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Clarifacation on NO JOBS LIE! INTERVIEWFollow

#1 Jun 05 2009 at 11:07 PM Rating: Sub-Default
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In an interview it was said that the subjob system is staying. They said it added depth to the game. So if anyone said that their wont be jobs they are wrong. I was mistaken in that the subjob system may not be staying but Jobs will most definetly be there which is a duh! Only reason I made this post was because silly people where posting no jobs in FF14.

Edited, Jun 6th 2009 4:57am by JingleHymer
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#2 Jun 05 2009 at 11:16 PM Rating: Decent
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What interview? what are you talking about. I haven't even heard the word subjob used in any q and a or interview anything.

Edited, Jun 6th 2009 12:43am by Xraidead
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#3 Jun 05 2009 at 11:28 PM Rating: Default
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Ill find it and link it



Edited, Jun 6th 2009 3:29am by JingleHymer
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#4 Jun 06 2009 at 12:01 AM Rating: Excellent
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OK, I'm glad you said you'd find it and link it. Because otherwise to come here and try to blow the lid off some great conspiracy theory without a link and act like anyone would take you seriously is pretty stupid. Next time, get the link first and include it in your oP.

Second, if you're referring to the video with the FFXI developer talking about this or that with an English translation, and it's the same video that I watched, you're just being a dork. In that interview, they didn't say they were keeping the job system. They said they liked the diversity the job system offered, and they wanted to continue with the diversity and expand on it. There's a difference.
#6 Jun 06 2009 at 12:11 AM Rating: Excellent
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JingleHymer wrote:


How in the ****...srsly...IN THE ****...do you get "just tweaked a bit" out of:

"We will expand the job system to make it fairly different from the one in FFXI. "

"Fairly different" is not in ANY way "just tweaked a bit."

Good lawd.
#7JingleHymer, Posted: Jun 06 2009 at 12:56 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) The whole post was about jobs and them implementing them in the new game. Not how they were being used. I proved to you they had them and they will be in the game. Also look at the IGN interview. @ 1:05 he stated that they loved the job system in FFXI and that it brought depth and variety to the game and hope to EXPAND on it. So theres your answer dude now take a chill pill.
#8 Jun 06 2009 at 5:24 AM Rating: Good
Going by what has been said, we are all pretty sure there is no more "Job" or "sub-job" system. Your characters growth will be more "Natural" than that. With the new system (which is an old FF system anyway), It will still be possible to run around as a war/whm if you want to spend the time doing so. It will depend on what weapons and abilities you use most.
#9 Jun 06 2009 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Yea I have to agree. It didn't say there would be jobs. It said they liked job system, and want to expand upon it. They also mention how important weapons are. So it could be as you say, jobs will be implemented through a system like FF Tactics. However, It is just as likely to be skill based development through weapon use/play style like many have suggested before. Also, I don't remember ever reading anything about subjobs. They might be in there, if we do have a set job system. On the other hand, I can see the limitations that would put on future game ballance. Like how they couldn't go over 75, because then some subjobs would just be way too **** awesome. Even if there arent specific jobs, you could still build your stats and abillitites and make a "Nin, War, WHM, ETC.
#10 Jun 06 2009 at 8:07 AM Rating: Decent
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It's my understanding that they said there would be no lvl's atleast not in the FFXI sense but I don't remember them ever saying anything about "we don't plan on having a job system" I still think there will be jobs as this would probably be a better grind and keep folks playing for longer. Also I can just imagine all the lame *** ability/spell combos you would see if it was a system of gaining abilities it would be RDM/NIN's all around but worse
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#11 Jun 06 2009 at 11:18 AM Rating: Decent
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JingleHymer wrote:
The whole post was about jobs and them implementing them in the new game. Not how they were being used. I proved to you they had them and they will be in the game. Also look at the IGN interview. @ 1:05 he stated that they loved the job system in FFXI and that it brought depth and variety to the game and hope to EXPAND on it. So theres your answer dude now take a chill pill.


You haven't proven anything. Expanding on the diversity does not entail a job system. You can have a diverse character development system that gives enormous freedom to a player to develop their character based on their interests and playstyles without locking them in to a rigid job system. As a result of that freedom and diversity, you may well end up with characters that resemble familiar jobs in the FF universe, but that doesn't mean that they're playing within the confines of a job system. The system could be designed so that if you develop skills on your character that would traditionally be associated with a White Mage, you could then get bonus abilities that would have previously been consider job-specific, but still wouldn't define you as a White Mage.
#12 Jun 06 2009 at 2:42 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
A: For FFXIV, the keyword that we've been using is "The Growth and Development of the Character." We will have the same type of storytelling and high-quality graphics. We also want to expand and create new in-game systems. The player can grow & develop in a more natural way without putting too much weight on the player. We will expand the job system to make it fairly different from the one in FFXI.


I don't read this as SE saying they're completely scrapping the job system as some people seem to think at all. To me it sounds like they do intend to use a job system, but one that allows for more free-form development within your selected job. So for example if you play PLD that's your base and would determine what abilities and traits you're capable of learning, but depending on how you play you could mold yourself into a purely <meat><shield> type PLD, or you could focus on DD and be more of a hybrid tank, or you could perhaps emphasize your spell-casting abilities translating into things like higher mp (or even enhanced auto-refresh), more potent cures or even more potent Holys and Banishes. Or as a THF you might have to prioritize your Steal/TH type abilities VS you DD capabilities while still accounting for you ability to escape danger through things like evasion and Flee type abilities.

To me this would be ideal because it would still allow for job changes unlike a more generic system where all your efforts go into one universal build. I don't know about everyone else but I like being able to train different jobs for various roles all accessible through one character.

Anyway, speculation is fun and all but none of us really know what SE has planned and this quote doesn't exactly spill the beans, so putting down other people's guesses in favor of our own is a bit silly at this point in my opinion.
#13 Jun 06 2009 at 3:06 PM Rating: Decent
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You could have had a better arguement using the art posted on the FFXIV main page. I clearly see a WHM and BLM. As previously stated though, SE has already confirmed that the "job" system will be different this game. It focuses on weapons that you use.

It's my theory that there will be base classes in FFXIV. Fighter, Tank, Healer, Mage, Support, and Thief. Each "class" can be specified to a certain class of weapons, and based on the weapons you use, can unlock certain abilities based on the level of the weapon. So, the Healer class, coupled with a staff will be able to unlock more efficient cures, and turn out like a White Mage. While a Healer with let's say, a Hammer, will turn out more like a Dancer. With the selection of weapons, also allows you to unlock armors, that will give us the "White Mage" or "Dancer" look. The idea came from a mixture of both Aeon, FFXII, and FFX; and of course, a cluster of ideas already posted, but I bet someone already has this idea posted. Being able to switch base classes will be the only thing that is similar to FFXI.

Back to the main point. There are no "jobs" in FFXIV as in the same sense as in FFXI.


Edited, Jun 6th 2009 7:07pm by Aristio

Edited, Jun 6th 2009 7:08pm by Aristio
#14 Jun 06 2009 at 3:09 PM Rating: Decent
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PopeyesOpenEye wrote:

I don't read this as SE saying they're completely scrapping the job system as some people seem to think at all. To me it sounds like they do intend to use a job system, but one that allows for more free-form development within your selected job.


I agree that we have no reason to believe without question that they're doing away with the job system altogether. The question is, however, that if their focus is on a more freestyle character development system, how freestyle can you actually get if you're still encompassed within the scope of a job label? To me, a truly freestyle development system is one where you develop abilities that suit a defined role as opposed to defining a role and then developing abilities within it. In your example with the PLD, you're still defining roles or, more specifically, you're defining restrictions on a role (ie. excluding significant magic-based dps from your repertoire).

Quote:
To me this would be ideal because it would still allow for job changes unlike a more generic system where all your efforts go into one universal build. I don't know about everyone else but I like being able to train different jobs for various roles all accessible through one character.


A job system defines your role within a group based on the limitations of the job. A "jobless" system defines your role in a group based on the abilities you've developed and the needs of the group. Either way, I can't really see entertaining group content built around the exclusion certain traditional roles. If you've got 6 hybrids in a party smacking things around with no clearly defined tank or healer, you're not really a group...you're a bunch of solo players sharing xp and loot.
#15 Jun 06 2009 at 3:38 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I agree that we have no reason to believe without question that they're doing away with the job system altogether. The question is, however, that if their focus is on a more freestyle character development system, how freestyle can you actually get if you're still encompassed within the scope of a job label? To me, a truly freestyle development system is one where you develop abilities that suit a defined role as opposed to defining a role and then developing abilities within it. In your example with the PLD, you're still defining roles or, more specifically, you're defining restrictions on a role (ie. excluding significant magic-based dps from your repertoire).


I think you can still allow for a lot of freestyle while maintaining job titles. Just look at what SE did with the job system in Tactics, it's old and a bit crude but certainly a good base to look at for creating customization within job titles. Of course for the sake of an MMORPG we would need a lot more abilites and traits to pick from or else it would feel limited as opposed to customizable.

And yes in my PLD example I am defining roles, I personally don't like the idea of everyone playing a hybrid type character for basically the same scenario you outlined in your second paragraph, it sounds like a very bland experience. I prefer team play where you have weaknesses that need to be made up for by your team-mates. So while the meat shield type PLD would lose the DPS that another PLD might bring to the table (weather magic or melee based), he would also have the advantage of more sentinel and flash type abilities as well as being able to withstand harder hits for his team. Of course, the benefit of having such a PLD as opposed to a DDPLD would be dependent on SE not ******** up the damage formula again in a way that makes defense negligible as well as them not repeating Colibri type XP parties, but I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt on this.
#16 Jun 06 2009 at 4:01 PM Rating: Good
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PopeyesOpenEye wrote:
And yes in my PLD example I am defining roles, I personally don't like the idea of everyone playing a hybrid type character for basically the same scenario you outlined in your second paragraph, it sounds like a very bland experience.


I think that done properly, it would be far from bland. My example of the 6 hybrids was intended to illustrate why people would still execute "traditional" roles in groups. The difference is, instead of defining what that role will be when you create that character, you define it over the lifespan of that character based on how you choose to play the game. To an extent, that's already possible in FFXI due to the option to level other jobs and subjobs, but I'm describing (or at least, trying to describe ;D) the next level of evolution for a diverse system. Instead of having to run back to your mog house to change job/subjob to perform a certain role in a group, it could be a simple gear swap in the field and off you go. If you like the idea of being able to nuke and debuff mobs and have proficiency with a melee weapon but you don't want to be forced to work a party buff rotation (hiya, Mr. RDM! your day has finally come!) you just don't develop your buff skills. Since you have no job label, nobody is inviting you expecting you to be able to fill a role you haven't said you wanted to fill.

Guy>> You have to work a haste and refresh rotation!
>> I don't really want to...I want to nuke and debuff D:
Guy>> You're an RDM and that's what RDMs do in groups! Do it or gtfo!
>> D:

vs.

Guy>> You have to work a haste and refresh rotation!
>> I don't really want to...I want to nuke and debuff D:
Guy>> You're a...oh...ok...nvm...
>> :D

See what I mean? ;D
#17 Jun 06 2009 at 5:53 PM Rating: Good
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AureliusSir wrote:

Guy>> You have to work a haste and refresh rotation!
>> I don't really want to...I want to nuke and debuff D:
Guy>> You're out of my party

D:
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