Alright, first of all apologies if I got a bit snippy there.
I got what you were saying the first time, and the poll seems very straight forward so I don't see how anyone would misunderstand the poll.
Multiple people were under the impression that this race would ONLY be able to be a Black Mage or Dark Knight. A job specific race would generally not be a popular idea.
Edit: to point out that the poll actually still reads that it is for a Black Mage/Dark Knight race.
There were three choices for yes and one for no, and even with the three different choices for yes, the "no" option still got more votes percentage-wise.
Which is not at all an indication that it shouldn't be a race. Think about it. How many people would have been in favor of Tarutaru, Elvaan, Galka, and female-only Mithra if the ideas had been presented before the release of FFXI? In nearly all accounts, more people would have said "no." 15-20% of people want that as a playable race. That's more representation than some of the existing races have already (in a game with only 5 races, no less! 20% is 1/5th!)
So 50% or so saying no is actually nothing. That's actually about what I expected to get because I've seen this kind of negativity about new ideas a dozen times over, for better ideas and worse ideas. 50% of people would have voted "no" to Blue Mage. Trust me, only 50% is very good.
A poll is valid as being reflective of what the majority on a much grander scale would want.
You clearly don't know enough about research design to comment, so I'm just going to ask that you not try to wing it. The poll was invalid, largely because self-reporting opt-out polls themselves are not especially valid, but also largely because I constructed it poorly if I were -trying- to get accurate results. I really wasn't. These results are good enough for me. I'm just trying to explain to you how the results should be interpreted because you don't seem to grasp what the data means.
Let's run with your "valid as the grander scale of majority" assertion. Ok, so tens of thousands of players want to play as this race. Even more think it's a fair enough idea. Half of the players don't like it, but it's assumed that roughly 0% of them won't play the game because of their addition.
I mean you seriously can't even begin to convince me that more people like Galkas, and in a game with subligar no less, than would like this race. You'd even be hard pressed to convince me that more people prefer Elvaan and Tarutaru.
I get that there are those who want to play a race that shows some form of evil for the mallgoths to express themselves, but a black formless race?
That's just an ignorant thing to say. Many people find that design appealing for differing reasons. Some of us happen to think it's cute.
How would character creation be since you'd really only get to choose the size?
See, I've already been over this once or twice. Different size. Different body shape (like with any race). Different hair. Different eye color and shape. And much of what constitutes as graphic character customization depends on gear.
What happens if the "black mage" doesn't want to wear a pointy hat and instead goes with no hat, forcing the creators to give it some sort of shape, which would end up just making them a race of humes that look like they've had their .dat's screwed with to the point where you can't even see that there was any design involved at all?
Many people have suggested that it simply have a "bald" head, but it could also have hair. The Fomors in FFXI frequently have no head gear. Others have suggested that by default they are wearing some sort of hood that covers the top of their head. I mean, god forbid they have to give the head some shape so that the massive number of players who want this race can play it?
With the eyes, wouldn't it look too cartoony, when the other races attempt to look as realistic as possible?
It would look no more cartoony than the moogles in FFXI at the very worst. If you make them look more like Fomor, then that becomes even less of an issue.
I'll have to agree with you on one thing, I thought the Fomors looked cool, but they aren't personal beings, they're the spirits of former personal beings, and as such, you couldn't necessarily "create" the spirit of a former personal being, nor play them and have them be a part of the FFXIV storyline as a race of personal beings. They were character-less enemies, and the only way to have them really "fit" into FFXIV would be to have them be an added race with cities and culture, that are just pointlessly feature-less, which would be extremely lazy for the designers and too cartoonish to fit in still.
As has already been explained by the creators of FFXIV, it's a completely separate game and the races are different. Whatever you can say about the Fomor in FFXI does not have to apply to a similar race in FFXIV.
It'd be awesome to play an undead creature in an other game, but unless you can pitch some actual good ideas as to how they'd be able to fit them into FFXIV while pleasing ALL players and not just less than half, I'm going to keep saying that they should not be in the game at all.
You can't please all of the players all of the time. If you rule out any race that even a significant portion of the gaming population is averse to, then you have a game with only playable humans and nothing else. Not all people were pleased with any of the races aside from Humes in FFXI, and there were probably a stray player or two that wished that there were no Humes either. People thought Galka were downright ugly. People hated the fact that Mithra were Female only. People thought Elvaan design was poor and didn't like their characteristics. People thought that Tarutaru looked creepy or deformed. I thought all of those things myself at some point or another.
Look, believe it or not, people get over it. They accept the fact that many players are glad that the race is there, and they learn to appreciate the diversity.
Every complaint you raised is something that all of the people who like the race are able to look past. And if you're not even going to play it, then why can't you? Afterall, at the end of the day, even a hated race like Galka gets accepted, even if only as the **** of many, many jokes. We had a GalkaHaters linkshell on my server, and others had Galka only LS. People still joke about the ugly furballs. And if people want to joke about Waltz/Shade/Fomor players as being soulless, goth, and emo, then I think Dark Knight players would sigh a sigh of relief for having a little of the heat taken off of them.
So I really hope that addresses your comments, and unless there are any NEW concerns that need to be addressed (which I will happily oblige), I'd like to turn the course of discussion in favor of people who do like the idea. People who don't are still welcome to vote "no." Edited, Jun 12th 2009 7:12pm by Kachi