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#52 Jun 04 2009 at 5:37 PM Rating: Default
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I disagree. I don't think it should require you to interact with the player base. I think the incredible potential of an MMO is that it gives you the option to do so, and I think most MMO developers realize that if they want to have a successful game with true longevity, it has to be kept as an option and not a requirement. People are paying by the month to play most MMOs. If the way the game is developed and tuned means that you can't enjoy the game because the conditions don't allow it (ie. can't find a group for whatever reason), you're going to **** people off and they're going to stop paying you.
The problem with this is that you are playing a MMO. It exists not for one person but many. If you want an offline single player game, then play an offline single player game. Why should a MMO have to adapt to single play? What is the purpose? That's like joining an orgy and then you walk [Over There] and ********** instead. What the eff?

I'll never understand the concept of playing a MMO, paying to play, to play ALONE. What the eff? Seriously. You people treat MMOs like 3D instant messengers. That's basically your argument right there. Paying to use a MMO for glorified IMing inside a game while you play said game.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 9:38pm by Voldermolt
#53 Jun 04 2009 at 5:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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Voldermolt wrote:
The problem with this is that you are playing a MMO. It exists not for one person but many. If you want an offline single player game, then play an offline single player game. Why should a MMO have to adapt to single play? What is the purpose? That's like joining an orgy and then you walk [Over There] and ********** instead. What the eff?

I'll never understand the concept of playing a MMO, paying to play, to play ALONE. What the eff? Seriously. You people treat MMOs like 3D instant messengers. That's basically your argument right there. Paying to use a MMO for glorified IMing inside a game while you play said game.


That's a pretty narrow view. You talk like people who enjoy having (and utilizing) the option to play an MMO solo only play solo and never group. Rarely is that the case. Maybe my last three xp groups sucked all to **** and I don't feel like taking the risk that the fourth one will be the same. Maybe I've tried for 15 minutes to find a group and that was enough before I decided to set out on my own and enjoy my time in the game instead of getting frustrated and impatient as the minutes/hours tick by and I can't do anything because nothing I would like to do can be done without a group.

Again, it's about the option to occupy yourself enjoyably whether there's a group available or not.
#54 Jun 04 2009 at 5:48 PM Rating: Good
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Squallido wrote:
SERIOUSLY, for those who wants FFXIV to be WOW-like... why not just then keep playing wow? this is a total different game, and they are smartasses which can come up with better ideas (which isnt really hard).

Game will be easier than FFXI in some aspects, but it is not a wow clone.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 9:20pm by Squallido

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 9:21pm by Squallido

About people leaving the game, dude, people won't play mmos forever, 4 years is more than enough time for a single game.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 9:22pm by Squallido


I don't normally do this...or announce it...but imma go ahead and rate you down for contributing the single dumbest post in this thread. Take care now.
#55 Jun 04 2009 at 5:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Why is there even a debate about this still? Whether or not you think it wise to include WoW attributes to FFXIV doesn't matter since they have already done it.
#56 Jun 04 2009 at 5:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Best suggestion? Don't worry about what other people can get. Find what you want and decide for yourself if it's worth the process to get it. If it is, go get it. If it's not, go get something else. Don't resent the grind you chose to do when there was a nearly equivalent option available to you for less effort. I'm not saying that everything should be instant, I'm saying that there are few things worse than listening to people whine because they put in soooo much more time than Bob but Bob's gear isn't so far from their own. If that were a valid argument, the one and only pair of Leaping Boots I ever got from Lizzy should have had +253 Agility on them to reward me for putting in so much more time than the guy who stumbled across Lizzy by accident and got them on his first kill.
Verily and a mighty ahah! at the Leapin Boots comment. It's not so much a resentment as a consistency factor, I'd be looking for. If I chose some long grind that involved many hours excavating dungeons with mages by my side and tanks at the front, I think my character should reflect that. Whereas someone that went out on their own and took a very casual tone to adventuring, should have a character that reflects that.

In less general terms:
If I over throw a God, I should hope to have more interesting armour than someone who scraped by a tedious quest.
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#57 Jun 04 2009 at 6:14 PM Rating: Good
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TheShadowWalker wrote:
Verily and a mighty ahah! at the Leapin Boots comment. It's not so much a resentment as a consistency factor, I'd be looking for. If I chose some long grind that involved many hours excavating dungeons with mages by my side and tanks at the front, I think my character should reflect that. Whereas someone that went out on their own and took a very casual tone to adventuring, should have a character that reflects that.

In less general terms:
If I over throw a God, I should hope to have more interesting armour than someone who scraped by a tedious quest.


I agree, but loot is rarely (if ever) forefront on my mind. I'm more interested in the experience that leads to the reward, which is why I like fresh content and progression as opposed to more static content coupled with an epic grind. I'll invest time in gearing my character...a lot of time, in fact. I do find building goals around better gear to be a key and enjoyable factor of any RPG, MMO or standalone console/PC. The main thing for me is that I won't subject myself to abject misery to get it. I think I entered Dynamis (of any kind) a total of 3-4 times max the entire time I played FFXI. My experience every time with the disorganized, ineffective, sloppy lunacy made it very, very clear to me that no relic, no AF2 was worth the kind of grind required for the estimated length of time required in that environment in order for me to get it. I left guilds in WoW because they turned dated raid content into another time consuming, sloppy, frustrating grind when it really didn't need to be.

My ideal scenario is to find a group of people of roughly equal skill and like mindset and progress through content and have a blast. Spend some time repeating if necessary to ensure we're adequately geared and experienced for the next tier of content and then get at it. Give me tough monsters that eat our faces off for weeks so that we feel accomplished for having finally downed them, reward us appropriately for our success, and do so in a way that doesn't force us to go back to that content every week for the next two years if we want everyone in the group to feel like they've gotten what they want from it before they can focus their attention elsewhere. I think from what I've been reading/seeing that SE realizes that there's only a very small place in an MMO for the epic, prolonged grind type of design, and by all means make the rewards for completing that grind absolutely fantastic. Just (as you say), make sure there's plenty in between for the little people.
#58 Jun 04 2009 at 6:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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It's not about being 'ultra nationalist', but it IS about defending the MMORPG that we love, that FFXIV HAPPENS TO BE THE NATURAL SUCCESSOR TO.
It is one thing to suggest aspects that we like from other games. It is an entirely other thing to COMPLETELY upend the core of a final fantasy game in order to gain subscriptions from another playerbase.


Two problems here:

One, you don't have to defend the MMORPG you love, because it's not under attack. XIV isn't it's successor, because successor implies replacing the old... and SE intends for XI to go on for years to come. Your character, linkshell, nation, all the wonders of Vana'diel are safe. What we have here is no different than every single MMO that has been announced or released since XI. Some players will leave to try it, some players will play both to test the waters, and others will stay. The things that seems to be getting the proverbial panties in a bunch here are the looks of the races, and the name Final Fantasy.


Two, perhaps you missed it, but "COMPLETELY upend"ing things is what the Final Fantasy series is about! You didn't hate SE for changing the Battle system from 6 to 7, did you? And from 7 to 8, 8 to 9, ect. Final Fantasy has always evolved from game to game, and since you obviously have an affination to the series, should accept and appreciate the differences between the two games. Because it sounds like there are gonna be a lot.

They have a game we already know we love in FFXI. Most of us only tried FFXI because of the fantastic times we had over the years with the series, even if not every change made was our favorite. I'm definitely going to try FFXIV because I continue to believe that SE will give me the best RPG experience for my dollar. And if it doesn't suit me, I know a MMO that does.

But this entire ownership feeling from the community has to go. XIV will have its own community. It will contain some familiar faces, and some notable omissions from the XI community, a host of returning players, and all new members to the FF community to give it a flavor all it's own. That community is already forming now, and everyone in it has an equal voice in this new community. Accomplishments in and love for XI are not required for admission, and do not grant you favored insight into what this game should be.
#59 Jun 04 2009 at 7:00 PM Rating: Default
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Okay, I'm not trying to call anyone out or do the wow vs ffxi. Having said that..

To answer why ffxi are so defensive, we normally aren't. But when we look at the board and see a post title "things WoW does right" or something like that it sends a statement saying you want it to play like WoW whether that is what you mean or not. That is how it is going to be seen. If you pop over too the swtor general boards you'll see the same defensive stance.

Both wow and ffxi have good qualities and bad ones. FFXI are just very passionite about the good and the want those to carry over in ffxi's sucessor. I for one want group based xping as the prime source of leveling.
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#60 Jun 04 2009 at 7:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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dyvidd wrote:
To answer why ffxi are so defensive, we normally aren't. But when we look at the board and see a post title "things WoW does right" or something like that it sends a statement saying you want it to play like WoW whether that is what you mean or not. That is how it is going to be seen. If you pop over too the swtor general boards you'll see the same defensive stance.


Yes, that is how it's going to be seen by FFXI players who are overly paranoid, defensive, and xenophobic. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with discussing it.
#61 Jun 04 2009 at 7:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Who ******* cares?

Honestly, it's in the FF series so it's not going to be like WoW in the atmosphere and gameplay. But that doesn't mean SE shouldn't be using good gameplay idea's, and applying them in their own ways to their MMO.

Stop bleeding all your emo ****** whining all over the forums, this is ****** ridiculous. 3 days and like 50 posts of utter ********* Shut up and wait for the gameplay demo video's before you start QQing and parading around the forums about how you want to game to be different, when you don't know how the original works yet. Yeah, you're really ******* innovative and ****, so go apply to work at SE, until then, STFU about your misinformed, poorly-aimed ******** ramblings that are basically about nothing.
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#62 Jun 04 2009 at 7:49 PM Rating: Decent
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AureliusSir wrote:
dyvidd wrote:
To answer why ffxi are so defensive, we normally aren't. But when we look at the board and see a post title "things WoW does right" or something like that it sends a statement saying you want it to play like WoW whether that is what you mean or not. That is how it is going to be seen. If you pop over too the swtor general boards you'll see the same defensive stance.


Yes, that is how it's going to be seen by FFXI players who are overly paranoid, defensive, and xenophobic. Doesn't mean there's anything wrong with discussing it.


And you are just adding fuel to the fire. Also FYI, there games out there that have been ruined because they tried to be wow clone. Look at SWG. It had a decent player base but the company got greeding and wanted wows sucess. So in mid game the tore down and did a fast rebuild to look and feel like wow. They lost 90% of the player base in one week and never recovered.

If you want to pitch your ideas that's fine. If like how another mmo does thing. But learn how to post without making flame bait. "things WoW does better" you be better "things I would like to see.". What do you think would happen if someone posted in the wow boards regarding their new mmo "things ffxi does better"?

Really this debate is silly though cause ffxiv is already built. All the major details are finished and se is doing the final tweaks before beta. It has to be if they are announcing a 2010 release which is only a year.

Edit: sorry for the poor grammar. Bored at work posted with iPhone.


As for the other guy, go take a smoke break or get a drink cause you are getting way to worked up over this.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 9:54pm by dyvidd
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#63 Jun 04 2009 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:
And you are just adding fuel to the fire. Also FYI, there games out there that have been ruined because they tried to be wow clone. Look at SWG. It had a decent player base but the company got greeding and wanted wows sucess. So in mid game the tore down and did a fast rebuild to look and feel like wow. They lost 90% of the player base in one week and never recovered.


I'll say it one more time and I'm going to ask you politely to get the stick out of your *** and read it carefully:

Nobody is asking for a WoW clone.

Did you get it that time?

Quote:
If you want to pitch your ideas that's fine. If like how another mmo does thing. But learn how to post without making flame bait. "things WoW does better" you be better "things I would like to see.". What do you think would happen if someone posted in the wow boards regarding their new mmo "things ffxi does better"?


I don't see a single thread throughout this forum title "things WoW does better". Maybe you're reading the translated version in another language and it didn't quite cross over?

Quote:
Really this debate is silly though cause ffxiv is already built. All the major details are finished and se is doing the final tweaks before beta. It has to be if they are announcing a 2010 release which is only a year.


It's not already built. SE says FFXI had a 3-4 month beta and they want FFXIV to have on a little bit longer than that. Say they shoot for a 6 month beta window..that leaves them 6 months worth of development time with a couple of months to spare to get the game out for next fall. 6 months is an enormous amount of time to tweak and overhaul game mechanics.
#64 Jun 04 2009 at 8:10 PM Rating: Good
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What do you think would happen if someone posted in the wow boards regarding their new mmo "things ffxi does better"?


This isn't the FFXI board. See where it says "Final Fantasy XIV Forum" at the top?

Oh, and this one from earlier is too funny to pass by:

Quote:
Well, if we now are discussing WoW, let me entertain you with a little bit of WoW facts. If you think that WoW is popular think again. According to Blizzard WoW had 11, 5 million subscribers at the end of November 2008, roughly 1 month after Wrath of Leech king. During a press conference not so long ago, Blizzard admitted that they are still at 11, 5 million. This is a period of 6 months after the release of Lich King.


Yes, s/he is arguing that WoW isn't really popular because its population didn't go up very much from 11.5 million, which is over ten times the population of the second place game.

Anyway, I played FFXI for years, and I mostly enjoyed it, but in the end I wasn't able to put in the ****-sock level of commitment that was required to do absolutely anything. Since I've quit, I understand SE has done some things to rectify that situation, and I'm glad for that. I don't doubt that FFXI remains a game for the hardcore, however, and that's not me.

WoW, which has a far better combat system and makes it possible to play even if you don't have 30 hours a week to commit, is my current game, and I'm enjoying that as well. Unfortunately, though, WoW is ultimately rather shallow, as all you really have to do is kill enemies, either alone or in groups of 5, 10, or 25. The dungeons all have the exact same basic structure: kill a bunch of trash that's blocking you way to the boss, kill boss, repeat. Where's the stealthing around? Where are the mazes? Where's the crazy off-the-wall stuff like gambling with a goblin to make money to buy explosives to free marids so the Imperial Army can shear them? No, it's all just kill kill kill and repeat.

Oh, and the story is weaksauce. Warcraft itself has plenty of good story to it, but it's in the previous Warcraft games and the novels. With a couple exceptions, it's not in WoW.

So now we have SE announcement that they're making a game that'll have the same storytelling and variety chops as FFXI with the casual friendly gameplay of WoW. Sounds like the next MMO to crack 10 million subscribers to me.
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#65 Jun 04 2009 at 8:25 PM Rating: Decent
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You know I could fire back with some insults for you too but you're diffently not worth the ban. Alla.ffxi is the ffxi communities home and some feel this forum whether part of ffxi or not is part of that home since it deal with we and their mmo. When you make a post learning from wow, some see as disrepecting that community in their home. That isn't the case of course but that is how it's seen. If that isn't clear enough then you'll just have to deal with it on your own.

As for time tables, 6 months isn't a lot of time at all. The game has been in development for 4 years. It takes a year or two just to go from design table to computer. They are only going to do tweaking and bug repairs from this point out until beta. Once beta they see what works and doesn't on a large scale and make the correction. Honestly we may see beta this fall to give them a long beta cycle.
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#66 Jun 04 2009 at 8:49 PM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:
When you make a post learning from wow, some see as disrepecting that community in their home. That isn't the case of course but that is how it's seen.


If someone chooses to see things falsely, that's their problem, not mine. And if the FFXI community is so insecure that the very idea that a competing game might have some good ideas to offer makes them panic and start screeching, that is also their problem, not mine.

This is the FFXIV board on a website that covers all MMOs. Nobody here is obligated to tiptoe around rabid whiny FFXI fanbois who'll whither and die at the very mention of WoW. If you can't stand that, go back to 10 where it's safe.
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#67 Jun 04 2009 at 8:56 PM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:

What do you think would happen if someone posted in the wow boards regarding their new mmo "things ffxi does better"?


Since I actually made a post like that a while back (on the official boards), I can answer. The answer is, people didn't really make a fuss of it. It got a lot of views but not many responses, and most of the responses were from former FFXI players who agreed or disagreed.

WoW players don't tend to feel threatened by other games, because "their" game is the biggest and most successful. The sense of tribalism that exists around an MMO just hasn't kicked in, for the most part.
#68 Jun 04 2009 at 9:25 PM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:
You know I could fire back with some insults for you too but you're diffently not worth the ban. Alla.ffxi is the ffxi communities home and some feel this forum whether part of ffxi or not is part of that home since it deal with we and their mmo. When you make a post learning from wow, some see as disrepecting that community in their home. That isn't the case of course but that is how it's seen. If that isn't clear enough then you'll just have to deal with it on your own.


Alla is a lot more than FFXI. Don't believe me? Mouse over the "Forums" tab at the top of your screen and count how many game related forums there are. My browser doesn't show them all on the list...it cuts them off at 7 game specific forums, two general forums, and a site feedback forum. Do you see FFXI on that list 9 times? 7 times? 3 times? Or is it just on that list once? If I look below the logo on the thread list page, I see that I'm posting in the FFXIV forums.

Maybe in your part of the world XIV is equivalent in roman numerals to XI? Help me out here...I'm trying to figure out wtf makes you think that these are in any way shape or form some kind of inherited FFXI forum granted to you by the Alla admin staff.

If Blizzard had a press conference tomorrow and announced that WoW 2 was nearing completion and slated for beta testing sometime soon and a forum was made on ZAM/Alla for the purpose of discussing it and you went there and commented that you'd like to see more lore, different graphical theme and more incentive for group play in the leveling process, I'd be just as much of a moron for blasting you there because you're not a WoW player as anyone here would be in blasting ideas presented by people who don't currently play FFXI.

Quote:
As for time tables, 6 months isn't a lot of time at all. The game has been in development for 4 years. It takes a year or two just to go from design table to computer. They are only going to do tweaking and bug repairs from this point out until beta. Once beta they see what works and doesn't on a large scale and make the correction. Honestly we may see beta this fall to give them a long beta cycle.


You're guessing. It doesn't matter how long the game has been in development up to this point...6 months is still a long time to make dramatic changes to the game mechanics if SE feels that that's what they want to do.

Edited, Jun 4th 2009 10:26pm by AureliusSir
#69Maldavian, Posted: Jun 04 2009 at 11:11 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) No it’s not going to crack 10 million, nor is it causal friendly, if you want that go and play FF13.
#70 Jun 04 2009 at 11:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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I would love to be able to jump in FFXIV...

Does that make me a WoW fan?

Edited, Jun 5th 2009 9:31am by RedGalka
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#71 Jun 04 2009 at 11:32 PM Rating: Good
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It is casual friendly the devs have clear as day stated it will be casual friendly.
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#72Maldavian, Posted: Jun 04 2009 at 11:34 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) No, jumping doesn’t affect the game in anyways, it’s a cosmetic feature.
#73 Jun 04 2009 at 11:39 PM Rating: Default
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mezlabor wrote:
It is casual friendly the devs have clear as day stated it will be casual friendly.


They said they will cater casual to some degree, but don’t be fooled by that, if you want to make as much money as possible of course you would say something like that to attract a lot of first buyer, common sense in business practice. The real question you need to ask yourself, is how much solo friendly are they talking about and what KIND of solo friendly are they talking about, also they said it’s not going to be like WoW, so does that mean not like WoW solo friendly ?
It’s really hard to tell at this point, we need some more information to be able to judge.
#74 Jun 04 2009 at 11:40 PM Rating: Default
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Are you sure that nobody is asking for a WoW clone? It doesn't necessarily have to mean that one person is asking for Everything to be like in WoW, but there are tons of people suggesting different changes which as a one big lump of suggestions become a huge "MAEK WOW PLEZ"-suggestion. And because of the huge amount of WoW players, if they found FFXIV to be their new WoW2 experience we might be seeing A lot more suggestions to make it more like WoW is - maybe even the kind of suggestions that want to create a new WoW copy.

Some people want more PvP to the game - this is not what SE is good at, and they're asking for some horrible unbalancing issues if they want SE to make their own battlearenas and whatever. FFXI players Know that SE is good at doing PvE content because that's what FFXI is all about- I am ready to give SE a chance of making PvP but if SE focused on PvE instead, it'd be a lot "safer" choice. They have done their mistakes on that department, they have experience. When it comes to PvP, there is only ballista, which doesn't really compare to anything what the western MMO market has to offer when it comes to PvP.

But it isn't only the WoW players that are making these suggestions that *cough "threaten" *cough the new MMO. (in reality there isn't much to be worry about, because in the end SE has their own image of what the game should be like) FFXI and other MMO players are also making up stupid suggestions. There are A Lot of opinions going around in the interwebs as to what direction XIV should take, but most of them are trash. Sadly because WoW is the most popular one of the bunch most of these poorly thought out suggestions and opinions are from those players.
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#75 Jun 04 2009 at 11:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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Maldavian wrote:
Again I can say that 11,5 million doesn’t mean its popular no. If you even bother to check the turnover rate of WoW you would say that it’s the _LEAST_ popular MMO.

I'm not sure you understand what popular means. It's silly to contest that WoW is the most popular MMORPG, because it clearly is. If you're going to state it has a high turn over rate, then you should link a veritable source. I'm not necessarily contesting that fact as it really has no relevance to how popular WoW is, but you need to prove quantifiable facts or else you lose any illusion of credibility... well to anyone not looking to hear only what they want to hear.
dyvidd wrote:
Alla.ffxi is the ffxi communities home and some feel this forum whether part of ffxi or not is part of that home since it deal with we and their mmo. When you make a post learning from wow, some see as disrepecting that community in their home. That isn't the case of course but that is how it's seen. If that isn't clear enough then you'll just have to deal with it on your own.

This hopelessly centric view is the problem with this forum. There are too many FFXI players here who cannot let go of FFXI being their world instead of being just another game.

The rampant fanboyism here is as silly as console wars. Oh no the PS3 has motion sensing too! That will ruin it and make it a casual gaming system just like the Wii! ZOMG!

It is so ridiculous that I see this every time a new MMO comes out. When I transferred from FFXI to WoW there were biased and ignorant posts everywhere about how everything in FFXI sucked and WoW was a such a better game. Then when I moved on to Lotro it was the same spiel, except it was now about how WoW sucked and Lotro was such a better game. When I moved on to Warhammer it was still WoW, but that is mostly the result of WoW popularity.

Edited, Jun 5th 2009 2:55am by Allegory
#76 Jun 05 2009 at 12:00 AM Rating: Good
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No, jumping doesn’t affect the game in anyways, it’s a cosmetic feature.


It improves the illusion of freedom by a lot and besides it being a cosmetic feature isn't a counter arguement. There are lots of comestic features in FFXI.
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#77 Jun 05 2009 at 12:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Maldavian wrote:
mezlabor wrote:
It is casual friendly the devs have clear as day stated it will be casual friendly.


They said they will cater casual to some degree, but don’t be fooled by that, if you want to make as much money as possible of course you would say something like that to attract a lot of first buyer, common sense in business practice. The real question you need to ask yourself, is how much solo friendly are they talking about and what KIND of solo friendly are they talking about, also they said it’s not going to be like WoW, so does that mean not like WoW solo friendly ?
It’s really hard to tell at this point, we need some more information to be able to judge.


The devs have said in plain (albeit translated) English that they want casual players to be able to log in and have a rich, rewarding experience even if they don't have the time to invest in a group. That sounds like a lot more than just casual friendly "to some degree."
#78 Jun 05 2009 at 12:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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Maldavian wrote:
RedGalka wrote:
I would love to be able to jump in FFXIV...

Does that make me a WoW fan?



No, jumping doesn’t affect the game in anyways, it’s a cosmetic feature.


Wrong again. Jumping allows developers to design environments where not everything above ankle height is a barrier that you have to go around.
#79 Jun 05 2009 at 12:17 AM Rating: Good
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372 posts
Maldavian wrote:
Again I can say that 11,5 million doesn’t mean its popular no. If you even bother to check the turnover rate of WoW you would say that it’s the _LEAST_ popular MMO. WoW is the most popular MMO for casual playing style and that reflect their massive turnover in their player base. Also, I have some other juicy news for you son, WoW servers will shut down in China 7th June 2009, that would make your precious 11,5 million down to 6,5 million. Let me once again say, numbers are meaningless, size of a MMO are meaningless. As a reference the biggest doesn’t make it the most popular, just look at what happened to GM, the so called BIGGEST.


Something I really, really don't miss about FFXI are the embarrassing fanbois. Your argument is that WoW is actually unpopular because its turnover rate is higher than the highest total population FFXI ever had? Honestly, do you have any idea how idiotic that is? And no, that 11.5 million number is not "precious" to me, it's simply a fact. I wouldn't be surprised if WoW's numbers drop by a couple million by the time the Chinese servers are running again, and you know what? I won't care. You know why? Because I don't base my self-esteem on the ******* video game I play!

Quote:
Nice that you admit hardcore games are not for you, then I do recommend that you stay with mmo:s that are casual like WoW.


I didn't "admit" anything, I said it. "Admit" implies shame, and I feel no shame in not playing an MMO 50 hours a week.

Quote:
We don’t exactly know how casual FF14 is, but if we go by SE record, I’m pretty **** sure you will get disappointed if you are a casual player since there won’t even be PvP in FF14.


What the **** are you talking about? Pvp doesn't imply casual. In fact the most hardcore WoW players I know are Arena junkies. I'm gonna go by SE's record, which is that they like making money, which implies that they're not going to make a game that will only be appealing to people who get angry when it only takes them 300 hours to get one piece of gear.

Quote:
Quote:
So now we have SE announcement that they're making a game that'll have the same storytelling and variety chops as FFXI with the casual friendly gameplay of WoW. Sounds like the next MMO to crack 10 million subscribers to me.


No it’s not going to crack 10 million, nor is it causal friendly, if you want that go and play FF13.


It's the eternal motto of the FFXI fanboi: "Go play something else!" Well ***** you. I've been a huge Final Fantasy fan since number 1 on the NES, and I hope to add XIV to the long list of FFs I've played. Frankly, I think you're the one who's in for disappointment, if you think SE plans to cater only to the hardcore with XIV. You know, because they've explicitly said the exact opposite. But don't worry, XI will still be there for you.
____________________________
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#80 Jun 05 2009 at 5:16 AM Rating: Default
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572 posts
AureliusSir wrote:
Maldavian wrote:
RedGalka wrote:
I would love to be able to jump in FFXIV...

Does that make me a WoW fan?



No, jumping doesn’t affect the game in anyways, it’s a cosmetic feature.


Wrong again. Jumping allows developers to design environments where not everything above ankle height is a barrier that you have to go around.


If you put it like that true.
#81 Jun 05 2009 at 5:19 AM Rating: Default
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572 posts
MrSenethSomed wrote:

It's the eternal motto of the FFXI fanboi: "Go play something else!" Well ***** you. I've been a huge Final Fantasy fan since number 1 on the NES, and I hope to add XIV to the long list of FFs I've played. Frankly, I think you're the one who's in for disappointment, if you think SE plans to cater only to the hardcore with XIV. You know, because they've explicitly said the exact opposite. But don't worry, XI will still be there for you.


I didn’t really say that it will ONLY cater hardcore, but if you think it’s going to be similar to WoW casual play style I think you are the one that is going to be disappointed. I quit FFXI 2004, so no thx for the offer, not going to play FFXI, instead I'm planning on playing FF14.



Edited, Jun 5th 2009 10:59am by Maldavian
#82Lostkaws, Posted: Jun 05 2009 at 6:37 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) FF or GTFO, WoW fanboi's suck
#83 Jun 05 2009 at 8:04 AM Rating: Excellent
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20,804 posts
Lostkaws wrote:
FF or GTFO, WoW fanboi's suck

Who is a WoW fanboy here? I've read to read to a single thread here that says "FFXI usck, WoW rules, FFXIV should be entirely like WoW," yet I've read plenty of the opposite. Aureliussir has played FFXI for quite some time before he joined WoW, and from what I recall he didn't leave the game in disgust shouting "ZOMG FFXI sucks." Is Aureliussir a "WoW fanboy?" MrSenethSomed has played both games as well. I'm less familiar with his history, but he has seemed to great the arrivla of FFXIV with a tempered attitude. Is he a WoW fanboy? I've played both FFXI and WoW for some time, and I moved on even beyond that because there were many aspects of WoW that didn't appeal to me at the time. Am I ranting and raving fanboy screaming "WoW is the best!?"

There is definitely some bias in this forum, but it isn't in favor of WoW.
#84 Jun 05 2009 at 8:14 AM Rating: Excellent
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11,576 posts
Lostkaws wrote:
FF or GTFO, WoW fanboi's suck


You do your screen name proud.
#85 Jun 06 2009 at 5:58 PM Rating: Default
It's so hard to read all these posts and wait to reply so yea...here goes part I of my response. :|

Not what I wanted to start on first but wow...

Quote:
He's being definitive from a source thats maybe a few sentences long, emphatically saying FFXIV will be like this and will have this and not that. Unless he is precognitive, he honestly has no idea what will make it into the final build, so its foolish to say what exactly it will be like beyond generalities.


He's doing exactly what your saying hes doing...but he's foolish from making assumptions which were derived from an inside source? I just dont understand why you felt the need to come on here and call someone foolish...

No one knows, but if a creator of a shirt co. said some of the shirts may possibly be blue, one can assume and post or inform others of interest that "hey dude some of the shirts may be blue". w/e

Quote:
Some of you anti-wow people are crazy. I mean seriously...my mind is boggled at how inane some of your arguments are. The most popular right now seems to be "I don't want FFXIV to be WoW." Who said it should be WoW? NOBODY


Why does anyone have to say it should be like lolWoW? Our point in saying that is WE KNOW, WE KNOW THAT WOW HAS BEEN LOOKED which one of the inside sources has said...(not sure if i should go from that infro, dont wanna sound foolish...anyway) but ya we dislike lol for a reason and were just saying we dont want something that were looking forward to be something we dislike. no one has to say that, theres nothing wrong w/ saying "I hope its not like lolwow"

Quote:
Does being popular make it a good game? Not in my opinion.


Exactly popular doesnt mean ****, just b/c 11million idiots play a game doesnt make it good, or that applies to alot of things in life.. moving on

Quote:
I don't like the fact you can solo all the way to 80 without any contact or interaction with anyone else.


I love teh fact that you have to work w/ others to gain xp, chatting in pties waiting for pties to be complete, the travel to the camp, the planning of tactics all that and much more just made me love the game more, I loved every bit of it, I also understand that not all ppl are ppl friendly, thats more so true to me in real life not that i choose to be so, its just that im diff. from alot of ppl(w/e), but in game i have alot more friends than id want in real life which is how i want it to be, I DEF AGREE THAT SOLOING SHOULD BE MORE REWARDING, BUT XPING IN PTIES SHOULD BE MORE REWARDING, IF YOUR GONNA SOLO IT SHOULD TAKE LONGER.

I never understood why ppl would want to go through all the hastle of getting a massively MULTI PLAYER online rpg, then wanting to go hide in a forest for hours. Nothing to me justifies that. Im sure there are games that are offline that are updated in content to keep them fresh. I dont mean for you to always have to interact w/ ppl but to want to get online and just go at it alone w/o any contact is just crazy to me.

W/e, ill just never understand casual gamers lol, I mean I go to school play guitar hang out w/ friends play other games and work, but I still find time to keep up in FFXI. What else do u do? I think alot of ppl are just lazy and want to get online and jump and kill other ppl, I hope this doenst become your game, go play WoW.

#86 Jun 06 2009 at 7:13 PM Rating: Default
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5,684 posts
pointless thread is pointless.
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#87 Jun 06 2009 at 10:02 PM Rating: Default
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424 posts
Auereliussir
Well, I guess I didn't make clear the fact that I have been playing wow for 2 years after leaving FFXI with 5 lvl 75s.

I like WoW, I really do, but WoW is WoW, and you have only made points suggesting that FFIV should be a WOW version of final fantasy.

So I will respond in response to your response of my response of your responding.

Quote:
Shazaamemt wrote:
It's not about being 'ultra nationalist', but it IS about defending the MMORPG that we love, that FFXIV HAPPENS TO BE THE NATURAL SUCCESSOR TO.


Quote:

Defending against what? Who/what is attacking it? The night elves? The moogles? The Scottish? There's absolutely nothing wrong with people saying, "FFXI was a great game, but x/y/z aspect of it really didn't work for me. <Other MMO> does it like this, which I found to be a much more enjoyable experience so barring all else, if SE could incorporate some of that or something similar as part of the evolution of their MMO offering I think that would be cool."


There is nothing wrong with saying x/y/z is wrong with FFXI, but there is something wrong with insisting that <other MMO> (or in the case of your arguments WOW WOW WOW WOW) is the only other option as opposed to refining the many excellent changes made to FFXI in the past 2 years.


Quote:

Quote:
Those of us who completely love FFXI are afraid.

We are afraid that the success of WoW will mean that many of the things from WoW will creep into this new game. I play WoW, and I like WoW for what it is. But I, as do many other final fantasy players, do not want to see WOW in Final Fantasy XIV.


Quote:

Could you do me a favor and be a wee tiny bit more closed minded please? I want to see if your head implodes and a black hole forms where once was only flawed logic.

WTF do you think you're saying when you say you do not want to see WoW in Final Fantasy? You're afraid there are going to be Tauren and Night Elves? That you might exit your starting city of choice to find a kobold screaming about his candle? What exactly is it that has you so paranoid about the idea of FFXIV taking note of certain components that never really worked in FFXI but are a huge part of the success of other MMOs? Making it so you can solo to the level cap in FFXIV, for example, does not make it WoW. Making a faster and more engaging combat system in FFXIV does not make it WoW. Cutting out an enormous chunk of the senseless waiting in FFXI (HEEEELLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO ULLIKUMMI! WE KNOW YOU'RE THERE SOMEWHERE!!!) is not going to make it WoW.

So perhaps you...or anyone else for that matter...would like to clarify exactly what it is that has so many FFXI neophytes trembling with fear and loathing at the idea that FFXIV might actually have long term appeal for more than a half million people.

1) Acknowledging that you don't need forced group play all the time, hours upon hours upon hours of doing nothing but waiting, and extreme penalties for failure for an MMO to be entertaining and rewarding would make us realize just how much of our time we had actually been wasting in FFXI relative to actually playing the game.
2)

Carry on...


Again, I don't think you got the point of that, YES FFXI players ARE afraid that every 10 year old with a mother's credit card will be able to hit the level cap without any social interaction whatsoever and suddenly be raining down Barrens chat in every endgame event. We welcome anyone into the game, we just want to maintain a sense of community that was so prevelant in FFXI and made the game feel like 'Home' in the MMO-verse. We gained that sense of community through quests and missions that required social interaction. We all know you don't need forced group play all the time, and so does SE, as evidenced by the many changes made in the last 2 years.

But I am guessing you don't know any of that, since you only hit level 66 at your highest and I am betting that was a number of years ago. If you want a game you can play completely solo, and are so enthusiastic about that option, either go level another alt to 80 in wow, or unplug your modem and play an offline game. I hear they are great for solo-only play.

My statement:
Quote:

We don't want to see hot bars.


Response:
Quote:

What's wrong with hot bars?


THE FACT THAT THEY ARE ABOUT THE FARTHEST YOU CAN GET FROM A FINAL FANTASY GAME IN THE WORLD OF RPGS.
I like my wow hot bar, it feels like Warcraft I-III to me, it feels like a warcraft game.

But a Hot bar in FFIV? It would just feel all wrong to a final fantasy player.

My statement:
Quote:

We don't want to see a UI that must be modded until we can't even see the game.

RESPONSE:
Quote:

UI mods are a choice by players, and FFXIV will likely not support them anyways due to their plans for cross-platform console support. Careful though...your ignorance is showing.


My point being that in WoW the UI MUST BE MODDED TO BE AN ADEQUATE RAID PLAYER. That is completely ridiculous. If the game itself cannot offer an adequate enough UI to simply PLAY endgame, the developer should spend more time on the UI. I like the customization of the WOW UI, but I think it is wrong that it became a NECESSITY to change the UI to simply progress. Blizzard themselves have realized that it was a mistake, and changed the way raids work in WotLK in order to start correcting this, not to mention soon the 3rd party applications everyone relies on will be regulated by the company. But it may be too little too late to change the tide in WoW.

I just don't want that to happen in the next MMO I will play, which is FFIV.

My post:
Quote:

We don't want to see a crappy story line.


RESPONSE:
Quote:

You'd have to be a right sodding moron to think that SE is going to leave the story aspects out of FFXIV...especially after the press conference yesterday...or to think that those of us from other MMOs would be pushing for a reduced story influence in FFXIV.


Well, a crappy storyline is something I am afraid of when I hear WoW, Warhammer, and Age of Conan thrown around as points of insipiration for the new game. THEY ALL HAVE CRAPPY STORYLINES. And yes, it isn't hard to think that some people from other MMOs (such as yourself) would be pushing for a reduced storyline influence when the 'other mmo' community seems more concerned with getting more PVP play and less 'grinding of quests'. ****, the quests and missions in FFXI are what MADE the majority of the storyline.

My post:
Quote:

We don't want to see a once character, one craft system.


RESPONSE:
Quote:
It was one character, two primary professions, actually. And I recall on these boards having seen very little discussion about crafting system hopes/ideas for FFXIV.


Sorry, 2 whole primary professions (one of which that usually backed up the other, unless of course you were tailoring and blacksmithing....)
Yeah, I want to be able to level all the tradeskills if I want to. Just because I know how to make an awesome sword doesn't mean someone can't teach me how to sow, or garden, or woodcraft, or jemcut, or whatever.


My post:
Quote:

We don't want to see WOW in FFXIV.


RESPONSE:

You need to do better than that. Or at least to read through the boards more thoroughly before you comment. People are suggesting aspects of other MMOs as examples for comparison. Not saying it should be <insert MMO here> with FFXI models and music.



You made the argument for me, I agree with you 100%, Not saying it should be <insert mmo here> with FFXI models and music.

Except that this is a post for WOW fans. And the other MMO discussed in this thread is WOW.
We don't want to see WOW in FFXIV, if we wanted to play WOW, we would play WOW. And I do play WOW. But I won't play FFXIV if it is like WOW.

I already have my alts leveled after all. ^^






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AureliusSir the Irrelevant:
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#88 Jun 06 2009 at 10:12 PM Rating: Default
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1,159 posts
Shazaamemt wrote:

We don't want to see WOW in FFXIV, if we wanted to play WOW, we would play WOW. And I do play WOW. But I won't play FFXIV if it is like WOW.


Ah, yes, very good, very good. I think that's the case for all of us here, isn't it? After all, if we wanted WoW we would be playing it now wouldn't we?

Now that we are all in agreement we can stop the discussion and maybe our troll infestation will go away...
#89 Jun 06 2009 at 10:19 PM Rating: Default
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424 posts
Yep.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 2:22am by Shazaamemt
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Actually it's called "Libel"... and only if it is fabricated, but hey, you are the admin.

AureliusSir the Irrelevant:
"They're on a tangent, but they aren't off topic."
#90 Jun 06 2009 at 11:07 PM Rating: Good
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11,576 posts
Shazaamemt wrote:
There is nothing wrong with saying x/y/z is wrong with FFXI, but there is something wrong with insisting that <other MMO> (or in the case of your arguments WOW WOW WOW WOW) is the only other option as opposed to refining the many excellent changes made to FFXI in the past 2 years.


This whole conversation would be a lot more entertaining if you would just read and ponder and comprehend.

If I say that I like the option for diverse solo content in an MMO, that's as far as it needs to go. It doesn't matter which MMO I've played the most recently and it doesn't matter how different that idea is from what FFXI players are used to because it's simply a concept. It's a concept that has been employed to great success in other MMOs...it just so happens that WoW is the most noteworthy of the bunch.

What is so horribly disappointing is the aggressive narrow-mindedness and supreme arrogance of a group of people who can't conceive of a game where casual content (to include but not limited to diverse solo options) can happily co-exist in a game with dedicated hardcore content. To read through these posts, there is no shortage of exceptionally ignorant people who have convinced themselves beyond a shadow of a doubt that casual friendly can only exist to the exclusion of hardcore. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

In a forum that was created to discuss a new MMO, the second of which released by the company that made an MMO that I played for 3-4 years, there are no shortage of FFXI neophytes that have jumped in and start talking down to everyone like they own the place. They'll learn, of that I'm convinced. Especially when more information comes from SE that echoes what they've already touched on...that FFXIV is not going to carry forward the bulk of FFXI with some tweaks and changes.

Whether the FFXI community likes it or not FFXIV is going to have components that resemble other MMOs, including but not limited to WoW. It will have aspects that are familiar to people who have played FFXI, and it will no doubt have aspects that none of us have seen before in any other MMO.

Quote:
Again, I don't think you got the point of that, YES FFXI players ARE afraid that every 10 year old with a mother's credit card will be able to hit the level cap without any social interaction whatsoever and suddenly be raining down Barrens chat in every endgame event. We welcome anyone into the game, we just want to maintain a sense of community that was so prevelant in FFXI and made the game feel like 'Home' in the MMO-verse. We gained that sense of community through quests and missions that required social interaction. We all know you don't need forced group play all the time, and so does SE, as evidenced by the many changes made in the last 2 years.


With the significant amount of negative feedback SE has received over the years regarding world spawn bosses, coupled with the positive feedback they've received about the instanced content they implemented later on, I think it's a pretty safe bet that there will be more instanced end-game content in FFXIV than non-instanced. I'm not suggesting that world spawn bosses would be a mistake...only that I fully expect SE to capitalize and expand on past successes.

If that turns out to be the case, if you experience undesirable behavior in your end-game content and it persists for any length of time, it's not SE's fault for creating a diverse game...it's the fault of your linkshell's leadership for not telling them to put a sock in it or they're going to be removed from the group.

Quote:
But I am guessing you don't know any of that, since you only hit level 66 at your highest and I am betting that was a number of years ago. If you want a game you can play completely solo, and are so enthusiastic about that option, either go level another alt to 80 in wow, or unplug your modem and play an offline game. I hear they are great for solo-only play.


Thank you for once again so eloquently proving my point.

I say solo options, you twist it around to say I only want solo play. You look at an exceptionally dated reference to my FFXI character on my forum profile and assume that tells the whole story of my FFXI experience when in fact you are wrong. I stopped updating my character information in my Alla profile over 2 years before I stopped playing FFXI, but you don't get that, do you? You don't understand the concept of objective thought and, "Hey, it says 66 but it's not info from SE, it's a friggin' user updated profile on a discussion forum. I'd be a right sloppy twit to ram my foot in my mouth and use that as the basis for an argument without confirming it in some way first."

Amirite?

Ya, I'm right.

Quote:
THE FACT THAT THEY ARE ABOUT THE FARTHEST YOU CAN GET FROM A FINAL FANTASY GAME IN THE WORLD OF RPGS.


The FFXI user interface didn't exactly mimic the interfaces of any of the standalone titles, either. Hotbars are an extremely effective option for having a user interface that allows rapid access to a large variety of abilities. That's not in any way to suggest it's the best option, but to say you don't like hotbars because it's too much of a departure from a Final Fantasy interface? Are you off your meds? What a fundamentally ridiculous argument. It's fine if you don't like them. It's fine if you'd prefer to see something else. But because they're not Final Fantasy enough. Good lawd...

Quote:
My point being that in WoW the UI MUST BE MODDED TO BE AN ADEQUATE RAID PLAYER.


Any idea why that is? Actually, first of all, maybe you can tell me what mods are mandatory. You don't need specific names, just what they do and why they're a benefit to a raider. Then you can entertain me with your take on why certain mods are necessary for top end raiders.

Quote:
That is completely ridiculous. If the game itself cannot offer an adequate enough UI to simply PLAY endgame, the developer should spend more time on the UI. I like the customization of the WOW UI, but I think it is wrong that it became a NECESSITY to change the UI to simply progress. Blizzard themselves have realized that it was a mistake, and changed the way raids work in WotLK in order to start correcting this, not to mention soon the 3rd party applications everyone relies on will be regulated by the company. But it may be too little too late to change the tide in WoW.


You're a funny guy. Blizzard incorporated the option for users to create their own UI mods because it was a neat feature. Rather than Blizzard trying to take on the impossible task of releasing a variety of different UI configurations to suit every player, they instead gave players a framework to create their own. It frees up development time on Blizzard's end and allows for a much greater scope of diversity on the player's end.

Quote:
Well, a crappy storyline is something I am afraid of when I hear WoW, Warhammer, and Age of Conan thrown around as points of insipiration for the new game. THEY ALL HAVE CRAPPY STORYLINES. And yes, it isn't hard to think that some people from other MMOs (such as yourself) would be pushing for a reduced storyline influence when the 'other mmo' community seems more concerned with getting more PVP play and less 'grinding of quests'. ****, the quests and missions in FFXI are what MADE the majority of the storyline.


How can you be bright enough to understand the twists and intricacies of an SE created story line yet not bright enough to understand that when people talk about COMPONENTS of other games, they aren't talking about the entire game? Tell me how that works.

Quote:
Yeah, I want to be able to level all the tradeskills if I want to. Just because I know how to make an awesome sword doesn't mean someone can't teach me how to sow, or garden, or woodcraft, or jemcut, or whatever.


Cool...so maybe you could be a sport and link me the post where someone said they wanted a one character/one profession system in FFXIV. Because if you didn't, there was no point to you bringing it up. Some of us are talking with eager anticipation about what we want to see in a new MMO. Others of you can't get past an opportunity to bash WoW. FFS...get over it.

Quote:
Except that this is a post for WOW fans. And the other MMO discussed in this thread is WOW.
We don't want to see WOW in FFXIV, if we wanted to play WOW, we would play WOW. And I do play WOW. But I won't play FFXIV if it is like WOW.


I'm going to restrain myself for poking fun at you for not knowing this, but there is a history behind this thread that began with a user who created it to trash WoW players for putting forward ideas about FFXIV because apparently, FFXI players had more right than anyone else to share their ideas. Apparently, FFXI players are the only ones who should be entitled to discuss FFXIV, and people who share ideas that don't suit the FFXI fanboi mentality were to be publicly ridiculed by a post that was started for the specific purpose of bashing them.

But you didn't see the initial thread that was nuked. All you saw was the repost with the changed title. I'll forgive you for that. Just do me a favor and going forward, stay off your **** fanboi high horse and think before you beak off.


Edited, Jun 7th 2009 12:13am by AureliusSir
#91 Jun 06 2009 at 11:14 PM Rating: Good
*****
11,576 posts
Yogtheterrible wrote:
Shazaamemt wrote:

We don't want to see WOW in FFXIV, if we wanted to play WOW, we would play WOW. And I do play WOW. But I won't play FFXIV if it is like WOW.


Ah, yes, very good, very good. I think that's the case for all of us here, isn't it? After all, if we wanted WoW we would be playing it now wouldn't we?

Now that we are all in agreement we can stop the discussion and maybe our troll infestation will go away...


Maybe you could enlighten me and explain to me what a troll is. I'm curious about your take on it.

Edit: And if you wanted FFXI, you would be playing it now instead of posting in an FFXIV forum, wouldn't you?

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 12:23am by AureliusSir
#92 Jun 06 2009 at 11:43 PM Rating: Default
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1,159 posts
AureliusSir wrote:
Maybe you could enlighten me and explain to me what a troll is. I'm curious about your take on it.

Wikipedia wrote:

In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.


I would say our troll infestation falls under the irrelevant category since, as I stated earlier, SE has already implemented what they want from WoW. No amount of whining will change that.

AureliusSir wrote:
Edit: And if you wanted FFXI, you would be playing it now instead of posting in an FFXIV forum, wouldn't you?


Yes, I very much agree. And since I want neither FFXI nor WoW but an amalgamation of the two I am not playing either but posting here.

Now please, stop feeding the trolls...they breed like rabbits.


EDIT: On second thought, this is actually a good place for trolls...maybe they should stay here.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 12:57am by Yogtheterrible
#93 Jun 07 2009 at 12:11 AM Rating: Default
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118 posts
TanthalassQuetz wrote:
FFXIV is not going to "be like WoW," "take a leaf out of WoW's book," "be a casual MMO," or any other of the stupid nonsense you have been trolling this forum with. It will not be a PvP-centric game, and I'll honestly be very, very surprised if they introduce anything more rewarding then Ballista.

The "casual" aspects of the game discussed at today's Q&A are almost certainly aspects of FFXI that were recently added, but were added far too late to make a difference. Level Sync, Treasure Caskets, and (most of all) Fields of Valor will probably make an appearance of some form in FFXIV. The only one I could see SE excluding, at least on release, is Level Sync, so that certain ways to abuse the system for ridiculous leveling speeds don't come to light in this new game.

This is not Final Fantasy XI, or related to Final Fantasy XI in any way, shape or form.

However, try to keep in mind that it is still a FINAL FANTASY GAME. The developers explicitly stated in the Q&A session that it would be PvE and story based. There is no longer any need for any of you to run around this forum spouting about how awesome WoW is. It's not going to fly with the FFXI community, since the large majority of that community hates WoW for the same reasons you love it.

If you're looking for another WoW clone, keep looking.

If you're looking for a new MMO likely to heavily compete with WoW (so long as SE doesn't suddenly get completely retarded - things are looking good so far), then you're in the right place.



Here i think we need change our way of think about WOW, FFXI etc

Question number one. "Why always when somebody say a MMRPG faster, where you can play little time and be good" always is WOW or Lineage2?

I played Lineage2 and WOW. "And for the people who think wow and Lineage are games easy"

Every game need time and dedication for be a PIMP. If you play in a lazy way in WOW, lineage or ffxi you will be a gimp always. no matter if you have 3 hours or 10 hours for play per day every dame need time

Second question "Why when somebody say ffxi have slow battles and ff14 maybe have slow battles too. we attack with -> WOW have fast battles and i hope FF14 be like that"

In WOW yes you have Fast battles, and you can lv up your job alone in 3 - 4 hours per day, thing in FFXI before /dancer was unable we do it. but

In wow when you have a party in midd or high leves. we lose something super important maybe here nobody did say.

You kill Too fast in wow for "Enjoy the job you are using" and this is something VERY dangerous for the live of a MMRPG. if you cant use all abilites of your job in low levels, mid levels or high levels, you are losing what is a MMRPG.

In wow i leved Rogue and i can say i kill to fast and when i party we kill to fast for enjoy the job. uusually i have time only for 1 or 2 hits. before it die.

In ffxi with my thief in greater colibri camp doing 150 chain + "ALWAYS i can enjoy my job and i can enjoy all abilites of my job"

So in WOW YOU kill to fast for enjoy the job =) sad but is true.

In FFXI you can enjoy your job always in exp party or alone. the enemies live the enough for make you enjoy your job.

Now i know playing FFXI in a hardcore way 8 - 12 hours per day need at lest 1 year for you can have Good gear.

But in WOW you need At lest 5 months for you can have your gear. (i know there hardcores who will start their 10 char, and they can have all in 1 month) (this same happen in ffxi a hardcore who start a new char can have everything in 2 - 3 months)

Now what i spec in FF14 is we can kill solo a decent speed, so we can lv up solo or in small groups. and second is we can enjoy our job or class in a exp party. and we NEVER have the problem of lineage and wow -> kill to fast for enjoy the job.

and now the people who love in WOW pvp. is often people who have a char very high level with nice equip and will Try PVP vs other player with equal skill.

We know in JAPAN they hate. violence or sh*t like that. So we cant EXPECT in a JP company they add PVP like WOW. because the JP hate it.

Lets see some problems of PVP in a new game with JP guys. Listen

They are people who always WILL GO for LV UP RACE! this mean they will have groups of 6 - 12 players who will try Hit the cap level SUPER FAST. -> is sad but 90% of We rest of world dont have that way of play.

Now if this 6 guys are trying RACE LV UP. and you for mistake kill a mob where they are EXPING. guess what? "You will have 6 guys vs you and will kick your ***"

and We the rest of world are player more lonely who always try First play solo before get a party. they ALWAYS will try party before play solo.

Now the JP guys. will Try get the best items before here we are instaling the game. and they will Use the method of 10 vs you. until you LEAVE the rare monster and will be ALMOST imposible for average player claim a Rare monster or start lv up solo.

Other aspect important. JP guys are "Racist" and if they see another player Trying steal exp mob they will kill you in the same way 10 vs you.

SOOOOOOO not is a good idea start PVP with this guys. THIS IS NOT like WOW or lineage2 where you see NA and european people mostly, this guys asian players haveo ther way of think.

So for now even if i love PVP i think not is a good idea a free PVP Like wow or lineage. "Maybe a ask for a duel is a good option but a FREE PVP NOOO"

Average player Means -> a player who dont have more than 2 hours per day for play, and even with this time this players,will be able for get the best gear posible and lv up they class or job.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 4:17am by Shakca
#94 Jun 07 2009 at 12:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yogtheterrible wrote:
I would say our troll infestation falls under the irrelevant category since, as I stated earlier, SE has already implemented what they want from WoW. No amount of whining will change that.


I agree, which is why it's so astounding that the FFXI fanbois are still in such denial.
#95DeMaWa, Posted: Jun 07 2009 at 1:06 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Funny how all the peeps who have WoW as their main game (I can judge something from signatures having WoW stuff in them) are here moaning about how they want this and that stuff from WoW to FFXIV.
#96 Jun 07 2009 at 1:22 AM Rating: Good
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wow just wow. theres alot of hate here I wonder why we all cant get along and be excited about this new game.
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#97 Jun 07 2009 at 1:51 AM Rating: Decent
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130 posts
I apologize for the tone of my last post, but these WoW/FFXI topics have already shown how differently some of us FFXI and WoW players think.

There are some clear WoW players here posting stuff about how they loved WoW and it's leveling system for example, because it was casual and not very time consuming and to a certain point, easy. Where as the same people say something like "oh my god, the dull forced party leveling in FFXI was just awful, it took too much of my precious time" or "Geez the HNM stuff in FFXI just plain sucks, I don't want to stay in a zone for 3 hours doing nothing just to get a chance to claim a mob".

You see, the stuff mentioned above are already some of the things that separate FFXI and WoW from each other and here we see WoW players defending the stuff that WoW has and not liking most of the FFXI content. If you like what WoW has to offer why not just keep playing it? We all know it will be evolving a long time still and there will be large amounts of people playing it for years and years.

FFXI in the other hand, will lose many players from its already "low" playerbase when FFXIV launches, so it is clear that there will be lot's of FFXI players posting here and defending their game, because they want another Final Fantasy (not saying XI), not a game that resembles WoW. And I'm not saying they're making it like WoW, please read this.

But for many FFXI players, it would be enough for FFXIV to be too close to WoW to have a fast, easy leveling system, a HNMless enviroment, ie. having every piece of gear instanced from places like dynamis for example, maybe even with bigger droprates. I admit to be one of these players, I love NM and HNM camping, where as I do not really care about dynamis for example.

And to add for an example, there are still many people camping ground HNMs every day on every server, do you think these people do this because "they have to", because they're somewhat forced to "work" like this for their linkshells? Nope. It's because many people actually like this feature of the game. It is a part of FFXI, a Final Fantasy game. And there are many people hoping to have that HNM feature in the upcoming Final Fantasy MMO game aswell, there is no denying it.

So maybe, just maybe to get both communities happy, it would have to have certain elements of both games. Maybe more instance like areas for some stuff and the HNM camping like features aswell. I know many FFXI players that are totally against WoW, calling it "lolwow" and having the game a complete piece of garbage in their minds, sure. But we all know how many "omg WoW iz da bezt" -kids there are around in WoW.

Because we, the players of these games have different views about many things, especially the two completely different games and communities we play in, there will be flaming and stuff like that when the discussions end up turning in "WoW vs. FFXI" threads, it is the sad fact that people will usually stand behind the thing they like the most, in this case it being WoW or FFXI, and this will result in pointless arguments in some situations.
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#98 Jun 07 2009 at 2:04 AM Rating: Good
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well I mean to **** you off but the wow players have said you can have both world spawns and instanced spawns.
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#99 Jun 07 2009 at 4:11 AM Rating: Default
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255 posts
Indeed, more player doesn't mean better game, just like Wii selling more than 360/PS3 and this doesn't mean it is better console, in my opinion, Blizzard in PC/MMO is what Wii/Nintendo is for consoles, it has success, some tried to copy it, even though it sucks.
#100 Jun 07 2009 at 5:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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305 posts
Quote:
I apologize for the tone of my last post, but these WoW/FFXI topics have already shown how differently some of us FFXI and WoW players think.


The problem going on here is that there is a rampant, for lack of a better term, hatred towards wow coming from the ffxi community.


This pretty much sums up the pettiness that i am seeing in the forum.

OP:
Quote:
i'm hoping for eating / drinking to recover hp/mp


Reply:
Quote:
Except that kind of reeks of WoW.


When a minute and insignificant mechanic such as out of combat regeneration is met with such prejudice how can anyone post about any meaningful mechanics without immediately being met with the hosility of "you want wow, play wow, we love ffxi as is".

Seriously, people need to stop - we are discussing possible features of the game =/
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#101 Jun 07 2009 at 6:12 AM Rating: Decent
I think judging from the way this thread was started and the 2 pages of players mostly arguing about which is better and some mostly arguing for the sake of arguing that this thread really isnt the one to be talking about possible features of the game. Even if a good pleasent discussion started theres bound to be 1 person who will choose to grave dig and bring it all up again and the fact is this thread was made to bash WoW player's opinions so it really wasnt ment for that, not that i agree with said subject topic...
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