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Measures, whips, and bells. Oh my!Follow

#1 Aug 26 2009 at 3:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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With "jobs" being defined by the weapon your character is using lets move past the obvious sword=warrior and staff=mage comparisons and think of what unusual weapons could be used by a job. For instance measures were used in FFXII to buff your characters (albeit by hitting them with it), Whips were the weapon of choice for tamers (think beastmaster) in FFV, and bells have been used by geomancers in several FF games.

What other job/weapon comparisons are there beyond the obvious?
#2 Aug 26 2009 at 4:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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I hope weapons confer bonuses beyond simple melee damage. As you mentioned Measures were used in a form of buff giving on strike-- It'd be nice if Whips were in game and slowed/tripped mobs up in terms of a random proc'd debuff or something. Lances I hope have a longer melee range, Two Handed Axes maybe can ignore a portion of blocking defences by mobs, Two Handed Swords could have a shield-like blocking effect to a much lesser effect of an actual shield.

Bells should be reserved for 5 years time, when the devs are scratching their heads for content.
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#3 Aug 26 2009 at 4:40 AM Rating: Good
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:O

But I want bells now...
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#4 Aug 26 2009 at 4:48 AM Rating: Good
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Bells for geomancers would be pretty awesome, especially if it rang every time you smacked a mob with it.
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#5 Aug 26 2009 at 5:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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For some reason, I thought this was a topic about wanting a new BDSM job.
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#6 Aug 26 2009 at 5:44 AM Rating: Excellent
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Karelyn wrote:
For some reason, I thought this was a topic about wanting a new BDSM job.
SE already said there currently aren't any "pet" jobs! :P
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#7 Aug 26 2009 at 7:17 AM Rating: Decent
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shintasama wrote:
SE already said there currently aren't any "pet" jobs! :P

Wait, really they did?

o.o;

No BST or DRG or SUM?

:(

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 11:17am by Karelyn
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#8 Aug 26 2009 at 7:18 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
obvious sword=warrior


Not so obvious. It wasn't in FFXI...
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#9 Aug 26 2009 at 7:45 AM Rating: Good
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Regardless of how they implement weapons, I'm holding out hope we'll have more than a right and left hand to customize. The insinuation that changing your weapon swaps all your visible gear is disheartening. I like the idea of rings and such to offer stat bonuses. Of course, this might have the benefit of eliminating Elvaans in subligars...hmmm.

Though, seeing the Genji Glove or Gauntlets from FF6 implemented would be kinda cool. And Dragoon Boots. And an Experience Egg. @_@ (Which would, of course, aid you in skilling up your weapon faster, as experience points are, of course an outdated, obscure concept. >_>)

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 8:59am by Greenray
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#10 Aug 26 2009 at 7:52 AM Rating: Decent
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What about the weapons which would be a little harder to figure what thier corresponding class is?

for instance.. what about other one handed weapons than the sword? What sort of class would those weapons be geared towards?

oh and... bells + geomancer = awesome
#11 Aug 26 2009 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Wait, really they did?


Actually, that was a joke that you seem to have missed.

But yes, they really did.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#12 Aug 26 2009 at 9:18 AM Rating: Good
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Tanaka/ffxicore wrote:
Q: There were many Summons in FFXI, but for an online world, I never felt there were enough. What Summons can we expect to see in FFXIV and will there be more variety than in FFXI?]

A: We can't really mention which summons will be in. But what we can say is that some is going to be really important in the storyline. It's not going to be included in the game like FFXI. At the moment we don't really have a class, a pet class / summoner. Not at the moment at least. So it will be implemented in the game in a different way. Please check back with us in the future.


Edited, Aug 26th 2009 1:19pm by shintasama
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#13 Aug 26 2009 at 10:59 AM Rating: Decent
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That quote really makes me wonder how they plan on implementing summon / pets into the game.

If there isnt a class that focuses on having a pet.. then how could they be implemented and still be, well.. significant?

All I could see is something like the summoning spells from FFT? That would be pretty dissapointing for all those who played the pet classes in FFXI...
#14 Aug 26 2009 at 11:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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If we're talking about Summoners... It's actually an incredibly recent trend for Summons to be equated with Pets. I cannot speak for all of the Final Fantasy series, having only played 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 10-2, 11, and 12 myself, but as a trend, only 10 and maybe 12 (honestly this game left so little impression on me, I cannot recall even though I played it most recently) had controllable Summons. 10-2 Did not even contain a Summoner class(dress). It can hardly be said that there is no precedence for a Final Fantasy game with no Pet Summons or even Summoners.

On the other side of the issue, Pet jobs are a staple of almost every MMO I can think of. But does that mean it has to be so? If SE is trying to give us a robust, varied gaming experience without Pet jobs, bully for them. I hope they can do it, and I think it's very possible.

As a final note:

Quote:
That quote really makes me wonder how they plan on implementing summon / pets into the game.

If there isnt a class that focuses on having a pet.. then how could they be implemented and still be, well.. significant?


Just as SE said, they are clearly vital to the plot and world of Eorzea. Summons have played an important role as guardians and protectors in much of the Final Fantasy franchise. I'm sure we will see something similar in this game. My personal theory is that the 12 Gods mentioned that protect Eorzea are the primary Eidolons.

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 3:16pm by Hulan
#15 Aug 26 2009 at 11:22 AM Rating: Excellent
ppoponon wrote:
What about the weapons which would be a little harder to figure what thier corresponding class is?

for instance.. what about other one handed weapons than the sword? What sort of class would those weapons be geared towards?

oh and... bells + geomancer = awesome

Red Mage and Fencer in FFTA got rapiers, while other classes got other sword variations.

I could see one-handed axes being used by some kind of Viking or Berserker class.

I'd love to see Bard and/or Dancer classes get main-hand musical instruments. If Beastmasters in FFXI get to shoot hearts out of their crotch, why can't Bards attack with musical notes?
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#16 Aug 26 2009 at 11:24 AM Rating: Good
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Hulan wrote:
If we're talking about Summoners... It's actually an incredibly recent trend for Summons to be equated with Pets. I cannot speak for all of the Final Fantasy series, having only played 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 10-2, 11, and 12 myself, but as a trend, only 10 and maybe 12 (honestly this game left so little impression on me, I cannot recall even though I played it most recently) had controllable Summons.


4 had Rydia, a Caller. She could call, among others, Leviathan, Bahamut, Titan and...Chocobo.

6 had Espers, which could be called by any character equipped with them. <3 Palidor

10, of course, was all about saving the cheerleader summoner.

12 returns to the concept of Espers and names them after previous titles' bosses.

Can't speak to the others (besides 10-2), as I haven't played them. Though I'm pretty sure 13 has summons in some form.
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#17 Aug 26 2009 at 11:30 AM Rating: Good
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Greenray wrote:
Hulan wrote:
If we're talking about Summoners... It's actually an incredibly recent trend for Summons to be equated with Pets. I cannot speak for all of the Final Fantasy series, having only played 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 10-2, 11, and 12 myself, but as a trend, only 10 and maybe 12 (honestly this game left so little impression on me, I cannot recall even though I played it most recently) had controllable Summons.


4 had Rydia, a Caller. She could call, among others, Leviathan, Bahamut, Titan and...Chocobo.

6 had Espers, which could be called by any character equipped with them. <3 Palidor

10, of course, was all about saving the cheerleader summoner.

12 returns to the concept of Espers and names them after previous titles' bosses.

Can't speak to the others (besides 10-2), as I haven't played them. Though I'm pretty sure 13 has summons in some form.
4&6 treated them like "magic" rather than "pets" though
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Winston Churchill wrote:
Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things
#18 Aug 26 2009 at 11:33 AM Rating: Good
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Greenray wrote:
4 had Rydia, a Caller. She could call, among others, Leviathan, Bahamut, Titan and...Chocobo.


This reminds me of another bit o' FF4...the Fat Chocobo. It was the 16-bit precursor to the mog satchel. You'd summon it with a bit of food, and it would store extra items for you.

Seems to me I read somewhere that chocobos will appear in FFXIV, but not as we've seen them in FFXI. Could there be plans to incorporate them as pack animals?
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#19 Aug 26 2009 at 3:28 PM Rating: Decent
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Bells for geomancers would be pretty awesome, especially if it rang every time you smacked a mob with it.


I always thought it was weird for caster type classes to melee mobs with their weapons. I always wanted my staff to do a ranged magical attack that dealt the same damage as if I smacked it. Similarly, it would be cool for the bells to actually be rung and it would shoot a ranged vibration attack at the enemy dealing the damage as if it was smacked.

Not sure how hammers would work though. I guess there is nothing magical about those.

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 4:28pm by Nathanael
#20 Aug 26 2009 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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They were granted from materia in 7, and it was a job in 5. Certain characters in 9, and you assigned them in 8 somewhat like espers in 6 (though they were much more fleshed out).

Personally I'd like it if they were controllable like in X.

Edited, Aug 26th 2009 5:01pm by Kachi
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#21 Aug 27 2009 at 6:58 AM Rating: Good
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I remember there being some staves in FFVI that would sometimes cast a spell when you smacked a mob with it. Wasn't usually as powerful as the actual spell being cast, but could be useful for saving MP sometimes. One of my favorites was the Healing Staff. When you first got it (if you got it as early as possible) it was strong enough to depend on for main healing for the most part. It was fun getting to hit a party member and watch them be healed. Eventually it became out of date, though, as you gained access to better healing spells.

Edited, Aug 27th 2009 10:00am by Faldein
#22 Aug 27 2009 at 7:18 AM Rating: Good
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Faldein wrote:
One of my favorites was the Healing Staff. When you first got it (if you got it as early as possible) it was strong enough to depend on for main healing for the most part. It was fun getting to hit a party member and watch them be healed.


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#23 Aug 27 2009 at 9:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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Faldein wrote:
I remember there being some staves in FFVI that would sometimes cast a spell when you smacked a mob with it. Wasn't usually as powerful as the actual spell being cast, but could be useful for saving MP sometimes. One of my favorites was the Healing Staff. When you first got it (if you got it as early as possible) it was strong enough to depend on for main healing for the most part. It was fun getting to hit a party member and watch them be healed. Eventually it became out of date, though, as you gained access to better healing spells.

stupid holy lance curing atma >__<
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I don't believe in good guys versus bad guys anymore… I only see a plethora of states acting in self interest… with varying ethics and moral standards of course, but self-interest nonetheless
Winston Churchill wrote:
Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things
#24 Aug 27 2009 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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If they're not going to have the summons as "pets" this time, then it's possible they might have them similar to FF6's materia items. You use an item, a summon does its thing, the item disappears.
#25 Aug 27 2009 at 11:02 AM Rating: Good
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If FFXI doesn't have a Town Crier job that uses bells and fireworks and everything they say is in /shout, I'm not buying it.

Fascists.
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#26 Aug 27 2009 at 11:15 AM Rating: Good
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Iyouboushi wrote:
If they're not going to have the summons as "pets" this time, then it's possible they might have them similar to FF6's materia items. You use an item, a summon does its thing, the item disappears.


Iirc, magicite was equipped to a character, thereby allowing that character to summon the related esper for one given battle, while also gradually teaching that character abilities associated with that esper, such as Fire and Fire2 from Ifrit. However, I do also recall there was some type of special and very rare item or ability that summoned a random esper to come do its thing. And the more I think about it, the more intriguing I find the concept.

In XII, espers are locked to an individual character, require a base amount of MP to summon, but then otherwise are on a timer during which they will fight for you, and may or may not use a special move if certain conditions are met.

I could easily imagine developers implementing this using an enchanted weapon - like a staff - to allow a summon. Isn't there already some piece of equipment in XI that has a WaterSpirit enchantment or some such?
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#27 Aug 27 2009 at 12:39 PM Rating: Good
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Greenray wrote:
Iyouboushi wrote:
If they're not going to have the summons as "pets" this time, then it's possible they might have them similar to FF6's materia items. You use an item, a summon does its thing, the item disappears.


Iirc, magicite was equipped to a character, thereby allowing that character to summon the related esper for one given battle, while also gradually teaching that character abilities associated with that esper, such as Fire and Fire2 from Ifrit. However, I do also recall there was some type of special and very rare item or ability that summoned a random esper to come do its thing. And the more I think about it, the more intriguing I find the concept.

In XII, espers are locked to an individual character, require a base amount of MP to summon, but then otherwise are on a timer during which they will fight for you, and may or may not use a special move if certain conditions are met.

I could easily imagine developers implementing this using an enchanted weapon - like a staff - to allow a summon. Isn't there already some piece of equipment in XI that has a WaterSpirit enchantment or some such?
see:here


ridiculously overpriced PoS stupid ingredients
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I don't believe in good guys versus bad guys anymore… I only see a plethora of states acting in self interest… with varying ethics and moral standards of course, but self-interest nonetheless
Winston Churchill wrote:
Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things
#28 Aug 27 2009 at 1:03 PM Rating: Good
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It's been so long since I last played 6, but I could have sworn that not only could you equip an Esper to teach the characters spells and use that esper once per battle, but there was throw-away items that you could use to summon Espers as well.

I might have to go play 6 again.
#29 Aug 27 2009 at 1:11 PM Rating: Good
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Iyouboushi wrote:
It's been so long since I last played 6, but I could have sworn...there was throw-away items that you could use to summon Espers as well.


Indeed there was, and I just remembered. Generic "Magicite." Smiley: laugh

The equippable magicites were all named for their espers, but the generic ones in inventory were just useable items called magicite.
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