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Dual gtx 480 build helpFollow

#1 Jul 16 2010 at 1:09 AM Rating: Default
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I'm kinda new to the whole build it yourself, and I was just gonna upgrade a couple parts and now it has turnt into a whole new system, so got a few questions, but first (here is what I ordered so far, can still be canceled since I just ordered most of it if theres a reason to cancel and change something).

Mother Board: ASUS P7P55D-E Pro LGA 1156 Intel P55 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131621

CPU: Intel Core i5-750 Lynnfield 2.66GHz LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor

Ram: G.SKILL ECO Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600

Video Card: GTX 480

Main purpose of the system is for gaming. I'm now planning to order a 2nd gtx 480 but I need some advice.

a.) I know nothing about 64-bit and what makes a system 64-bit. Will this system be 64-bit? assuming I install a 64-bit version of windows of course?

b.) What power supply should I get? My current OCZ 600watt power supply surely will not handle 2 gtx 480 gpu's
In case you need to know what else will be on the system power wise, there will be a sound card, a dvd burner a blu-ray burner, nvidia 3d glasses/rf emitter, 3 monitors (dont think monitors consume power from computer but just in case). and other then that I can't think of anything besides 6-8 usb items that could be plugged in at any given time.

c.) Cooling.... Here is what I currently have:

case: ENERMAX Uber Chakra ECA5001B Black Aluminum / Steel Trim w/250mm Intake/Exhaust LED Monster Fan ATX Full Tower Case w/Front I/O 1 eSATA, 4 USB2.0, Audio I/O http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811124121

rear fan: 120mm 6000 rpm
front fan: the one that came with the case
side fan: the one that came with the case
cpu cooler: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134

Thanks for any help in advance.

edited: to fix links

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 3:13am by Diggtown
#2 Jul 16 2010 at 1:17 AM Rating: Decent
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You might want to look at liquid cooling; I hear a single 480 runs hot as it is out of the box. Trying to fan those up may be too loud and/or inadequate for cooling.

Also, dual 480s sound pretty hardcore, but i5-750 may not be so much, your CPU might bottleneck. Try looking into i7-930.



#3 Jul 16 2010 at 1:24 AM Rating: Decent
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ya I was thinking the same thing I was going with the i5 before I kinda went nuts graphic wise lol. just didnt feel like canceling the order is all, but I probably really should. anyone have any good mobo's to suggest for 1366?
#4 Jul 16 2010 at 2:01 AM Rating: Decent
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Every modern CPU is 64-bit capable, so yes you will be able to (and should) use a 64-bit OS.
The i5 750 is a great CPU, but if you have the kind of money to buy two 480's then you might as well pick up an i7 930 from micro center for $200.
I'm not so sure about that case, personally I would go with something from Antec, Lian Li, or Cooler Master, but if your heart is set on it then feel free to go for it.
For a power supply, this would be a pretty good choice:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010
It's from a quality brand, it's got enough power for SLI 480s, and it's 80 PLUS SILVER certified, as well as being modular (you can remove power cables you don't need)
I don't know know much about aftermarket CPU coolers, but it looks like you've made a solid choice, and it will be compatible with both the i5 750 and a possible i7 930.
That motherboard DOES support SLI/Crossfire, but it's important to note that the PCIe slots will be limited to x8 if you run two cards.
What this means is that the performance of your 480s might be slightly restricted, but probably not by much, as most cards won't reach a level of performance to need x16 bandwidth (although I believe the 480s just barely do). If you do end up switching to an i7 930, you'll be changing your motherboard anyways, but this shouldn't be much of an issue - probably less than a 5% performance loss on your cards.

edit: if you do end up going with an i7 930, I would recommend you change the RAM to a triple channel kit, such as this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231225

edit2: Another power supply option:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139009
A bit more power, and a few dollars cheaper, and still a quality PSU. Only thing is it's not modular, so if having cables in the way is a big deal to you it might not be an option. Has a few combos on newegg with motherboards, including one with this motherboard:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813188046
which is a pretty quality choice, though if USB 3.0 is important to you, it might not be an option. Keep in mind SATA 6 Gb/s is completely useless at the moment, since no consumer hard drive even reaches the old 3Gb/s limit.
Keep in mind this motherboard would be for if you switch to an i7 930, and it appears to require a BIOS upgrade, so if that's not something you're comfortable with this might not be an option.
Edited, Jul 16th 2010 4:03am by Loaffy

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 4:07am by Loaffy

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 4:10am by Loaffy

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 4:14am by Loaffy
#5 Jul 16 2010 at 2:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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dont listen to people about liquid cooling with all do respect.

Just have a full tower case with well ventalation.

No liqid cool needed until you want to overclock. (That means you will need the fan of course 80% and above in gaming situations. Lets face it.. 40% fan speed on a 480 is just st000pit xD)

#6 Jul 16 2010 at 2:29 AM Rating: Default
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If you build a system for FFXIV i think you will be better of with a single 480 and a faster processor. Or keep the two 480 and add an i7 if you have the money.
And why only 4GB RAM? If you have that kind of money to spend i would seriously consider more RAM. 64bit should not even be a question as you pretty much need it already to get the most out of your setup.
A ->good<- 850W PSU would do the trick. I ran my dual Xeon system once with a no-name 450W PSU for two weeks without a problem (and that system was much more demanding for the PSU then your setup).
Also i think that liquid cooling might be a bit overkill unless you're going to OC your system. Most important thing about air cooling is the airflow not the amount of air moved.
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#7 Jul 16 2010 at 2:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
And why only 4GB RAM? If you have that kind of money to spend i would seriously consider more RAM


If the OP goes for an i7 930, chances are he'll move to 6GB. Really though, even if you have the money, there's no use for more than 4-6GB of RAM unless you run several OS at once through virtual box or something. You wouldn't see any performance increase in games, for one thing.

Quote:
If you build a system for FFXIV i think you will be better of with a single 480 and a faster processor

I agree with this.
You should easily max FFXIV with even the i5 750 + 480 setup. Two 480s is massive overkill for any games out now, so I would suggest you just get one for now, and maybe get another in the future when the price is down, if you feel the need.
#8 Jul 16 2010 at 2:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Heres what I came up with, based on your input and certain limitations (daily limits on bank cards which required just as much work to figure out how to stagger all the orders as the work of figuring out what to order lol)

1.) I switched to the i7 875k (kept the same motherboard)
2.) I went with the only 1500w PSU on newegg (figured this way I won't have to worry about upgrading if I do OC in the future, don't think i'll be needing to OC for a while)
3.) I don't like liquid cooling (as in I dont wanna try to learn about it or install it) so until I have a heating problem or I decide to OC I will just see how it goes
4.) I ordered 4 sticks of the same memory for a total of 8gb
5.) ordered 64-bit windows 7 ultimate

edit: my video cards don't have to be the exact same right for sli? I mean there both evga and there both 480's but diferent model numbers and clock speeds. Also the case is the case I currently own. I am gonna switch cases also but not for like 2 months unfortunetly, cause now my old computer is gonna be gutted with no case to put all the old stuff in lol

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 4:46am by Diggtown
#9 Jul 16 2010 at 2:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Also FF14 is the game I'm waiting for atm, but certainly not the sole purpose of my new computer, for all I know i'll hate FF14 lol, and even if I love it, theres gonna be other games I wanna play down the road also, and btw the dual 480's is for my nvidia 3d surround (3 3d monitors for those that dont know, gotta have 2 cards).
#10 Jul 16 2010 at 3:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
I went with the only 1500w PSU on newegg

O.o
I really wouldn't recommend that, even 1000W is way more than you'll need anytime in the next couple years, 1500W is just way too much.
Quote:
my video cards don't have to be the exact same right for sli?

They should be fine, I've seen people crossfire/Sli cards from different manufacturers before.
Quote:
I switched to the i7 875k

I would go for the i7 930, unless you've found somewhere selling the 875 for around $200. Also, LGA1366 offers triple channel RAM, for one thing, so you could go for just 6GB which is still more than enough.
#11 Jul 16 2010 at 3:37 AM Rating: Decent
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ok ok you twisted my arm =) changed to the triple stack memory that you suggested... but the mobo I went with is http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130289 and the i7 - 930
#12 Jul 16 2010 at 6:18 AM Rating: Decent
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Playing Devil's Advocate:

Quote:
Keep in mind SATA 6 Gb/s is completely useless at the moment, since no consumer hard drive even reaches the old 3Gb/s limit.


Consumer drive that surpasses by a large margin the "old" 3Gb/s limit:
Crucial RealSSD C300 CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1 2.5" 128GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)


Edited, Jul 16th 2010 8:19am by Levish
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#13 Jul 16 2010 at 6:20 AM Rating: Good
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Two GTX 480s? Just make sure your case is shielded for radiation. You should also install a slide-out tray in your case so you can cook Hot Pockets while playing FFXIV.

But really, stay away from liquid cooling. Fermi is supposed to handle the heat, and while you will want some extra ventilation when you're running two of them, liquid cooling is strictly for overclocking. Remember, NVIDIA actually expects people to run multiples of these cards, so they're designed to handle it. And while they do run on a lot of power, you certainly don't need more than 1000W.

One last thing which I recommended in another thread, since you appear to be wealthy: look into investing in some SSDs for a big performance boost. While they're not appropriate for mid-tier consumers, you're obviously more interested in having top-of-the-line stuff in your machine.
#14 Jul 16 2010 at 6:49 AM Rating: Decent
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I would agree to stay away from liquid cooling since it sounds like it would be your first time putting together a Liquid Cooled system and you have a heck of alot of high end pieces.

I also agree that a ssd for OS and games would make you <3 your computer, keep pictures/movies and files on the big drive

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 8:50am by Levish
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#15 Jul 16 2010 at 7:07 AM Rating: Excellent
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1.) http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=184
Jonny guru is one of the few in-depth power supply testers out there. This one in particular was amazing and it's 750w which is enough for your system including two 480s and a few (1-3) HDD's.

2.) When looking at power supplies try to focus on only ones with 80+ efficiency rating, and then an even better identifier for good PSU's is weight.(rule of thumb- most PSU's wont list weight as a spec on most sites.) A lot of PSU's are 80%+ efficient at 20-30 degrees C, but once they get up to 50-60 degrees C ambient, start to droop. If you get a bad PSU it could have efficiency ratings of 50-70% at 50C+. That means if you got a 1000w PSU but some cheap generic brand it could be only pumping out 500-700w instead of a full 1k. Then think if you got a 600w and your system draws 400, but you got a cheap 600w so once things heat up it drops to 300-400w.

If the PSU aint' happy, no one is happy.


3.) Putting two 480s in SLI mode you are going to create a bottleneck at your CPU with the i5 unless you overclock it to somewhere in the mid 3.0 ghz range or higher. There are doubts FFXIV will support SLI/crossfire at all so if this is your main game then don't worry about it.

4.) The 465~480 gtx cards run hot. Upwards of 90*CELSIUS under full load. CELSIUS. That is near boiling water-hot. That's not to say it's going to be damaged, I'm just sayin'. When people say make sure your case is well ventilated, they mean it. Ambient temps in the case being higher generally makes electronics underperform.
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#16 Jul 16 2010 at 7:28 AM Rating: Decent
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Interesting site Fenrir. I just found a review he did on a power supply I am currently looking at purchasing. thanks for the tip.
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#17 Jul 16 2010 at 7:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Playing Devil's Advocate:

Quote:
Keep in mind SATA 6 Gb/s is completely useless at the moment, since no consumer hard drive even reaches the old 3Gb/s limit.


You'll be way better of with a fast (Intel eg.) 3Gb/s SSD then a regular 6Gb/s SATA HDD. Or if you feel like spending some real money a RAM PCIe 'HDD' :)
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#18 Jul 16 2010 at 8:24 AM Rating: Good
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FenrirXIII wrote:


2.) When looking at power supplies try to focus on only ones with 80+ efficiency rating, and then an even better identifier for good PSU's is weight.(rule of thumb- most PSU's wont list weight as a spec on most sites.) A lot of PSU's are 80%+ efficient at 20-30 degrees C, but once they get up to 50-60 degrees C ambient, start to droop. If you get a bad PSU it could have efficiency ratings of 50-70% at 50C+. That means if you got a 1000w PSU but some cheap generic brand it could be only pumping out 500-700w instead of a full 1k. Then think if you got a 600w and your system draws 400, but you got a cheap 600w so once things heat up it drops to 300-400w.


My understanding of the efficiency ratings is different than this. If its rated for 1000W it can pump 1000W to your PC. The efficiency has to do with how much it draws from your house to actually supply 1000W to your computer. So if something is only 50% efficient it will have to draw 2000W of power to produce 1000W to your PC. Nothing is 100% efficient. But if it is a good brand and has a solid 80% certification then you can be pretty sure you are running at least 80% efficiency. This means that if your PC is actually demanding 550W of power, then your power supply is drawing a maximum of 687.5 watts from the wall.





Edited, Jul 16th 2010 9:25am by Mithsavvy
#19 Jul 16 2010 at 10:36 AM Rating: Good
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Don't worry about the i5-750. It's a strong cpu for gaming. Check out any of the comparison tests for gaming rigs and you'll find that not only is the 750 en par with a good many more expensive cpus but performs better than a few (mainly AMD, all of the intel quadcore processors perform about the same for gaming). Now, if you do things like video editing or graphical design more expensive cpus perform a bit better but the 750 is really built for gaming. The only way you can do better is to purchase the intel hexacore.

If you have the money to spend a few hundred dollars extra, though, yes, a 930 would not only perform well in gaming but all other tasks.
#20 Jul 16 2010 at 11:46 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
There are doubts FFXIV will support SLI/crossfire at all so if this is your main game then don't worry about it.

SE put up the 'high' system requirements because it wants the game (read engine) last for a long time coming.
Excluding multi GPU support in the engine sounds not very logical to me. (Also because i want my second GPU to have something to do to ;) )
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You're never gonna know what's fake or real
'Til you know who you are
You're lying to your face And running in a race
You're never gonna win 'til you find your place
And you know who you are
#21 Jul 16 2010 at 12:04 PM Rating: Decent
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IMO if you are gonna spend the funds on 2x GTX 480s, you're robbing yourself by going with anything other than the X58 (ie 1366) CPUs and MoBos. 1156 can't support more than one 16x PCIe slot at a time. If you decide to go 1366 instead search until you find a board that has at minimum 2 true 16x PCIe there are a few that have 3 and even 4.

I would also strongly suggest purchasing the CoolerMaster HAF X 942 case, I just got mine a little while ago and it drasticaly reduces the heat from your GPUs with its GPU tunnel, that and it's as future proof as you can get with a case since it supports ATX-E (Entended length) as well as USB 3.0.

If you're set on using the parts you have listed I would reccomend you ditch the dual 480s for dual 460s instead. It will be cheaper and you honestly should be able to tell the difference between the two setups without true dual x16 slots.

*EDIT* Saw you changed to the i7 930 ignore most of my post now except the case :p

Edited, Jul 16th 2010 6:07pm by PerrinofSylph
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#22 Jul 16 2010 at 1:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Thanks for all the input, allthough i'd say some of you only read the first post cause most of your suggestions where allready changed. Changed to 1366 and i7-930, now I realize that the i5-750 does actually perform just as well if not better in most gaming rigs, but I did decide to make the switch to the i7 just to get the 1366 mobo for triple stack ram and a x58 for my 2 cards, not to mention it leaves open the possibility of buying a 3rd card so I dont have to run 2 of the 3d monitors on 1 of the cards, i'll wait till the price comes down in a year to throw a 3rd card in.

Alot of people keep talking about the power supply though.. Is there a reason that I dont know of, besides electricity bills to not have a larger psu then needed? I mean I went with the 1500w for a lot of reasons.

1.) it was $60 cheaper when purchased in combo with 1 of my video cards
2.) I read that 2 480's require 860 watts (without overclocking) and both my video cards are manufacturer OC'ed I know the manufacturer OC's don't add much but still it adds something, then the cpu is 135w, so your looking at 1000w allready, a good 1000w psu would run the machine I agree, but you are then left with no option to OC if you want to in the future when you start falling being in technology.
3.) The possibility of adding a 3rd 480 for my 3d surround setup.
4.) I'm tired of having to replace every single part every time I upgrade my computer. So with the 1500w psu I finally have a chance that in 2 years when I go to upgrade again that there will be 1 part that does not need to be re-purchased, so I would most certainly rather spend $350 on my psu now rather then $250 and then have to spend $250 in 2 years for another psu lol

Oh and ya I plan on getting a SSD for those that mentioned it, probably a 80gb for my OS and games. 80GB should be fine I don't play many games at same time. Some may say 80gb is actually too large, but FFXIV alone will be huge on release i'm sure a good 20gb once all said and done, add in expansions as life goes on and updates and it could possibly eat half the HD alone lol.
#23 Jul 16 2010 at 4:34 PM Rating: Decent
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Probably because it's a bit overkill for now. I think you made the right decision based on your last post. That psu will last for quite a few future builds and would handle anything you will throw at it.
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