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#1 Nov 21 2009 at 11:54 AM Rating: Good
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Anyone hoping we finally get sheaths this time? I remember it being requested quite heavily in FFXI. The only way we could get them was giving Humes the Tenzen weapon through DAT edits but hopefully we won't have to do that this time around.

And for the people who don't want sheaths(don't really know why unless weak computer), there could be an option to toggle them on and off. ;)
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#2 Nov 21 2009 at 1:35 PM Rating: Good
I want a sheath that looks like those insulated tubes that holds a six-pack of beer/soda cans.
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#3 Nov 21 2009 at 1:52 PM Rating: Decent
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call me stupid but what is a sheath ^^
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#4 Nov 21 2009 at 2:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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Tazblackferret wrote:
call me stupid but what is a sheath ^^

Ok stupid (couldn't resist), check Here.
Basically, its rather unsafe to run around with a naked blade on your thigh/back. So it would be more realistic to cover that sharp edge with something then to run around with it flapping around.

edited for engrish

Edited, Nov 21st 2009 12:17pm by Demonye
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#5 Nov 21 2009 at 2:21 PM Rating: Decent
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i never really paid attention to what they were lol
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#6 Nov 21 2009 at 3:29 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, I can't honestly say I'd given it much thought either.

How does one sheath a great axe? Or like, a greatsword? That'd have to be one huge, unwieldy ************.
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#7 Nov 21 2009 at 8:25 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
How does one sheath a great axe? Or like, a greatsword?


If I'm not mistaken, things of that nature where usually wrapped in a thick cloth/and or leather.

On topic, it bothered the **** out of me that they never had it. I always found it odd that people would run around without covering a sharp blade.
#8 Nov 21 2009 at 9:21 PM Rating: Good
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I've always thought that a sheath should be included as an equipment slot. Having them with effects like enpoison or something.
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#9 Nov 21 2009 at 11:10 PM Rating: Decent
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dont ever run without a over a blade when its dangling on your side. Stupidity took hold of me and I did this and stabbed half an inch into my leg/foot area >.>; Never again, im not even sure why it really happened, besides that I jumped and when I landed I stabbed myself
#10 Nov 22 2009 at 1:45 AM Rating: Good
The One and Only Deadgye wrote:
I've always thought that a sheath should be included as an equipment slot. Having them with effects like enpoison or something.


I think that would be pretty neat. Maybe two-handed weapons would take the sheath and both hand slots, 1-h weapons would not, so you could use an off-hand weapon or shield and the sheath. (2h weapons don't go on the side anyways).

Maybe you could even wield some sheaths like a defensive parrying tool. Samurai could have the quick draw talent for various opening moves.
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#11 Nov 22 2009 at 5:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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Creating sheathes for weapons, especially those pretty and elaborate in the fantasy genre, is a graphical nightmare. Adding them means animations will need to be custom tailored to drawing them properly to avoid clipping (of both the weapon and other gear), while putting the weapon away can't become some kind of arduous task that has you locked down between fights.

The functional purpose of sheathes isn't exactly a requirement in a fantasy world, either. Protection from rust and wear along with basically having the weapon in safety mode is why one would have a sheath. Certainly a subslot option could be had where maybe durability loss is lessened or other beneficial effects, but keep in mind sheathes can also come with negatives such as your weapon getting stuck inside in cold weather or a clever opponent being able to keep you from drawing your blade.
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#12 Nov 22 2009 at 7:15 AM Rating: Default
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I kinda find it hard thinking back that I never noticed weapons in XI floated.
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#13 Nov 22 2009 at 11:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'd rather see my character pull his gigantic 2 handed sword from his tiny backpack. It'll give the monster a good "wtf" moment.
#14 Nov 22 2009 at 1:39 PM Rating: Decent
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allways wounder why they never added them, axes come with a clip on type of sheath, i think swords and short blades are teh only weapon that has a sheath. I would like to see them add it to ffxiv woudl be something you have never seen done in a mmorpg. adding it as a subslot for a weapon could give an extra slot to add status to.
and you can use your seath as a weapon if its a hard one block perry then swing with your sword
#15 Nov 22 2009 at 4:59 PM Rating: Decent
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I think including sheathes depends on what style SE takes when designing weapons. As far as FFXI is concerned most, if not all, weapons were 'sheathable'. If they choose to go the more artsy route (take a look at some of the WoW weapons) sheathes would become a graphical nightmare. If you like the look of your sword, why cover it out of battle (where you spend most of your time)? An on/off toggle would be great, but it still depends on how SE designs weapons. I prefered the FFXI style, simple and not too over-the-top. Sheathes as additional equipment slots would be great, similar to the grips that were eventually added to FFXI.
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#16 Nov 22 2009 at 5:16 PM Rating: Good
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Zackary wrote:
Yeah, I can't honestly say I'd given it much thought either.

How does one sheath a great axe? Or like, a greatsword? That'd have to be one huge, unwieldy mother@#%^er.
2h axe sheath Traditional 2h swords used normal sheaths like 2h swords, because of weight issues no one really used ff sized "great swords" IRL (although a couple were forged), but if you look at Berserk (NSFW) the way to go seems to be: sword across back, leather "cap" to cover the tip of the sword, open sides/front w/ leather strap up back, and easily undone leather clasp/strap across hilt by the shoulders.
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#17 Nov 23 2009 at 12:22 AM Rating: Decent
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Another way to do Sheath designs would be to have them set to the design of the armor you're wearing.

As for two handed swords, I've seen full sized twohanded sword sheaths that look like any other sheath, I've also seen somthing a bit more like a frog ( http://www.by-the-sword.com/acatalog/Frogs.html ) with an openended sheath and also one that was little more than a metal ring.
#18 Nov 23 2009 at 10:03 PM Rating: Decent
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shintasama wrote:
Zackary wrote:
Yeah, I can't honestly say I'd given it much thought either.

How does one sheath a great axe? Or like, a greatsword? That'd have to be one huge, unwieldy mother@#%^er.
2h axe sheath Traditional 2h swords used normal sheaths like 2h swords, because of weight issues no one really used ff sized "great swords" IRL (although a couple were forged), but if you look at Berserk (NSFW) the way to go seems to be: sword across back, leather "cap" to cover the tip of the sword, open sides/front w/ leather strap up back, and easily undone leather clasp/strap across hilt by the shoulders.


Are you sure about this? I thought claymores, zweihanders and (n)odachis were real swords used in combat.
#19 Nov 23 2009 at 11:37 PM Rating: Decent
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They are but they tend to be a bit less impressive looking in real life than the one's you see in most games.
#20 Nov 24 2009 at 2:44 AM Rating: Good
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valid wrote:
shintasama wrote:
Zackary wrote:
Yeah, I can't honestly say I'd given it much thought either.

How does one sheath a great axe? Or like, a greatsword? That'd have to be one huge, unwieldy mother@#%^er.
2h axe sheath Traditional 2h swords used normal sheaths like 2h swords, because of weight issues no one really used ff sized "great swords" IRL (although a couple were forged), but if you look at Berserk (NSFW) the way to go seems to be: sword across back, leather "cap" to cover the tip of the sword, open sides/front w/ leather strap up back, and easily undone leather clasp/strap across hilt by the shoulders.
Are you sure about this? I thought claymores, zweihanders and (n)odachis were real swords used in combat.
Claymores were tiny compared to their "fantasy" counterparts, zweihanders were long but very narrow (developed by swiss/german mercs as anti-polearm/cavalry weapons but weren't very effective), and the nodachi created by the Japanese were mainly for ceremonial use and not fighting because they are too awkward for normal use(and polearms are just lighter and more effective in the situations nodachi would excel in).
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#21 Nov 24 2009 at 4:29 PM Rating: Good
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Creating sheathes for weapons, especially those pretty and elaborate in the fantasy genre, is a graphical nightmare. Adding them means animations will need to be custom tailored to drawing them properly to avoid clipping (of both the weapon and other gear)

I really can't see these things presenting even a minor technical hurdle. Sheath animations would be identical to weapon animations, since they occupy the same space. Same goes for clipping -- the sheath doesn't change anything outside of combat mode, and in combat it just adds an object that bounces around the same as it did outside (and it doesn't look like they're very concerned about clipping anyway).

Quote:
while putting the weapon away can't become some kind of arduous task that has you locked down between fights.

Why would it be? Even XI had sheathing animations... the sheath just happened to be invisible.
#22 Nov 24 2009 at 5:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Borkachev wrote:
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Creating sheathes for weapons, especially those pretty and elaborate in the fantasy genre, is a graphical nightmare. Adding them means animations will need to be custom tailored to drawing them properly to avoid clipping (of both the weapon and other gear)

I really can't see these things presenting even a minor technical hurdle. Sheath animations would be identical to weapon animations, since they occupy the same space. Same goes for clipping -- the sheath doesn't change anything outside of combat mode, and in combat it just adds an object that bounces around the same as it did outside (and it doesn't look like they're very concerned about clipping anyway).


XI did a good job in a number of cases to keep clipping to a minimum. Looking at other MMOs, it tends to happen a lot when gear starts getting more spikes, useless extensions, and all that flavor crap that basically makes 'em more than traditional. I like fancy gear as much as the next gal, but there's no denying the presence of sheathes will demand more code and processing power on the user end if they at all hope to maintain some semblance of physics without taking the easy way out with clipping. And the bigger the weapon gets, the more awkward drawing and sheathing it will become, and thus the more they'll have to focus on those animations. Which is easier: A generic readying motion for all great swords with no sheaths, or having to make 132 different ones for all of that weapon type and their unique sheathes that hit the game? Maybe it's just interpretation of SE over the years with XI, but they'll choose the lazy way every time.
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#23 Nov 24 2009 at 7:25 PM Rating: Good
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Which is easier: A generic readying motion for all great swords with no sheaths, or having to make 132 different ones for all of that weapon type and their unique sheathes that hit the game?

Well, I don't see any reason that would be necessary. Weapons fit under weapon classes because they're all pretty much the same size and shape. One animation per weapon type worked in FFXI and I'm sure it would work here.

Great sword might not be the best example though. I'm not sure there's any way to sheath a weapon that's as tall as you are without looking extremely silly. The best you might be able to do there is a small harness on the character's back that it hangs from.
#24 Nov 25 2009 at 12:06 AM Rating: Decent
There are all kinds of neat details SE could add to the game that would make it that much more polished and engaging.

Unfortunately, they all require development time to implement. If SE has (example only) 40 man hours to invest in designing new items for a particular content patch or expansion, I'd rather see those 40 hours invested into the meat and potatoes issues and not having to sidestep those to create/reskin sheaths just to keep players from complaining that they're using the same boots sheath they've been using since level 7.
#25 Nov 25 2009 at 1:46 PM Rating: Good
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Would sheaths be nifty? I think so, especially if like deadgye stated, they get stats or effects. If the work has already been put into sheaths I'll take it, but if not, the time can be better spent elsewhere.

in XI all races sheath differently ( even male and female sheathing effects are different ) some sheath backwards or on different sides.
so 5 races( I wont even count male and female ) X 10 weapons = 50 sheathing styles.

And dont forget just because you're in the same class of weapons doesnt mean the weapons look alike. butterfly greataxe VS volgue VS byakko's axe
for swords kilij VS epee VS longsword VS shamshir etc.

loads of work but would be cool if they had stats.
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#26 Nov 25 2009 at 2:50 PM Rating: Good
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Great sword might not be the best example though. I'm not sure there's any way to sheath a weapon that's as tall as you are without looking extremely silly. The best you might be able to do there is a small harness on the character's back that it hangs from.


I once read a very interesting article that made the argument that any sheathing of a blade on the back longer than a shortsword was completely the work of fiction.

That is to say, from a fantasy/fiction standpoint it looks cool to draw your huge sword from your back, but physics prevent it from actually occurring. Your arm is simply not long enough to make the draw.

...I came across this article whilst trying to figure out why I looked so silly trying to draw a hand-and-half sword, and what I was doing wrong. That was with a 3 foot blade I might add(46'' overall), not anything so huge as a claymore.

Baldrics (belt with a loop over one shoulder, to carry weapons) may well have been common in medieval times for larger swords, but for travel; not in a situation where you needed your weapon quickly.
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#27 Nov 28 2009 at 1:46 AM Rating: Good
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For greatswords, sheaths aren't necessary, but at least put a leather strap around part of the blade so it doesn't look like its stuck to my back like a magnet lol
#28 Nov 28 2009 at 4:38 AM Rating: Good
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Mykha wrote:
For greatswords, sheaths aren't necessary, but at least put a leather strap around part of the blade so it doesn't look like its stuck to my back like a magnet lol


Better yet, put a magnet on your back! Smiley: lol
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#29 Nov 28 2009 at 8:08 PM Rating: Good
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Borkachev wrote:
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Which is easier: A generic readying motion for all great swords with no sheaths, or having to make 132 different ones for all of that weapon type and their unique sheathes that hit the game?

Well, I don't see any reason that would be necessary. Weapons fit under weapon classes because they're all pretty much the same size and shape. One animation per weapon type worked in FFXI and I'm sure it would work here.

Great sword might not be the best example though. I'm not sure there's any way to sheath a weapon that's as tall as you are without looking extremely silly. The best you might be able to do there is a small harness on the character's back that it hangs from.


I wouldn't hold your breath for sheaths. The statement "weapons fit under weapon classes because they're all pretty much the same size and shape" is the problem. If you think back to FFXI, you can probably remember a few unique looking weapons that fell under the generic categories of "sword" or "dagger". Think about the weird, curvy scythe-esque knives, for example. There are enough hitches in the weapon designs to keep them from fitting into one uniform sheath, unless it's really bulky and generalized for all forms.

No, they'd likely have to design quite a few different sheaths, and they'd encounter a few hiccups along the way. It only takes one issue with the animation of one sheath to detract from the game's look. Mind you, I think it's perfectly reasonable to get it done right, but I'm certain they won't bother. It's a shame, too.

I know how ya feel though...I've been holding out the vain hope for a Spear/Shield combo in the game that I know I'll never get, heh.

Edited, Nov 28th 2009 9:11pm by Eske
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