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What if SE Can't remove surplus?Follow

#1 Aug 29 2010 at 9:13 AM Rating: Default
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After reading all the silly complaints on the Beta forums about the surplus problem I came to think... What if Square-Enix has programmed their game so deeply they cannot remove the system? I can actually see that happening. They did say it has always been there since the beginning. If its soo hard coded into their system I wouldn't trust them to strip it all out in a month of time before the gold release. From a programming background I could see the challenge of removing a whole system from a program. hmmm... maybe I think too much waiting for the Open beta to start up...
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#2 Aug 29 2010 at 9:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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Zalim wrote:
After reading all the silly complaints on the Beta forums about the surplus problem I came to think... What if Square-Enix has programmed their game so deeply they cannot remove the system? I can actually see that happening. They did say it has always been there since the beginning. If its soo hard coded into their system I wouldn't trust them to strip it all out in a month of time before the gold release. From a programming background I could see the challenge of removing a whole system from a program. hmmm... maybe I think too much waiting for the Open beta to start up...


From a programming background you would certainly be aware that removing the system entirely is almost certainly NOT the solution they'd go with if they wanted to get rid of it. They'd simply remove or comment the hooks in the code that reference it. Or adjust the trigger values on it so that they never occur (2000 hours of EXPing per week for instance)
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#3 Aug 29 2010 at 10:34 AM Rating: Decent
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I don't think they will completely remove it period. Change it, yes. Remove it, no.
#4 Aug 29 2010 at 10:39 AM Rating: Good
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Honestly it SHOULD be fairly simple to remove [for them, anyway] but you can bet they still won't do it.

With SE's rep, if they only sold 5 copies of the game total and everyone in the world signed a petition telling them that FATIGUE is the cause of all evil in the world, and just by removing it we'd experience an age of enlightenment the like of which had never been seen by mankind. . .they STILL wouldn't remove it.

Some people will defend an idea to the DEATH because they just cannot admit that they made a mistake.
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#5 Aug 29 2010 at 10:43 AM Rating: Good
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Archmage Callinon wrote:
Zalim wrote:
After reading all the silly complaints on the Beta forums about the surplus problem I came to think... What if Square-Enix has programmed their game so deeply they cannot remove the system? I can actually see that happening. They did say it has always been there since the beginning. If its soo hard coded into their system I wouldn't trust them to strip it all out in a month of time before the gold release. From a programming background I could see the challenge of removing a whole system from a program. hmmm... maybe I think too much waiting for the Open beta to start up...


From a programming background you would certainly be aware that removing the system entirely is almost certainly NOT the solution they'd go with if they wanted to get rid of it. They'd simply remove or comment the hooks in the code that reference it. Or adjust the trigger values on it so that they never occur (2000 hours of EXPing per week for instance)


Exactly, anyone that programs knows how easy it is to remove something like the surplus code. Like Cal said its as easy as changing the surplus value to 2000 hours. In all honesty the surplus is the stupidest thing i've seen a MMO try to implement in a long time. You can only play our game for 1 hour per day without being extremely inconvenienced.... ummm no
#6bushpig, Posted: Aug 29 2010 at 10:45 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) why should they remove it?
#7 Aug 29 2010 at 10:51 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Exactly, anyone that programs knows how easy it is to remove something like the surplus code. Like Cal said its as easy as changing the surplus value to 2000 hours. In all honesty the surplus is the stupidest thing i've seen a MMO try to implement in a long time. You can only play our game for 1 hour per day without being extremely inconvenienced.... ummm no


You have to hit the threshold value of EXP they set for one hour EIGHT TIMES in one week. Then when you are NOT EXPING, like running around or in town or logged off or whatever else you do when you're not EXPING, or on another class, you will recover. So I don't think this will be a big issue at all unless you have no life.
#8 Aug 29 2010 at 11:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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Zalim wrote:
After reading all the silly complaints on the Beta forums about the surplus problem I came to think... What if Square-Enix has programmed their game so deeply they cannot remove the system? I can actually see that happening. They did say it has always been there since the beginning. If its soo hard coded into their system I wouldn't trust them to strip it all out in a month of time before the gold release. From a programming background I could see the challenge of removing a whole system from a program. hmmm... maybe I think too much waiting for the Open beta to start up...


1. I doubt they want to take it out. More likely if enough people quit they'll do some adjustments, but if they were going to remove it, they'd have said something already with all the rage going on about it.

2. If they are competent developers at all, it would be easy to take out. If they use good coding practices, all they'd have to do is change a handful of lines. If they don't, it would still just be a simple find & replace.

3. If a person puts something "so deep" in the code that it can't be found and taken out in a day or two of work by one programmer, that person is either a stupendous moron who has no clue how to program and shouldn't be working in the first place, or an amazing coder and is doing it intentionally to sabotage the project. This type of person would probably not waste their time putting in a sh*tty game mechanic, as they could do much worse. Just off the top of my head, sneak code into the compiler that sneaks random errors into the compiled code. Better yet just in case they decide the compiler is the problem and make changes to the compiler, put code into the compiler's compiler that puts code into the compiler that makes it put the bugs into the code.

Quote:
I don't think this will be a big issue at all unless you have no life.


So you're saying it'll be an issue for a lot of people then?

Edited, Aug 29th 2010 1:47pm by khorbin
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#9 Aug 29 2010 at 12:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Ya if they just wanted to remove the whole thing to clear up lines of code it would be as simple as deleting the surplus function/class and then doing a find and delete for every place that main or another function calls the surplus function.
#10 Aug 29 2010 at 12:07 PM Rating: Excellent
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They probably have the scaling values set as global constants somewhere. Quickly setting them to 0, or 100, or whatever value represents no change in experience rate should take about 2 minutes.

If the system is coded in any other way I would say we have much bigger worries about the people behind the game and their ability to fix much of anything.
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