Forum Settings
       
1 2 3 Next »
This Forum is Read Only

Updates from pre-launch event * EnjoyFollow

#102 Sep 14 2010 at 4:09 PM Rating: Good
**
863 posts
Yeah it seems so, I am just surprised they've gone so far as to "design abilities with PvP in mind".
#103 Sep 14 2010 at 4:11 PM Rating: Excellent
***
3,825 posts
KarlHungis Delivers on Time wrote:
I guess it just depends on whether S-E likes money or not. Does the open beta have to look like an almost finished version of the product? No, it doesn't HAVE to, but if it did, it would probably lead to more sales right away. The fact that other companies seem to shoot for this goal and S-E doesn't, doesn't mean S-E is morally wrong, it just means they're not up to the same standard of excellence in this regard.


It's just that other companies have conformed to Open Beta meaning "free Demo" as opposed to meaning "Hey this is our loose mechanics attached to our near final graphical system, F around with them and show us our flaws so we can unleash the best semi-finished product we can at retail"

I've Beta'd a few games over the years (none on a professional basis, but a few since alpha stages and back in the day in very non-open tests) and it seems the trend in the last few years has quickly moved from "help us make a better game" to "hey look what we made, it's awesome... it's like crack try it try it, oh you want a bit mor chocolate flavor in your crack? We'll try to get that in our street version"
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#104 Sep 14 2010 at 4:27 PM Rating: Good
*
55 posts
im sold
thats it im 100% sold now.

NM's only thru guild leves made my day, and the fact that they will be HUGE makes it even more fun.
guess they really want us to party up when it comes to doing the much harder worth while leves.

all they need to do now is add a search to the bazaar and id be hooked for a long time.

tbh i didn't enjoy the beta much since there wasn't much u could do. after the first couple boring leve quests and that first story mission and the possiblilty of a wipe at the end of the week made me feel very unattached to my character.
sounds like the retail is going to be worth the wait.

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 6:30pm by nirtsbro
#105 Sep 14 2010 at 4:50 PM Rating: Decent
It's Just a Flesh Wound
******
22,699 posts
Told you all. Smiley: tongue

You can say "Why didn't they just implement it in OB" all you want, but it's silly to implement these easy changes into a testing phase that's only a few weeks long. And you can say "Why didn't they just tell us their plans earlier" well, you obviously expect SE to talk with their playerbase, which is a foolish mistake. :3 (They really should do it though.)
____________________________
Dear people I don't like: 凸(●´―`●)凸
#106 Sep 14 2010 at 5:02 PM Rating: Good
***
2,081 posts
Thank god they are taking a serious look at the UI and adding a hardware mouse. I think the poor UI was probably the number one thing that took away from the enjoyment of the game. Beyond the lag and lack of ingenuity, it just didn't feel right. I am looking forward to experiencing these changes. I am also happy to hear that they are adding NM's, but disappointed to see that there will be no "open-air" NM's. For me, that will take away a bit of the excitement of the game. I see no reason why they couldn't have both "open-air" and instanced NM's. Two other things I hope they work on is 1) adding some variation to the zones. They seem quite uniform. I think so far I much prefer the zones in XI, they somehow felt much more magical. Then 2) I hope they allow for 100% stat reallocation in town. As it stands now with only 20% allowable reallocation, is it feasible to have a single character if you want to play all the classes effectively?


Anyway, good stuff and glad to see SE is taking notes. Let's see just how studious they have been ; )
____________________________


#107 Sep 14 2010 at 5:24 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Deadgye wrote:
Told you all. Smiley: tongue

You can say "Why didn't they just implement it in OB" all you want, but it's silly to implement these easy changes into a testing phase that's only a few weeks long. And you can say "Why didn't they just tell us their plans earlier" well, you obviously expect SE to talk with their playerbase, which is a foolish mistake. :3 (They really should do it though.)
Again, they haven't actually done anything yet. This is just talking about what they plan to do. They may still not follow through on all of the points, it may still take a significant amount of time for this these fixes to all roll out, it may come out by release date. It still remains to be seen. I hope they fix these issues ASAP. Will be anxious to see what happens. It's a bold list of promises and I hope they follow through.

And I still do say "why didn't they implement this in OB" because, yes, it's a short testing phase, but it's the first chance the public at large got to get their hands on the game, and it was rife with problems. So what if it's only a 3 week phase? The client from Open Beta is what will be tweaked into the release client anyway. Why NOT add the fixes as soon as possible? If they had delivered some of what they're promising for the release clients 3 weeks earlier, the Open Beta would have been a massive hit and preorder rates would be drastically higher. Fixing the UI up and enabling the hardware mouse would be the difference between "well this game is kinda frustrating to play right now but they're on the right track and hopefully they'll fix it soon" and "I can't f*cking wait for the 22nd!" for a lot of people, and that's where the sales would be doing much better.



Edited, Sep 14th 2010 6:33pm by bsphil
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#108 Sep 14 2010 at 5:43 PM Rating: Decent
*
62 posts
Awesome update from SE, even if not everything gets implemented right away.

Most importantly, it shows what direction the game is going to go after launch and what parts of the game they're improving (UI, economy, grouping, questing).

Most of my interest in this game stemmed from the fact that the FFXI team was making, as that was an amazing game for its time (and still holds up today). Looks like this will be well worth the rough beta.
#109 Sep 14 2010 at 5:45 PM Rating: Good
2 posts
After reading what SE had to say reassured me in playing FFXIV.
#110 Sep 14 2010 at 5:47 PM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
*
77 posts
Quote:
Again, they haven't actually done anything yet. This is just talking about what they plan to do. They may still not follow through on all of the points, it may still take a significant amount of time for this these fixes to all roll out, it may come out by release date. It still remains to be seen. I hope they fix these issues ASAP. Will be anxious to see what happens. It's a bold list of promises and I hope they follow through.

And I still do say "why didn't they implement this in OB" because, yes, it's a short testing phase, but it's the first chance the public at large got to get their hands on the game, and it was rife with problems. So what if it's only a 3 week phase? The client from Open Beta is what will be tweaked into the release client anyway. Why NOT add the fixes as soon as possible? If they had delivered some of what they're promising for the release clients 3 weeks earlier, the Open Beta would have been a massive hit and preorder rates would be drastically higher. Fixing the UI up and enabling the hardware mouse would be the difference between "well this game is kinda frustrating to play right now but they're on the right track and hopefully they'll fix it soon" and "I can't f*cking wait for the 22nd!" for a lot of people, and that's where the sales would be doing much better.


just in general. you realize their pre-order has already done insanely well? here in japan CE is already SOLD OUT EVERYWHERE. i was lucky to find a copy. SE is also selling very very well.

also, you have to realize that they are testing things on their own end. they "listened" to the feedback and tested it. A lot of the stuff they seem to be adding on release will be a HUGE thing. the Open Beta was NOT a free trial. it was ONLY a stress test for the SERVERS. To see if all **** would break loose. so when people say "its just beta" what it really means is "they are not going to be working on general game mechanics but mostly server issues" game mechanics they will test on their end and probably hold for release so we have something to "look forward too"

also. with all the recent server issues (lag etc.) you probably have to realize they had their hands full. I think anyone in network administration would tell you things are as easy as it looks from your point of view. In their mind, they already sold the game, and its true. They probably know the pre-order estimate, and went from there. It IS a business.

I understand the aggravation, the retainer system not having a search ****** me off too..however i made a lot of money selling shards only, i got some fun armor pieces, even with the broken system. I might of gotten a better deal if i had a search, but i didnt wanna blow my time so i just grabbed what i could first. Just wanted to try it on anyways. And it IS true it might be a MONTH or 2 before we see the FULL extent of all these updates, not because some sort of conspiracy, but due to testing, implementing and not wanting to ***** something up.

That being said, I am psyched to see this game grow now because if they DO pull through (which, i kinda think they will out of my own optimism). This game is going to be a lot of fun.


also...many people might buy the game now just due to the "hope" factor...meaning they are trying to trick people into coming. If they gave us all they promised and it was not enough, they would just lose. So by promising stuff we have not seen yet, people will believe and buy it (like me haha). Maybe they WILL crap on our heads...lets just hope not because I am paying for this game. And all that matters is my own happiness ;P
#111 Sep 14 2010 at 5:54 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
orenji13 wrote:
also, you have to realize that they are testing things on their own end. they "listened" to the feedback and tested it. A lot of the stuff they seem to be adding on release will be a HUGE thing. the Open Beta was NOT a free trial. it was ONLY a stress test for the SERVERS. To see if all **** would break loose. so when people say "its just beta" what it really means is "they are not going to be working on general game mechanics but mostly server issues" game mechanics they will test on their end and probably hold for release so we have something to "look forward too"
Stress testing servers is fine, but by that point the UI issues should for the most part be fixed and done with. Sitting and waiting on core UI fixes so we have something to look forward to is rampantly stupid.

Sitting and waiting on content and storyline so we have something to look forward to? Absolutely understandable and acceptable.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#112 Sep 14 2010 at 5:56 PM Rating: Decent
*
81 posts
It's wonderful to hear they plan to make these changes. Open beta and the forums has done it's job to alert them to how the players feel about the game and its mechanics, and thankfully, they've listened.

As we draw closer to release day, I get more and more anxious to play the real thing!

Whoo hoo! Kudos to Square Enix!

And to you naysayers who still stay "well they haven't done it yet - don't count on it", you all need to have a little faith. Really.

~M~
____________________________
Just Play - Have Fun!
#113 Sep 14 2010 at 6:08 PM Rating: Good
*
56 posts
While I had every intention of testing out retail before making a decision on the game, I'm really happy with the prospect of the updates.
Thanks for the translation.
#114 Sep 14 2010 at 6:08 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
77 posts
Quote:
UI issues


That is very very true. the UI was clunky. Server side UI is...crazy but i think it might be a way of them trying to thwart 3rd party stuff? (this is just a theory...)

However that improved drastically and now I have very little lag (except for selling crap to a vendor. dear god that is a nightmare) but..to me...it is not much slower then FFXI. Also, beta 123 people will tell you its still a huge increase from before. Not saying perfect.

I dont know how much of it is sitting and waiting on it and maybe (just maybe) not enough time? 3 weeks seems long, but its not to them. UI fixes (adding a retainer search etc) is a lot of programming, new art(ui art) and testing. MAYBE it was just a time issue, but i think it is true they were sitting on it. I am sure 90% of the retail players played the beta and were like "ooo beta ****" and just put it down waiting for release. Thats where when it comes down to it, they are getting the crap done they need to and the crap they "need too" for release. I just hope that as a CE player i am not in one more week of beta if you know what i mean hahaha.
All that matters now is what happens AFTER i fork over my 100$ (***** you weak american dollar!) hopefully what they do with that money will involve more then a night of drinking...haha
#115 Sep 14 2010 at 6:33 PM Rating: Good
***
2,120 posts
Great news all around here. I guess I was one of the few that didn't think the 48hr cooldown was a big deal...but if they're gonna allow me to do GLs more often I'll definitely take advantage.

I was already liking where the game was going and this news helps a ton. Bring on the 22nd...
____________________________

#116 Sep 14 2010 at 6:37 PM Rating: Good
***
1,636 posts
well they 180'd again and said that guild leves are supposed to be the main source of leveling exp, so they kinda had to lower the cooldown on leves.
____________________________


#117 Sep 14 2010 at 6:45 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
orenji13 wrote:
I am sure 90% of the retail players played the beta and were like "ooo beta ****" and just put it down waiting for release. Thats where when it comes down to it, they are getting the crap done they need to and the crap they "need too" for release. I just hope that as a CE player i am not in one more week of beta if you know what i mean hahaha.
Yeah, that's pretty much exactly why I canceled my preorder. I don't want to spend my first month or two finishing the beta testing that SE should have finished 2 weeks ago. I'll let the remainder of you paying customers put up with that and I'll jump on board later when everything is running at an official release quality.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#118 Sep 14 2010 at 6:49 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
386 posts
Can you elaborate for me on what "official release" quality is supposed to be? Maybe I don't get around enough, but I can't recall an MMO that was completely perfect, oozing with content without bugs or hiccups, with lollipops and rainbows falling out of the sky at release.

It's fine to say you'd rather wait for more updates before purchasing, but to insinuate that FFXIV (or any other MMO for that matter) should be flawless at release is unfathomable to me.
#119 Sep 14 2010 at 6:55 PM Rating: Excellent
****
6,470 posts
Lots of good news in this thread! Smiley: yippee

Quote:
By passing a certain condition, "class quests" will become available at guilds. Class quests are of course related directly to the class itself, but at the same time are a way to truly learn the details of each city-state. Please enjoy the story revealed in these quests, in addition to the quest rewards themselves.
When you complete a quest, you will receive Guild Tokens [marks?]. We are planning to add more and more things to exchange tokens for.


This (among other things) is great news to me. If it's anything like FFXI, this'll really help flesh out the classes and make them all feel really unique. I loved the job backstories in FFXI.




I still feel like they're cruising out of control with this "no AH" thing, though. I have a feeling it's not going to work out like they seem to think it will... Smiley: twocents

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 8:57pm by Eske
____________________________
Latest Articles:
Monaco: What's Yours is Mine Review

Follow me on Twitter!
#120 Sep 14 2010 at 6:56 PM Rating: Good
*
57 posts
I almost want to stop playing beta so I can build up my anxiousness for what will appear to be a somewhat different game come release day.

/excited
#121 Sep 14 2010 at 7:12 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
ThePacster wrote:
Can you elaborate for me on what "official release" quality is supposed to be? Maybe I don't get around enough, but I can't recall an MMO that was completely perfect, oozing with content without bugs or hiccups, with lollipops and rainbows falling out of the sky at release.

It's fine to say you'd rather wait for more updates before purchasing, but to insinuate that FFXIV (or any other MMO for that matter) should be flawless at release is unfathomable to me.
Why does everyone assume that when I say an acceptable release quality must mean "absolute flawless perfection and gobs of content"? NO. Nice strawman though.

I made a graph of this a week ago back when everyone first started ******** themselves at the complaint threads about canceling preorders. There is no objective definition of what release quality should be, it's a subjective opinion. The UI should be fast, the 3d rendering should be optimized, the hardware mouse should be there (it IS there and has been for a while but SE doesn't want to let us use it)... I'm not saying that the game should be perfect and done, and in fact I'm saying nothing at all about the amount of content available. The interface and core game features should be fairly complete and not need any drastic overhauls or fixes. Further tweaking is perfectly acceptable after release, but not having the UI functioning properly by the release date isn't acceptable for me. All of the storylines and quests can be rolled out in time.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#122 Sep 14 2010 at 7:15 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
**
386 posts
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that when I say an acceptable release quality must mean "absolute flawless perfection and gobs of content"? NO. Nice strawman though.


No need to get hostile, I'm not strawmaning anything. I'd wanted you to be clear about what you're saying so it is not taken the wrong way as it apparently was by me. Thank you for clarifying yourself, and I agree with your sentiment.
#123 Sep 14 2010 at 7:17 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
**
751 posts
bsphil wrote:
ThePacster wrote:
Can you elaborate for me on what "official release" quality is supposed to be? Maybe I don't get around enough, but I can't recall an MMO that was completely perfect, oozing with content without bugs or hiccups, with lollipops and rainbows falling out of the sky at release.

It's fine to say you'd rather wait for more updates before purchasing, but to insinuate that FFXIV (or any other MMO for that matter) should be flawless at release is unfathomable to me.
Why does everyone assume that when I say an acceptable release quality must mean "absolute flawless perfection and gobs of content"? NO. Nice strawman though.

I made a graph of this a week ago back when everyone first started sh*tting themselves at the complaint threads about canceling preorders. There is no objective definition of what release quality should be, it's a subjective opinion. The UI should be fast, the 3d rendering should be optimized, the hardware mouse should be there (it IS there and has been for a while but SE doesn't want to let us use it)... I'm not saying that the game should be perfect and done, and in fact I'm saying nothing at all about the amount of content available. The interface and core game features should be fairly complete and not need any drastic overhauls or fixes. Further tweaking is perfectly acceptable after release, but not having the UI functioning properly by the release date isn't acceptable for me. All of the storylines and quests can be rolled out in time.


There is an absolutely justifiable reason why there is no hardware mouse and the UI is clunky and slow.

Its BETA!!!! SE server sided functionality in order to better identify how people play the game. This helps them optimise functionality on release. If this is client side, the capture and analysis of information is far more difficult.

As it is beta, SE use this time as an opportunity to work out how to improve retail release. Unfortunately, for some weeks everyone has been slamming the game for things that are entirely expected in Beta. I commend SE for having the bottle to do things there way in the face of forum outcry - it will lead to a better game in the long run!
____________________________
FFXIV: Crafty Hallie, Ultros





#124 Sep 14 2010 at 7:22 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
*****
12,707 posts
bsphil wrote:
ThePacster wrote:
Can you elaborate for me on what "official release" quality is supposed to be? Maybe I don't get around enough, but I can't recall an MMO that was completely perfect, oozing with content without bugs or hiccups, with lollipops and rainbows falling out of the sky at release.

It's fine to say you'd rather wait for more updates before purchasing, but to insinuate that FFXIV (or any other MMO for that matter) should be flawless at release is unfathomable to me.
Why does everyone assume that when I say an acceptable release quality must mean "absolute flawless perfection and gobs of content"? NO. Nice strawman though.

I made a graph of this a week ago back when everyone first started sh*tting themselves at the complaint threads about canceling preorders. There is no objective definition of what release quality should be, it's a subjective opinion. The UI should be fast, the 3d rendering should be optimized, the hardware mouse should be there (it IS there and has been for a while but SE doesn't want to let us use it)... I'm not saying that the game should be perfect and done, and in fact I'm saying nothing at all about the amount of content available. The interface and core game features should be fairly complete and not need any drastic overhauls or fixes. Further tweaking is perfectly acceptable after release, but not having the UI functioning properly by the release date isn't acceptable for me. All of the storylines and quests can be rolled out in time.


It didn't seem like a strawman, it's basically expecting it to be a DEMO more than a phase of game development which has issues and will continue to have issues till the game goes out, and all MMOs get a post launch patch that fixes any unresolved issues during it's beta. (if its not a glorified demo)

It is completed, it's just not fine tuned (nothing really is but they've been fine tuning things almost daily since OB began) which is what seems to be all thats left with the game..fine tuning which is something thats done over time with MMOs, but they already confirmed most peoples fears and will work on it.
____________________________

#125 Sep 14 2010 at 7:22 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
ThePacster wrote:
Quote:
Why does everyone assume that when I say an acceptable release quality must mean "absolute flawless perfection and gobs of content"? NO. Nice strawman though.


No need to get hostile, I'm not strawmaning anything. I'd wanted you to be clear about what you're saying so it is not taken the wrong way as it apparently was by me. Thank you for clarifying yourself, and I agree with your sentiment.
Sorry, I've had to clarify myself probably a half dozen times at least, all because whenever I'd say "the core of the game should be running smoother than this" everyone who adamantly defends the game tends to jump out and yell "You want the game to be 100% flawless by the release date and overflowing with content?! That's markedly unreasonable, you daft man, which makes the point you just made completely invalid!" as if that's in any remote way what I just said.

It's aggravating; particularly I'm critical of the game because I'm not happy with it right now and I want it to be better so I can enjoy playing it with my friends. So when people dismiss my requests by blowing what I say way out of proportion... yeah.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#126 Sep 14 2010 at 7:29 PM Rating: Good
Sage
***
1,500 posts
KarlHungis Delivers on Time wrote:
I guess it just depends on whether S-E likes money or not. Does the open beta have to look like an almost finished version of the product? No, it doesn't HAVE to, but if it did, it would probably lead to more sales right away. The fact that other companies seem to shoot for this goal and S-E doesn't, doesn't mean S-E is morally wrong, it just means they're not up to the same standard of excellence in this regard.
I see where you are coming from and while I respect your opinion, I have to say that I strongly disagree with this point.

Beta testing is a critical step in the early life of a program, it make or brake it's initial development, if you use it only as a commercial strategy, the chance to learn the real needs of your customers it's gone.

We have to consider that it's very different having something and try to realize how necessary it could be if you don't have it, than having the necessity itself and try to think your way out of it, the latter provides a better base to improve a product than the former.

It's a fact that they are listening, the main issues that we have been talking about the last 2 weeks are right there, however before jumping into no-game-will-be-like-FFXIV type of mentality, I will sit calmly here waiting for the retail, just then I will form a new opinion.

Although good news, are good news indeed.

Ken
____________________________
"Maybe it means: you're the evil man, and I'm the righteous man, and Mr. Nine-millimeter here, he's the shepherd protecting my righteous *** in the Valley of Darkness." - Jules.
FFXIV: Mabel Rand (Gugnir)
FFXI: Kenage, retired.
K&K forever!,
#127 Sep 14 2010 at 7:33 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
kenage wrote:
KarlHungis Delivers on Time wrote:
I guess it just depends on whether S-E likes money or not. Does the open beta have to look like an almost finished version of the product? No, it doesn't HAVE to, but if it did, it would probably lead to more sales right away. The fact that other companies seem to shoot for this goal and S-E doesn't, doesn't mean S-E is morally wrong, it just means they're not up to the same standard of excellence in this regard.
I see where you are coming from and while I respect your opinion, I have to say that I strongly disagree with this point.

Beta testing is a critical step in the early life of a program, it make or brake it's initial development, if you use it only as a commercial strategy, the chance to learn the real needs of your customers it's gone.

We have to consider that it's very different having something and try to realize how necessary it could be if you don't have it, than having the necessity itself and try to think your way out of it, the latter provides a better base to improve a product than the former.

It's a fact that they are listening, the main issues that we have been talking about the last 2 weeks are right there, however before jumping into no-game-will-be-like-FFXIV type of mentality, I will sit calmly here waiting for the retail, just then I will form a new opinion.

Although good news, are good news indeed.

Ken
For the alpha and closed beta testing periods, yes, I agree with you completely on that point. That's the reason why the NDA existed - the game was in a testing phase and did not accurately represent the final product at that point. Negative press about an alpha testing phase or a closed beta testing phase is completely unfair, as that is SE extending a hand to a handful of its customers to assist in refining the game. I would expect that once it reaches open beta (literally meaning that it is open for the public at large to test) they have most of those issues resolved. Lag from server stressing is fair, but it should take days not weeks of work to sort that out. Open beta in Aion for example had ridiculously bad lag for the first couple days, but the dev team addressed it immediately and after that it was nice and smooth. The gameplay was essentially finished - little changed by the actual release because that was already taken care of (unless I'm remembering incorrectly, but IIRC playing on release day was near identical to playing in the open beta, except with more people).



Edited, Sep 14th 2010 8:41pm by bsphil
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#128 Sep 14 2010 at 7:38 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
**
751 posts
What we have here is failure to communicate. Some men you just cant reach!

The internet provides everyone a voice and forum to air their grievances about anything they choose to vent about. It also gives voice and forum to people who have absolutely no idea what they are talking about.

Now I am not commenting on any individual so I will use me as an example.

In my work life, I have had occasion to be involved in several significant IT implementaion projects (I am not an IT person but hold a snr mgt position). As a result, whilst I know a little about software implementation/development, I know nothing about game development.

So, I apply my experience to my understanding of game development and form a view on the role of a beta test, and of development more generally, combine that with my experiences of game beta testing and then express opinions.

Everyone else does the same. I suspect very few posters on this site have any real understanding of exactly what SE have sought to achieve with this beta - but i guarantee you SE know.

Much of the criticism is being addressed. We do not know whether or not there is a magical set of disks and servers that reflect a game 100 times better than the beta we are playing (probably not, but there might be).

We dont know whether beta is intended to reflect current status, or status 3 months ago which has been significantly improved at SE headquarters.

We know very, very little. Unfortunately there are those that shout loudest on forums (who generally are people that know/understand the least). The sad fact is that these people are given a voice despite their ignorance.

Thankfully, all will be revealed next week. Unfortunately, many people who might have had a great time in this game wont play because of their ignorance of software development phases - i feel sorry for them.
____________________________
FFXIV: Crafty Hallie, Ultros





#129 Sep 14 2010 at 7:40 PM Rating: Good
*
94 posts
Now that we have finally gotten quotable feedback from SE, I am extremely pleased with the direction the game is going and I can better understand a little about why they've been so quite. They couldve very easily over promised to sell copies and would have been crucified if they didnt follow through. Honestly since playing and listening to SE from alpha, I sort of expected that they are slowly but surely moving the PR in a different direction from XI. Sure they may not have answered the 2000++ UI/etc complaint threads directly but its obvious they heard us. If anything it took some major cajones to sit on that stage, man up, look the crowd in the eyes to apologize about the UI. A BIG +2 to the whole team for that. I feel the appology was unnecessary but really set a nice tone for the the upcoming years. Guaranteed it wasnt an easy thing to say especially coming from Japanese developers who usually as a society would never admit they were wrong in any way. Im still fairly shocked to hear that tbh

Anyways, Im happy and the vast majority of issues I had were all addressed. The 22nd cant come soon enough!

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 9:42pm by KingRaul
#130 Sep 14 2010 at 8:37 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
77 posts
Quote:
If anything it took some major cajones to sit on that stage, man up, look the crowd in the eyes to apologize about the UI. A BIG +2 to the whole team for that.


Thats actually huge in Japan. (weird as it is) I should go watch the video but i didnt have time.

You could be selling fake eel (this happened a few years back) or something like fake beef. If you get caught they do a huge public apology. For a company here to make a public apology is a HUGE thing and isn't some crappy thing. (i mean, you apologize for that crap and its all ok some how...obviously there is more but thast the big part)

Just wanted to let you know that, Japanese business culture is like that.
Should mean we will see large improvements in that section then.
#131 Sep 14 2010 at 8:49 PM Rating: Decent
*
205 posts
i really really want to know abt chocobo... its a FF game how can SE not talk abt chocobo
____________________________
I'm Xabac/Sleepymagi from FFXI Odin Server, if u hate/love me send me a /tell.
#132 Sep 14 2010 at 9:13 PM Rating: Excellent
1 post
For those asking for the source, 90% of it was from me personally. I translated the original official report (link) when it was posted almost immediately after the live stream ended. A few hours later, they posted the official translation (link), which has a few extra points but is missing a few as well.

Hope everyone enjoyed the info, I'm happy to help translate whenever I can :)

okuRaku

Edited, Sep 14th 2010 11:16pm by okuRaku
#133 Sep 14 2010 at 9:21 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
okuRaku wrote:
For those asking for the source, 90% of it was from me personally. I translated the original official report (link) when it was posted almost immediately after the live stream ended. A few hours later, they posted the official translation (link), which has a few extra points but is missing a few as well.

Hope everyone enjoyed the info, I'm happy to help translate whenever I can :)

okuRaku
Thank you, I appreciate the assistance.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#134 Sep 14 2010 at 9:34 PM Rating: Default
**
265 posts
So no word on what the deal with Musketeer and Arcanist is?

Also, as someone else mentioned... I was kind of hoping to get a little info about chocobos and how they worked in this game.
#135 Sep 14 2010 at 9:47 PM Rating: Good
Avatar
***
1,416 posts
bsphil wrote:


Open beta in Aion for example had ridiculously bad lag for the first couple days, but the dev team addressed it immediately and after that it was nice and smooth. The gameplay was essentially finished - little changed by the actual release because that was already taken care of (unless I'm remembering incorrectly, but IIRC playing on release day was near identical to playing in the open beta, except with more people).


To be fair, Aion had already been out for a year or so. I was playing Aion (released version) on a chinese server months before the NA beta started. Korea already had the first major patch.


/derail off.




Edited, Sep 14th 2010 11:48pm by Teneleven
____________________________

#136 Sep 14 2010 at 9:52 PM Rating: Decent
It's Just a Flesh Wound
******
22,699 posts
Quote:
Open beta in Aion for example had ridiculously bad lag for the first couple days, but the dev team addressed it immediately and after that it was nice and smooth. The gameplay was essentially finished - little changed by the actual release because that was already taken care of (unless I'm remembering incorrectly, but IIRC playing on release day was near identical to playing in the open beta, except with more people).


NA Open beta? Pretty sure Aion was already released in NK before NA open beta started. As for the actual subject; I suppose I could have been wrong but I assumed that the UI was going to be client side in retail.
____________________________
Dear people I don't like: 凸(●´―`●)凸
#137 Sep 14 2010 at 9:58 PM Rating: Good
***
1,636 posts
Quote:
So no word on what the deal with Musketeer and Arcanist is?


The word is that there will not be any additional classes on release. Most people seem to think that they are likely to have something to do with the story, and the classes will probably be patched in or added in the next expansion.
____________________________


#138 Sep 14 2010 at 9:59 PM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
**
441 posts
I love how they plan to integrate leves involving DOW/DOM's with DOL/DOH. This is going to really change the dynamics of party action.

Imagine: the instance involves an aerial battle, where some party members are fending off attacks whilst the crafters are busy repairing the airship...they run out of materials, so the DOM/DOW members take down parts of an inorganic monster, which is then used to repair the ship etc...or a major boss is immune to attacks except from weapons made from his own body parts, so everyone concentrates on taking down piece by piece to build weapons.

Or you could be working towards a festival in the game, so you have the DOLs out there gathering materials and working with DOHs cooking and preparing the materials etc, hopefully SE integrate the disciplines so that each has its usefulness in-game.

The diversity will really make levelling more classes viable, and that's a good thing.
____________________________
War 75 Nin75 Sam75
#139 Sep 14 2010 at 10:46 PM Rating: Good
Edited by bsphil
******
21,739 posts
Sorry, mistaken about Aion then.

I guess if that's what it takes to get a MMO up to a decent state, I'll just never play a MMO from the release date. ¯\(º_o)/¯ Doesn't seem worth the hassle.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#140 Sep 14 2010 at 10:56 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
24 posts
Nice! Well this is encouraging. There's still hope! haha
#141 Sep 14 2010 at 11:49 PM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
**
626 posts
Quote:
It's more like the fact it IS still a beta and they ARE still taking feedback they're actually incorporating it before release or shortly after like you should with a beta. You generally don't see changes when you play a demo of an MMO.

not that i disagree with you, but i think the original point of that particular matter is that about a month ago SE was 100% adamant in sticking up for their idea of 8/48 guildleve system even though (and they were very aware of this) message boards and interviewers alike were complaining about the very idea. yet they still stuck by it all the way up until the very end of OB. (this was for those that dont follow interviews so much)
But my point is that they basicly said the 8/48 system is set in stone and there is no need for any other testing as far as that goes. obviously they were wrong.

Quote:
If anything it took some major cajones to sit on that stage, man up, look the crowd in the eyes to apologize about the UI


thats literally the first thing that came into my head when i read on twitter that they are addressing player feedback concerns. i was like wow right on stage in front of the same people who are hating on them, hey right on in my book.

Edited, Sep 15th 2010 1:54am by pixelpop

Edited, Sep 15th 2010 1:56am by pixelpop
____________________________

#142 Sep 15 2010 at 3:57 AM Rating: Decent
**
863 posts
Dik wrote:
I love how they plan to integrate leves involving DOW/DOM's with DOL/DOH. This is going to really change the dynamics of party action.

Imagine: the instance involves an aerial battle, where some party members are fending off attacks whilst the crafters are busy repairing the airship...they run out of materials, so the DOM/DOW members take down parts of an inorganic monster, which is then used to repair the ship etc...or a major boss is immune to attacks except from weapons made from his own body parts, so everyone concentrates on taking down piece by piece to build weapons.

Or you could be working towards a festival in the game, so you have the DOLs out there gathering materials and working with DOHs cooking and preparing the materials etc, hopefully SE integrate the disciplines so that each has its usefulness in-game.

The diversity will really make levelling more classes viable, and that's a good thing.


Wow, having these types of scenarios would be a dream come true. :)

#143 Sep 15 2010 at 5:03 AM Rating: Decent
****
9,043 posts
AbstinNence wrote:
After reading what SE had to say reassured me in playing FFXIV.


This.

I've pre-ordered the game again.

I was really disappointed with the beta and didn't expect any of the issues to be addressed any time soon. The amount of silence was worrying.

But this has reassured me. It's not like I didn't WANT to play the game... I just didn't want to play a game on the same level as the beta.

Kudos to SE for listening, and acting on people's comments. It's a refreshing change.
____________________________
Likibiki ~ 75 WHM ~ 75 SAM ~ 75 THF ~ 75 SMN ~ 74 NIN
Pandemonium Server, FFXI. Retired. Gone but not forgotten.
Cailey ~ 90 DNC ~ 90 RDM ~ 90 BLM
Asura Server, FFXI. Adventurer Extraordinaire.
#144 Sep 15 2010 at 9:49 AM Rating: Excellent
PerrinofSylph wrote:
KarlHungis Delivers on Time wrote:
I guess it just depends on whether S-E likes money or not. Does the open beta have to look like an almost finished version of the product? No, it doesn't HAVE to, but if it did, it would probably lead to more sales right away. The fact that other companies seem to shoot for this goal and S-E doesn't, doesn't mean S-E is morally wrong, it just means they're not up to the same standard of excellence in this regard.


It's just that other companies have conformed to Open Beta meaning "free Demo" as opposed to meaning "Hey this is our loose mechanics attached to our near final graphical system, F around with them and show us our flaws so we can unleash the best semi-finished product we can at retail"

I've Beta'd a few games over the years (none on a professional basis, but a few since alpha stages and back in the day in very non-open tests) and it seems the trend in the last few years has quickly moved from "help us make a better game" to "hey look what we made, it's awesome... it's like crack try it try it, oh you want a bit mor chocolate flavor in your crack? We'll try to get that in our street version"


Serious work on a game is what Closed Beta is for. That's why it's closed, so people can't freely distribute information that makes you look bad when the game is clearly meant to be a work in progress. Open Beta is for showing off what you've accomplished and getting last minute feedback before launch. It's not really the time when you should still be working on the things that you were getting feedback about at the start of beta (although I'd rather see them working on that stuff in open beta than not working on it at all, so I am encouraged at least).

It's true that Open Beta has turned into a marketing tool more than a serious development tool, but there are great reasons for that.

Edited, Sep 15th 2010 11:53am by KarlHungis
1 2 3 Next »
This forum is read only
This Forum is Read Only!
Recent Visitors: 21 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (21)