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Armoury System... what about the character status?Follow

#1 Sep 03 2009 at 8:12 PM Rating: Decent
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I understand about the Armoury System.

However, no one ever mentioned or ask about the character status of FFXIV. How does each character's status works? In FFXI, every character pretty much had about same stauts up untill they reach lv75 and sped their merit point on skill, stats, etc....


I wonder about the character status system....



Edited, Sep 4th 2009 12:14am by hexid
#2 Sep 03 2009 at 9:09 PM Rating: Default
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Huh?

Stats... or Status?


Stats I'm not concerned with. That's easy to work out. What worries me a bit is grouping and finding players with certain level of abilities.

Since there are no levels (technically there is though with skill levels) how would you go about forming a group of players together to tackle an event?

I mean I understand they want to do away with level gap penalties yadda yadda, but I wouldn't want to go exploring a dangerous dungeon with a healer who only has basic cure skills and delve into an adventure that is way over their head getting us all killed.

With a new system comes a drastic change to the way we think about an MMO. In every mmo you can just look at someones level and know IMMEDIATELY where they are and what they should be able to do. Now we have to ask "Great Axe skill level?" "What abilities do you have?" "What other skill levels do you posess?" "Do you have a discipline of hand leveled?" (that's crafting) "What weapons can you use?"

It's not a hassle at all, but without being able to just /sea all for an ability level or even to readily see an ability level you will no doubt have people lying so they can leech, or get better stuff, etc.

It's a concern I have, but I feel confident with everything I've seen so far. I'm not afraid of change anymore.
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#3 Sep 03 2009 at 9:38 PM Rating: Decent
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Louiscool: This post isn't specifically against you but I see many people posting things like you just did as if SE doesn't think of this stuff. Do you really think they will not address something like this before the game is released? I'm sure they'll have a system in place where you can pick and choose players with certain classes and certain skills (i doubt it would get to the point where you'd have to ask for specific skills the character uses, that's based on their preference and will dictate whether they are good or bad players, atleast in your (or my) opinion). I think.....well i think with every post i type up i can't wait to play this game more and more.
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#4 Sep 03 2009 at 9:48 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:
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I see many people posting things like you just did as if SE doesn't think of this stuff.
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many people posting things like you just did as if SE doesn't think of this stuff.
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you just did as if SE doesn't think of this stuff.
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as if SE doesn't think of this stuff.
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SE doesn't think of this stuff.
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SE doesn't think
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#5 Sep 04 2009 at 12:09 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:

SE doesn't think



lawlz XD

Edited, Sep 4th 2009 4:09am by mithrandrk
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#6 Sep 04 2009 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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I think the idea that there aren't "levels" is being overblown a bit. There aren't "total job levels" but there are "skill" levels. I would assume that searching for players to form a group in FFXIV would be much like searching for a specific job and level in FFXI. You'd just substitute the specific job with the specific skill you're looking for.

So instead of /sea all PLD 43-46, you'd have something like /sea all Sword 100-125(or whatever)
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#7 Sep 04 2009 at 10:55 AM Rating: Decent
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You would encounter a problem doing a /sea for weapon skills due to classes sharing weapons and customization. You couldn't really assume based on the weapon they are using that they have the abilities that you are looking for.

The developers said in interviews that there would be more incentives to do quests with the same people. You also do not need large parties and there's no lvl gap penalties.

So I think in this game we will have to look more to our linkshell and friends to complete guildleves since we would know what they are leveling.
#8 Sep 04 2009 at 12:59 PM Rating: Decent
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While I can't say one way or the other if finding party members will be as easy as /sea, I can draw from my experiance with UO.

There was one great way to figure out what other players had for skills, Talking to them :P

Seriously though, if nothing else one can always ask in general chat if any gladiators of at least X-skill are up for Y-leve. *shrug* you might not get in touch with people at differant cities that way but they are probably doing differant leves anyway.
Most group activities in UO ended up being something done with close friends or guild members though.
#9 Sep 04 2009 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
You would encounter a problem doing a /sea for weapon skills due to classes sharing weapons and customization. You couldn't really assume based on the weapon they are using that they have the abilities that you are looking for.
I don't see why. If the weapon type you're using determines your job, as we already know, all you have to do is replace the Job Name with the Weapon Type, and the Job Level with the Weapon Skill Level, and you get the same results. The fact that jobs don't have "levels" is really not true. It's just weapon skill levels.

In fact, what I see happening in FFXIV is the playerbase defining job levels through skill levels. So if every weapon caps at say, 300, then there are 300 levels. For instance, if a Gladiator is the only class that can use "X Sword Type" and you have "X Sword Type" level 257, you have a level 257 Gladiator.
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#10 Sep 04 2009 at 3:33 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't see why. If the weapon type you're using determines your job, as we already know, all you have to do is replace the Job Name with the Weapon Type, and the Job Level with the Weapon Skill Level, and you get the same results. The fact that jobs don't have "levels" is really not true. It's just weapon skill levels.

In fact, what I see happening in FFXIV is the playerbase defining job levels through skill levels. So if every weapon caps at say, 300, then there are 300 levels. For instance, if a Gladiator is the only class that can use "X Sword Type" and you have "X Sword Type" level 257, you have a level 257 Gladiator.


Like I said,some jobs will share weapons. A "Black Mage", "White Mage", and "Summoner" may all use staff. So if you do a search for "Staff", that alone doesn't tell you what class they are playing. You would have to inquire further.

It also seems you may have more freedom to customize your character. Someone you has Sword equipped may be learning abilities to make him more offensive or defensive, maybe he is learning magic too.

The easiest way to form a party seems to be to invite people you already know. They have already said that there will be benefits for playing with the same people. Being able to keep your FFXI name also seems to indicate that they want your friends and linkshell from XI to join you in the new game.
#11 Sep 04 2009 at 9:52 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:

Like I said,some jobs will share weapons. A "Black Mage", "White Mage", and "Summoner" may all use staff. So if you do a search for "Staff", that alone doesn't tell you what class they are playing. You would have to inquire further.
How? They've already told us that the type of weapon you're using will determine your job. You can't be 3 at once, so there's going to have to be some distinguishing factor for every weapon.
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#12 Sep 04 2009 at 11:41 PM Rating: Default
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No, they told us the weapon you choose will determine your disciple, different classes fall under the same disciple and only the skills you choose to learn will determine what job you become. Atleast that's how i understood it. Meaning if I equip any of the following: sword, axe, katana, great sword, great axe, scythe, spear, etc. I would be in the disciple of war category, but depending on whether i decide to learn white magic or black magic to go along with that sword and shiled of mine or that scythe of mine will determine whether i'm considered a paladin or a dark knight.
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#13 Sep 04 2009 at 11:55 PM Rating: Decent
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Hmm... wonder how players will gain stats..

lv5 sword skill = +2STR +2DEX +2VIT or will players gain stats from guild leves...

if players gain stats with guild leves then a crafter can pickup a new weapon and skill it easy and that would work with what they said about char can grow without fighting a monster.

like Blacksmith Guild leve quest= +4 STR +4 VIT for complete and some craft skill.
#14 Sep 05 2009 at 4:25 AM Rating: Decent
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No, they told us the weapon you choose will determine your disciple, different classes fall under the same disciple and only the skills you choose to learn will determine what job you become.


There are multiple disciplines but within each discipline is a class which is determined by the weapon that you choose. The best example of this so far is with the Disciple of War(DoW). So far in this discipline we know there to be 4 seperate classes; Gladiator (sword and board); Marauder (Great Axe); Archer (Bow and Arrow); Pugilist (Hand-to-Hand). Each class learns specific skills. Weather some of these transfer between classes has yet to be seen. Also, for all we know, you have to be of the Disciple of Magic(DoM) only to learn magic. We don't know enough yet to know if there will be magical skills that a DoW class can learn and use. I would imagine that like the DoW the DoM has various classes that one can be depending on the staff, wand, orb, or whatever SE gives them.

I would imagine, that as for /sea, that we'll be able to search for a certain class and just use skill level numbers after it to try and find what we want. Perhaps like a variation of the quote below.

Quote:
In fact, what I see happening in FFXIV is the playerbase defining job levels through skill levels. So if every weapon caps at say, 300, then there are 300 levels. For instance, if a Gladiator is the only class that can use "X Sword Type" and you have "X Sword Type" level 257, you have a level 257 Gladiator.
#15 Sep 05 2009 at 7:40 AM Rating: Decent
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Hmm... wonder how players will gain stats..



that's why I put this post.
I'm really curious about gaining stats.
The reason why is it makes the characteristic of each character.
Morever, not only skill lv, but also shouldn't we care about the character's
stats before forming a party as well?
#16 Sep 05 2009 at 2:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
that's why I put this post.
I'm really curious about gaining stats.
The reason why is it makes the characteristic of each character.
Morever, not only skill lv, but also shouldn't we care about the character's
stats before forming a party as well?



that's the problem with asking question that do not have solid answers yet.. you get a lot of mixed responses. all you can do is wait and wonder like the rest of us
#17 Sep 05 2009 at 3:09 PM Rating: Good
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I think SE's focus is going to be on more casual grouping. i.e., partying with people that you want to party with, rather than searching for people with the right stats/skills. Progression may be somewhat downplayed in exchange for more strategic battles.
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#18 Sep 06 2009 at 6:34 PM Rating: Good
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There are multiple disciplines but within each discipline is a class which is determined by the weapon that you choose. The best example of this so far is with the Disciple of War(DoW). So far in this discipline we know there to be 4 seperate classes; Gladiator (sword and board); Marauder (Great Axe); Archer (Bow and Arrow); Pugilist (Hand-to-Hand).


Exactly.
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#19 Sep 06 2009 at 8:58 PM Rating: Decent
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I think SE's focus is going to be on more casual grouping. i.e., partying with people that you want to party with, rather than searching for people with the right stats/skills. Progression may be somewhat downplayed in exchange for more strategic battles.


I love that idea, especially since it seems to have a whole new twist on the term 'casual'.

It is casual in that you can play with whom you like, and don't need to find specific roles, but it seems so much more hardcore in that battles will require strategy on behalf of the players.

I still think you will be searching for players with the right skills though, just not in the same manner that we usually think of MMOs.

Imagine a FFXI where instead of being laughed at for taking War/Whm, a party encourages you to take it because you have healing abilities from leveling whm that can sustain the party. You don't sacrifice stats in order to do this, you sacrifice your ability slots. You lose your provoke, but you gain cure II. And you still get to skill up that big axe.

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#20 Sep 08 2009 at 3:53 PM Rating: Decent
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If you mean by starting stats by each race, if I remember SE had stated that no race will differ from the other. So in essance a Roegadyn can be a mage and a Lalafell can be a warrior or gladior without any race penalties. So we can choose any race and be any job without worry. Yay ^_^
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#21 Sep 08 2009 at 4:48 PM Rating: Decent
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I see a simple solution to this.

Search for one skill, search for another skill within that skills search results, than for another skill in that skills search result and so on.

Easy really.
#22 Sep 09 2009 at 2:50 AM Rating: Decent
You know, ever since I heard the leveling system was abolished, I have been pretty skeptical. I've had this fear that it would be something like guildwars; where there was only 20 levels. But after reading this thread, I feel a little more positive. I hope what you're all talking about is right. If it is, we'll never have to worry about having a skill underleveled, because the skill will define the level.

Also, mages in XI had access to wands, clubs, poles and staffs, maybe there will be a bigger distinction in XIV? But, swords and daggers are shared by different jobs too. In XI, BLU had a different style sword than paladin did. Just like RDM was more of a flourette style sword wielder. PS2 limitations made it so they couldnt just come up with different weapon types, they just had to wrap it into one 'sword' class, and change it visually. Maybe XIV will tackle that problem, and make the different sword styles = different jobs. But what does that mean for those FFXI Rangers? Will they have to decide between bow/crossbow/gun? Is archer bow only? Will samarai be restricted to Great katana? no more archery or polearm for SAM's?

I love FF's job system, I'll always play their MMO's if they have some sort of job system. But a job being restricted to one weapon kinda bums me out. Thiefs with no crossbow? Red mage with sword, but no dagger or staff? I'm really impatient to hear more info.

Its like getting a call from the hospital... "Hello, is this _____? Theres been an accident, you.... oh, I'll call you back." *click*

aarrggggg
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#23 Sep 09 2009 at 8:21 AM Rating: Decent
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I think SE want's us to be less concerned about your actual designation, and focus more on yourself as an individual character with a custom skillset. In other words, it's not about inviting the THF, it's about inviting the guy who can pull well and do damage while staying out of the way. What matters is if they can DO the job, not if they labeled a certain way.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the fact that you'll have to converse a lot more to get a feel for who you'll party with. We all know blind invites were frowned upon in FFXI, and this system looks to make that even more evident.
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#24 Sep 09 2009 at 8:33 AM Rating: Decent
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But what does that mean for those FFXI Rangers? Will they have to decide between bow/crossbow/gun? Is archer bow only?


Yea I believe Archer will be bow only. If there are guns in 14 and you equip one that would probably make you a Marksman. But it may be possible to learn abilities from another class, so you could learn bow and gun but couldn't master both.

I think that there may be sub categories within the disciplines that are "related" or next to each other on a grid. So it would be easy to swap abilities with a class you have something in common with rather than a class on the other side of the grid.
#25 Sep 09 2009 at 7:25 PM Rating: Good
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It's possible that bow and crossbow may share the same skill, while something like corsair would get the guns.
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