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FFXIV isnt beta anymore.Follow

#1 Sep 26 2010 at 12:41 PM Rating: Decent
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I read over a bunch of the threads and it's hilarious to me. The same people that were defending SE about all the so called "minor" issues and saying "this is beta, have you guys never played a beta before?" are now saying similar things about the live game that costed 70+ dollars. "It's only 3 days into CE launch!!!!" Yeah it is...And it's also no longer beta. Why are there still MAJOR issues that players talked about over and over during the betas? Just a few things:

- Still cant see party members on the map???
- UI still lags out when crafting???
- STILL no auction house?


To me and many other players these are major issues. Especially no AH, and server side UI lag. It's literally unbearable to have to spend 10 minutes selling off my junk loot to a NPC due to server side UI lag.

Queue the "Dont like it, dont play it" and the "It's only 3 days live, what do you expect?" responses.


Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:49pm by Soezu
#2 Sep 26 2010 at 12:44 PM Rating: Good
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There is a hardware mouse.
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#3 Sep 26 2010 at 12:44 PM Rating: Excellent
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Soezu wrote:
Still no hardware mouse?

have you opened up the config yet?
#4 Sep 26 2010 at 12:48 PM Rating: Decent
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#5 Sep 26 2010 at 12:49 PM Rating: Decent
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That being one of the minor issues, I use a controller so no i guess i didnt look into it. But yeah the major issues are still there.

Thank you LordAshal. Lets go through a checklist on that link and see what was there in beta and what is still there now. Quite amazing how the beta is pretty much the exact same as the live version.

This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.

Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:53pm by Soezu
#6 Sep 26 2010 at 12:51 PM Rating: Decent
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Soezu wrote:


Queue the "Dont like it, dont play it" and the "It's only 3 days live, what do you expect?" responses.



I don't remember any MMO that worked properly for months after release.

Anyway, who the **** cares? If it doesn't improve, people will quit. The difference is, is that the people who stick around, will have a good MMO that was worth the time investment (for whataver that actually means).

Don't worry your little head about it precious, kay?
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#7 Sep 26 2010 at 12:56 PM Rating: Decent
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Soezu wrote:
That being one of the minor issues, I use a controller so no i guess i didnt look into it. But yeah the major issues are still there.

Thank you LordAshal. Lets go through a checklist on that link and see what was there in beta and what is still there now. Quite amazing how the beta is pretty much the exact same as the live version.

This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.

Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:53pm by Soezu

So you are complaining about issues that don't even affect you?

Quote:
This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.

Oh, i get it now. ><
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#8 Sep 26 2010 at 12:58 PM Rating: Decent
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Soezu wrote:


This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.



Did a fanboy pick on you at school?

What gives?
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#9 Sep 26 2010 at 1:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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There were a ton of issues in closed beta, and many of them were fixed in open beta.

There were still a lot of issues in open beta and many of them were fixed in retail.

There are still issues and most of them will be fixed in the next few months. All of them? Maybe not, but most of them should.
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#10 Sep 26 2010 at 1:00 PM Rating: Decent
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I remember getting called an idiot and a "mmo noob" because I was saying during beta how mmo's rarely change much, if at all, after open betas and going into launch. I remember such responses like "Have you ever even played a beta before?" or how about "This is all just stress testing." or maybe "Open beta is meant to test and fix things not give you a free demo of the game".

Well...Hate to say I told you so to all the fanboys but....I told you so. Launch is almost exactly like OBT with a few minor tweaks and the major issues are still there which will drive many players away. First impressions are huge in this genre of games. Fortunately for SE, they attract so many dedicated fanboys that they can survive even if everyone that has any common sense quits tomorrow.

Putting XIV on the shelf for a year or 2 will be great for me and many other players. I do see great potential with FFXIV, but it just doesnt even compete with any other mmo, new or old as far as basic fundamentals go. Sure it's pretty...But no AH? Seriously? In 2010 no AH in an mmorpg? No mail system? Would think I was beta testing Ultima Online back in 94. Wait nvm, it's FFXIV in 2010.
#11 Sep 26 2010 at 1:03 PM Rating: Decent
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For the record, I'm not complaining. I have no problems with putting FFXIV on the shelf for a year or 2 then coming back when it's an amazing, polished, fleshed out game. I'm just laughing at the dillusional fanboys for insisting all these issues were strictly due to the game being in beta testing. When in reality, any mmorpg veteran could tell you OBT's rarely change at launch.
#12 Sep 26 2010 at 1:04 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.


All problems are still there? Sorry, but have you played the Beta?
There are quite a few things that got better with CE-Release.

* almost no UI Lag now
* stable connection
* faster NPC selling (still not perfect but way better)
* hardware mouse
* Patcher works decent

I was never one of the people who thought we would get the magic monster update that fixes all and everything so I'm satisfied with the current state of the game. Ok an AH would be really nice but SE said already that they want to try without one so....
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#13 Sep 26 2010 at 1:07 PM Rating: Good
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Soezu wrote:
I remember getting called an idiot and a "mmo noob" because I was saying during beta how mmo's rarely change much, if at all, after open betas and going into launch. I remember such responses like "Have you ever even played a beta before?" or how about "This is all just stress testing." or maybe "Open beta is meant to test and fix things not give you a free demo of the game".

Well...Hate to say I told you so to all the fanboys but....I told you so. Launch is almost exactly like OBT with a few minor tweaks and the major issues are still there which will drive many players away. First impressions are huge in this genre of games. Fortunately for SE, they attract so many dedicated fanboys that they can survive even if everyone that has any common sense quits tomorrow.

Putting XIV on the shelf for a year or 2 will be great for me and many other players. I do see great potential with FFXIV, but it just doesnt even compete with any other mmo, new or old as far as basic fundamentals go. Sure it's pretty...But no AH? Seriously? In 2010 no AH in an mmorpg? No mail system? Would think I was beta testing Ultima Online back in 94. Wait nvm, it's FFXIV in 2010.


People that use names like "Fanboy" use them because they haven't the intelligence to put up a good argument. Even here, you are just trying to troll with no useful information, or meaningful debate. I don't really care what you think of the game. Your "i told you so" attitude is not only wrong, but offensive.
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#14 Sep 26 2010 at 1:33 PM Rating: Good
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Auftragskiller wrote:
Quote:
This post was mainly laughing at the fanboys that insisted all these problems were because it was "beta" and they are still here, now they are saying "it's only 3 days live blah blah blah". I just find that hilarious.


All problems are still there? Sorry, but have you played the Beta?
There are quite a few things that got better with CE-Release.

* almost no UI Lag now
* stable connection
* faster NPC selling (still not perfect but way better)
* hardware mouse
* Patcher works decent

I was never one of the people who thought we would get the magic monster update that fixes all and everything so I'm satisfied with the current state of the game. Ok an AH would be really nice but SE said already that they want to try without one so....


I disagree with some of your points.

I have a 50MB connection and I'm getting really bad UI lag. That's in crowded areas and out in the middle of nowhere.

As for stable connection, I've gotten timed out from the server 10 times. Loosing guildleves in the process which is just tits.

NPC selling is abysmal, after selecting the item I want to sell I have to wait for a slow count to 10 then select sell in order for it to register that I've sold it.

The mouse options and functionality is still as useless as in OB.

But this is just my experience.
#15 Sep 26 2010 at 1:33 PM Rating: Good
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Soezu wrote:
I read over a bunch of the threads and it's hilarious to me. The same people that were defending SE about all the so called "minor" issues and saying "this is beta, have you guys never played a beta before?" are now saying similar things about the live game that costed 70+ dollars. "It's only 3 days into CE launch!!!!" Yeah it is...And it's also no longer beta. Why are there still MAJOR issues that players talked about over and over during the betas? Just a few things:

- Still cant see party members on the map???
- UI still lags out when crafting???
- STILL no auction house?


To me and many other players these are major issues. Especially no AH, and server side UI lag. It's literally unbearable to have to spend 10 minutes selling off my junk loot to a NPC due to server side UI lag.

Queue the "Dont like it, dont play it" and the "It's only 3 days live, what do you expect?" responses.


Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:49pm by Soezu


I still haven't played release because I'm waiting on Standard Edition. However I partied with my wife in Open Beta regularly, and she showed up on the Map as the same symbol as me, but blue. So I don't know WTF people are talking about when they say you can't see party members, because I could.

The Auction House thing is simple. SE stated a long time ago that they weren't going to have an AH at release. Here is the quote:

Quote:
Regarding auctionhouses:

Regarding Final Fantasy XIV and the market battle system is something we would like to consider the equilevent to the auction house we had in Final Fantasy XI. Only that you'll also be able to fix your equipment and things like that. It is something we really want people to enjoy. Also after the release of the game we will see how it goes and for example find out what kind of search options players will want and need and improve the situation. We don't really want to introduce the auctionhouse from the beginning because that is going to determine the economy system. So we want to improve it slowly and adjust it accordingly.






#16 Sep 26 2010 at 1:36 PM Rating: Good
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Yes, SE did say that there was not going to be a AH at launch. But that does not mean it's a good idea.

Also there are alot more people on the servers now than there were in OB. The game does not give priority to party positions when it loads on the minimap.

Edited, Sep 26th 2010 3:38pm by LordAshal
#17 Sep 26 2010 at 1:37 PM Rating: Default
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this thread is pathetic,

just sayin
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#18 Sep 26 2010 at 1:39 PM Rating: Excellent
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LordAshal wrote:
Yes, SE did say that there was not going to be a AH at launch. But that does not mean it's a good idea.


I don't think it was a good idea, I just don't think people should be surprised it's not there.
#19 Sep 26 2010 at 1:40 PM Rating: Decent
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Lolthread...

That is all.
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#20 Sep 26 2010 at 1:41 PM Rating: Decent
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It is my personal experience too so take it with a grain of salt but I don't have the kind of UI lag that I had in Beta anymore. Sure it could still be better then it is now but I can't complain anymore. For me the lag in crowded areas is like 0,5 sec and I'm playing from europe (germany). And I haven't got a single time out in like 20hrs of playing.

NPC selling is ok for me now too. Well ok it takes like 2-3secs but it isn't 10secs anymore so I've happy with it FOR THE MOMENT.

Can't really coment about the mouse issues because I don't use my mouse much but when I do it is fast and with no lag thought.
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#21 Sep 26 2010 at 1:43 PM Rating: Good
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Auftragskiller wrote:
It is my personal experience too so take it with a grain of salt but I don't have the kind of UI lag that I had in Beta anymore. Sure it could still be better then it is now but I can't complain anymore. For me the lag in crowded areas is like 0,5 sec and I'm playing from europe (germany). And I haven't got a single time out in like 20hrs of playing.

NPC selling is ok for me now too. Well ok it takes like 2-3secs but it isn't 10secs anymore so I've happy with it FOR THE MOMENT.

Can't really coment about the mouse issues because I don't use my mouse much but when I do it is fast and with no lag thought.


Just out of curiosity are you playing on a SE account registered to Germany? I'm about to be moving to the UK but my SE account and my wife's are registered for NA. We don't want to make new ones registered for Europe because we will be coming back, been trying like **** to find someone who has tried playing this way. We will still be using a NA copy of the game on a NA built PC btw.

Edited, Sep 26th 2010 3:43pm by BRizzl3
#22 Sep 26 2010 at 1:43 PM Rating: Good
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I don't think the issue is surprise, more like amazed that SE would actually go ahead and not learn from anything anywhere. Even their own MMO.
#23 Sep 26 2010 at 1:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:

Just out of curiosity are you playing on a SE account registered to Germany?


Yes it is registered to germany. Thanks god for international servers.
I played WoW on a german server and the german community just fails really hard but I couldn't play
on any NA Server with my german WoW Account :( Good part of the story is that it brought me back to FF ;)



Edited, Sep 26th 2010 9:47pm by Auftragskiller
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#24 Sep 26 2010 at 3:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Biggest issues for me in Beta

1) Hardware mouse - fixed
2) Conjurer Exp - fixed
3) clunky UI - mostly fixed, very little server side lag now
4) resetting skills - fixed with macros (probably not an issue in beta either)
5) no AH - agreed, still needs fixing
6) Leve timers - not an issue now that I am in an LS and can share leves with LS buddies
7) Storage space for the crafters among us - still needs fixing.

Overall my game experience is pretty awesome. I am not a fanboy and almost everything that frustrated me about the beta has been fixed. When I said "its only Beta" it seems that for me - I was right!
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#25 Sep 26 2010 at 3:38 PM Rating: Decent
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Soezu wrote:
That being one of the minor issues, I use a controller so no i guess i didnt look into it.


You were just running out of things to ***** about so you started trying to think of things that didn't even affect you?
#26 Sep 26 2010 at 3:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Haters gonna hate
Trolls gonna troll.
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#27 Sep 26 2010 at 3:45 PM Rating: Good
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Soezu wrote:
I read over a bunch of the threads and it's hilarious to me. The same people that were defending SE about all the so called "minor" issues and saying "this is beta, have you guys never played a beta before?" are now saying similar things about the live game that costed 70+ dollars. "It's only 3 days into CE launch!!!!" Yeah it is...And it's also no longer beta. Why are there still MAJOR issues that players talked about over and over during the betas? Just a few things:

- Still cant see party members on the map???
- UI still lags out when crafting???
- STILL no auction house?


To me and many other players these are major issues. Especially no AH, and server side UI lag. It's literally unbearable to have to spend 10 minutes selling off my junk loot to a NPC due to server side UI lag.

Queue the "Dont like it, dont play it" and the "It's only 3 days live, what do you expect?" responses.


Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:49pm by Soezu


MMOs are made to evolve, they never have much content less than 1 week after release.

It is impossible to work out all the bugs and issues only from a beta in a MMO.

And you say no AH is a major issue, i cant remember where but SE said they werent gonna have one, what we need is a retainer search, would be like an AH but not one.

Also, check the update history for XI at the origanal JP release (18 months BEFORE NA release) there was barely any content in XI, beleave it or not there was no AH for 1 month. Link to ffxi update history.

So if you dont like it stop playing and come back in 1 yr when they have had time to fix things and add content.

Wtf were you expecting when you started playing on release day.
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#28 Sep 26 2010 at 5:54 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not going to discuss your opinion here... I think everyone agrees that the game has serious flaws at this point.
I'm just surprised that nobody seems to understand the way big companies like SE work! I'll take my own job as an example, since I'm working for a company producing MMOs; specifically, I'm in charge of one of the localization teams here in China. The executive board in USA decides of the release date, not me, not the APM, not the PM, not the devs! Let's say that on this particular game, the devs forgot to include a big chunk (an entire expansion for instance, and don't laugh, that kind of **** happens when your company is spread out on 3 continents) when they sent me the content to localize, and they find out about this a week before the OB kicks off, well chances are we'll release with vast portions of the game left in the original language because the board won't give a ****. They think in terms of ARPU and PCU, not in terms of overall quality, and they'll only order people to work at full speed on the issues mentioned in this thread and others when they see those numbers falling, or for this game, not rising fast enough, since it has just been released...
#29 Sep 26 2010 at 6:19 PM Rating: Decent
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HallieXIV wrote:
Haters gonna hate
Trolls gonna troll.


scrish wrote:

MMOs are made to evolve, they never have much content less than 1 week after release.

It is impossible to work out all the bugs and issues only from a beta in a MMO.

And you say no AH is a major issue, i cant remember where but SE said they werent gonna have one, what we need is a retainer search, would be like an AH but not one.

Also, check the update history for XI at the origanal JP release (18 months BEFORE NA release) there was barely any content in XI, beleave it or not there was no AH for 1 month. Link to ffxi update history.

So if you dont like it stop playing and come back in 1 yr when they have had time to fix things and add content.

Wtf were you expecting when you started playing on release day.


+1 and a +1 =)
#30 Sep 26 2010 at 9:18 PM Rating: Good
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Soezu wrote:
I read over a bunch of the threads and it's hilarious to me. The same people that were defending SE about all the so called "minor" issues and saying "this is beta, have you guys never played a beta before?" are now saying similar things about the live game that costed 70+ dollars. "It's only 3 days into CE launch!!!!" Yeah it is...And it's also no longer beta. Why are there still MAJOR issues that players talked about over and over during the betas? Just a few things:

- Still cant see party members on the map???
- UI still lags out when crafting???
- STILL no auction house?


To me and many other players these are major issues. Especially no AH, and server side UI lag. It's literally unbearable to have to spend 10 minutes selling off my junk loot to a NPC due to server side UI lag.

Queue the "Dont like it, dont play it" and the "It's only 3 days live, what do you expect?" responses.


Edited, Sep 26th 2010 2:49pm by Soezu


The thing is some people don't find those major issues. I for one don't find any of those 3 you listed as a reason to rage quit a game, and try to blast forums with the "don't buy this game memo." Really though, those issues are minor in the scope of things. Something major would be along the lines of servers crashing at a random and constant basis. The game runs relatively smooth with some UI lag that will eventually be fixed. Heck even certain MMO expansion don't run as smooth. Servers crashing left and right, and this MMO has been around the block a few times.
#31 Sep 27 2010 at 1:09 AM Rating: Decent
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ITS BETA !!!

Things will be good at release.



























oh wait...
#32 Sep 27 2010 at 1:18 AM Rating: Decent
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Mithraspike wrote:
ITS BETA !!!

Things will be good at release.



























oh wait...


And they are so good right now. I have not played an MMO that is so impressive at release. As I think a previous poster mentioned, this game crashes out less times at release than most MMO's do months into their existence.

Huge rate ups for SE for getting the servers so stable so fast.

Huge rate ups for delivering on time

Huge rate ups for a commitment to deliver the new content over the next few months as the game starts to mature.
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#33 Sep 27 2010 at 1:20 AM Rating: Good
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When I checked server population today at 7pm PST versus yesterday at 7pm PST there were 1836 people logged in today, while there had been 2564 people logged in yesterday.

25% less people were playing on Mysidia.
#34 Sep 27 2010 at 1:32 AM Rating: Good
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And this is because?

I think you are suggesting that the game is losing its audience - i suspect a bit premature given that the number of people on Wutai has been on steady increase since launch day. Perhaps everyone was at church (being a Sunday). Perhaps people were having a break after 4 hectic days of levelling - I know I took last night off to chill after playing pretty solid for the last few days.

This is a pre-order early access period and already the servers are pretty busy.

MMO's are designed for the long haul, how many people logged into WoW in the first week. I suspect not as many as this game will get.


I would rather play on a server with 5,000 engaged, enthusiastic positive players than 10,000 haters who wish the game was easier so they could have hit the cap already. SE will get a big enough audience to sustain the game. I personally dont care about much else.

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 3:34am by HallieXIV
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#35 Sep 27 2010 at 2:27 AM Rating: Excellent
I think some people just need to sort out exactly what was or wasn't something a reasonable person would expect to see fixed in an open beta.

The open beta was about stress testing the servers and continuing to gather feedback from closed beta testers. It would appear that a lot of bugs were fixed, which is very important. Also, a lot of things were changed, and there are more things slated to be changed in the near future. As far as AH, anyone who thought that would be implemented for retail launch was retarded. The lack of an AH was not a bug. It was not something SE had in the wings that they were tweaking and waiting to roll out. They received a lot of feedback saying that the retainer ward system had too many shortcomings and very few benefits over a standard auction system and SE has apparently since decided that they want to add something. Whether it's a centralized search feature or something that more closely resembles an AH, we don't know, but these kinds of systems don't just develop themselves. They have to be planned, coded, tested, fixed, reworked, tested again, etc. Anyone who said there was no AH because it was beta was dumb.

No MMO releases fully polished. The majority of times, the studios start running out of money to develop the game and have to just push it out the door. If they can't get enough polish on it by the time it hits consumers, they lose out on a lot of fickle subscribers but they still tend to make money. So far, there are only a small handful of things I find irritating about the way the game is set up (most notable being the crafting/inventory UI).
#36 Sep 27 2010 at 2:59 AM Rating: Decent
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This game will be in beta for the first year or so before we get a complete product.
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#37 Sep 27 2010 at 3:02 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
I think some people just need to sort out exactly what was or wasn't something a reasonable person would expect to see fixed in an open beta.

The open beta was about stress testing the servers and continuing to gather feedback from closed beta testers. It would appear that a lot of bugs were fixed, which is very important. Also, a lot of things were changed, and there are more things slated to be changed in the near future. As far as AH, anyone who thought that would be implemented for retail launch was retarded. The lack of an AH was not a bug. It was not something SE had in the wings that they were tweaking and waiting to roll out. They received a lot of feedback saying that the retainer ward system had too many shortcomings and very few benefits over a standard auction system and SE has apparently since decided that they want to add something. Whether it's a centralized search feature or something that more closely resembles an AH, we don't know, but these kinds of systems don't just develop themselves. They have to be planned, coded, tested, fixed, reworked, tested again, etc. Anyone who said there was no AH because it was beta was dumb.

No MMO releases fully polished. The majority of times, the studios start running out of money to develop the game and have to just push it out the door. If they can't get enough polish on it by the time it hits consumers, they lose out on a lot of fickle subscribers but they still tend to make money. So far, there are only a small handful of things I find irritating about the way the game is set up (most notable being the crafting/inventory UI).

Going to have to disagree with your first point. Open beta was not at all about gathering feedback. There are also many more issues that were pointed out in the feedback that still remain apparently. I personally didn't bother to preorder and will not be buying the release, but what I remember from alpha/beta has caried over in the posts I read here. I was there from the start of it in April. The lack of AH was not really a shock to me, but the alternative being so incredibly unintuitive is. I would've embraced this idea had it been implemented with even an ounce of thought as to what would make it work well. Ease of use. This is something that is lacking in many aspects of the game.

I had never expected this launch to come out polished. Then again, I didn't expect it to be released before next year. SE is not going to see any profit from this game for years anyway. They probably don't expect to see returns for the next 4 years or so. It's funny and kind of ironic, but SE tossed this game into a savage market without even a shield to defend itself with. Hi gladiators!


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#38 Sep 27 2010 at 3:31 AM Rating: Good
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@TC

Nuh-uh..!
It's still beta you see.. this screen is from today's announcement for the emergency maintenance..
http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/1589/ffxivgame20100927105328.jpg
Seriously though.. this is really from today lol..

Edited, Sep 27th 2010 5:31am by KaineGestalt
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My name is pronounced "kai-neh" actually.. and yes, it is feminine..
#39 Sep 27 2010 at 1:50 PM Rating: Good
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254 posts
People are totally dismissing the whole point of the thread and trying to make me out to be a rage quitting forum troll lol.

Like I've said a few times now...I'm mainly talking to the fanboys that, throughout the whole beta testing insisted all the issues were simply "beta testing issues". Now that the game is live and most of the major issues still exist what are they saying now? I said throughout all beta that issues would NOT be fixed come launch and that OBT is merely just stress testing. This is why they did not allow any OB testers to post feedback on the beta forums.

I'm sorry but having no AH or not even having a search function for the retainers is a MAJOR ISSUE. If you are a crafter, which you sort of need to be in FFXIV to be succesful...Having no way to find specific materials or ingredients that are only crafted by other crafts just makes it next to impossible to make something that is actually useful to you. Crafting in FFXIV is extremely reliant on other crafts to supply specific materials. Now one could say "you should level sub crafts" and I agree. But there's a point where you need to stop. It seems every craft is reliant on every other craft in one way or another. Having no search function on the retainers, not to mention no AH is game breaking for me and many other crafters.

Like I said in previous posts. This is 2010. This isnt Ultima Online. There are certain things that are mandatory for any MMO. To me, FFXIV is a great game that is severely crippled by not including many mandatory fundamentals that every mmo should have at launch.

Someone previously said they have no problem seeing their wife's location on the map. You obviously are talking about the mini map. Yes you can see where your party is on the mini map. But we are talking about the big map. If you're in Gridania and your wife is out doing a guildleve good luck finding her without looking at her screen. The only time you can see your party on any map is when you're standing near each other. Example would be I joined an exp party and they werte already out fighting. Trying to find them required me to get step by step directions from the party leader. "Leave from the north east exit, take your second left, then hang a right, follow the path around then go up the ramp to your right and follow that". <- This is just unacceptable lol. That's game breaking for me seeing as how I am really big into grouping up. How could something as simple as this not be in the live version of the game? That's garbage.

Anyway, I wont be playing FFXIV until AT LEAST the PS3 release as I'm sure many others wont either. I'm sure all this will get polished out in the near future, but like I said before...This isnt beta anymore so **** off with the stupid fanboys defending SE and giving the "This is a fresh mmo blah blah blah" crap. I've launched almost every mmo on the market and NEVER seen a mmo skip out on some of the most basic functions like FFXIV has.

/end wall'o'text
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