Hmmm . . . perhaps you could point out where Setzer's random abilities buffed party members?
Perhaps you could point out where Setzer used guns?
Perhaps you could point out where Setzer could strengthen enfeebles currently on the mob?
Stylistically, COR and Gambler are very similar. Functionally, they have huge differences.
Setzer's slots did have random effects that could heal the party of HP/status, and could randomly summon espers that could cast buffs. Is it exactly the same? No, but I'm sure a part of the design decision was in creating a job that filled a needed role. The game didn't need more damage dealing jobs, but it suffered from a lack of support roles.
Setzer didn't use guns, but he did use Cards.
Of course the functions are very different. We're comparing a character in a single offline RPG from over a decade ago to a job added late in the development of an MMO. I'm only noting the stylistic similarities-- Setzer has been traditionally considered a "gambler," and what job is like a gambler? Probably the one that uses cards and essentially requires one to try their luck at Blackjack to be effective.
I'm baffled how you can accept how aspects of Setzer's Gambler were adapted
into how COR currently functions, but continue to be willfully blind to the parallels between PUP and Mime.
Sure, I totally see how Setzer and COR are related, even though it's not a direct 100% translation.
Guess what? I'm not claiming PUP is a 100% Mime translation either!
As for PUP, you're not convincing me. A hybrid is not a Mime. You can perform a single role any time you want to. A Mime can only perform the roles of members in the party.
Please point out why an alternate
Mime incarnation couldn't copy available jobs.
A Mime is not necessarily a hybrid job, a PUP is.
A) The whole point to every Mime I've ever played in a Final Fantasy game was to gather together varied abilities to one character. Like with Gogo, I could use Magic, Tools, AND Blitzes! If that's not being hybrid, I don't know what is. Plus, you could mime attack actions of your allies, you could mime defensive actions, and you could mime healing actions. How is the capacity to do all those not count as Hybrid?
B) PUP frequently specializes. In fact, that's the most effective way to play the job. In situations where the BLM puppet shines, the master's physical dmg is typcially useless. In situations where you need a physical DD puppet, the master is going to be up fighting right along with it. There are only a couple examples of situations where the master and the puppet have different focuses.
Regardless, PUP is free to specialize or hybridize as it sees fit. Perhaps if you actually played the job you would understand how it works.
Mimes can't melee like PUPs, either.
And Setzer can't shoot guns like COR can, yet they're still considered incarnations of the same job, right? Edit
: Furthermore, after looking up the FFT version of Mime, it appears that one of their innate abilities is Brawler, which increases abilities of H2H fighting. So right there you're wrong- even the one Mime incarnation you're basing your stance off of specializes in H2H fighting, just like PUP does.
A Mime can be like 5 jobs at one time-- it doesn't change equipment to change its role, but party members.
I really don't understand why you're being so closed minded about this. Gogo wasn't reliant on the other 3 party members for his ability slots. In both PUP and the traditional Mime, and even Gogo, there are limitations set in place as to how many things you can actually mimic. Why is a difference in the limitation factor automatically rule out the resemblence between the jobs?
And a Mime can't change their role like a PUP can.
Wait, a Mime can't choose to stop mimicing an attacker and start mimicing the healer? That doesn't make any sense at all. Are you sure you know what Mimes do?
A Mime's role is pretty much fixed based on what's in the party, whereas a PUP can act independently of the party.
Yet another example where, for some reason, you refuse to entertain the idea that the classic Mime template can be adapted in different ways.
I really don't think there's anything particularly Mime-like about PUP. They are completely different jobs with only very small stylistic similarities. Functionally there is a big difference between being a jack-of-all-trades-that-are-present-in-the-current-party, and someone who can change to any role they want to.
Wait, what's the funcional difference between having access to the abilities of many other jobs and having access to the abilities of many other jobs again? Oh, one is limited to what abilities they're equipped with, like Gogo, while the other is limited to the abilities used by other characters in the party?
Seriously, what idea of Mime are you basing your closed minded view from?
I've already talked about Gogo from FFVI.
The Mime in FFV had the mimic command, but also was able to 'equip' abilities from other jobs.
And then, of course, is the FFTactics Mime, which seems to be the one you're referring to.
Well, let's see, 2/3 times Mime has appeared as a seperate class in a Final Fantasy game (and not just a command), it has NOT
been limited to only doing what others in the party do. In 2/3 specific Mime incarnations, the Mime is able to EQUIP
the special abilities of other jobs regardless of whether they were fighting alongside the Mime or not.
I seriously think it's time for you to re-evaluate what the "traditional" FF Mime is really like. Edited, Oct 14th 2009 4:25pm by CireXF