setup, you could get about twice the Experience Points per Hour in Wajaom Woodlands, than in Cape Terrigan.

Now, the frustrating part, is when you build a party, and the few good EXP camps are taken. Most people will refuse to go to other places, and even if you are willing to take a hit on your experience points per hour, most others won't be, and your party could very well disband. If the monsters would have been more equal in strength for their level, then people would be more open and willing to go to different places. The main reason people only want to go to certain places, is because of this, and because of the fact that there are certain hardcore people that find out what place is by far the best, and word gets around.

I personally just want people to have more options, and to not see parties disbanding because of not enough camps for experience points being open, which has happened to me many times, or trying to fight over certain monsters because of people being stubborn. The sad thing is, this happens through all levels, more frequently at some, and VERY often in end game experience points, where you need the most, most often, and there are the fewest "good camps" it seems. At least, that is the case for FFXI, and I don't believe it will be so in FFXIV.

Now, about the storage issue. Yes, I always thought it was funny that some one could carry 60 Gigantic beds on them at once, but only the equal amount of something small, like instruments. A weight limit is surely an idea worth looking into, for your character, but you should be able to carry just about all of what you would need for an excursion. As far as your Mog-House thing or whatever home nation storage system you will have, I do not want to see muling ever again, and hope that people have more than enough room for expansion to hold all the things they might collect.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 12:40am by EndlessJourney
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#20 Jun 04 2009 at 1:22 AM Rating: Default
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I had this on another forum topic but I wanted to put it here just in case Square would actually see it, who knows. Plus this would be a better place for my thoughts.


So I was at work as usual it was kinda slow at Starbucks and I started thinking about FFXI and what I enjoyed and disliked about the game over the 6+ years I invested in the game. (Since U.S ps2 launch) and what I would and would not like to see in FF14. This is what I came up with (Kind of if you had the power to do whatever you wanted what would you do thing) One thing I realized is that they didnt choose new races that kind of made me sad. Almost like they are rehashing FFXI why not go with something new after all it is a "NEW" game. Ill post my ideas below.

Sub-jobs: I think that this was a great idea in FFXI and would also be a good idea in 14. It adds depth to the game and versatility. I think it gave jobs options that they would not have been possible otherwise. SMN healing and BRD back up etc. Yall get the point. But what if they did something like in FF1 where you can opt for a more advanced job type of deal. Like ex. Start off as a THF then you can opt to branch off to a Sky Pirate or Ninja. A warrior can adv to a Beserker or Knight. A Blm can opt for **** Knight. Granted the game would be different but its just an idea. Then if you choose to not advance to a different job and would get all the benifits of the original job. The adv jobs wouldnt nerf the basic ones just a chance to branch off and do a quest and change prof mid game. Like I said just a concept I had come up with thinking at work for a couple hours.

RACES (This IMO should be a big deal): I think that them choosing the same races was kind of a bad idea. It accosiated the game to FFXI and this is not FFXI it is a new MMORPG so bring some new characters to the table. IMO I would like to see some races from Tactics and other games in this one. Here are some of my ideas.

Rhonzo: By far one of the coolest races to ever hit the FF universe IMO a Warrior race that looks neat and would fit in well in a MMORPG fun to look at and even funner to play as. (COULD REPLACE GALKA)

Viera: Seriously give that some thought rad looking better version of Mithra hands down the bunny from ****!

Mogs: These would make tarus wish they were never created if we could play as a mog welll....... ya get the point!

Humans: Obviously a staple for most RPG's and are in ever FF game.

Bangaa: These guys rock and would be a good replacment for the elves even though elves rock the whole idea was breaking free from the races of FFXI and I think they would be a great addition to the roster.

MACRO: I think the macros already were done well so why change that aspect or maybe if there is something better then go for it but I think that the macros were fine as is.

NOTORIOUS MONSTERS AND DROPS: One of the biggest problems in the game IMO was the competivness for NM's I think that it would be a smart idea to make all NM Drops BOP so that you dont have to compete with gil selling jerk off's.

WEAPON SKILLS: I think that this should stay in one form or another. I think that the Skill Chain idea was a great idea that gave partying a bit of strategy and not mindless grinding. Made it much more interesting then the WoW grinding.

2 HOUR JOB ABILITY: My only problem with this is it should be lowered 1 hour. I think 2 hours is to long of a down time. This will make the ability more usable but not broke. Or heck make it a 30 min cooldown. Still wouldnt make it broken.

JOBS: THIS IS A BIG ONE. These are some ideas that I had that werent in FFXI or should be made better and brought back IMO.

TANKS
========================================================================================================
========================================================================================================
1.Knight: A knight is your Warrior without the direct damage. Specializing in Mace, Flail and Sheilds they are make good tanks and deal fair an average amount of damage. Their specialty would be lowering opponents stats with their rend abilities as well as breaking armor for PVP purposes think of FF Tactics.

3.Viking: A wall of defense. This guy specializing in dual wielding sheilds. Sounds stupid I know but his job is to defend and boost party stats with his moral boosting Shouts. He has a variety of Shouts that also demoralize the mob and affect the mobs stats. All the shouts save a few will be a taunt and have a 30 seconde cooldown. The only class that has the abitliy to attack with a shield. Shield bash, Slam will also be able to stun enemies for a small period of time. (Think of a Spartin warrior with a spike on its shield slamming it into the oponents head over and over again ouch!)

4.Ninja: Thats right the Utsusemi King is back and this time with a boost to his ninjutsu (making it viable to actually use most of it to lower your opponents resistances). One of which counts as a taunt. The standard ninjutsu still applies being able to lower the mobs resistance to increase magical damage and we have one strategic tank. Dual wielding and evasion is your friend still specialzing in throwing weapons and katanas.
=============================================================================================================
=============================================================================================================

SUPPORT

1.Time Mage: With the focus of Red Mage being a damage dealer/back up healer/magic burster. The time mage gets a place in support. They would bost spells such as Haste, Hasteja, Slow, Slowja, Stop, Immbolize, Float, Reflect, Quick (FLEE), Gravity, Gravija, Extend (increases duration of status effects and buffs). Two Hour would be Meteor where all mobs in the area would be hit by a giant well... meteor dealing massive damage and effecting all mobs targeting the party with Stop.

I would like to see Bard return. Aswell as maybe some jobs from newer tactics games or other jobs such as.

Oracle, Dancer, Chocobo Knight. If you do not know what they do look up the jobs on websites. ================================================================================================================
==============================================================================================================
Damage Dealers

Beserker: A dual Weilding axe toating powerhouse. Sacrifices defense for raw damage. Give this guy the old warriors war cry, and an ability to use haste every 5 min for a 30 seconde durration you got your self a good DD. Give him a 30 min where he gets nothing but crits for 1 min and you win =).

Sky Pirate: A mix between thf and ranger specializing in guns and knives. This guy will control hate and then deal some mean damage from a distance to keep his squishy body from getting agrro. He will also be a great puller. Give him some special abilty with guns like Trick shot (attack with a 50% chance to crit) Add some elementle damaging shots that can MB and we got a winner.

Red Mage: thats right a Red Mage DD. The trick is to know your mobs weakness and use that Elementle enchantment on your swords. Add some healing and some nukes and you got a happy team.

For the sake of not taking up anymore space imma stop here but feel free to share your ideas this is the whole point of my starting this forum.

Also note that I would like to see more ability to solo. Like in WoW. But greater rewards for team play which I loved. Also keep the lvl sync and we got one **** of an MMORPG. Please get rid of the exp cap at 200. that was one problem i did have with the game.


Edited, Jun 4th 2009 5:25am by JingleHymer
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#21 Jun 04 2009 at 1:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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444 posts
Make us less dependant from Haste and Refresh for God's sake.
Other than that, please develope Jobs so they can be complete on their own (without the need of THAT particular subjob for example).
Try and give every job something it can add to a Party/Alliance in every occasion, make them unique.

Very personal thought: PLEASE make a better and complete Summoner job. Let Summoner be really unique and give summons a reason to be used all the time.
#22 Jun 04 2009 at 1:50 AM Rating: Excellent
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416 posts
Make it possible to get messages sent while zoning after you have zoned.

Keep the job/sub job changing system. The main reason I don't play WoW type MMOs is because you have to make alter characters each time you want to try other jobs.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 11:53am by IcemanDK
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#23 Jun 04 2009 at 3:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Regarding subjobs, I think the original concept/intent of the system could use some heavy re-thinking. With the subjob system they wanted to create a system that encouraged more character customization so that one could augment their main in a way they found appealing, creating pseudo-hybrid jobs. The issue with this, of course, was in how restrictive MMOs are and that only a handful of subs ended up doing anything useful for a given main job.

I think it would be interesting to have main only instead of main/sub, but integrate the concept of hybrid jobs into the advanced job system. So, for example, to unlock the Paladin job one would have to level Warrior and White Mage to a certain level (20 or 30 maybe) and complete a quest. Dark Knight the same, but with Warrior and Black Mage. Ninja? Warrior and Thief maybe. How about a Duelist class from Warrior and Red Mage?

There wouldn't necessarily have to be a job for every possible combination, and there may also be some advanced jobs that don't follow the hybrid concepts but are just plain new jobs.

The beauty of this is that we can have hybrid jobs that largely combine the concepts of the jobs they're based on, while at the same time sporting things (spells, abilities) completely unique to that job. At the same time, you could simply decide you want to play Warrior. At endgame that Warrior will be more focused on things a Warrior excels at than its hybrid classes will be.

Ultimately this might end up being too restrictive a system, and it would require a lot of thought and maybe a new personalization system to prevent cookie-cutter jobs. Then again, I would argue that the subjob system failed pretty hard at breaking people out of cookie-cutter job builds right from the start.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 6:47am by Shiinpu
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#24 Jun 04 2009 at 3:55 AM Rating: Good
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1-Do not carry subjobs to the next game! Even though you might like to sub other jobs for some variety and fun that is only half of the coin. You can't play as your favorite job til level 75. You have to level your subjob and in order to level that subjob you need to level the subjob of that subjob. You want to play as Summoner? You have to level White Mage. You want to level White Mage? You have to level Black Mage. This was a huge turn off and many people including me were about to quit. People should get to play the job they from start to finish not have to level up jobs they don't even like. I don't like monks. I don't like fighting barefisted. Yet I had to level it just to use it with War. Don't make people struggle to level up using jobs they don't want to use and making them invest money on extra equipment for that job they don't care for.

I liked the advanced version jobs of JinglyHymer. That or a different way of aquiring abilities for a job. With a advanced job system your job could evolve and have the subjob baked in. The Warrior could evolve to Dark Knight or Paladin which would be War/whm or War/blm. Basically you would be accessing different subjob variants but still playing the job you love.

2-Non Premium Magic- Remove the having to buy scrolls. Why do warriors don't have to waste a cent? They get their provoke, bersek and all skills just by leveling up. Why do mages have to pay up for their magic? Magics should be learned at their respective levels except for high level magic like Teleports and such. But magic like Cure, Cure II, Curaga, etc. or other magic should be attainable by leveling. Thiefs don't need to buy a flee scroll or a treasure hunter scroll do they?


Quote:

Keep the job/sub job changing system. The main reason I don't play WoW type MMOs is because you have to make alter characters each time you want to try other jobs.


Iceman. That is the ability to change job. I'm very sure Square Enix will keep it as it has been very succesful. But the subjobs need to go.

Quote:
Make us less dependant from Haste and Refresh for God's sake.
Other than that, please develope Jobs so they can be complete on their own (without the need of THAT particular subjob for example).
Try and give every job something it can add to a Party/Alliance in every occasion, make them unique.


Eeri. That is why subjobs have to go. They make jobs useless without having a subjob on. We need a alternative to the subjob system that is baked in to the main job. I don't want to level other jobs just so I can level my main.


#25 Jun 04 2009 at 4:25 AM Rating: Good
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444 posts
Falmung wrote:
Eeri. That is why subjobs have to go. They make jobs useless without having a subjob on. We need a alternative to the subjob system that is baked in to the main job. I don't want to level other jobs just so I can level my main.


I completely agree with you, but the "Second Job" idea is not that horrible.
I'd love to get a Sub Job as long as it doesn't define what my real job is.

If they really want to keep this concept, fine with me. But they need to rework it entirely.
#26 Jun 04 2009 at 5:56 AM Rating: Decent
25 posts
I believe the majority of the playerbase dislike subjobs because the main job was far too dependent on it. If you were not a PLD/WAR and was something like PLD/SAM, you were not a tank job. However, what took the biggest blow from subjobs was Summoner, a job that was really underpowered and restricted, but was left in the dust since it could /WHM and that's what got them invites.

If subjobs stay in FFXVI, they need to have a far less impact on your main job. No access to job abilities, but job traits would be a nice start. Personally, I don't want to see them at all. So many buffs could've been given to the jobs in FFXI if there were no subjobs.
#27bigbosshenry, Posted: Jun 04 2009 at 7:04 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) hello , i really suggest limit the gil in bids and bazaar transactions , so prices can be reasonable...not like 45m+ for a **** ingame item!! , how can i person with a normal life and body can farm all that gil?! , games = to have fun , not to live into , so please SE make items less rare , and please NO MORE RELICS that takes 2 YEARS of my life to get , if i want to build a real car id make it in less than 2 years , and what i like to see is more self-dependance in the game , like i can open my xbox360 and sign in to ffxiv and go kill stuff and get good XP my own self not with 6 ppl >< , and i think i have a good suggestion for loot system , if a rare item drops with a 6 ppl party then better if u make the drop x6 so it would be fair but i dont think SE will take it seriously lol.
#28 Jun 04 2009 at 7:07 AM Rating: Good
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255 posts
there are many things they can do and that we don't even talk about, i really hope they make the game on their own, not hearing people's cries, the criying thing should be for the beta not before.

They ca do really cool stuff, they want both solo playing and party to be there, they should put bonus for parties, an improved chain sistem would be really cool, a bar tell us how much time left we have for next chain (with cool HUG design) and the more we go, the more bonus chain we get, and i'm not talking about exp just, something like getting attack bonus, mp regen, and other stuff the more you advance the chain would so **** cool, but then again, they can do something absolutelly new that actually works
#29 Jun 04 2009 at 7:55 AM Rating: Good
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Keep the same keyboard/controller system of movement/camera.

I would be so upset if they turned it into mouse/WASD or heaven forbid click to move. :C I have always been a huge fan of the fact I can use my Ps2 controller on my PS to run around etc, I'd hate to see that lost.
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#30 Jun 04 2009 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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I second that this should be a sticky. This is a great list of wants and do not wants.

People really seem to be stuck on the issue of sub jobs - personally I'd want to see them gone.

If a job is defined and fleshed out enough then there will be no need. Hybrids are okay in that the skills or stats are already pre-determined in a way... it's not a matter of leveling x-job for y-job and in turn leveling y-job for z-job...

It's more like taking the idea of job combinations and making them into a single entity. Using Paladin as an example, you take a little white mage, a bit of warrior and poof, you have a paladin who has similar abilities but also some of it's own unique abilities AND the ability to be the focus and agressor without the need for another skill from another job (utsusemi, provoke -.-).

Or how about this... You start out as a basic job, say fighter. You hit a certain point where you can branch out into specific categories, i.e Paladin, Dark Knight, or, just continue to strengthen your 'fighter' into a Warrior. Then that way you have the basic skills but you also have a focus which branches into many other things thus making it unique.

*shrug*

Edit: also, less time sinks and standing around. i.e. wait for people to gather... wait for people to enter.. wait for people to mule junk, wait for people to help you do something (make requirements less steep).

So many times my husband would walk past the computer and be like 'what are you doing?' because all he sees is my character sitting there when in reality I'm just waiting for something to begin, waiting for people to log in, waiting for people to mule or run to the destination.

Campaign was actually one of the things that was great because you could go from battle to battle with fairly short wait times and still gain experience. Besieged was cool too except horrible lag and happened less frequently. In short, other fun ways of gaining experience very unlike the mind numbing party camps would be fantastic (quests, events, crafting, reward for taking breaks, etc.).

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 12:08pm by Riydia
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#31 Jun 04 2009 at 8:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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My suggestion is to make choosing a specific server easy to do and plan ahead of time if one chooses to. Entire linkshells from FFXI are going to want to stick together when they make to move to FFXIV, and it would be great if we could do this efficiently.

I think it would be even better if we had server names similar to FFXI, as this would encourage people who want to stay with their friends to pick the same server name as their previous one. It's a concern of mine that many of my friends will pick different servers as they aren't all from the same linkshell, but a new server by the same name as the FFXI servers could make the decision of which server to pick easier on everyone, to allow close friends from many different linkshells to stick together.
#32 Jun 04 2009 at 8:10 AM Rating: Good
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Susanoh wrote:
My suggestion is to make choosing a specific server easy to do and plan ahead of time if one chooses to. Entire linkshells from FFXI are going to want to stick together when they make to move to FFXIV, and it would be great if we could do this efficiently.

I think it would be even better if we had server names similar to FFXI, as this would encourage people who want to stay with their friends to pick the same server name as their previous one. It's a concern of mine that many of my friends will pick different servers as they aren't all from the same linkshell, but a new server by the same name as the FFXI servers could make the decision of which server to pick easier on everyone, to allow close friends from many different linkshells to stick together.


I agree with keeping server names... They're all FF summons anyhow so it's keeping with tradition.
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#33 Jun 04 2009 at 9:37 AM Rating: Decent
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I want to say in advance that this post might sound a bit disorganized but I have a cold right now and my head hurst so please bear with me. Anyways, I myself would like to see some sort of way that mages, BLM for instance, can combine a like spell such as "Stone" with another BLM and create a even more powerful spell. Example being when the Taru-tarus, in the FFXI before game video, all combine there magic together and create huge boulders to attack the beastmen attacking the city. I think something like that would be pretty awesome. Of course it would not be something that would be easily done as to make it overpowered but where it would take a long period of concentration from all mages involved in the spell to cast the spell. This way it would make it only viable on extremely tough mobs like NM or perhaps as a means to defend a city from frequent monster attacks if the towns would be under attack from beastmen. Feedback on this would be nice. Thanks!
#34 Jun 04 2009 at 9:45 AM Rating: Good
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Bring back FFXI's form of Goblins.

Also, make goblins playable.
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#35 Jun 04 2009 at 10:03 AM Rating: Good
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I think it would be cool to have advanced job like some of you are saying. Where you choose a certain path (specialty) beyond your own. I don't think you should be able to easily change and maintain all the XP you put into the specialization like with WoW and where you can pay to have your points reset. Story-wise that doesn't make much sense.

Example could be THF hitting 50, then three options: Assassin, Ninja, Pirate. Where Assassin is your basic THF (obviously you're leveling so you get better skills and the like), Ninja is a stealth associated THF, and Pirate is less stealth more DD. Each path would have it's own skills. (Assassin gets Dimension Door, Ninja gets shadows and magic, Pirates have better guns and more HP)

Dang, I think that sounds like a much better idea than I did when I started typing it. I would love to see this implemented into the game.

Quote:
I want to say in advance that this post might sound a bit disorganized but I have a cold right now and my head hurst so please bear with me. Anyways, I myself would like to see some sort of way that mages, BLM for instance, can combine a like spell such as "Stone" with another BLM and create a even more powerful spell. Example being when the Taru-tarus, in the FFXI before game video, all combine there magic together and create huge boulders to attack the beastmen attacking the city. I think something like that would be pretty awesome. Of course it would not be something that would be easily done as to make it overpowered but where it would take a long period of concentration from all mages involved in the spell to cast the spell. This way it would make it only viable on extremely tough mobs like NM or perhaps as a means to defend a city from frequent monster attacks if the towns would be under attack from beastmen. Feedback on this would be nice. Thanks!
This would be cool, but I see a whole lot of BLM, BLM, BLM, BLM, BLM, BRD parties cropping up. (if we were to apply FFXI jobs. [and yes, I realize this isn't FFXI but since we don't know what the jobs will be, we can assume there will be the basic Final Fantasy jobs and at least make up hypothetical situations]) They'd have to be really careful about the casting time, but if they extended it like you say, they may be able to pull it off.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 2:06pm by TheShadowWalker
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#36 Jun 07 2009 at 10:04 AM Rating: Decent
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bump to front page.


p.s. this should be a sticky so people can add to this thread instead of everyone making their own "zomg this is what i want and dont want" thread.
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#37 Jun 07 2009 at 10:30 AM Rating: Decent
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I would love to see quests and missions reward with experience.
#38 Jun 07 2009 at 12:14 PM Rating: Default
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No More Sub Jobs!

It seems to be a pretty common theory that people do not want the sub job system anymore. They want ways to specialize their jobs, and be versatile at them, however they don't want to have to level other jobs to be complete on the job they wish to play. It allows for too much confusion, and also takes away from the uniqueness and feel of some jobs. Each job should be good at what it does in it's own way, and with it's own abilities and trade marks. You should have ways to do different things differently, but the use of sub jobs seems to be something that people no longer wish to have to bother with. It simply has too many drawbacks and problems.


No. Freaking. Way. The Sub job system is one of truly unique and brilliant things about FFXI. It provided a huge level of customization and versatility.

It also makes for a much more creative player base. The FFXI community did things, and created more ways to play than even SE expected because of the sub job system. Testing out unique job combos and finding out different ways to play was fun as ****, and it would be a sad day if it was gone from FFXIV. If you make a system that keeps customization to within the main job, you're going to end up with something like talent trees from WoW, which are inherently limiting. The sub job system lets the player decide. If they wanna go out and solo as a WAR/BLM because they feel like it, they can. If they wanna use a more common combo, they can. It's a wonderful system.
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#39 Jun 07 2009 at 12:35 PM Rating: Decent
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TravestyOfAsura wrote:
No. Freaking. Way. The Sub job system is one of truly unique and brilliant things about FFXI. It provided a huge level of customization and versatility.
Seeing that you'd get laughed out of parties if your main/sub combination was not optimal or cookie cutter, I'll disagree on this.

Quote:
It also makes for a much more creative player base. The FFXI community did things, and created more ways to play than even SE expected because of the sub job system. Testing out unique job combos and finding out different ways to play was fun as ****, and it would be a sad day if it was gone from FFXIV. If you make a system that keeps customization to within the main job, you're going to end up with something like talent trees from WoW, which are inherently limiting. The sub job system lets the player decide. If they wanna go out and solo as a WAR/BLM because they feel like it, they can. If they wanna use a more common combo, they can. It's a wonderful system.
WoW's system may be inherently limiting through mechanics and things like talent points or the way trees are set up, but FFXI's system is limited by a much bigger factor: the playerbase's mentality.

To put my two cents on the subjob system, the system is a good idea on paper, but the way it was implemented has always been lousy, since only a handful of combos were actually usable and viable while the rest were pretty much left to rot. The creation of overpowered combos from a development perspective (stuff like NIN/WAR before the Utsusemi nerf come to mind) is another thing that makes people like me wary of subjobs. I'd rather have an emphasis on the main job, with the sub offering very minor boosts. Having access to what may be the good half of an entire job class is just a bad idea, IMO.

On topic, stat dependencies need to be looked at and revamped. Accuracy should not be so make-or-break for melee classes during the leveling process. Either that or it should be more plentiful in gear as people level up (I doubt anyone wants to see Peacock Charm v2.0). Defense needs to matter more, in turn allowing more jobs to tank in group content.

Additionally, hybrid jobs need to be able to choose their role and provide useful benefits to their groups. I personally don't think I can stomach a second coming of the MP-battery-and-curebot Red Mage in content that matters.
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#40 Jun 07 2009 at 1:07 PM Rating: Decent
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WoW's system may be inherently limiting through mechanics and things like talent points or the way trees are set up, but FFXI's system is limited by a much bigger factor: the playerbase's mentality.
It's not limited if you want to go out and solo with whatever combination you feel like. It's not limited if you have a group to play with that's willing to experiment. It's limited to a similar degree as talent trees within the whole of the playerbase. To me that means there's no upside to scrapping it in place of a talent tree-like system.

The thing I would hate most about a talent tree type system is the lack of ability to figure out ways of playing that SE didn't think of. It forces you to choose from a set list of paths that they created instead of piecing together your own from everything that's available.

Quote:
To put my two cents on the subjob system, the system is a good idea on paper, but the way it was implemented has always been lousy, since only a handful of combos were actually usable and viable while the rest were pretty much left to rot.
Is that not how it should be? Why should combo's that don't make sense be viable? If you look at the majority of the commonly used combo's they make sense. Mages sub mage jobs, melee's sub melee jobs. The one's that don't make sense aren't commonly used, but they're still there for people to mess around with. That option for experimentation should remain available for those who wish to use it. All you do by removing the system is make the developers do what the playerbase does now, only worse.
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#41 Jun 07 2009 at 1:12 PM Rating: Decent
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My Suggestions.

1. Stop deleting characters. Ive played a number of mmos and the only one I've encountered that deletes your character is XI. Its stopped me from returning in the past. If I want I can reactivate my Characters on WoW exactly as I left them 2 years ago. Same with Age of Conan, Eve, City of Heros, and every other mmo Ive heard of. You should never make it hard for a player to return to your game.

2. Character Customization options. Ok I get that 11 could only have so much because of the ps2. Im sure the ps3 can handle the wide derth of customization options thats become standard in certain mmos out now (CoH, AoC, Aion). In this case more is better.

3. Communication. Look at Funcoms recent FAIL on that front and do everything they did not do.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 5:40pm by mezlabor
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#42 Jun 07 2009 at 1:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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{Major Point #1}Don't make realism the enemy of fun:I'm perfectly fine with being able to carry 10x500lb fish and being able to change my cloths in the middle of battle (not the best examples but I think you know what I mean). There are a lot of times when developers restrict players because certain actions/situations are "unrealistic", but we're playing a game where a 500lb reincarnating galka with two tons of gear riding a 200lb bird is the norm, we're ok with some oddities as long as it's done to make the game more playable. (plus, it gives webcomic writers material, which gives you free publicity lol)

"Short" Events: No more crappy 4hr dynamis or 5hrs sitting at kings, make short (30min-1hr) events, that are completable back to back (see: nyz, assualts, XNMs)
No Massive spawn windows: 40 people sitting around in 2-3 groups staring at blank space for 4hrs every 20 hrs in the hopes that X mob spawns, and they get the claim is incredibly frustrating.
No PvP: The only thing that ****** me off more than having my class completely revamped every 2-3months, is having my class completely revamped because of an event I don't participate in. Having a PvP focus in a PvE game is nightmarish on game balance. It also causes a lot of unnecessary social drama.
Make Crafting meaningful: HQ ingredients should have a greater chance of HQ results. There should be more than one way to HQ. How skilled the crafter is *at that synth* should have a much greater impact on the result. While, you're at it, going through 20 different items to make ingredients for 1 synth is puts ridiculous strain on inventory/item management, and having to select each ingredient separately is a pain in the ***, especially with nonsensical sorting.
Add inventory management tools: Keeping auto-sort is a must, but players should also be able to sort their inventory in multiple ways as is convenient to them (alphabetically, by type, by craft, by level, etc). If there are multiple jobs/rolls that require different gear sets, players should be able to set entire "sets" of gear they swap out of banks/lockers/house/etc, rather than having to select each piece to remove individually.
Everyone should be able to heal themselves to some degree: Feeling like you can't do any solo content because you have to stop and wait 5min to rest every other mob sucks. /DNC in FFXI was a good start for melee, but having access to reasonably affordable potions/ethers/etc like every other game in the franchise and every other MMO I can think of would be better.
Worthwhile HP/MP regen: Must break the ball and chain of "every group must have a BRD or RDM to succeed", the previous point is a good start for this, but at least some level of non-resting refresh/regen would be better.
Allow for useful macros: If players want to semi-automate their experience a bit, let them. They'll feel pressured to figure out work arounds otherwise, then you'll end up with 80% of players using "illegal" programs to make your game playable. Functions like: "cancel X buff", "alt-tabbing", "distance finder", "chatlog time stamps", "don't blink", "recast display", and "exp/enmity/stat monitoring" should be available from the get go. If you don't want a certain function available, clearly state it (or make a list of approved functions) rather that using vague umbrella descriptions that leave the players guessing whats "ok".
Worthwhile drops: I don't care if it doesn't make sense for a lv1 bunny to drop money{1}, I want to have some sort of tangible reward for killing any mob. Limiting major money farming activities to harvesting/crafting or farming X mob for Y item to make Z gear creates a tremendous bottle neck and leads to a lot of pop competition and frustration. If an item is meant to be valuable due to rarity/usefulness it still will be regardless, but it shouldn't feel like I have to camp X mob because 90% of the other mobs in the game drop worthless crap.
Better work-> reward relationship: I've taken 87 tries to get a 6% drop item before, killing the same mob over and over with no clear end in sight is very frustrating.{1} I recommend A)point systems (see assault/einherjar: do activity soo many times soo well, and you're able to get X gear), B)kill based drop systems (the more you've killed mob X, the better your drop rate, this is especially good for quests and NMs w/ r/e gear), and/or c) "Tokens" that can be traded for a selection of gear (example: token "NyzHead" drops, can be traded for denali or askar or goliard head, because it seems like if need 4 askar and 2 goliard pieces nothing but denali drops ~_~)
No specific strategy required: Far too often in FFXI you "need" a certain job or piece of equipment to complete a mission. Try to make things as open ended as possible and keep the difficulty at a reasonable level for plot related fights at least.
No "this item takes 6months-2yrs and huge amounts of resources to complete": Frustration with relic weapons has caused several dozen players I know to quit, it's ok to have difficult to obtain pieces, but keep it reasonable.
More even transition between weapons: It's ok for some weapons to be better than others, but it shouldn't be to the point where if you don't have X sword you're worthless.
Gear with similar/same stats but different models: Something I think Lineage 2 did particularly well, when I leveled up and was ready to get a new sword I could choose between 3-4 1handed swords with the exact same stats but different models, so I could pick which one went best with the rest of my gear and avatar personality.{1} I hate looking absolutely ridiculous in mismatched gear just because it's the only thing available with best stats.
Scaling set bonus's: set bonuses are fine and increase the complexity of gear decisions, but it shouldn't be "all #/# pieces or it's crap". Iron ram vs Usukane is a good example of this, if I have 2-3 free slots it makes sense to wear IR and get the added bonus, but with usu it's "until I get the last item I have 3-4 expensive pieces that are worthless".
Barber shop: Players get tired of looking at the same hair/race/etc for seven years. It can't be that hard to change the code from "face 6-A" to "face 6-B". In that same line I think players should be able to change race/face/***/tattoos/tails/horns/names/etc as well as hair.{1} Maybe make it require pecial items (magical potion) and/or have a "cool down" to prevent abuse.
Easy Travel: Waiting 15-20min for a boat to show up/ferry you is not fun. Taking 30min to walk somewhere and then have the people who were waiting on you disband is not fun. Having to fight countless crap mobs to get from A to B is not fun. Travel needs to be quick and painless. The first time someone goes to a location it's good to make them explore it a bit, but they shouldn't have to spend all day getting there every time. Convenient summon/warp/teleports/etc are a must.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 6:00pm by shintasama
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#43 Jun 07 2009 at 2:58 PM Rating: Good
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TravestyOfAsura wrote:
It's not limited if you want to go out and solo with whatever combination you feel like.
This was a laughable argument until fields of valor popped into existence. Still is in my eyes because the game in question happens to be built around grouping.
Quote:
It's not limited if you have a group to play with that's willing to experiment.
Which no group that wants to progress at a decent rate will be willing to do once the cookie-cutter set-ups have been figured out.
Quote:
It's limited to a similar degree as talent trees within the whole of the playerbase. To me that means there's no upside to scrapping it in place of a talent tree-like system.
Talents at least let you choose what parts of the class you want to improve on instead of forcing a complete package where only one or two things would be appealing to you.
Quote:
The thing I would hate most about a talent tree type system is the lack of ability to figure out ways of playing that SE didn't think of. It forces you to choose from a set list of paths that they created instead of piecing together your own from everything that's available.
I'm scratching my head over why you'd want a repeat of the "discovery" of utsusemi tanking. Those little "discoveries" tend to bork game balance way more than bugs that manage to make it to a live release. Or did you suddenly forget how at one point blood tanking was made obsolete by Utsusemi because one generated downtime while the other didn't? Or how utsusemi made certain bosses and mobs trivial while they were suicide if a paladin or a warrior attempted to tank them?
Quote:
Is that not how it should be? Why should combo's that don't make sense be viable? If you look at the majority of the commonly used combo's they make sense. Mages sub mage jobs, melee's sub melee jobs. The one's that don't make sense aren't commonly used, but they're still there for people to mess around with. That option for experimentation should remain available for those who wish to use it. All you do by removing the system is make the developers do what the playerbase does now, only worse.
Creating options that are not viable is wasteful from a development perspective. It also goes against the idea that there should be something for everyone. Again, I'd rather see emphasis on the main job, so that you can choose to invite the main job instead of worrying about the sub. Either that or do a skill/trait borrowing system.
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#44 Jun 07 2009 at 3:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Offline Macro editor with import export. Being able to edit macros without logging onto a character. Being able to export macros to share with friends.
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#45 Jun 07 2009 at 4:31 PM Rating: Decent
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A feature I really thought was neat from my brief time in LotRO (at least I'm pretty sure it's LotRO that I saw it) was the ability to use a set of clothes for your appearance, totally independent from the Armor you were wearing for their stats. I mean, no one ever liked seeing my ugly Elvaan legs in a subligar anyhow. ;P
#46 Jun 08 2009 at 8:33 AM Rating: Decent
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Honestly, I would love SE to show a mobs health bar (and give users the option to hide it for those who don't want it to be displayed).

Also, if they utilize mages in the same was as FFXI I would want to see some form of greater mana regen. It would eliminate alot of the issues of mages having to stop damage and /heal while melee don't have that limitation. Again, it cannot be something that makes healing meaningless. Best thing i could point to in this reguard is wow and how they have spirit impact how much mp is regened while not casting.

Edited, Jun 8th 2009 12:37pm by EklmForever
#47 Jun 08 2009 at 9:19 AM Rating: Good
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One thing I really hope they stop is hidden stats. There's no logical reason to hide my Accuracy total from me, especially when it's represented with specific numbers on items. There can be some hidden stats, like Luck or something, but more important things like Accuracy need to be clearly shown.

I also want them to remove equipped items from inventory. Why am I wearing my armor, and carrying it in my gobbiebag at the same time? Increased, and more easily attained, inventory space in general would be good as well.

Someone else also posted about outfits from LotRO, which is an awesome addition. The ability to customize your appearance with equipment that you like the look of, while still being able to keep the gear that benefits your stats, is a great idea.
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#48 Jun 08 2009 at 9:35 AM Rating: Decent
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EklmForever wrote:
Honestly, I would love SE to show a mobs health bar (and give users the option to hide it for those who don't want it to be displayed).

Also, if they utilize mages in the same was as FFXI I would want to see some form of greater mana regen. It would eliminate alot of the issues of mages having to stop damage and /heal while melee don't have that limitation. Again, it cannot be something that makes healing meaningless. Best thing i could point to in this reguard is wow and how they have spirit impact how much mp is regened while not casting.
I may be alone in this, but I'd love to just see resting (AKA sitting down) done away with and replaced by some sort of always active/progressive regen/refresh. Maybe you're always getting 1-2 HP/MP a tic, but as your character stays inactive (IE: not fighting/engaged with a mob/something) the more HP/MP you begin getting per tic. So after maybe two tics of 1-2 and no activity you get 5 per tic, then 10, then 20, then 40, then 80. I just think that being inactive is enough to warrant incredibly rapid recovery. I absolutely hate resting. ><

ETA: On the gear changing thing: I like the fact that when I see someone running around in awesome gear I know they're awesome. Maybe you should have to own the gear to be able to look like you're wearing it when you're not... I don't know, I'm kind of halvsies on this one.

Edited, Jun 8th 2009 12:37pm by Codyy

Edited, Jun 8th 2009 1:57pm by Codyy
#49 Jun 08 2009 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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The Codyy of Doom wrote:
I may be alone in this, but I'd love to just see healing done away with and replaced by some sort of always active/progressive regen/refresh. Maybe you're always getting 1-2 HP/MP a tic, but as your character stays inactive (IE: not fighting/engaged with a mob/something) the more HP/MP you begin getting per tic. So after maybe two tics of 1-2 and no activity you get 5 per tic, then 10, then 20, then 40, then 80. I just think that being inactive is enough to warrant incredibly rapid recovery. I absolutely hate healing. ><


I doubt that getting rid of healing spells is going to happen in this, or just about any other MMORPG. In boss fights, someone's got to tank the boss and take the majority of the damage. If there are no healing spells, then either the boss would have to hit light enough so that the fight is a joke, you'd have to have a tank rotation setup which I think would be more annoying then fun, or the tank is going to fall over dead every time.

#50 Jun 08 2009 at 9:54 AM Rating: Decent
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Keep the subjob but make it more versatile. Having to have a certain subjob was ridiculous. Tanks needed /war or they couldn't do anything... stupid.

Keep NM's but make them much more random and make all the items rare/ex. I think one thing that fixed inflation was making the items rare/ex... before that no chance. Make the mobs slightly easier to get... for example since it's rare ex keep a count of how many times player A has killed the enemy and compensate them with a higher drop rate... could be abused but yeah i think people will like this... then you still have to camp for an uber item but you will be guaranteed it after while(like 5 kills? whereas a thief might get it in 3)

Faster transport/chocobos in town. Having to walk across jeuno or some other stupid city only to miss the boat/airship by 10seconds and having to wait 30min for the next one is dumb. Parties are disbanded all the time this way. On top of that the transpot system was owned by the whitemages which is good and bad. The quests were very long and tedious so many didn't do them. Then there were bots offering teleports all the time for a large amount of gil since it was needed. Even a huge transport that takes me relatively close to an area in a decent time would be... very nice.

/agree with NO PVP. I play FFXI for story, challange and parties. Having a chat with someone, releasing and relaxing is what a community based FFXI is about. Having jobs ruined because you need to balance for pvp doesn't help anyone except those who pvp... and if you want to PVP hardcore... go play wow.

More strategy. Too many battles are cookie cutter required certain dps, no other "unneeded" jobs and no time to waste. The only randomness was if a gob was going to toss a bomb and wipe the party, drop it, or just not throw one at all... stupid.

More mob restrictions. Having a mob chase you forever is dumb, having a mob with unlimited mana, bombs, items etc is just stupid. I understand they are powerful but being able to pummel you because they have unlimited everything just makes the game less fun when people want to try new things. That and once again there is no strategy except brute force.

Active regeneration. Not having it is really old. Even oblivion understood this when they transitioned from morrowind. Having a mage run out fo mana and stay out is dumb. Having to "rest" is a little tedious especially considering how slow it is on FFXI where you have to be down for... 15 seconds? before you get 1 tick @ .. 11 hp and slowly rising? That and the dependance upon refresh was ridiculous. RDM always had parties... which is good but they were needed or highly desired if you even wanted to level at anything past "slow". too much dependance upon a certain job/spell that once again sky rocketed the AH prices on the scroll.

Scrolls are fine to me if managed well. I do not think mages should have all spells, nor should any class. Adding more depth like giving people a quest to do to unlock a skill or a vital choice on a skill instead of another might be fun. Anything to lower dependance on buying things on the auction house to be a little self sufficient or camping the monster for 20 years.(PS when you camp a monster for your spell you just got at level the monster is usually much much much higher then you and you have no chance of getting it unless you have ahigher job... hence why fighting jobs usually leveled faster, they were significantly cheaper).

Bigger storage... no auto sort and 40 items limit? what! Having expensive quests with rare items was no change either. You had to farm for a long time just to get to 45 because it cost you 40k-80k gil. So not fun. Either make a bag system, or make the quests group based like Eco warrior... or mats easier to gather, or a bigger inventory... either way a tweak is needed. Or perhaps make the items rare/ex and a fair bit easier to gather.
#51 Jun 08 2009 at 10:10 AM Rating: Good
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This list more-or-less reflects my feelings as well. I just want to add though that sometimes a good long battle is not a bad thing. FF has always been known for it's monstrous boss battles that can take hours and I like that but I think the upper limit on any boss battle or area battle (like Dynamis) should be set to 2-3 hours max.

Also please make it easier to change jobs/equipment. Nothing is worse than an LS waiting on a single person to mule gear for one of the 13 jobs that they have leveled.
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Kyansaroo - Kujata
Windurst Rank 10
Tarutaru
BLM 75 / WHM 75 / BST 75 / RDM 75 / BRD 75
Next to 75: COR 47 / SCH 58
RotZ: Complete
CoP: Complete
ToAU: In-Progress
WoTG: In-Progress
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