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#1 Jul 26 2010 at 1:40 AM Rating: Default
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I'm sorry if this has been asked but in FFXIV can we jump? I've seen a lot of videos and at this point have yet to see a toon jump.
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#2 Jul 26 2010 at 1:42 AM Rating: Good
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As of last beta test, no jump. I wouldnt count on it making it into the game.
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#3 Jul 26 2010 at 1:50 AM Rating: Default
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I hope that changes >.< I was really looking foward to little changes like that
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#4 Jul 26 2010 at 1:52 AM Rating: Good
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I don't have a link, but I remember an interview in which Tanaka laughed off the question and said that it would serve no purpose, so why include it at all.
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#5 Jul 26 2010 at 1:59 AM Rating: Good
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There will be no jumping. There will also be no "toons" either.

As Mictam pointed out; they stated definitively that there was no point to having a jump feature, therefore there was no need for them to include it.

See also: Dragon Age

EDIT: More on "Why there will be no jump" : http://ffxiv.zam.com/story.html?story=22562

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 4:00am by Mikhalia
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#6 Jul 26 2010 at 2:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
toon

Quote:
jump

Quote:
Miami Fl

Troll thread.
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#7 Jul 26 2010 at 2:46 AM Rating: Good
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Almalexia wrote:
Quote:
toon

Quote:
jump

Quote:
Miami Fl

Troll thread.


The third one whooshed me.
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#8 Jul 26 2010 at 3:38 AM Rating: Decent
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Actually, I find jumping very much has a purpose. How many times have you been stuck on a small edge of land in XI? Less then a foot high but your character can't quite seem to grasp lifting his/her foot a little higher in order to bypass the obstacle? A small rift about two feet deep and less then a foot across?

Which all cause you to run all the way around said obstacle when a little jump could have you across this minor inconvenience in no time.
#9 Jul 26 2010 at 3:55 AM Rating: Good
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snieh wrote:
Actually, I find jumping very much has a purpose. How many times have you been stuck on a small edge of land in XI? Less then a foot high but your character can't quite seem to grasp lifting his/her foot a little higher in order to bypass the obstacle? A small rift about two feet deep and less then a foot across?

Which all cause you to run all the way around said obstacle when a little jump could have you across this minor inconvenience in no time.


Small terrain hiccups like ridges in La Thiene or the steps in Ordelle's or "that rock" in Qufim are a problem. However, 2 foot gaps like the Yuhtunga path to Ifrit's Cauldron or pits in caves were intended by design to -force- the player to go around; basically, a one-way terrain obstacle that was there by design. Ditto for many rivers/lakes such as those in Jugner which were intended to force people to go around them to artifially divide land.

If your game is designed around the notion of jumping as a tactic/strategy and where the terrain -requires- it, that's one thing, but if the terrain is designed to be more or less flat, then jumping is unneeded. Many places in XI had land divides where the ability to jump would have surpassed the "intended path". Sky comes to mind.

As I said: look at Dragon Age. The game has no jump option and it doesn't need it.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 5:57am by Mikhalia
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#10 Jul 26 2010 at 4:02 AM Rating: Decent
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It's my theory that no jumping leads to a more mature, dignified community.
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#11 Jul 26 2010 at 4:03 AM Rating: Decent
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Aleandra wrote:
It's my theory that no jumping leads to a more mature, dignified community.


I kinda see where you're trying to go with this, but I would love to hear you expound on it.
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#12 Jul 26 2010 at 5:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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Mikhalia wrote:
Many places in XI had land divides where the ability to jump would have surpassed the "intended path". Sky comes to mind.


You just made me reminisce jumping off the Plane of Night and dropping dead in the middle of the marketplace. It was epic.
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#13 Jul 26 2010 at 5:52 AM Rating: Decent
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There are a few games where you can't jump with free will, just most of the time you don't think about it.

Of course most examples are not MMOs (Zelda, Monster Hunter to name but two), but it shouldn't really be any different.

From experience, jumping in MMOs I've played aren't really a necessity, and about 90% of the jumping time is spent in towns or some such because people are bored. Sort of the like the equivalent of people waving their arms for attention or even children who kick their feet to make noise (apologies if you still do this - I myself tend to jig my leg subsconsciously.)

When jumping is required, people often fail to be able to execute it properly, having turned into a platform game (prime WoW example is getting into BRS).

There are times when I can imagine that jumping would be handy for terrain issues and such, but if the game is designed solidly enough hopefully these situations will be reduced to the point that you won't miss it.
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#14 Jul 26 2010 at 6:23 AM Rating: Decent
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This game doesn't need jump. Other games do, this one doesn't.
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#15 Jul 26 2010 at 6:32 AM Rating: Decent
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Roehon wrote:
toon


Player avatars are called characters not ******* toons.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 9:33am by Lobivopis
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I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#16 Jul 26 2010 at 6:38 AM Rating: Decent
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snieh wrote:
Actually, I find jumping very much has a purpose. How many times have you been stuck on a small edge of land in XI? Less then a foot high but your character can't quite seem to grasp lifting his/her foot a little higher in order to bypass the obstacle? A small rift about two feet deep and less then a foot across?


They are there by design. If you could jump that 2 foot ledge would be a 6 foot ledge that you still couldn't pass.
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Adjust the resolution of menus.
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If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#17 Jul 26 2010 at 7:59 AM Rating: Decent
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Player avatars are called characters not @#%^ing toons.


Furthermore:

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Thanks for your time.
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#18 Jul 26 2010 at 8:18 AM Rating: Good
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I really like to get into things, whether it be movies, books, or role-playing games. Not being able to do very natural things like jump or swim always breaks the immersion for me. Really brings it home in that moment that I'm playing a vidjamagame.

Can you imagine a game designed with your character being able to climb in mind? It makes me tingly.
#19 Jul 26 2010 at 8:24 AM Rating: Excellent
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Keitre wrote:
I really like to get into things, whether it be movies, books, or role-playing games. Not being able to do very natural things like jump or swim always breaks the immersion for me. Really brings it home in that moment that I'm playing a vidjamagame.

Can you imagine a game designed with your character being able to climb in mind? It makes me tingly.

Play Uncharted 2 then. More climbing and jumping THAN YOUR BODY HAS ROOM FOR!
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#20 Jul 26 2010 at 8:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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I HAVE.

IT IS AMAZING.

I guess I should have said "...imagine an MMO..."

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 9:31am by Keitre
#21 Jul 26 2010 at 8:33 AM Rating: Good
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If ladders fall under your category of "climbing," DDO has plenty. ;P
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#22 Jul 26 2010 at 8:35 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm talking about a lot more than just ladders, but they're definitely a step up (HA) in that area over a lot of MMOs.
#23 Jul 26 2010 at 8:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Reason not to jump

1) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-aDoGb191A

2) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqmzkya0mUU

3) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RROz_ohGwrs
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#24 Jul 26 2010 at 8:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Character/toon why so sensitive? I only played WoW for a week and FFXI for 5 years. The toon thing just stuck.

and as for jumping the question was asked only in retrospect of getting stuck on very very small obstacles that you had to drag your character around to get past.
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#25 Jul 26 2010 at 8:58 AM Rating: Good
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Jumping is for amateurs. Teleporting is what all the cools kids are doing now.
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#26 Jul 26 2010 at 9:05 AM Rating: Good
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Jumping though has more than just the up and down motion. It usually involves a calculation of rise and fall. Which can lead to more interesting mechanics such as flight, falling damage, and knockbacks from specific monsters/bosses. These also potentially lead to jumping puzzles which are quite entertaining to watch less than coordinated people attempt.
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#27 Jul 26 2010 at 9:10 AM Rating: Decent
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People really just want jumping cuz they are used to playin WoW so much they they get bored and spam the space bar... i've played it for a long time and as the 3yrs i played FFXI i found it alot easier to not waste time to start jumping and jumping and even jumping more just tryint to get somewhere you think you might not can get... If you wanna jump and that kinda stuff why play FFXI or FFXIV and complain, why not just play wow???
#28 Jul 26 2010 at 9:20 AM Rating: Good
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Keitre wrote:
I really like to get into things, whether it be movies, books, or role-playing games. Not being able to do very natural things like jump or swim always breaks the immersion for me. Really brings it home in that moment that I'm playing a vidjamagame.

Can you imagine a game designed with your character being able to climb in mind? It makes me tingly.


On jumping: If jumping were made to be somewhat realistic (i.e. a standing and/or running long jump rather than a Mario-esque instant jump) I think I'd have less of a problem with it. In most MMOs, though, jumping is mostly unnecessary and poorly done. Even vanilla Oblivion had some lame jumping, though there it could be "fixed" with various mods. Also: Lots of people cite areas in FFXI like Ordelle's Caves as reasons jumping should be allowed, but I look at them more as reasons terrain design needs to be less ****ing stupid. If the "stairs" in Ordelle's Caves weren't ill-designed to begin with, we wouldn't need to jump over them.

On climbing: I'd love to see a MMO incorporate climbing into the game (especially if it were an actual skill and had equipment to go along with it), but I have a feeling it'd be a huge pain for the developer to control. I'd much rather have cliffs, chasms, etc. that I can't climb as the borders of an area than invisible walls. Nothing ****** me off like invisible walls.
#29 Jul 26 2010 at 9:32 AM Rating: Excellent
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On jumping, yeah, I'd definitely want something more on the realistic side.

There are options other than cliffs, chasms and invisible walls for sealing off an area. Running into an invisible wall is a product of poor map design.
#30 Jul 26 2010 at 10:07 AM Rating: Excellent
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I wonder how many people jump in real life? When is the last time you jump up a slight terrian increase opposed to just taking a bigger step?
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#31 Jul 26 2010 at 10:26 AM Rating: Decent
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Thank god, too. Bunny hopping looks stupid. Always has, always will.
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#32 Jul 26 2010 at 10:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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dyvidd wrote:
I wonder how many people jump in real life? When is the last time you jump up a slight terrian increase opposed to just taking a bigger step?


My son does a lot, but he's five. Five-year-olds aren't human.
#33 Jul 26 2010 at 11:40 AM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:
I wonder how many people jump in real life? When is the last time you jump up a slight terrian increase opposed to just taking a bigger step?
I have to agree with you here. Although I don't remember the last time I carried a sword and shield out in public either. My kids though, they are always running around the yard with those Nerf swords and battle axe.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 12:41pm by Harri
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#34 Jul 26 2010 at 12:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Seems like adding jump causes more problems than it solves. Not necessary really.

Ordelle's though - well that could have been solved by changing the mapping of the floor area/walking space, right? RIGHT?! I hope any areas that have similar frustrations are brought to the attention of SE during Beta testing.

On a side note: After you finally divined the correct path up through Ordelle's (through trail and error and error and error) you could easily beat someone in a race up those stairs that did not have as much experience in the zone. Then you felt that you were a FF veteran or something. Is that what they had in mind?
#35 Jul 26 2010 at 1:11 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
On climbing: I'd love to see a MMO incorporate climbing into the game (especially if it were an actual skill and had equipment to go along with it), but I have a feeling it'd be a huge pain for the developer to control. I'd much rather have cliffs, chasms, etc. that I can't climb as the borders of an area than invisible walls. Nothing ****** me off like invisible walls.


Age of Conan had climbing with climbing skill.
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#36 Jul 26 2010 at 1:16 PM Rating: Decent
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Seems like this thread has developed a troll who is jumping all over the rate buttons for anyone that wants to point out the reasons for lack of jumping.

Tossed some rateups all around for anyone on either side who had a valid point or two.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 3:16pm by Mikhalia
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#37 Jul 26 2010 at 1:18 PM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia wrote:
Seems like this thread has developed a troll who is jumping all over the rate buttons for anyone that wants to point out the reasons for lack of jumping.

Tossed some rateups all around for anyone on either side who had a valid point or two.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 3:16pm by Mikhalia


My ratings have been fluctuating up and down all over this forum, people are very free with the red arrows Smiley: smile

I pretty much only rate up anymore, and that only if I find a post compelling or interesting.
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#38 Jul 26 2010 at 1:19 PM Rating: Excellent
Personally, I would love to see swimming in XIV. I'm thinking more along the lines of EQ2 style swimming, where it wasn't only about swimming above water from point A to point B.

You could go underwater to fight mobs, explore ruins, do quests, etc. Underwater was a whole other world to explore. You had a breath gauge, but certain classes had temporary and long term water breathing buffs.

As great as I think it would be for XIV to have that, I seriously doubt it will ever be added.
#39 Jul 26 2010 at 1:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Wint wrote:
Mikhalia wrote:
Seems like this thread has developed a troll who is jumping all over the rate buttons for anyone that wants to point out the reasons for lack of jumping.

Tossed some rateups all around for anyone on either side who had a valid point or two.

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 3:16pm by Mikhalia


My ratings have been fluctuating up and down all over this forum, people are very free with the red arrows Smiley: smile

I pretty much only rate up anymore, and that only if I find a post compelling or interesting.


I'm noticing a lot of posts in several threads that seem like they just got blanket rate-downs for no reason. Fortunately we're on the cusp of having a new Mod to look into this.

*presses the Osarion button*

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 3:54pm by Mikhalia
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#40 Jul 26 2010 at 1:55 PM Rating: Good
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Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally, I would love to see swimming in XIV. I'm thinking more along the lines of EQ2 style swimming, where it wasn't only about swimming above water from point A to point B.

You could go underwater to fight mobs, explore ruins, do quests, etc. Underwater was a whole other world to explore. You had a breath gauge, but certain classes had temporary and long term water breathing buffs.

As great as I think it would be for XIV to have that, I seriously doubt it will ever be added.


I'm in agreement here. I liked swimming in WoW and in DDO.
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#41 Jul 26 2010 at 2:09 PM Rating: Excellent
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Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally, I would love to see swimming in XIV.


Agreed. Swimming, if done well, would add a lot of immersion (*snicker*).
#42 Jul 26 2010 at 2:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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Hate = Threat

Aggro is the result which you walked too close to the mob and made it noticed you and your group, then it caused link.

As far as jumping, I do like jumping, but I also agree that jumping was not required in FFXI, so I'm ok with no jumping in FFXIV.

I don't know in other MMOs, but in WoW, the jump function did serve a very important purpose in PVP, especially for caster classes. For the class I played, there's an ability that would trigger an instant cast magic under certain situation, when the ability is triggered, I can cast a magic spell without casting it for 3 second, however, I have to face the target in order to cast the spell. So during a one on one PVP fight, casters basically don't have the time to stand still to cast a 3 second spell unless we can somehow immobilized the target. So in my case, I would be running around and some times I would have my back facing my opponent, which this ability triggered, I would jump up and click and drag my mouse's right click so I could turn 180 degree in the air and blast the magic spell to my opponent then continued to drag the mouse until it face another direction before I landed, thus, I could keep running to the same direction or change my direction as soon as I landed.

Since there's no PVP in FFXIV, I don't really see the need for jumping...

Edited, Jul 26th 2010 4:17pm by dunlag
#43 Jul 26 2010 at 2:17 PM Rating: Decent
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CapnCrass wrote:
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally, I would love to see swimming in XIV.


Agreed. Swimming, if done well, would add a lot of immersion (*snicker*).


*groan* That was so bad, it was funny.
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#44 Jul 26 2010 at 2:27 PM Rating: Good
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#45 Jul 26 2010 at 2:29 PM Rating: Good
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XelKarin wrote:


That does bring up an interesting point. I can't see how they would let you jump in and toodle along in full chainmail Smiley: laugh
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#46 Jul 26 2010 at 2:30 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mikhalia wrote:
CapnCrass wrote:
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally, I would love to see swimming in XIV.


Agreed. Swimming, if done well, would add a lot of immersion (*snicker*).


*groan* That was so bad, it was funny.


Fortunatly we done have to go to in depth with the swimming jokes
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#47 Jul 26 2010 at 2:36 PM Rating: Decent
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Wint wrote:
That does bring up an interesting point. I can't see how they would let you jump in and toodle along in full chainmail


It could work, with some lead boots and an attachment to turn his helm into a diving helmet. I don't know if you could call that swimming though.
#48 Jul 26 2010 at 3:04 PM Rating: Excellent
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For whatever reason, swimming in video games scares the crap outta me. I think it stems from Daggerfall (Elder Scrolls #2) where you would be swimming along and get one-shotted by an underwater Deadra. Evil looking things.

Now my mind comes up with the scariest possible creatures to grab at my ankles - so I peek underwater and AHHHH, a simple fish will make me soil my undies. Has turned me into an digital coward where water is concerned.
#49 Jul 26 2010 at 3:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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XelKarin wrote:
Wint wrote:
That does bring up an interesting point. I can't see how they would let you jump in and toodle along in full chainmail


It could work, with some lead boots and an attachment to turn his helm into a diving helmet. I don't know if you could call that swimming though.

What you need is the blue tunic, then you can walk along with your iron boots underwa...... wrong game nevermind
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#50 Jul 26 2010 at 3:22 PM Rating: Decent
I don't really care to see jumping or swimming in the game (although to be honest climbing ladders/etc would be kinda cool)

but... if anyone has ever listened to something named 1D... Someone commands us to "roam, run, swim".
Sounds like in the beginning cutscene for Limsa Lominsa that "Hear, Feel, Think" stuff... So. Who knows.



Edited, Jul 26th 2010 5:23pm by AngelicPretty
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#51 Jul 26 2010 at 3:56 PM Rating: Decent
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RufuSwho wrote:
Ordelle's though - well that could have been solved by changing the mapping of the floor area/walking space, right? RIGHT?! I hope any areas that have similar frustrations are brought to the attention of SE during Beta testing.

On a side note: After you finally divined the correct path up through Ordelle's (through trail and error and error and error) you could easily beat someone in a race up those stairs that did not have as much experience in the zone. Then you felt that you were a FF veteran or something. Is that what they had in mind?
See also:

Crawler's Nest
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
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