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#1 Dec 22 2009 at 9:38 AM Rating: Decent
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My biggest wish for FF 14 is that I wont level/grind on the same crabs from 1 to 60, this is it !

Was just reading bestiary on the site and remembered how I was sick of grabs once in boyada tree.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 10:48am by MrBarjavel

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 11:20am by MrBarjavel
#2Skeptic, Posted: Dec 22 2009 at 9:52 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Spell Check...PLEASE!
#3 Dec 22 2009 at 1:59 PM Rating: Good
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MrBarjavel wrote:
My biggest wish for FF 14 is that I wont level/grind on the same crabs from 1 to 60, this is it !

Was just reading bestiary on the site and remembered how I was sick of grabs once in boyada tree.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 10:48am by MrBarjavel

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 11:20am by MrBarjavel


This was a serious problem, in my opinion. It was an issue with the scaling of enemy difficult. No reason to make a level 60 crab. If I recall correctly, we should be able to gain experience from quests now. Perhaps that'll help SE to scale enemy progression properly this time around.
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#4 Dec 22 2009 at 2:01 PM Rating: Good
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Hate to be the bearer of bad news but,

http://www.neko-sentai.com/images6sr1/up30401.jpg
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#5 Dec 22 2009 at 2:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Evayde wrote:
Hate to be the bearer of bad news but,

http://www.neko-sentai.com/images6sr1/up30401.jpg


if they do make the higher level crabs look badass like those two in the background I really don't have a problem killing lvl 100 crabs.


I mean at least do something like this: http://betweenshowers.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/Zoidberg_real.jpg

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 3:13pm by burtonsnow
#6 Dec 22 2009 at 2:21 PM Rating: Decent
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never saw that pic before, is it fake ? or when/where was it released ?
#7 Dec 22 2009 at 2:53 PM Rating: Decent
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this look like an artwork of Norg ..
#8 Dec 22 2009 at 3:06 PM Rating: Excellent
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This would be more relevant if you were talking about Colibri.
Otherwise, even in the game to this day nobody actually forms a 6 man to fight crabs after Qufim island. Ironicaly many people stay in Qufim until way later levels due to level sync.

Honestly, even in FFXI all they needed to do was tweak the meshes and reskin them. The boyhada tree had those steel shells and they were simply scaled up versions of the same exact graphics in the dunes. It would not have been the hardest thing in the world to make slightly modified version of each mob for each location in the world....

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 4:12pm by thorazinekizzez
#9 Dec 22 2009 at 4:33 PM Rating: Good
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Does anyone else think that crab looks photo-shopped into that pic?

I mean the crab itself is way less detailed, and the lighting is different on it. Even on the monsters that were transfered over from FFXI to FFXIV, there was something different about them. (More detail, different skin graphics, ect)
#10 Dec 22 2009 at 4:37 PM Rating: Decent
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lol that picture is obviously a crab photoshoped and taken from FFXI Online. FFXIV Crabs just simply cant look that ordinary or the same as the FFXI one.
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#11 Dec 22 2009 at 5:37 PM Rating: Default
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I think the real problem was that they insisted on making the game cross-platform.
They should have discontinued FFXI for the PS2 as it was an inferior system with severe limitations.
If FFXI was PC (and later 360) only, there would have been many more monster and character meshes.

Console MMORPGs are weak. They should keep it PC only, I think, if they want to explore the game's full potential.
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#12 Dec 22 2009 at 6:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
I think the real problem was that they insisted on making the game cross-platform.
They should have discontinued FFXI for the PS2 as it was an inferior system with severe limitations.
If FFXI was PC (and later 360) only, there would have been many more monster and character meshes.

Console MMORPGs are weak. They should keep it PC only, I think, if they want to explore the game's full potential.


FFXI wouldn't have even existed if they canceled the PS2 version/discontinued it. Because it was such a poor launch in the NA and EU does not mean it doesn't have a grip hold on the Japanese market and it was FIRST a PS2 game and not a PC game. Wings of the Goddess Expansion alone sold for 127k its first week on the PS2 in Japan. They cancel or discontinue the game for PS2 thats at least 127k accounts that go out the window for expansion purchases and likely 3/4th of them completely for accounts. Same with FFXIV you can guarentee. Most MMORPG just don't increase the graphics/game specs at the drop of hat either even if they are PC only. I can name only 2 MMORPGs that did that so its not even a console limitation. Those games are Ultima and Eve Online, and the ultima change only happened on like its 10th anniversary and wasn't even a huge step up from the old spec by much.

People like you really need to understand that these games just wouldn't exist without that cross-platform for extra accounts. The limitations for this MMORPG will be small though at least for a good 5-6 years. 500MB RAM is plenty of work around room for memory and they have already commented on giving different texture resolution for the PC and the PS3. Little graphical differences don't seem to be an issue and 500 MB is really going to last a decent amount time for memory management and comments of game limitations probably won't happen for an equally long period. Come back to me when PC games start asking for 3 Gigs standard for RAM than ill agree that the PS3 might be holding back future development.
#13AlizaSeraphim, Posted: Dec 22 2009 at 6:40 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) There are plenty of successful PC-only MMORPGs that boast greater numbers than FFXI.
#14 Dec 22 2009 at 6:48 PM Rating: Decent
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If there was no PS2 version of FFXI, they probably could have squeezed more mob types into a single zone. But in no way did it limit Square to recycling the same mob designs in zone after zone after zone without so much as a reskin.

The PS2 version lowered the baseline specs of FFXI, but it also increased the number of subscribers. Less subscribers = lower budgets to spend on software updates and expansions = less content. Not having a PS2 version of FFXI would have eliminated some limitations on the game, but imposed new ones as well.

And it's not as if console players don't have to put up with shortcoming in the game because of the PC version, since the PC version makes it possible to mod and cheat in the game.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 7:54pm by FilliamHMuffman
#15 Dec 22 2009 at 8:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
There are plenty of successful PC-only MMORPGs that boast greater numbers than FFXI.
Of course, there are plenty of failed MMORPGs for PC as well, but that's cuz the majority of MMOs are on PC and they do tend to fail.

A good MMORPG, though few and far between, would never need cross-platform support to be successful.
FFXI is the first to do this, I believe, and it is far from the top MMO despite having paying customers on PC, 360, and PS2.

Anyway, you seem to have deviated from the thread's topic. I'm sorry that your mommy won't buy you a good gaming rig, your PS3 will have to suffice.

MMORPGs are not anywhere close to single player games in terms of graphics due internet limitations and lag.. etc, and I doubt that there would be as many issues with the PS3 (such as the issue of limited actor/monster 3D models) as with the PS2.

I was comparing the vast difference between the PS2 and gaming PCs at the time.

PS3 and 360 are pretty capable systems, though still nowhere near the PC. However, I don't really see an MMORPG pushing that boundary anytime soon.


Not going to say anymore than this because its already off topic. But I spent over 3k so far on my PC (over a period of 3 years) including the latest line of Graphics cards and quad-Core CPU with 4 Gigs of RAM and Samsung 3D sync monitor. Next time you want to think about my intentions might want to pull away from the childish comments like my "mommy" can't get me a better PC. My comment was derived around the fact that you said putting it on consoles is stupid because it 'holds' back the game yet very few PC MMORPGs on the market have ever upped the minimum spec to play a game competantly after the release. Again the only decent MMORPGs that I can think that have done that are Eve Online and Ultima. Adding graphical 'options' to better PCs does not constitute completely excorsizing a previous spec minimum which is what you are suggesting SE should have done with the PS2. Not even WoW or many of the other higher grossing MMORPGs have done that. Why? Because they don't want to lose accounts on older PC specs that many customers might be using since the game came out.



Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 9:20pm by croythegreat
#16 Dec 22 2009 at 8:37 PM Rating: Good
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lol that picture is obviously a crab photoshoped and taken from FFXI Online. FFXIV Crabs just simply cant look that ordinary or the same as the FFXI one.


Although it may be photoshopped, I truly wouldn't underestimate SE using the same character design. XD look at there history of using teh same things over and over...

That scan of a crab and lalafell are supposedly out of the latest famitsu. We'll get confirmation soon enough I'd say. Also, it looks like norg to me... so maybe the whole photo is messed with. We'll know soon.
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#17 Dec 22 2009 at 8:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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One of these things is not like the others,
One of these things doesn't belong,
Mr. Crab's angle is off from his brothers,
and Mr Crab's shadow is wrong.

Besides, SE has already broken the 'no pet classes' news, and Mr. Crab isn't even looking at that wide-open taru mage sitting right next to him.






Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 10:07pm by Zemzelette
#18 Dec 22 2009 at 9:36 PM Rating: Decent
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there were enough crabs in FFXI, lets not bring them to the forum :(
/headexplodes

Edited, Dec 22nd 2009 10:41pm by Mostaru
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#19 Dec 22 2009 at 10:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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I hear you can get a special creme and comb for this kind of thing.
#20 Dec 22 2009 at 10:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Crabs were fine... I wish there was an oversized HNM crab.. that would be cool!
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#21 Dec 22 2009 at 10:50 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah, something like a giant armor plated snapping turtle would have been a much cooler fight for an NM.

Hopefully we will get some nm type mobs that actualy look differant model wise.
#22 Dec 23 2009 at 4:34 AM Rating: Excellent
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AlizaSeraphim wrote:
There are plenty of successful PC-only MMORPGs that boast greater numbers than FFXI.
MMORPGs are not anywhere close to single player games in terms of graphics due internet limitations and lag.. etc, and I doubt that there would be as many issues with the PS3 (such as the issue of limited actor/monster 3D models) as with the PS2.


This has been one of the things that has me quietly anticipating FFXIV. Looking at the detail in the graphics for the game already. Not only is the detail in the characters very sharp but they have full out facial expressions and detailed faces. Honestly it blows most games out of the water already.

This will be without a doubt the best looking mmo in terms of technology use. Fully normal mapped with specular highlights on everything and motion captured animations. and imo this MMO seems to transcend the idea that MMOs don't look as good as single player games and I am frankly not sure how in the **** they are doing it. Must have a super huge team.

The growth in PC gaming has slowed in part as a result of the console rage. Console systems can handle allot more than most of you are giving credit. I work with a 360 devkit all the time and have yet to ever really slow the **** thing down. The PS2 nonsense should remain an FFXI exclusive complaint. :)
#23 Dec 23 2009 at 8:54 AM Rating: Good
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In regards to the crab pic:

That picture looks shopped. I can tell from the quality of the pixels and the shopping I have done in my time.
#24 Dec 23 2009 at 4:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Zemzelette wrote:
Besides, SE has already broken the 'no pet classes' news, and Mr. Crab isn't even looking at that wide-open taru mage sitting right next to him.


The crab might not be aggressive.
#25 Dec 27 2009 at 8:35 PM Rating: Decent
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As long as I can level from 1 to 60 at least 15 times, i'm fine with it :D
#26 Dec 27 2009 at 10:55 PM Rating: Decent
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I'll take crabs anyday over colibris....at least they take some beating rather then die before you could pull out your weapon >.>
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#27 Dec 28 2009 at 4:29 AM Rating: Excellent
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thorazinekizzez wrote:
This has been one of the things that has me quietly anticipating FFXIV. Looking at the detail in the graphics for the game already. Not only is the detail in the characters very sharp but they have full out facial expressions and detailed faces. Honestly it blows most games out of the water already.

This will be without a doubt the best looking mmo in terms of technology use. Fully normal mapped with specular highlights on everything and motion captured animations. and imo this MMO seems to transcend the idea that MMOs don't look as good as single player games and I am frankly not sure how in the **** they are doing it. Must have a super huge team.


I remember when Spirits Within the movie came out in theaters. I was blown away by the CG effects, certainly not the story. Ever since, Square has really taken graphics to a new level, no matter the platform. If you look at the specs of the PS2, you'll shake your head how the game even manages to run at all on the robust 4MB of VRAM. Yet the SE team pulled it off. Now in their latest expansion pack WoTG, the CS's are vastly improved over all the other expansions. The facial expressions and animation are so top-notch, I can't believe it's FFXI.

Then SE goes and drops the bombshell. The Rapture project is really FFXIV. After checking out Conan, LoTR, WoW, Warhammer, Eve, and of course Aion, FFXIV blows all of them away and we've only seen the Alpha phase. The very first time I logged on the the official FFXIV site, I knew we were all in good hands. It was something about the music, reminded me of FFVI. Considering FFVI is known by the hardcore FF fans as the best FF title of them all, that's quite a complement.

On a ending note, this is Final Fantasy XIV folks, not FF online. I realize this is a MMORPG, but that's not the point. SE has long established high quality technology when creating FF games and the 14th game in the never-ending saga is no slouch. It's no surprise to me that Square managed to pump out so much power out of the PS3. I've been telling people for years that those Xbox 360 ports are holding the system back. What we have here is a game that not only looks good on the PC, but the console as well. Keep up the great work SE.
#28 Dec 28 2009 at 9:00 AM Rating: Good
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MrBarjavel wrote:
My biggest wish for FF 14 is that I wont level/grind on the same crabs from 1 to 60, this is it !

Was just reading bestiary on the site and remembered how I was sick of grabs once in boyada tree.


I dont think the problem was that you had to level on the same crabs until 60, there was a large variety of different 1-60 mobs, so there was no reason you had to XP on crabs for so long.

I think the main problem was that crabs were a relatively easy and safe mob to fight, and so they quickly became a popular XP mob, turning crab camps into some of the main bread and butter XP spots of the day. Nowadays Colibri are the fashionable mob in XI, thanks to their quick kills and easy chains.

I think its just human nature to go with the more efficient option, and so my guess is that the trend will probabally continue into XIV, they can add as many different beasties as they want, but eventually the player base come to the conclusion that fighting Monster A is more effiecient, or easier than fighting monster B and eventually monster A will become the norm.

Edited, Dec 28th 2009 3:09pm by GenryuOfBahamut
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#29 Dec 28 2009 at 10:23 AM Rating: Decent
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You can argue that SE should've dropped PS2, you can argue that they should have focused more on certain aspects of the game, but really SE does things the way they want and their priorities rarely align to what most NA players generally want changed.

It will be interesting to see how 14 turns out, but I am expecting similar models to be dragged about the entire game world. Maybe slightly prettier, but still too repetitive.

Regardless I am expecting a huge group of FFXI players to switch to FFXIV only to quit within a month and not bother coming back to XI, which many of XI's server's populations are so pitifully small they will be forced to merge servers just to compensate for the lack of subscriptions.
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#30 Dec 28 2009 at 10:34 AM Rating: Good
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I don't think it will be an issue in XIV because they are turning back to the many vs many instead of many vs one concept.

The only reason people fought crabs and other common monsters were that they had the least AOE pain moves. In a 6 humans vs 1 computer monster that is unavoidable. In a 6 humans vs 12 computer monsters it doesn't have to be any terrible AOE moves at all. (Though if SE insist on ******** their second MMO over as well, then they should give all mobs AOE silence/paralyze/petrify/whatever.)
#31 Dec 28 2009 at 11:27 AM Rating: Excellent
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I think it's a fair bet camping-style progression won't be key to XIV.

Quote:
They laugh as they admit that "growth" in Final Fantasy XI would often amount to an endless cycle of shoot-pull-kill, shoot-pull-kill. The new MMO will focus on the variety and accessibility of methods to grow one's character.


http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=18309


My money's on quest-based progression. Which, incidentally, is a fantastic way to encourage the population to encounter a wide variety of mobs.
#32 Dec 28 2009 at 1:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Zemzelette wrote:

I think it's a fair bet camping-style progression won't be key to XIV.

Quote:
They laugh as they admit that "growth" in Final Fantasy XI would often amount to an endless cycle of shoot-pull-kill, shoot-pull-kill. The new MMO will focus on the variety and accessibility of methods to grow one's character.


http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=18309


My money's on quest-based progression. Which, incidentally, is a fantastic way to encourage the population to encounter a wide variety of mobs.


Like WoW solo quests? Not a fantastic way imo.
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#33 Dec 28 2009 at 1:21 PM Rating: Good
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odinpingpong wrote:

Like WoW solo quests? Not a fantastic way imo.


They have already shown the Quests to be much more like Fields of valor in nature and they don't level you up they appear to be Guild related.
#34 Dec 28 2009 at 1:27 PM Rating: Decent
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thorazinekizzez wrote:
odinpingpong wrote:

Like WoW solo quests? Not a fantastic way imo.


They have already shown the Quests to be much more like Fields of valor in nature and they don't level you up they appear to be Guild related.


Never played that. Could you describe or is there a link to a similar discussion?
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#35 Dec 28 2009 at 1:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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Fields of Valor is a relatively new system in FFXI that allows players to select a set of monsters they wish to defeat in a game day. Once they have defeated the entire set of monsters, they receive an award of extra exp, gil, and points that can be spent on buffs, food, and other things like warping back to your home country. It is a system that is easily accessible to common camping areas, so often entire parties will arrange their killing order around which Fields of Valor page they have selected.
#36 Dec 28 2009 at 1:46 PM Rating: Excellent
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I was just referring to how each system encourages interaction with mobs.
The solo part of questing is a completely different topic.


Quote:
They have already shown the Quests to be much more like Fields of valor in nature and they don't level you up they appear to be Guild related.


Where'd you get that from?
Quote:

Dengeki magazine also managed to get in some of their own questions. As Tanaka has stated before, Guildleve will be central to the game play of Final Fantasy XIV. They plan to include an immense amount of variety for the quests available to players. Also, rewards will vary greatly, with quests granting the player with gil, items or even skill points.

http://www.ffxivcitadel.com/dengeki-editor-hands-experience-with-ffxiv-t229.html?s=c90accac2bde361834159f08657d0cec&
#37 Dec 28 2009 at 5:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Zemzelette wrote:



Dengeki magazine also managed to get in some of their own questions. As Tanaka has stated before, Guildleve will be central to the game play of Final Fantasy XIV. They plan to include an immense amount of variety for the quests available to players. Also, rewards will vary greatly, with quests granting the player with gil, items or even skill points.


^^This is what I've read too. Guildeves will be he hub and everything you'll do in game will revolve around it to some extent.
#38 Dec 28 2009 at 5:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Zemzelette wrote:

Quote:
They have already shown the Quests to be much more like Fields of valor in nature and they don't level you up they appear to be Guild related.


Where'd you get that from?


From videos of game play that were recently released showing guild quests in action. Also it very much looks like the Fields of Valor system in action. Basically fields of valor is WoWs questing system with no Quest dialog attached. They just come out and ask you to kill 5 of these and 10 of those and thats about it.

Hopefully they will expand on that system to help make quests feel more interesting than simply killing things. They also mention that Guildleves are cards you collect and the guildleves are actually quests by themselves allowing access to instances or otherwise inaccessible locations.

Sounds pretty interesting.
#39 Dec 29 2009 at 12:04 AM Rating: Decent
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The link to the picture won't work for me but there is an official pic of the crab now. It is under the media section of the finalfantasyxiv.com site.
#40 Dec 29 2009 at 4:34 AM Rating: Decent
That was the biggest problem i had with FFXI.

Same size and color for most monsters from lvl 1 and up.

At least make em bigger as they get tougher this time round.
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#41 Dec 29 2009 at 8:03 AM Rating: Decent
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Illicious wrote:
That was the biggest problem i had with FFXI.

Same size and color for most monsters from lvl 1 and up.

At least make em bigger as they get tougher this time round.


believe it or not they did scale them up it was just by such a small amount you didn't notice lol
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