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#1 Mar 17 2010 at 7:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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this is it. this is the thread for people who are interested in the marauder class. people like me.

as a refresher, here are the developers own words regarding the marauder as reported at dengeki and famitsu

Dengeki says wrote:
Marauder: A macho attacker with massive power. The party's trump card. For people who love waiting for the perfect opening to strike.

- Marauders can store up power to unleash an AoE attack. Can they do this with regular melee attacks, or is it only reserved for weaponskills?


A: Basically, storing up power will make regular melee attacks into AoE attacks. Storing up power will have other special effects on weaponskills.

- While storing up power, is it impossible to perform any actions that require movement?

A: Moving cancels the act of storing power.

- The ability Disorient uses the axe to stir up dust or sand to lower enemy evasion. Can this be used in places with no sand, like on a boat?

A: You can still use the ability, but the effect may be altered.

- The weaponskill Fracture makes an enemy weaponskill unusable. Is this a continuous effect or is it more like Stun?

A: It's a continuous effect.

- Brandish and Iron Tempest (both are circular AoE weaponskills) seem to have similar effects, but are the damage types different?

A: The type of damage they do is different, as well as the shape and size of their areas of effect.



Source article

Famitsu says wrote:
Iwao: This is a class that can really deal out massive damage. However, if there are many enemies to deal with, they can forgo storing up that power in order to strike more often.

Sato: Marauders use battle axes, which give them more attack power than any other class at the expense of some accuracy.

Okada: While their special attacks are powerful, some require that the Marauder be stantionary while they activate. Due to this, a Marauder must be adept at reading an enemy's movements.



Source article

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to sum up, here are the key points as i understood them:

-the marauder is a melee dps class, utilizing two-handed axes (wars unite!). they may or may not use other weapons, but we know for sure that they use 2h axe and it seems that 2h axe is a primary weapon focus (if not *the* focus) of the class.

-marauders have the ability to "store power" then using this stored power to initiate an aoe attack in place of a normal attack (in effect, turning a normal attack into an aoe attack).

-currently, storing power is done by not moving. presumably power is only storeable (is that even a word? it is now) while in combat stance.

-storing power also will have an effect on weapon skills, altering them in some way (perhaps adding more raw power, an aoe effect, or some other kinds of effects on top of the standard WS).

-marauders also have at least two kinds of debuffs; a continuous effect that prevents the usage of enemy WS, and an aoe evade debuff.


What can we infer from all this?

well, its obvious that the marauder is a class built around damage. they kill stuff, but in order to best kill stuff they need to stand still. this means good teamwork is essential to getting the most out of the marauder, as well as a healthy understanding of the flow of battle on the part of the marauder player.

secondly, it seems to me that squenix is taking the intelligent approach and spreading some debuff love around to each class. the ability to negate a targets usage of WS is immense, not to mention an aoe evasion debuff. this is good because....

....thus far, FF14 seems to have one "true" tank class (gladiator) and three "melee dps" classes (pugilist, lancer, marauder, altho its implied that a gladiator has some dps capability with the right gear set). now, as anyone who has played any melee dps class in FF11 knows, finding groups as a melee dps (or, ****, any dps) can be a harrowing, time-consuming experience. by spreading around useful debuffs to each class you ensure a good reason exists to bring said classes.

finally, it looks like the marauder has the tools necessary to fill the role of "melee aoe." this is a niche that tends to go unfilled for a variety of reasons, so im really unsure about what to make of it. for the time being, im tentatively optimistic.

How will the Marauder play?

well, having no first hand experience i can't say for certain, but the information given seems to suggest a kind of "ramping up" in how the marauder functions in a fight. the tank will engage a mob (or group of mobs), the marauder will find a good position near the mob(s) that allows him to deal damage while minimizing or eliminating movement, and as the tanks threat increases the marauder ramps the damage up. debuffing techniques are used as needed to help the fight flow better, and likely will give the marauder something to do besides dealing damage, acting as a sort of "threat control" for the player.

so, any thoughts or criticisms on this? obviously all this information is both very new and very preliminary; so much can change in alpha and beta that entire mechanics might be scrapped and/or replaced by the time the game goes live. but as it stands now, the marauder intrigues me. it speaks to the warrior in me, carrying a big *** axe, using it to crack skulls, trampling the weak and crushing the powerless. but its also quite tactical in its implementation, rewarding careful planning and positioning as well as providing more to a group than a living blender.

Edited, Mar 17th 2010 6:30pm by Quor
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#2 Mar 17 2010 at 7:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Quor wrote:
....thus far, FF14 seems to have one "true" tank class (gladiator) and three "melee dps" classes (pugilist, lancer, marauder, although its implied that a gladiator has some dps capability with the right gear set).

I'm hoping at least one of the melee fighters is a capable off tank, and I'd like to see off tanks be used often in groups. It feels like less of a group fight to me when all he enemy focuses on one pc and every pc focuses on one enemy.
Quor wrote:
finally, it looks like the marauder has the tools necessary to fill the role of "melee aoe." this is a niche that tends to go unfilled for a variety of reasons, so im really unsure about what to make of it. for the time being, im tentatively optimistic.

Lotro tried a similar idea with their Champion. It was a melee DPS class with a plethora of aoe options and the second toughest in terms of armor and hp. The class turned out to be one of the most gimped in Lotro, and if wasn't for the absolute need for their aoe in one particular part of a raid fight, they probably would have been obsolete for end game.

That is not to say the maruader will have the same issues. FFXIV is supposedly more focused on group fights, which increases the importance of AOE (unless CC is too powerful). Also, marauders have utility features that Lotro champions lacked. I'm hopeful for the marauder, and I believe it looks interesting. It has some of the flavor of a berserker, but done in an unorthodox manner.
#3 Mar 17 2010 at 7:56 PM Rating: Good
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Just the giant *** axe is enough to interest me. The concept worries me a little, as the whole store power to increase attack just reeks of BNS. We'll see how it works in practice. Assuming its a reduction in attack rate in exchange for attack power, it'll have to be a pretty impressive increase to make it worthwhile.
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#4 Mar 17 2010 at 8:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Just to unlock Great Sword, would I need to skill up both sword skill and axe skill? None of two job mentin about Great Sword....

Since Great Sword can be use for powerful AOE attack, it would fall in Marauder category though...

Edited, Mar 17th 2010 10:05pm by hexid
#5 Mar 17 2010 at 9:38 PM Rating: Good
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Just to add the already known abilities/weaponskills to the thread:

Abilities wrote:
* Bloodbath: Revel in the blood of an enemy, converting a percentage of the damage dealt by your next successful attack into HP.

* Murderous Intent: Throw yourself into your attacks, increasing critical hit rate and reducing TP generation.

* Defender: Tighten your guard, increasing defense and reducing attack power. Increases enmity generation while in steadfast stance.

* Disorient: Flick dust, sand, or soil at an enemy, reducing the target's evasion. Effect may stack up to three times.

* Enduring March: Take strong and sure steps, enabling movement at reduced speed while bound. While active, also maintains steadfast stance while moving.


Weaponskills wrote:

* Skull Sunder: Strike an enemy in the head, increasing attack power and dealing slashing damage. Deals further damage over time. Attacks enemies in a cone before you while in steadfast stance.

* Trunksplitter: Deliver a strong chop, increasing attack power and dealing slashing damage. Attack power is further increased against Seedkin.

* Brandish: Strike nearby enemies, increasing attack power and dealing slashing damage.

* Iron Tempest: Spin your axe wildly, increasing attack power and dealing wind damage to nearby targets.


SE chose these abilities out of all of the ones available, which means these probably best demonstrate Marauder's roles and playstyle.

I'm typically always a mage, but being a lalafell marauder seems kind of badass in a way.
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#6 Mar 17 2010 at 10:49 PM Rating: Decent
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If you move will you lose TP or just not gain it?
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#7 Mar 18 2010 at 1:32 AM Rating: Decent
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Yup this is the class I'm going to start with.

Hopes: Hp recovered from Bloodbath significant enough to matter.
Worries: Power up when not moving, but FFXIV will have more moving targets?
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#8 Mar 18 2010 at 2:02 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Worries: Power up when not moving, but FFXIV will have more moving targets?


Quote:
While their special attacks are powerful, some require that the Marauder be stantionary while they activate. Due to this, a Marauder must be adept at reading an enemy's movements.


This is the whole strategy and positioning thing that SE keeps talking about. As a Marauder you have to read the enemy's movements and anticipate where they're going to be just as you get ready to swing.
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#9 Mar 18 2010 at 7:39 AM Rating: Good
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lolgaxe wrote:
Just the giant *** axe is enough to interest me.


So you have something to lol at? :D

lolgaxe wrote:
Assuming its a reduction in attack rate in exchange for attack power, it'll have to be a pretty impressive increase to make it worthwhile.


All joking aside, I agree on this. If I wait out my 2 swings, the damage output has to be better then 2 x Swing.
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#10 Mar 18 2010 at 7:51 AM Rating: Good
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Anyone have any idea of how "stances" will work? Having different stances is mentioned for Pugilist and there are mentions of "Steadfast Stance" for Marauder. I'm guessing that these stances will allow for the Marauder to act as a very effective crowd control tank.

I'm guessing when the party gets swarmed, the Marauder would switch stances and go into the Steadfast stance and use the Defender ability for the AoE hate generation, then commence to wailing on the crowd of mobs gathered.
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#11 Mar 18 2010 at 7:55 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
All joking aside, I agree on this. If I wait out my 2 swings, the damage output has to be better then 2 x Swing.


then we're back to FF11 and the same problem it had. You miss a couple attacks and you are dead, you get no tp and no damage to the enemy, kiss you **** goodbye.

It will be interesting to see how they implement it. With the increase in damage it could also increase accuracy, basically like taking longer to aim so you can strike harder without risk. they might just no mention that part... i hope.
#12 Mar 18 2010 at 10:33 AM Rating: Good
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Kirbster wrote:
Weaponskills wrote:

* Iron Tempest: Spin your axe wildly, increasing attack power and dealing wind damage to nearby targets.

Why couldn't they name this one Sturmwind or Steel Cyclone instead?
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#13 Mar 18 2010 at 11:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Ralrra wrote:
Kirbster wrote:
Weaponskills wrote:

* Iron Tempest: Spin your axe wildly, increasing attack power and dealing wind damage to nearby targets.

Why couldn't they name this one Sturmwind or Steel Cyclone instead?


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#14 Mar 18 2010 at 6:03 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Just to unlock Great Sword, would I need to skill up both sword skill and axe skill? None of two job mentin about Great Sword....

Since Great Sword can be use for powerful AOE attack, it would fall in Marauder category though...


lolwut? I've not heard anyone say anything about greatsword in FFXIV, let alone what is needed to use one, and what class it would be.
#15 Mar 18 2010 at 6:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Why couldn't they name this one Sturmwind or Steel Cyclone instead?


Why couldn't they name that one Iron Tempest? What question is that?
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#16 Mar 18 2010 at 7:26 PM Rating: Decent
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because sturmwind and steel cyclone are awesome, whereas iron tempest was a terrible failure of a skill (or "terrifail" if you will). lets just say that, amongst the war community, we dont even acknowledge the existence of iron tempest as a WS. on the WS list of every gaxe using war theres a blank spot where iron tempest should be. its not that IT doesnt exist, its just that no self-respecting war admits to its existence.
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#17 Mar 18 2010 at 7:33 PM Rating: Good
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Quor wrote:
on the WS list of every gaxe using war theres a blank spot where iron tempest should be.
I used a post-it note to cover up that part of the screen.
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#18 Mar 18 2010 at 10:58 PM Rating: Decent
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I was drawn to the great axe in FFXI for the satisfaction in swinging it. Seeing my Elvaan Warrior wind up, swing with all his body, the axe head flying in a great arc and having it crunch on a crab was one of the most satisfying videogame experiences.

Seeing Marauder low in the poles also makes me want to use 'em to stand out from the crowd.
#19 Mar 18 2010 at 11:21 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Hopes: Hp recovered from Bloodbath significant enough to matter.
Worries: Power up when not moving, but FFXIV will have more moving targets?


I wouldn't call that a worry, in fact this tells us that there'll be enemies that take a little time to down, while the marauder is stationary, storing all his energy, the tank needs to do his job keeping in mind the marauders position -- and then (hopefully) there is the concept of skillchains which would be awesome when a marauder stores up energy and unleashes a WS as part of a skill chain while working in accordance with the tank. Point in case: this tells me there'll be teamwork in this game for those who want it and i want it!!!
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#20 Mar 19 2010 at 12:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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Seeing Marauder low in the poles also makes me want to use 'em to stand out from the crowd.


yeah, thats part of it for me too. wars were always the underdog amongst NA's until about two years in. i (and many others) had to fight tooth and nail for our class. i hope marauder doesnt have to go thru the same growing pains as it were, but at the same time the sense of togetherness fostered as a result of it turned the war community here at alla into one of the best ive seen ever.

Quote:
I used a post-it note to cover up that part of the screen.


it would seem people dislike my description about the general feeling towards IT amongst us old school wars. my advice to those people? do as the gaxe does and apply a bit of optical obfuscation.
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#21 Apr 03 2010 at 7:03 AM Rating: Default
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How will the Marauder play?


I'm planning to start as Marauder and later on blacksmith. FFXIV monster are designed to hunt in groups and I believe Marauder will be the ultimate job for mobbing monsters and therefore for farming loot drops (i.e. will be very popular among gilfarmers). Marauder's can farm solo if it can kill mobs with 1 AoE skill (either Brandish or Iron Tempest). If a Marauder can't kill certain mobs with 1 AoE it should hunt together with a Conjuerer.

I envision this is how a Marauder will mob:
Step 1: find monsters you wanted to farm, preferably ones that will die in 1 or 2 AoE
Step 2: cast {Unyielding March} to make sure you can still move forward despite being attacked by monsters
Step 3: tap/hit all the monsters in one area (5-20 monsters) to make them follow you (if the monster is aggro, you don't have to hit them, just make sure they follow you)
Step 4: keep moving to make sure all 20 monster are clumped into one cell
Step 5: drive the mob to camp if you're hunting with a conjurer
Step 6: cast {Power Attack} and {Blood Bath}. {Blood bath} is not needed if hunt with a conjurer.
Step 7: attack mobs with {brandish}
Step 8: if the mobs need 2 AoE to die, cast {iron tempest}
Step 9: pick up loots
Step 10: sit and heal, while waiting for the mobs in the area to respawn; rinse and repeat from Step 1

A marauder's equipment should focus on :
- atk to ensure one or two AoE kill
- def or HP to ensure not getting killed before reaching camp or desired number of mobs
- accuracy
#22 Apr 03 2010 at 7:42 AM Rating: Decent
The idea Rudra gave sounds dead on. With that and the axe, I'm sold on being a lalafel marauder/culanarian.
#23 Apr 03 2010 at 11:19 AM Rating: Good
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I've got a feeling that Marauder will be a powerhouse. The piece that needs to be in place for them to really deal it out: the enemy being still, seems like it might be something that can be resolved easily enough. I'm envisioning some sort of combination of a spell or WS like shadowbind or stop being used to hold an enemy in place while the Marauder lines up some devastating attack.
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#24 Apr 03 2010 at 11:21 AM Rating: Decent
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i hope Marauder isn't going to be like Samurai where you need to stack accuracy to hit anything. (before buffs)
#25 Apr 03 2010 at 3:34 PM Rating: Decent
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DarkBlastphemy wrote:
The idea Rudra gave sounds dead on. With that and the axe, I'm sold on being a lalafel marauder/culanarian.


You won't be disappointed :)

Another idea is farming with a party of 2 Marauders. With 2 Marauders, we can hunt monsters that can only be killed by 3 or 4 AoE Spells. In this party, each Marauders mob different side of the map and then pool all of them into one spot to spam {Brandish} and {Iron Tempest}.

My only concern about my mobbing idea is how strong a Marauder against enemy attacks... Will there be enough high Defense equipment without sacrificing too much Attack and Accuracy.

If Marauders turn out to be "Glass Cannons" then they should at least bring one conjurer to mob monsters. If a conjurer has {HP Regen} he/she can cast it before a Marauder leaves camp. But if there are no {HP regen} then there are no choice but the conjurer has to keep following the Marauder.

Eske wrote:
I've got a feeling that Marauder will be a powerhouse. The piece that needs to be in place for them to really deal it out: the enemy being still, seems like it might be something that can be resolved easily enough. I'm envisioning some sort of combination of a spell or WS like shadowbind or stop being used to hold an enemy in place while the Marauder lines up some devastating attack.


Yes Marauder definitely will be a powerhouse class as how SE has mentioned it a couple of times. The question is will it be a "Glass Canon"?

Edited, Apr 3rd 2010 5:39pm by Rudra
#26 Apr 05 2010 at 1:17 AM Rating: Decent
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My guess is that it will play somewhat like a DD warrior or something like a DK/WAR from FFXI.

Basically you will be able to take some hits, but not necessarily tank, and perhaps you will have some abilities like Berserk or Souleater where you can increase your damage in exchange for def/health.
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#27 Apr 05 2010 at 3:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Quor wrote:
How will the Marauder play?

well, having no first hand experience i can't say for certain, but the information given seems to suggest a kind of "ramping up" in how the marauder functions in a fight. the tank will engage a mob (or group of mobs), the marauder will find a good position near the mob(s) that allows him to deal damage while minimizing or eliminating movement, and as the tanks threat increases the marauder ramps the damage up. debuffing techniques are used as needed to help the fight flow better, and likely will give the marauder something to do besides dealing damage, acting as a sort of "threat control" for the player.

so, any thoughts or criticisms on this?


With the higher form of mob AI, I think it will be challenging to fight group of mobs in a stationary battle (the way FFXI battles are fought). Because who knows if the mobs will group together the way you want them to? Like in this picture : http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/gmw/docs/353/970/ff14_03.jpg
Stationary battle might put a Marauder, who shines in strength and AoE skills, at a disadvantage.

Solo mobbing, at least, will ensure your AoE weapon skills hit all the monsters. All you need to do is to keep running and make sure the group of monster is chasing you on a one straight line, then stop, turn around towards the mob, and before the mob scatters cast {Brandish} followed by {Tempest Iron} if necessary.
#28 Apr 06 2010 at 3:23 PM Rating: Good
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interesting ideas rudra. if anything, this might point to a slightly off-tank-like role for the marauder. be a lot easier to utilize aoe skills if the marauder didnt have to rely solely on other classes for mob positioning.

if that were the case, it would likely be a very light off-tanking role, something done temporarily to maximize aoe damage potential with a high opportunity cost for tanking too long.
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#29 Apr 08 2010 at 1:58 AM Rating: Decent
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Now that we know we can allocate our own stats points into 8 different status (STR, VIT, DEX, AGI, INT, MND, CHA, and LUK), I am 100% positive that Marauder should hunt by solo mobbing. Stats will be something like STR > VIT > DEX depending on the equipment, assuming:
STR = +physical attack
VIT = +max HP, +physical defense
DEX = +physical accuracy, -skills/magic cast delay??
AGI = +attack speed, +physical evasion
INT = +magic power, + max MP, +magic defense??
MND/CHR = +magic accuracy?? +status resistance??
LUK = +critical hit%??, +success rate in synth,forge,etc??

STR to increase attack power, VIT to increase survivability and DEX to ensure hit. AGI won't be useful for a solo mobber since we will be spamming skills instead of using normal attack. Weapon skill uses TP, so INT is not needed. The need for MND/CHR/LUK should be satisfied with accessories or food.
#30 Apr 08 2010 at 2:16 AM Rating: Decent
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I am 100% positive that Marauder should hunt by solo mobbing.


Why is that?
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#31 Apr 08 2010 at 3:16 AM Rating: Decent
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This will likely be my class of choice if they don't have something more similar to SAM. I'm really hoping they do though.

If not this class seems very interesting to me. Definitely the most interesting out of the DPS melees we know about so far.
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