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#1 Jun 06 2009 at 6:16 PM Rating: Good
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Who wants them to stay the same, and who wants 'em different? :p

And if you want them different, what do you want different about them.

I honestly, want the ability to use the old FFXI controls, and a control setup like WoW, really more mouse-controlled, from a PC/Keyboard side.

Controllers for the PS3... I think they are pretty much fine. :)

What's your 2 gil?
#2 Jun 06 2009 at 6:26 PM Rating: Decent
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I'd like to continue to be able to play the game without having to use a mouse. It was impossible to pvp in WoW as rogue with one hand, yet I could easily do so in ffxi, although with pve on thief.
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#3 Jun 06 2009 at 6:32 PM Rating: Default
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I think they should remain relatively the same with some minor tweaks for the pc/keyboard. Maybe an easier macro set in stead of Ctrl & Alt 1~0. The PS3 controller will be great and if one picks up the add on keyboard pad for the controller there will be no need for a pc keyboard for typing.
#4 Jun 06 2009 at 6:43 PM Rating: Good
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I'm completely opposed to the utilization of a mouse in the game. It makes no sense to me why you'd even want to have your hands in two different places at once--being able to play with just a keyboard or a controller in your hands makes things much more engaging for me.

Thankfully, that will probably be the case. The idea of only needing to use one input device goes towards accessibility, which is what SE claims to be after. Though on the other end of the spectrum, they might implement mouse usage to try and make a transition from WoW to XIV easier. Personally speaking I hope they finish their development and testing without even acknowledging that WoW exists, other than simply as another game in the world.
#5 Jun 06 2009 at 6:48 PM Rating: Good
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I prefer keyboard + mouse. If I want to type something with keyboard + mouse, I just take my hand off the mouse, type, and my hand goes back on the mouse. Fluid and reasonably intuitive. If I want to type something while using a gamepad, I have to set the gamepad down (desk space is sometimes restricted), type, and then pick up the gamepad again. As far as keyboard only or keyboard + mouse...well...

Classic and so, so true.
#6 Jun 06 2009 at 6:51 PM Rating: Decent
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I prefer WoW's controls, but then FFXI's weren't too bad when I was playing that game. I just want a jump button darnit! =P

And how is using a keyboard and mouse less accessable? Oh, laptops, I suppose you have a point. Oh well, guess we'll see.
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#7 Jun 06 2009 at 6:58 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
And how is using a keyboard and mouse less accessable? Oh, laptops, I suppose you have a point. Oh well, guess we'll see.


With WoW if I wanted to do anything I needed to have my right hand on the mouse to click and move my character and/or camera. My left hand then had to be on the keyboard and would push the hotkeys. If I made hotkeys for all the mouse clicks I would be almost set.. except that I'd be a keyboard turner.

In FFXI I was able to use my right hand on the right of the keyboard, the left of the keyboard, or the entire keyboard; the same thing with my left hand. It was also much easier to fluently go from typing anything to doing anything and back and forth. I also didn't have to try and click on anything.. <.<;

Quote:
I prefer keyboard + mouse. If I want to type something with keyboard + mouse, I just take my hand off the mouse, type, and my hand goes back on the mouse. Fluid and reasonably intuitive. If I want to type something while using a gamepad, I have to set the gamepad down (desk space is sometimes restricted), type, and then pick up the gamepad again.


Hmmm? Wouldn't then using just a keyboard be best? It allows you to switch between typing and other stuff even more smoothly.
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#8 Jun 06 2009 at 7:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, I want WASD movement by default with A and D rotating the camera. I do not enjoy the more Eastern style of mousing to the edge of the screen to move the camera. EVERY time I went on a tour of FFXI with the folks at OnePR, I'd have to immediately set my controls to compact keyboard and disable mousing for the camera. Otherwise, I would get totally turned around in the middle of the tour.

Of course, I might just play it on the PS3. We'll see!
#9 Jun 06 2009 at 7:01 PM Rating: Decent
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I think they're referring to the fact that they get incredible precision(mouse) with just being a couple inches farther to the right of the number pad. Which is what I like. It's not a big hassle to move an extra two inches to type, if I get amazing accuracy.

After all, how do you view threads? You use your mouse, eh? :P
#10 Jun 06 2009 at 7:12 PM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Deadgye wrote:
Hmmm? Wouldn't then using just a keyboard be best? It allows you to switch between typing and other stuff even more smoothly.


Nope, 'cause I didn't want to be a Donald.

1-6, Alt 1-6, Ctrl 1-6, and rebind 'a' and 'd' to hotkeys since I don't use them to turn and I've got fast access to 20 abilities with minimal movement from my left hand. Tab and/or mouse to target, turn with mouse. Snappy response times never bad, but are especially handy when tanking multiple-mob content.
#11 Jun 06 2009 at 7:14 PM Rating: Decent
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MilkshakesOO wrote:
I think they're referring to the fact that they get incredible precision(mouse) with just being a couple inches farther to the right of the number pad. Which is what I like. It's not a big hassle to move an extra two inches to type, if I get amazing accuracy.

After all, how do you view threads? You use your mouse, eh? :P


Keyboard hotkeys will forever be more accurate precision-wise compared to a mouse. But I guess it really is very personal, I liked very much being able to move my character, zoom in and out, move the camera around, autorun toggle, view toggle, change targets, confirm/action button, run/walk toggle, lock target on/off toggle, /heal on/off toggle, view chatlog/view&cancel buffs, and opening up the main menu and being able to cycle through it all with only my right hand, without even lifting it up.
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#12 Jun 06 2009 at 7:14 PM Rating: Decent
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The edge of the screen rotation was, at least to me, absurd. I for one prefer right clicking and moving the camera freely; the WoW camera controls were perfect. It can fall back in place once I start moving again, I don't care, but I like a particular angle while fighting and the click and drag that PC FFXI had was not my cup of tea.

I think the WoW binding system was very effective and made customization amazingly easy. It allowed each user to have his/her own particular setup that felt most comfortable. Comfort is definately key when dealing with controls.

I think SE should give PC users the ability to choose their controls, while giving PS3 users their basic menu system, macros, and/or hotkeys. I just hope FFXIV doesn't have the mess of hotkeys WoW forced each player to have.




Edited, Jun 6th 2009 11:15pm by Mictam
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#13 Jun 06 2009 at 7:18 PM Rating: Decent
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AureliusSir wrote:
The One and Only Deadgye wrote:
Hmmm? Wouldn't then using just a keyboard be best? It allows you to switch between typing and other stuff even more smoothly.


Nope, 'cause I didn't want to be a Donald.

1-6, Alt 1-6, Ctrl 1-6, and rebind 'a' and 'd' to hotkeys since I don't use them to turn and I've got fast access to 20 abilities with minimal movement from my left hand. Tab and/or mouse to target, turn with mouse. Snappy response times never bad, but are especially handy when tanking multiple-mob content.


Hmm.. that doesn't seem to match up at all, maybe because you're talking about WoW while I'm talking about ffxi. Smiley: lol I think it's actually too different to compare the different set ups in WoW vs FFXI, especially when pressing the left key makes your character run left instead of making them turn left.

Quote:
The edge of the screen rotation was, at least to me, absurd. I for one prefer right clicking and moving the camera freely; the WoW camera controls were perfect. It can fall back in place once I start moving again, I don't care, but I like a particular angle while fighting and the click and drag that PC FFXI had was not my cup of tea.

I think the WoW binding system was very effective and made customization amazingly easy. It allowed each user to have his/her own particular setup that felt most comfortable. Comfort is definately key when dealing with controls.


Edge of the screen rotation? Smiley: confused The arrow keys are the default keys used to turn the camera, which can easily be manipulated with your thumb and index finger since your right hand will be right there using the numberpad to move. FFXI also had a binding system, although if we were to go into binding keys I'd actually start to use windower binds as examples since they're much better. If you're using a laptop without a numberpad, the camera keys were somewhere decent too.. but I don't really know where since I rarely play in compact.

Edited, Jun 6th 2009 11:21pm by Deadgye
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#14 Jun 06 2009 at 7:22 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
the click and drag that PC FFXI had was not my cup of tea.


You could press shift+arrow keys to move the camera at any time, regardless of whatever menus were open. There was no need to click or pan at the edge.
#15 Jun 06 2009 at 7:26 PM Rating: Decent
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Ennyam wrote:
Quote:
the click and drag that PC FFXI had was not my cup of tea.


You could press shift+arrow keys to move the camera at any time, regardless of whatever menus were open. There was no need to click or pan at the edge.


Aye, if you were using the mouse at any time while playing ffxi you were probably either having fun ******** around or doing something very wrong.
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#16 Jun 06 2009 at 7:38 PM Rating: Decent
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True, I didn't play much on my PC. I played most of the time on my ps2, and I completely forgot about the arrow keys. You will have to forgive me, it's been over a year since I've played.
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#17 Jun 06 2009 at 7:43 PM Rating: Decent
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Wait, how is the keyboard so much better? Either way, in FFXI or WoW, you're controling movement with the right hand and macros with the left.
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#18 Jun 06 2009 at 8:25 PM Rating: Good
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As long as I can play entirely with a keyboard, I'll be happy. Was never a fan of MMO play with a control pad or a mouse.
#19 Jun 06 2009 at 8:35 PM Rating: Good
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Raymund wrote:
Wait, how is the keyboard so much better? Either way, in FFXI or WoW, you're controling movement with the right hand and macros with the left.


The main difference in terms of the WoW interface was that you could turn extremely quickly with the mouse, whereas turning with the keyboard only had one speed, and that speed quite often was too slow to allow for a prompt reaction time. It's been so long since I've played FFXI that I don't specifically recall all the commands. When I played FFXI I used the keyboard exclusively, but I'm not sure I could do away with the option to turn with the mouse now that it's become so familiar, especially if it meant having to rely on a slow turning speed option.
#20 Jun 06 2009 at 9:10 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Wait, how is the keyboard so much better? Either way, in FFXI or WoW, you're controling movement with the right hand and macros with the left.


In WoW you're moving with your left hand, doing macros with your left hand and mouse, and moving the mouse and camera with your right hand. You really wouldn't take your right hand off of the mouse mid battle to hit a macro with your right hand, right? The only reason you would do it is to type.

In FFXI your right hand is moving your character, controlling the camera, pressing macros, and typing all very smoothly, while your left hand is typing and hitting macros. In some situations it actually can become advantageous to criss cross your hands and switch them for better comfort and reaction time. (Hello standing in one spot and camping Hoo Mjuu the Torrent for hours <3)

There's a pretty big difference between the two. Trying to compare keyboard only in ffxi to keyboard only in WoW is like comparing.. let's just go with apples and bananas.
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#21 Jun 06 2009 at 9:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Even in games that use the mouse for camera, I still keybind movements to numpad ala FFXI style, and I move my hand to the mouse for camera movements and movement when there. Might seem strange but I still found it to be quite successful. Of course this doesn't work in games which doesn't have auto facing since it would take a while to turn if on a keyboard.

Edited, Jun 7th 2009 5:18am by Feyted
#22 Jun 06 2009 at 10:29 PM Rating: Decent
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I like the controls in WoW because they feel so much like the other Warcraft games.

But I LOVED how playing FFXI with a controller felt just as intuitive as playing any other FF. I plug in a controller every time I play FFXI because I find it so much easier than trying to use a mouse. So for FFXI I use a mouse, keyboard, and controller.

I really hope they give us the option of using the controller with FFIV, and I am pretty sure they will. It is intended to be a cross-platform console game after all. I found it much easier to control the camera and my view with the controller than the keyboard, even though the mouse gave a faster look speed.
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#23 Jun 07 2009 at 8:10 AM Rating: Good
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I loved using a PS2 controller to play FFXI on my PC, and would love to be able to do the same for FFXIV. For me, nothing beats analog player and camera movement, with very easy menu navigation. I have no trouble setting the controller in my lap and moving to the keyboard to type messages.

Also, for PS3 owners, don't forget about that keypad attachment they sell. Could be very awesome.
#24 Jun 07 2009 at 8:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Ennyam wrote:
I'm completely opposed to the utilization of a mouse in the game. It makes no sense to me why you'd even want to have your hands in two different places at once--being able to play with just a keyboard or a controller in your hands makes things much more engaging for me.

While obvious things can be said about the lack of good games on the Wii, I still enjoy the controller on the Wii system immensely... not for the motion sensing, but for being able to separate my hands.

I wish I could take my controller for every console, and rip it into two pieces. One for each hand.

Though, using a keyboard to play any game is extremely awkward. In my opinion, keyboards are for typing only. For gaming, well... my Belkin n52 is so comfortable for the left hand ^.^
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#25 Jun 07 2009 at 9:04 AM Rating: Default
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nah, for ps3 is always better having a normal usb keyboard
#26 Jun 07 2009 at 9:07 AM Rating: Decent
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I enjoyed controlling my character with my right hand while typing with my left at the same time. Couldn't do that very well in the other mouse-driven MMOs.
#27 Jun 07 2009 at 9:14 AM Rating: Good
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It's also a PS3 game remember. I dunno if they could pull it off without alienating the PS3 gamers. This kinda brings back the whole which is better for FPS's; Mouse or controller argument.

They also said it would have many crucial time critical controls (or something along the lines)
I'm guessing they'll implement some critical trigger type system like most modern turn based RPGs.

In lost odyssey they had a target ring system, this along with other things kept each and every battle engaging and fun throughout each of the 4 disks.
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