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#502 Jul 27 2010 at 2:19 PM Rating: Default
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I wonder if the advantages the 965 was showing over the 1055 was due to FFXIV benchmark not using all 6 cores. Couple that with the slower clock on the 1055 and that may account for the difference.

Interesting indeed...

If that holds true and this PC is going to be used exclusively for FFXIV, I would go ahead and save the $20 and get the 955 and then just OC it slightly to match the 965. Stock CPU coolers and voltages are almost always OK for slight OCing like that.

The extra cash could go into your pocket or into beefing up your PSU. The 730W one you selected will be cutting it pretty close if you decide to go with dual GPUs in the future.
#503 Jul 27 2010 at 2:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Enscheff wrote:
I wonder if the advantages the 965 was showing over the 1055 was due to FFXIV benchmark not using all 6 cores. Couple that with the slower clock on the 1055 and that may account for the difference.

Interesting indeed...

If that holds true and this PC is going to be used exclusively for FFXIV, I would go ahead and save the $20 and get the 955 and then just OC it slightly to match the 965. Stock CPU coolers and voltages are almost always OK for slight OCing like that.

The extra cash could go into your pocket or into beefing up your PSU. The 730W one you selected will be cutting it pretty close if you decide to go with dual GPUs in the future.


That certainly could be the case. I am wondering if the "recommended" specs pushing the six-core CPUs are indicative that the game will utilize them, and therefore the lower clock speed will be offset by the 2 additional cores.

I figure it like this, though: if I can play the game with pretty good settings at 720P with the less expensive processors now, then in 6-12 months I can upgrade to the 6 core when the new chips are released and take advantage of more cores. If the game doesn't end up utilizing more than 4 cores, then I'm all set.

I ended up with the 730W PSU after reading tons of various reviews and such at NewEgg. The whole dual-GPU power requirement seemed to be overblown, as in I saw many people say they did dual GPUs (of the 57xx gen) with 650W or better PSUs. Maybe they weren't running them under major load? I figured the 730W was a good compromise between "I can use 2 cards at 650W!" and "You need 900-1000W to even consider two cards!". Worst case, I just upgrade to a better, single card once the next gen ones are released.

One other thing that's bugging me... is there any need to get more than Win 7 Home Premium for a pure gaming machine? Network backup would be nice, but if all I need to reinstall is a game or two and the OS... meh. Are there other features in Pro or Ultimate that I will be sorry I didn't get?

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 4:49pm by Edalya
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#504 Jul 27 2010 at 3:03 PM Rating: Decent
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I agree, go with the 955 for now save yourself some money towards a better GPU. Make sure to get an AM3 board because it sounds like AMD is planning on releasing "8 core" processors aka "Bulldozer" in early 2011, supposedly true 8 core PSU vs intel's HT versions.
#505 Jul 27 2010 at 4:32 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm not planning on pulling the trigger on a GPU until much closer to release to see if anything new from either ATI or Nvidia are released or to see if prices drop for both these cards over the next couple months. Based on deals through new egg however is a $100 difference justifiable to upgrade from an ATI 5770 to a GTX 460?
#506 Jul 27 2010 at 5:39 PM Rating: Default
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My PC is currently rocking a Core2 Duo E6600 OC'd to 3.0GHz, and an 8800GTS 320MB GPU. I only plan on playing at 720p. I know the GPU isn't going to cut the mustard, so I will be upgrading it for sure. I am hoping my dual core CPU at 3.0GHz will not hinder me too much.

If my CPU does end up holding me back too much then I will buy a new PC based around the X6 1055T and swap in my upgraded GPU and just trash my old PC or sell it off for parts.

My question is this:

Should I buy a used GTX 260 for ~$140 and stick it in my current system and give it a shot, or buy a GTX 460 1GB and stick it in my system and give it a shot?

What are some good sites to buy used GPUs?

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 7:42pm by Enscheff
#507 Jul 27 2010 at 5:53 PM Rating: Decent
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My now sub $600 build I'm pretty pleased with. Gaah 2 weeks till I cna start buying parts is killing me. I keep changing things lol.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/attachments/general-ffxiv-discussion/23879d1280274591-guide-building-pc-play-ffxiv-parts.gif

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 7:53pm by BunnyFufinator

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 7:54pm by BunnyFufinator
#508 Jul 27 2010 at 6:22 PM Rating: Default
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That is really a solid build, especially for around $600. Well done.
#509 Jul 27 2010 at 8:46 PM Rating: Good
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OK, I've done some building online, I will be going physically to the store to have them put it together for me, the $70 is worth piece of mind for them to do it for me, but this is what I've come up with. Any thoughts? Should I upgrade/downgrade on something? I would love to whittle down the cost a bit, but I don't want to lose any performance.

Corsair 6GB XMS3-1600 PC3-12800 Core™ i7 Triple Channel DDR3 Kit (3 x 2GB) w/ Intel XMP $219.99
Cooler Master Centurion 590 Chassis, Black $80.99 (Might get a cheaper case if it all fits into another. Don't care what it looks like.)
Scythe 120mm Slip Stream Kaze-Jyuni PWM Fan $9.99
AMD Phenom™ II X6 1055T 2.8GHz w/ 9MB Cache (Retail Box, Socket AM3) $219.99
Asus M4A88TD-M w/ Radeon HD 4250, DualDDR3 1333, 7.1 Audio, Gigabit Lan, Hybrid CrossFireX, HDMI $99.99
SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda 7200.12 SATA II w/ 16MB Cache $46.99
Samsung SH-S223L 22x DVD-Writer, SATA w/ Lightscribe Black $27.99
Asus EAH5830 Radeon HD 5830 DirectCU 1GB GDDR5 PCI-E w/ DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort $259.99
Antec EarthWatts EA 650W Power Supply w/ Triple +12V $89.99
Assemble Assemble Hardware + Load my O/S $70.00
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium x64 (64-bit) DVD - OEM $119.99
Sub Total $1,245.90

Do I need more fans/cooling? Can I switch to a dual channel Ram like Kingston ValueRam and not see any changes? Do I need to switch to an Intel i7 to use that ram? Will any parts not work with each other? The motherboard was something that confused me. I had someone suggest the motherboard because I have no clue about it. Should I go with something else? Is 650w enough for the power supply? It's going to be hooked up to a 40" tv and I want to run the game on High settings.

Edit: The 5770 card is $190... will it make a huge difference if I downgrade to that? $70 is a good chunk of change.

Again, thanks!

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 11:34pm by AnaraWarren
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#510 Jul 27 2010 at 9:57 PM Rating: Good
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I'm a newbie computer builder myself so take the following with a grain of salt, but I'm fairly certain that motherboard only supports dual channel. You'd need a motherboard that's made for intel processors to use triple channel ram.
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#511 Jul 27 2010 at 10:36 PM Rating: Good
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Veagan wrote:
Thnx Threx, from what i read, it only support up to phenom (not phenom ii). would a regular phenom quad be good?


I wouldn't consider them "good," but they would still be half a lightyear better than the x2 you've got. ;)
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#512 Jul 27 2010 at 10:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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RufuSwho wrote:
Will a PCI-E 2.1 card like the 5850 or 5870 work fully in a PCI-E 2.0 slot?

I'm not sure I understand the designation of the PCI-E 2.1.


I don't know the details, but from what I've read the two have only very minor differences, and you shouldn't worry about them. I know I don't. :)
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#513 Jul 27 2010 at 10:42 PM Rating: Good
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Edalya wrote:
Enscheff wrote:
Edalya,

If I were you, I would either save $20 and go with the X4 955, or spend an extra $20 and go with the X6 1055T. Both have a better CPUMark/Price ratio than the X4 965:

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+Phenom+II+X6+1055T

You should be able to easily overclock the X4 955 to almost the same speed as you could overclock the X4 965 anyways. I would only spend extra money over the 955 to get more cores with the X6, not to get a minor clock speed bump with the 965.


I had originally gone with the 1055T, but in reading this thread and one on bluegartr, it seemed that people were getting better performance out of the 965 for the benchmark than with the 1055T. I could be wrong, and I'm okay with jumping to the 1055T, but it almost seemed like an X6 wasn't worth it unless you went with the 1090T. The 955 may not lose me much though, so could be a place to save a couple bucks.



I agree. I had originally planned on going with a 1055T myself, but after getting more info I'm now leaning toward a 955BE. I'm still waiting a bit though to see if SE somehow optimizes the game to take advantage of 6 cores.
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#514 Jul 27 2010 at 11:27 PM Rating: Good
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Edalya wrote:
I ended up with the 730W PSU after reading tons of various reviews and such at NewEgg. The whole dual-GPU power requirement seemed to be overblown, as in I saw many people say they did dual GPUs (of the 57xx gen) with 650W or better PSUs. Maybe they weren't running them under major load? I figured the 730W was a good compromise between "I can use 2 cards at 650W!" and "You need 900-1000W to even consider two cards!". Worst case, I just upgrade to a better, single card once the next gen ones are released.


Yeah, I've also noticed some of the exaggerations about PSU...although I guess in the case of this specific piece of hardware, exaggerating a bit to be on the safe side is better than underestimating and causing people's systems to fry.

From what I've read and my calculations, a 850W PSU is enough to run any AMD chip on the market right now AND two GTX 460s AND overclock all 3. That's, of course, if you don't have other crazy components like 5 hard drives, 10 case fans, three watercoolers and whatnot.
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#515 Jul 28 2010 at 10:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Anara,

That price seems a few hundred dollars too high, even for a built machine. Do yourself a favor and check out AVADirect.com. They seem to have the best price on PCs you can completely configure yourself. I buy all my complete systems from them.

Go here:

http://www.avadirect.com/product_details_configurator.asp?PRID=15159

Then select the following components that bring your total to $925 (most are already the default option):

COMPUCASE HEC 6C28B Black Mid-Tower Case, No PSU, ATX
HEC Orion HP 585D 585W Power Supply, 24-pin ATX, ATX12V, Dual 80mm Fans, OEM
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H (rev. 1.0), AM3, AMD® 785G, DDR3-1800
AMD Phenom™ II X6 1055T Six-Core 2.8GHz
CRUCIAL 4GB (2 x 2GB) PC3-10600 DDR3 1333MHz CL9 1.5V SDRAM DIMM, Non-ECC
SAPPHIRE Radeon™ HD 5830 800MHz, 1GB GDDR5 4000MHz
SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda® 7200.12, SATA 3 Gb/s, 7200 RPM, 16MB cache
SONY AD-7241S Black 24x DVD±R/RW Dual-Layer Burner w/ Lightscribe, SATA, OEM
MICROSOFT Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit Edition, OEM
WARRANTY Silver Warranty Package (3 Year Limited Parts, 3 Year Labor Warranty)

If you do not select a GPU the final price will be around $675 and you can pick up a 5830 on Newegg for $200 and install it yourself (installing a GPU is really very simple):

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125317&cm_re=5830-_-14-125-317-_-Product

If you do end up ordering from AVADirect, I would stick with the 1055T since it is only $40 more than the 955BE. I would bet good money that FFXIV will end up playing better on 6 cores. Even if it doesn't, FFXIV is not the only game you will be playing, and the 6 core processor is more powerful overall and certainly worth an extra $40.

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:09pm by Enscheff

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:10pm by Enscheff
#516 Jul 28 2010 at 10:25 AM Rating: Good
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Enscheff wrote:
Anara,

That price seems a few hundred dollars too high, even for a built machine. Do yourself a favor and check out AVADirect.com. They seem to have the best price on PCs you can completely configure yourself. I buy all my complete systems from them.

Go here:

http://www.avadirect.com/product_details_configurator.asp?PRID=15159

Then select the following components that bring your total to $925 (most are already the default option):

COMPUCASE HEC 6C28B Black Mid-Tower Case, No PSU, ATX
HEC Orion HP 585D 585W Power Supply, 24-pin ATX, ATX12V, Dual 80mm Fans, OEM
GIGABYTE GA-MA785GMT-UD2H (rev. 1.0), AM3, AMD® 785G, DDR3-1800
AMD Phenom™ II X6 1055T Six-Core 2.8GHz
CRUCIAL 4GB (2 x 2GB) PC3-10600 DDR3 1333MHz CL9 1.5V SDRAM DIMM, Non-ECC
SAPPHIRE Radeon™ HD 5830 800MHz, 1GB GDDR5 4000MHz
SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda® 7200.12, SATA 3 Gb/s, 7200 RPM, 16MB cache
SONY AD-7241S Black 24x DVD±R/RW Dual-Layer Burner w/ Lightscribe, SATA, OEM
MICROSOFT Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit Edition, OEM
WARRANTY Silver Warranty Package (3 Year Limited Parts, 3 Year Labor Warranty)

If you do not select a GPU the final price will be around $675 and you can pick up a 5830 on Newegg for $200 and install it yourself (installing a GPU is really very simple):

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125317&cm_re=5830-_-14-125-317-_-Product

If you do end up ordering from AVADirect, I would stick with the 1055T since it is only $40 more than the 955BE. I would bet good money that FFXIV will end up playing better on 6 cores. Even if it doesn't, FFXIV is not the only game you will be playing, and the 6 core processor is more powerful overall and certainly worth an extra $40.

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:09pm by Enscheff

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:10pm by Enscheff


Thanks! I'll have to look into if they ship to Canada and what the shipping prices would be. It might end up being around the same price, and if I go in person to the place in my city, I can always try and ask for a deal. Will be upgrading another computer at the same time, too, so it'll be a lot of money spent there.
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#517 Jul 28 2010 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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Enscheff wrote:
My PC is currently rocking a Core2 Duo E6600 OC'd to 3.0GHz, and an 8800GTS 320MB GPU. I only plan on playing at 720p. I know the GPU isn't going to cut the mustard, so I will be upgrading it for sure. I am hoping my dual core CPU at 3.0GHz will not hinder me too much.

If my CPU does end up holding me back too much then I will buy a new PC based around the X6 1055T and swap in my upgraded GPU and just trash my old PC or sell it off for parts.

My question is this:

Should I buy a used GTX 260 for ~$140 and stick it in my current system and give it a shot, or buy a GTX 460 1GB and stick it in my system and give it a shot?

What are some good sites to buy used GPUs?

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 7:42pm by Enscheff


Based on the fact that you're using a dual core and not a quad core, I dunno that I'd suggest putting too much more money into it without upgrading that. Normally I'd say upgrade the CPU and the GPU. However, the 460s are like $200 and with the 20% off code (there's a thread about Starcraft II, check that one), that drops the price to 160.
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#518 Jul 28 2010 at 10:40 AM Rating: Decent
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Threx wrote:
RufuSwho wrote:
Will a PCI-E 2.1 card like the 5850 or 5870 work fully in a PCI-E 2.0 slot?

I'm not sure I understand the designation of the PCI-E 2.1.


I don't know the details, but from what I've read the two have only very minor differences, and you shouldn't worry about them. I know I don't. :)


Great Threx. You, sir, are doing an excellent job carrying the tech question torch!
#519 Jul 28 2010 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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BunnyFufinator wrote:
My now sub $600 build I'm pretty pleased with. Gaah 2 weeks till I cna start buying parts is killing me. I keep changing things lol.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/attachments/general-ffxiv-discussion/23879d1280274591-guide-building-pc-play-ffxiv-parts.gif


Very nice build for the price.
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#520 Jul 28 2010 at 10:44 AM Rating: Good
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AnaraWarren wrote:
OK, I've done some building online, I will be going physically to the store to have them put it together for me, the $70 is worth piece of mind for them to do it for me, but this is what I've come up with. Any thoughts? Should I upgrade/downgrade on something? I would love to whittle down the cost a bit, but I don't want to lose any performance.

Corsair 6GB XMS3-1600 PC3-12800 Core™ i7 Triple Channel DDR3 Kit (3 x 2GB) w/ Intel XMP $219.99
Cooler Master Centurion 590 Chassis, Black $80.99 (Might get a cheaper case if it all fits into another. Don't care what it looks like.)
Scythe 120mm Slip Stream Kaze-Jyuni PWM Fan $9.99
AMD Phenom™ II X6 1055T 2.8GHz w/ 9MB Cache (Retail Box, Socket AM3) $219.99
Asus M4A88TD-M w/ Radeon HD 4250, DualDDR3 1333, 7.1 Audio, Gigabit Lan, Hybrid CrossFireX, HDMI $99.99
SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda 7200.12 SATA II w/ 16MB Cache $46.99
Samsung SH-S223L 22x DVD-Writer, SATA w/ Lightscribe Black $27.99
Asus EAH5830 Radeon HD 5830 DirectCU 1GB GDDR5 PCI-E w/ DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort $259.99
Antec EarthWatts EA 650W Power Supply w/ Triple +12V $89.99
Assemble Assemble Hardware + Load my O/S $70.00
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium x64 (64-bit) DVD - OEM $119.99
Sub Total $1,245.90

Do I need more fans/cooling? Can I switch to a dual channel Ram like Kingston ValueRam and not see any changes? Do I need to switch to an Intel i7 to use that ram? Will any parts not work with each other? The motherboard was something that confused me. I had someone suggest the motherboard because I have no clue about it. Should I go with something else? Is 650w enough for the power supply? It's going to be hooked up to a 40" tv and I want to run the game on High settings.

Edit: The 5770 card is $190... will it make a huge difference if I downgrade to that? $70 is a good chunk of change.

Again, thanks!

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 11:34pm by AnaraWarren


That motherboard only supports dual channel, not triple channel; change your RAM. Also, yes there is a rather significant difference between the 5830 and 5770.

It's a shame you don't get the joy of building it yourself, but it's a good system regardless.

Also, You can get that OS for $99. Whoever you're buying it from is ripping you off for 20 bucks.
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#521 Jul 28 2010 at 10:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Honestly, and I'm not saying anything against AMD, my build is an AMD one but If your looking to spend $1200+ I'd seriously looking into an i5-750 build. The i5-750 is just a better processor overall than anything AMD has right now at that price. As nice as it is to have a 6 core processor unless you plan on OC its actually going to run worse than the 955BE or the 965 BE due to it being only 2.8GHz. Also don't skimp on the graphics.

If you plan on running the high settings its much more GPU intense, if you plan on running the Low settings it much more CPU intense.

Drop down to 4Gigs of Ram, you really shouldn't need more than that and it will save you $100

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:55pm by BunnyFufinator
#522 Jul 28 2010 at 10:52 AM Rating: Decent
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Mikhalia,

Thanks for the info about the 20% off. I will probably upgrade the GPU to a GTX 460 and then see how it plays. If it still plays like crap I will buy a new PC without a GPU and stick my 460 in it.
#523 Jul 28 2010 at 11:01 AM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia wrote:
AnaraWarren wrote:
OK, I've done some building online, I will be going physically to the store to have them put it together for me, the $70 is worth piece of mind for them to do it for me, but this is what I've come up with. Any thoughts? Should I upgrade/downgrade on something? I would love to whittle down the cost a bit, but I don't want to lose any performance.

Corsair 6GB XMS3-1600 PC3-12800 Core™ i7 Triple Channel DDR3 Kit (3 x 2GB) w/ Intel XMP $219.99
Cooler Master Centurion 590 Chassis, Black $80.99 (Might get a cheaper case if it all fits into another. Don't care what it looks like.)
Scythe 120mm Slip Stream Kaze-Jyuni PWM Fan $9.99
AMD Phenom™ II X6 1055T 2.8GHz w/ 9MB Cache (Retail Box, Socket AM3) $219.99
Asus M4A88TD-M w/ Radeon HD 4250, DualDDR3 1333, 7.1 Audio, Gigabit Lan, Hybrid CrossFireX, HDMI $99.99
SEAGATE 500GB Barracuda 7200.12 SATA II w/ 16MB Cache $46.99
Samsung SH-S223L 22x DVD-Writer, SATA w/ Lightscribe Black $27.99
Asus EAH5830 Radeon HD 5830 DirectCU 1GB GDDR5 PCI-E w/ DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort $259.99
Antec EarthWatts EA 650W Power Supply w/ Triple +12V $89.99
Assemble Assemble Hardware + Load my O/S $70.00
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium x64 (64-bit) DVD - OEM $119.99
Sub Total $1,245.90

Do I need more fans/cooling? Can I switch to a dual channel Ram like Kingston ValueRam and not see any changes? Do I need to switch to an Intel i7 to use that ram? Will any parts not work with each other? The motherboard was something that confused me. I had someone suggest the motherboard because I have no clue about it. Should I go with something else? Is 650w enough for the power supply? It's going to be hooked up to a 40" tv and I want to run the game on High settings.

Edit: The 5770 card is $190... will it make a huge difference if I downgrade to that? $70 is a good chunk of change.

Again, thanks!

Edited, Jul 27th 2010 11:34pm by AnaraWarren


That motherboard only supports dual channel, not triple channel; change your RAM. Also, yes there is a rather significant difference between the 5830 and 5770.

It's a shame you don't get the joy of building it yourself, but it's a good system regardless.

Also, You can get that OS for $99. Whoever you're buying it from is ripping you off for 20 bucks.


Again, thanks so much. I went and checked newegg.ca and some of the prices are lower - so I called the place and they will price match to them, so everything seems great.

I want to go out and get this done now, but I have to wait on my sister to get a paycheque or two, first, so she can upgrade hers. I dreamed about computer parts last night. :p
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#524 Jul 28 2010 at 11:03 AM Rating: Decent
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AnaraWarren wrote:
[...] I dreamed about computer parts last night. :p


Thankfully I'm not the only one!! I was having pseudo-nightmares about ordering the wrong parts and being berated for failing, lol!
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#525 Jul 28 2010 at 11:15 AM Rating: Decent
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I've got a question now. haha

In order for an AMD motherboard to be able to support SLI (specifically two GTX 460s in case you're wondering), does the northbridge HAVE to be nForce SLI?
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#526 Jul 28 2010 at 11:22 AM Rating: Good
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BunnyFufinator wrote:
Honestly, and I'm not saying anything against AMD, my build is an AMD one but If your looking to spend $1200+ I'd seriously looking into an i5-750 build. The i5-750 is just a better processor overall than anything AMD has right now at that price. As nice as it is to have a 6 core processor unless you plan on OC its actually going to run worse than the 955BE or the 965 BE due to it being only 2.8GHz. Also don't skimp on the graphics.

If you plan on running the high settings its much more GPU intense, if you plan on running the Low settings it much more CPU intense.

Drop down to 4Gigs of Ram, you really shouldn't need more than that and it will save you $100


Agreed about Intel being ahead of AMD for processors in that price range.

However, one must also consider futureproof. Intel is not going to release anymore processors that use the same socket. The next lot of processors will use a new socket, which will require a motherboard upgrade too if you're going to get one of the newer Intel CPUs in a year or two.

AMD, on the other hand, is still releasing new processors that use the AM3 socket, so you won't have to change motherboards if you decide to upgrade your CPU in a year or two from now.

:)
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#527 Jul 28 2010 at 11:31 AM Rating: Good
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Threx wrote:
I've got a question now. haha

In order for an AMD motherboard to be able to support SLI (specifically two GTX 460s in case you're wondering), does the northbridge HAVE to be nForce SLI?


Looks like it. I hadn't heard much about that possibility, didn't think you could, but apparently you can. Just found this discussion that lists 4 that can do it...
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/277401-30-compatible-motherboard
#528 Jul 28 2010 at 11:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Threx,

From what I understand, yes, an AM3 MoBo must have nVidia chipset for SLI. Unfortunately, there seems to be very few choices to run an AM3 CPU with SLI.

And I am not so convinced that Intel is a better bang for your buck. This chart shows that the 1055T, 955 and 965 give a higher CPUMark/Cost ratio than anything Intel offers.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+Phenom+II+X6+1055T

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 1:41pm by Enscheff
#529 Jul 28 2010 at 11:44 AM Rating: Good
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Alright, based on this and a couple other threads I've decided to build myself a machine. I've gotten it down to around $515, and I'm thinking of possibly recycling my case and dvd drive if I can (they're both quite old).

If I go with a triple core now, can I upgrade to a quad core later when I have more money? Here is what I have so far:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/registry/wishlist/WCPL2JZ4I8GY

How well could that run FFXIV? Are there any parts that are comparable that would be better?
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#530 Jul 28 2010 at 11:48 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah, I kinda figured that, but was just hoping I was wrong. >.<

I couldn't access tomshardware forums just now for some reason so I decided to post here.

Thanks for the confirmations.
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#531 Jul 28 2010 at 11:57 AM Rating: Good
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Enscheff wrote:

And I am not so convinced that Intel is a better bang for your buck. This chart shows that the 1055T, 955 and 965 give a higher CPUMark/Cost ratio than anything Intel offers.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=AMD+Phenom+II+X6+1055T



I wasn't really referring to direct cost-performance ratio. I was kind of grouping them together into the same "tier" of performance (I should have clarified that), and from what I've seen so far I prefer the i5 750 to those AMD chips in performance.

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#532 Jul 28 2010 at 11:57 AM Rating: Decent
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Super,

That is pretty much the bare minimum PC I would build for FFXIV. Keep in mind that you may be able to unlock the 4th core of your CPU and have an X4, though it doesn't always work.

You will also need to come up with a copy of an OS.
#533 Jul 28 2010 at 11:59 AM Rating: Decent
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Thanks, Enscheff. One last q, would I be able to use my HDTV as a monitor with that? Or would I need a better mobo?

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:00pm by superdupernuker
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#534 Jul 28 2010 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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superdupernuker wrote:
Alright, based on this and a couple other threads I've decided to build myself a machine. I've gotten it down to around $515, and I'm thinking of possibly recycling my case and dvd drive if I can (they're both quite old).

If I go with a triple core now, can I upgrade to a quad core later when I have more money? Here is what I have so far:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/registry/wishlist/WCPL2JZ4I8GY

How well could that run FFXIV? Are there any parts that are comparable that would be better?



I'm assuming you would be running the game on lower res, right? Probably 720p?

Now, this is purely based on the benchmark: If your performance in the benchmark holds true to the performance in the game itself, then I would suggest upgrading that CPU to a quad core, probably a Phenom II 940. You can drop the video card down to a 5750 if you want to save some money.

The reason for this is that 720p on the benchmark is much more CPU dependent that GPU dependent. Thereforce, a Phenom II 940 + 5750 is more likely to perform better than an x3 440 + 5770 on the 720p benchmark.

And I can't stress this enough. This is only a prediction of your system based on the benchmark, not based on experience in the game itself.

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 1:06pm by Threx
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#535 Jul 28 2010 at 12:14 PM Rating: Good
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superdupernuker wrote:
Thanks, Enscheff. One last q, would I be able to use my HDTV as a monitor with that? Or would I need a better mobo?

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:00pm by superdupernuker



I'm not certain, but I don't think the motherboard has anything to do with that. The 5770 has an HDMI port, so you should be able to use your HDTV.
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#536 Jul 28 2010 at 12:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Yes, to the low res. I have a 720p (well, 1080i)32" Sharp Aquos I was hoping to use as a monitor.

Ah, okay. I wasn't sure. I've seen a bunch of motherboards on newegg that had it listed in the specs, but I didn't see it on the one I was getting. Hence the confusion.

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:16pm by superdupernuker
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#537 Jul 28 2010 at 12:19 PM Rating: Good
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A lot of motherboards have built in graphics which is why they have onboard HDMI outs, not that you'd actually be able to play with the onboard graphics card.
#538 Jul 28 2010 at 12:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Nevermind, googled it.

Edited, Jul 28th 2010 12:42pm by superdupernuker
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#539 Jul 28 2010 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Agreed about Intel being ahead of AMD for processors in that price range.

However, one must also consider futureproof. Intel is not going to release anymore processors that use the same socket. The next lot of processors will use a new socket, which will require a motherboard upgrade too if you're going to get one of the newer Intel CPUs in a year or two.

AMD, on the other hand, is still releasing new processors that use the AM3 socket, so you won't have to change motherboards if you decide to upgrade your CPU in a year or two from now.

:)


That's why I prefer AMD over Intel, every time intel releases a new processor you have to buy a new motherboard. AMD is the king of backwards compatabilty.
#540 Jul 28 2010 at 1:24 PM Rating: Decent
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Mikhalia wrote:
BunnyFufinator wrote:
My now sub $600 build I'm pretty pleased with. Gaah 2 weeks till I cna start buying parts is killing me. I keep changing things lol.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/attachments/general-ffxiv-discussion/23879d1280274591-guide-building-pc-play-ffxiv-parts.gif


Very nice build for the price.


Thanks!
#541 Jul 28 2010 at 4:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I've been following this thread, as well as a similar one on BG in detail, yet I haven't seen a detailed discussion on SLI or Xfire.

Specifically, around the lanes of traffic that each PCI-E slot can support. Now, with most of the newer cards, you need X16 to get full performance out of it.

This I understand. Here is where I get confused...

I notice some motherboards that say they are "SLI Ready" or "Crossfire Ready", however when reviewing the technical specifications of the motherboard, while they have two PCI-E slots, they don't all have 2 x PCI-E 16 slots. Some have 1 X 16, 1X 4 or you can run them in 2 X 8.

I have my build ready, and in thinking about future proofing to a certain extent, I'd love to get a board that has 2 X 16 PCI-E slots so in 6 months when I have the extra money, I can slap in another 460. Apparently, there's few motherboards available with this configuration without really starting to blow the budget out. I plan to run the 1055T and the Gigabyte GA-890GX MOBO.

I realize that motherboard doesn't even support SLI (supports xfire), but I am kind of stuck as to how to evaluate this. Is it safe to say that 2 X 8 in xfire or SLI would give about the same (with equivalent cards) as one in 8x16 mode? If not, any thoughts on performance increase? Meaning, if it would only add about 25% increase, then it woudln't be worth it unless you upgraded the board to take better advantage of the second card.

My last question, when finding a board that does, in fact, have PCI-E (2) X 16, does it have to specifically say it's "SLI" ready? Meaning, if I see one that is "Xfire" ready, then I assume I have to have an ATI card, correct?

Any suggestions? Insight? Would love to know specific details if possible.

Thanks in advance,
Knoc



Edited, Jul 28th 2010 6:35pm by KnocturnalOne
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#542 Jul 28 2010 at 5:14 PM Rating: Decent
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TO ALL THOES GETTIGN NEW VIDEO CARDS!!

Sorry about caps but its kinda important. When you buy a new system most power supplys default at 300W, When buying video cards it has a minimum requrement for power. Most are 450w or higher for a decent card. Your power supply has the Wattage on a stick on it , usualy on the side facing the opening of your pc case. So jsut keep this in ming while upgrade video cards. :) thanks for your time.
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#543 Jul 28 2010 at 8:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Quick question. Are DDR3 boards reverse compatible? Reason I ask, is I am ordering a DDR3 board, but I would like to temporarily use the 2x1gig DDR2 sticks in my current board until I can get a couple 2x2gig DDR3 sticks.
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#544 Jul 28 2010 at 10:55 PM Rating: Good
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KnocturnalOne wrote:
I've been following this thread, as well as a similar one on BG in detail, yet I haven't seen a detailed discussion on SLI or Xfire.

Specifically, around the lanes of traffic that each PCI-E slot can support. Now, with most of the newer cards, you need X16 to get full performance out of it.

This I understand. Here is where I get confused...

I notice some motherboards that say they are "SLI Ready" or "Crossfire Ready", however when reviewing the technical specifications of the motherboard, while they have two PCI-E slots, they don't all have 2 x PCI-E 16 slots. Some have 1 X 16, 1X 4 or you can run them in 2 X 8.

I have my build ready, and in thinking about future proofing to a certain extent, I'd love to get a board that has 2 X 16 PCI-E slots so in 6 months when I have the extra money, I can slap in another 460. Apparently, there's few motherboards available with this configuration without really starting to blow the budget out. I plan to run the 1055T and the Gigabyte GA-890GX MOBO.

I realize that motherboard doesn't even support SLI (supports xfire), but I am kind of stuck as to how to evaluate this. Is it safe to say that 2 X 8 in xfire or SLI would give about the same (with equivalent cards) as one in 8x16 mode? If not, any thoughts on performance increase? Meaning, if it would only add about 25% increase, then it woudln't be worth it unless you upgraded the board to take better advantage of the second card.

My last question, when finding a board that does, in fact, have PCI-E (2) X 16, does it have to specifically say it's "SLI" ready? Meaning, if I see one that is "Xfire" ready, then I assume I have to have an ATI card, correct?

Any suggestions? Insight? Would love to know specific details if possible.


The reason why people don't talk about it is because the game doesn't support it yet, so there's nothing much to discuss.

You can use SLI only on a motherboard that has an "nForce" chipset. Click on any motherboard on newegg.com and then click specifications. Under the "northbridge" if it doesn't say nForce, then it won't support SLI. (***see the edit below)

The difference in performance between a x16 and a x8 slot is pretty negligible (x8 is about 2% slower than x16). A x4 slot still isn't far behind (about 10% less performance than a x16 if I remember right). It's only the x1 slots that you want to avoid.

Edit: Actually, I'm not sure about this myself. I'm under the impression that this is the case, but I'm waiting for confirmation after posting about this on tomshardware.

Edit 2: Ok, got confirmation that:

1. SLI support is only available with nForce chips.
2. Not all nForce chips support SLI.

Therefore, you NEED to pick the RIGHT nForce chipset motherboard to run SLI.

Edited, Jul 30th 2010 12:06pm by Threx
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#545 Jul 28 2010 at 10:56 PM Rating: Good
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Demonadrastos wrote:
Quick question. Are DDR3 boards reverse compatible? Reason I ask, is I am ordering a DDR3 board, but I would like to temporarily use the 2x1gig DDR2 sticks in my current board until I can get a couple 2x2gig DDR3 sticks.


DDR2 and DDR3 aren't compatible. :(
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#546 Jul 28 2010 at 11:48 PM Rating: Decent
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Dell Studio Athlon II x4 630 (2.0GHz)
ATI Radeon HD 5770 1024MB GDDR5
750GB Serial ATA 2 Hard Drive 7200 RPM
Win 7 64bit
6GB DDR3 SDRAM, 1333MHz, 2x2GB+2x1GB

I scored 3420 on low settings. I'm just so happy I got it to work finally.
Thanks to everyone working on these build/benchmark threads. Knowledge is power!

Edited, Jul 29th 2010 3:02am by MongooseQueen
#547 Jul 29 2010 at 8:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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MongooseQueen wrote:
Dell Studio Athlon II x4 630 (2.0GHz)
ATI Radeon HD 5770 1024MB GDDR5
750GB Serial ATA 2 Hard Drive 7200 RPM
Win 7 64bit
6GB DDR3 SDRAM, 1333MHz, 2x2GB+2x1GB

I scored 3420 on low settings. I'm just so happy I got it to work finally.
Thanks to everyone working on these build/benchmark threads. APPLIED Knowledge is power!



Fixed.

And grats. :P
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#548 Jul 29 2010 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
KnocturnalOne wrote:
I've been following this thread, as well as a similar one on BG in detail, yet I haven't seen a detailed discussion on SLI or Xfire.

Specifically, around the lanes of traffic that each PCI-E slot can support. Now, with most of the newer cards, you need X16 to get full performance out of it.

This I understand. Here is where I get confused...

I notice some motherboards that say they are "SLI Ready" or "Crossfire Ready", however when reviewing the technical specifications of the motherboard, while they have two PCI-E slots, they don't all have 2 x PCI-E 16 slots. Some have 1 X 16, 1X 4 or you can run them in 2 X 8.

I have my build ready, and in thinking about future proofing to a certain extent, I'd love to get a board that has 2 X 16 PCI-E slots so in 6 months when I have the extra money, I can slap in another 460. Apparently, there's few motherboards available with this configuration without really starting to blow the budget out. I plan to run the 1055T and the Gigabyte GA-890GX MOBO.

I realize that motherboard doesn't even support SLI (supports xfire), but I am kind of stuck as to how to evaluate this. Is it safe to say that 2 X 8 in xfire or SLI would give about the same (with equivalent cards) as one in 8x16 mode? If not, any thoughts on performance increase? Meaning, if it would only add about 25% increase, then it woudln't be worth it unless you upgraded the board to take better advantage of the second card.

My last question, when finding a board that does, in fact, have PCI-E (2) X 16, does it have to specifically say it's "SLI" ready? Meaning, if I see one that is "Xfire" ready, then I assume I have to have an ATI card, correct?

Any suggestions? Insight? Would love to know specific details if possible.


The reason why people don't talk about it is because the game doesn't support it yet, so there's nothing much to discuss.

You can use SLI only on a motherboard that has an "nForce" chipset. Click on any motherboard on newegg.com and then click specifications. Under the "northbridge" if it doesn't say nForce, then it won't support SLI. (***see the edit below)

The difference in performance between a x16 and a x8 slot is pretty negligible (x8 is about 2% slower than x16). A x4 slot still isn't far behind (about 10% less performance than a x16 if I remember right). It's only the x1 slots that you want to avoid.

Edit: Actually, I'm not sure about this myself. I'm under the impression that this is the case, but I'm waiting for confirmation after posting about this on tomshardware.


Keep me posted on the details. At least I know I have done some decent research (I am nowhere up to date on all the technology available) and hopefully am not asking a dumb question.

I also see it's less common to find boards that support an AM3 socket but support nForce SLI. There are some, but options appear to be less limited, and I don't want to run the Intel chips due to higher cost - both for the boards supporting them and the processors.
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#549 Jul 29 2010 at 12:50 PM Rating: Decent
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Hello everyone,
I want a desktop so I can build or have it built because ofcourse it runs games better.
But, a laptop is way more convenient for me. I am trying different website to get a custom laptop with similar specs i would a desktop even though i know they will be less powerful.

What do you guys think of a laptop with these specs?

Processor ( Intel® Core™ i7-740QM Mobile Processor (4x 1.73GHz/6MB L3 Cache) )
Memory ( 4GB [2GB x 2] 1333MHz DDR3 SDRAM [Laptop Memory] - Corsair or Major Brand )
Video Card ( Mobility DDR5 1GB ATI Radeon HD 5870 PCI-Express 3D Video [W870CU] )
window 7 home premium

thanks
I really want to be able to play FFVIX on the go when I can.



Edited, Jul 29th 2010 2:52pm by jvfly23
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#550 Jul 29 2010 at 1:24 PM Rating: Decent
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ok i just bought this off craigslist and i need help figuring out how to beef it up with out spending an arm and a leg. (thanks Ravida, Kreisash, and Mikhalia for helping me decide if it was worth it or not.)

-NZXT M59 case
-EVGA 780i 3 way sli
-Core 2 Quad Q6600(2.4ghz)
-Thermaltake V1 cpu cooler with arctic silver 5 thermal paste.
-EVGA gtx 260 core 216
-4gb 1066mhz Corsair Dominator
-Sigma Monster 850w Modular PSU
-500gb Seagate SATA hard drive and Samsumg dvd burner.
-Windows 7 ultimate x64
-19" HP w1907 LCD,1440x900
-White Razer Lycosa keyboard(VoodooDNA edition) and White Razer Lachesis Lazer mouse.
i ended up getting it for $525 and figured it will run XIV just fine but thats never good enough now is it? In not sure what to do with the GPU should i buy another GTX 260 and run in SLI or just upgrade to a single better GPU? and what about RAM, I believe this MOBO will handle up to 1200MHZ is it worth it, or is the 1066MHZ Dominator ok? im open to suggestions. Thanks all
#551 Jul 29 2010 at 2:05 PM Rating: Decent
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Nice deal man, in that situation I might really consider the SLI option. Though if you look at slizone.com for the 260 they suggest the sigma 900W or 1000W only, your 850 is obviously close. On some of the other brands they suggest lower wattages. So I guess the question there is how cautious those suggestions are. Also if it's a tough call is it worth the risk?

http://www.slizone.com/object/slizone_build_psu.html

Here's a chart showing gpus related to the FFXIV benchmark that can show you some ideas. If you're gonna upgrade to a better single gpu you'll want to make a decent jump up the ladder to make the purchase worth it. Then you may be talking more money than you'd like to spend.

http://www.gpubench.com/gpubench/index.cfm/graphics-and-video-card-tools/

Depending on what "without spending an arm & a leg" means exactly to your situation, I'd say the ram is fine and focussing on the gpu would be the better way to spend the money...


Edited, Jul 29th 2010 4:07pm by TwistedOwl
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