Forum Settings
       
This thread is locked

Are the **** still prejudice against playing with NA/EU?Follow

#1 Sep 28 2010 at 2:15 PM Rating: Default
25 posts
When I played FFXI back in the day, I remember the Japanese players were pretty rude about letting English players play with them. In fact in my server there were a group of high level **** that would run around in low level areas killing everything using the auto translate to say something of the affect to "English Leave" or something like that.

It was kind of a sucky move on their part because we didn't mind having them in our parties. Has anything like this happened so far in ffxiv or has a lot changed since the early days of ffxi?


Edited, Sep 28th 2010 4:24pm by CaptainLangston

Edited, Sep 28th 2010 8:20pm by Nizdaar Lock Thread: Thread got out of hand.
#2 Sep 28 2010 at 2:19 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
36 posts
#3 Sep 28 2010 at 2:19 PM Rating: Decent
*
108 posts
I'm sad you had such a bad experience. :( I didn't really have much experience with Asian FFXI players because my playing schedule put me at about 3 am Japan time, but I never had any problems like that. Those were just trolls. I don't think Japanese players as a whole care as much about where you're from as whether or not you can work with them and have a good time.

Edited, Sep 28th 2010 4:20pm by jwhite1083
____________________________
#4 Sep 28 2010 at 2:21 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
Avatar
**
698 posts
Pregidous? I'm only 60% sure you meant prejudice?
____________________________

Burn the land and boil the sea, you can't take the sky from me.
#5 Sep 28 2010 at 2:21 PM Rating: Decent
***
3,825 posts
Did you call them **** then? That might be your problem.

I know my eyes have been opened a bit since living in the UK as an American. When we go out to a Chinese or Asian restruant with British friends they will often say that it's good Chinky Food... I found this appaling at first but then I've heard it said in front of local Asians (well local Asians include Middle Easterners as well according to them and I suppose US History class) and there's not even an eye batted. Granted they call black people black on TV and Radio and it apparantly isn't offensive over here either...

However **** has pretty much almost been a derogitory term to Japanse folks no matter what country they live in.

Oh in answer to your question I've run across JP, French, German, and Spanish players and while I haven't seen good use of the Auto-Translate function yet, every one that HAS (capitilized because it's minimal) spoken to me has been friendly.
____________________________
FFXI:Sylph - Perrin 75 Hume THF; Retired (At least from my use any way)
EVE Online:ScraperX; Retired
WAR:IronClaw- Peryn SW;SkullThrone- Grymloc BO; Retired


#6 Sep 28 2010 at 2:22 PM Rating: Good
***
1,636 posts
can I point out that you just used an ethnic slur to describe the group you are curious dont want to play with you?
____________________________


#7 Sep 28 2010 at 2:25 PM Rating: Good
*
108 posts
KujaKoF wrote:
can I point out that you just used an ethnic slur to describe the group you are curious dont want to play with you?


I gave him the benefit of a doubt. People learn new things every day.
____________________________
#8 Sep 28 2010 at 2:27 PM Rating: Default
**
265 posts
jwhite1083 wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
can I point out that you just used an ethnic slur to describe the group you are curious dont want to play with you?


I gave him the benefit of a doubt. People learn new things every day.


I suppose if you have been living in a cave for the past 60 years you could have just learned that. The title really did make me *facepalm*... not just saying that.
#9 Sep 28 2010 at 2:27 PM Rating: Decent
25 posts
Ryshenron wrote:
Pregidous? I'm only 60% sure you meant prejudice?


PerrinofSylph wrote:
Did you call them **** then? That might be your problem.

I know my eyes have been opened a bit since living in the UK as an American. When we go out to a Chinese or Asian restruant with British friends they will often say that it's good Chinky Food... I found this appaling at first but then I've heard it said in front of local Asians (well local Asians include Middle Easterners as well according to them and I suppose US History class) and there's not even an eye batted. Granted they call black people black on TV and Radio and it apparantly isn't offensive over here either...

However **** has pretty much almost been a derogitory term to Japanse folks no matter what country they live in.

Oh in answer to your question I've run across JP, French, German, and Spanish players and while I haven't seen good use of the Auto-Translate function yet, every one that HAS (capitilized because it's minimal) spoken to me has been friendly.


KujaKoF wrote:
can I point out that you just used an ethnic slur to describe the group you are curious dont want to play with you?


Yes I did.

I thought it was just short for Japanese like Jewish people go by Jews. This is eye opening however. It would explain a lot, thanks grandpa.
#10 Sep 28 2010 at 2:28 PM Rating: Excellent
Scholar
****
9,997 posts
*** is a very common accidental slur. Personally I don't think there's much justification for being upset by it without knowing the speaker's intentions, but I realize that that belief makes me unpopular with some people.
____________________________
Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#11 Sep 28 2010 at 2:31 PM Rating: Decent
*
82 posts
To answer your question without all the drama, yes.

It really sucks for those of us who chose Figaro, only to find out a week later it's the unofficial Japanese server.
#12 Sep 28 2010 at 2:31 PM Rating: Excellent
*
145 posts
I noticed they didn't like me playing, but then again my character's names were FatMan and LittleBoy
#13 Sep 28 2010 at 2:35 PM Rating: Default
*
108 posts
runtheplacered wrote:
jwhite1083 wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
can I point out that you just used an ethnic slur to describe the group you are curious dont want to play with you?


I gave him the benefit of a doubt. People learn new things every day.


I suppose if you have been living in a cave for the past 60 years you could have just learned that. The title really did make me *facepalm*... not just saying that.


Ignorance knows no bounds. Especially nowadays. :)
____________________________
#14 Sep 28 2010 at 2:44 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
94 posts
Kachi wrote:
*** is a very common accidental slur. Personally I don't think there's much justification for being upset by it without knowing the speaker's intentions, but I realize that that belief makes me unpopular with some people.

Notice people get all bent out of shape by the OP using the word "***" but they dont bat an eye at your sig (I'm not saying you should btw).
#15 Sep 28 2010 at 4:08 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
**
549 posts
Quote:
I know my eyes have been opened a bit since living in the UK as an American. When we go out to a Chinese or Asian restruant with British friends they will often say that it's good Chinky Food... I found this appaling at first but then I've heard it said in front of local Asians (well local Asians include Middle Easterners as well according to them and I suppose US History class) and there's not even an eye batted. Granted they call black people black on TV and Radio and it apparantly isn't offensive over here either...


Well in a way, words only really have meaning when context is applied. In this case of the ops choice of the word, I don't think he meant to call them **** as with negative intention, but with intention of Japanese for short(not a in "Japanese Dwarf").

My UK gf said "Chinky" once before when referring to Chinese food too where she was visiting here in the states and no one even thought about it.

I think it's mostly this overly sensitive culture that America has become, ironic, most Americans claim they're tough, but a little word makes them cry.
____________________________
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination.
#16 Sep 28 2010 at 4:15 PM Rating: Decent
It's Just a Flesh Wound
******
22,699 posts
Quote:
I thought it was just short for Japanese like Jewish people go by Jews. This is eye opening however. It would explain a lot, thanks grandpa.


I followed the same exact way of thinking until I was like 15 and found out it was apparently a racial slur through xi.
____________________________
Dear people I don't like: 凸(●´―`●)凸
#17 Sep 28 2010 at 4:57 PM Rating: Decent
Sage
**
575 posts
CaptainLangston wrote:
Are the **** still prejudice


No real reason to read further than that. So I won't.
#18 Sep 28 2010 at 4:58 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
123 posts
You dumbasses do realize you're prattling on about a term that's considered offensive to Japanese-Americans who were discriminated against in WW2. I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.

"In Singapore[9] and Hong Kong,[10] the term is used freely as a contraction of the adjective "Japanese" rather than as a derogatory term. The Australian news service Asia Pulse also uses the term.[11] In 1970, the Japanese fashion designer Kenzo Takada opened the "Jungle ***" boutique in Paris.[12] In Japan itself, most Japanese are apathetic about the term, according to a 2004 study.[1]"
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#19 Sep 28 2010 at 5:01 PM Rating: Good
Sage
**
575 posts
measureups wrote:
I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.


I'll have to inform pretty much ever jp player I met during my 7+ years in FFXI and tell them they were incorrect about the word being offensive to them. They'll be happy to hear it. Were we wrong about the N-word for African Americans too? Because I could tell them they are wrong about it be an offensive word as well.
#20 Sep 28 2010 at 5:04 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
123 posts
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.


I'll have to inform pretty much ever jp player I met during my 7+ years in FFXI and tell them they were incorrect about the word being offensive to them. They'll be happy to hear it. Were we wrong about the N-word for African Americans too? Because I could tell them they are wrong about it be an offensive word as well.


Dude, it depends on who is saying it and in what context.
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#21 Sep 28 2010 at 5:06 PM Rating: Decent
Sage
**
575 posts
measureups wrote:
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.


I'll have to inform pretty much ever jp player I met during my 7+ years in FFXI and tell them they were incorrect about the word being offensive to them. They'll be happy to hear it. Were we wrong about the N-word for African Americans too? Because I could tell them they are wrong about it be an offensive word as well.


Dude, it depends on who is saying it and in what context.


Ok, Dude.... Thanks for clearing that up? So who exactly is allowed to use the word and in what context?
#22 Sep 28 2010 at 5:09 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
123 posts
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.


I'll have to inform pretty much ever jp player I met during my 7+ years in FFXI and tell them they were incorrect about the word being offensive to them. They'll be happy to hear it. Were we wrong about the N-word for African Americans too? Because I could tell them they are wrong about it be an offensive word as well.


Dude, it depends on who is saying it and in what context.


Ok, Dude.... Thanks for clearing that up? So who exactly is allowed to use the word and in what context?


Probably going to get sub-defaulted for this but here goes..

example A (this would be offensive):

"@#%^ the ****, we should nuke them again!"

example B (not offensive):

"**** are fun to party with, they get sh*t done!"

OR

example A (bad):

"Hang that ******!"

example B (ok):

"Sup Niggah! I ain't seen you all week! What's poppin?!"

Edited, Sep 28th 2010 7:10pm by measureups
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#23 Sep 28 2010 at 5:11 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
***
2,153 posts
Quote:
You dumbasses do realize you're prattling on about a term that's considered offensive to Japanese-Americans who were discriminated against in WW2. I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.

Huh? Who did they ask in that study? Preschool children?
Can't speak for those, but if you ever call us "****" in
a PT, you're sure to get a PT without Rinsui.
#24 Sep 28 2010 at 5:12 PM Rating: Excellent
It's Just a Flesh Wound
******
22,699 posts
Quote:
Ok, Dude.... Thanks for clearing that up? So who exactly is allowed to use the word and in what context?


Black Guy A: What up mah *****?
Guy B: Playin' mario party bro, sh*t is serious business!

Obviously, all you have to do is be the type of person the slur is intended for, and it makes it okay to use it. This effect extends greatly when talking about slurs like "***" and "*****", because all asians look alike. :3

Edited, Sep 28th 2010 7:13pm by Deadgye
____________________________
Dear people I don't like: 凸(●´―`●)凸
#25 Sep 28 2010 at 5:12 PM Rating: Decent
Avatar
*
208 posts
i dont get it tho... how does an abbreviation of a word make it offensive?? what is soo bad about saying *** instead of Japanese??
#26 Sep 28 2010 at 5:13 PM Rating: Good
Sage
**
575 posts
measureups wrote:
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
Vawn43 wrote:
measureups wrote:
I hate to burst your bubble but the term "***" is not considered offensive to the vast majority of those living in Japan.


I'll have to inform pretty much ever jp player I met during my 7+ years in FFXI and tell them they were incorrect about the word being offensive to them. They'll be happy to hear it. Were we wrong about the N-word for African Americans too? Because I could tell them they are wrong about it be an offensive word as well.


Dude, it depends on who is saying it and in what context.


Ok, Dude.... Thanks for clearing that up? So who exactly is allowed to use the word and in what context?


Probably going to get sub-defaulted for this but here goes..

example A (this would be offensive):

"@#%^ the ****, we should nuke them again!"

example B (not offensive):

"**** are fun to party with, they get sh*t done!"


That didn't explain anything. I'm sure any despritive term followed by "we should nuke them again" is going to be offensive.

Many JP players speak english and have become in-game friends over the years. And this subject has been discussed and it from these people I have come to know that the word is considered offensive. And they didn't say, "Yes, that word is very offensive, but only when its followed by you wanting to bomb us".
#27 Sep 28 2010 at 5:13 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
123 posts
Deadgye wrote:
Obviously, all you have to do is be the type of person the slur is intended for, and it makes it okay to use it. This effect extends greatly when talking about slurs like "***" and "*****", because all asians look alike.


lol. i'm white and when i lived in a pretty fail neighborhood when i moved out of my folks house @ 18 I used non-racial slurs quite a bit.
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#28 Sep 28 2010 at 5:15 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
2,153 posts
Quote:
Probably going to get sub-defaulted for this but here goes..

example A (this would be offensive):

"@#%^ the ****, we should nuke them again!"

example B (not offensive):

"**** are fun to party with, they get sh*t done!"

OR

example A (bad):

"Hang that @#%^!"

example B (ok):

"Sup Niggah! I ain't seen you all week! What's poppin?!"

Not true. Derogative terms are an offense no matter what the context is you are using them.
Your inability to understand this speaks of too much trust in "logic", and that people will
"understand I didn't mean it/it was just a joke". Calling a black friend a "*****" may be fun
for you, and some of those called so may not mind; but it is not upon you to decide how they
should feel about it. That's just ignorant. Shows you're unable to leave your own point of
view concerning that matter.
#29 Sep 28 2010 at 5:16 PM Rating: Decent
It's Just a Flesh Wound
******
22,699 posts
demegod wrote:
i dont get it tho... how does an abbreviation of a word make it offensive?? what is soo bad about saying *** instead of Japanese??


I thought this way also a while back, even though it's an abbreviation some people don't view it that way. It's like say a white guy is really good friends with a black guy and they both sometimes refer to the black guy as "my *****" or something similar. They're friends so both of them don't even care about it, but if that white guy uses the term the same way with some black people he just met, there's a decent chance he's getting his *** kicked.
____________________________
Dear people I don't like: 凸(●´―`●)凸
#30 Sep 28 2010 at 5:16 PM Rating: Good
Sage
**
575 posts
demegod wrote:
i dont get it tho... how does an abbreviation of a word make it offensive?? what is soo bad about saying *** instead of Japanese??


Yes, I realize the reason most people use the word as an abbriviation and they don't mean it to be offensive, it is just ingorance on the subject. That does not matter, as it is still considered offensive to the group in question. The accepted abriviation is "jp".
#31 Sep 28 2010 at 5:18 PM Rating: Good
As you've been properly corrected as to the dergatory term you used.

To answer your question: No, they are not prejudice against NA players. However, most do not speak english and the autotranslate function tends to be a bit clunky. Also, like players on the NA side, voice programs do tend to speed up communications in MMOs so many (especially in the hardcore grouping) tend to want to avoid the culture and language barrier to avoid frustration in the game.

That's not prejudice, it's just convinient play. Living as a part of a melting pot culture we really don't think of it very often.

Still, I understand what you mean about having difficulty getting groups. But honestly, some Japaneese players are open enough to try it. Some of my best parties have been of mixed groupings.

So take it on a case by case basis.
#32 Sep 28 2010 at 5:19 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
123 posts
Rinsui wrote:
Quote:
Probably going to get sub-defaulted for this but here goes..

example A (this would be offensive):

"@#%^ the ****, we should nuke them again!"

example B (not offensive):

"**** are fun to party with, they get sh*t done!"

OR

example A (bad):

"Hang that @#%^!"

example B (ok):

"Sup Niggah! I ain't seen you all week! What's poppin?!"

Not true. Derogative terms are an offense no matter what the context is you are using them.
Your inability to understand this speaks of too much trust in "logic", and that people will
"understand I didn't mean it/it was just a joke". Calling a black friend a "*****" may be fun
for you, and some of those called so may not mind; but it is not upon you to decide how they
should feel about it. That's just ignorant. Shows you're unable to leave your own point of
view concerning that matter.


No, I completely understand that some people choose to be offended by words. The issue I seem to have is that I could really care less if you want to get ***** bruised over the matter. In truth the majority of the population of the world are only easily offended when they are in a situation where they can't confront the issue in person. ie., THE INTERNET.
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#33 Sep 28 2010 at 5:23 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
94 posts
Quote:
No, I completely understand that some people choose to be offended by words. The issue I seem to have is that I could really care less if you want to get ***** bruised over the matter. In truth the majority of the population of the world are only easily offended when they are in a situation where they can't confront the issue in person. ie., THE INTERNET.


/thread
#34 Sep 28 2010 at 5:28 PM Rating: Good
Scholar
***
2,153 posts
Quote:
Yes, I realize the reason most people use the word as an abbriviation and they don't mean it to be offensive, it is just ingorance on the subject. That does not matter, as it is still considered offensive to the group in question.

Exactly.
Quote:
To answer your question: No, they are not prejudice against NA players. However, most do not speak english and the autotranslate function tends to be a bit clunky. Also, like players on the NA side, voice programs do tend to speed up communications in MMOs so many (especially in the hardcore grouping) tend to want to avoid the culture and language barrier to avoid frustration in the game.

That's not prejudice, it's just convinient play.

True (in most cases). There are, however, some in which that point is mixed with "real" prejudice, or rather, those unwilling to try out something new by trying to integrate a foreign player in their well-functioning PT system (playstyle sometimes very much differs).
Quote:
No, I completely understand that some people choose to be offended by words. The issue I seem to have is that I could really care less if you want to get ***** bruised over the matter. In truth the majority of the population of the world are only easily offended when they are in a situation where they can't confront the issue in person. ie., THE INTERNET.

Well, that's the ignorance I was talking about. ^.^/ Actually I don't understand what you're trying to tell me with the latter half of that statement. Like: "If I were standing next to you, little asian rice-planter, you wouldn't dare to oppose me! Is it that?"
#35 Sep 28 2010 at 5:29 PM Rating: Good
Sage
**
575 posts
Imnotded wrote:
Quote:
No, I completely understand that some people choose to be offended by words. The issue I seem to have is that I could really care less if you want to get ***** bruised over the matter. In truth the majority of the population of the world are only easily offended when they are in a situation where they can't confront the issue in person. ie., THE INTERNET.


/thread


/thread? I don't understand the argument. Most people only get offended by racial slurs when they aren't there in person to punch them in the face?
#36 Sep 28 2010 at 5:30 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
186 posts
This thread needs to get locked.

Edited, Sep 28th 2010 7:30pm by LordAshal
#37 Sep 28 2010 at 5:30 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
***
2,153 posts
Please lock the thread, yes -.-/
I might lose my temper once again.
#38 Sep 28 2010 at 5:50 PM Rating: Default
*
103 posts
Jebus crepes. Shut up with the "Oh my god, he said something offensive!" diatribes. If you are easily offended, or can't see when people are not using something in a context that would appear to be a slur, shut the **** up already. People are way to quick to jump on the being offended band wagon. Who cares who you **** off saying what you want to say.

God **** tree hugging hippie care bears. Everyday someone gets offended, get over it, this will never be the sparkly fairy rainbow and sunshine world you want it to be, move on already. If you can't handle it, stay in the little bubble that your life is and ignore the fact that in the real world people are people and going to say what the **** they want, when they want, regardless of who it ****** off.

Of course, the ones jumping into the "oh my god! He said something offensive!" fray are the same ones who laugh at South Park, and grew up watching Ren and Stimpy. God **** hypocrites.
____________________________
Life is to short to waste by being nice to everyone all the time. Have fun, **** a few people off, it's good for your blood pressure and peace of mind.
#39 Sep 28 2010 at 6:12 PM Rating: Good
Pagansaint wrote:
Jebus crepes. Shut up with the "Oh my god, he said something offensive!" diatribes. If you are easily offended, or can't see when people are not using something in a context that would appear to be a slur, shut the **** up already. People are way to quick to jump on the being offended band wagon. Who cares who you **** off saying what you want to say.

God **** tree hugging hippie care bears. Everyday someone gets offended, get over it, this will never be the sparkly fairy rainbow and sunshine world you want it to be, move on already. If you can't handle it, stay in the little bubble that your life is and ignore the fact that in the real world people are people and going to say what the **** they want, when they want, regardless of who it ****** off.

Of course, the ones jumping into the "oh my god! He said something offensive!" fray are the same ones who laugh at South Park, and grew up watching Ren and Stimpy. God **** hypocrites.


You sound offended.
____________________________
Love,
PunkFloyd
#40 Sep 28 2010 at 6:13 PM Rating: Default
Scholar
*
123 posts
PunkFloyd, King of Bards wrote:
Pagansaint wrote:
Jebus crepes. Shut up with the "Oh my god, he said something offensive!" diatribes. If you are easily offended, or can't see when people are not using something in a context that would appear to be a slur, shut the **** up already. People are way to quick to jump on the being offended band wagon. Who cares who you **** off saying what you want to say.

God **** tree hugging hippie care bears. Everyday someone gets offended, get over it, this will never be the sparkly fairy rainbow and sunshine world you want it to be, move on already. If you can't handle it, stay in the little bubble that your life is and ignore the fact that in the real world people are people and going to say what the **** they want, when they want, regardless of who it ****** off.

Of course, the ones jumping into the "oh my god! He said something offensive!" fray are the same ones who laugh at South Park, and grew up watching Ren and Stimpy. God **** hypocrites.


You sound offended.


I'm offended by people getting offended over the "J"-word.
____________________________
i5-750 @3.4ghz/4gb DDR-1600/HD5770

Hundah - EQ2:80sk(Befallen) *current
Hunda - FFXI:75pld(fairy->hades) *retired
Measure - EQ2:90trb,90def(Lucan D'Lere) *sold
#41 Sep 28 2010 at 6:15 PM Rating: Default
*
154 posts
Yes this does happen, you meet a few who don't mind using the translate function which makes it fun.

But most will just completely ignore you.
This thread is locked
This Forum is Read Only!
Recent Visitors: 13 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (13)