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Lack of male Miqo'teFollow

#1 Aug 05 2009 at 3:59 PM Rating: Good
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It seems like there are many, many people who are fairly upset that SE hasn't announced that the game will include male Miqo'te. I'm wondering how many people besides me don't actually want to see this. One of the things that really made the Mithra (and Galka) interesting was their single gender society. It made them seem more alien and interesting (to me anyway). Taking away that aspect of the race would make them seem much more like humans with cat tails and ears. Which is way, way less interesting (again, to me).

So a poll...

Do you want playable male Miqo'te in FFXIV
Yes, I'll only be happy if I can play a male Miqo'te! :55 (24.0%)
Yes, but I don't plan to play one. :73 (31.9%)
I don't care either way.:63 (27.5%)
No. :38 (16.6%)
Total:229


My answer is No. I'm sympathetic to people who want to play male Miqo'te, and I think they could be fun. If SE decides to include them then I won't complain. But I think the single gender Miqo'te are much more interesting.



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#2 Aug 05 2009 at 4:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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keelut wrote:
It seems like there are many, many people who are fairly upset that SE hasn't announced that the game will include male Miqo'te. I'm wondering how many people besides me don't actually want to see this. One of the things that really made the Mithra (and Galka) interesting was their single gender society. It made them seem more alien and interesting (to me anyway). Taking away that aspect of the race would make them seem much more like humans with cat tails and ears. Which is way, way less interesting (again, to me).

So a poll...

Poll Removed: No more than one per thread, please!

My answer is No. I'm sympathetic to people who want to play male Miqo'te, and I think they could be fun. If SE decides to include them then I won't complain. But I think the single gender Miqo'te are much more interesting.





Just quoting you so your poll shows up.
#3 Aug 05 2009 at 4:05 PM Rating: Good
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I'm down for it, sure if it'll make people happy. Besides it'll be nice to see some different playable characters, though my heart is still set on playing a TaruLalafell.

Edited, Aug 5th 2009 8:06pm by kyansaroo
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#4 Aug 05 2009 at 4:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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I would like to see them, but I don't think I would be playing one.

I think it would be nice because it would continue to add more diversity to the game.

I am also hoping they reveal/add more races.

Many games only start off with a few races, even in closed beta testing, and then reveal more when the game has open beta testing.

Some games, like Mabinogi, didn't even add Elves and Giants until several months after open beta testing ended.

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#5 Aug 05 2009 at 4:14 PM Rating: Good
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I don't really care either way. I know that a lot of guys played a Mithra just for stat reasons and were teased by people calling them <Man>thras. Seems like a similar thing will happen this time around, although I read that race won't play as much as a significant role in stat differences.

As someone mentioned in a different thread, I really would of liked to see a new/different race. I mean come on... all the new races are exact copies from FFXI. Why can't we have 1 new race?
#6 Aug 05 2009 at 4:27 PM Rating: Good
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I'm starting to panic either way. If they don't add Male Miqo'Te I'm going to be so disappointed, I'm not sure if I'll even play FFXIV. People have been BEGGING Square Enix to add Male Mithra, and wanted them, for a long long time, many people. Many guys wanted a more "feminine" race to play. Many guys love the look and feel of Mithra (Cat Like Race) but wanted to actually play as a guy.

There have been so many discussions on this that I'm blue in the face, you can even check out my blog for a lot of them. If Square Enix doesn't add a male to this Miqo'Te race I'm going to be HIGHLY disappointed, for the sole fact that this is not suppose to be FFXI 2.0 again. I want it to have a fresh feel, I don't want another storyline explaining why ONCE AGAIN there can't be Male Cats as playable characters even though they exist.

I think they might be holding it off, for suspense. I'm pretty sure Square Enix will add at least 1 new race, wouldn't everyone else agree? I'm not positive, but it would stand to logic.

I will say this much. They are making a BAD move if everything is exactly like it was, race and gender wise, in FFXI.
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#7 Aug 05 2009 at 4:41 PM Rating: Decent
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I picked the first choice.

They say this isn't a sequel but i beg to differ.
Lemme guess, male miqo'te are locked up and don't fight?
Oh oh! *future sight* Are female Roegadyn nonexistant because the males aren't really MALES?! They just look, act, talk, walk, and wear the clothes of males? BUT in actuality they just REINCARNATE?!

OH MY GOOOOOD THAT'S NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE! OMIGOD SO NEW!

:3
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#8 Aug 05 2009 at 4:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm really sad they didn't announce Male Miqo'te in those scans. And Idk why people are afraid of a female Roegadyn, it could work!
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#9 Aug 05 2009 at 5:01 PM Rating: Good
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Carbi wrote:

They say this isn't a sequel but i beg to differ.
Lemme guess, male miqo'te are locked up and don't fight?
Oh oh! *future sight* Are female Roegadyn nonexistant because the males aren't really MALES?! They just look, act, talk, walk, and wear the clothes of males? BUT in actuality they just REINCARNATE?!

OH MY GOOOOOD THAT'S NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE! OMIGOD SO NEW!

:3


I know, this is the exact impression I'm getting now. I agree, it's good they are keeping some styles and elements from FFXI, even if they keep them all, but they at LEAST need to add some new things to make it fresh. We thought these new things would most likely be Male Mithra and possibly a new race. So far I'm disappointed.
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#10 Aug 05 2009 at 5:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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I could care less really. If they add them in, great. Maybe I'll roll one and see if I like the style. If they're not in oh well, I'll move on and pick another race.

I thought they would be in given the amount of people who whined about it in FFXI and especially after they announced they'd basically be using the same races. But I still think SE has something up there sleeve as far as races go. I'm still thinking 1-2 more races will be revealed at some point later down the line and maybe not until closer to release.
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#11 Aug 05 2009 at 5:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Pikko wrote:
Just quoting you so your poll shows up.

You're never gonna get people to sign up for premium with that kind of attitude :D
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#12 Aug 05 2009 at 5:14 PM Rating: Good
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Not including them just seems like an annoyance to those who'd want to play them, when there's little effort involved on SE's part involved in their implementation. It's not like adding a whole new race or class. Using the same backstory as in FFXI to account for their nonplayability just strikes me as odd and forced. I want to play a new game, not FFXI HD!

If there aren't any more races to be revealed, I hope the character customisation is vastly improved at least to distinguish players more (beyond the trivial addition of being able to pick a skin colour). Higher graphical fidelity should be taken advantage of by allowing finer variation in appearance.
#13 Aug 05 2009 at 5:17 PM Rating: Good
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Personally I'll be disappointed in SE if they don't add gender counterparts to Mithra and Galka as well as add at least a new race or two. It would convey a dismal message about their ability to stay at the forefront of game development.

I did actually submit to SE a lengthy assessment of people's opinions of new races based on forum discussion, and one thing I specifically pointed out was the high demand for a "male Mithra" and that the community was even generally favorable of a "female Galka". I wrapped that up with the observation that players are mostly in consensus about not liking single-gender races.
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#14 Aug 05 2009 at 5:28 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, exactly what everyone is chiming in to say. It's basically going to be nothing but an annoyance and let down if Square Enix DOESN'T add Male Mithra as a playable character. I know for a fact, that in Japan the demand for them is even BIGGER than the Demand from western style countries, and our demand for them is pretty big as it is.

We want a new story, a new feel. We don't want the same feeling of Gender Exclusion, and we don't want to hear the SAME **** excuse or another stupid excuse about why we can't play a Male Cat Race.

Although, given some of the trends Square Enix has shown in FFXI and their connection with their consumers lately, nothing would surprise me at this point, although as others are saying, they might just be keeping us in suspense, saving the "Best for Last" announcing new Race(s) and Male Mithra or anything else like that, at the end.

One way or another, they need to do things in a new manner, they need to add some freshness, and they need to add something that has no negative effect, which the fans have been begging for, and hoping for, in the masses, for a long time. Seriously Square Enix.

Listen to your consumers, World Wide. Add Male Mithra As a Playable Race!
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#15 Aug 05 2009 at 5:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
Personally I'll be disappointed in SE if they don't add gender counterparts to Mithra and Galka as well as add at least a new race or two. It would convey a dismal message about their ability to stay at the forefront of game development.


Really? Maybe it just conveys a message that they like the sort of demographics they had in Vana'diel and would like to recreate that again.

Personally, I kind of like the asymmetric quality of male-only and female-only races. If players want more feminine male models or more masculine female models, hopefully that will be accommodated by the expanded customization system.
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#16 Aug 05 2009 at 6:00 PM Rating: Decent
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I think there should be a male mithra. I might decide to play one...the whole nocturnal/diurnal thing is interesting.

However, being a Highlander fan and a fan of Scottish accents I'll probably go with a highlander hume...or whatever they are being called nowadays.
#17 Aug 05 2009 at 6:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think there are going to be male Miqo'te. *quote from article* Miqo'te: 2 clans - the Sun Seekers who live regular daytime lives and the Moon Keepers who are nocturnal, not a lot of males, not clear if they will speak like cats

Because the stated the same thing for the lalafell, but the opposite.

*quote from article* Lalafell: based in the south, agricultural, high intelligence, not many females. but yet we see both male and female pic of the lala's.

I think SE is just trying to give us a nice surprise, they know some of you want the male side of the Miqo'te. I just using logic base on those descriptions and the pics that were shown and the fact that the Main site cover art has a male Miqo'te admiring the eyes of that male lalafell.
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#18 Aug 05 2009 at 6:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think it's very possible that they included that blurb about there not being many males just to ***** with us. SE's marketing style has never been the type to regularly update players with the news that they want to hear... they seem to like to make us suffer. If SE's marketing team were a prostitute, she'd be a **********. I'll let you run with that analogy on your own.

Quote:
Really? Maybe it just conveys a message that they like the sort of demographics they had in Vana'diel and would like to recreate that again.

Personally, I kind of like the asymmetric quality of male-only and female-only races. If players want more feminine male models or more masculine female models, hopefully that will be accommodated by the expanded customization system.


Well, that's all well and good if they like those demographics. Big game developer they are, they should go ahead and develop a version for themselves however they want it. And the devs can play it all by themselves, and pat eachother on the back for making the perfect game for themselves.

But if they want to actually stay at the forefront of development, I'll strongly urge them to convey the message that they'll deliver what their playerbase, the customers, like.

Now I understand what you're saying about the asymmetric quality of single-gender races, I really do. But that quality, novel the butterfly that it is, does not offset the tremendous blow delivered by restricting players from a gender they identify with on a race that they like when there is a constant reminder everywhere they look that, "You could have this, but you can't." Ultimately, one of the single most important things an MMORPG can do is allow its player to create the character that they want to play.
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#19 Aug 05 2009 at 7:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Not to stifle the discussion but it really is to early to say anything. Its only been a few days or so since we actually got any 'real' info that isn't just conjecture from trailers and interviews. There is a lot more to come and I think that the whole having both gender thing is one we'll hear eventually, but maybe not till the second big convention/event.
#20 Aug 05 2009 at 9:28 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
There is a lot more to come and I think that the whole having both gender thing is one we'll hear eventually, but maybe not till the second big convention/event.


This. This is SE we're talking about. Do you really think they'd spring female Galka/Roegadyn and male Mithra/Miqo'te on us this early, along with hordes of other info? Heck no. They'd save that kind of a big reveal for something like TGS or one of the Fanfests for maximum suspense and surprise.
Or, they would perhaps string us along with "maybes" and "we can't comment at this time" lines then fail to deliver them when the game comes out, for maximum disappointment. One of the two. SE is a fickle mistress.
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#21 Aug 05 2009 at 11:13 PM Rating: Good
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Well there is still hope guys. The descriptions so far dont say anything about Miqo'te or Roegadyn being gender specific, right? Thats pretty important info for them to not even mention, so maybe there is more to be revealed(hopefully along with new races ^-^)
#22 Aug 05 2009 at 11:23 PM Rating: Good
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Am I the only one who thought that the sunseekers and the moonkeepers meant something more than just clans?(I know, it doesn't make sense that males would be in one clan, and females in another, but whatever, that what first came to mind)
I was disappointed when I seen the pictures and seen no male Miqo'te, but when I seen that whole clan thing, it reminded me that SE is the company in question.

I still have high hopes that they will surprise us with male Miqo'te, suspension is one of the best tools in the industry.
#23 Aug 05 2009 at 11:41 PM Rating: Good
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Mezzura wrote:
Am I the only one who thought that the sunseekers and the moonkeepers meant something more than just clans?(I know, it doesn't make sense that males would be in one clan, and females in another, but whatever, that what first came to mind)
I was disappointed when I seen the pictures and seen no male Miqo'te, but when I seen that whole clan thing, it reminded me that SE is the company in question.

I still have high hopes that they will surprise us with male Miqo'te, suspension is one of the best tools in the industry.


Yeah, the same thing came across my mind as well. Them mentioning two different clans "Sunseekers" and "Moonkeepers"... I dunno, hopefully it's referring to Males and Females, like how in the wild, usually the Females are Active during the day (hunt and what not) And the males become active at night Generally. I dunno, I could be wrong but perhaps it's a hint.
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#24 Aug 06 2009 at 9:18 AM Rating: Excellent
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I think SE still has a lot up their sleeves that they haven't announced... they have announced what we already know, the races from FF11 will be there in some form. That doesn't mean they won't surprise us and announce something later. Personally I think it would be very silly if they didn't have at least one new race, seeing it didn't take much creativity to give us the same thing over again.

Only thing I'm wondering about is the name, I still don't know if I like "Miqo'te"... /sigh

Mezzura wrote:
Am I the only one who thought that the sunseekers and the moonkeepers meant something more than just clans.


Maybe it will be a stat thing, if you're a Sunseeker you have a specific boost during the day, and if you are Moonkeeper you have a boost to stat at night? Just a guess... lol

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 1:20pm by YfandesofBismarck
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#25 Aug 06 2009 at 9:24 AM Rating: Default
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I don't care, the Roegadyn looks so freaking cool not choosing to play one would be impossible for me.

Either that or when I transfer my name from FFXI and my friend list my character will be hume female.

I don't care too much for the cat people. If the males were wolf-like then I would have a conundrum.
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#26 Aug 06 2009 at 9:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Honestly, I don't care. I'm probably insensitive to this because I'm female and can choose freely (aside from choosing galkas), but I mean... It's not that big of a deal to have male Miqo'te. And I noticed in the article they didn't say the males were nonexistent, they just said they were -extremely rare-, HOWEVER, in the Lalafel article, they said Females were rare... but they blatantly had a picture of one next to a male Lalafel. So, who knows. Maybe SE is tricking us, maybe not. Either way doesn't really affect me. :|
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#27 Aug 06 2009 at 2:21 PM Rating: Default
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Another idea I greatly dislike and I'm glad SE will not listen it. Stop thinking you know better then SE at making an MMO.

HQ FEMALE mithras will be one of the biggest selling points for FFXIV.
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#28 Aug 06 2009 at 2:53 PM Rating: Decent
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I think what we see in those pictures is going to be all we get for races. I'm sure they'll release more information about gameplay and jobs during the months to come, but there is no reason for them to hold back information about the races. All they are doing by this is disappointing a large number of people. Just giving us a picture of a male Miqo'te isn't too much to ask, and it keeps those of us who wanted to play one excited for the future.

It's unfortunate, but if they had it I'm sure we would have seen it. Recycling the old races from FFXI is a **** shame. They weren't that original to begin with.



Edited, Aug 6th 2009 6:54pm by Calispel
#29 Aug 06 2009 at 3:09 PM Rating: Good
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pearlsea wrote:
Another idea I greatly dislike and I'm glad SE will not listen it. Stop thinking you know better then SE at making an MMO.

HQ FEMALE mithras will be one of the biggest selling points for FFXIV.


I lol'd. I dare you to go say this on the FFXI boards.

This MMO is more or less being made BECAUSE of the mistakes and short comings FFXI had. Things like, taking way to much time, all the draw backs, PS2 limitations, etc. You do not know jack about what you're talking about.

One of the BIGGEST selling points of this game should be conforming to the HUGE mass of players that have been begging for Male Mithra. Do you think people are NOT going to play because they are added? No. What about if after all this speculation they AREN'T added? I bet a lot of people will be highly disappointed, including myself. This not only equates to bad publicity, but it means there's a good chance a lot of people will lose interest in something they had high hopes for, and not play.
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#30 Aug 06 2009 at 3:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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That might actually be a deal-breaker for me.

As far as I'm concerned; It's less a call for greater character variety and more a test of customer service. Fans have been harping on this topic for years. The fact it contradicted FFXI's lore was the only feeble shield SE was able to muster against the idea. And yet, when they have a chance to completely rewrite the lore from the ground up, they're still deadset on this asinine attraction to single gender races?

The demand for gender options is high, the actual work required is next to nothing.

Why in god's name wouldn't you?


Edited, Aug 6th 2009 7:32pm by Zemzelette
#31 Aug 06 2009 at 4:20 PM Rating: Default
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Wanting something is one thing. Feeling entitled to playable male mithras is another. It's square enix's game, they made the characters they know what they wanted when they made them.

I don't think SE will care if a few hundred people wont buy because there are no male mithras, look how many people they are banning en masse in FFXI. Having a good story that supports the race thats being transfered from FFXI is FAR more important.
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#32 Aug 06 2009 at 4:28 PM Rating: Decent
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pearlsea wrote:
Wanting something is one thing. Feeling entitled to playable male mithras is another. It's square enix's game, they made the characters they know what they wanted when they made them.

I don't think SE will care if a few hundred people wont buy because there are no male mithras, look how many people they are banning en masse in FFXI. Having a good story that supports the race thats being transfered from FFXI is FAR more important.


You just contradicted yourself. Basically what they are doing is transferring stories and ideas, as you said yourself. Do you know how many people won't buy the game when they feel it's FFXI 2.0? It will be more than a few hundred, it will be more than a few thousand, I can guarantee you this. People want fresh new innovative idea's and changes. Even people who haven't played FFXI will be turned off if they find out it's the EXACT same races in the EXACT same way as FFXI.

Yes, this may be their game, but this is business pal. They can make the game exactly how they want it and sit around and play it themselves, or with a few hundred thousand people. OR, they can conform more often to the consumers and what they want, like some other MMORPG's do and watch millions of people funnel in. Guess what, that makes them a lot more money and gives the game a better reputation and feel as well.

I myself and many others don't want to hear the same **** excuses and reasons why we have to be held back, especially with a race that is KNOWN to have males, in this new game. We want to play them and all they are doing is holding the consumers back if they don't allow them to. Do you think Female Mithra will suddenly lose their appeal if their Male Counterparts are playable? Have Female Humes lost their appeal because there are Males to the race?

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 5:31pm by EndlessJourney
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#33 Aug 06 2009 at 4:44 PM Rating: Good
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When I first saw the races, I thought "Wow, its just FFXI-2." Then I read this thread and thought "Wow, people care that their cat person has a *****." Finally, I read this:
EndlessJourney wrote:
This MMO is more or less being made BECAUSE of the mistakes and short comings FFXI had.
and laughed at the naivety. No, FFXIV isn't being made as an apology for all the things that were done incorrectly in FFXI; It is being made because FFXI made them a lot of money. That's all.
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#34 Aug 06 2009 at 5:18 PM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
When I first saw the races, I thought "Wow, its just FFXI-2." Then I read this thread and thought "Wow, people care that their cat person has a *****." Finally, I read this:
EndlessJourney wrote:
This MMO is more or less being made BECAUSE of the mistakes and short comings FFXI had.
and laughed at the naivety. No, FFXIV isn't being made as an apology for all the things that were done incorrectly in FFXI; It is being made because FFXI made them a lot of money. That's all.


qft.

The game isn't FFXI-2 and it doesn't have to have any relation to FFXI at all so SE isn't obligated to include male mithra. Sure I feel bad for the guys who want to be a male mithra but there are other races to choose from that you can make similar to male mithra minus the tail. And I believe there was an earlier quote saying something that there are "few male miqo'te". I'm not expecting anymore races really but hopefully the customization is so diverse that we can make our characters look very unique that we'll forget about including anymore races.

Personally for me, it's hard enough choosing a race. Last time I was hume, but I want to be a Roegadyn now. Not sure what I want to do really but from my experience, galka players in ffxi were the friendliest, coolest people I knew.

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 9:58pm by EpedemicOptikz
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#35 Aug 06 2009 at 5:21 PM Rating: Decent
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They made this game to generate more money for their company bottom line. They are a business and last time I checked in order to keep loyal customers is to give them what they want. The old saying "The customer is always right" was made for the purpose simply to keep customers coming back . Now straight from one of the many customers that want a male version "People have been BEGGING Square Enix to add Male Mithra, and wanted them, for a long long time, many people. Many guys wanted a more "feminine" race to play. Many guys love the look and feel of Mithra (Cat Like Race) but wanted to actually play as a guy. " and he is not the only one thousands of people would like to have the option even myself. There are even thousands of forums on this site expressing the same thing. So SE PAY ATTENTION give your loyal customers what "they" want and far as the folk lore behind the races I can kinda/ slightly see why there wasn't any in FFXI but Now? No REASON none Give them what they want.


Edited, Aug 6th 2009 6:26pm by Ruam
#36 Aug 06 2009 at 5:33 PM Rating: Decent
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@gaxe: I guess you missed the point. It's not just 'i want a male version!', it's also because there's no reason NOT to have one. It's bad enough they copy and pasted the races but to also exclude the SAME genders on each race is really annoying.

Also, a person's character is very important. Don't tell me to "just customize another character. You won't have a tail or ears or be a Miqo'te in anyway but AT LEAST you'll be a male so BE GRATEFUL". Wtf? Well, THANKS for letting me know i can be ANOTHER COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MALE RACE. I mean... wow, use your brain much?

I don't understand the people who think that we, the players, should be grateful anything SE deems necessary for us. lolwut? Last time i checked, this game was made for us. Last time i checked, this game was made to make money. How will SE make money, you ask?
By giving us the **** we ask for. (AKA the stuff we GROVEL for over a period of years. In this case... 7 years of asking for a male cats.)
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"Crab, Beetle, Crawler, Crab, Beetle, Crawler, Crab, Crab, Crab, the odd Bat or Worm, Crab. All the time Crab... Thickshell, Steelshell, Snipper, Bigclaw, Rock Crab, Robber Crab. Enough with the **** Crab." -Diamondis

Yay!
#37 Aug 06 2009 at 5:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Nicely put Carbi :)
#38 Aug 06 2009 at 7:46 PM Rating: Default
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Trust the furry fanboys to be whining about not being able to be a cat boy. Here's my deal: if you plan on playing an MMO when your primary concern is that your avatar has junk in his front and not in her trunk then you need to step back and re-examine why you want to play that game to begin with.

I personally loved that Galka and Mithra had no counterpart as I feel like, as has been said, it made them genuinely unique. I know I shouldn't be surprised, but I can't help but be disappointed that this is going to be one of the most hotly debated topics this week.

IMO: No to male cat people.
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#39 Aug 06 2009 at 7:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think being forced to play a girl Mithra in XI made me gender confused.

Can I sue SE for damages?
#40 Aug 06 2009 at 7:53 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm also voting for a different name because I keep reading the race name as "Mojito."
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#41 Aug 06 2009 at 8:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Trust the furry fanboys to be whining about not being able to be a cat boy. Here's my deal: if you plan on playing an MMO when your primary concern is that your avatar has junk in his front and not in her trunk then you need to step back and re-examine why you want to play that game to begin with.


Or if your female...?

I don't know why I have to keep reminding folks there are in fact two genders during discussions about wanting to play two genders.

Quote:

I personally loved that Galka and Mithra had no counterpart as I feel like, as has been said, it made them genuinely unique.


You know what would have been genuinely unique? Actually making 5 new races that weren't homogenized clones of the already perennially rehashed gnome/elf/human trope seen in RPGs since the dawn of time.

I think the words "genuinely unique" isn't an accurate way to describe FFXIV's races in any way shape or form. And "genuinely unique in a way that is precisely the same as the previous game" is complete nonsense.



Edited, Aug 7th 2009 12:47am by Zemzelette
#42 Aug 06 2009 at 8:24 PM Rating: Default
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Why are you even dignifying the new names for FFXI races? Call them what they are: hume-nosed mithra.
#43 Aug 06 2009 at 8:37 PM Rating: Decent
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lolgaxe wrote:
It is being made because FFXI made them a lot of money. That's all.


And I'm the Naive one? Surely you're kidding. Do you see a WoW 2.0? No? Really? Why not? Not trying to bring up the FFXI vs. WoW thing, but Square Enix said their own **** selves "We want a MMORPG that will act as a new flagship to our MMORPG department". Guess what smart guy, if FFXI had 10,000,000 people instead of 500,000 they wouldn't be saying this. Guess why there's 500,000 and not 10,000,000? Is it because of the graphics? No, FFXI is beautiful. What about the stories? No, FFXI has amazing stories. What about the style and feel? No, people love that about FFXI.

It's because there are things that they themselves have said would be hard to overhaul, redo, customize and add, because of a whole slew of reasons. If you're going to tell me FFXI is not flawed in many ways, being the great game it is of course, I'll laugh you right out of the bank, because I don't think too many people would agree with you there.

That's why they are making a more user friendly game. One you can accomplish things in a hour or two a day in, not weekly events taking 5+ hours each, not feeling the need to be on 10 hours a day, that WAS one of FFXI's drawbacks, and that's WHY they are making FFXIV. To recreate the things they have wanted to do, or things they thought would react differently when they first introduced them.

And yet you call me Naive...

lolgaxe wrote:
"Wow, people care that their cat person has a *****."


I guess an avatar, and being able to be familiar to it, and relate to it and it's personality is pretty **** important to people, can't you see that by now? Thank you for dumbing it down though.

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 9:43pm by EndlessJourney
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#44 Aug 06 2009 at 8:44 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not even sure why we're dignifying them as races, particularly.

They've gone too far with the homogenization of the character design. It all just blends together too much, a Roegadyn is like a body builder Hyuran, Lalafell are like children Elzen. I could understand clinging so desperately to FFXI's races if they had explored new and interesting character designs that were wildly popular and redefined the genre. But it's all just the same song and dance we've been seeing since Dungeons & Dragons.

4 out of FFXIV's 5 races can be reasonably facsimiled with the array of character creation options available in Aion's one race.

That's just dissapointing.


Edited, Aug 7th 2009 12:49am by Zemzelette
#45 Aug 06 2009 at 9:51 PM Rating: Good
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Wow...

I'm glad SE doesn't listen to every little faction in their playerbase, even the hysterically vocal ones.

If they did their games would be plagued by everything from Chocotaurs to Baconmages.

I was disappointed (though not surprised) that no new races will be added to FFXIV, but it's not something that will keep me from playing the game...
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#46 Aug 06 2009 at 10:01 PM Rating: Good
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And I'm the Naive one? Surely you're kidding. Do you see a WoW 2.0? No? Really? Why not?

PC doesn't have limitations.
#47 Aug 06 2009 at 10:13 PM Rating: Decent
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As far as I'm concerned; It's less a call for greater character variety and more a test of customer service.


It's both for me. It does not bode well for SE if they snub the player base of something they so audibly clamor for.

SE does not know best. The customers know best. What SE should worry about is pleasing people the best they can. When a majority of players want something and the resistance to the idea is minor, you do it if it's at all feasible.

When it's completely feasible, a large % of players want it, and you don't do it, that's a pretty outright admission that you don't value player feedback.

But that aside, it's going to be laaaaaaaaaame if they don't add any new races. ****, it will be lame if they only add one. I'm already not especially keen on the way they've described the gameplay, and objectively I have doubts about how it will be received based on what we've seen so far. It seems to be unintuitively different, which is not a compliment. Anyway, point being, when you're taking a chance with innovation, maybe it's wise to rack up some easy fan points.

Quote:
I'm glad SE doesn't listen to every little faction in their playerbase, even the hysterically vocal ones.


lol @ "little faction"

Even 10% is by no means a little faction. 10% is greater than all the players who played the Galka race. 10% is a huge amount of money to the executives. 10% are tens of thousands of players.

The group of people that want male Mithra is significantly larger than 10%.

The fact is, when you as a business can write off 10% of your customers so easily when they ask for so little, it doesn't just happen once. It happens many times over, and then you end up losing more than a fraction of that 10%. You fail to generate hype. And then in the long run you lose as many as 100%+ customers.

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 11:21pm by Kachi
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#48 Aug 06 2009 at 10:43 PM Rating: Good
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Kachi wrote:
Quote:
I'm glad SE doesn't listen to every little faction in their playerbase, even the hysterically vocal ones.


lol @ "little faction"

Even 10% is by no means a little faction. 10% is greater than all the players who played the Galka race. 10% is a huge amount of money to the executives. 10% are tens of thousands of players.

The group of people that want male Mithra is significantly larger than 10%.

The fact is, when you as a business can write off 10% of your customers so easily when they ask for so little, it doesn't just happen once. It happens many times over, and then you end up losing more than a fraction of that 10%. You fail to generate hype. And then in the long run you lose as many as 100%+ customers.


Yes, this is absolutely true. The only valid argument against having them I've heard, is that then there wouldn't be a Female Only race to counteract the Male Only Roegadyn race. There are two VERY simple solutions. Add Female Roegadyn (Could be done VERY easily. Look at ancient romans and greeks, the men were huge and masculine while the women were tall and beautiful) or simply add a NEW Female Only race (I've always said it could be along the lines of a Gria/Pixie type race), then you could be killing three birds with one stone. Adding a NEW race, for people to witness a new race being added, adding Male Mithra, as more or less a new type of race being playable and counteracting the Galka Problem.

One way or another, there's some pretty simple solutions to that problem.

To get back on topic though, I was reading further into something. A translation the other day by some one on BlueGartr noted that the magazine articles in Famitsu said that the Male Miqo'Te are EXTREMELY rare. I had a friend of mine who is Japanese translate it for me, and read another translate. Both said the same thing "Miqo'Te are very rare" it no where specified "men" or "males". That was yesterday, then today the site gets updated, with the following information under the Miqo'Te description:

"Comparatively few in number, they maintain and insular group mentality, tending to avoid contact with other races. Many individuals lead isolated lifestyles, even when residing in the more populous cities"

That is at least something to go off of, this coupled with the other quote about the Sunseekers and Moonseekers being very different from each other, could possibly be referring to the Male and Female aspects of the race. Or it could be just referring to different clans like the Hyur and Roegadyn.

I know at this point I'm very discouraged and worried. I hoped so badly, and worried so much. We were hinted to in several ways that we would see Male Mithra, and it has been such a big demand that I assumed it would surely come to be. However, it's a more blurry outcome at the moment.

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 11:46pm by EndlessJourney
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#49 Aug 06 2009 at 11:02 PM Rating: Decent
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I did take notice of the lack of mention that males were rare in the teaser site. That's a small relief.

Personally I would rather there just be female Galka and they stick with keeping M/F options for all races. Female Galka is one thing-- Galka didn't have a lot of appeal even to its target demographic (males), and of course the demand for females is even less. Based on how most people envision a female Galka, you'd be looking probably at 1% or less of the player base choosing it. Some good concept art could swiftly change that.

But my point is that adding a new female only race would probably not solve anything. If you add female only Gria, that's going to receive just as much or more clamor for a male Gria option. I mean, you're talking about cat people vs. DRAGON people.

See, Girlkas are the exception to demand because Galkas are not very visually appealing. Any female race will be aesthetically pleasing, and that is going to cause ideas for a desirable male counterpart to be generated very quickly. Make an ugly male race, and people are less quick to try to figure out a hawt female counterpart. Make a female race ugly or not, and it can be easily turned into a male.

Of course this principle is due in part to the fact that there are no women on the internet.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#50 Aug 06 2009 at 11:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Kachi wrote:
I did take notice of the lack of mention that males were rare in the teaser site. That's a small relief.

Personally I would rather there just be female Galka and they stick with keeping M/F options for all races. Female Galka is one thing-- Galka didn't have a lot of appeal even to its target demographic (males), and of course the demand for females is even less. Based on how most people envision a female Galka, you'd be looking probably at 1% or less of the player base choosing it. Some good concept art could swiftly change that.

But my point is that adding a new female only race would probably not solve anything. If you add female only Gria, that's going to receive just as much or more clamor for a male Gria option. I mean, you're talking about cat people vs. DRAGON people.

See, Girlkas are the exception to demand because Galkas are not very visually appealing. Any female race will be aesthetically pleasing, and that is going to cause ideas for a desirable male counterpart to be generated very quickly. Make an ugly male race, and people are less quick to try to figure out a hawt female counterpart. Make a female race ugly or not, and it can be easily turned into a male.

Of course this principle is due in part to the fact that there are no women on the internet.


You know, I'm not even a artist and I can imagine up how Female Roegadyn could look really cool. I mean, they are more dignified looking than Galka were, it would certainly be a lot easier to implement Female Roegadyn than it would be Female Galka. Even that being said, I've seen some pretty cool looking Female Galka Concept art before. Not the funny stuff, but serious stuff.

In a perfect world, Square Enix would add Female Galka, Male Mithra, and at least one new race all together.

Edited, Aug 7th 2009 12:16am by EndlessJourney
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#51 Aug 06 2009 at 11:27 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, I could too, but most people just slap some tits and lipstick on a dude. Then if it's not halfway ********* they write it off as a lost cause.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
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