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hardware: my bottleneck?Follow

#1 Sep 09 2010 at 8:31 AM Rating: Default
i can change the res to 1080p (currently in 720p) and the only difference would be that I lose 15 fps from anyplace i would normally get 60fps. Other than that, same crap.

Changing settings in ffxiv doesn't do much (other than occlusion and depth of field). I've tried a ton of different settings, and this is what ive learned:
You can change your fps when in wide open areas, such as outdoors zones. You can get 60fps out here with a 250gts or 8800gtx.
You CANNOT change your fps when in crowds/cities. If you get 20-30fps, you cannot get much higher than that by tweaking settings. youre stuck with that.
When running around in slightly populated areas, like starting zones where people are fighting, or in gridania's forest, you can make the game smoother by removing "distant drawing" (long distance foliage rendering), but that's really it.

Texture quality makes no difference to my performance. Texture filtering makes no difference. Antialiasing doesn't even make much of a difference. You MIGHT lose 5fps by going max 16x, but I didn't notice.

I've changed the window and internal res to tiny resolutions, and I get the same 20-30 fps in crowds and cities.

This may be due to whatever my bottleneck is.

I've got a gts250, 4gb ram, and a q9550 quad.

What do you guys think my bottleneck is?

I'm thinking my cpu because it has trouble with crowds, where perhaps a lot is going on computing-wise. I doubt its my gpu, because changing resolutions and all sorts of stuff makes no difference where it matters - crowds.
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#2 Sep 09 2010 at 9:19 AM Rating: Default
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the GTS 250 is your bottleneck.. Also please tell us the video ram capacity of your video card.. because video ram greatly effects resolution... But then again the GTS 250 sucks.. It was a good deal in 2009..

but in 2010.. you should already have a GTX 260 equivalent or better to run a monster that is Final Fantasy XIV.. with the gts 250 you perhaps can run on medium to low settings on 720p.. with very nice frame rates..
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#3 Sep 09 2010 at 9:26 AM Rating: Default
It'd be nice if you read my post.

I can run any resolution, no change in fps.
I can use high textures and such, no change in fps.

Thank for the try though? Really don't know why someone would reply without reading, and simply looking at my specs. ;\
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#4 Sep 09 2010 at 9:32 AM Rating: Good
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Generally speaking if you can increase resolution and not decrease in performance then it's the CPU side. Like doing the benchmark on my secondary computer, I get a 1522 on low and 1457 on high (video card way outclasses the little dual-core CPU). From the sound of it, you do get a decent drop in performance (framerate) with the video card, so that's part of the equation. At least on PassMark, the Q9550 spanks the X4 630 in my main computer, and I have no issues with crowds (but I'm not doing framerate checks), so I wouldn't think it'd have anything to do with the CPU. I'm running a 1GB 460 in that computer, for comparison. It could just be that the 250 is choking on the sheer number of triangles it's asked to push in crowded areas.

I'll have to see what my setup gets for framerates at some point, as well as how the secondary PC is doing in similar situations and see what the difference in CPU looks like.
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#5 Sep 09 2010 at 9:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Glad you asked!

Your bottleneck is the Common Code Monkey, Pan Cplusplus. These apelike creatures live in caves, basements, and development houses that crank out poorly-written code. There is no cure for the problem, save rewriting the engine.
#6 Sep 09 2010 at 9:36 AM Rating: Good
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If you are getting 20-30 FPS, that is actually pretty good for now. I would just wait until the release or well after the release to determine if you have a real bottleneck or if something needs to be upgraded. My specs are as follows and I average around 30 FPS. Latency seems to be what I have observed that affects my performance the most. If there are lots of people around it takes them a while to appear, just like FFXI did.


Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate Edition 64bit (build 7600)
Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9300 @ 2.50GHz (4 cores)
4 gigs ddr2
DirectX Version DirectX 11
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260
1920 x 1080

Most things turned off except textures...gotta have high textures :)

I average about 30 FPS.
#7 Sep 09 2010 at 9:37 AM Rating: Default
Eugenitor wrote:
Glad you asked!

Your bottleneck is the Common Code Monkey, Pan Cplusplus. These apelike creatures live in caves, basements, and development houses that crank out poorly-written code. There is no cure for the problem, save rewriting the engine.

Love <3 this.

And Triane, I'd be really annoyed if the only bottleneck is the simple ability for my gpu to render triangles. It seems to run resolutions and textures and other stuff fine, but my limit is literally a basic 3d-rendering one?
Wouldnt this also make higher resolutions run slower? It's confusing because it seems too simple. If my gpu cant ru na ton of triangles, why can it run high resolutions fine? Strange

Evil monkeys indeed

@ parsalyn,
Yes it's pretty good, I've just been trying to make it run smoother (i get 40-45 in the gridania woods which isn't ideal) but I can't seem to increase my fps, even when lowering everything possible to crap levels

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 11:39am by DirectorCobbs
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#8 Sep 09 2010 at 9:51 AM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:
And Triane, I'd be really annoyed if the only bottleneck is the simple ability for my gpu to render triangles. It seems to run resolutions and textures and other stuff fine, but my limit is literally a basic 3d-rendering one?
Wouldnt this also make higher resolutions run slower? It's confusing because it seems too simple. If my gpu cant ru na ton of triangles, why can it run high resolutions fine? Strange

Yeah, I'd be annoyed too. And that's why I made the point that I haven't checked actual framerates, so I have no real clue how my frames are, just that I don't feel a problem. And maybe you don't either, I don't know. ^^ Comparing the "feel" of the two computers I've got, the CPU makes itself known on the secondary PC even at very low settings at 1280x800 (it's a 16:10 monitor) with some lag while the main PC runs perfectly at 1152x720 on very high settings. Your CPU is supposed to beat the X4 630 in my main PC by quite a bit (at least at PassMark, it gets something like 4300 and mine is like 3200), so I wouldn't think the CPU would be a problem, so that left the 250 which is a decent step down from the 460 I'm running. Triangles per second was pulled from my tail as a potential issue, but it's just an off-the-cuff guess, certainly not a guarantee. :\

(Unfortunately I'm not at home at the moment so I can't check out Fraps and get back to you on my particular setups and what framerates they get. I'm hoping someone else has a Q9xxx and can chime in with their own experience to add relevant data points to your issue.)


EDIT - BB code fail -.-

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 8:02pm by Triane
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#9 Sep 09 2010 at 9:52 AM Rating: Good
DirectorCobbs wrote:
It'd be nice if you read my post.

I can run any resolution, no change in fps.
I can use high textures and such, no change in fps.

Thank for the try though? Really don't know why someone would reply without reading, and simply looking at my specs. ;\


Probably because you asked what piece of your machine was holding you back. Or maybe because you placed bold tags around your machine specs? He suggested that your GPU was your bottleneck (which answers your question), then provided an inquiry into your system's VRAM and told you why he was asking. It was extra to his answer of the question you asked (note the "Also").
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#10 Sep 09 2010 at 11:15 AM Rating: Default
PLDXavier, Defender of Justice wrote:
DirectorCobbs wrote:
It'd be nice if you read my post.

I can run any resolution, no change in fps.
I can use high textures and such, no change in fps.

Thank for the try though? Really don't know why someone would reply without reading, and simply looking at my specs. ;\


Probably because you asked what piece of your machine was holding you back. Or maybe because you placed bold tags around your machine specs? He suggested that your GPU was your bottleneck (which answers your question), then provided an inquiry into your system's VRAM and told you why he was asking. It was extra to his answer of the question you asked (note the "Also").


I told him i can run the game at high settings with no performance difference from low settings.

He tells me " with the gts 250 you perhaps can run on medium to low settings on 720p.. with very nice frame rates.."
Meaning he didnt read what I told him, since i just told him i can run high settings at 1080p. ;\
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#11 Sep 10 2010 at 8:35 AM Rating: Good
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As promised, I ran a quick check in Fraps on my two computers (quick because the maintenance was during my available playtime so it was just before heading out to work >.<). My char was standing in front of the Limsa repair NPC which seemed like as good a spot as any since it's usually busy. On the main PC with the X4 630, I was getting right around 25fps at 1152x720 with high settings (no AO/DoF, but all the dropdowns pretty well maxed out, except buffer which was just "resolution"). On the secondary PC with the X2 3800+ (lolz), I got 13-15fps on 1280x800 with rock-bottom settings (absolutely everything turned off or on its lowest setting, except for buffer which was still "resolution"). Changing settings on the secondary PC definitely seemed to make a difference when I did that the other day, since at default settings running around was rather laggy/choppy.

Running around on the main PC gave me drops to around 20 or so, which still seemed perfectly fine for playability. Simply turning the camera on the secondary PC dropped to 9 or so.

Not sure how much this data ends up helping (be nice if someone with a similar CPU could chime in with their results so it's a better comparison), but I did promise to get the numbers, so there they are. ^^ I suppose a secondary test would be to change the resolution (especially on my main PC since it's more competent and closer to your setup) and see if I still get 25fps or if it drops from a higher resolution. If it stays 25fps then it's entirely possible that your CPU is holding you back from higher framerates in town, but you may have to go to the very top (overclocked i7 980X, maybe? XD) to improve to where you probably want it.
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#12 Sep 10 2010 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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I can also confirm that the only thing I can change that will up my FPS, is when in game, you turn off extended drawing. I even tried fishing around with nvidia settings and did not see any change from that.
#13 Sep 10 2010 at 8:45 AM Rating: Default
Same here, that's the only noticeable effect, giving me 5-6 fps outdoors and making camera turning a bit smoother. But that's it. The big problem is the pauses and stuttering. Totally unstable engine.
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