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#1 Sep 09 2010 at 3:13 PM Rating: Default
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I've been playing this on and off for a few days but I really don't really enjoy the way it's done to be honest.

As far as I could tell, there's a quest to introduce you to the generic gameplay features and then you're forced to basically level up your crafting skills? As for generic levequests there's not much to do, or is it because I'm still only level 8 rank 7 on my char that there's not much to do?
#2 Sep 09 2010 at 3:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Taeni wrote:
I've been playing this on and off for a few days but I really don't really enjoy the way it's done to be honest.

As far as I could tell, there's a quest to introduce you to the generic gameplay features and then you're forced to basically level up your crafting skills? As for generic levequests there's not much to do, or is it because I'm still only level 8 rank 7 on my char that there's not much to do?


Could it be because it's a beta with much of the actual game stripped out that there's not much to do? I don't even understand your first question. You're not forced to level up any crafting skills that I'm aware of.
#3 Sep 09 2010 at 3:19 PM Rating: Good
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Being beta everything is very very limited.

Other than the beginning quest and a few leve/guild quests there are no other quests.
Guildquests starts at a higher level.

Right now it's all of us is fighting over the few mobs in the starting zones

I'm having very mixed feelings about this game, mostly cause of its lack of information between the game and the player. I do like to figure things out for my own but I do think that there should be a little more user friendly informative UI.

Will buy the game and give it a try though
#4 Sep 09 2010 at 3:28 PM Rating: Good
Beta has nothing to do with the limitations. Unless I'm mistaken and SE has come out and said that the 8 regional and 8 local levequests/48 hours is a beta-only restriction, I'd have to say the OP has an extremely valid point. Grinding is not content anymore. It was back in the UO/EQ/FFXI days. It's not anymore. If all your game has is a handful of quests every couple of days and a ******** of grinding in between, guess what? By modern standards, you've got a game with jack for content. And take it a step further with a cryptic penalty system in place so that even grinding becomes a fruitless endeavor after a certain period of time and you've got a developer who doesn't really know wtf they're doing trying to control things that they should just retune or leave the **** alone.

If SE is concerned about people earning too much gil/bonus xp from guildleves, you know what they can do? REDUCE THE GIL BONUS AND LOWER THE XP!! Ha HA!! And then they can get rid of these crap restrictions and everyone has lots to do and life is awesome.

And if SE feels that people who play outside the confines of a casual schedule are able to progress too fast relative to the casuals, you know what they can do? Give the casuals a bonus instead of penalizing the people who have more time! Ha HA!! But no, SE doesn't get it. Why they don't get it, I don't know.
#5 Sep 09 2010 at 3:33 PM Rating: Decent
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OP may have a valid point but is it for lack of other complaint threads that you decided to start a new one? lets keep them all in one place please.
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#6 Sep 09 2010 at 3:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
And if SE feels that people who play outside the confines of a casual schedule are able to progress too fast relative to the casuals, you know what they can do? Give the casuals a bonus instead of penalizing the people who have more time! Ha HA!! But no, SE doesn't get it. Why they don't get it, I don't know.


Points for hitting it right on the head. I'm currently also in the dilemma of talking with my xi buddies and although all 5 of us have preordered XIV, we are all supremely disappointed @ how SE has handled the evolution of FF mmo and how the discipline of war thus far is a stupendous step backward from xi. The gathering professions are a new interesting concept with the minigame, the pass/fail crafting is almost a carbon copy of the Aion system only with more nuisances so it's not really all that "new."
#7 Sep 09 2010 at 3:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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#8 Sep 09 2010 at 3:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Is it bad game design that we are 1 week into open beta and its already a "Beating a dead horse" topic that people are bored? That happened in record time. Wonder if it means SE needs to add content and by content i mean things people consider content in 2010 not 2002.
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#9 Sep 09 2010 at 4:20 PM Rating: Decent
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I look forward to the day when the whiners are gone so the rest of us can enjoy the game in peace.
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#10 Sep 09 2010 at 4:23 PM Rating: Excellent
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.
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#11 Sep 09 2010 at 4:30 PM Rating: Decent
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TauuOfSiren wrote:
I look forward to the day when the whiners are gone so the rest of us can enjoy the game in peace.


I wonder if SE will raise the monthly prices with just the 6 of you playing the game.
#12 Sep 09 2010 at 4:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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I look forward to the day when people can offer constrictive criticism without every fanperson gets his or her gonads in a Santorum-foamed knot because not everyone wears their rose-colored glasses and prefers Pinot Grigio to the Kool-aid.

Worry not though. I cancelled my pre-order. You won't have to deal with me in the game. I reward game companies who actually give a sh*t about my experience my hard-earned money. And this time around, for me, that clearly is NOT SE.

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 6:31pm by hexaemeron
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#13 Sep 09 2010 at 4:31 PM Rating: Good
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.


Ya, except you have to pay to experience the "finished" product, and there are a lot of people who aren't willing to pay for what they've seen, so SE needs to **** or get off the pot. They either release something closer to the finished version or this open beta fiasco is going to hurt them.
#14 Sep 09 2010 at 4:51 PM Rating: Good
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I'm no "fanboy" and I have some beefs too but... I also think that people forget just how bad FFXI was in beta and at initial release. My friend and I spoke about this the other day (he beta'd FFXI) and even with all of FFXIV's warts, the fact that it's NOT FFXI, and the fact that we're only seeing a fraction of the whole game - he said FFXI was a MUCH bigger disaster initially than FFXIV. And I know him and trust his opinion (you may not tho lol). I think people are doing what people are wont to do - revising history a little bit by forgetting the bad and only remembering the good. How can anyone compare a game that had years to be fleshed out and years to be adopted and loved to a game that is in beta and has not yet been given it's fair shake?

I think that there are still some issues to be ironed out for sure and that it will likely take some getting used to the new game mechanics but I also think that within 6 months to a year many of the gripes will be history as well... waiting for the NEXT FF release to be in beta so that that new title can be seen as the end of all things warm, fuzzy and good! :D
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#15 Sep 09 2010 at 4:56 PM Rating: Good
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mcbizzle wrote:
I'm no "fanboy" and I have some beefs too but... I also think that people forget just how bad FFXI was in beta and at initial release. My friend and I spoke about this the other day (he beta'd FFXI) and even with all of FFXIV's warts, the fact that it's NOT FFXI, and the fact that we're only seeing a fraction of the whole game - he said FFXI was a MUCH bigger disaster initially than FFXIV. And I know him and trust his opinion (you may not tho lol). I think people are doing what people are wont to do - revising history a little bit by forgetting the bad and only remembering the good. How can anyone compare a game that had years to be fleshed out and years to be adopted and loved to a game that is in beta and has not yet been given it's fair shake?

I think that there are still some issues to be ironed out for sure and that it will likely take some getting used to the new game mechanics but I also think that within 6 months to a year many of the gripes will be history as well... waiting for the NEXT FF release to be in beta so that that new title can be seen as the end of all things warm, fuzzy and good! :D


I think what bothers people here is that SE should have learned from the mistakes that made FFXI such a disaster for so long. For example, I've never played XI, as I couldn't struggle past the interface, but from what I've heard, they failed to include features in FFXIV that they eventually did, due to user concerns, in XI. The one that stands out mostly in my mind is the ability to sort your inventory. How could they overlook what was one of the major annoyances of its predecessor for so long?
#16 Sep 09 2010 at 4:56 PM Rating: Good
The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.


Ya, except you have to pay to experience the "finished" product, and there are a lot of people who aren't willing to pay for what they've seen, so SE needs to sh*t or get off the pot. They either release something closer to the finished version or this open beta fiasco is going to hurt them.



If you choose to not buy a 2011 Mustang GT500KR based on seeing only the solid rear axle and not the rest of the car, Ford can't really be blamed for it.

Beta is not the full game. I keep saying it because people need to realize that they shouldn't be judging based on it. It's part of the game for testing purposes, not for 'look at this and judge whether you want the game or not only judging by these parts' purposes.
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#17 Sep 09 2010 at 5:03 PM Rating: Good
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.


Ya, except you have to pay to experience the "finished" product, and there are a lot of people who aren't willing to pay for what they've seen, so SE needs to sh*t or get off the pot. They either release something closer to the finished version or this open beta fiasco is going to hurt them.



If you choose to not buy a 2011 Mustang GT500KR based on seeing only the solid rear axle and not the rest of the car, Ford can't really be blamed for it.

Beta is not the full game. I keep saying it because people need to realize that they shouldn't be judging based on it. It's part of the game for testing purposes, not for 'look at this and judge whether you want the game or not only judging by these parts' purposes.


If I test drive that Mustang and the brakes take 5 seconds to engage after stepping on the pedal... can that be Ford's fault? Is that a reason not to buy the whole car?

Can it be a reason to say "fix this and I'll buy it?"

EDIT: Complete thought ftw

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 6:07pm by Callinon
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#18 Sep 09 2010 at 5:06 PM Rating: Decent
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You have to understand what is SEs intent with this game. Their intent is to make a solid game based on their values, beliefs and ideas of enjoyment. Not yours, mine or ours. FFXI was not a hugely popular game. It did not cater to the masses. It was a very slow game when compared to whats out there. Leveling was slow, crafting was slow, main storyline quessts were few and far between. It was about taking your time to enjoy creativity and immersion.

This game has a lot of content, its just not accessible quickly. One character can be ALL classes, theres weeks of game time there. The world is expansive and quite large, you cant explore it all in a week. Crafting takes quite a bit of time. Yes there are times where some things seem too slow (Zombie Bazaars anyone?)

One thing to consider as well is that there isnt even everything in beta available that will be in the game. For example, there are no faction quests currently, but there will be. There are no main story quests, but there will be. There are no airships/chocobos/bosses/named mobs but there will be. We can see that SE has them in place (airship locations, chocobo renters, dungeons with regular mobs in them) so there will be more content come release + a few months.

My point is this game is slowed down. Its about taking your time to experience a world SE put a lot of time into. There is stuff to do, but SEs is just not going to let you do it 10+ hours each day. Its what they want. This game is catered to casuals in its current form and to each their own. If its not your cup of tea there are plenty of other faster paced games out there (WAR isnt too bad if youre not a WoW fanboy). No, this game is not perfect and I dont know if it will hold my attention come a month after release. But I will buy it because the FF lore is great. I didnt play XI that long because it was too slow and I am afraid the same thing will happen here. But, as I pointed out, they are not catering to fast-paced "hardcore" gamers.
#19 Sep 09 2010 at 5:07 PM Rating: Good
Archmage Callinon wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.


Ya, except you have to pay to experience the "finished" product, and there are a lot of people who aren't willing to pay for what they've seen, so SE needs to sh*t or get off the pot. They either release something closer to the finished version or this open beta fiasco is going to hurt them.



If you choose to not buy a 2011 Mustang GT500KR based on seeing only the solid rear axle and not the rest of the car, Ford can't really be blamed for it.

Beta is not the full game. I keep saying it because people need to realize that they shouldn't be judging based on it. It's part of the game for testing purposes, not for 'look at this and judge whether you want the game or not only judging by these parts' purposes.


If I test drive that Mustang and the brakes take 5 seconds to engage after stepping on the pedal... can that be Ford's fault? Is that a reason not to buy the whole car?



Yes, but that's testing the final product that you are going to or not going to buy. ;) Did that actually happen?


EDIT: Oh heh, I didn't get the analogy until the person down V posted. I agree the menu lag is pretty terrible. If it's like that in the finished product, they're going to have some serious retention trouble.

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 4:10pm by digitalcraft
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#20 Sep 09 2010 at 5:08 PM Rating: Good
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LOL! Brilliant retort :D The menu lag in this game does suck gaint donkey sack.
#21 Sep 09 2010 at 5:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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RonnieDoitch wrote:
Its about taking your time to experience a world SE put a lot of time into.


One only needs to look at the insane amount of 'recycled' landscape to disregard this. I think I ran up/down the same mountain like 5 times just on the run from the ferry to Ul'Dah.
#22 Sep 09 2010 at 5:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:

Yes, but that's testing the final product that you are going to or not going to buy. ;) Did that actually happen?


Fortunately no, little Timmy didn't have to die.

Unfortunately, this is as close to a demo as we'll ever get with this game until they start giving those away (which no MMO company does at launch for very good reasons).

Honestly, the only issue presently preventing me from picking this up at launch is the UI lag. I don't need endgame content to be complete at launch, I don't need balance to be perfect, I don't need 50+ hours of storyline missions out of the box (it'd be very nice of course, but it's not realistic). I just want a game that I can play without wanting to kill myself.
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#23 Sep 09 2010 at 5:14 PM Rating: Good
I have heard people say that the issue is that during the beta, all menu functions are performed serverside and that come release it will not be that way, which would help that problem immensely.

I haven't actually heard confirmation of this though, but I'd think they're smart enough to realize this sort of menu lag is not ok.

I could see them doing this to see what kinds of things people are clicking on, where they're clicking etc to see what might be sources of confusion. Maybe that's giving them too much credit, I don't know.
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#24 Sep 09 2010 at 5:14 PM Rating: Good
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Standard answer: Still a beta, judge when we see the finished product. Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much. They want people around to test server capacity and game mechanics, not so people see everything and finish it all before its released.


Ya, except you have to pay to experience the "finished" product, and there are a lot of people who aren't willing to pay for what they've seen, so SE needs to sh*t or get off the pot. They either release something closer to the finished version or this open beta fiasco is going to hurt them.



If you choose to not buy a 2011 Mustang GT500KR based on seeing only the solid rear axle and not the rest of the car, Ford can't really be blamed for it.

Beta is not the full game. I keep saying it because people need to realize that they shouldn't be judging based on it. It's part of the game for testing purposes, not for 'look at this and judge whether you want the game or not only judging by these parts' purposes.


I know this is way off topic but I love the new Mustangs. :)

On topic, I don't know if it is naiveté, or impartiality but I'm going to wait to hold judgement on content related stuff. I'm going to assume that there will be more and that things will be tailored to hold my interest.

The beta isn't holding my interest because of its limitations. There is no awesome gear to attain, there is no story to progress, there is no grouping because of the ease of soloing (early levels, no incentives, etc.). But I'm assuming that all of that stuff will be taken care of.

The mechanical problems are the ones that worry me. Though, after I bought a controller, a lot of those problems fixed themselves.

It all boils down to your tolerance for the game. I've contended that I'll wait for it to come out to make a solid judgement.


#25 Sep 09 2010 at 5:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah it's pretty generic. I'm having more fun looking at stuff than actually doing things. Funny because even though FFXI was slow and weak in the combat area, I found myself having quite a bit of fun soloing out in Gustaberg on my first character. I had fun doing basic stuff in Aion and WoW too, so I'm not sure what it is. It just feels flat and lacks soul. The sights and sounds are pretty cool though and I'm sure the combat will pick up later. I'm still up in the air on the game, but I'll buy it and play for a few months before I make any decisions. The only other games I'm considering playing are Cataclysm and SWTOR (maybe Tera, but it's Korean and that usually ends up bad). Cataclysm isn't out yet, so that gives me a chance to really play FFXIV see what it's about. SWTOR doesn't come out for another year.

We'll see..
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#26 Sep 09 2010 at 5:22 PM Rating: Good
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The OP has a good point and it is my main concern about the game at the moment.

Quote:
This game is catered to casuals in its current form and to each their own.


This I hardly doubt. With the current content in this game I do not think it is catered for the casual who spend 2 hours a day playing, it is more catered for the hard core gamer who can spend a lot of time. Let's face it, doing 8 leve's per 48 hours which gives you a merely bit of XP advantage. The most XP gain comes from grinding for hours, which ain't casual friendly.

And if you find grinding a lot of fun, then FFXIV in this form (OB) is an amazing game :)
#27 Sep 09 2010 at 5:22 PM Rating: Decent
The reason I decided to use that is because the new cars are awesome :) The engines are very impressive. They've shaved a ton(not literally a ton) of weight with new manufacturing techniques and been able to increase the HP at the same time.

The new GT500KR actually has similar performance as a new M3, and it's not because the new M3 has declined in capability either. This is impressive considering the Mustang costs around half the M3.

The thing is, even though the new top of the line Mustangs have had tons of improvements to turn them from just muscle car to a track beast, they've stuck with the solid rear axle for some reason. Solid rear axle is fine for a straight line, like a drag strip, which is what muscle cars have always been good at (bad at turning) and the Mustangs sort of let handling slide a little in favor of cool factor and horsepower on the cheap, but it makes it feel like too much compromise when they do try for overall performance. People say that its because it wouldn't be worth the research time, and to their credit, they've really done some amazing things with it, but I still can't help feel it's holding them back a little. Ford is a big company too, why can't they use the suspension from something else? Maybe a Fusion, or a Mazdaspeed6, or something.
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#28 Sep 09 2010 at 5:24 PM Rating: Good
GuardianFaith wrote:
Yeah it's pretty generic. I'm having more fun looking at stuff than actually doing things. Funny because even though FFXI was slow and weak in the combat area, I found myself having quite a bit of fun soloing out in Gustaberg on my first character. I had fun doing basic stuff in Aion and WoW too, so I'm not sure what it is. It just feels flat and lacks soul. The sights and sounds are pretty cool though and I'm sure the combat will pick up later. I'm still up in the air on the game, but I'll buy it and play for a few months before I make any decisions. The only other games I'm considering playing are Cataclysm and SWTOR (maybe Tera, but it's Korean and that usually ends up bad). Cataclysm isn't out yet, so that gives me a chance to really play FFXIV see what it's about. SWTOR doesn't come out for another year.

We'll see..



That's kind of where I am now. I'm going to try it. If its not improved, I might go to SWTOR. I don't think I'll go back to WoW for Cataclysm. Its sort of funny, even though I'm already kinda bored by the XIV beta, it's absolutely killed WoW for me. If XIV crashes and burns, maybe I'll do no MMO at all. Woe! Weird!
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#29 Sep 09 2010 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
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I am in agreement with others, it's too early to criticize....just yet.

I do agree with the OP at first it was a little slow and there are moments where it doesn't seem to "hold your hand" through the process ... but that's fine with me because as a NPC said somewhere along the line, "we have to make our own meaning" and frankly it comes up when you need to repair your weapon.

Time to learn a trade.

This part is from the player, he has to put 2+2 together and go out there and make it happen. No there isn't a tutorial quest or a big flashing NPC who has scripted audio dialogue where he tells you what to do. You have to explore it out yourself and I bet a lot of this game will be similar.

SE mentioned several times it's about exploration and community websites to collect and distribute information. This means that many people will feel the same as you do in the beginning and I swear it's a way for SE to frustrate and intimidate younger players who don't have the patience nor understanding to get through it. They seem totally fine turning those hyper players away.

As I play through open beta more and more I realize it's not a immediate satisfaction game. It's a longer "process" that is more involved and lengthy and does take time to get into. I think whatever changes there will be between here and release will not change this aspect of the game. Atleast in the beginning starter areas.

I wanted to complain at first until I saw all the people running around trying to do things. Then you look at the table where all your jobs are at 0 level and you get the idea it's up to you to make those numbers rise.
#30 Sep 09 2010 at 5:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
GuardianFaith wrote:
Yeah it's pretty generic. I'm having more fun looking at stuff than actually doing things. Funny because even though FFXI was slow and weak in the combat area, I found myself having quite a bit of fun soloing out in Gustaberg on my first character. I had fun doing basic stuff in Aion and WoW too, so I'm not sure what it is. It just feels flat and lacks soul. The sights and sounds are pretty cool though and I'm sure the combat will pick up later. I'm still up in the air on the game, but I'll buy it and play for a few months before I make any decisions. The only other games I'm considering playing are Cataclysm and SWTOR (maybe Tera, but it's Korean and that usually ends up bad). Cataclysm isn't out yet, so that gives me a chance to really play FFXIV see what it's about. SWTOR doesn't come out for another year.

We'll see..



That's kind of where I am now. I'm going to try it. If its not improved, I might go to SWTOR. I don't think I'll go back to WoW for Cataclysm. Its sort of funny, even though I'm already kinda bored by the XIV beta, it's absolutely killed WoW for me. If XIV crashes and burns, maybe I'll do no MMO at all. Woe! Weird!


Yeah I was just thinking that the other day while driving. "Maybe I won't play MMOs at all anymore.." lol.

I really doubt it though, I'm addicted. Even if it's only a few hours/week. I don't use Facebook or anything, I just log on to whatever MMO I'm playing, stand around and BS for 30 min and log out.
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#31 Sep 09 2010 at 5:31 PM Rating: Good
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I can remember hearing somewhere that leves can take 5 or 6 hours to complete, maybe even more

"You can take leves depending on how long you're wanting to play in the game" Or something along those lines.

So even if it is limited to 8 every 48 hours, you can do a single leve that would be your full day's gameplay.

I'm 90% sure I heard this anyhow.. I could be wrong though.

But even so.. it is still a beta, and even tith the limitations they have put on i'm LOVING IT!
#32 Sep 09 2010 at 5:31 PM Rating: Decent
Smokefox wrote:


As I play through open beta more and more I realize it's not a immediate satisfaction game. It's a longer "process" that is more involved and lengthy and does take time to get into. I think whatever changes there will be between here and release will not change this aspect of the game. Atleast in the beginning starter areas.



I just made you scholar. Use your power well.

:)
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#33 Sep 09 2010 at 6:32 PM Rating: Good
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Wow, didn't expect so many replies.


I appreciate the input from everyone, it's really nice to hear from the other players, I've progressed a little bit, but my opinion hasn't changed too much.

As someone put it quite well, there's no hand-holding. And usually I'm all for it, I hate hand-holding and the tedious tutorials in most scenarios, but this game is really just touch and go, regardless of what you're doing.

There's no indication of where you should go, how to upgrade your gear, it's more of a "hmm.... maybe I should ____" situation.

As for generally leveling up, I'm still not that high level, only level 9 rank 8 currently as a Pugilist,I started in Ul'dah, but my opinion thus far is the same.

I've been killing the same maybe 2-3 mobs because anything else is way too difficult, and if you even try to "explore" and head to other regions, i.e. the dark shroud area, you'll just get 1 shot because the mobs are that much more difficult in those areas.

The mob difficulty "gauge" is a little bit primitive, it'd be nice to maybe see mob levels imo. As for fighting higher level mobs, it's basic to assume that you need better gear, as having level alone shouldn't affect your performance against mobs that much.

Which then brings up the question of the crafting system, you need decent enough ranks in order to craft "okay" gear, not to mention procuring the actual substances required? I can't even get most things passed rank 1 because I started in the wrong region and have no wind shards.

As for the Synthesis overall, it's completely touch and go like most other things. drag and drop mats and hope that a recipe pops up, it's very impractical.



#34 Sep 09 2010 at 6:38 PM Rating: Default
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People seem to not understand the meaning of beta.. or the fact that we're only playing maybe 10-20% of what the game will have to offer. Why don't you wait for the actual release before you decide the game is boring...
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#35 Sep 09 2010 at 7:19 PM Rating: Decent
Sage
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54 posts
Quote:
SE mentioned several times it's about exploration and community websites to collect and distribute information. This means that many people will feel the same as you do in the beginning and I swear it's a way for SE to frustrate and intimidate younger players who don't have the patience nor understanding to get through it. They seem totally fine turning those hyper players away.


You've pretty much summed up SE's philosophy right there. What FF game has ever been truly "hand-holding" and go here and here next...

It's a "FANTASY" if you can't see yourself getting immersed or being immersed in the world of Eorzea, then the game isn't for you. And when I say "immersed" it doesn't have to be from a story standpoint but something that connects with you.

We're complaining about a lot of the same things that's fine some are valid some are not. But FF MMO's have always been about "learning on your own or with a group of people."

I've joined a linkshell in OB that's been a great group of people attitude wise who've tested out things and thrown ideas/theories/solutions around that helped us get a better grasp of the game quicker.

If you don't have the courage to explore the unknown don't do it; and don't hate yourself for not doing it. But you can't blame "nature" for not telling you where to go next.

:D
#36 Sep 09 2010 at 7:36 PM Rating: Default
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2,120 posts
sodux wrote:
Quote:
SE mentioned several times it's about exploration and community websites to collect and distribute information. This means that many people will feel the same as you do in the beginning and I swear it's a way for SE to frustrate and intimidate younger players who don't have the patience nor understanding to get through it. They seem totally fine turning those hyper players away.


You've pretty much summed up SE's philosophy right there. What FF game has ever been truly "hand-holding" and go here and here next...

It's a "FANTASY" if you can't see yourself getting immersed or being immersed in the world of Eorzea, then the game isn't for you. And when I say "immersed" it doesn't have to be from a story standpoint but something that connects with you.

We're complaining about a lot of the same things that's fine some are valid some are not. But FF MMO's have always been about "learning on your own or with a group of people."

I've joined a linkshell in OB that's been a great group of people attitude wise who've tested out things and thrown ideas/theories/solutions around that helped us get a better grasp of the game quicker.

If you don't have the courage to explore the unknown don't do it; and don't hate yourself for not doing it. But you can't blame "nature" for not telling you where to go next.

:D


Exactly this. I understand the complaints about the real issues...lag, UI, controls, etc. But with some of these other complaints a lot of people start sounding like "Man, this game would be great if they just made it less final fantasy" Hmm...see the obvious problem there?

I'm having fun with it and have had no problems progressing fairly quick in the past week. Already up to physical21 and my top class is conjurer 16, quite a few others around the rank10 area. I also understand that guildleves aren't meant to be done an unlimited amount of time...there will be grinding. It's not unlike FoV & Assaults in XI, they were a bonus system you could take advantage of, but you didn't sit around doing nothing until the next batch...you grinded.

Also people see the words "It's just beta" and lose it, but that still works depending on the subject at hand. It's perfectly valid to say in regards to content. I know there will be much more to do so I'm not concerned with that.
The technical issues & UI, etc. are a separate issue entirely...


Edited, Sep 9th 2010 9:38pm by TwistedOwl
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#37 Sep 09 2010 at 7:53 PM Rating: Good
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To be honest this is like the only new worth it mmo lately. seriously.. every other quality p2p crap was basically a flop.. For example: APb god that was pitiful... Aion, it was alright, but storyline was total sh*t... Final Fantasy XIV looked fairly promising... nothing a little third party fix and mod can't do :D .. My hardware mouse works.. UI is hardly a problem now.. The present content is fairly mediocre at best.. but it's a beta.. I can imagine if I was the dev.. I wouldn't want to completely spoil the experience of the beta testers.. I will instead use this time to test basic ingame mechanics to make sure everything work as planned and doesn't completely crap the @#%^ out on release day..

So far every hard to code thing has been covered.. from smooth movement to cutscene initiation to crafting.. everything seems to be in place.. WHy would they need to show you guild quests and main storyline.. When they can just test out the functionality of the quests through your home nation quests? Exactly..

From what I can tell FFXIV will be pretty good.. seeing how they don't even charge you for the days you don't paly.. some if guildleve stands at its current limit.. I'll just log every 2 days.. do the guildleve log out.. and continue on with my life :D..

Also this game will probably not hold my interest when Guild Wars 2, SWTOR, diablo 3, Vindictus (skeptical), Tera (skeptical), or cataclysm (just kidding) comes out... We'll just see just how much SE has learned over the last decade of gaming history...

p.s. Let's be serious this game is not doing nearly as bad as APB

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 9:54pm by nick2412
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WoW: we want to give players a more fun time with less grinding and generic quests
GW2: we want the player to feel like they are leveling while doing something fun
Final Fantasy XIV: we want less fun and more grinding
#38 Sep 09 2010 at 7:57 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
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21,739 posts
TwistedOwl wrote:
But with some of these other complaints a lot of people start sounding like "Man, this game would be great if they just made it less final fantasy" Hmm...see the obvious problem there?
Hmmm, yeah that would be odd if anyone had actually made that argument.

So what exactly is the "fantasy" in needing to go onto alla forums to read guides on how to do basic things in the game? FFXI had this problem for the longest time. Had I not been walked through a lot of the less obvious details of the game by a friend of mine early on, I'd have never stuck with it.

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 8:58pm by bsphil
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Almalieque wrote:
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Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
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#39 Sep 09 2010 at 8:01 PM Rating: Good
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172 posts
I love how the fanboys always say "It's beta!" "It's beta"

like that gives it an excuse to suck.

The 8 lvlquests a day thing is stupid, and i think they want to include it in retail, because lets face it, there's no reason it should even be in beta, unless it' just a way to slow people down so they don't hit end game content and go "WTF this game sux".

Apparently all they wanted to test was server capacity in beta cause everything is slow as **** so the only content people are testing is the low as **** lvl content. No chocobos? Seriously? Let us test quickly not slowly if you wanted us to test anything to begin with. No need for us to have to move insanely slow, Lvl insanely slow, be unable to even trade with each other quickly. (no auction house)

The pace of this game is so insanely slow and even if they add chocobos and an auction house i'd still feel like i'm repeating the same actions over and over for far too long. (I just want to get to content where I'm forced to actually strategize during combat besides backing away from a mole when it goes underground)

I haven't preordered or anything but some friends of mine are FFXI fanboys so i'll see what they say about retail cause currently beta of FFXIV feels like this game could've came out 10 years ago and it'd cut it, but nowadays we've seen what works in MMOs and what doesn't and the whole boring grindfest of killing the same mobs over and over and over.... doesn't.
#40LioenHeart, Posted: Sep 09 2010 at 8:06 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Ok these comments are dumb as ****.. If you dont like the game GTFO and play something else. end of.
#41 Sep 09 2010 at 8:08 PM Rating: Decent
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2,120 posts
bsphil wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
But with some of these other complaints a lot of people start sounding like "Man, this game would be great if they just made it less final fantasy" Hmm...see the obvious problem there?
Hmmm, yeah that would be odd if anyone had actually made that argument.

So what exactly is the "fantasy" in needing to go onto alla forums to read guides on how to do basic things in the game? FFXI had this problem for the longest time. Had I not been walked through a lot of the less obvious details of the game by a friend of mine early on, I'd have never stuck with it.

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 8:58pm by bsphil


No, people haven't said those exact words, and that's not what I said either. Some of the complaints "sound like" making it less of a final fantasy game would do the trick for people.
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#42 Sep 09 2010 at 8:12 PM Rating: Default
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I agree.. but people with crap taste.. will always have crap taste.. apparently they like grinding until their hands are all sore.. What can you do but just point and laugh at idiots like that..
I will laugh my *** off if SE pulled an "APB" .. and completely went under within 6 months of this game's release.. Don't want to go bankrupt? Don't release ****** games.. Do what you got to do.. Honestly I don't give a **** if it is a walk in the park like WoW.. Why was WoW successful? Only naive people say because it was because of the easiness.. Do you think it was easy at release? no.. WoW.. made a game where you get to end game lightning fast so you can enjoy the content that is not grind...

NO ONE ON FREAKIN EARTH LIKES TO GRIND.. (except for those crazy asians.. yes I am talking about you farmers that obviously have no life) Americans/Europeans like to work and get paid with non virtual money.. we call it the EURO or USD .. We don't have time for mundane crap like pure grind for 99+ hours.. We want to log in .. Do a quest and feel like we accomplished something.. not these trivial crafting minigames.. that take freakin ages to finish..

That is why WoW was so dam successful.. they made it quick and painless to get things.. peopel diss it simply because it was way too easy.. and I agree it was too easy.. that is why you find WoW's mistake and you fix it and make it better,... therefore you will +1 on wow.. and dominate the game market.. not completely go in the opposite direction of the trend.. and make an absolute abomination of the game.. if release is a 5+ hour grindfest at level 20 like beta... I won't even pick up the collectors edition from best buy.. and I'll just tell them to stick it up their ****.. and give me back my money... I need to save up for some other revolutionary stuff like.. I don't know..

GUILD WARS 2, SWTOR, and perhaps DIablo3 if that ever comes out... Don't disappoint SE.. release some better trailers.. because so far all the trailers are pretty much showing what you can see in beta.. except for those stupidly high quality renders that are probably not going to be in game..
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WoW: we want to give players a more fun time with less grinding and generic quests
GW2: we want the player to feel like they are leveling while doing something fun
Final Fantasy XIV: we want less fun and more grinding
#43 Sep 09 2010 at 8:15 PM Rating: Decent
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154 posts
nick2412 wrote:
I agree.. but people with crap taste.. will always have crap taste.. apparently they like grinding until their hands are all sore.. What can you do but just point and laugh at idiots like that..
I will laugh my *** off if SE pulled an "APB" .. and completely went under within 6 months of this game's release.. Don't want to go bankrupt? Don't release sh*tty games.. Do what you got to do.. Honestly I don't give a sh*t if it is a walk in the park like WoW.. Why was WoW successful? Only naive people say because it was because of the easiness.. Do you think it was easy at release? no.. WoW.. made a game where you get to end game lightning fast so you can enjoy the content that is not grind...

NO ONE ON FREAKIN EARTH LIKES TO GRIND.. (except for those crazy asians.. yes I am talking about you farmers that obviously have no life) Americans/Europeans like to work and get paid with non virtual money.. we call it the EURO or USD .. We don't have time for mundane crap like pure grind for 99+ hours.. We want to log in .. Do a quest and feel like we accomplished something.. not these trivial crafting minigames.. that take freakin ages to finish..

That is why WoW was so dam successful.. they made it quick and painless to get things.. peopel diss it simply because it was way too easy.. and I agree it was too easy.. that is why you find WoW's mistake and you fix it and make it better,... therefore you will +1 on wow.. and dominate the game market.. not completely go in the opposite direction of the trend.. and make an absolute abomination of the game.. if release is a 5+ hour grindfest at level 20 like beta... I won't even pick up the collectors edition from best buy.. and I'll just tell them to stick it up their ****.. and give me back my money... I need to save up for some other revolutionary stuff like.. I don't know..

GUILD WARS 2, SWTOR, and perhaps DIablo3 if that ever comes out... Don't disappoint SE.. release some better trailers.. because so far all the trailers are pretty much showing what you can see in beta.. except for those stupidly high quality renders that are probably not going to be in game..


Someone hasnt had their milk today, and as I said above. If you dont like the game go play something else :) simple as that.
#44 Sep 09 2010 at 8:17 PM Rating: Good
11 posts
Here's the problem I think we have..

The name of the company.
SE has been the leader of the RPG world. They've been changing as a whole by trying to redesign the whole gaming experience. Take a look at FFXII, half the people love it, half the people hate it. Same goes for FFXIII, you either love it or hate. They are trying to learn from the mistakes, but it is with our help they can better understand. Now I know that it seems like the majority of the posts is people hating or severly disappointed with the game, but the honest truth is that most of the people that love the game are probably playing it right now.
I still love the game evening after playing some beta, I'm reserving the rest of my time to play at release, but the game is not finished yet, it's not a demo, but a beta of a game not 100%. It has happened to just about every MMO out there and even RPG's. It's just what you prefer, and I am willing to fork out alittle cash and support the company that has kept me entertained for over a decade.
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#45 Sep 09 2010 at 8:18 PM Rating: Good
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506 posts
digitalcraft wrote:
Pretty sure they've said they turned off all the side quests and such and added limitations so people don't see too much.


Any idea where you read/heard this? Would be encouraging to see the actual quote.
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#46 Sep 09 2010 at 8:21 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
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21,739 posts
shad0winc wrote:
Here's the problem I think we have..

The name of the company.
If any company at all put out what SE has released at an open beta, I'd still not like it. If it was some unknown developer, a lot more people would be negative on the open beta because the company doesn't have a reputation from older games.
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His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#47 Sep 09 2010 at 8:26 PM Rating: Default
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230 posts
Quote:
If any company at all put out what SE has released at an open beta, I'd still not like it. If it was some unknown developer, a lot more people would be negative on the open beta because the company doesn't have a reputation from older games.


Looks like you have never played a beta before...
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#48 Sep 09 2010 at 8:27 PM Rating: Good
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81 posts
Quite frankly, though so many people seem to think they don't explain things to you, has anyone even bothered to read the "book" that is one of the options when you're standing near the Aether (or w/e that thing is called) when you're in a camp? I decided to take a look at it and discovered it is actually a manual explaining some of the game workings to you. Plus, if you do the beginning quest all the way through, things are explained along the way - and as you do some of the tutorial guild leves, you're learning how to do things - like the mining, fishing, etc. ones.

In the beginning I didn't know what the heck I was doing or who I was supposed to go see, but after a few days of playing, I realized that they had been explaining all this stuff to you all along. All you got to do is go back to the person in whichever city you are at that first welcomed you to the city and gave you a linkpearl. That person is your guide with answers to how things work, and they'll direct you to others who will tell you how things work.

I admit that once you get to a certain point, it does seem like there's not much left to do. However, as said before, you have the chance to level up another class or learn about gathering and crafting. Heck, just fish a while and then learn how to cook. At least we've had the opportunity to plaly the beta and figure the way these things work, so that when we get the live game, we wont have to waste our time trying to figure things out. We'll be ready to up and go.

As many others have said, I don't believe they're giving us all there is to see in the live game - that would be stupid to do. I'm sure they're holding back a lot of stuff so that we'll have it to do live. Otherwise, we really would get bored with the game, if it were all laid out in the beta so we could "do it all".

Don't fret it - just be patient!

~M~
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#49 Sep 09 2010 at 8:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Mimotep wrote:
Quite frankly, though so many people seem to think they don't explain things to you, has anyone even bothered to read the "book" that is one of the options when you're standing near the Aether (or w/e that thing is called) when you're in a camp? I decided to take a look at it and discovered it is actually a manual explaining some of the game workings to you. Plus, if you do the beginning quest all the way through, things are explained along the way - and as you do some of the tutorial guild leves, you're learning how to do things - like the mining, fishing, etc. ones.

In the beginning I didn't know what the heck I was doing or who I was supposed to go see, but after a few days of playing, I realized that they had been explaining all this stuff to you all along. All you got to do is go back to the person in whichever city you are at that first welcomed you to the city and gave you a linkpearl. That person is your guide with answers to how things work, and they'll direct you to others who will tell you how things work.


Precisely. It's not a design flaw if you rush through every cutscene, ignore the NPC & aetheryte tutorial info handed to you, never check the journal babysitting you through the quests and then have to /shout or come online for help because you don't know what to do.

Though I will mention, this is the kind of thing that was bound to happen when SE decided to cater more towards the casual non-FF fan as well as their usual fanbase. I totally get that it's a steep learning curve, caused by SE trying to please everyone.

Edited, Sep 9th 2010 10:48pm by TwistedOwl
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#50 Sep 09 2010 at 8:48 PM Rating: Decent
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67 posts
I don't know if my post will inspire, or upset other readers/posters. But I am a fan of SE, fanboy if you will, since people like to label. I was greatly dissapointed at the beta at first. I was upset at the idea of surplus, the idea of the software mouse, the greatly upsetting miscommunications from SE themselves about everything this game was developing, as far as the translations and the lack of European and NA interviews and website updates. But here is the thing, this game is far from being complete, but so was every other game released when it came out. FFXI was very buggy and rigid when the game started, it turned out to be one of the best games I have ever played. Wow was exceptionally laggy with terrible user interfaces because the servers were not capable of holding the player base, now Wow is the largest MMO out there doing amazing. This game is in birth, there are some things that are a no brainer - no sort function in the inventory. But there is amazing potential for this game. Months ago, SE said, the beta would have 5-10% of launch gameplay in it. That was from their mouths. I understand the beta is somewhat lackluster, but it was designed to be this way. No company is going to give away all the excitement in the beta, because that is what the launch is for. As far as the UI, it was confirmed by SE a little over a month ago that the UI was server based, they wanted to document and record how people were interacting with their controls and settings. This lag that makes "buying arrows a 25min process" is not something that launch will have. Yes, I am a "fanboy", but yes I am also skeptical about the game. Here is the thing though, I will play it, I have loved the beta so far, the beta in the week I've played it had gotten a lot better. People have already said the beta from closed through the stages has gotten extremely better. FFXI was very poor at the start, this game may be too. But when I look back at the 8 years I played FFXI, I played on the Comp from NA release, the game went through a metamorphesis. It was never the player's game, it was SE's. They told the story and you decided if you wanted on for the ride. There is nothing wrong about being dissapointed or upset at this game in this stage, there is something wrong about assuming because you don't like it should change. You have all the right to walk away from this game and never play it. But, just like FFXI went through changes, I expect this game to as well. I am sorry to those this post bothers, but the truth is, they will make this game succeed or crash and burn, we will not. You just have to decide if you will be riding it when it soars or goes down. Thanks and sorry for the lengthy post.

~Skye - Gilgamesh
75 thf/sch/sam/blu/cor
50+ all other jobs
103 Leatherworker
60 all other crafts
All story lines completed
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#51 Sep 09 2010 at 8:55 PM Rating: Good
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359 posts
Quote:
Exactly this. I understand the complaints about the real issues...lag, UI, controls, etc. But with some of these other complaints a lot of people start sounding like "Man, this game would be great if they just made it less final fantasy" Hmm...see the obvious problem there?


So help me...I almost wish they had just taken WoW and reskinned it with Tarus, and Mithras, and Chocobos...oh my!
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