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#52 Jun 19 2010 at 5:55 PM Rating: Decent
ShadowedgeFFXI wrote:
Hey Aur, would you suggest I purchase the PS3 version at launch if I rather wait a year or so to pay for a cheaper rig? This is a serious question. I realize the high tech parts won't drop overnight, but I hope I could max FFXIV with less cash. I just can't justify spending 2k for one frigging game. I'd rather wait 1-2 years the cut corners for a launch rig. Good or bad plan?


I would say that if the idea of playing on PS3 doesn't bother you, then by all means start out on PS3 and migrate to a PC when you can get a rig for $1000-1200 that will score at least 5k on the benchmark @ 1080p. My reasoning is pretty simple. For most people, even $1000 for a new PC is still a chunk of cash. It makes sense to consider just what you'd be getting in terms of performance out of XIV for that kind of money, and the answer is "not much". If I'm going to buy a new rig, I'm not going to be happy with "barely adequate" performance. And since you 'd need to spend at least $1500 (but realistically closer to 2k) to get good (but not superb) performance out of XIV, if that kind of money is out of the budget you're better of to make do with a PS3 until prices come down. And realistically, we're not going to be seeing the kind of hardware that will score 5k+ on the high res benchmark in the $1000-1200 range for 2-3 years.
#53 Jun 19 2010 at 6:05 PM Rating: Decent
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So if I waited only a year, how much could I realistically shave off the price? $500? $1,000? I rather plunk down 1,500 in one year than 2000 this year. Plus I'm planning to install a solid state drive.
#54 Jun 19 2010 at 6:20 PM Rating: Decent
ShadowedgeFFXI wrote:
So if I waited only a year, how much could I realistically shave off the price? $500? $1,000? I rather plunk down 1,500 in one year than 2000 this year. Plus I'm planning to install a solid state drive.


It's hard to say. A lot of it depends on when ATI can get their second generation DX11 cards to market. They're aiming for late 2010/early 2011 but with new technology there's never a guarantee. I wouldn't count on an enormous price drop on anything in the next year, and considering that anything short of high end is producing lackluster results for XIV benchmark scores, aiming for less than today's high end standards is an iffy decision. XIV is one of those exceptions to standard PC buying considerations. "Adequate" today is not adequate for XIV.
#55 Jun 19 2010 at 6:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. My system gets me just under 4000 on the benchmark.

And the total cost of all my parts (not counting OS ($140), case ($100) and monitor) was about $700-750. So I don't get how people are allegedly running systems that are less than a year old, cost $1500+, and are getting benchmark scores of 2500 or lower, unless they paid retail or were uninformed about the parts they were buying.

My initial assumption is that these people are paying retail, and it's pretty common knowledge among system builders that the value of parts in a system that retails for $900+ is usually 50-75% of what you're actually paying for a system.

A friend of mine was planning to spend about $1200ish on a Dell XPS last week and I showed him how we could pick out some parts (better processor, better RAM, better video, better everything) and the total bill came to under 1k.

Honestly, when it comes to retail desktops, for under 400, you're getting a piece of junk. For 500-800, you're getting a decent system that can run most things (FFXIV is not one of them) on low-medium settings. For $900+, you're almost always better off building it yourself (Or having someone build it for you); you can get a better system for the same price or the same system for a lower price.

If you consider yourself a semi-serious gamer, you will nearly always benefit from building your own system. A serious gamer that doesn't know how to build a system is like a classic car enthusiast that doesn't know how to change their own oil. If you're interested in learning, find a friend that can teach you (or just look up instructions online).

Granted, my system is no i7 with a 5870, but it's a Phenom II x4 with a 5770 and 4 GB of RAM and it gets me 4k for under $1k. I don't think people need to be spending $1500+ on their systems (Although if you have the money, go for it), but for what I paid, I'm happy with the performance I'm expecting to get out of it according to the benchmark. As far as price vs performance goes, it's just a matter of balancing price and performance. The more you pay, the better the performance you'll get. If price -is- an object and you can't afford the top of the line everything, it's just a matter of figuring out how much performance to lose to save on money without crippling yourself. You may not want to spend $500 for a processor, but you can still get a good one for $140-170. Getting a $90 one will kill you. You may not want to spend $500 for a video card either, but again you can still get a good one for $140-170. And again, getting a $90 one will kill you.

I could go on, but I'm way off topic as-is.

Edited, Jun 19th 2010 8:31pm by Mikhalia
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#56 Jun 19 2010 at 10:37 PM Rating: Default
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Now you're crossing the line between whiny and just a right sodding twunt. Smarten up. Seriously. You bought crap and you think you're in a position to be advising people on what they should or shouldn't be looking for in a PC to run XIV? Get over yourself. You're an ignorant buyer and a forum wart. And when it was pointed out to you that blowing it like you did and then arguing like you were in the right for buying crap was not kosher, you have a meltdown and cry moar. Go figure. If someone is in the market for a new PC to run XIV and they can't afford to pend $1500-2000, they're better off with a PS3. My statement stands...pay the money or don't, but don't whine when you try to shortcut the shortcut and get burned


I am not the one on here giving advice you are. Telling someone to save another $1,000 to build a $2,000 PC that may or may not be much better then a PS3 is out right stupid. Until you see how the game runs on the PS3 I wouldn't be giving people advice. I know if I knew no better and listen to you and built a $2,000 PC and there wasn't much difference between PS3 I would be *******

You have no idea on how the game is going to run, if history repeats its self your going to be in for a rude awaking. When EQ2 launched the baddest of the bad PC's ran the game like crap. I am going to laugh in your face if history repeats its self.

Right now beta runs @720p and puts a strain on the best of PC's. Now times that with DX11 and 1080P and your going to have some serious slow downs! Until you have beta and know how the game is going to run your advice means as much to me as a steaming pile of dog crap!
#57 Jun 19 2010 at 10:42 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Granted, my system is no i7 with a 5870, but it's a Phenom II x4 with a 5770 and 4 GB of RAM and it gets me 4k for under $1k.


Are you running the benchmark in 720p?? Because I can hit just under 4k running 720p!
#58 Jun 19 2010 at 11:08 PM Rating: Decent
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My current PC won't be able to run it. I'd really like to play it on PC but economically speaking it looks like I might need to borrow my brothers PS3 for a bit (he doesn't play it very often)
#59 Jun 19 2010 at 11:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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TheBSTGuy wrote:
Quote:
Granted, my system is no i7 with a 5870, but it's a Phenom II x4 with a 5770 and 4 GB of RAM and it gets me 4k for under $1k.


Are you running the benchmark in 720p?? Because I can hit just under 4k running 720p!


Well, given that my monitor maxes out at 1280x1024, that's the resolution I'm going to be running the game at. And it runs more than adequately at that resolution.

The high resolution benchmark is too big. I'd need a second monitor for it, or a new one to replace this one, and for reasons that I've already went into in depth in this post, I'm not going to get a second monitor or replace my first one.

So if your computer can hit under 4k in 720, then good. You have a system that can run the game fine as-is and don't need to spend any money on new parts to upgrade it.

So if your benchmark is at 4k, what are you ******** about?
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#60 Jun 19 2010 at 11:31 PM Rating: Default
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Quote:
So if your benchmark is at 4k, what are you ******** about?


Because It's 4k @ 720p and not 1080P. I ran the test again this time I over clocked the processor and opened the task manager and seen that my processor is working @ 18%~30%. Its clearly a GPU problem and not a CPU problem. I havent had a chance to go over the bench marks in a few days. I wonder how I would score if I had a ATI 5870 video card?
#61 Jun 20 2010 at 12:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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TheBSTGuy wrote:
Quote:
So if your benchmark is at 4k, what are you ******** about?


Because It's 4k @ 720p and not 1080P.


I don't see anything wrong with 720p. That's what I'll be running it on, and I'll be able to tune up the graphical effects given that I got a 4k.

I still don't get why you've been complaining for half of the last page; is it really all over the fact that despite having a perfectly acceptable score on a perfectly acceptable resolution, you're unhappy that a higher resolution gives you a lower score?

I don't get where all the "Stop wasting your money on a good computer"/"I'm saving for retirement!"/"Clearly anyone who is going to buy a decent system will be flipping burgers at 70 years old" (Really not sure where that last one came from at all, but I digress) rage is coming from if you have a system perfectly capable of running the game at a perfectly acceptable setting.

You've got half a dozen posts trying to bite someone else's head off over the fact that you can't run a game that isn't out yet on max resolution with maxes settings, and I'm just trying to understand the purpose and reason behind the animosity if you have a perfectly fine system.

*scratches head*
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#62 Jun 20 2010 at 12:25 AM Rating: Good
Mikhalia wrote:
I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. My system gets me just under 4000 on the benchmark.


Same here.

Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.

Also here's hoping SE allows alt-tabbing, or even *gasp* something that plays nicely with multiple monitors.
#63 Jun 20 2010 at 12:28 AM Rating: Decent
Lamnethx of the Seven Seas wrote:
Mikhalia wrote:
I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second. My system gets me just under 4000 on the benchmark.


Same here.

Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.

Also here's hoping SE allows alt-tabbing, or even *gasp* something that plays nicely with multiple monitors.


It's pretty much 100% guaranteed that you'll be able to tab out of the game (or at least run it windowed). We've already seen it running on 3 monitors at E3 as well.
#64 Jun 20 2010 at 12:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Lamnethx of the Seven Seas wrote:
Mikhalia wrote:
I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second.


Same here.

Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.

I'm not sure I'm understanding this post correctly. Are you saying people can last longer playing on a PC than on a console..? Because I play on both and I assure you that is not the case for everyone.
#65 Jun 20 2010 at 12:31 AM Rating: Decent
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I'm just trying to understand the purpose and reason behind the animosity if you have a perfectly fine system.
I have a 1080p monitor the 720p benchmark covers about half of my screen. Its not the way I want to play, I will just buy a PS3 and play on my big screen and be happy. In two years the difference in PC technology is going to be night and day. I will just build a new computer then, for now I will keep on using what I have.
#66 Jun 20 2010 at 12:34 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.
Its easy, you just sit back in the lazyboy with your feet propped up and your wireless keyboard on your lap. What more could you ask for? =p
#67 Jun 20 2010 at 12:38 AM Rating: Decent
Bluefirefly wrote:
I'm not sure I'm understanding this post correctly. Are you saying people can last longer playing on a PC than on a console..? Because I play on both and I assure you that is not the case for everyone.


Normal console games don't have chat logs, the eye-strain from reading small text on a TV that is half a room away for five hours. Then again the only thing I can really compare it to, was trying out FFXI on the 360.
#68 Jun 20 2010 at 12:42 AM Rating: Good
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TheBSTGuy wrote:
Quote:
I'm just trying to understand the purpose and reason behind the animosity if you have a perfectly fine system.
I have a 1080p monitor the 720p benchmark covers about half of my screen. Its not the way I want to play, I will just buy a PS3 and play on my big screen and be happy. In two years the difference in PC technology is going to be night and day. I will just build a new computer then, for now I will keep on using what I have.


Fair enough. I think the anger/rage was excessive, but I guess I can see where you're coming from. :)

TheBSTGuy wrote:
Quote:
Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.
Its easy, you just sit back in the lazyboy with your feet propped up and your wireless keyboard on your lap. What more could you ask for? =p


Or in my case, I ended up inheriting two spare living room chairs when my grandparents passed away and after we moved into their house, my fiancee and I use them in our computer room. ^^ Computers + Comfy chairs = win.

I'll grant you I like my 55" TV downstairs for most games, but I'd still rather keep FFXIV up here on my computer, where I have a second one next to me to look things up, instead of needing to situate myself in my living room with a keyboard on my lap, mouse on the end table, and laptop next to it for IMs/looking stuff up.

To each their own.
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#69 Jun 20 2010 at 12:48 AM Rating: Good
Mikhalia wrote:
Computers + Comfy chairs = win


Tell me about it
#70 Jun 20 2010 at 12:52 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I'd still rather keep FFXIV up here on my computer, where I have a second one next to me to look things up, instead of needing to situate myself in my living room with a keyboard on my lap, mouse on the end table, and laptop next to it for IMs/looking stuff up.


I agree its much nicer then having to get out of the lazyboy and go in the other room and look something up. How ever if SE wants millions of subscriptions like WOW. Then the game should be made so easy that my 5yr old niece can play the game with out looking a single thing up. I can play either way and I don't care how many subscriptions FFXIV will have. So long as I can find a party to do what I want.
#71 Jun 20 2010 at 12:52 AM Rating: Good
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Nice computer chair sofa.
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#72 Jun 20 2010 at 12:55 AM Rating: Good
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How ever if SE wants millions of subscriptions like WOW.


Luckily, I think SE has figured out that trying to emulate WoW hasn't worked out so great for everyone else who tried...

One of the main draws of FFXI, was that it was so different from the mainstream MMOs on the market, and I can only hope SE realized that.
#73 Jun 20 2010 at 12:58 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Luckily, I think SE has figured out that trying to emulate WoW hasn't worked out so great for everyone else who tried...

One of the main draws of FFXI, was that it was so different from the mainstream MMOs on the market, and I can only hope SE realized that.


Time will tell but greed has a funny way of making people try and emulate what the other person is doing.
#74 Jun 20 2010 at 1:03 AM Rating: Excellent
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TheBSTGuy wrote:
Quote:
I'd still rather keep FFXIV up here on my computer, where I have a second one next to me to look things up, instead of needing to situate myself in my living room with a keyboard on my lap, mouse on the end table, and laptop next to it for IMs/looking stuff up.


I agree its much nicer then having to get out of the lazyboy and go in the other room and look something up. How ever if SE wants millions of subscriptions like WOW. Then the game should be made so easy that my 5yr old niece can play the game with out looking a single thing up. I can play either way and I don't care how many subscriptions FFXIV will have. So long as I can find a party to do what I want.


At the risk of derailing the thread on a massive tangent, I have to comment on this.

I do agree the game should not be so completely lacking explanation that FFXI was (Where "Hey, go find this moondrop" neglects to mention "It's way up in Boyahda tree, on an island, at a ??? that only spawns at night, and an NM will spawn, so bring friends"), but I would rather have a game that -isn't- so easy that a 5 year old can play it. It's not that I have anything against your five year old niece, I'm sure she's a lovely girl and all that, but I'd rather play a game that isn't "So easy, a caveman could do it". Not calling your niece a caveman, either.

I can also agree that I don't care how many subscriptions they have. Actually, scratch that. I do care. I, ideally, would like them to have "enough that people can get a group within a reasonable amount of time". Beyond THAT, I don't care. It's not that I don't want SE to make money (I do); it's just that outside of the people on my server, the number of overall subscribers (and the number of servers) has no effect on my gameplay experience. Dumbing down the game to attract more people doesn't affect me in terms of "Oh, more people are playing"; it affects me in terms of "This game is too easy and I'm bored".

So I agree that it should be "easier than XI", but not mouth-breathingly, face-rollingly, keyboard-droolingly easy.
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#75 Jun 20 2010 at 1:10 AM Rating: Excellent
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Lamnethx of the Seven Seas wrote:
Quote:
How ever if SE wants millions of subscriptions like WOW.


Luckily, I think SE has figured out that trying to emulate WoW hasn't worked out so great for everyone else who tried...

One of the main draws of FFXI, was that it was so different from the mainstream MMOs on the market, and I can only hope SE realized that.


Honestly, that's the main reason I loved FFXI, and the main reason I played it for so long. It's also the reason that, if FFXIV totally fails to live up to what I'm hoping it will be, FFXI will be the game I go back to.

I've played FFXI and WoW for years. I've also played several other games in this time. There are so many MMOGs out there that look like the devs just copied the look and feel of WoW, scratching out the names of characters and writing their own. The UI is laid out the same, the whole "two warring factions" thing, the way their quest systems work and are tracked, rewards, dialogue... There are so many games out there that make it blatantly obvious that the developer was just trying to capitalize on WoW's popularity.

The problem is... if people want to play WoW, they will play WoW. If you're hoping to attract someone from WoW to your game, you need to convince them that your product is BETTER, not that it's the same. Better, by definition, means that you need to do something different.

And that's why the only games I can play for more than a week are ones that look and feel as little like WoW as possible. I liked WoW; I enjoyed it for years and then I stopped enjoying it and started looking for something that wasn't WoW. Downloading a game, installing it, and then staring at a carbon copy of the UI I've spent my WoW lifetime staring at is just... a letdown.

This isn't directed just at SE's FFXIV, or even MMO developers in general, rather this is directed at all companies that produce any product:

If another company is making a good product and it's more popular than yours... make yours BETTER, not the same.

I thought New Coke taught us that. I guess some people didn't learn though.
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#76 Jun 20 2010 at 1:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Mikhalia wrote:
Or in my case, I ended up inheriting two spare living room chairs when my grandparents passed away and after we moved into their house, my fiancee and I use them in our computer room. ^^ Computers + Comfy chairs = win.

I'll grant you I like my 55" TV downstairs for most games, but I'd still rather keep FFXIV up here on my computer, where I have a second one next to me to look things up, instead of needing to situate myself in my living room with a keyboard on my lap, mouse on the end table, and laptop next to it for IMs/looking stuff up.

To each their own.

If FFXIV is going to be windowed/alt-tabbable, as evidence so far has been supporting, I don't think you'll be needing both computers, hopefully. :)

Must say, though, unless you're using a controller for your PC, using a mouse requires you to stay seated in more or less the same position for hours on end and, comfy chairs or not, that gets annoying. You don't need a mouse period if you're playing on a console in your living room. I prefer to lay in bed while playing with a wireless controller and keyboard and to address the above comment, FFXI text was just as easy, if not easier, to read on a television for me than on a computer monitor simply because everything was bigger. It also produces less eyestrain because I'm not forced to be so close to a screen for long periods of time.
#77 Jun 20 2010 at 1:41 AM Rating: Decent
Mikhalia wrote:
And that's why the only games I can play for more than a week are ones that look and feel as little like WoW as possible. I liked WoW; I enjoyed it for years and then I stopped enjoying it and started looking for something that wasn't WoW. Downloading a game, installing it, and then staring at a carbon copy of the UI I've spent my WoW lifetime staring at is just... a letdown.


There's an awful lot of WoW mainstream MMO concept in XIV already. And really, that's the best thing SE could have done. SE isn't know for their UI, or their user friendliness in general. They aren't known for their gameplay mechanics. If you look at virtually every FF title (excluding XI and probably XIII), it's basically a next generation hardware spin on the exact same concepts.

What SE is known for is storytelling, especially as far as the FF series goes. That's their "ace in the hole", so to speak. They're known for their character development from a storytelling perspective and their characters in general. Take Cid, for example. Cid is probably the most recognized non-moogle character in the entire franchise. If you need an airship, Cid's the go-to guy. And who doesn't need an airship? Cid knows his sh*t. He's like the drunk uncle who farts too much who, despite his alcoholism and noxious fumes has somehow managed to pick up more down to earth wisdom than anyone else in the world. Even when they come as close as they possibly could to butchering his character like they did in FFIX, Cid is still the goods. And anyone who has any entitlement to call themselves a fan of the FF franchise knows exactly who Cid is. What other RPG franchise can say the same thing about their characters?

In short, SE is known for taking epic stories and wrapping them around mediocre gameplay in such a way that you don't care how uninspired the combat systems are, you just want to keep going. I was bored sh*tless of the combat system and day to day grind in XI long before I stopped playing but CoP kept me around for over a full year because I wanted to see that next cutscene. And it wasn't until I found ToAU to fall disturbingly short in the first half of the missions that I finally threw in the towel. And in truth, that was mostly because CoP was such an incredibly tough act to follow, not because ToAU was terrible.

If borrowing this gameplay mechanic from that game and that gameplay mechanic from this game gives SE a more entertaining foundation for their storytelling platform, XIV is going to do very, very well.


Edited, Jun 20th 2010 1:22am by Aurelius
#78 Jun 20 2010 at 1:53 AM Rating: Good
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Bluefirefly wrote:
Mikhalia wrote:
Or in my case, I ended up inheriting two spare living room chairs when my grandparents passed away and after we moved into their house, my fiancee and I use them in our computer room. ^^ Computers + Comfy chairs = win.

I'll grant you I like my 55" TV downstairs for most games, but I'd still rather keep FFXIV up here on my computer, where I have a second one next to me to look things up, instead of needing to situate myself in my living room with a keyboard on my lap, mouse on the end table, and laptop next to it for IMs/looking stuff up.

To each their own.

If FFXIV is going to be windowed/alt-tabbable, as evidence so far has been supporting, I don't think you'll be needing both computers, hopefully. :)

Must say, though, unless you're using a controller for your PC, using a mouse requires you to stay seated in more or less the same position for hours on end and, comfy chairs or not, that gets annoying. You don't need a mouse period if you're playing on a console in your living room. I prefer to lay in bed while playing with a wireless controller and keyboard and to address the above comment, FFXI text was just as easy, if not easier, to read on a television for me than on a computer monitor simply because everything was bigger. It also produces less eyestrain because I'm not forced to be so close to a screen for long periods of time.


This is just where personal preference comes into it again.

I like to play my games in full screen; I hate them in a window. And it's more preferable for me to have maps/strategies/IM window/music player open on a second computer with a second keyboard and mouse than it is for me to alt-tab back and forth.

Not saying I'm against a windowed option (That I'll never ever use) or the ability to alt-tab (which will also have limited use at best) but I'd prefer it the way I'm used to it.

And as for the controller... I just like my mouse better for precision and function than a controller. I won't even -touch- an FPS game on a console. Anything moddable (e.g. FFXI .dat swaps, or any game like Oblivion/Fallout/NWN that has massive amounts of free, user-created content) also becomes "PC only" for me.

The only things I use my consoles for are games where no typing are required, button mashing is more important than precision, and the thought of never being able to add to my game does not affect me (Rock Band/Guitar Hero were exceptions for which I've downloaded extra songs, but I almost never get any DLC for anything that isn't on my computer). I'm well aware that I have hook up a keyboard to my other systems (and have) but once a keyboard becomes required for a major portion of the game, or if the game will require updates/downloads (or will have a large amount of them), it has officially entered "I will only ever play this on PC" territory for me.

Also, for the love of me, I cannot figure out how FFXI was ever even playable without a keyboard without driving yourself insane, but that's another matter. I know people have done it; I just can't picture it.

So yeah, it's a matter of opinion. If you like a console better, I won't try to talk you out of what you're comfortable with. But I don't play anything on consoles that involves online multiplayer or a keyboard. My console gaming is limited to single player games that require nothing more than the disk that came in the box, and the controller that came with the system (Again, RB/GH being the only exception).

I still don't even have a PS3 because there are no games on it I want enough (That aren't also available on PC or 360) that I'm willing to fork out 300 bucks for a new system. Nearly every game that interests me is for PC, and the few that aren't are 360/DS/PSP.

Just my own preference. YMMV.
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#79 Jun 20 2010 at 2:01 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
In short, SE is known for taking epic stories and wrapping them around mediocre gameplay in such a way that you don't care how uninspired the combat systems are, you just want to keep going. I was bored sh*tless of the combat system and day to day grind in XI long before I stopped playing but CoP kept me around for over a full year because I wanted to see that next cutscene. And it wasn't until I found ToAU to fall disturbingly short in the first half of the missions that I finally threw in the towel. And in truth, that was mostly because CoP was such an incredibly tough act to follow, not because ToAU was terrible.


I found that a staggeringly accurate description. I personally didn't dislike XI's UI or combat system, but I can agree that the stories of FF games are their selling points more so than the game play (Especially when you talk about "gems" like 13... ugh)

Gameplay is my first concern when I pick up a game. Balancing and Story come in second or third, and graphics don't come till way later, but gameplay is always first for me. I want a game that's easy to play, but not a game that's easy.

As for the UI, I think it looks unique enough that it's fine. It's not the obvious wow clone that some other games are.

It's one thing to take a few general ideas from popular games and incorporate them into your own; it's another to make your game look almost exactly like it.
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#80 Jun 20 2010 at 6:42 AM Rating: Decent
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ShadowedgeFFXI wrote:
I just can't justify spending 2k for one frigging game. I'd rather wait 1-2 years the cut corners for a launch rig. Good or bad plan?


Sounds like you just answered your own question. My advice is the PS3. It's cheaper and it's almost a guarantee(almost) that it will look good as it keep that smooth framerate coming out. I say almost since on my PS2 XI wasn't all that smooth. I don't know what quality others had though. I speak only for myself.
#81 Jun 20 2010 at 12:50 PM Rating: Excellent
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Please play nicely in the forum. we just had it cleaned and it takes forever to get the blood out of the carpet. Also, for the record, my computer can beat up all of your computers, so nyah <thbbt!!!>
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#82 Jun 20 2010 at 12:51 PM Rating: Decent
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Please play nicely in the forum. we just had it cleaned and it takes forever to get the blood out of the carpet. Also, for the record, my computer can beat up all of your computers, so nyah <thbbt!!!>


I'm still waiting for your tweaked benchmark scores! Dag nabbit! Git a move on!!
#83 Jun 20 2010 at 1:39 PM Rating: Decent
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I'll be playing on PS3 :) I played my XI career on a PC with a mouse and keyboard though so I am a little curious to see how 'frustrating' I may find paving through XIV on a PS3 to be. Buuut I have a Macbook Pro now and so my PS3 is what will be able to run it out of the box (plus I can play it on a TV).

Mikhalia and Aurelius have a pretty interesting discussion going here. I agree with you both. While I did find the comparably fast paced / 'esay' gameplay of WoW refreshing at some points, I think the XI community accepted the game for what it was and just understood who XI was targeting. If you were suited for the XI gameplay then the game was an amazing experience. I hope SE is still brave enough to produce a product that they don't intend to obliterate / overcome all other MMOs on the market, but rather produce a solid product that perfectly delivers what FF fans expect it to deliver.

Overall I want a 'Final Fantasy' out of XIV. One that's transitioned beautifully into an MMO. I don't want another WoW or one of the 50 WoW knock offs. And I think that Aurelius said it great about what makes an FF an FF. Its memorable characters and beautifully told stories. Cutscenes that make your jaw drop and get you amped up. Music that's unrivaled by any other game of the same genre on the market. I love seeing how they re-use the FF staples such as Cid, Summoners and summons, Moogles, etc and use them in different ways to create compelling experiences.

I guess what I'm saying to XIV is: Go ahead and experiment with game mechanics if you think it will be well received...... but if at the end of it all I don't feel like I'm playing a Final Fantasy then something went very very wrong.

edit: spelling




Edited, Jun 20th 2010 3:39pm by infinity2k9
#84 Jun 20 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Good
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Bluefirefly wrote:
Lamnethx of the Seven Seas wrote:
Mikhalia wrote:
I'm a PC gamer first and a console gamer second.


Same here.

Honestly, you spend such long times sitting down and playing a MMO, and unless you are hooking your PS3 up to a monitor and playing at a desk, I really don't know how you could last.

I'm not sure I'm understanding this post correctly. Are you saying people can last longer playing on a PC than on a console..? Because I play on both and I assure you that is not the case for everyone.


Idk about you guys. My *** sits fine without moving regardless of it being in front of the PC or in front of the TV/console. Protip: a$$ grooves.
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#85 Jun 20 2010 at 5:19 PM Rating: Decent
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FenrirXIII wrote:

Idk about you guys. My *** sits fine without moving regardless of it being in front of the PC or in front of the TV/console. Protip: a$$ grooves.

Unfortunately from running and working out I have more of a rounded, toned behind and therefore the muscles become uncomfortable sitting in a chair for long periods of time. Not saying you have a fat *** or anything, just explaining why *** grooves don't help me very much. ^^b
#86 Jun 20 2010 at 5:57 PM Rating: Good
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I'll be playing FFXIV on my PC, so that my gaming sessions aren't interrupted because my girlfriend wants to watch Project Runway, or Gossip Girl, or The Girls Next Door, or The Real Housewives of Some Random State, or E! News, or Chelsea Lately, or....

...you get the idea.




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#87 Jun 20 2010 at 8:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Eske wrote:
I'll be playing FFXIV on my PC, so that my gaming sessions aren't interrupted because my girlfriend wants to watch Project Runway, or Gossip Girl, or The Girls Next Door, or The Real Housewives of Some Random State, or E! News, or Chelsea Lately, or....

...you get the idea.




-_-


I hadn't even THOUGHT of this..... Good call. I'll now need to re-evaluate my decision.
#88 Jun 20 2010 at 8:24 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Eske wrote:
I'll be playing FFXIV on my PC, so that my gaming sessions aren't interrupted because my girlfriend wants to watch Project Runway, or Gossip Girl, or The Girls Next Door, or The Real Housewives of Some Random State, or E! News, or Chelsea Lately, or....

...you get the idea.




-_-

I hadn't even THOUGHT of this..... Good call. I'll now need to re-evaluate my decision.


I'll still be playing on PS3 regardless. I have a separate TV in my office dedicated to gaming. It's soon to be upgraded to something LCDish :D

If you want, you could probably pick up a generic old CRT TV at a flea market real cheap and set it up somewhere out of the way. Just a thought. ;)
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#89 Jun 20 2010 at 10:33 PM Rating: Good
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So here's my setup...

Living Room
55" projection TV on right with DVR, DVD player, surround sound, and 360.
27" TV on left with PS2, N64, SNES, NES, VCR.
Couch, Sofa, Recliner

Computer Room
My desk - 19" LCD, iMac G5, two keyboards, two mice, recliner, AC to my right, Ottoman to my left to prop feet up on, or set laptop on
Fiancee's desk - 19" CRT, space for laptop on right.
In the middle - 19" TV

I spend most of my time in the computer room. I just enjoy the setup more.

Sadly, the living room only sees use when I get a random urge to play something on a console, or when company comes over.
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#90 Jun 20 2010 at 10:58 PM Rating: Decent
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PC.

I need to upgrade my 'old' E7200 to a Q9550. I'll overclock that to maybe 3.5, then maybe buy a 5830, 5850 or something in that range. Ugh though I may have to buy a new PSU.

That will cost me about: $500-$600! But I should be able to run it on high comfortably.

A new i7 rig would cost me about $400 more...

In the end I use my computer a lot more than I would ever use a PS3. And with this upgrade I'll have a very decent rig.

Edited, Jun 21st 2010 2:52am by Kierk
#91 Jun 21 2010 at 7:46 AM Rating: Good
As I said when I started this thread im going with PS3, I have come here now to ask what sort of spec would be good for ffxiv if I was to save up for a PC?

I'm not very PC wise when it comes to components?

Pinkfyre.
#92 Jun 21 2010 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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I would advise that if you are going to build a rig for gaming. First focus on what video card(s) you want. Then build the computer around that. I have 1 geforce 260 gtx and a 2.5 ghz intel quad core, 4 mb ram. On high res. it ran a score of 2500 on the ffxiv benchmark and everything was smooth. This is about a 2 year old setup, so I would say at a minimum you would want my setup or a similar setup and nothing lower, if you are going to make a new purchase. Second, decide on a processor, find out how many watts it outputs and search to see if it gets too hot (temperature) compared to others. Find a motherboard that compliments the processor and also has an nvidia chipset if you are going with an nvidia video card. If not then it is ATI and someone help me "crossfire"? I cannot emphasize this last part enough. Purchase a powersupply that has an exhaust system, that faces your processor, and vents with a good fan, the hot air out the back of the case. Get a powersupply that will exceed what you need by 100 watts. And place a decent front intake fan to pull new air into the case. I have a microcenter computer store near me and they always know which components are both good and cheap and run well. If you have a store like that near you, go talk to them. Bestbuy does not count haha...

Side note: If your computer is not performing well, always find a video card upgrade first. Upgrading other components usually will not help, or be as effective. And make sure your motherboard and powersupply can handle the video card.

*Edit*

Here is my system, more detailed.

Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit
Motherboard: EVGA
Chipset: nForce 750i SLI
1 x Geforce 260 GTX, PCI
1 x Processor: Intel Core 2 Quad, Q9300, 2.5 GHZ (4CPUs)
4 gigs of ddr2 ram
800 watt powersupply
Sata hard drives

Edited, Jun 21st 2010 10:49am by Parsalyn

Edited, Jun 21st 2010 10:50am by Parsalyn

Edited, Jun 21st 2010 10:51am by Parsalyn
#93 Jun 21 2010 at 9:02 AM Rating: Decent
Pinkfyre wrote:
As I said when I started this thread im going with PS3, I have come here now to ask what sort of spec would be good for ffxiv if I was to save up for a PC?

I'm not very PC wise when it comes to components?


It depends largely on how much you're prepared to spend. Realistically speaking, if you're going to spend your hard earned money on a new PC for FFXIV, you're going to want one that is capable of a benchmark score no lower than 3000 on high resolution. A score of 3000 according to the scale we were given basically means that the computer will run fine at default settings in most situations, but you're likely to experience a certain amount of noticeable stutter in crowded areas. For most people, that would be acceptable for a rig they already own, but to buy a new PC for the kind of performance is questionable as to whether or not you're going to feel you made the right choice.

Something like an Intel i7/i5 processor with suitable motherboard, RAM (6GB minimum), PSU, etc. and a Radeon 5850 or a GTX465 graphics card would probably give you a benchmark score in the 4000 range. That's good performance at default settings with a buffer against crowded zones and/or the option to turn on a few extra graphics refinements/environmental settings. With some savvy shopping you should be able to source the components and have it assembled for you for $1300-1500.
#94 Jun 21 2010 at 9:54 AM Rating: Decent
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I'll be using my PS3, even though I played FFXI on my PC and I think I would prefer to play on a PC. Unfortunately, I'm using a MacBook Pro now and my desktop is pretty old.

On the point of playing on the PS3, is it possible to play FFXIV on the PS3 with keyboard and mouse? Or is it too early to tell?

Thanks.
#95 Jun 21 2010 at 9:58 AM Rating: Good
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Zelcarim wrote:
On the point of playing on the PS3, is it possible to play FFXIV on the PS3 with keyboard and mouse? Or is it too early to tell?

Thanks.


Yep, you can use keyboard + mouse on the PS3. FFXIV will presumably support it just fine.


Edited, Jun 21st 2010 11:58am by Eske
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#96 Jun 21 2010 at 11:36 AM Rating: Good
Well if that is the case, I think i'll stick to my PS3 if you can use Mouse and keyboard.

BUT -----

My current computer I have right now is:

Motherboard = Gigabyte G31M-ES2L
Processor = Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9550 @ 2.83Ghz
RAM = 4GB
Graphics Card = nVidia GeForce 9500GT
Hardrive = 1.5TB SATA
OS = Windows 7 64 Bit

(I have no idea what any of that means, Bro wrote it for me)

If I need to upgrade anything what would it be?

Id like to have PC and PS3 available for FFXIV
#97 Jun 21 2010 at 12:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Pinkfyre wrote:

Motherboard = Gigabyte G31M-ES2L
Processor = Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9550 @ 2.83Ghz
RAM = 4GB
Graphics Card = nVidia GeForce 9500GT
Hardrive = 1.5TB SATA
OS = Windows 7 64 Bit

If I need to upgrade anything what would it be?


Just the graphics card.

A 5770 from ATI should do the trick for 720p. If you have your desktop resolution @ 1920x1080(1080p) then you'll need to get one of the top-of-the-line cards like the 470/480 from Nvidia or 5850/5870/5970 from ATI.
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#98 Jun 21 2010 at 12:29 PM Rating: Good
Quote:
A 5770 from ATI should do the trick for 720p. If you have your desktop resolution @ 1920x1080(1080p) then you'll need to get one of the top-of-the-line cards like the 470/480 from Nvidia or 5850/5870/5970 from ATI.


If you are trying to stay on the cheap, you should check out the prices on Nvidia's 9800 or 250. That's what me and my girlfriend are running, and we both scored ~2500 on the 720p benchmark.
#99 Jun 21 2010 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
Thanks, I'll have to see if I can get the money, If not i'll stick to ps3 :)
#100 Jun 21 2010 at 4:45 PM Rating: Good
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Lamnethx of the Seven Seas wrote:
Quote:
A 5770 from ATI should do the trick for 720p. If you have your desktop resolution @ 1920x1080(1080p) then you'll need to get one of the top-of-the-line cards like the 470/480 from Nvidia or 5850/5870/5970 from ATI.


If you are trying to stay on the cheap, you should check out the prices on Nvidia's 9800 or 250. That's what me and my girlfriend are running, and we both scored ~2500 on the 720p benchmark.


I'm getting ~4k on 720 with a 5770 and it ran me about $160.
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#101 Jun 21 2010 at 9:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Let me re-emphasize. Your video card(s) can be the most deciding factor on how the game performs on a pc. You could have a geforce "insert numbers" and an 8 core processor and 6 gigs of ram, but you could still fail to perform. On the other side you could have a 2 core processor and 2 gigs of ram, and the most high end video card and it would not do too well, because it is bottlenecking.

A great example are pre-built machines like hp or other things like emachines. All of the components do well together because they are at a similar level of performance. So what I am trying to say is don't go out and buy a ferrari level of performance video card, and then try to run it on a system that is is four years old. And don't do the opposite as well. If your pc is extremely out-dated as a whole, then it is probably time to upgrade nearly everything.

Look at video card benchmarks online, see how they perform on different games and compare them to other brands or generations, and then build a system around them. Some of this is vague, but if you put the time in and do some research, you will save yourself headaches.
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