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#1 Jul 13 2010 at 1:27 PM Rating: Good
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I've seen a number of posts here from people who want (or need) a new PC to play FFXIV on. I'll just assume that they'd want to continue to do everyday things on it too. I'll also assume that if it can handle FFXIV then doing everyday things (ie E-mail, surfing, video etc) shouldn't be a problem.
Obviously by all my assumptions you can tell I'm not much for PC building, and we can pretend that they aren't either. Personally I'll be (sadly) waiting till it's out of PS3, cause I don't think I'll be upgrading my system anytime soon...

Finally my point. Recommend an out of the box ready PC for those not tech savy enough to custom build a rig. I see the topics about each part by itself, but I haven't seen one that just puts it as simple as "This is what you should buy, and here is how much it costs"

I tried to look at what I thought would be a good rig and here is what I came up with:

MSRP $1699.00
Intel® Core™ i7-860 Processor1 2.8GHz with Turbo Boost2 Technology up to 3.46GHz (8MB L3 Cache)7
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium (64-bit)8
16GB DDR3 Dual-Channel 1333MHz Memory9
4 DDR3 Slots Total (0 Slots Available)
1.5TB 7200RPM SATA hard drive4
ATI Radeon™ HD5850 Graphics card with 1GB of Discrete Video Memory9
Blu-ray Disc™ 4X BD-ROM / DVD-SuperMulti Drive and 16X DVD+/-R/RW SuperMulti Drive
750W Power Supply

Expensive? Yes. Worth it? I have no clue, I'm not a PC gamer :)

Have fun!
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#2 Jul 13 2010 at 1:32 PM Rating: Decent
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you can buy the same parts for cheaper might save $300-$350
#3 Jul 13 2010 at 1:36 PM Rating: Decent
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AlvinTheChip wrote:
you can buy the same parts for cheaper might save $300-$350


His point was some people do not have the skills or time required to learn building a PC. If it had a 5870 I would be all over that machine, either way it is a fairly decent buy (*edit* although the RAM and HD are a little excessive in size)

Edited, Jul 13th 2010 3:37pm by burtonsnow
#4 Jul 13 2010 at 1:44 PM Rating: Good
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burtonsnow wrote:
AlvinTheChip wrote:
you can buy the same parts for cheaper might save $300-$350


His point was some people do not have the skills or time required to learn building a PC. If it had a 5870 I would be all over that machine, either way it is a fairly decent buy (*edit* although the RAM and HD are a little excessive in size)

Edited, Jul 13th 2010 3:37pm by burtonsnow


Yeah, I'm sure that 5 years from now I will look back on this post and laugh at my ignorance, but I can't see the need for 16 GB RAM and a 1.5 TB HD, unless you own a lot of **** and want to watch it all at once.
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#5 Jul 13 2010 at 1:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Power supply is way too low to grow, and honestly you won't get good use out of a BD Drive for another year or two unless you don't have a BluRay player on your TV I'd skip that. Also 16 GB is over kill 6-8 is plenty for the next few years. If you want that much RAM wait until the market drops again, it's barely on the downslope right now from a recent spike and memory is pricey.

IMO 850 Watts is the minimum I would get in a current PC, you never know when you might want the latest greatest powerhungry GPU (or 2 or 3)

If you want something out of the box check sites like ibuypower or whatever spams the PCGaming magazines these days. They have some pretty good deals usually. Avoid Dell and Alienware (same company), Falcon Northwest, etc... unless you're only using them to see what decent setups are. Take the setups and build the same PC on one of the budget custom sites.

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#6 Jul 13 2010 at 2:25 PM Rating: Decent
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Well, it's obviously not an HP or Dell so it's a step in the right direction, but I would make some changes.

The Quad core processor is a very good investment. Keep that.

Lose the Home Edition and get, at a minimum, Professional. Ultimate is only anouther $10-20 more, but isn't really necessary for a gaming rig, so it's up to you if you want to pay for it. Professional and up offer XP mode which is a virtualized (and free) copy of XP so you can still run programs that don't work in 7.

16GBs of RAM is great if you are running a file server, but you will not need that much memory for FFXIV.

The 1.5TB drive is great for storing all your ****, but you want a Raid 0 or Raid 5 array with 10K RPM drives for running your games. 2 150GB 10K spin drives will run about $280-300. You can get smaller drives for less if money is an issue. Since Raid 0 does not mirror you will get the full (formatted) drive space of both drives (I.E. 2x150gb = 300gb total). You also have some solid state drive options.

The ATI HD5850 is nice, but if FFXIV does, or will, support PhysX or 3D I'd want to go with a GeForce card.

750W power supply should be enough for what you have there, but if you start adding peripherals adn additional cards/accessories you may want to upgrade to a 100W. Be sure that the power supply is modular. You don't want unused power cords blocking airflow.
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#7 Jul 13 2010 at 2:34 PM Rating: Good
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I truly wish I had your budget. You could *almost* build a 2x5870 for that price with top tier parts.


COOLER MASTER HAF 932 RC-932-KKN1-GP Black Steel ATX Full Tower Computer Case
EVGA 141-BL-E757-TR LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX X58 SLI LE Intel Motherboard
Antec CP-850 850W Continuous Power CPX SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Modular Active PFC
OCZ Gold 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Voltage Desktop Memory
Intel Core i7-930 Bloomfield 2.8GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80601930
Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner - Bulk - OEM
And any brand 5870 card

Total price directly from newegg: $1417 with $40 in additional rebates.

Optional: Add a COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus Intel Core i5 & Intel Core i7 compatible RR-B10-212P-G1 120mm
To easily OC the processor to 4.0ghz.

If you were to take the components to a local computer store, community college with CSCI or IT departments, or post an add on craigslist, I gaurantee you will be able to find somebody to build it for you for less than $100.

This would save money and outperform your listed build.

Edit: Most computers need processors.

Edited, Jul 13th 2010 4:36pm by Inralkil
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#8 Jul 13 2010 at 2:43 PM Rating: Good
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I'm seeing a ton of great ideas. I took my list right off gateway, the only problem is that since they don't directly sell anymore I'm not seeing any way to change specific components.
I see what people mean about not having a need for 1.5TB and such so I was trying to lower the price.
I looked at the Dell site and they have the option to customize, but it just seems that it's at a crazy price. I didn't even have 3/4ths of the same system build an it was already more expensive than the gateway
____________________________
The more I train, the harder I get. The harder I get, the more lethal I am. The more lethal I am, the fewer opponents. The fewer opponents, the less to lose. The less to lose, the more I let up. The more I let up, the more room for mistakes. The more room for mistakes, the more I train.

#9 Jul 13 2010 at 2:50 PM Rating: Decent
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ReiThor wrote:
I'm seeing a ton of great ideas. I took my list right off gateway, the only problem is that since they don't directly sell anymore I'm not seeing any way to change specific components.
I see what people mean about not having a need for 1.5TB and such so I was trying to lower the price.
I looked at the Dell site and they have the option to customize, but it just seems that it's at a crazy price. I didn't even have 3/4ths of the same system build an it was already more expensive than the gateway


I only buy from dell deals, check it out:

http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/deals/performance_desktops?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&redirect=1
#10 Jul 13 2010 at 2:57 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I only buy from dell deals, check it out:


That's a terrible idea. Dell sells PCs cheap because they use cheap parts. Yes, you do get, say, a 250GB hard drive. That hard drive does store the same amount of data as a "more expensive" drive, but it has less cache, lower spin and higher seek times. It is also more likely to suffer from disk strikes and general hard drive failure. You get what you pay for.
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#11 Jul 13 2010 at 3:03 PM Rating: Decent
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IAmAnsel wrote:
Quote:
I only buy from dell deals, check it out:


That's a terrible idea. Dell sells PCs cheap because they use cheap parts. Yes, you do get, say, a 250GB hard drive. That hard drive does store the same amount of data as a "more expensive" drive, but it has less cache, lower spin and higher seek times. It is also more likely to suffer from disk strikes and general hard drive failure. You get what you pay for.


Yes some of their parts are not as efficient, but someone was checking out dell so I wanted to point them in the direction of the lowest cost dell machines. In terms of quality, I have never had a problem with dell quality and I'm lucky enough to be a business user who gets great support. In 10 years of IT I have only had one dell failure (server motherboard capacitor got fried, I was down 2 business days. one day for shipping the second day for installation).
#12 Jul 13 2010 at 3:13 PM Rating: Good
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Corporate users are a different issue. They buy at lower prices, need the security that the warranty and technical support provide and rely on lower demand machines than gaming. A computer I just configured on that site wound up costing $1700. While it had a monitor and 8GB of RAM (slower and less efficient than the triple channel I posted above) every other part was vastly inferior. To build the computer with higher quality parts at the same spec would cost ~$1000. Tack on $200 for the monitor (I'm being generous here) and you are paying an awful lot for a trial version of Office and 18 months of Norton. If you feel that you will need $500 in tech support over the life of the computer, then buying from Dell is worth it.

I'm not trying to knock anyone who isn't tech savvy. Computers can be daunting, and if you don't have the time, energy, or inclination to dive right in and try to fix any problems yourself, I can understand why you would want to buy a premade computer. No matter what though, computers are going to be buggier than consoles. Instead of paying a 20% markup to manufacturers for inferior parts, I would recommend keeping to the cheap $4-600 desktops that are a reasonable bargain and do your gaming on the PS3. You will come out far ahead in the financial game.
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#13 Jul 13 2010 at 3:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Inralkil wrote:
Corporate users are a different issue. They buy at lower prices, need the security that the warranty and technical support provide and rely on lower demand machines than gaming. A computer I just configured on that site wound up costing $1700. While it had a monitor and 8GB of RAM (slower and less efficient than the triple channel I posted above) every other part was vastly inferior. To build the computer with higher quality parts at the same spec would cost ~$1000. Tack on $200 for the monitor (I'm being generous here) and you are paying an awful lot for a trial version of Office and 18 months of Norton. If you feel that you will need $500 in tech support over the life of the computer, then buying from Dell is worth it.

I'm not trying to knock anyone who isn't tech savvy. Computers can be daunting, and if you don't have the time, energy, or inclination to dive right in and try to fix any problems yourself, I can understand why you would want to buy a premade computer. No matter what though, computers are going to be buggier than consoles. Instead of paying a 20% markup to manufacturers for inferior parts, I would recommend keeping to the cheap $4-600 desktops that are a reasonable bargain and do your gaming on the PS3. You will come out far ahead in the financial game.


$100 OS as well.

I'm not saying GO WITH DELL OR DIE either. I'm just saying check all options out there. Personally, if you have the time to invest in building your own computer, that will be my only suggestion again and again.

Edited, Jul 13th 2010 5:32pm by burtonsnow
#14 Jul 13 2010 at 3:34 PM Rating: Good
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I would just have ecollegepc build it if you arent too comfortable doing it yourself. They have their base packages and you can customize them if you see fit. You could buy this system for $1390 and it would run the game very well imo.

cpu: core i5-750
gpu: Radeon 5870
memory: 4gb 1600mhz ddr3 ram
hdd: 500gb 7200rpm
os: Windows 7 home premium 64 bit
psu: 850 watt Antec Truepower Quattro
case: Cooler Master HAF 922
#15 Jul 13 2010 at 3:54 PM Rating: Decent
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HooraySoysauce wrote:
I would just have ecollegepc build it if you arent too comfortable doing it yourself. They have their base packages and you can customize them if you see fit. You could buy this system for $1390 and it would run the game very well imo.

cpu: core i5-750
gpu: Radeon 5870
memory: 4gb 1600mhz ddr3 ram
hdd: 500gb 7200rpm
os: Windows 7 home premium 64 bit
psu: 850 watt Antec Truepower Quattro
case: Cooler Master HAF 922


4700 on High...not bad at all!
#16 Jul 13 2010 at 4:07 PM Rating: Good
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Well I can't say exactly how it would score, but on bg someone with an i5-750 + Radeon 5870 scored 4361 on high.

#17 Jul 13 2010 at 4:12 PM Rating: Decent
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HooraySoysauce wrote:
Well I can't say exactly how it would score, but on bg someone with an i5-750 + Radeon 5870 scored 4361 on high.



I remember it being something like that...so yea I rescind my comment and you can probably reach 4500 with slight OC.
#18 Jul 14 2010 at 12:21 PM Rating: Good
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IAmAnsel wrote:
Quote:
I only buy from dell deals, check it out:


That's a terrible idea. Dell sells PCs cheap because they use cheap parts. Yes, you do get, say, a 250GB hard drive. That hard drive does store the same amount of data as a "more expensive" drive, but it has less cache, lower spin and higher seek times. It is also more likely to suffer from disk strikes and general hard drive failure. You get what you pay for.


Acually i dont find dell that bad, pricy yes. but durable for the most part. The hard drive failure I had was due to it falling down a flight of steps.. after it was out of warantee too (dang). repalced it but the system back together works great! I find an issue with the video card though but I hate all built in video cards :P.
Can also get some alienware PCs of the dell site as well.
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#19 Jul 14 2010 at 2:29 PM Rating: Good
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The thing to remember is that ANY manufacturer; Dell, HP, Gateway, yes, even Apple... all just buy parts from other manufacturers (Hitachi/Toshiba/Samsung/Maxtor/WD, MSI/Asus/ASrock, Intel/AMD, nVidia/ATI), toss them in a case with their company logo, and offer phone support and a collective limited warranty on all parts.

Now, note that in some cases, manufacturer's warranties may be higher; XFX offers a double lifetime warranty, meaning that not only do you get a lifetime warranty, but if you sell it or give it away, that person gets one too. Furthermore, many manufacturer warranties include a limited warranty on overclocking and modding to a certain threshold. Some GPU manufacturer warranties are -not- voided by removing the stock cooling unit and replacing it with liquid cooling.

Conversely, many prefab manufacturers (Dell, Gateway, etc) offer a warranty that is voided if the case is ever even OPENED, or if ANY overclocking is done. For the convenience of not having to deal directly with the parts manufacturer to get an RMA, you trade off the ability to upgrade or replace anything yourself. Many people, myself included, will tell you that a viable option for a gaming rig is to buy a prefab with a solid processor and just replace the PSU and/or GPU. In many cases, this -will- void the warranty on the ENTIRE SYSTEM.

So yeah, when you buy a Dell computer or an HP computer or a Gateway computer, the only thing actually MADE by them is the case. When you talk about how "reliable" or how "durable" your Brand X system is, you're only talking about all of the parts inside it, none of which were ACTUALLY MADE by Brand X. It's the same hard drives, the same processors, the same OS (excluding Apple), the same everything, with a different case.

If you say that "Well my HP lasted 5 years and my friend's Gateway stopped turning on after three, so I told him to buy a new HP; they're better!", all that means is that his system's Samsung Hard Drive or Apevia Power Supply or whatever died, and yours didn't. The parts are no more "HP parts" or "Alienware parts" than putting a Sony stereo system in a Ford car makes it a "Ford stereo system".
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#20 Jul 14 2010 at 2:38 PM Rating: Good
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is also how its put together as well (although there not usualy much variation in that). But yeah guess your right (grumble grumble). its all really the same stuff inside.
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#21 Jul 14 2010 at 3:15 PM Rating: Good
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Puppy1 wrote:
is also how its put together as well (although there not usualy much variation in that). But yeah guess your right (grumble grumble). its all really the same stuff inside.


How its put together depends on how the case is laid out :)
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Mikhalia: and FWIW, my posts are 95% helpful, informative, or funny.
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#22 Jul 14 2010 at 6:18 PM Rating: Good
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The link sends you to the custom build page. What were you specs and how would it compare to the gateway?





Quote:
4700 on High...not bad at all!

Is there a way to just run specs on the benchmark?
____________________________
The more I train, the harder I get. The harder I get, the more lethal I am. The more lethal I am, the fewer opponents. The fewer opponents, the less to lose. The less to lose, the more I let up. The more I let up, the more room for mistakes. The more room for mistakes, the more I train.

#23 Jul 14 2010 at 6:21 PM Rating: Good
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ReiThor wrote:
Quote:
4700 on High...not bad at all!

Is there a way to just run specs on the benchmark?


I wish, but none that I'm aware of. All we can do is compare proposed/example rigs to people who have similar rigs and give an approximate guess of how the proposed rig should perform.
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