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So whats the new trick to crafting?Follow

#1 Sep 30 2010 at 10:03 PM Rating: Default
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I'm having troubles with crafting. Can someone either explain the way it works now that they have reworked crafting or can someone point me in the direction of a website with good instructions? If you are having lots of success and are just gonna come hear and say something like L2P or something else like that ...congrats on your ingame mastery of crafting please just lend a hand.
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#2 Sep 30 2010 at 10:05 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not higher than 12 in any craft atm but ive had reasonable success just using standard all the time. Wait if it flashes. Thats it.
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#3 Sep 30 2010 at 10:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Timorith wrote:
I'm not higher than 12 in any craft atm but ive had reasonable success just using standard all the time. Wait if it flashes. Thats it.


What do you mean flashes? Is that when it looks like it blows up?
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#4 Sep 30 2010 at 10:10 PM Rating: Good
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alot of hempen crafting gear helps i think.
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#5 Sep 30 2010 at 10:16 PM Rating: Default
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#6 Sep 30 2010 at 10:19 PM Rating: Good
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Well, as far as the minigame goes, Standard seems a better choice now for making things around your level, while Rapid seems only real good for steamrolling low stuff. But that's still an ongoing debate. As for what to do to level a craft, I'd suggest going to the class forums here or going to the recipe section and looking for easy recipes at the lowest rank.
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#7 Sep 30 2010 at 10:24 PM Rating: Default
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I think flashing means you have equal chance of success in all 3 methods. White,Gold,Pink...Im pretty sure pink is bold but still testing the other 2. so far white is rapid and gold is standard, i think???????
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#8 Sep 30 2010 at 10:48 PM Rating: Default
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Okay, final edit with my findings.

Using this strategy, I was able to go 5/5 on a synth 1 rank above my leatherworking.

White= Standard, Pink=Rapid, Gold=Bold, flashing=wait.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 12:09am by Uryuu
#9 Sep 30 2010 at 11:23 PM Rating: Default
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Uryuu wrote:
Okay, final edit with my findings.

Using this strategy, I was able to go 5/5 on a synth 1 rank above my leatherworking.

White= Standard, GOLD=Rapid, PINK=Bold, flashing=wait.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 12:09am by Uryuu


this seems to be the way to go except i fixed the error on your post and i never use bold, the consequences are just too dire. standard is a good fill in.
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#10 Oct 01 2010 at 12:21 AM Rating: Default
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This also works, close your eyes and keep smashing that enter key!

If element is going out of control, no worries HIT THAT KEY! Standard = Rapid now since standard doesn't cause sparks and sparks ruin durability. If your failing alot, chances are you need a new hammer/better gear or your rank is too low. You REALLY need to be at the same ranking to make anything or at least close, until you get the training books... Which I am still trying to get myself
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#11 Oct 01 2010 at 12:33 AM Rating: Good
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Uryuu wrote:
Okay, final edit with my findings.

Using this strategy, I was able to go 5/5 on a synth 1 rank above my leatherworking.

White= Standard, Pink=Rapid, Gold=Bold, flashing=wait.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 12:09am by Uryuu


That sample size is incredibly too small to even amount to any findings. I can get 5/5 on a synth 4 levels above my rank by doing that EXACT opposite <.<
#12 Oct 01 2010 at 12:44 AM Rating: Good
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Yeah I used to could just spam Rapid and throw in a couple of Bolds at the end if I had alot of durability left. I never used Standard to get any craft to 10. Looks like they threw us a curveball.
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#13 Oct 01 2010 at 12:52 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'll dare to say that crafting has become a little more... reliable? At least "reliable" in the sense that it feels less random and more like there's a method behind it when compared to how it used to be (read: click and pray). Sure it's been "adjusted" (ninja adjusted too, and probably would still be if SE didn't mess it up the first time), but now between Standard, Rapid, and Bold I can somewhat expect what's going to happen before the action even finishes.

I've only been back in the game for a few hours trying to compare it to what I experienced during Beta, but that's at least how it feels to me. Time will tell I guess.
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#14 Oct 01 2010 at 1:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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Actually the colours don't represent what action to take. They are examples of what the success rate of your next action will be.. White 75% yellow 50% red 25% something like that.

Through testing I think the flashing is "unknown state" as in your char is not skilled enough to tell what colour it is. I say this as when working a way lower synth the flashing hardly occurs.
As for the dif levels of flashing I need to do more research on but from what I've noticed the faster the flashing the further you are from telling the state of the mats.
I.e. Fast flashing 2-3 waits will show current states slow flash 1 wait.

But I'm sure colours do not represent what action to take only success rate. Try it out for yourselves. Wait on red and only go on White or yellow or if you're brave flashing. I do suggest not using rapid on yellow however as with a 50/50 chance rapid failure loses alot of durability.
#15 Oct 01 2010 at 1:46 AM Rating: Good
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terabyt3 wrote:
Actually the colours don't represent what action to take. They are examples of what the success rate of your next action will be.. White 75% yellow 50% red 25% something like that.

Through testing I think the flashing is "unknown state" as in your char is not skilled enough to tell what colour it is. I say this as when working a way lower synth the flashing hardly occurs.
As for the dif levels of flashing I need to do more research on but from what I've noticed the faster the flashing the further you are from telling the state of the mats.
I.e. Fast flashing 2-3 waits will show current states slow flash 1 wait.

But I'm sure colours do not represent what action to take only success rate. Try it out for yourselves. Wait on red and only go on White or yellow or if you're brave flashing. I do suggest not using rapid on yellow however as with a 50/50 chance rapid failure loses alot of durability.


You know, that's actually a pretty nice theory. Never thought of that, but it makes sense*. I figured the solid colored orbs represented your base success rate, but I always wonder if the lower your estimated success rate the greater benefit you get from a successful attempt as a trade off. I can never tell because the Progress/Durability/Quality gains/losses per turn seem to have a wide range of values they can hit based on the action used and I don't feel like throwing away shards and materials to test it yet.

*Unfortunately, SE doesn't like things that make sense
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#16 Oct 01 2010 at 1:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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I have noticed before that white > yellow > red, at least it seemed so. I think you might also be right about blinking, since I seem to get it alot less when I'm a number of levels above the synth.
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#17 Oct 01 2010 at 2:12 AM Rating: Excellent
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i agree with the last few posts. and the alchemist lvl 10 ability seems to back that idea up http://ffxiv.zam.com/en/ability.html?ffxivability=29553
it makes the orb white for a few turns, so if making it favorable is white then white probably simply has the best success rate for any attempt, and after that yellow is usually a warning color and red is usually a stop sign. still dunno what the flashing colors are, so the idea that they are simply unidentified white/yellow/red orbs seems as likely as any other theory.

now if only durability wouldn't drop like a rock regardless of fail/success this info might actually be usefull. =)
Edited, Oct 1st 2010 1:12am by gerwenscalebane

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 1:14am by gerwenscalebane
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#18 Oct 01 2010 at 2:46 AM Rating: Decent
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gerwenscalebane wrote:
i agree with the last few posts. and the alchemist lvl 10 ability seems to back that idea up http://ffxiv.zam.com/en/ability.html?ffxivability=29553
it makes the orb white for a few turns, so if making it favorable is white then white probably simply has the best success rate for any attempt, and after that yellow is usually a warning color and red is usually a stop sign. still dunno what the flashing colors are, so the idea that they are simply unidentified white/yellow/red orbs seems as likely as any other theory.

now if only durability wouldn't drop like a rock regardless of fail/success this info might actually be usefull. =)
Edited, Oct 1st 2010 1:12am by gerwenscalebane

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 1:14am by gerwenscalebane


How the **** do we use those skills we get at level 10 crafting, like the one you linked for alchemy, when i look through my "Actions and Traits" menu and select any of my crafts that are over level 10, for example alchemy no skills are listed except wrist flick. Are these skills just passive or is there an actual way to use them?
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#19 Oct 01 2010 at 2:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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Equip them the way you normally would an ability and while you're synthing they show up as an option (below Wait) on occasion while you work.
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#20 Oct 01 2010 at 3:16 AM Rating: Decent
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MasterOutlaw the Irrelevant wrote:
Equip them the way you normally would an ability and while you're synthing they show up as an option (below Wait) on occasion while you work.


I dont see them in them to equip tho :/
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#21 Oct 01 2010 at 3:28 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'd also like to add that White: 75% yellow:50% and red:25% is about average if you are crafting a synth that is your current level.
If however your crafting a synth that's lower level the %'s adjust

e.g. Weaver rank 10 making level 5 synth would be something along the lines of:
White:85%
yellow:60%
red:35%

And of course crafting a synth higher send the %'s the other way.

Also recommended skills and shops add to difficulty. I know weaving training adds about 5 levels maybe more do difficulty of synth if you don't have it. But the adjustments for not having recommended training vary.

Like I say I've done a fair bit of crafting and this is what I've found so far. Sounds complex but that's SE all over.

Hope this helps y'all

Edit: it will never be possible to achieve 100% success rate. But at lvl50 I'd expect making a lvl 1 synth at White to have somewhere in the region of 96%
also as for progress amount and durability loss,
Standard = 10-20% on success with lowest dura loss
Rapid = 20-30% on success medium dura loss
Bold = 0-10% on success high dura loss

The progress and quality dura values are based on level and synth level.

All crafts are marginally effected by both physical and elemental stats from what I've heard but I've not done much research and I don't think they make THAT much difference.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 5:41am by terabyt3
#22 Oct 01 2010 at 3:55 AM Rating: Good
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Unstable element greatly increases dura loss on failed synths. Bold adds most quality least progress rapid most progress least quality and standard is best of both.

***** it think I'll write a guide and stick it on the wiki
#23 Oct 01 2010 at 4:19 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
I dont see them in them to equip tho :/


They're under abilities.
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#24 Oct 01 2010 at 4:43 AM Rating: Default
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terabyt3 wrote:
Actually the colours don't represent what action to take. They are examples of what the success rate of your next action will be.. White 75% yellow 50% red 25% something like that.

Through testing I think the flashing is "unknown state" as in your char is not skilled enough to tell what colour it is. I say this as when working a way lower synth the flashing hardly occurs.
As for the dif levels of flashing I need to do more research on but from what I've noticed the faster the flashing the further you are from telling the state of the mats.
I.e. Fast flashing 2-3 waits will show current states slow flash 1 wait.

But I'm sure colours do not represent what action to take only success rate. Try it out for yourselves. Wait on red and only go on White or yellow or if you're brave flashing. I do suggest not using rapid on yellow however as with a 50/50 chance rapid failure loses alot of durability.


Based on what you say we should Wait until white (highest chance) and then go rapid, but it doesnt really work atm :(
#25 Oct 01 2010 at 4:52 AM Rating: Good
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No as rapid has a sturdy durability loss if you fail. So even with a same level synth there's a 25% chance you're gonna lose. Also rapid would give next to no quality. It all depends on what you're crafting the level your level and it you are tryin to hq. Also wait does not garauntee it turning White and repetitive waiting decreases durability more each time.
#26 Oct 01 2010 at 5:05 AM Rating: Decent
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terabyt3 wrote:
No as rapid has a sturdy durability loss if you fail. So even with a same level synth there's a 25% chance you're gonna lose. Also rapid would give next to no quality. It all depends on what you're crafting the level your level and it you are tryin to hq. Also wait does not garauntee it turning White and repetitive waiting decreases durability more each time.


Yeah...pretty hard to decide what to do then when its red or gold...
I'm pretty disappointed by now, I just botched a lv11 craft at 23% as lv17 armorer+master facility.......WTF?
Yesterday I was crafting Bronze Barbut easily before mant, now its near impossible and its a lv15 craft...
At the same time I saw a japanese boy craft a lv20 recipe and he was lv18....again WTF?
I start to belive that SE made it harder to craft just because some japanese crafters are already lv30 after 8 days from release.

Edited, Oct 1st 2010 7:07am by MisterSatan
#27 Oct 01 2010 at 5:23 AM Rating: Decent
Crafting in a nutshell:

4 orb statss: solid white, solid yellow, solid red, flashing.

4 basic skills: standard, rapid, bold, wait.

Use Standard as your mainstay, ideally only on solid orb colors. Use Wait to cycle orb state if it's flashing. If it's still flashing after using Wait 2-3 times, take your chances with Stanard/Rapid/Bold as appropriate. Use Rapid only if you're making things well below your rank where you just want to get them made and aren't worried about quality or if you need a large boost to progress after several Standard failures in order to try and recover the synth. Rapid success rate has been nerfed substantially and the potential durability loss has gone way up if it fails. Use Bold if your Progress is > 80 and you've got plenty of durability to spare, but only if you're aiming for high quality. If Bold fails and takes of a big chunk of durability, you need to make sure you've left enough of a buffer to finish the synth with Standard or Rapid.

Final note: Rapid spam was a cheeseball strategy concocted by lazy people who didn't want to learn how to do things right. It carried one substantial drawback: crap final Quality. The skill points you get for a successful synth, your reward for local levequests, and your chances of an HQ result are all tied to Quality. Now that Rapid has been nerfed, people are going to have to learn that crafting, especially challenging synths, is not intended to be a faceroll jaunt to fun and profit. If my post sounds peevish, it's because I am. I spent the night arguing with people who figured that after ten successful synthesis attempts pre-rapid nerf that they were crafting experts. Post nerf, they figured that their perfect interpretation of crafting strategy was the only one that worked and thus crafting was broken and SE sucks. Crafting actually requires attention to detail for best results, especially on combines that aren't a sure thing.
#28 Oct 01 2010 at 5:33 AM Rating: Default
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White = Standard, Yellow = Rapid, Red = Bold, Color changing = Wait.
With a chance of failure every time.

Works most of the time (Only failed a Synthesis once). Used it to craft a R11 item at R4 Weaving.
#29 Oct 01 2010 at 5:51 AM Rating: Good
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Read the above. Your method may work but it's purely chance. Not consistent.
#30 Oct 01 2010 at 5:55 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
Crafting in a nutshell:

4 orb statss: solid white, solid yellow, solid red, flashing.

4 basic skills: standard, rapid, bold, wait.
.


There are different rates of flashing too. Above posts sum up what I've found so far. Virtually the same as you posted.
#31 Oct 01 2010 at 6:45 AM Rating: Good
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terabyt3 wrote:
Actually the colours don't represent what action to take. They are examples of what the success rate of your next action will be.. White 75% yellow 50% red 25% something like that.

Through testing I think the flashing is "unknown state" as in your char is not skilled enough to tell what colour it is. I say this as when working a way lower synth the flashing hardly occurs.
As for the dif levels of flashing I need to do more research on but from what I've noticed the faster the flashing the further you are from telling the state of the mats.
I.e. Fast flashing 2-3 waits will show current states slow flash 1 wait.

But I'm sure colours do not represent what action to take only success rate. Try it out for yourselves. Wait on red and only go on White or yellow or if you're brave flashing. I do suggest not using rapid on yellow however as with a 50/50 chance rapid failure loses alot of durability.


You got it all right. Your assumptions were just officially acknowledged on the newest lodestone FAQ.

/bow
#32 Oct 01 2010 at 6:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Currently I have:
leather and alchemy at 10
weaving at 12
wood at 11
armor and smith at 8

I'm not sure why some people are still trying to rapid spam synths. That strat hasn't worked well since OB. In fact the first thing I noticed on sept 22 was that rapid spam generally resulted in failure.

When I synth something close to my rank I usually just use standard on any solid color, use fulfillment and/or preserve when they are up and maybe try to get in 1 or 2 rapids if it looks like my durability may not last until finished. As long as the recipe is not considerably higher than my current rank, I will succeed about 99% of the time.

One thing I have noticed about the colors:
While the chance of success goes:
white>gold>red>flashing
Your chance of getting a large boost to quality on a success seems to go:
flashing>red>gold>white
If I manage to succeed on a bold when its flashing I have seen quality go up as much as 70-80. This NEVER happens on white.



Edited, Oct 1st 2010 9:06am by Mattarutaru
#33 Oct 01 2010 at 7:26 AM Rating: Decent
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The One and Only Aurelius wrote:
Final note: Rapid spam was a cheeseball strategy concocted by lazy people who didn't want to learn how to do things right. It carried one substantial drawback: crap final Quality. The skill points you get for a successful synth, your reward for local levequests, and your chances of an HQ result are all tied to Quality. Now that Rapid has been nerfed, people are going to have to learn that crafting, especially challenging synths, is not intended to be a faceroll jaunt to fun and profit. If my post sounds peevish, it's because I am. I spent the night arguing with people who figured that after ten successful synthesis attempts pre-rapid nerf that they were crafting experts. Post nerf, they figured that their perfect interpretation of crafting strategy was the only one that worked and thus crafting was broken and SE sucks. Crafting actually requires attention to detail for best results, especially on combines that aren't a sure thing.


I beg your pardon, pre-rapid nerf I spam rapid, post-rapid nerf I spam standard, result is the same, pretty much same SP/XP gain, and possibly same chance of HQ as well (but since I don't usually aim for HQ, can't really tell). If you're going to make 100 rings for the next rank, you could care less about quality. For now, whatever colour flashing just spam standard, I did that and I crafted a bunch of r21 weapons at r18/19. So yes, crafting is a faceroll jaunt to fun and profit :]
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#34 Oct 01 2010 at 8:03 AM Rating: Default
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Ive noticed there is a hum that comes from the crystals.

Every time the pitch of the hum lowers I fail.
When the pitch is high I succeed.

something to consider.
#35 Oct 01 2010 at 8:33 AM Rating: Excellent
SE actually posted some info on the Lodestone about this:
http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com/pl/topics/detail?id=5542db352bb764087916b9d9200acf78650edf81

Quote:
Synthesis
Q. I haven't been having much success crafting items. What am I doing wrong?
A. The colored, glowing graphics provides players with a large hint toward a successful synthesis. When the glow is white, the synthesis is at its most stable, and the chances of success are high. When the glow takes on a color, however, the chances of success are low. Players seeking simple completion of their synthesis rather than high-quality results should attempt to use the Wait command when the indicator is colored to restore the stability of the synthesis before finishing it.

Q. Is there a trick to synthesizing high-quality items?
A. Though synthesis actions carried out while the colored circle graphic is red suffer a reduced rate of success, they often serve to increase the quality of the synthesis. In addition, the successful execution of consecutive actions also serves to increase quality. Ultimately, the higher the quality of the synthesis process, the more likely it is to yield a high-quality result.

Q. What do the values attached to synthesis materials, such as +1, signify?
A. These values represent bonuses applied to the durability and quality of a synthesis when it is first begun. Unlike increases to quality made during the crafting process, this initial bonus has no bearing on the degree of difficulty of the synthesis. Such bonus materials therefore increase a player's chances at synthesizing high-quality items, without increasing the difficulty of the synthesis.

Q. I am able to choose between using my main hand or off hand tool when beginning a synthesis. What is the difference?
A. Main hand and off hand tools have varying characteristics which manifest themselves in different ways when a high-quality result is achieved while synthesizing. There are many possible outcomes. For instance, a successful synthesis with a main hand tool may result in a +1 or +2 item, while the result obtained with an off hand tool may be a higher yield of regular quality items.

Q. I don't have enough of the crystals I need for synthesis. Is there a way to get more of the certain crystal type I need?
A. Other than looting fresh corpses, crystals can also be obtained through gathering. Further, for Disciples of the Land, allotting elemental bonus points to a certain element will result in a greater likelihood of procuring crystals of that type. Location is another factor to consider, as some places will yield more of certain crystal types than others.
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#36alosiusbelvedere, Posted: Oct 01 2010 at 9:14 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) why couldnt SE just properly test the game before putting it to sale?
#37 Oct 01 2010 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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**** YEAH! Now what do I win?

Although I went a bit more in-depth with my results and theories. I did notice they said higher quality can also be achieved on a successful red orb synth. I suppose that's to make it a reward for being brave. But with my speculated success %'s a low level synth for a high level crafter could make red maybe 50% success rate.... There is definitely more there than colour=action people! I mean c'mon it's SE ffs :)
#38 Oct 01 2010 at 11:15 AM Rating: Decent
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I still dont get it....I keep failing a lv11 craft (Brass Plate) when I'm 17+Master facility.
I proceed like this: start as white, I go standard, then if turn flashing/red I use Wait up to 3 times for making it go yellow/white, then I go standard again. But I fail....a lot.....sigh
#39 Oct 01 2010 at 11:44 AM Rating: Default
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MisterSatan wrote:
I still dont get it....I keep failing a lv11 craft (Brass Plate) when I'm 17+Master facility.
I proceed like this: start as white, I go standard, then if turn flashing/red I use Wait up to 3 times for making it go yellow/white, then I go standard again. But I fail....a lot.....sigh


iv heard if you wait a full 3 times in a row your next attempt is guaranteed to fail, any information regarding this? when my orb becomes unstable i generally wait 1-2 times, try again, then wait again if necessary.
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#40 Oct 01 2010 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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One thing I noticed was when I was 8-9 levels higher, the colors was more stable often and it seemed that I wasn't failing as often, so I was bold synthing more often. I managed to do a level 3 synth 5-6 times (out of 7 attempts) with quality between 150-200.

Btw, I had the 2nd tier crafting tool and some crafting clothes. I'm wondering if a lot of these failing complaints is because people are crafting naked with their weathered tool?



Edited, Oct 1st 2010 1:56pm by VelvetJ
#41 Oct 01 2010 at 11:56 AM Rating: Decent
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Almost 100% positive that SP gain for a synth is NOT related to Quality. It is related to the number of times you succeed. The reason that Rapid-spm seemed to give a little less SP is because you are doing fewer actions during the synth.
#42 Oct 04 2010 at 5:00 PM Rating: Decent
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"If I manage to succeed on a bold when its flashing I have seen quality go up as much as 70-80. This NEVER happens on white. "

Yeah I've experienced the largest gains to quality on the flashing state. I'm not sure why people talk about the red state so much, for me it's all about succeeding bolds on the flashing state to get massive gains. My highest has been 98 quality on a perfect bold synth with no durability loss, when attempting to create a level 1 recipe at level 15. I'm guessing you can score in the 100+ zone when you're really high level vs the item you're creating. The game already hints at different states equaling a higher chance of success. The preserve ability from Alchemy rank 10 allows your state to stay in white from 3-5 turns of crafting, real useful for the hard to craft items.

It seems the secret to succeeding tough crafts is to take the right mix of abilities and use them well, but obviously if you can simply spam standard for a craft it's by far the quickest way to do it.

Edit: Also fully agree with Sigmakan, there's no correlation between quality and sp gains, (else you'd get heaps on those 400+ quality synths using +3 mats).

Edited, Oct 4th 2010 7:53pm by mygosity
#43 Oct 04 2010 at 5:53 PM Rating: Decent
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alosiusbelvedere wrote:
why couldnt SE just properly test the game before putting it to sale?
They did. And we left tons of feedback on all of the problems mentioned recently.

SE just didn't do anything about it.
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#44 Oct 04 2010 at 5:53 PM Rating: Good
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MisterSatan wrote:
I still dont get it....I keep failing a lv11 craft (Brass Plate) when I'm 17+Master facility.
I proceed like this: start as white, I go standard, then if turn flashing/red I use Wait up to 3 times for making it go yellow/white, then I go standard again. But I fail....a lot.....sigh


1. Plate can be made by both Blacksmith and Armourer. Armourer recipe is low lvl (11) while Blacksmith one is higher level (I would say somewhere in the 16).
2. Tool. A r7 tool will be much less useful once you hit the r15+, at least get a r12 tool.
3. Crafter clothes, as much important as a good tool.
4. Stats? My LS armourer/blacksmith guy pump all his points into STR.
5. Waiting 3 times does not affect anything.
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#45 Oct 04 2010 at 6:02 PM Rating: Decent
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398 posts
I believe that Quality gains is on a chain.

It looks at how many successes you've gotten since your last failure. More successes = higher quality. You guys are saying that "I got huge quality growth on flashing!", not because it was flashing, but because you succeeded the last three synthesis.

And I don't believe flashing is actually a color. I think it just means that you're not talented enough to see the color of it. I notice that when crafting level 1 things, I don't get flashing as much as when crafting level 15 things- whose color sometimes goes flashing on the second synthesis.
#46 Oct 04 2010 at 8:32 PM Rating: Decent
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53 posts
Negative, the states definitely yield more depending on the type. True enough I've never procced for 80+ on the first try (so there may be a chain involved) but it'll never happen on the white state, it has already been confirmed via lodestone that the red state will yield more quality if you succeed on it with a bold attempt.

Edited, Oct 4th 2010 10:33pm by mygosity
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