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Distributing attribute points...?!Follow

#52 Sep 12 2010 at 10:33 AM Rating: Default
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hints wrote:
So I plan to play a hybrid class of CON/THM/GLD/LAN/PUG and put all my points into STR and PIE because it sounds awesome and fun. But what if down the road I read that playing a PUG/LAN/MAR is way better DPS and i need to put all my stats into STR/DEX. I think I shouldn't be penalized for wanting to change my play style to get bigger numbers.


.

Too much " I WANT A GOLDEN GOOSE, I WANT IT NAO" in this thread. listen to the oompa loompas FFS!

http://media.photobucket.com/image/i%20want%20a%20golden%20goose/tothemoonalice02/blog%20photos/veruca_salt.jpg

Edited, Sep 12th 2010 12:34pm by GusMorgan
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#53 Sep 12 2010 at 10:43 AM Rating: Good
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GusMorgan wrote:
hints wrote:
So I plan to play a hybrid class of CON/THM/GLD/LAN/PUG and put all my points into STR and PIE because it sounds awesome and fun. But what if down the road I read that playing a PUG/LAN/MAR is way better DPS and i need to put all my stats into STR/DEX. I think I shouldn't be penalized for wanting to change my play style to get bigger numbers.


.

Too much " I WANT A GOLDEN GOOSE, I WANT IT NAO" in this thread. listen to the oompa loompas FFS!

http://media.photobucket.com/image/i%20want%20a%20golden%20goose/tothemoonalice02/blog%20photos/veruca_salt.jpg
Really? You're going with character stats as the golden goose?
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#54 Sep 12 2010 at 10:46 AM Rating: Default
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GusMorgan wrote:
hints wrote:
So I plan to play a hybrid class of CON/THM/GLD/LAN/PUG and put all my points into STR and PIE because it sounds awesome and fun. But what if down the road I read that playing a PUG/LAN/MAR is way better DPS and i need to put all my stats into STR/DEX. I think I shouldn't be penalized for wanting to change my play style to get bigger numbers.


.

Too much " I WANT A GOLDEN GOOSE, I WANT IT NAO" in this thread. listen to the oompa loompas FFS!

http://media.photobucket.com/image/i%20want%20a%20golden%20goose/tothemoonalice02/blog%20photos/veruca_salt.jpg

Edited, Sep 12th 2010 12:34pm by GusMorgan


I don't understand your post.

But how am i supposed to keep up with FOTM builds if i can't respec for free any time i want?
#55 Sep 12 2010 at 10:46 AM Rating: Good
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Redistributing points may actually be my favorite part of the game. 3 hours cooldown is a bit long but that may or may not be final. Could be worse, could charge you massive amounts of in-game gil, redoubling in price for every redo... for the same job >.> (AKA wow)
#56 Sep 12 2010 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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First off let me say I haven't played BETA so this is just personally conjecture, nothing more.

I think the ability to do a full re-stat would be broken.

This is what I invisioned SE doing with this. Let's say we are hunting a NM or doing a quest and have a dedicated tank or healer or whatever. Then as a group you end up losing that player, well obviously there should be a "punishment" for your group not doing well. When playing FFXI if we lost our tank or healer it was usually a fullwipe then you had to re-group and pray someone didn't take Kirin or whoever you were fighting.

But now they have it that if you lose your tank then one of your melee cold "flip" on the fly and make due until you get your act together, I personally think that is awesome. So even if you aren't maxing the role like most of us like to do, you are still hanging in there.

Now granted we used to try to make sure that we had "spare" tanks and healer and red mages and whatever. Which means you spent a buttload of time getting people together and which made for a real pain in the *** for a lot of things you wanted to do, Dynamis is a great example. I quit FFXI 4 years ago so I am not sure of the new content as you can tell.

So in this new scenerio lets say we are battling a boss and we lose our tank due to some wicked move that someone didn't stun or something, one of the melee flip to the tank and hold on for dear life with "lower" stats as a punishment for our failure. The new tank mamages to hold on until the old tanks gets unweakened and gets back in the role then he can switch back to melee and we all move on. All with keeping our group relatively small so no long wait times and you KNOW who you are dealing with. I remember wishing we had something like that in FFXI, because I had a pretty badass paladin but like to play either my Blm or War, and I hated going as a "back up " tank standing around waiting for the other tank to fall, it would have been nice to "switch" to my Pld then back to War when needed. And I will take a stat loss for that ability any day.

That is what I see SE trying to accomplish here, granted it will be a pain when we just want to play another role and we aren't our best, but I think there has to be some kind of deficit because swapping on the "fly" and getting max stats would be a huge advantage, almost unfair. I know the "maxers" won't agree but there has to be a compromise in there somewhere.
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#57 Sep 12 2010 at 10:58 AM Rating: Good
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It's an interesting character concept, being able to customize your character's abilities around. I've played too many games where once you allocate character points or IP points, it close to impossible to make changes.
#58 Sep 12 2010 at 11:07 AM Rating: Good
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The reassignment cooldown is a game balance mechanic. Every character can be every job. However, it would be completely broken if you could be any job at any time. Imagine, for instance, if every character could switch to conjurer instantly. Healers would be pointless, you'd much rather have DDers with Conj leveled. The DDers fight, and then swap to cast Cure, and then swap back. It would make the word "job" meaningless. With the reassignment cooldown, you can be any job, but it takes time to fully switch between them. The point is that it should not be viable to swap out jobs in the middle of a big fight, because that would lead to silly and probably broken strategies.

The real downside, of course, is that switching from War to Magic and back is a pain. But switching between different kinds of war or different kinds of magic, not at all. I went from Conj to Thaum at physical level 18, and my level 1 Thaum was invincible. She has so much VIT that level 1 monsters don't even hurt her, even when she's wearing rank 10+ armor.

As for people saying that they're "penalized:" There's more to the game than just grinding mobs. If you want to do a full respec, try some crafting or harvesting. There's a lot to do in this game that's not fighting, and it is generally very profitable. Just trip your reasign every 30 mins while cutting wood or whatever, and that will be that.

But honestly, how often do you need to reassign points fully? Only if you're swammping between War and Magic, which you probably shouldn't do that often, given how long it takes. Also, after 40, every attribute takes double points to raise. So for my conj, that means taking every attribute I need up to 40. It's silly, for instance to spend 2:1 to raise INT when I could raise MND or PIE up to 40 on a 1:1 basis. That means the system really encourages me to use a balanced build and not do any radical spec'ing that would later call for radical re-spec'ing. To be sure, at some point people will start specializing their builds for party play, like conj's with pumped up INT for nukers, and with pumped up MND for healers. But for solo play anyway, you really don't have that many choices to make on stats, so it's easy not to ***** them up.


Edited, Sep 12th 2010 1:15pm by Solimurr
#59 Sep 12 2010 at 11:54 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
The reassignment cooldown is a game balance mechanic. Every character can be every job. However, it would be completely broken if you could be any job at any time. Imagine, for instance, if every character could switch to conjurer instantly. Healers would be pointless, you'd much rather have DDers with Conj leveled. The DDers fight, and then swap to cast Cure, and then swap back. It would make the word "job" meaningless. With the reassignment cooldown, you can be any job, but it takes time to fully switch between them. The point is that it should not be viable to swap out jobs in the middle of a big fight, because that would lead to silly and probably broken strategies.


I don't think that anyone here is saying that switching should be unlimited with absolutely no restrictions. I mean I get not being able switch from lancer to conjurer in the MIDDLE OF A FIGHT as u suggest. What I am saying is that 3+ hours is to long for a total reallocation. I think that 1/2 an hour is plenty of time to need to wait. That way people wont be changing just for the tanks weakness timer, but I can still go from soloing to a party in a reasonable amount of time.

In response to the comment that we need be punished because the tank left because we are SOOO bad at the game is preposterous. Need I be punished if my tank leaves because it is his dinner time? I think not.
#60 Sep 12 2010 at 12:15 PM Rating: Default
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The reallocation process is a second chance to undo any immediate mistakes you might have done, it was not intended to optimize spec a class every time you wanted to change!

You will have to plan ahead which disciplines of war you want to focus on and prioritize the stats that benefit them the most. Someone like me, who will be leveling everything, will just have to balance them out based on one's own preference and play style.

I know the game will be better off without it, but it is something one will have to adapt with in order to play effectively.
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#61 Sep 12 2010 at 12:53 PM Rating: Decent
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So am I the only one that noticed that (at least in the conjurer's guild hall) there is an NPC that 'sells' 'abilities' that are to the effect of 'grants you x str per y int'. There was at least an entire page of different combos.

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#62 Sep 12 2010 at 1:10 PM Rating: Default
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I appreciate what is being wrote on quickly changing stats, but I just can't agree with it. You should not be able to flip flop your avatars physical stats at will when you switch a job. The stats and reassignments IMHO make the player think about how they want to assign the points in the first place.

Sure it would be nice to go from super strength PUG to an intelligent Conjy, to get the big heals. Being able to do this would make the game to easy. I'm tired of easy mode games.

I'm sure my words will go unheeded or be flamed.
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#63 Sep 12 2010 at 2:02 PM Rating: Decent
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I appreciate what is being wrote on quickly changing stats, but I just can't agree with it. You should not be able to flip flop your avatars physical stats at will when you switch a job. The stats and reassignments IMHO make the player think about how they want to assign the points in the first place.

Sure it would be nice to go from super strength PUG to an intelligent Conjy, to get the big heals. Being able to do this would make the game to easy. I'm tired of easy mode games.

I'm sure my words will go unheeded or be flamed.


Because Final Fantasy XI was so easy with being able to change jobs and outfits. Right.

Was that a flame?
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#64 Sep 12 2010 at 2:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Alabazman wrote:
So am I the only one that noticed that (at least in the conjurer's guild hall) there is an NPC that 'sells' 'abilities' that are to the effect of 'grants you x str per y int'. There was at least an entire page of different combos.


To get those it costs something like 5000 guild marks doesn't it? Which would make that very impractical.
#65 Sep 12 2010 at 3:17 PM Rating: Good
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In response to the comment that we need be punished because the tank left because we are SOOO bad at the game is preposterous. Need I be punished if my tank leaves because it is his dinner time? I think not.


Christ man, my 13 year old daughter isn't that dramatic. No one said you were SOOOOO bad, the the fact remains either a member fell due to carelessness or other priority, in either circumstance then yeah you should be inconvenienced(punished). You act as if someone swapping into a role would totally diable the party if he weren't maxed out.

In FFXI I was very proud to have the best gear I could at any given level, some did not. Did that mean if they came in a serk merit party with less than ideal equipment that we would fail, of course not, sure it slowed us down but I didn't give up the thought entirely. If you had a Blm with +1 staves and he had to leave and one came with NQ staves would you say to **** with the boss fight, I think not.

Would having full re-stat be great, **** ya, but it isn't game detroying not having it. A full re-stat could be easily abused and this is the lesser of two evils, or that's the way I look at it though.

I think a great fix would be to have a full re-stat in town or something so if you wanted to switch jobs and do something entirely different you could accomplish that with just a little inconvenience. But out in the field being able to switch jobs and get instant full re-stat is very overpowered, just my opinion of course and to each their own.

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#66 Sep 12 2010 at 4:11 PM Rating: Good
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So what you're saying is not only do you want the ability to change your class at any time without having to make a new character, such that no other MMO offers, but you want the ability to completely mix and match and customize these jobs still without having to create a new character. Ontop of that you want to be able to change your stats immediately on the spot to fit whatever situation you're going into in the game.

They should make the re-distribute every month so you actually have to use your brain for once in an MMO. Maybe even make it a year, lend some GRAVITY to your decisions. Did you get to change you're Elvaans pitiful INT stat in FFXI? A little bit of sarcasm I apologize but its like all MMO players think today is "Give me, give me give me! Dificulty? No way! Adversity? Eeeewwwww!".
#67 Sep 12 2010 at 4:28 PM Rating: Default
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Alright Tech, I admit that my statement may look more dramatic than I meant it, but you were the first one to use the word "punishment". However, I still don't see why the reallocation of stats need take so long. Like I said before 1/2 an hour and not being able to switch in battle seem like enough of a restriction to prevent abuse. If you could point out exactly what abuse you thing could happen then I probably would agree with you. Truth be told, I haven't even had a problem with this yet because when someone switches weapons there base stats change and at the levels we are talking about in beta the difference is hardly noticeable.
#68 Sep 12 2010 at 4:34 PM Rating: Good
Deadgye wrote:
hexaemeron wrote:
Quote:
Why do you need to COMPLETELY flop your stats around? Is it really going to make your conjurer unplayable because you don't have the maximum possible int?


At level 2, of course not. At level 20 or more, yeah, probably.


So you're just making random guesses on what it's going to be like?


Yeah I play as con and as different melee classes - 1 redistribute is enough.

Since at a certain point if you try to stack everything on 1 attribute you start paying 2 points for a 1 point increase - it becomes pointless to overstack on just a couple stats
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#69 Sep 12 2010 at 4:39 PM Rating: Good
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I guess it's six of one and a half dozen of another. I am trying not to get all worked up about it. I started playing FFXI as soon as it came out for PS2. I know the version we are about to see is the building blocks of a game, as time goes it will get better. I figure if I am in the mix and a casual player then I can "grow" my character with the game. I am a casual player anyway, so my vision is a little skewed I guess. I could care less about mining and maxing a character, XP penalties, leve time restrictions, etc, etc. None of that effect my day to day play.
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WAR has access to enough enmity gear and enough hate-inducing JA to aggro baby jesus.


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When I'm trying to decide what spell to cast I look at the mobs' weaknesses, check the day, check the weather and then calmly cast Thunder IV.
#70 Sep 12 2010 at 6:01 PM Rating: Good
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I just posted this in a new thread. Going to copy and paste it here. What I'm trying to say is: Be careful about putting all your points into one stat. Not because the reassigning later. Because SE set a limit to how much a class can use in each stat.

When you go up in physical level you put your points into the areas you want(Everyone knows this), but Class Level only uses so much of each stats points. For example:
Level 10 Gladiator, Level 16 Physical.
If you put 57 points into VIT. Anything past 50 points is redundant. Level 10 class I found out only uses up to 50 in one stat. If you surpass this then those last 7 points are completely wasted.

This is a way to stop people from putting all their eggs into one basket. Maybe someone can experiment with Levels 1-9. Best way to experiment is with VIT or MND(guessing that's the one that gives MP?). Something physical you can see increasing.
I think it would be great to know how much we can have into each stat at each level so you'll be a better character. I hope this makes sense.
#71 Sep 13 2010 at 1:08 AM Rating: Decent
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Sure, you don't want to waste points that are above the cap for your current class level. Problem is when your class level finally reaches the same cap as your physical level (50, I think?) you don't want to end up not having enough points to max the attributes that matter because earlier you spread your points too evenly when your class level was lower than your physical level.
#72 Sep 13 2010 at 7:07 AM Rating: Good
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I like the stat system. Even if it's not like FFXI where your stats would change depending on your class, you get the freedom to put your points where you want and you can even reassign them! There is no risk of f**** up your char because you put your points in the wrong stat.

And if you want to be the best melee you'll have to sacrifice your magic potential and vice versa. If you want to be both you'll have to distribute your points accordingly.

What bothers me more is that we've got to reassing the abilities every time we change class. Yes it's possible to write a macro to set them all but the game should be able to remember the set abilities for each class.
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#73 Sep 13 2010 at 7:17 AM Rating: Default
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RidingBean wrote:
I like the stat system. Even if it's not like FFXI where your stats would change depending on your class, you get the freedom to put your points where you want and you can even reassign them! There is no risk of f**** up your char because you put your points in the wrong stat.

And if you want to be the best melee you'll have to sacrifice your magic potential and vice versa. If you want to be both you'll have to distribute your points accordingly.

What bothers me more is that we've got to reassing the abilities every time we change class. Yes it's possible to write a macro to set them all but the game should be able to remember the set abilities for each class.


In fairness, yes the game could remember your last set of abilities when you changed...
but writing macros is simple.

Also with this macro system, you can have numerous pre-made 'sets' on the same class.

On my THM for instance... I could have a debuffing macro set where I have all my spells like bio/slow/paralyze... hit the next THM macro set where I have mainly damage dealing type spells... and so on...

If the game simply "remembered my last preset abilities" i wouldn't be able to customize like this.

The macro system is good if you know how to use it, which I'm sure you do. It only takes a few minutes to write out macros if you know what you're doing, and is FAR superior to a system that just remembers your last abilities before you changed classes.
#74 Sep 13 2010 at 7:21 AM Rating: Decent
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...and you forgot the best part about it.
It's a primitive excuse for a simple drag-and-drop based macro system.
Come on, typing command line parameters in a MMORPG... are we in 1980 or what?
It's a pretty powerful tool, but its implementation is horrible.
#75 Sep 13 2010 at 7:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Come on, typing command line parameters in a MMORPG... are we in 1980 or what?


That's a pretty ridiculous statement.

There are some people who like to use a GUI, which is normally a frontend to a command line call anyway, and which also doesn't always incorporate all of the potential of that underlying call. Then there are those of us who prefer command line for the power and freedom it gives us.

A command line interface in an mmo is no different. If you want to be average, stick to the gui. If you want to rise above the norm, try learning how to use the command line.
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#76 Sep 13 2010 at 7:54 AM Rating: Decent
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Rinsui wrote:
...and you forgot the best part about it.
It's a primitive excuse for a simple drag-and-drop based macro system.
Come on, typing command line parameters in a MMORPG... are we in 1980 or what?
It's a pretty powerful tool, but its implementation is horrible.


How about you use your drag and drop... I'll use my macros.
then I'll do things 50x faster than you. OK thanks.
#77 Sep 13 2010 at 10:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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How about you use your drag and drop... I'll use my macros.
then I'll do things 50x faster than you. OK thanks.


Man, they weren't kidding around about your BRD princessery. I prefer a command line for a lot of things, but an MMORPG isn't one of them. Casual gamers (like most people today) would expect graphical drag and drop + action bar memory functionality as a given.

Not everyone lives in a NetBSD world, Shona.
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#78 Sep 13 2010 at 11:30 AM Rating: Good
bsphil wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
It takes a really long time to reset to normal stats if you're a crazy person who dumped every single point into fire to see if your fire nukes would do amazing damage...but no one does that kind of thing right? = P

I did...
Eventually people will learn that you need to balance your stats to allow yourself to not get completely gimped on other jobs.

Then everyone will start wondering why the game bothers to let you allocate your own stats if you need them balanced in the first place.

Meanwhile, at SquareEnix Headquarters in Japan...



 _____   _____    _____       ___   _____   
/  ___| |  _  \  | ____|     /   | |_   _|  
| |     | |_| |  | |__      / /| |   | |    
| |  _  |  _  /  |  __|    / / | |   | |    
| |_| | | | \ \  | |___   / /  | |   | |    
\_____/ |_|  \_\ |_____| /_/   |_|   |_|    
 
 _____   _   _   _____   _____   _____   _____   _____   
/  ___/ | | | | /  ___| /  ___| | ____| /  ___/ /  ___/  
| |___  | | | | | |     | |     | |__   | |___  | |___   
\___  \ | | | | | |     | |     |  __|  \___  \ \___  \  
 ___| | | |_| | | |___  | |___  | |___   ___| |  ___| |  
/_____/ \_____/ \_____| \_____| |_____| /_____/ /_____/  


Edited, Sep 12th 2010 1:03am by bsphil

LOL this was hilarious. An interesting point though. I'm not sure people will balance their stats, however. I think some people will stick with DoW and increase STR-DEX-VIT.
And some others will stick with DoM and increase DEX-VIT-INT-MND-PIE. Mages kinda get the shaft, they need dex for TP moves and Vit for health, etc.
But yeah we'll see specialists.

But for those who dont want to specialize, you're going to have to keep your stats balanced so you can take advantage of the 'change class at any time' feature
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#79 Sep 13 2010 at 11:34 AM Rating: Good
hexaemeron wrote:
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Should I go complain about how the game needs chocobos and airships or it's going to suck too?


Is this how you respond to any legitimate non-trolling complaint about this game? Cmon now.

Welcome to Zam, it seems <:)

I personally thinkg a respect is a good idea. It's just a more convenient way to change stats.

SE has the idea that we'll be changing classes frequently, which is really cool. But the stat system, and how mages need 5 stats while fighters only need 3, and so forth, are currently not balanced.
If anyone has an indication SE is fixing this, then you will humble those who have a problem with the stat system. Otherwise, there's no point in insulting us. Don't
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#80 Sep 13 2010 at 11:48 AM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:
And some others will stick with DoM and increase DEX-VIT-INT-MND-PIE. Mages kinda get the shaft, they need dex for TP moves and Vit for health, etc.


Has anyone done some testing on that? Needing Dex for radiance & the other one? I haven't put one point into Dex as conjurer & hit ok with radiance. I miss more against tougher mobs, but I don't think it's drastically different than DoWs with loads of dex missing their weaponskills against similarly tough mobs.
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#81 Sep 13 2010 at 11:51 AM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:
hexaemeron wrote:
Quote:
Should I go complain about how the game needs chocobos and airships or it's going to suck too?


Is this how you respond to any legitimate non-trolling complaint about this game? Cmon now.

Welcome to Zam, it seems <:)

I personally thinkg a respect is a good idea. It's just a more convenient way to change stats.

SE has the idea that we'll be changing classes frequently, which is really cool. But the stat system, and how mages need 5 stats while fighters only need 3, and so forth, are currently not balanced.
If anyone has an indication SE is fixing this, then you will humble those who have a problem with the stat system. Otherwise, there's no point in insulting us. Don't


Dunno about you but I find spells to be useful on my DoW jobs so - given that I can't replenish MP except at crystals with DoW - I actually think that it is important to add points to Piety Mind so I have a decent MP pool.



Edited, Sep 13th 2010 11:05am by Olorinus
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#82 Sep 13 2010 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
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@Slapaho (sorry, can't really quote easily on Android):
Your post is relevant to my interests. Just to confirm, are you saying that after 50 points put into VIT at level 10 that you stopped gaining HP? I haven't tested this or experienced it as I tend to favor other stats when my primary stat starts costing double.
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#83 Sep 13 2010 at 12:01 PM Rating: Excellent
TwistedOwl wrote:
DirectorCobbs wrote:
And some others will stick with DoM and increase DEX-VIT-INT-MND-PIE. Mages kinda get the shaft, they need dex for TP moves and Vit for health, etc.


Has anyone done some testing on that? Needing Dex for radiance & the other one? I haven't put one point into Dex as conjurer & hit ok with radiance. I miss more against tougher mobs, but I don't think it's drastically different than DoWs with loads of dex missing their weaponskills against similarly tough mobs.

Yeah, as it is now, the mage TP moves require DEX to be accurate.

And to the poster above me, MND increase MP, not Piety (last time i checked) :)
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#84 Sep 13 2010 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
DirectorCobbs wrote:
And some others will stick with DoM and increase DEX-VIT-INT-MND-PIE. Mages kinda get the shaft, they need dex for TP moves and Vit for health, etc.


Has anyone done some testing on that? Needing Dex for radiance & the other one? I haven't put one point into Dex as conjurer & hit ok with radiance. I miss more against tougher mobs, but I don't think it's drastically different than DoWs with loads of dex missing their weaponskills against similarly tough mobs.

Yeah, as it is now, the mage TP moves require DEX to be accurate.

And to the poster above me, MND increase MP, not Piety (last time i checked) :)


Der... you're right - I had a brain ****. Thanks for the correction - rate up.
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#85 Sep 13 2010 at 12:15 PM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:

Yeah, as it is now, the mage TP moves require DEX to be accurate.


I'd like to see more info on that, may have to mess with it myself. If it were really important to have DEX you'd think my radiance would rarely hit with the awesome 13 dex my roegadyn is rockin'
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#86 Sep 13 2010 at 12:17 PM Rating: Good
You could go to the conjurer/thaum threads, they've got threads talking about it (or it may have been on another forum, I don't remember).

And yes, their radiance not hitting is exactly what i and other have experienced, until we rose our Dex
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#87 Sep 13 2010 at 12:35 PM Rating: Good
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The way that redistributes are now, I'm thinking that it either means that skills do plateau off based on skill rank, or that they really do want us to be slightly gimped for X hours after switching classes. The first implies that stat points aren't all that important, and physical level starts to become irrelevant. The second implies that switching classes often and/or on the fly isn't going to be all that fun/useful.


Personally I'm all for the full switch in town/player house idea. or allowing us to pick which sets we're going to lose stats on when we redistribute. I hate right now, when I switch, I lose say 2 points from each stat. then I put them into say str/dex/vit. next time I redist, I'm going to lose 2 more of everything, including losing those from stats I want. For every 12 stats I gain back, only 6 of them I'm actually moving.
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#88 Sep 13 2010 at 12:46 PM Rating: Good
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DirectorCobbs wrote:
You could go to the conjurer/thaum threads, they've got threads talking about it (or it may have been on another forum, I don't remember).

And yes, their radiance not hitting is exactly what i and other have experienced, until we rose our Dex


Yeah I saw the thread in the thaumaturge forum. Mainly speculation and 1 person saying dex helped the TP moves with no testing information provided. So I'm not completely sold on the whole idea. And again, my conjurer with 13 dex that does pretty well using radiance puts a dent in the theory. Haven't seen enough to agree with "DEX is required for mages"...

Then there's the other worry that things change in the retail and a lot of our testing is all for naught...still fun though...


Edited, Sep 13th 2010 2:48pm by TwistedOwl
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#89 Sep 13 2010 at 12:49 PM Rating: Excellent
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I can attest to the Radiance requiring dex. Of coarse I do not have fancy screen shots so take my post with a grain of salt if you wish, but it is my experience.

On my new Open Beta char I went Lala Con/Tham and only put stat ups into INT, MND, PIE, and a few into VIT as I was duo/trio with friends most of the time.

I finally hit Rank10 con... got Radiance. Missed 10/10 radiance and was like WTH... then i thought about it and guessed it was Physical attack as i obviously swing my wand... so did my first ever re-assign and brought dex up from 14 to 25, and through other points into other places as normal. Out of the next 10 attempts I landed 8 Radiances. I would definitely say that dex plays a roll in that TP move connecting. (For the record we were fighting Moles near drybone that were conning blue/green to 2 rank 10 chars)
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#90 Sep 13 2010 at 12:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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Honestly, the current system is no good. It does defeat the purpose of having such easily switchable classes. It should just save your stats on each job. If you want to redo your stats on a certain job, then it can force you to wait 30 minutes per stat re-assign.
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#91 Sep 13 2010 at 1:08 PM Rating: Good
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edge1006 wrote:
I can attest to the Radiance requiring dex. Of coarse I do not have fancy screen shots so take my post with a grain of salt if you wish, but it is my experience.

On my new Open Beta char I went Lala Con/Tham and only put stat ups into INT, MND, PIE, and a few into VIT as I was duo/trio with friends most of the time.

I finally hit Rank10 con... got Radiance. Missed 10/10 radiance and was like WTH... then i thought about it and guessed it was Physical attack as i obviously swing my wand... so did my first ever re-assign and brought dex up from 14 to 25, and through other points into other places as normal. Out of the next 10 attempts I landed 8 Radiances. I would definitely say that dex plays a roll in that TP move connecting. (For the record we were fighting Moles near drybone that were conning blue/green to 2 rank 10 chars)


Interesting, 10/10 misses is pretty bad lol
I do remember radiance sucking more when I first got it, but now at conjurer19 it's much better without the dex. May go test some of this out now though...

Edited, Sep 13th 2010 3:08pm by TwistedOwl
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#92 Sep 13 2010 at 1:16 PM Rating: Good
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The way I think it should be is this...

Job 1: you pick your stats.

you switch to job 2 and all stats are reset the first time you go into a new job.

Job 2: you pick your stats.

You decide you want to go back to job 1 and all your stats from job 1 automatically switch to what you had them for job 1.(saves stats)

If you go back to job 2 then your stats should automatically switch to the stats you picked for job 2.



I really hate time sinks. and being a core mechanic of the game don't you ALL agree that this would make more sense?



PS: I don't think they should get rid of redistributing stat points because you might want to change them in the future or for situation purposes like if your fighting a certain mob and you need to reallocate your resistances or a certain stat than its all gravy.
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#93 Sep 13 2010 at 1:27 PM Rating: Good
I agree, but SE doesn't have any class-memory system in place. As it is, we have to manually rearm our abilities (or use a macro, but we still have to constantly change it as we level up), reallocate all of our stats over a 3 hours period, and so forth. I do understand why some aren't liking the current stat system. It's quite objectionably strange
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#94 Sep 14 2010 at 1:00 AM Rating: Decent
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When you change job, it sucks that you have to put the skills back on the bar lol.

About points, I wonder what some of them do. Peity and mind what the **** do they do? I've seen only a good increase at evading with points on dexterity, but magics didn't increase in points when I allocated points to mind...
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#95 Sep 14 2010 at 1:46 AM Rating: Good
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@Kaelia88
Quote:
@Slapaho (sorry, can't really quote easily on Android):
Your post is relevant to my interests. Just to confirm, are you saying that after 50 points put into VIT at level 10 that you stopped gaining HP? I haven't tested this or experienced it as I tend to favor other stats when my primary stat starts costing double.


Sorry for the late reply. Yeah I tested it. Class rank 10. If you put more than 50 points into a stat then everything after 50 doesn't help you what so ever. You virtually wasted them. VIT stops giving you HP. Now once you reach 11 I'm not sure what the points cap will be higher. I stopped playing the beta because I'm tired of throwing time at it just for it to be erased. People throwing all their stats into one thing are in for a rude awakening.

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 2:47am by Slapaho
#96 Sep 14 2010 at 5:20 AM Rating: Good
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sk1887 wrote:
When you change job, it sucks that you have to put the skills back on the bar lol.

About points, I wonder what some of them do. Peity and mind what the **** do they do? I've seen only a good increase at evading with points on dexterity, but magics didn't increase in points when I allocated points to mind...


Mind is your MP stat. Piety is Magic accuracy, Intelligence is magic power.
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lolgaxe wrote:
When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#97 Sep 14 2010 at 6:45 AM Rating: Default
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I think I might have said this before but I rarelly (if ever) see people considering this option...

The reason why SE has restricted the ammount of stats you can change at any one time is so that instead of the playerbase going for the somewhat Elitist practice of min/maxing their characters have that same playerbase consider a more average distribution of the points?
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#98 Sep 14 2010 at 6:53 AM Rating: Good
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The reason why SE has restricted the ammount of stats you can change at any one time is so that instead of the playerbase going for the somewhat Elitist practice of min/maxing their characters have that same playerbase consider a more average distribution of the points?

First of all, it's not elitist to want to get the most out of your character. Second, if that was their goal then they failed. The most it will do is make people level slower, or worse: make players quit the game in frustration. It currently is a pointless time sink.
#99 Sep 14 2010 at 7:18 AM Rating: Default
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Inida wrote:
Quote:
The reason why SE has restricted the ammount of stats you can change at any one time is so that instead of the playerbase going for the somewhat Elitist practice of min/maxing their characters have that same playerbase consider a more average distribution of the points?

First of all, it's not elitist to want to get the most out of your character. Second, if that was their goal then they failed. The most it will do is make people level slower, or worse: make players quit the game in frustration. It currently is a pointless time sink.


My quote "Elitist" as nothing to do how people view their own characters but how some espect or even demand certain things (equipment in FFXI, build traits in WoW) of other characters just so they can take part in events.

Personally I spent over a month preatty much doing nothing else but harvest in yagudo land (Sarutabaruta) to be able to buy Leaping Boots and Emperor's Hairpin but I was never hable to get Scorpion Harness for example... some people would say THF with no scorpion Harness, <no, thanks> and even if I had other average/good equipment that might not count for nothing with them.

Oince again, only as a possibility this might be a reason why SE is doing it this way, to try and prevent people from saying PUG with 35 INT? <No, thanks>.
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#100 Sep 14 2010 at 7:42 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I finally hit Rank10 con... got Radiance. Missed 10/10 radiance and was like WTH... then i thought about it and guessed it was Physical attack as i obviously swing my wand... so did my first ever re-assign and brought dex up from 14 to 25, and through other points into other places as normal. Out of the next 10 attempts I landed 8 Radiances. I would definitely say that dex plays a roll in that TP move connecting. (For the record we were fighting Moles near drybone that were conning blue/green to 2 rank 10 chars)


First of all, I do not say I don't believe you but take some things in mind:

- Putting 11 points in DEX and get an increase hit chance on radiance of 80% seems odd
- Most if not all skills "grow" with the increase of class level
- DoM having to focus on a melee class stat seems odd

- It seems logic that Radiance rely on DEX, basically you swing your stave

Again, I am not saying you are wrong, just questioning your test results :) If it is true, then SE either forget about this skill to make it rely on PIE stat or DoM classes are overpowered and needed to be toned down by stat allocation.


Edited, Sep 14th 2010 9:47am by Shoomy
#101 Sep 14 2010 at 7:53 AM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Rinsui wrote:
...and you forgot the best part about it.
It's a primitive excuse for a simple drag-and-drop based macro system.
Come on, typing command line parameters in a MMORPG... are we in 1980 or what?
It's a pretty powerful tool, but its implementation is horrible.

How about you use your drag and drop... I'll use my macros.
then I'll do things 50x faster than you. OK thanks.


Ayayay. Princess Peach didn't get enough Mario tonight, did she?

I never said anything against macros. I said they way you have
to set them up *manually* with a keyboard dependent syntax is
just, well... you know, even David Hasslehoff (spelling? well, he
definitely was a hassle, so...) didn't use a syntax to communicate
with his computer-car in 1980. That was 30 years ago.

But chances are you are too young to understand what I'm talking about.
That's ok. Eventually you'll understand there's a difference between
well-deserved loyalty to a great company and blind fanatism that makes
you shiver in extasy when thinking about the way how Tanaka's farts smell.
Hopefully.

And now, please do us all a favor and give Mario a call, ok?

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 10:18am by Rinsui
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