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#52 Sep 26 2010 at 1:11 PM Rating: Excellent
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
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I've hit a dreadful wall with my crafting. Anything listed as requiring a rank of 11 or higher is destroying me with DoH classes at rank 11.


We're still learning what level these synths are. SE only listed ranges (1-10, 11-20 etc), not specific skill levels. So we put in 11 as a temporary placeholder for the 11-20 range, and also to mark it's tier.

Once people start learning the actual skill levels, we'll update them to reflect that and not just their general range.

It was either that, or just have a huge jumbled mess of recipes which give no hint as to their even general range.


I'm using a different list that shows explicit values for the ranges, but it looks like they're showing minimum rank for the synthesis, not the "break even" rank. Right now, Undyed Hempen Cloth is shown as a rank 7 synthesis and at rank 9 my failure rate is still about 2 out of 3 attempts.
#53 Sep 26 2010 at 1:24 PM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:

I'm using a different list that shows explicit values for the ranges, but it looks like they're showing minimum rank for the synthesis, not the "break even" rank. Right now, Undyed Hempen Cloth is shown as a rank 7 synthesis and at rank 9 my failure rate is still about 2 out of 3 attempts.


Try using the facilities for the support on those. I can make yarn anywhere no problem, but rarely fail on cloth if I go to the camp or guild. Made some hempen cowls from scratch starting with the moko grass thanks to the support...

However I have the same problem with an alchemy recipe, turning crystals into shards. Most say level8...I'm 10 and with support I can barely pull it off. 1/4 last night before quitting and that 1 was extremely lucky. Even tried the secondary tool and upgraded the main to a copper alembic.
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#54 Sep 26 2010 at 1:34 PM Rating: Excellent
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On one hand, I do expect bugs and glitches and lag in the first month or three of an MMORPG, but we can't really base a game in 2010 on what games had 6-10 years ago. The way the gaming industry is now, there's a lot of competition for everything. New games are entering a market where they NEED to compete with existing products to draw in players.

Doom didn't have strafing, but would players be okay if Halo Reach was released without Strafing?
Gothic 1 had less than half a dozen armor options, and the combat system was terribly clunky. Would the same thing be acceptable in Oblivion?
Warcraft 1 only allowed you to select a maximum of 4 units at once; would a modern RTS that did this be okay?
Diablo 1 only had 3 class options and no gender or appearance customization options. Would this fly in Diablo 3?

I expect new MMORPGs to have rough launches, but there are some features that are just so integral on such a basic level to not just a game's success, but playing the game at all, that they really should be included at launch, not added in later. The fact that a game 5-10 years old didn't have that feature is not a good reason to not include it in a game in 2010.

I never expected perfection at launch, and anyone that did is a fool. But there are just some features that a game needs.

I also strongly feel like the game was rushed ahead of schedule. The September release caught everyone by surprise, and I'm guessing that SE's programmers were caught by surprise too. I feel like this game has been aimed at late November or early December, and that this September thing was dropped into people's laps at the last moment on their end. I can't imagine the stress that -they- must be going through trying to get a game "ready for release", 4 days after launch.
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#55 Sep 26 2010 at 2:29 PM Rating: Good
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Solution:

1) Put in an Auction House
2) Put in a trade chat and/or city-wide chat
3) Put in Mailboxes
4) Put in a more simple & smooth trade function
5) Make the retainers ****** off

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#56 Sep 26 2010 at 2:29 PM Rating: Excellent
TwistedOwl wrote:
The One and Only Aurelius wrote:

I'm using a different list that shows explicit values for the ranges, but it looks like they're showing minimum rank for the synthesis, not the "break even" rank. Right now, Undyed Hempen Cloth is shown as a rank 7 synthesis and at rank 9 my failure rate is still about 2 out of 3 attempts.


Try using the facilities for the support on those. I can make yarn anywhere no problem, but rarely fail on cloth if I go to the camp or guild. Made some hempen cowls from scratch starting with the moko grass thanks to the support...

However I have the same problem with an alchemy recipe, turning crystals into shards. Most say level8...I'm 10 and with support I can barely pull it off. 1/4 last night before quitting and that 1 was extremely lucky. Even tried the secondary tool and upgraded the main to a copper alembic.


Ya, I have to correct my previous statement that I've spent zero gold on crafting so far...facilities rentals I tend to forget about. And the list I was referring to, on closer inspection, actually shows rank 5 for the cloth, even though I still need common facilities at rank 10 to be able to get a good success rate. The list shows cotton yarn as a rank 10 synth, and it requires lightning crystals so I'm not sure if I want to chance it...I've only got 9 crystals, but I need the canvas :P

I did the whole crafting grind in XI so I'm no stranger to blowing up mats, and I don't even fault SE's system. Everything works just fine, but the interdependence of classes is getting some people miffed.
#57 Sep 26 2010 at 3:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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the biggest problem I see right now, is the difficulty in crafting low level weapons. a rank 9 harpoon shouldn't require rank 15ish synths.
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#58 Sep 26 2010 at 3:23 PM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
the biggest problem I see right now, is the difficulty in crafting low level weapons. a rank 9 harpoon shouldn't require rank 15ish synths.


This.

Imagine my frustration when I started making my level 12 gladiator armor only to find that after levelling lots of DoH and DoL high enough (or what i thought was high enoug) one of the ingredients is a level 4 botany drop.

To make the level 12 armour, i need a level 40 botanist.

Guess I will have to look for an alternative armor.

I would have thought that SE would be encouraging people to level up their jobs simultaneously. This feature is a little silly in my opinion. Of course, I could wait until someone else gets a botanist to lvl 40 and buy it from them but I suspect it will cost more gil than i will ever have due to the lack of a central AH.
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#59 Sep 26 2010 at 3:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Plus, let's face it... Nobody who was following the game's progress really expected the game to be released in September. They pushed the game out the door early for whatever reasons SE might have had.

As far as the AH goes, they did specifically say they didn't want to go that route (in the past). Although now it looks like they're looking into *some* sort of search system, which would be great.

Take a look in the wards. In the middle areas, there's readerboard type thing. I have a hunch that's what's going to be used to search each individual ward. But that's just my theory.


I have come to the conclusion that SE needs to stop making mmorpg's that can also be played on consoles. FFXI and now FFXIV can never reach their full potential because they're so limited by this.
FFXI suffered so much from PS2 limitations, and you can bet anything that we'll start hearing about PS3 limitations soon.
I know they're a Japanese company, but since they want to sell to a world-wide customer base now, then it's time to realize a Playstation console is in no way comparable to today's gaming pc's.



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#60 Sep 26 2010 at 3:56 PM Rating: Decent
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Vorkosigan wrote:
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Plus, let's face it... Nobody who was following the game's progress really expected the game to be released in September. They pushed the game out the door early for whatever reasons SE might have had.

As far as the AH goes, they did specifically say they didn't want to go that route (in the past). Although now it looks like they're looking into *some* sort of search system, which would be great.

Take a look in the wards. In the middle areas, there's readerboard type thing. I have a hunch that's what's going to be used to search each individual ward. But that's just my theory.


I have come to the conclusion that SE needs to stop making mmorpg's that can also be played on consoles. FFXI and now FFXIV can never reach their full potential because they're so limited by this.
FFXI suffered so much from PS2 limitations, and you can bet anything that we'll start hearing about PS3 limitations soon.
I know they're a Japanese company, but since they want to sell to a world-wide customer base now, then it's time to realize a Playstation console is in no way comparable to today's gaming pc's.


I don't buy this. An MMO can work just fine on a console. What issues with XIV are you pinning on PS3 limitations exactly?
#61 Sep 26 2010 at 4:13 PM Rating: Good
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Im not a techy but I do know that there is more power in one of my two graphics cards than there is in the whole PS3.

I have 2 graphics cards with said power, GTX480's and then to that add a super powerful processor liquid cooled and overclocked from 3.2ghz to 4.2 ghz, and a whole host of other very powerful and expensive components.

With all this uber power my PC runs the game pretty much maxed out settings (though i turn off AO).

How could a PS3 possibly match that processing power?

Imagine how could the game would be if they didnt have to limit it to be run by a PS3
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#62 Sep 26 2010 at 4:35 PM Rating: Good
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Vawn43 wrote:
Vorkosigan wrote:
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Plus, let's face it... Nobody who was following the game's progress really expected the game to be released in September. They pushed the game out the door early for whatever reasons SE might have had.

As far as the AH goes, they did specifically say they didn't want to go that route (in the past). Although now it looks like they're looking into *some* sort of search system, which would be great.

Take a look in the wards. In the middle areas, there's readerboard type thing. I have a hunch that's what's going to be used to search each individual ward. But that's just my theory.


I have come to the conclusion that SE needs to stop making mmorpg's that can also be played on consoles. FFXI and now FFXIV can never reach their full potential because they're so limited by this.
FFXI suffered so much from PS2 limitations, and you can bet anything that we'll start hearing about PS3 limitations soon.
I know they're a Japanese company, but since they want to sell to a world-wide customer base now, then it's time to realize a Playstation console is in no way comparable to today's gaming pc's.


I don't buy this. An MMO can work just fine on a console. What issues with XIV are you pinning on PS3 limitations exactly?


Yes, they can work fine. But, they are inherently limiting anyone playing on a high end pc to the level of the console.
I have nothing concrete, just a gut feeling that there are 'limitations' involved in the lack of an auction house, mail system, general chat channels, and then my retainer that is filled with only 6 items, inability to sort inventory, no search, party members unseen on my map, no in-game craft recipe lists, inability to alt/tab out just to look that stuff up... you know, just the basic mmo functions that any international game in the 2010's should have.
I'm trying to be patient, going to play casually til they start to make changes...IF they make them. I've said it before, I have this sinking feeling.
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#63 Sep 26 2010 at 5:11 PM Rating: Good
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There are massive synergistic benefits of joining a linkshell in this game.

As Aurelius is pointing out, there is a huge interdependence between ALL the disciplines, and the lack of one will interrupt the progression of another.

Last night, my ls buddy had materials but was too low ranked to craft his first gladiator shield. As I had the ranks but not the materials, I stepped in to help synthesise the shield. So I got rank ups, he got his shield.

The game model is designed so that you either become a jack of all trades, or you become specialised and rely on your fellow players to help you. Think of progression like this:

1) DOW/DOM hunt mobs for drops and crystals, earning rank and exp and GIL.
2) DOL gather for the HELM resources and crystals, earning rank and exp.
3) DOW/DOL trade ingredients to DOL to synthesise.
4) DOH crafts the armour, weapons and other ingredients.
5) DOH trade finished products with other DOH and DOW/DOM/DOW, and any excess that cannot be bartered is sold using GIL.
6) DOW/DOM/DOL get better gear to fight stronger mobs and get higher level materials and crystals...and so on.

Once people realise it's a fully integrated economy, progression will go MUCH faster, especially when everyone works together to keep moving the system forward.

Currently, the system is frustrated because the lack of AH slows down the speed of transactions. The best way around this is to join a linkshell and start helping yourself by helping others.
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#64 Sep 26 2010 at 10:03 PM Rating: Default
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I just can't bring myself to do all this crafting again that's an even more painful process than was in 11. They won't just let the game go to sh*t but I thought no matter what I'd be playing 14 after loving so many years of 11. Now I just don't know. I'm mainly a ps3 player but pc has it's upsides. I didn't spend the CE money for nothing but there is no way I can force myself to play this game a lot.

Problem is I want to play a lot and I don't want to feel forced to play or like it. It is a really hard sell for me to pay after the 30 days as of now. Hopefully by the time ps3 version is out it will be a changed and much better game. Market ward idea is just a failure to me. I also don't want to have to depend on mass time searching for items nor do I want to be dependent on my linkshell or friends to help me.

I liked the fact that I was capable and dependent enough on myself to do things such as crafting, farming gil, items without always asking for help or needing help.

Auction House would solve a good deal of problems but as ffxi taught us it can also bring with it other issues. Maybe the ward idea is SE's way of saying.. well we know you guys love the AH's but this is our answer to not being able to make it work like we wanted it so gogo Market Ward.

no thanks. Game looks beautiful. That's about all I can say right now. At least CoDuty and Socom have new games coming out.
#65 Sep 26 2010 at 10:13 PM Rating: Decent
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the way I look at this is that eventually I WILL be getting all of these crafts up, then why not in the beginning when everyone else is around the same ranks as yourself. With the other MMO's that I have played I have gotten screwed because I would worry about leveling and not the crafting abilities and wasting huge masses of money.

So when I get the game on thurs I will lvl to the max I can then get to the crafting.
#66 Sep 27 2010 at 3:39 AM Rating: Decent
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just skimed through thread so this is reply to first poster, i think the getting gear will get easier as more people level up however i think the game is too dependent on crafting and i was never a fan in ff11 of crafting even though play 11 alot, i worry 14 has poteniatal to be even worse than 11 in the future at the moment its ok easy to craft low level stuff but when we all high lv and a new player starts are they really going to want to play on because the market is controled by thoese with super high craft skills.
i know everyone says they want an auction house but is that best system for game and what is everone thought on this issue , i feel it might be big one not now, but in two or 3 years time of games life.
#67Tenkuro, Posted: Sep 27 2010 at 3:53 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Auction House Cons and Pros
#68 Sep 27 2010 at 3:55 AM Rating: Default
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Sorry if this has been said, but was alot to read through so skiped a bit.

But as I see it, the game needs time to develop.

FFXIV has to be based on player crafted items to make the crafting classes a viable option for people to pick that as their main class. Now this has been made alot harder then it needed to be, mainly because of the lack of the Bazaar wards having any sort of order. But once thats fixed (I realy hope they plan to fix it) the game will be alot better. The other thing that is exacerbating the whole problem, is the fact that the crafting classes still need time to level up and gain the knoledge, in-game skills and resourses to craft the equipment needed by the other classes. So once the crafters sort their crap out, the rest of us can start buying equipment to level more and enjoy the game alot more.
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#69 Sep 27 2010 at 3:59 AM Rating: Default
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I understand that you don't like to craft, but you should have friends or have the ability to make friends right? Do what some of my guildmates does. They hunt for materials and pass it to me, the crafter. I then craft them the gear. Or do what my other crazy level hungry friend does: NPC the loot, do missions and leves, buy the gear from the bazaar. It might be a terrible system, but it's still faster to look through that **** of a mess than crafting it yourself.
#70Silegna, Posted: Sep 27 2010 at 4:01 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I didn't even read the post, the title was enough for me, and all I only saw the title as "Cry cry cry cry" take your rant else where, like "Go back to WoW".
#71 Sep 27 2010 at 4:04 AM Rating: Good
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I had the same problem, I have my maraduar at lvl 11 with lvl 1 weapon, missing evades...lame. I stopped leveling him to make Blacksmith for my lvl 7 BRONZE AXE, oh wait i need to lvl carpenter for the shaft, but not just a maple or ash or willow shaft, a ******* elm shaft which i think is lvl 15ish, oh wait now i need to level leathercraft ...that not so bad...then finally alchemy again not so bad, i understand them wanting us to try new classes but all this to get a level 7 axe, and now i need the level 10 axe. funny thing is i am doing all this just so i dont have to pay 40k for that next axe. I think i will have some skills to pay the bills once the ah comes out this retainer **** is EPIC FAIL!!
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#72 Sep 27 2010 at 4:08 AM Rating: Decent
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I was pretty unhappy about all the crafting interdependence also, until i saw that local leves can skill you up at no cost to yourself. At least I can get all crafts to 10 and proceed from there. Good enough for now i think. I wonder how players who start the game in 6 months or a year will view crafting?

I was having a blast with the crafting quests until they cut me off... how long is the cooldown i wonder?

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 10:09am by Timorith
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#73 Sep 27 2010 at 4:08 AM Rating: Default
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Score: Decent I feel like we're playing a game modeled after the Smurfs... little communists according to this:
http://www.iamlost.com/features/smurfs/commies.shtml

I remember SE said we would get a hint about the armory on the new logo. Since it's all the jobs coming out from one central point, I guess your supposed to be the Swiss Army "knife" of FFXIV ^^;



This describes the game, you need to be every job.
Would be nice if you had a seperate section to put your tool/weapons. With how SE makes you level every job to do one thing, you would think we would have more then 80 spaces. Ya i know Retainers have 80 as well but when you need to repair your armor you need a lot of tools and items to do it.
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#74 Sep 27 2010 at 4:18 AM Rating: Good
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Tenkuro wrote:
Auction House Cons and Pros
Pros: Greater playability, easier to roll through the game, easier to find wanted items.
Cons: Promote RMT, makes game too easy.

In all honesty its not the AH that promotes RMT, its the fact that in XI many of the best items in the game could be bought and sold. The soulbind system of WoW effectively castrated RMT - sure they could farm gold and buy/sell stuff - but the items available with gold could not significantly impact the balance of the overall game in PvE or PvP. Gold couldn't buy you power. Gil can. THAT promotes RMT.


Edited, Sep 27th 2010 10:18am by Timorith

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 10:19am by Timorith
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#75 Sep 27 2010 at 4:19 AM Rating: Decent
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hanibalz wrote:
I had the same problem, I have my maraduar at lvl 11 with lvl 1 weapon, missing evades...lame. I stopped leveling him to make Blacksmith for my lvl 7 BRONZE AXE, oh wait i need to lvl carpenter for the shaft, but not just a maple or ash or willow shaft, a @#%^ing elm shaft which i think is lvl 15ish, oh wait now i need to level leathercraft ...that not so bad...then finally alchemy again not so bad, i understand them wanting us to try new classes but all this to get a level 7 axe, and now i need the level 10 axe. funny thing is i am doing all this just so i dont have to pay 40k for that next axe. I think i will have some skills to pay the bills once the ah comes out this retainer sh*t is EPIC FAIL!!


I got to rank 12 on most of my classes just using the level 1 weapon. Now there's a bunch of people selling rank 11 weapons, but I refuse to buy it from them.
#76 Sep 27 2010 at 4:27 AM Rating: Default
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Timorith wrote:
Tenkuro wrote:
Auction House Cons and Pros
Pros: Greater playability, easier to roll through the game, easier to find wanted items.
Cons: Promote RMT, makes game too easy.

In all honesty its not the AH that promotes RMT, its the fact that in XI many of the best items in the game could be bought and sold. The soulbind system of WoW effectively castrated RMT - sure they could farm gold and buy/sell stuff - but the items available with gold could not significantly impact the balance of the overall game in PvE or PvP. Gold couldn't buy you power. Gil can. THAT promotes RMT.


Edited, Sep 27th 2010 10:18am by Timorith

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 10:19am by Timorith


I know plenty of Gold buyers that started WOW and went straight to the AH. It helped them a great ton and that in itself keeps the RMT going in WoW. If you think WoW doesn't have an RMT problem, you need to talk to a Blizzard GM in person, off the record. My classmate was a GM and moved to moderator. All he said was that the GMs are overwhelmed with trying to keep the RMTs out. In fact, they have a full time staff just trying to keep them out, but it's not possible. The best they can do is slow them down.

I like the fact that I'm able to find a rare item and be able to give it to my guildmate who was not able to play at the time. The soulbind system is amazing, but it has it's negative sides.
#77 Sep 27 2010 at 4:38 AM Rating: Excellent
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ditx wrote:
It's safe to say SE knows we want an AH system, they havent said there wont be one flat out. But for crying out loud, what do you expect? They can't just magic one up overnight, it takes a alot of work and resources, which are overwise being focused on making a smooth launch possible. It would have been too big to impliment in the Beta, would you rather they added that and just left the Menu's crappy and laggy like they used to be instead?



I can see how they might want to wait a few weeks at least before they implement the AH just for the economy to sort itself out and they also probably want to wait until the general release is out rather than implementing the AH right away during the early release.

However things that are missing that really get me scratching my head are:

1) Sort / Auto-sort - Really, is this *that* hard to implement? I think anyone here who's taken and introductory computer programming class had homework doing sorts on lists lol. It's hard to believe something as basic/simple sorting is still not implemented in a game that's been in development for this long? Does SE not listen at all to comments from alpha/beta testers ? I have to imagine *some* people in alpha/beta brought this to their attention...

2) Party search options - I've enjoyed the parties I've had so far - the few times I've been in a party .... It seems like all the parties being formed right now are at camps with people shouting for people. You can't invite people unless you see them ??

3) No markers on maps for party members

4) No F1, F2, etc. keys to select party members. Can't even use <p1> <p2> in macros for targeting.


All of this stuff existed in FFXI. What were the developer reasons for leaving these things out? I would really love to hear their responses in an interview to these questions.

Oh yeah - and another thing that lots of people have already mentioned on this board but I think needs to be mentioned again - TONS of menus. Why can't I just hit "B" or "I" to bring up my inventory? Is anyone else annoyed with the number of menus you have to navigate through when you do a crafting levequest not to mention that annoyingly long pause after it shows you kneeling down to perform the synth and then *another* long pause after you decide to "commence" the levequest?

There's a lot in the game that I do enjoy which is why I am still playing. What's really disappointing is that these annoyances seem *extremely* simple to fix so it leaves people wondering why haven't they fixed this yet? And what's most worrysome is that if they can't even implement the *simplest* things such as SORTING, is this development team even capable or competent enough to fix/improve the other issues?
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#78 Sep 27 2010 at 4:45 AM Rating: Default
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I'm going to reply to you like I do to my guildmates:

In my personal opinion, this game was released too early. This version is called prelive by some people. Technically, it is not the official release yet. The official release is on the 30th. However, I don't think much will change then. I think SE released this game early based on their marketing strategy. They know their target audience are willing to be patient and let them fix it as it goes. I honestly think they wanted to get the most sales possible and this is the best time to do it. There are a lot of games being released at the end of this year or next year that will saturate the market even more. SE profited big by releasing early. In a perfect world for game publishers, no competition, this game would be released next summer or even winter. I'm not surprised that they made this move, it was done for FFXI also. FFXI was even more terrible than this in the first few months. I was patient and gave it a chance; it became my favorite MMO of all time.
#79 Sep 27 2010 at 5:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Amazing post on the topic of Auction House:

http://www.eorzeapedia.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=8629
#80 Sep 27 2010 at 5:33 AM Rating: Good
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zpanda wrote:
Is anyone else annoyed with the number of menus you have to navigate through when you do a crafting levequest...
Yeah the nested menus are terrible. I found myself COUNTING the number of mouse clicks/keypresses it took to perform simple tasks the other day. I think i counted like 6 to equip gear, 4 to edit a macro then another 4 to play again, etc.

At one point i was writing a macro but forgot the name for an item so i had to click 3 times to get back to the menu, then another 3 times to get the items name in my inventory, another 3 times back to the menu AGAIN then 4 clicks to actually begin to type the name. Having any menu open locks ALL others out lol? Seems really ridiculous; how'd something like that make it past development?
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#81 Sep 27 2010 at 5:57 AM Rating: Excellent
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Tenkuro wrote:
Auction House Cons and Pros

Pros: Greater playability, easier to roll through the game, easier to find wanted items.

Cons: Promote RMT, makes game too easy.


If anything, the retainer system actually favors RMT much more strongly than an AH possibly could.

Effective economic activity is going to rely on being able to gather price data from large numbers of retainers and make use of that information to buy goods where they are cheap and sell them where they are expensive. Who's going to be most able to check lots of retainers for price information? RMT. Even if SE adds a retainer search function (which will reduce information asymmetry), who's going to be most able to capitalize on price imbalances? RMT.

The retainer system gives RMT a major advantage in engaging in arbitrage, which in turn makes it easier for them to control markets.
#82 Sep 27 2010 at 7:29 AM Rating: Excellent
rotny wrote:
We cant have an AH! That would be too much like W_rld _f W_r_raft.


Oh, man, I HATE World of Worcraft! It's such a blatant rip-off of WoW.

What I like is the Auction House. I'll probably learn the basics of working on my gear anyway, though.
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#83 Sep 27 2010 at 7:32 AM Rating: Default
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Very interesting thread ZAM, here's my 2 gil:

Playing an MMO at launch is like buying a house. You love it's shiny newness and infinite potential at first...but then you start to notice little the flaws here and there, and there is ALWAYS something that is broken / needs to be fixed / needs to be replaced / needs to be removed / could be better.

I'd say there's no hurry to endgame, enjoy the game "as is", take your time and enjoy the scenery along the way, etc. etc., but that advice doesn't make sense to a pre-order crowd that consists of dedicated core gamers that really want this game to succeed.

The reality is this: the game is what it is right now. It's not perfect; it's far from it. But SE is dedicated to it, and it will absolutely get better over time. That being said, if you don't want to weather the storm, don't. If FFXIV in it's present state frustrates you to the point where you aren't enjoying it, don't play it.

Personally, I'm enjoying the **** out of FFXIV gamma. I'm taking a laid-back, casual approach, meandering through the world and dabbling with all of the classes. When I run into a broken game-mechanic or something that even seems mildly frustrating / annoying, I go do something else and advance my character horizontally rather than vertically.
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#84 Sep 27 2010 at 7:42 AM Rating: Excellent
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I agree peeps are too greedy selling things for even 20k is a bit much at this point.


I'm sorry, but I don't think you realize how much some of these materials cost. I had a guy not wanting to offer more than 12k for Bronze Mitt Gauntlets. Lets break down the craft with mostly NPC prices:

2x Bronze Plates 6,600 each (13,200 total)
1x Sheep skin (7,200)

I'll stop right there. That isn't even all the components.

You know what I sell these for? 25k. I make about a 5-7k profit per synth. That is only because I leveled up my own tanning to make the inner sheepskin mitts, after farming my own sheep skin and lucky enough to find some bronze buckles in the market wards. 20k+ is going to be standard for much of the starting gear. If people expect to pay component price rates for their gear, then they need to get the items themselves and find a crafter to make it for them. There is a reason why NPCs charge prices like 65k for Bronze Chain mail.

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 8:45am by Rysa

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 8:46am by Rysa
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#85 Sep 27 2010 at 7:58 AM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
I can think of something that would solve your problems.

AUCTI_N H_USE

Wanna buy a vowel? Good luck finding one in the market wards.


Just popped over, saw this from Mik, and almost spooged my morning coffee.

Back on topic though, I'm going to charge a high price on things that are in-demand, and are hard to come by. Some people have used armor as an example, but i'll give you another one: Leather Dyes. In order to make one dye synth (four dyes)...yes, one you need:

4 Flax: 18.3k PER @ NPC, or I can go farm a very limited array of mobs, who also have a very low drop rate on this item. Average time for 4 Flax to drop on all my gathering attempts...1 hour.

1 of (Taupe/Grey/etc.) Bug: These can only be quarried, and are always the least favorite of the loot table, I assure you. Add into that, there's 3 quarry spots in starter zones, 1 in each higher ranking zone. Everytime you quarry or harvest, you are REQUIRED to go and mine/log two DoL pops before you're able to access another quarry/harvest. Average time to make it worthwhile to quarry through...45 min.

Those 4 Flax made 12 Linseed Oil: This also requires Alchemy at 10 essentially to succeed on every synth, even with guild support. Average time to get Alchemy to 10, even with leves...10 hours.

One Linseed Oil, One (Color) Bug: 4 dyes.

I feel perfectly justified in my pricing, and I'd hate to see what someone who bought the flax would charge.




Edited, Sep 27th 2010 7:07am by Dallie

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 7:08am by Dallie
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#86 Sep 27 2010 at 8:06 AM Rating: Excellent
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BastokFL wrote:
Tenkuro wrote:
Auction House Cons and Pros

Pros: Greater playability, easier to roll through the game, easier to find wanted items.

Cons: Promote RMT, makes game too easy.


If anything, the retainer system actually favors RMT much more strongly than an AH possibly could.

Effective economic activity is going to rely on being able to gather price data from large numbers of retainers and make use of that information to buy goods where they are cheap and sell them where they are expensive. Who's going to be most able to check lots of retainers for price information? RMT. Even if SE adds a retainer search function (which will reduce information asymmetry), who's going to be most able to capitalize on price imbalances? RMT.

The retainer system gives RMT a major advantage in engaging in arbitrage, which in turn makes it easier for them to control markets.


exactly, adding to transaction time only benefits them further. I've said it before, RMT take advantage of economies because they are better at it than regular players. Because its their job. Making it harder for everyone hurts regular players as much, if not more than RMT.
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#87 Sep 27 2010 at 8:12 AM Rating: Default
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DonFlamenco wrote:
Very interesting thread ZAM, here's my 2 gil:

Playing an MMO at launch is like buying a house. You love it's shiny newness and infinite potential at first...but then you start to notice little the flaws here and there, and there is ALWAYS something that is broken / needs to be fixed / needs to be replaced / needs to be removed / could be better.

I'd say there's no hurry to endgame, enjoy the game "as is", take your time and enjoy the scenery along the way, etc. etc., but that advice doesn't make sense to a pre-order crowd that consists of dedicated core gamers that really want this game to succeed.

The reality is this: the game is what it is right now. It's not perfect; it's far from it. But SE is dedicated to it, and it will absolutely get better over time. That being said, if you don't want to weather the storm, don't. If FFXIV in it's present state frustrates you to the point where you aren't enjoying it, don't play it.

Personally, I'm enjoying the **** out of FFXIV gamma. I'm taking a laid-back, casual approach, meandering through the world and dabbling with all of the classes. When I run into a broken game-mechanic or something that even seems mildly frustrating / annoying, I go do something else and advance my character horizontally rather than vertically.


This is by far the best explanation for FFXIV or make that ANY MMO that first comes out
#88 Sep 27 2010 at 8:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Couldn't agree more, very eloquently put.
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#90 Sep 27 2010 at 8:24 AM Rating: Good
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Humster wrote:

Flax for linseed oil comes form Botanist harvesting and Fish glue ingredients comes from Fishing... in sea water.


Flax is dropped from Glowfly which can be found in caves in Grindania..

The drop is fairly rare but I've gotten plenty for a few stacks of oil.

I haven't gotten any flax by harvesting...

just my experience.
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#91 Sep 27 2010 at 8:44 AM Rating: Decent
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I actually enjoy crafting and had planned to get all the DoH up anyway. :O)
#92 Sep 27 2010 at 8:50 AM Rating: Default
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thats exactly what I was saying, I am one of the people that decided to wait the few days for the standard edition, but I believe becoming jack of all trades will actually be fun. I'm so used to games like wow where you really dont need crafting to get better in your main level. So i think this will be a good twist to have to work to get my guy the best he can be in the disciplines of war.
#93 Sep 27 2010 at 9:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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bsphil wrote:
Osarion, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
You'd think that, eh? And I'd agree. But even XI didn't have an AH at JP launch.
I don't buy that argument though. Just because they've made bad choices in the past doesn't give them a pass for making them again in new games.


I have to agree. Content-wise, you can't rightfully expect XIV to have the same amount of stuff that XI has gained after four plus expansions. However, the years of development on XI have led to what is now its own standard, and if XIV is supposed to draw from that and be even better, you'd think even basic features from XI would be par for the course. I don't necessarily agree that an AH should have been on the table at first, since they wanted to try a new system and had to see how this one was going to work (clearly it hasn't). But in terms of other missing functionality, it's like the developers completely forgot XI had any of that stuff.

We're expecting XIV to improve over time. This is a given for any MMO. However, given the way things are now, improving XIV only means bringing it closer to XI's level, since they're basically starting off the same way. Actually surpassing XI seems to be years out.
#94 Sep 27 2010 at 9:56 AM Rating: Good
10 posts
Gotta say, I disagree with a distinct lack of features being "part of an mmo launch". Granted further down the road in any game, more features are going to be added, but if there are fairly standard features the company _wants_ to implement, but hasn't, it just means they weren't done in time. Also a lot of issues in game aren't actually bugged, they are "working as intended", but they just don't work very well. I'm reminded of the Age of Conan launch, not exactly the same thing, but the game was incomplete, lacked content, and paid the price for it.

The problems and inconveniences in this game currently are going to turn away a _lot_ of potential customers. Granted I don't want this game to be the second coming of WoW, but there's no denying a decent chunk of people trying the game are doing so because they're bored of WoW. FFXIV has definitely changed from FFXI release and for that I'm grateful, but a lot of people aren't going to put up with all the frustrating aspects of this game, I feel like SE has shot themselves in the foot somewhat releasing the game in it's current state.

We're all seeing the same issues, inconveniences, flat out clunky outdated mechanics, there's no need to be apologists.

With other mmo launches there's been server lag, crashes, bugs etc, this is more what I expect (though just as undesirable). FFXIV has these things and a lack of features that they know they want in game, yet haven't implemented.

As far as the op goes, I've picked up a few peices of gear aside from starter gear and am leveling past 10 fairly easily, not sure what you're trying to fight, but stick to greens/blues and you should be ok. While archaic, try and spend a few minutes in the bazaar and look at the people with obvious names like "weapon guy" or "armorandstuff" and you should be able to find gear here and there.
#95 Sep 27 2010 at 10:16 AM Rating: Good
Dallie wrote:
[quote]Those 4 Flax made 12 Linseed Oil: This also requires Alchemy at 10 essentially to succeed on every synth, even with guild support. Average time to get Alchemy to 10, even with leves...10 hours.


Nonsense. Buy Muddy Water from a vendor. Convert to Disitlled Water. As you approach rank 10, skillups will slow to ~200/synth, but it's still the fastest and esaiest DoH class to push to 10. A bunch of fire crystals and a couple of hours synthing in front of a vendor and you're set.
#96windexy, Posted: Sep 27 2010 at 10:25 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I bet all other MMO releases are much better because when they started up the servers everyone already was able to craft everything and all items were already gathered for them. In fact I think every other MMO in existence all players started with one of every available armor in the game....
#97 Sep 27 2010 at 10:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
Dallie wrote:
[quote]Those 4 Flax made 12 Linseed Oil: This also requires Alchemy at 10 essentially to succeed on every synth, even with guild support. Average time to get Alchemy to 10, even with leves...10 hours.


Nonsense. Buy Muddy Water from a vendor. Convert to Disitlled Water. As you approach rank 10, skillups will slow to ~200/synth, but it's still the fastest and esaiest DoH class to push to 10. A bunch of fire crystals and a couple of hours synthing in front of a vendor and you're set.


But, but... what if I'm one of those mythical 'casual' players SE is aiming at? I don't want to spend hours sitting in front of a vendor trying to level up one craft.

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 12:26pm by Vorkosigan
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#98MajidahSihaam, Posted: Sep 27 2010 at 10:25 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) holy **** man. You are complaining about having to socialize on a MMORPG.
#99 Sep 27 2010 at 10:27 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Doom didn't have strafing, but would players be okay if Halo Reach was released without Strafing?
Gothic 1 had less than half a dozen armor options, and the combat system was terribly clunky. Would the same thing be acceptable in Oblivion?
Warcraft 1 only allowed you to select a maximum of 4 units at once; would a modern RTS that did this be okay?
Diablo 1 only had 3 class options and no gender or appearance customization options. Would this fly in Diablo 3?



Or FPS without dedicated servers and no ability to mod... oh wait that makes it one of the best selling games of all time...
#100 Sep 27 2010 at 10:47 AM Rating: Decent
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DonFlamenco wrote:
Playing an MMO at launch is like buying a house. You love it's shiny newness and infinite potential at first...but then you start to notice little the flaws here and there, and there is ALWAYS something that is broken / needs to be fixed / needs to be replaced / needs to be removed / could be better.
If it's an old house. If it's a new house, you build it the way you want it.
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#101 Sep 27 2010 at 10:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Well, I only read the first page of this post thread, but had to go ahead and put 2 cents in before I get to page 2.

First off, complaining about leveling and not wanting to craft - well heck, the fact is you level your physical character AS YOU CRAFT. That is awesome! I have never played a game that actually gives you experience points while you're crafting. I've leveled a couple levels in a short time just because I was crafting. And when it comes to leveling your weapon, that is easy enough to do on random mobs.

The only stuff I've worn so far is what I've gotten from quests. I repair my own weapon, which is easy to do - just level the craft that has to do with your type of weapon. For me, have a bow, so I'm leveling carpentry and I can easily fix my own bow. I can even buy the supplies to do so from vendors. Yeah, it is a b it ch trying to find which vendor has what, but think after a while I'll get the hang of it. Heck, we've only been playing 5 days - how dang fast to you expect to get to 50? Too many people are worried about "leveling up" to stop and enjoy the game for what it is.

Sure, I get tired of running everywhere and using up my anima to travel by teleporting, but hey, if I could do everything there was to do in this game within the first week I played it - then why would I want to keep playing on afterwards?

You all really need to just slow down and enjoy the game. I'm really enjoying it even with the few things that bother me. For one, I have a hard time with the targeting, especially when several things are coming at you at once. But the way I see it, I just need to get the hang of it and eventually I'll do better.

Seriously, this really is an exceptional game. There is no need to rush through it and then start whining because there's nothing left to do or because you want an expansion already. Just stop and smell the roses and enjoy it for what it is. Stop rushing everything!

~M~
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