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Gamescom Interview - Details on the Open BetaFollow

#1 Aug 19 2010 at 6:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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4Gamer sat with Final Fantasy XIV developers Hiromichi Tanaka, Nobuaki Komoto and Sage Sundi to discuss the big changes coming for the open beta. Check out the details.
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#2 Aug 19 2010 at 6:34 AM Rating: Decent
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Interesting to see that there will be a new benchmark.
#3 Aug 19 2010 at 6:39 AM Rating: Good
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Omg @ people not trying to party...
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#4 Aug 19 2010 at 6:44 AM Rating: Good
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I like this!

Faster battles/Quicker action - I think the pace is good even now, but if it makes the game more fun for everyone else, I'm all for it!

Solo vs. Group - I really like the fact that the game is playable solo, but I also would like grouping to have slightly better benefits to make up for the time and effort of forming a good group.

New Guildleves - I think I'll love the guildleve system so more guildleves is sweet.

Open Beta will be 2-3 weeks - So, that gives us an approximate date when open beta starts...so maybe it'll start around the beginning of September?

Long distance between city-states - I think having a realistic distance between them just adds to the epicness factor.

Saving names from open beta - This would be great, though it's highly unlikely someone will have my planned first AND last name already taken.

Can't monopolize "certain monsters" - Remember HNM camping, anyone?

New Benchmark - I guess they heard about the current benchmark not being so accurate?
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#5 Aug 19 2010 at 6:50 AM Rating: Good
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I guess they heard about the current benchmark not being so accurate?


Or they've adjusted the parameters to in the game to a point where the original benchmark numbers are meaningless. ;)


Quote:
In FFXI, players complained they couldn't get parties, but in FFXIV, they don't even bother trying to join one.


. . . /facepalm

No, I don't think I'll elaborate on that. . . too much has already been hotly contested regarding solo vs pty play.

Edited, Aug 19th 2010 8:54am by seneleron
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#6 Aug 19 2010 at 7:02 AM Rating: Decent
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A new version of the benchmark software is under development.



wowwww.. that shocking news lol maybe crossfire/sli support?
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#7 Aug 19 2010 at 7:03 AM Rating: Decent
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seneleron wrote:
Quote:
In FFXI, players complained they couldn't get parties, but in FFXIV, they don't even bother trying to join one.


. . . /facepalm

No, I don't think I'll elaborate on that. . . too much has already been hotly contested regarding solo vs pty play.


Oh, yes. The irony is awesome.
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#8 Aug 19 2010 at 7:08 AM Rating: Decent
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•The game has been designed in a way that players cannot monopolize certain monsters in an area

I wonder how this is going to turn out, I Loved nothing more than HNM camping. Anything about BCNM's poped up yet?
#9 Aug 19 2010 at 7:09 AM Rating: Good
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Hopefully they will implement ground breaking technology allowing players to Alt-Tab a full screen game and not crash! I know, a man can dream.
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#10 Aug 19 2010 at 7:09 AM Rating: Decent
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I guess this means we can expect to see our initial benchmark scores rise. That's fantastic.

As for solo vs party play... Lol. Let's just leave it at that.
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#11 Aug 19 2010 at 7:19 AM Rating: Decent
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w34v3r wrote:
I guess this means we can expect to see our initial benchmark scores rise.


This and lets hope for the ability to select which city state to choose from.
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#12 Aug 19 2010 at 7:28 AM Rating: Decent
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People only solo makes me a sad panda.
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#13 Aug 19 2010 at 7:37 AM Rating: Good
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widnes wrote:
•The game has been designed in a way that players cannot monopolize certain monsters in an area

I wonder how this is going to turn out, I Loved nothing more than HNM camping. Anything about BCNM's poped up yet?


I kind of feel like levequests are an evolution of BCNMs and would be kind of surprised if they included a BCNM system.
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#14 Aug 19 2010 at 7:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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Sounds like some interesting stuff. With the open beta and people retaining names, it makes it seem like the server names are set.
#15 Aug 19 2010 at 8:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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Omg @ people not trying to party...


In the beta, partying can be difficult.

First, the chat system is still pretty clunky. Often I can't even tell if a person is online when I try to whisper them.

Second, there is no LFG tool that's worth anything.

Third, there is no chat channel to spam with "LFG / LFM" stuff. You can only sit at an Aetheryte and /say or /shout.

Fourth, while there are defined healer and DD roles, it is difficult to find a shield for gladiators. Taking on party-level mobs without a shield right now is pretty "iffy."
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#16 Aug 19 2010 at 11:01 AM Rating: Good
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I'm all for soloing but I'd also liked to be forced to pt, or at least get a greater reward for doing it. It seems the tables have turned now instead of "You can't solo in ffxi." now its "You can't pt in ffxiv." 8)
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#17 Aug 19 2010 at 11:40 AM Rating: Decent
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I tried to PT for leve last night but beta is so unstable, I got error message and when I log back in like less than one minute, can't see my duo partner anywhere.. maybe he got forced out the game as well.... no way to tell since I only remembered his first name....
I feel so sorry, Iron something...
Hope the retail version gets much better.
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#18 Aug 19 2010 at 11:42 AM Rating: Decent
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If this is gonna be a MSORPG (massive single player online RPG) it wont last long, at least not for me.
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#19UncleRuckusForLife, Posted: Aug 19 2010 at 12:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Its just the other starting city cut scenes dont get to excited.
#20 Aug 19 2010 at 12:10 PM Rating: Default
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widnes wrote:
•The game has been designed in a way that players cannot monopolize certain monsters in an area

I wonder how this is going to turn out, I Loved nothing more than HNM camping. Anything about BCNM's poped up yet?


Its called surplus exp if you fight the same thing long enough you wont get exp from it so you have to move to something else. Awsome system lol.
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#21 Aug 19 2010 at 12:17 PM Rating: Decent
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So, this eliminates farming and certain grinding or...?

Wait, ugh, I'm a moron. When one farms for mats one doesn't usually care about getting EXP.

But solo grinding for EXP would be a problem? I don't understand this system.
#22 Aug 19 2010 at 12:42 PM Rating: Good
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I read somewhere else that they're working on the 48 hour guildleve cooldown so that it makes more sense than it does currently. Sounds like currently, you have a 2 day cooldown before you can do another leve, during that time, in order to do another leve, you have to party up. SE is actively trying to "promote" partying up without turning away players that enjoy soloing more. They seem to be looking for that balance. I believe there's going to be so many FFXI players playing FFXIV that nobody who enjoys partying up is going to have an issue finding a party.

I know I enjoy to group and meet new players in every mmorpg I've played but I don't want to be forced to party, there's days where I don't feel like being social, yet I still find it amusing to listen to others chat it up in a mmorpg rather than playing a solo game. There are other days where I have to /afk a lot but I still enjoy the group atmosphere, just don't have time to group up.

I think a good mmorpg will find balance between the two camps so that they appeal to the biggest playerbase.

Edited, Aug 19th 2010 2:44pm by RinnaKai
#23 Aug 19 2010 at 1:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Its called surplus exp if you fight the same thing long enough you wont get exp from it so you have to move to something else. Awsome system lol.


Alright, I have some questions regarding this:

I'm guessing this means that typical party "Grinding" has, in fact, been stopped. [obviously if your mobs quit giving XP]

Which leaves the guildleave system. Let's I have two days straight off to play, but I finished my guildleaves in a few hours. Nobody wants to invite me to their guildleave party, because I have no guildleaves outstanding to be of benefit to the party. [or for the sake of an easier argument, let's just say it's a slow night] I feel like leveling, but not crafting. I enjoy [random job] and would like to get it higher over the next 48 hours.

What are my options?
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#24 Aug 19 2010 at 1:05 PM Rating: Excellent
Anyone else beginning to think we're just a giant panda joke?

Panda Joke noun. Def: Any person, place or thing that is in appearance too contrary to exist, similar to pandas, which are so specialized that they can only eat one type of food and rarely breed even though they are endangered. Ex: In FFXI, players complained they couldn't get parties, but in FFXIV, they don't even bother trying to join one.
#25 Aug 19 2010 at 1:08 PM Rating: Default
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seneleron wrote:
Quote:
Its called surplus exp if you fight the same thing long enough you wont get exp from it so you have to move to something else. Awsome system lol.


Alright, I have some questions regarding this:

I'm guessing this means that typical party "Grinding" has, in fact, been stopped. [obviously if your mobs quit giving XP]

Which leaves the guildleave system. Let's I have two days straight off to play, but I finished my guildleaves in a few hours. Nobody wants to invite me to their guildleave party, because I have no guildleaves outstanding to be of benefit to the party. [or for the sake of an easier argument, let's just say it's a slow night] I feel like leveling, but not crafting. I enjoy [random job] and would like to get it higher over the next 48 hours.

What are my options?


I guess you have to stop fighting those rabid fireflys and switch to vicious lady bugs.
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#26 Aug 19 2010 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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I keep reading a whole lot of different things about the surplus exp...that it's class related because it's gone when you switch classes, others say it's the cause of having a degraded weapon(repairing fixes it), or you can't stay in 1 spot too long, or it's a way to balance the hardcore players with the casual ones, etc.

Quite confusing...
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#27 Aug 19 2010 at 1:20 PM Rating: Good
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TwistedOwl wrote:
I keep reading a whole lot of different things about the surplus exp...that it's class related because it's gone when you switch classes, others say it's the cause of having a degraded weapon(repairing fixes it), or you can't stay in 1 spot too long, or it's a way to balance the hardcore players with the casual ones, etc.
Quite confusing...


Imagine how nice it would be if a dev would give us like 1 paragraph of what it actually is what a mind blowing thought right?
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#28 Aug 19 2010 at 1:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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UncleRuckusForLife wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
I keep reading a whole lot of different things about the surplus exp...that it's class related because it's gone when you switch classes, others say it's the cause of having a degraded weapon(repairing fixes it), or you can't stay in 1 spot too long, or it's a way to balance the hardcore players with the casual ones, etc.
Quite confusing...


Imagine how nice it would be if a dev would give us like 1 paragraph of what it actually is what a mind blowing thought right?


Exactly
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#29 Aug 19 2010 at 1:23 PM Rating: Decent
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someone stated earlier in the thread why there's not much partying going on, mainly cause you cant lfg.. most people are trying just to get past the slowness of menus and bad server lag on their own to worry about finding a pt to 'grind'
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#30 Aug 19 2010 at 1:30 PM Rating: Good
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So when does open beta start and how do you get in?
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#31 Aug 19 2010 at 1:44 PM Rating: Good
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New benchmark!

Yeah, ive waited this long, im not gonna go into beta, ive decided i want everything fresh on day 1.
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#32 Aug 19 2010 at 2:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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The distance between each city-state is very far, allowing players to really explore the vast landscape of Eorzea for the first time. Getting to and from Limsa-Lominsa will require access to a ship.


Yep, I can just see the interview.

Interviewer: I remember going through Jugner Forest as part of my first trek to Jeuno, you're planning something like that?
Tanaka: Oh, yes. The tigers. We have many tiger areas in FFXIV.
Interviewer: You say you'll need to go by sea to get to one city...
Tanaka: Sea Tigers. Very fierce.

#33 Aug 19 2010 at 3:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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I keep reading a whole lot of different things about the surplus exp...that it's class related because it's gone when you switch classes, others say it's the cause of having a degraded weapon(repairing fixes it), or you can't stay in 1 spot too long, or it's a way to balance the hardcore players with the casual ones, etc.
Quite confusing...


Surplus EXP has been bugged this entire time and its now 'starting' to work as intended. Its related to your weapon and the quality its currently in. You don't repair it and you start seeing not just your ability to damage or perform your job well but you also can't get better at it. The last patch people have seen there surplus mysteriously vanish only to come back shortly but now its possible eliminate the surplus by simply repairing the tool. I'm sure the same priniciple is used for physical EXP and you must repair armor to get that leveling when in surplus. SE should have commented the purpose of it for a long time but that's SE for you :/ they treat the beta testers are literal unpaid slaves who don't deserve the time of day much less an explanation for why they are doing things.

As for the issues with groups, its a culmination of an unworking lfg tool, no player search, reward balancing of leves not being worthwhile enough to stay in large groups and battle mechanics in groups are wonky to say the least (Fix hate management for release SE or I will bite you!) Several of the issues will probably be fixed at release but I'm weary of them getting hate management done since that is such a core part of the system that 'adding' stuff to the game that's unfinished won't change it much.
#34 Aug 19 2010 at 4:57 PM Rating: Good
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insanekangaroo wrote:
If this is gonna be a MSORPG (massive single player online RPG) it wont last long, at least not for me.


I am all for partying if you can easily get a party together within 10min-20min.... and still do it two years from now when most of the players have either quit or playing their high levels.

I enjoyed partying in FFXI when I was actually in a party, but LFG for 2+ hours is just stupid, IMO.

I would rather have the ability to solo (at any level) and get less XP for the time I am by myself and not worry about dying and losing 10% of my level...

I would also like to see a 2x (or some other type) bonus to XP for those who want to party... that way there are incentives for people who are borderline solo/party type of players.

I can see the reasoning behind most of the old time FFXI players getting upset about the solo vs. party situation, and they don't want their (that's funny... really.) community to be like Warcraft's... but SE knows what sells now and it isn't the strict no solo ability game. SE wants money, and making FFXIV more friendly to the masses will get them more money. It isn't YOUR game, it belongs to SE.

I would be willing to bet that if everyone who complains about the "I don't want to be able to solo" situation just ups and quits FFXIV... SE will still be raking in the cash like no one's business.

I loved FFXI when I first started. I loved everything about the game for a loonnggg time... except being forced to group in order to get XP fast, and the ability to not have a chance of dying on every fight. I tried BST and BLU soloing and even though both were great fun I never had the time to commit to long sessions of grinding... even in a group.

I am not a WoW "fanboy", and I am not a Final Fantasy fanboy either... I just want options when I play an online game. The term "MMO" has never meant that you have to group up to do things... it means that there are a lot of other human players playing the same game... so let them play the game like they want and if certain people don't like how the game plays then maybe they should find something else to play.

Edited, Aug 19th 2010 5:57pm by PentUpAnger
#35 Aug 19 2010 at 7:05 PM Rating: Good
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star trek online was a MMO that turned out to be a Massive single player game. ranked up to cap in one week completly solo. terrible game.

but the beta is low level. keep that in mind. in 11 you traditionally lvld solo until the teens, 10 being the min. aion i solod until the 20s. and i as i said in Star trek i solod until 45(cap). each game is different and its likely FF14 testers havent got to the level its best to group.
#36 Aug 19 2010 at 8:03 PM Rating: Decent
TwistedOwl wrote:
I keep reading a whole lot of different things about the surplus exp...that it's class related because it's gone when you switch classes, others say it's the cause of having a degraded weapon(repairing fixes it), or you can't stay in 1 spot too long, or it's a way to balance the hardcore players with the casual ones, etc.

Quite confusing...


In my personal experience I've only run into surplus XP when my highest leveled class was significantly higher than my next highest class.

Surplus XP is indicated by a change in color on your XP counter. If you have guardian's favor, it's green. If you have no effects, it's white. If you are in "surplus" it turns yellow or red (red being worse, up to 90% XP lost).

If I swap to a level 1 class with a physical level of 15, my physical XP starts being lost to surplus, but not my class XP. If I switch to a level 15 class and no other class is above level 1, then I get surplus XP on my class, but not my physical XP.

It seems pretty obvious to me what's causing it, but every one seems to have a crazy theory of their own.
#37 Aug 19 2010 at 8:10 PM Rating: Decent
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KarlHungis Delivers on Time wrote:
If I swap to a level 1 class with a physical level of 15, my physical XP starts being lost to surplus, but not my class XP.
Odd, because I've seen the exact opposite.
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#38 Aug 19 2010 at 9:23 PM Rating: Good
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Yes, UI problems, unfriendly grouping mechanics..... yada yada rabble rabble. I think everyone is missing the real issue here. Where the **** are my Goblin pics!!!?? They have shown a lot of pics and video of the land and beasts, but I have yet to see some Goblins. And I wants em!!
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#39 Aug 19 2010 at 10:50 PM Rating: Decent
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but the beta is low level. keep that in mind. in 11 you traditionally lvld solo until the teens, 10 being the min. aion i solod until the 20s. and i as i said in Star trek i solod until 45(cap). each game is different and its likely FF14 testers havent got to the level its best to group.


This. I'm also one of those people who're worried about the party play in FFXIV, but for some reason the fact that in FFXI you solo'd until 10-12 slipped my mind. Im sure the need for parties will arise not that far into the game.
#40 Aug 19 2010 at 10:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Yes, UI problems, unfriendly grouping mechanics..... yada yada rabble rabble. I think everyone is missing the real issue here. Where the **** are my Goblin pics!!!?? They have shown a lot of pics and video of the land and beasts, but I have yet to see some Goblins. And I wants em!!


I fought a Kobold yesterday, what a nasty mob that was. I bet those are the goblins of XIV. Red eyes and stuff... but no pic!
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#41 Aug 19 2010 at 10:53 PM Rating: Decent
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* So far, players are very happy with the ease of solo play. In FFXI, players complained they couldn't get parties, but in FFXIV, they don't even mind not joining one.

This makes me angry. The rest looks nice, but this makes me very angry.
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#42 Aug 19 2010 at 11:07 PM Rating: Default
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That sentence is telling me one thing. People only want to solo. In FFXI people hated partying, now in FFXIV people do not have to, thus the comment that no one want to party.

#43 Aug 19 2010 at 11:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
That sentence is telling me one thing. People only want to solo. In FFXI people hated partying, now in FFXIV people do not have to, thus the comment that no one want to party.


That's not how it is in-game. Even if I wanted to party, the design limits me from doing so. There are also not enough incentives to make grouping (or should I say- leading) worth it.

Edited, Aug 20th 2010 5:15am by Hyanmen
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#44 Aug 19 2010 at 11:31 PM Rating: Decent
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I, sure, hope that parties will evolve to be a key part of FFXIV at higher levels in the game. Soloing is good and all, but, to me, grouping up is a cornerstone of what makes a mmorpg a MMO. Frustrations with trying to find parties in FFXI was, or is still, one of the worse parts of that game. But soloing , or too much solo content, would be just as bad imo. I dearly hope FFXIV will contain an equally-balanced system for those who wish to solo and those who enjoy parties.

Just as a personal comment... too much soloing would be akin to playing any normal offline rpg. I enjoy mmorpgs because of the community (group) dynamic of working together to get something done. To work as a unit to achieve a goal and, hopefully, get rewarded for it.
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#45 Aug 20 2010 at 8:25 AM Rating: Decent
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I can't wait to try the new benchmark. I did have a problem running the current one but that was easily fixed by reinstalling my directX and updateing. I'm curious to see how my low/high res scores will change if at all.

EDIT: ok, here's a stupid question but what's a 'open' beta mean???? ^.^;;;
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#46 Aug 20 2010 at 12:43 PM Rating: Decent
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open means it's open for everyone to join.

Edited, Aug 20th 2010 8:43pm by insanekangaroo
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#47 Aug 20 2010 at 1:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Not necessarily.

Open beta in many games does mean that it is fully open to the public. But in some games it just means that it is open to a very large group of people. But not necessarily everyone.

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#48 Aug 20 2010 at 1:08 PM Rating: Decent
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KarlHungis wrote:

In my personal experience I've only run into surplus XP when my highest leveled class was significantly higher than my next highest class.

Surplus XP is indicated by a change in color on your XP counter. If you have guardian's favor, it's green. If you have no effects, it's white. If you are in "surplus" it turns yellow or red (red being worse, up to 90% XP lost).

If I swap to a level 1 class with a physical level of 15, my physical XP starts being lost to surplus, but not my class XP. If I switch to a level 15 class and no other class is above level 1, then I get surplus XP on my class, but not my physical XP.

It seems pretty obvious to me what's causing it, but every one seems to have a crazy theory of their own.


... What?

No, really - I swear these devs just sit around thinking up ways to overcomplicate things that could be very simple. So there is a whole convoluted system to make it harder for us to level (and incidentally, understand the process of leveling at all). Guildleves are locked to 1 per two days. The whole last name system has just added an extra layer of unnecessary /search problems.

I may be only getting bits and pieces of what is actually going on and perhaps by Sept this will all magically tie together in some epic show of mmo mastery - but holy **** I have never seen more complicated systems in a game as XI and XIV.
#49 Aug 20 2010 at 1:24 PM Rating: Good
Torrence wrote:


... What?

No, really - I swear these devs just sit around thinking up ways to overcomplicate things that could be very simple. So there is a whole convoluted system to make it harder for us to level (and incidentally, understand the process of leveling at all). Guildleves are locked to 1 per two days. The whole last name system has just added an extra layer of unnecessary /search problems.


Just to clarify some thing, Guild leves are not locked at one per 2 days. You can have up to 8 regional leves and 8 local leves at a time. Local leves are always crafting, regional leves are combat or gathering. Usually less than 8 leves of each type are available, but you can hold 8 of each.

Every 48 hours, the available leves reset. Leves you already have accepted can still be done, and new leves are available. So the upper limit is 8 regional leves per 48 hour window, plus 8 local (crafting) leves, plus any "missions" or non leve activities.

The problem isn't really the 48 hour window, it's 1) Not enough leves available to actually fill your quota and 2) No group related activities other than leves and 3) No real incentive to do leves in a group.

Also, the only thing I can say for absolute certaintly about surplus XP is that it's never explained at all in game. I have my theory about what causes it that seems to match my experience, but other people are just as certain that they know what's going on and their theory is completely different than mine.

#50 Aug 20 2010 at 1:54 PM Rating: Decent
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3,416 posts
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... What?

No, really - I swear these devs just sit around thinking up ways to overcomplicate things that could be very simple. So there is a whole convoluted system to make it harder for us to level (and incidentally, understand the process of leveling at all). Guildleves are locked to 1 per two days. The whole last name system has just added an extra layer of unnecessary /search problems.

I may be only getting bits and pieces of what is actually going on and perhaps by Sept this will all magically tie together in some epic show of mmo mastery - but holy sh*t I have never seen more complicated systems in a game as XI and XIV.


The whole GuildLeve system is quite easy to understand, in the end. The limitations all come down to helping the developers keep the economy and player's growth in check, as well as help to narrow the line between a hardcore and a casual player.

For hardcore players, this may be a bad thing, but a) they are not without any benefits for playing long periods of time, the opposite actually and b) majority of players will be casuals, and the system benefits them more.

It also makes the game very group based, without making soloing an impossibility. It's quite genius of a system, to be honest, but if they made it "simpler" it would not work as it does now.

It still needs tweaks, but it's getting there like the rest of the game.

As for surnames, that's just SE trying new things, which I can not think as a bad thing in this industry where everything is copied and nothing is new. You are bound to have some stupid ideas that may not work as envisioned, but also ideas that work, especially with little tweaking.

No new idea is perfect right from the get-go. Not all new ideas are bound to be successful. That's just something we have to live with, or play the copycat games instead.
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SE:
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We really want to compete against World of Warcraft and for example the new Star Wars MMO.

#51 Aug 20 2010 at 3:12 PM Rating: Decent
3 posts
As much as people rip on WoW's community (with good reason), having a tiny but awesome community isn't all that great for the health of a game. Frankly, the whole 'forced to party at all times' concept should be left behind in the Everquest era. I don't think being able to solo everything in the game is much better, but there's plenty of room between those two extremes.

Personally I'm fairly happy with WoW's system in that area. You can level up characters completely solo, or you can just grind dungeons with random groups. Either way beats the pants off camping some corner of a zone with a party. If I'm going to grind, I'd at least like some vague motivation behind what I'm killing (ie: quest XP/quest loot, maybe some lore if I'm lucky). If I'm grinding in a group, it's much more interesting to progress through some kind of instance than to just camp in one spot ad nauseum. The only time you ARE forced to group in WoW is to get dungeon/raid loot (at least until you outgear it), or just to experience the top-end content, and that makes sense to me.

I'm fairly optimistic that FFXIV will figure out something sensible. FFXI would've been my EQ killer if not for the forced grouping (even EQ wasn't so bad about it later in its life) and a few other issues... instead that ended up being WoW. Maybe FFXIV will be my WoW killer. ;)
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