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#1 Jan 27 2010 at 11:44 PM Rating: Decent
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I have a question about a technical aspect of the game that I'm sure no one would know yet but thought I'd ask anyway.

When I play a FPS or MMO, in most cases after 5-15 minutes I get a nasty headache and the urge to hurl. It's a motion sickness thing I think, I don't quite get it but it means I can't enjoy HALO or BioShock or Portal or any of those other gorgeous games that make me cry.

Anyone this same problem holds true for DAoC, SWG, LotRO, Second Life(I was bored), and probably a slew of other MMO's as well. But FFXI didn't do that. I'm not sure if it was because of the floating camera controls, or pace the character ran, or what but that's another reason I loved 11, because I could actually play it without the desire to kill myself with prescription painkillers.

Anyway, my question is does anyone know or do you think they'll implement the same kind of motion and camera control, I'd hate to buy a PS3 and 14, get it home, plug in, download, start up, and then 5 minutes in realize I can never play this again.
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#2 Jan 27 2010 at 11:56 PM Rating: Decent
SE is planning to add a 1st person camera view, as well as a 3rd person "FPS style" camera angle. Other than what we've seen from the Demos, I think this is all that we really know.
#3 Jan 28 2010 at 12:01 AM Rating: Good
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Quick question.

I noticed you compared FPS (with first person perspectives) to MMOs which are usually played in third-person perspectives but offer first person perspective options. Are you playing the MMOs in first person perspective?
#4 Jan 28 2010 at 12:05 AM Rating: Decent
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You know, there's treatment for motion (simulation) sickness that you can take. There's tons of over the counter medication for it. Lots of people think ginger tea cures it as well (as seen on Mythbusters).
#5 Jan 28 2010 at 12:23 AM Rating: Decent
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No, I'm not playing the MMO's in 1st person but several of them don't let you really reposition the camera, in 11 I could put the camera slightly over the right shoulder, high up pointing down at an angle, still gave me a good distant view ahead of me but not dead ahead. Whereas many of the games let you move the camera until you start running, then the camera auto drops directly behind the toon and stays pretty much locked there, which for me is just as bad as 1st person. It really sucks.
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#6 Jan 28 2010 at 12:56 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Q. Will there be different kinds of camera angles?

The alpha version of the game uses the third person perspective. Shoulder type perspective like that on a third person shooter game is being worked on.

Spoiler Test

Quote:
what the camera angles could be like

There are also changes being planned for camera angles in the game. The game is currently in the alpha stage but they are looking into providing two different 3rd-person points of view, a 1st person point of view, and a point of view looking over the shoulder of your character. (EDIT: Later video footage and interviews state 3 camera views. This could have been a mistype for the printed version.)

http://www.eorzeapedia.com/2009/08/21/famitsu-interview-with-hiromichi-tanaka/

What the camera angles could be like:
@Distant third person.
@Zoomed third person.
@Over the shoulder.
@First person.
#7 Jan 28 2010 at 1:13 AM Rating: Decent
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Best way to solve simulation sickness (3D game motion sickness) for good is to just continue playing through the sickness. Eventually your brain will realize that you're not being poisoned and will stop giving you nausea.
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#8 Jan 28 2010 at 2:32 AM Rating: Decent
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Yogtheterrible wrote:
You know, there's treatment for motion (simulation) sickness that you can take. There's tons of over the counter medication for it. Lots of people think ginger tea cures it as well (as seen on Mythbusters).


The most absolute cure is, if its available, to turn off "viewbob" which causes the bobbing of the camera slightly to simulate head movement during running etc.

Motion Sickness is believed to be caused by your body combating hallucinations. Your eyes send images back to your brain that you are moving around in erratic ways, but your brain has not recieved any signals from your inner ear etc to back up these shifts in momentum. Your brain, now confused, concludes that you must be hallucinating and makes you feel ill to eject whatever you may have eaten that would cause the hallucinations.

This explains why people tend to get carsick in the back but not in the front (in the front they can feel/see the movement, in the back they can only feel. Queue stomach eject!) and why disabling viewbob helps combat motion sickness in computer games.
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#9 Jan 28 2010 at 2:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
You know, there's treatment for motion (simulation) sickness that you can take. There's tons of over the counter medication for it.


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#10 Jan 28 2010 at 7:45 AM Rating: Good
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My fiancee has issues with games and motion sickness. Usually FPS are the only games that will trigger it for her, but there are a few times, in 3rd person games, she has felt ill when the camera has a forced over-shoulder perspective. As you might imagine it's mostly the wild turns of perspective that really do her in. I knew she shouldn't have tried to watch Cloverfield...Anyways, in the Alpha footage it appeared as though FFXIV will retain a free floating camera you enjoyed from FFXI. Try watching the footage from Gamescom. If you can sit well with that, then I would think you'll be fine. At least it hasn't bothered her. I hope it works out for you.

It's ok to look now, they've stopped running. Argh...never mind.
#11 Jan 28 2010 at 8:54 AM Rating: Decent
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I get motion sickness alot from....
battlefield
Counter Strike
Rogue Spear RavenShield (the old Rogue Spear works fine for me)
Grand Theft Auto series... (i love playing it, but i cant play any longer than 30mins, no matter im on PS2, PS3 or PSP lol)

FFXI works fine for me, i love to get my camera view high up the shoulder when running around, i think my field of vision (or can see further) is bigger, so i always hold the up arrow when running
if SE could make the view a little higher up, that would be great, i hate it keep dropping down after i release the up arrow
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#12 Jan 28 2010 at 9:16 AM Rating: Decent
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I would expect the control scheme to be the same as FFXI. Left stick is going to control camera and right stick for movement.
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#13 Jan 28 2010 at 1:26 PM Rating: Good
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What kind of monitor do you have? It sounds like you may be running a monitor at a 60Hz refresh rate, which some people are known to be sensitive to, suffering from headaches/nausea just from looking at the display, especially when there is a lot of motion. The fact that FFXI runs at a maximum 30 fps may also be a reason why you don't feel nauseous when playing it.

For widescreen monitors, increasing the field of view in FPS games can also help with fighting nausea, though this is not always possible. The fact that you're having this issue with third person cameras is a bit strange though. I can attest that FFXI's camera does have a unique way of tracking, especially noticeable if you zoom in and out. Since you mentioned Second Life, which I also play, you'll notice a distinct difference from zooming in/out in that. It's tough to say whether FFXIV will have camera tracking exactly like that, or if you can at least configure it to be similar.
#14 Jan 28 2010 at 3:35 PM Rating: Good
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Rated down for explaining the reason for motion sickness and an easy way to combat it in computer game settings?

Sorry, Ill post more XIV like.

I WANT GIRL MIQOTE OMG SE WHER IS TE UPDATES THIS IS RIDICULOUS!!!! IM IN THE BETA WOOOO!!!!
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#15 Jan 28 2010 at 4:49 PM Rating: Good
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I got rated down for asking a reasonable question.
If that makes you feel any better? :p

Ah, so it's the automatic re-adjust to behind the shoulder when you start to move that gets to you?

Here's a gamescon video.
The camera remains stationary in third person perspective despite the lalafell running away from the camera, toward the camera, and to the left. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vH2MQ_RFX_U&feature=relate


Edited, Jan 28th 2010 6:10pm by Zemzelette
#16 Jan 28 2010 at 6:49 PM Rating: Decent
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how do you rate down?
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#17 Jan 28 2010 at 7:51 PM Rating: Decent
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i've never had any type of motion sickness in games. It looks like ffxiv will have a similar camera like in ffxi. I found nothing wrong with ffxi camera either so i hope they continue using it.
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#18 Jan 29 2010 at 4:32 AM Rating: Good
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Zemzelette wrote:

Ah, so it's the automatic re-adjust to behind the shoulder when you start to move that gets to you?


A static third person view shouldnt cause any sickness issues. As I say the main cause is when in a first person view the camera bobs up and down slightly when you move to simulate real life vision when you walk (your steps make your head move up and down slightly). Its this that causes the sickness, and its very rarely used when in a 3rd person perspective. Namely because it just looks really wierd :)

Tried to find some vids on youtube but no luck!
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#19 Jan 29 2010 at 5:50 AM Rating: Decent
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I think Gears of War had a bobbing screen movement from third person view, but it was very slight though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoPC_ibBJiQ
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#20 Jan 29 2010 at 6:07 AM Rating: Decent
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I remember playing EQ in 1st person and did fine with that for 6 years.. As soon as FFXI came out I had no idea how 3rd person changed my life. I can't play in 1st person anymore. I have to be above and behind my character to see what's going on around me. That and games these days make 1st person have tunnel vision imo.
#21 Jan 29 2010 at 1:00 PM Rating: Good
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I'm sorry, I should have quoted.
My post was in response to his clarification post.

Quote:
Whereas many of the games let you move the camera until you start running, then the camera auto drops directly behind the toon and stays pretty much locked there, which for me is just as bad as 1st person. It really sucks.


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