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problem with no-level systemFollow

#1 Jun 04 2009 at 6:56 PM Rating: Good
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so, since they stated that the growth system will not be a conventional growth system, and that there may be no set "jobs", how will this effect {looking for members}

i mean, if you've got no level, or no job attatched to you're name, what are you labelled as?

if my group needs a healer, do i need to ask every person i see "hey do you have any healing spells? how developed are you're healing spells?"

like instead of being a 50 paladin, you would be "a character with defensive abilities and healing magic skilled up to about half way to cap"

i don't know, im sure they will work something out, but i just see it as being a pretty big hurdle.

discuss
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#2 Jun 04 2009 at 6:59 PM Rating: Decent
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I think you would just look for people based on role, and judge them based on how well they perform that role...

... and keep an up to date friends list of people who don't suck. :)
#3 Jun 04 2009 at 7:01 PM Rating: Good
Well they said they did like the job system and are planning on implementing it in a new way, so I assume there's going to be some sort of way they differentiate the characters and measure advancement, even if it's not specifically a character level.
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#4 Jun 04 2009 at 7:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Instead of a job level distinction, you could have an ability distinction. Instead of, "LF1M healer 65-70" you could say, "LF1M healer rank4-5" or "LF1M healer tier4-5" (with the obligatory semi-obscure abbreviations, of course); in other words, you'd be specifying that your healer have access to a certain level of healing. Right now, when you're specifying a job/class level in an MMO, you're basically just using an umbrella label to specify a certain range of skills. A no-level system just means you'll have to be a little more specific (and aware) about what you need.
#5 Jun 04 2009 at 7:05 PM Rating: Decent
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Well they said they did like the job system and are planning on implementing it in a new way, so I assume there's going to be some sort of way they differentiate the characters and measure advancement, even if it's not specifically a character level.


The way I interpreted that was that they liked the diversity of the job system in that it allowed players to experience (or just experiment with) a variety of abilities and roles. While they may still go with a more rigid job system than some of the other options discussed here, it wouldn't surprise me if there is no option to select a job of any kind on the character creation screen when the game goes live.
#6 Jun 04 2009 at 7:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Well they did say "character growth" is the biggest thing they're going for, so something tells me that even though they like the diversity of jobs, there won't be a direct option to select a job during character creation, giving one time to bond with their character more and try different things before choosing a job. It'd be great if, like in Age of Conan, you had to go through an apprenticeship or training for the job you choose. Though, I highly doubt they'll do away with the job system entirely. They still want to appeal to those players who play for the parties, and parties rely on certain roles/jobs to work.
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#7 Jun 04 2009 at 7:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Instead of a job level distinction, you could have an ability distinction. Instead of, "LF1M healer 65-70" you could say, "LF1M healer rank4-5" or "LF1M healer tier4-5"


this would make it so you've got to shout (or some equivalent to wide spread chat) in order to look for a group for anything, not just missions and what have you.

no LFG system would be rough.
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#8 Jun 04 2009 at 7:29 PM Rating: Decent
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/sea all skill heal lv5
#9 Jun 04 2009 at 8:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, they could simply make FFXIV have new version of "Level Sync" from the start. That way, you can invite anyone and then just "adjust everyone to a party member's skill levels". Just invite people by role or "job" (whatever it means in FFXIV) "Sync" and go around killing monsters, or doing quests or missions or events.
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#10TheFlyingGoat, Posted: Jun 04 2009 at 8:26 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Please no... the level sync system is a terrible noobification system that allows lazy people to stay in the low level areas and never leave. IMHO it is killing the quality of players in FFXI already... when coming across characters 50+ who don't even have access to Kazham let along know Kazham even exists all I can say is completely and utterly no level sync system. I did however agree with the level down of equipment but ONLY and i mean ONLY when entering capped areas.
#11 Jun 04 2009 at 8:30 PM Rating: Decent
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TheFlyingGoat wrote:
Quote:
Well, they could simply make FFXIV have new version of "Level Sync" from the start. That way, you can invite anyone and then just "adjust everyone to a party member's skill levels". Just invite people by role or "job" (whatever it means in FFXIV) "Sync" and go around killing monsters, or doing quests or missions or events.


Please no... the level sync system is a terrible noobification system that allows lazy people to stay in the low level areas and never leave. IMHO it is killing the quality of players in FFXI already... when coming across characters 50+ who don't even have access to Kazham let along know Kazham even exists all I can say is completely and utterly no level sync system. I did however agree with the level down of equipment but ONLY and i mean ONLY when entering capped areas.
and to all the people who <3 the level sync system flame me hate me but understand that there is a limit to how lazy a person can be even if they're looking for a "casual gaming experience"


Level Sync works for FFXI, it has its flaws, but it works amazingly well, so it would be a great idea to make it available for FFXIV. ****, maybe Blizzard should one day copy it for WoW, if they aren't planning to do that already, oh, I forgot, no one parties in WoW, so it has no purpose there.
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#12 Jun 05 2009 at 8:44 AM Rating: Good
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ok fine i'll say it... lfg, scantily clad female characters only!
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#13 Jun 05 2009 at 9:00 AM Rating: Decent
I read the new system as "level will be determined by your ability to wield a weapon".

So, you have one character, but your job and abilities change depending on what weapon you equip. So if you want to be a "DRK", you have to equip a scythe, and as your level in scythe increases so do your other abilities.

So you would still /sea all DRK 40-45, but the abilities he has will be based on his scythe skill, rather than a solid amount of exp per level.

Bear with me a moment..

This also means that if the "DRK" wants to go and level GS, he has to go back to "level 1", only GS now offers him a complete new range of abilities, so in essence he is not a "DRK" but a new job.

So, in a way there is no "job" system, but a "job defined by weapon of use system". The benefits of this include no more completely backline jobs, even a WHM may be forced to melee.

However, they could just implement a system whereby mages are skilled with magics only.
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#14 Jun 05 2009 at 9:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Well another way to look at it is this. Scythe=drk. Equip a weapon would be like changing job. That weapon will have a level and depending on the level you'll gain the stats and abilities of the drk.
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#15 Jun 05 2009 at 11:03 AM Rating: Decent
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While I am a bit intrigued by the potential of a weapon determining your class... it worries me a bit. I'd much rather the traditional pick your own class in the mog house/character selection. That's just me.
#16 Jun 05 2009 at 11:08 AM Rating: Good
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I think its way to early to start speculating about what the problems of the new system are going to be.

I mean speculating about how it might work? Sure. But isn't it a bit early to start saying "I'm not sure I like how this will work"?
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#17 Jun 05 2009 at 12:25 PM Rating: Good
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I don't know. What you are suggesting is really too complicated. I doubt that is what SE is planning since it would just scare new players with its complexity. They clearly said one thing they liked about FFXI was the jobs and that they would be appearing again slightly altered. As for the growth system I think that refers to how you evolve from that existing job. In other words instead of leveling a second job and and equipping it as a subjob you would manipulate by what type of skills and weapons you utilize. SE has a big plan in store but if we try to analyze it without information we'll turn it more complicated than it seems. Remember than in each FF there are jobs. In FFX, Yuna was a summoner but she could move through the sphere grid and learn either black magic or white magic spells. You were the one who decided on what to move to. In FFXII there was no set job. You could use any weapon and develop skill as long as you had the license to wield that weapon. Hm....weapon. Nah couldn't be. But in most Final fantasy games usually the flexibility comes from how you customize your job.

Whatever SE is planning, we are talking about the company that has made one of the most successful rpgs in history. Lets have some fate on them shall we? If you are going to try finding what this new job sub system they are going for try analyzing previous FF job systems. There might lie the answer. "We are trying to find what we can add from other Final Fantasies into this one. We hope that what we do can surprise the gamers." Those lines they said are pretty interesting.
#18 Jun 05 2009 at 1:23 PM Rating: Decent
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The biggest disappointed here would be that jobs will be locked to one type of weapon, for ex as someone mentioned Scythe for DRK, does that mean a DRK will never be able to use two handed swords, or 2 handed axes or dual wield 2 swords ? That would be depressingly boring.
#19 Jun 05 2009 at 1:31 PM Rating: Default
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actually it was mention that there would be use of multiple weapons.
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