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#1 Sep 06 2010 at 7:33 AM Rating: Good
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Okay, so I finally finished the downloading, and successfully logged in.

The game performed better than I thought it would. I didn't have an FPS monitor running, and I couldn't find one in game, but I would estimate about 30 FPS or so, better than I thought I'd do at any rate.

The graphics are stunning, even with them on LOW! I was impressed by the graphics, and the first battle (I started in Gridania, so I was fighting wolves in the woods with a pugilist) looked cool. It wasn't "wait 5 seconds, throw 2 punches, wait 5 seconds, throw 2 punches", my character was hopping and jumping, and jabbing away with very little wait time between attacks. Movement seemed much more realistic too, than in FFXI.

What I'm getting stuck on, though, is the camera.

Is there a way to "lock" your camera behind your character, so that if you turn, the camera turns with you in Third Person? This is confusing the heck out of me, if I turn my character, the camera doesn't and I find myself having to stop and turn the camera every time I need to change direction (otherwise, I get my character running towards the camera, and I can't see where I'm going)... I know I can use Third-person, but I enjoy seeing my character on-screen.

It took me awhile to figure out how to *move* the map. The very first thing I was told to do, was go to some place marked on the map. Easy enough, I thought.. I opened the map and there's no scrollbars, no arrows, nothing and I had to start hitting random keys to figure out how to move (or even zoom!) the map...

So, recap:

1). Give us a camera (un)lock, please. Every other MMORPG allows you to be in third-person view, and allows the camera to move with the character. Make it an option for those who like the current way.

2). Add some arrows/scrollbars/zoom buttons on the map, instead of forcing us to use keys on the keyboard to do this.

That's what I saw in the first 10 minutes of playing the game.
#2 Sep 06 2010 at 7:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
1). Give us a camera (un)lock, please. Every other MMORPG allows you to be in third-person view, and allows the camera to move with the character. Make it an option for those who like the current way.

2). Add some arrows/scrollbars/zoom buttons on the map, instead of forcing us to use keys on the keyboard to do this.


1) its there, I've never used it but some people have used it, its a setting somewhere maybe in config menu..also, IJKL to rotate camera or if you use the mouse you click and hold the right mouse button and move it.

2) yea no arrows or scroll bars although i'm not sure if using the mouse to move it works as well, I use IJKL but you can try the mouse as well. (right click mouse and move).
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#3 Sep 06 2010 at 7:53 AM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
1) its there, I've never used it but some people have used it, its a setting somewhere maybe in config menu..also, IJKL to rotate camera or if you use the mouse you click and hold the right mouse button and move it.


It does...? I looked in the config menu, the only things I could find were "invert axis" unless you mean out-of-game config.

Quote:
2) yea no arrows or scroll bars although i'm not sure if using the mouse to move it works as well, I use IJKL but you can try the mouse as well. (right click mouse and move).


Using the mouse does NOT work. Left clicking + dragging does nothing, Right clicking + dragging moves the camera as if the map wasn't being displayed at all.
#4 Sep 06 2010 at 8:01 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah, just looked and I don't see any settings in the out-of-game config that sets the camera view. Not sure about the ingame, but if it was there, I didn't see it before. Of course now I'm waiting for the update so I'm not in there . . .

In any event, I really do like the game. This is beta though, so hopefully when the game comes out they will have some issues resolved enough that we don't have to have flipping maintenance every day. I know they're just trying to get all the kinks out at the moment, but geez, at least let us play two days in a row! =P
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#5 Sep 06 2010 at 8:27 AM Rating: Good
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Update: For some odd reason, even the slightest mis-click with the right mouse button causes the camera to become locked in place. Hitting "L" unlocks the camera (semi). Your character still turns faster than the camera, but at least it is possible to maneuver around in 3rd person.

That's kind of annoying though, if you click the right mouse button for anything and just barely bump the mouse, it locks your camera... I might have to disable right mouse to move camera if I can, if it keeps doing this.

What Baffles me is why the "Follow Camera" (the camera that follows behind your character, instead of remaining where it is), will only accept 3-4 positions and angles. Tilting the camera to your own liking in any way, locks the camera and it now refuses to move. I wish I could just tilt the camera down just slightly and then leave it there and have it follow behind my character, but nope. Can't have that, I guess.

Edited, Sep 6th 2010 10:29am by Lyrailis

Edited, Sep 6th 2010 10:30am by Lyrailis
#6 Sep 06 2010 at 8:50 AM Rating: Decent
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Being a previous WoW player, I definitely found it extremely difficult to play without the camera following me properly.

My solution?

I remapped the camera keys to my movement keys. So, now A is turning the camera to the left and D is turning the camera to the right. :P

That definitely freed my hand up for the mouse.
#7 Sep 06 2010 at 9:15 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
This is beta though, so hopefully when the game comes out they will have some issues resolved enough that we don't have to have flipping maintenance every day. I know they're just trying to get all the kinks out at the moment, but geez, at least let us play two days in a row! =P


Trust me, this is a good thing. The more maintenance they do now, the less after release. I'm actually glad there's a patch everyday, it makes me confident that SE is actually working hard to perfect this game.


Edited, Sep 6th 2010 11:16am by BRizzl3
#8 Sep 06 2010 at 9:21 AM Rating: Good
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MaxwellDemon wrote:
Being a previous WoW player, I definitely found it extremely difficult to play without the camera following me properly.

My solution?

I remapped the camera keys to my movement keys. So, now A is turning the camera to the left and D is turning the camera to the right. :P

That definitely freed my hand up for the mouse.


Does the game allow you to keybind 2 things to the same key? I thought of this idea too, but...

I wanted to make Num4 both Turn Left AND Turn Camera Left, but... when I went into the controls section, I couldn't figure out how to get the game to actually allow me to change the keybinds.
#9 Sep 06 2010 at 9:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Well, the sad thing about it is that the game won't allow you to map two things into one key. I had to remap the default turn left and turn right to something else then map the camera keys into it.

If you try to map something that is already occupied with another action, nothing will simply happen. It is slightly silly, because that makes it difficult to tell whether if the keymapping function is working or not... but that's how it goes. :P

Anyhow, I just came back from a run using those configurations and I definitely don't mind having my turn keys mapped into something else (never use it anymore). Along with the hardware mouse patch, I am definitely a lot more happier with the controls of FFXIV now. XD
#10 Sep 06 2010 at 9:37 AM Rating: Good
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3,128 posts
MaxwellDemon wrote:
Well, the sad thing about it is that the game won't allow you to map two things into one key. I had to remap the default turn left and turn right to something else then map the camera keys into it.

If you try to map something that is already occupied with another action, nothing will simply happen. It is slightly silly, because that makes it difficult to tell whether if the keymapping function is working or not... but that's how it goes. :P

Anyhow, I just came back from a run using those configurations and I definitely don't mind having my turn keys mapped into something else (never use it anymore). Along with the hardware mouse patch, I am definitely a lot more happier with the controls of FFXIV now. XD


We will probably wind up having to use a hardware keyboard emulator or something (see the thread about remapping arrow keys) just to do something so basic, it should already be in the game already.

Here's hoping that enough people ask for a locked-behind-your-character camera mode, though I doubt it. FFXI didn't have this very simple functionality either.

What gets me, is I haven't seen a single MMORPG yet that does this. The standard is "keep the camera locked behind your character at default" and "If you turn, camera turns too". It is SO much easier, and everyone who has used other RPGs is used to it... I could understand them not including it in FFXI -- it was first launched on PS2 before anything else.

But FFXIV is going PC-first, and has come after many other MMORPGs have already been on the market. Surely they would have recognized that some players could be confused and feel uncomfortable trying to get used to "Move in 1st person only, combat in 3rd person only" style that FFXI (and now FFXIV apparently) uses.

All I want is an Option -- I don't want to force other players to play it that way if they don't want to. Call it "Lock camera behind character yes/no" and be done with it.
#11 Sep 06 2010 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
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I definitely agree. You can say that being a long-term WoW player, I got spoiled by the simplicity, but extremely user-friendly UI. FFXIV doesn't have to be WoW, nor am I asking for it to be, but with something as simple and basic as UI, this is something they should have been polishing until it is as smooth as butter.

I would say more, but I would start sounding like if I am advertising WoW since I really enjoyed the UI for it (a camera that followed you and turned upward or downward whenever you are on a slope? That's neat!). The point is, I enjoy FFXIV a lot, I am just sad that something small like that would ruin what a potential game SE currently have.

... I am one of the fews that don't mind finding ways to go around SE's sloppiness however... XD
#12 Sep 06 2010 at 9:55 AM Rating: Decent
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If the camera lock bothers you that much use a controller. The camera moves much better with a controller, and you can set it up so you can adjust the camera with one of the control sticks. You can get a simple logitech dual action for pretty cheap:

Classic Logitech Dual Action
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826127204&cm_re=logitech_dual_action-_-26-127-204-_-Product

Fancy Cordless Rumble Flashy Dual Action
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826127209&cm_re=logitech_dual_action-_-26-127-209-_-Product

The one I have(couldn't find new, don't know if you can trust these sellers)
http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-12-Button-Gamepad-Programmable-Buttons/dp/B003POCEWU/ref=sr_1_cc_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1283788453&sr=1-1-catcorr
#13 Sep 06 2010 at 10:02 AM Rating: Good
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3,128 posts
BRizzl3 wrote:
If the camera lock bothers you that much use a controller. The camera moves much better with a controller, and you can set it up so you can adjust the camera with one of the control sticks. You can get a simple logitech dual action for pretty cheap:


PC controllers suck.

They are almost always very poorly made, and/or have very poor response (I've tried many on them before giving up on them). There's just... some reason why PC controllers are made far worse than console controllers, except for the USB->PS2 adapter, and that's only because you're using an actual, real console controller.

I could maybe use USB->PS2 adapters like I have in the past, but I do not enjoy having to set the controller down to type. Yes, yes, you have to move your hand from the mouse, but you don't have to set the mouse down on the desk -- it is already there. Using a controller in an MMORPG is exceedingly awkward, I tried it back in my FFXI days. I found it to be very awkward, and found myself trying to find workarounds to use an ergo KB while playing the game on my x360.

"Use a Controller" should not be the only option we have. Not everyone has, or even wants to, use a controller just to play a game. No other PC game out there requires a controller, this game shouldn't either. Especially when every other MMORPG released on the PC platform has quite nice and easy KB/Mouse control.

Edited, Sep 6th 2010 12:03pm by Lyrailis
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