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Do you think Square-Enix should have waited until 2011?Follow

#52 Sep 29 2010 at 4:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Vanguard, Conan, and Tabula Rasa have something to say about rushing a launch.
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#53 Sep 29 2010 at 7:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Jennestia wrote:
Catrim wrote:
How many years passed between FF12 and FF13....

and FF13 is arguably one of the worst FF games.

No, they shouldn't have waited. Time doesn't necessarily mean quality.


I find FFVII worse than XIII, all XIII did was make it apparent how on rails a FF storyline actually is for awhile. Really think about every FF you've played and how there's invisible plot walls even if you can explore the whole world the second you stepped out of a city.

Heck XIII gave birth to one of the most beautiful songs I've heard in a FF game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eV1ilRlYmgE

But different subject for a different topic~

Edited, Sep 29th 2010 1:53pm by Jennestia


You're opinion no longer matters because apparently you have a horrible judgment with games.. To say that 13 was better than 7 is mind boggling. 7 was definitely one of the best FF games released where as everyone I've talked to about 13 agrees with me that it's pretty bad.

And yes, I do believe they should have waited till around November to release. Give the game a bit more time to be polished. However, knowing SE, they would have sat on their asses and put in new things they thought were cool instead of actually working out some of the kinks.
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#54 Sep 29 2010 at 7:17 PM Rating: Excellent
Yes they should have. While releasing it later may have had less impact with other games being released, releasing an incomplete game will give enormous seriously negative press. A lot of people who try it won't keep paying for it, and a lot of people who might have otherwise tried it now will not. It's seriously a failure of a move to release an incomplete game just to meet a release date.
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#55 Sep 29 2010 at 7:48 PM Rating: Good
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The release date is irrelevant. The most important thing is what goes on before the game is released. So far the major issues with this game are all from developmental stages. They have decades of experience with RPGs, 8 years of experience in MMOs and they've been working on this project for around 6 years now. Keeping this in mind magnifies the mistakes they have made so far. I'm not bashing SE, but they really should have done better on the development end. Incredible graphics and great music does not compliment mediocre controls and mechanics.

MMOs are meant to be released missing certain pieces. The whole idea is to grow and expand, but they neglected to add things that would have avoided the outcry. The funny thing is, I don't really have a problem with the bigger stuff that is absent. No auction house? No problem... if the market wards had a search feature. The thing that kills it for me are the basics: Functional UI and controls for keyboard, mouse AND controller. Inventory sort, **** just make it auto-sort and be done with it. Class specific action bars that revert to what you stored previously when you changed classes.

I could make a list a mile long. Someone could make a list just as long of temporary fixes, but the bottom line is that this stuff should have been thought through from the beginning. How do you develop a product that lacks the same functionality of a comparable product you released 8 years ago? Its like taking someone's CD player, handing them a shiny new cassette walkman and telling them it is going to turn into an iPod at some point down the road.
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#56 Sep 29 2010 at 8:11 PM Rating: Decent
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A game this bad is not going to be around long. I expect they'll start shutting servers down soon. Have you seen the response of the Japanese gaming community to this abommination? Check the comments on amazon.co.jp's FFXIV product page. Count the stars and look at the comments that are found to be useful. You don't have to be able to read Japanese. One star is one star. I only wonder if SE can survive this catastrophe. Titanic fail?

Edited, Sep 29th 2010 10:20pm by Chaiwallah
#57 Sep 29 2010 at 8:14 PM Rating: Default
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Chaiwallah wrote:
A game this bad is not going to be around long. I expect they'll start shutting servers down soon. Have you seen the response of the Japanese gaming community to this abommination? Check the comments on amazon.co.jp's FFXIV product page. Count the stars and look at the comments that are found to be useful. You don't have to be able to read Japanese. One star is one star. I only wonder if SE can survive this catastrophe.
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#58 Sep 29 2010 at 8:52 PM Rating: Good
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the release date is irrelevant? I'm not so sure about that. As an example, I did the whole pre-order collector's edition of Aion way-back-when. I honestly was interested in playing the game, but then the relatively tolerable draw-in of questing gave way to that hardcore grinding aspect that I wasn't the slightest bit interested in.

So, I figured I'd give them a few months to get things sorted, if they ever did. The months went by, I got email newsletters from ncsoft about all the new changes and stuff they made for the game, their bonuses for keeping a subscription for X amount of months and stuff... but I just never bothered to resub. Don't know why, I guess that first impression was enough for me, regardless of whatever other steps they might've taken to improve the game.

While I admit I stuck with FFXI for a long period of time, it was because I was pretty much an MMO newb: I didn't have much of any experience with other MMOS, so FFXI just seemed awesome at the time. These days, I've seen plenty of MMOs, and certain decisions made by S-E regarding the development of this game just seems "meh."

I may play indefinitely: I buy every major franchise FF that's released, I play FF MMOs because I'm somewhat of a fan of the series, but what about the other players? The normal FF games usually sell what, anywhere from 5 million to 9 million copies? The suits at S-E have got to be wondering why those numbers aren't carrying over to their online games, and they're failing to take note that it's their own actions that're keeping a larger player-base away.

Little stunts like rushing unfinished MMOs out to market don't help them any, either. People reading this forum may be the more resilient player type that's been through the FFXI crap and will play regardless, but the other people they're trying to actually get to play the game WILL NOT. They might play the game, encounter some difficulties with gameplay, and just move on, and that'll be the end of that.

Like I've said, I don't think S-E cares about the "few" junkies like us that keep our subs active; they couldn't care less about your individual enjoyment of the game if your aspect of a fun game is an exclusive community that numbers in the mere hundreds of thousands. They're eyeballing the millions of "FF" players that aren't playing their MMOs -- but their actions basically undermine their objective.


Edited, Sep 29th 2010 11:10pm by ghosthacked
#59 Sep 29 2010 at 9:02 PM Rating: Decent
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I am going to guess that for every 1 person that hates this game and posts on this site and others, there are probably 25 that love the game and are too busy playing to post.

The game certainly has issues, im not going to say its perfect but I am having a huge amount of fun playing. I rush home from work every day and the first thing I do is boot my PC up. Yes, there are things I dont like but I guarantee you there are 10's of thousands of players (maybe even 100's of thousands of players) that will still be playing this game for years to come.

There are issues - they will be fixed. Then there are a lot of QQing players who are just annoyed this game isnt WoW, Aion or whatever other MMO they like most. Many of the complaints just dont stack up - lag for example, what lag?
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#60 Sep 29 2010 at 9:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm glad this game is getting bad public opinions among the Japanese as well - I hope the major game magazines there rip this game apart in their reviews. The reason I say this is because I'm sure SE is much more likely to respond to Japanese criticism then listen to any critics coming from the West.

There are a lot of aspects of FF XIV that I enjoy but at the same time, the negatives are extremely frustrating because most of these negatives are things that worked great in FF XI and because of some bizarre decisions by SE, removed from this game. Item sorting? The party search system? The previous linkshell management system? Being able to see your party members on the map? Weren't these things all in place in a game that's been around for 8 years now - and they decide taking these things out is a good idea? I'm not mentioning the AH here because I can sort of understand the reason for not having it right at the launch - but I will say they had better have one within a few months because people are going to get tired of spending hours in bazaars really , really quick. I can honestly say that my enjoyment of this game will double or more once all of these issues are (hopefully) addressed.

Another thing that seems contradictory to me is the Battle Regimen system. Am I the only one who thinks the old Weapon Skill -> Magic Burst system felt a lot more interactive and more satisfying? Now we just input attacks into a list and one party member hits a button? First SE says they want combat to be more interactive so there's no auto-attck , we have to swing/stab/attack manually each time - I have no problem with that. But then why remove the old WS->MB system and then replace it with a much less interactive system like Battle Regimen ? This isn't a deal-breaker or anything and I'm sure most of us can learn to accept the new battle system, but once again I think they removed one of the best aspects of the previous game.
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#61 Sep 29 2010 at 9:51 PM Rating: Excellent
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ditx wrote:
They never would have known the Retainer system wasn't usable in its current state. They never would have been able to predict many many things which are set to be heading our way in the near future.


The problems with the retainer system were fully predictable. Even without testing it, it was obvious with just a little thought that is would not scale well with population - i.e. that as a server's population grew, it would become increasingly difficult and time consuming for players to find the specific items they wanted to buy.
#62 Sep 29 2010 at 9:51 PM Rating: Default
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HallieXIV wrote:
I am going to guess that for every 1 person that hates this game and posts on this site and others, there are probably 25 that love the game and are too busy playing to post.?


Realy Awsome number, can you prove it? You are enjoying the game and still making post on forum.

HallieXIV wrote:
The game certainly has issues, im not going to say its perfect but I am having a huge amount of fun playing. I rush home from work every day and the first thing I do is boot my PC up. Yes, there are things I dont like but I guarantee you there are 10's of thousands of players (maybe even 100's of thousands of players) that will still be playing this game for years to come.


What happen if it's wrong, since you garanty it? you ll refound everyone that bought the game? comon 100k player .. even a fanboy on crack wouldnt say that

HallieXIV wrote:
There are issues - they will be fixed. Then there are a lot of QQing players who are just annoyed this game isnt WoW, Aion or whatever other MMO they like most. Many of the complaints just dont stack up - lag for example, what lag?


Easy to presume that every QQing players are ex-wow player, you do have no opinion you just read and resume other post and some random numbers, QQing might not help to make the game better but being blind wont either!
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#63 Sep 29 2010 at 10:00 PM Rating: Excellent
zpanda wrote:


Another thing that seems contradictory to me is the Battle Regimen system. Am I the only one who thinks the old Weapon Skill -> Magic Burst system felt a lot more interactive and more satisfying? Now we just input attacks into a list and one party member hits a button? First SE says they want combat to be more interactive so there's no auto-attck , we have to swing/stab/attack manually each time - I have no problem with that. But then why remove the old WS->MB system and then replace it with a much less interactive system like Battle Regimen ? This isn't a deal-breaker or anything and I'm sure most of us can learn to accept the new battle system, but once again I think they removed one of the best aspects of the previous game.


Gawd, thinking back on it. The WS+WS->MB system was so fun : \ It made me play Samurai because I loved being able to always WS off people's stuff. I knew that WS diagram like a fanatic.
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#64 Sep 29 2010 at 10:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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HallieXIV wrote:
Then there are a lot of QQing players who are just annoyed this game isnt WoW, Aion or whatever other MMO they like most. Many of the complaints just dont stack up - lag for example, what lag?
Never played WoW and didn't like Aion. Still doesn't change the fact that not including stuff like an inventory sort by launch after 5 months of testing is remarkably stupid. Or alt+tab. Or UI shortcuts. And so on...

Edited, Sep 29th 2010 11:01pm by bsphil
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#65 Sep 29 2010 at 10:10 PM Rating: Good
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ghosthacked wrote:
the release date is irrelevant?

I didn't see much in your post about this specifically, but my point was that if they had taken the time in development to sort out the easy stuff, the things that are missing which seem elementary, they would not be in this situation. People would be much more willing to accept other content specific issues coming down the road if the focus was away from things this game should have included at launch. I guess technically it isn't launch yet, depending on your timezone, but I don't know what is in store for the main release. Needless to say, I'm not all that hopeful given what has happened from the beginning of alpha up to now.
HallieXIV wrote:
There are issues - they will be fixed. Then there are a lot of QQing players who are just annoyed this game isnt WoW, Aion or whatever other MMO they like most. Many of the complaints just dont stack up - lag for example, what lag?

I hear this way too often. No one wants this game to be WoW. If they did, they wouldn't give a **** anyway because they would be playing WoW. What people want are certain elements that other games have incorporated used in XIV. Whenever I see a WoW argument there are two words that pop into my head... User Interface. I would like my game to run well in windowed mode, like WoW. I would like the ability to type a complete sentence into the chat window, without having to select the chat window and without being interrupted by in game actions, like WoW. I want to be able to create a clean, customizable interface with keybinds and macros, like WoW. It would be nice to be able to alt-tab to the desktop, like I can in WoW. NOTE: You can substitute hundreds of games for WoW, it just happens to get used due to popularity because most people will know what the **** you're talking about or have probably played at some point or another.

Check the server populations now and record it. Then check again in a week after release. Then again a month after that when the free play wears off. I bet you will be surprised.



Edited, Sep 30th 2010 12:11am by FilthMcNasty
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30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#66 Sep 29 2010 at 10:43 PM Rating: Excellent
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While I'm enjoying the game, I would be enjoying it a lot more with some kind of system for shopping. Bugs are inevitable, but as much as this subject is beat to death, buying items you want is a Sisyphean ordeal at this point and it's 100% a choice in design. Someone actually sat at a desk, looked at the retainer system, and decided it was a good idea. It just boggles the mind - supermarkets can certainly improve, but when I'm picking up groceries I don't think "This place would be even better if the things on shelves were randomly sorted into unmarked cardboard boxes!"

No doubt there are some people being reflexively negative, but there are some pretty big problems that are simply the result of choices. While it's not as serious as the difficult shopping issue, the UI is incredibly clunky and inelegant. People are hopefully going to be using the UI for years - there's no need to make basic tasks needlessly difficult. I had to click so many times to check wear on items that I thought I was playing a FPS.
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#67thehellfire, Posted: Sep 29 2010 at 11:07 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) man did the haters come out for this thread, just ragequit and gtfo over to cataclysm forums or swtor or wherever you'll troll next
#68 Sep 29 2010 at 11:17 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm happy to be able to play now, even with the poor UI. So long as they correct that until 2011, I'm glad they released the game last week and not in 2011 ^^
#69 Sep 29 2010 at 11:29 PM Rating: Default
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[quote=FilthMcNasty
Check the server populations now and record it. Then check again in a week after release. Then again a month after that when the free play wears off. I bet you will be surprised.



Edited, Sep 30th 2010 12:11am by FilthMcNasty [/quote]

I would rather have 100,000 committed players who are fun to hang out with than 1,000,000 players who are a complete pain in the backside. Frankly I am looking forward to all of the cry babies getting out of the game so those of us who enjoy it, can enjoy it in peace.

All that matters is that there are sufficient players playing to keep the game alive - I dont think there is any risk of this not happening.

As an aside, it is only on forums you see the hate. Every single person I have met in game is having a great time - sure there are complaints but nothing that would stop them logging in as often as they can.
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#70 Sep 29 2010 at 11:35 PM Rating: Default
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nope the game comes out sept 30th !
we just have openbeta thats gonna let us keep our characters, remember early access started on the 21st.

well we will see if you get a big *** version update tomarrow.
#71thehellfire, Posted: Sep 29 2010 at 11:36 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) QFT Happy players dont post alot. They are to busy playing!
#72 Sep 30 2010 at 12:51 AM Rating: Decent
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... Unless they are at work... :D
#73 Sep 30 2010 at 5:07 AM Rating: Good
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UltKnightGrover wrote:
Tl;dr Version: Would you have rather waited for the release to come later to start off with the features that seem to be needed in the game or do you not regret starting now in September with all of these missing features?


I play the game with 2 friends from FF XI and so far we are having a good time even with all the hicups that are around at the moment, so far I would say it is ok that they release the game now.

But still some things are really weird, take sorting the inventory for example. That was taken out of game in the start of Alpha (April 2010) and did not return even at release. I am sure that this issue is on the list of the developers and that there is other stuff on higher priority to be solved 1st but that really means that maybe there is still too much stuff not working for a real release, IMHO.
I really would like to see the "Known Error Database" for FFXIV right now ;).

Cheers,
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#74 Sep 30 2010 at 5:30 AM Rating: Decent
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The game is excellent, despite its flaws right now. I understand that it just came out and that it is going to take a little bit of time to fix the little annoying quarks that it currently has and i just ignore it. now in 6 months if the game is still funky and has major issues yeah there is going to be a problem, but i am really happy that the game is out now. Im currently stationed in Iraq and the game is making my off time worthwhile.. (and yes the internet is good enough to play out here.. barely..)

but i have a feeling that those who constantly ***** about the game then leave are going to miss out on a great game once they get themselves situated.. either way im having a great time and i dont care what bad **** people say about it..
#75 Sep 30 2010 at 5:35 AM Rating: Decent
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Anurid wrote:
... Unless they are at work... :D

like myself lol

Edited, Sep 30th 2010 7:36am by Elandren
#76 Sep 30 2010 at 5:57 AM Rating: Default
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If they had waited, some bugs will still be discovered. In adding any new content = more possible bugs. So what? 12 months of just BUG fixing?

Nah happy to play it now people are just whiny and moany
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#77 Sep 30 2010 at 10:51 PM Rating: Good
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HallieXIV wrote:
I would rather have 100,000 committed players who are fun to hang out with than 1,000,000 players who are a complete pain in the backside. Frankly I am looking forward to all of the cry babies getting out of the game so those of us who enjoy it, can enjoy it in peace.

All that matters is that there are sufficient players playing to keep the game alive - I dont think there is any risk of this not happening.

Based on your example above, and given the fact that there are probably 10 times as many people playing WoW than there are people playing FFXI and FFXIV, it doesn't really mean much. This is important because while it seems that there are far more idiots in WoW, well... there actually are, but only because so many people play. If all of a sudden 10 million people started playing FFXIV you would notice the same trend. In a room filled with 10 people, there is always going to be one idiot. In a room filled with 100 people there will be 10 idiots. The population is different, but the ratio remains the same.
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Rinsui wrote:
Only hips + boobs all day and hips + boobs all over my icecream

HaibaneRenmei wrote:
30 bucks is almost free

cocodojo wrote:
Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#78 Oct 01 2010 at 1:11 AM Rating: Decent
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They should have waited until they implemented an auction house.....Not having one is taking a huge step backwards imo. It wasnt a matter of waiting, it's more a matter of getting it right. At this time the game is a mess.
#79 Oct 03 2010 at 9:03 PM Rating: Default
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To be completely honest?

Firstly, I think alot of people hyped the game up too much in their heads because of their love for XI. I kind of feel this is S/E fault in a way however. They stated that this isn't going to be an updated XI, but an entirely new game entirely. Then they make all the playable races pretty much exactly the same albeit name changes. When an XI player looks at the game, it looks like an updated FFXI....... If you want to start fresh S/E, you kind of got to start fresh.... You know? Tho we all know they did this for a reason don't we? ;)

I feel alot of people rushed to buy the game rather the S/E rushed to release it. Majority (not all tho) of the people complaining are people who've yet to experienced an MMO from day 1 launch and did not know what they were about to face. For those that feel XIV should've been released at a later time? Noone forced you to buy it. You have a 1 monthe free trial. Cancel your account, but don't delete your character. Feel free to rejoin at anytime and continue where you left off. Come back when the PS3 version releases in March '11. I'm sure things will be more to your liking by then.

Yes, the game it's fair share of issues, but lets face it.
All MMOs have a rocky start due to the fact that that the game and the world itself is forever changing. Things get changed around constantly as people play the game and realise what works and what doesn't, What they like and what they don't like. What has to be changed or what they can learn to cope with because it isn't as bad as they make it out to be.

I honestly think this was a huge factor in why the PS3 version was pushed back aswell. Your average console gamer may not be a PC gamer and chances are less likely that they are also MMO players. Especially Launch Day MMO players. You think alot of people are complaining and whining now? Imagine if it had launched on the PS3 aswell. All **** would've broken loose guaranteed.. It gives S/E the time needed to polish up the game to a more respectable fashion for the console gamers much like they did with XI on the PS2.

Welcome everyone to the Launch Day MMO Club. My name is Faaeng and I'm a long standing member. =P
{edited} BTW, the words "unfinished" and "MMO" are synonymous to one another. They day an MMO is "finished" is the day the servers get shut down. ;)

Edited, Oct 3rd 2010 11:25pm by Faaeng
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#80 Oct 04 2010 at 1:53 AM Rating: Default
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Of course not silly... if they delay this then
1) The game will still be as it is now or
2) The game might not even be release due to financial/budget problems

The release date that SE had committed to their share holders must be met.
Those share holder does not care whether this game is complete and does not even care what the player wants because it time the share holders see revenues for this investment.

The only people that really cares about the quality of this game are the team involve. but without revenue coming in there will be no budget to start anything.

In addition, the PS 3 version is going out to the mass population and it got to be the completed version.
therefore either you like it or not...we who bought either one of the edition are guinea pig customer who we pay them to improve the game.

But seriously, in the course of this 2 ~ 3 weeks... most of my RL friends and those that i met in FF 14, who had play MMO like WoW, aeon etc etc tends to grumble alot on why isnt like this like WoW or aeon or war hammer or etc etc...where we got this and that...

These people got to wake up because
1) FF 11 is the model of this game.
2) This is FF14 and it is not going to be like WoW, aeon etc etc or even FF11..

if you think the crafting system is ******, or there is no NPC who sell high lv armor or weapon ******, down to the simplest things of walking from one country to another takes forever. Then you had better consider to quit this game or wait till the PS 3 version is release.

Because if these things are available straight out from where you want it...then this game is too comfortable for people who had played harder MMO before.





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