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Possible Solution to Market Wards / Auction HouseFollow

#1 Oct 02 2010 at 8:21 AM Rating: Decent
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170 posts
With the information released about having a market ward specifically geared for each type of item I believe SE is taking a small step in the right direction. However, this does not solve the problem of consolidating these type of items to each specific ward.

Now I fully love the look of the market wards and the concept behind them, but believe one major change could please both people who prefer the look of the market ward and those who want an AH.

I believe SE should keep the idea of market wards, but instead of having it filled with retainers we hire it should be filled with NPC's. Have one NPC at each stand (no more retainers cluttered wherever they can fit making the wards look like crap). Instead of us having our retainers carry our goods we should upload all the good we want to sell to a centralized location (just like any AH). The big change is instead of accessing one major AH, we would go to each market ward and access a NPC who would access only certain gear from a central AH. Here is an example using the Hatters Ward (which will be geared towards head gear):

In this ward you have something like 10 stands. What SE could do is have each stand segmented for a specific level range. Say one NPC would carry all level 1-10 head gear. The next would carry the level 10-15 head gear and so on. When you talk to each npc they would only access this section of the central AH on which all our items are listed.

I feel this change would keep the look of the market ward alot of us love as well as give us the ease of use so many of use desire. Also, this would allow possibly for a FFXIVAH.com to be set up (I assume) since it will be NPC driven and not PC retainer driven. Let me know what everyone thinks of this idea.

In short - Have NPCs in each ward that lets us view a central AH for gear only specific to that ward and divided between each NPC (either by each NPC having a specific level range or type of that specific gear).

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 10:45am by EklmForever
#2 Oct 02 2010 at 10:42 AM Rating: Good
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211 posts
Not to rain on your parade or anything, but that idea defeats the point of both ideas it utilizes.

It would look like the market wards, yes... But it would completely lose all function that the market wards have. So really, it's just an arbitrarily broken apart AH that would be cumbersome and time consuming to navigate.

The whole point of the market wards is to have a system where the prices don't stabilize, and the instant you connect everyone's bazaars together, that's exactly what would happen. Don't get me wrong, I do want an AH or retainer search, I really do... It's just that SE seems pretty bent on not giving us one for a while so they can have their damned player driven market.

So yeah, long story short, there really is no common ground. Either they have an AH or centralized retainer search, or they don't.

The separate item specific wards is a nice improvement to the wards, if people actually use it right, but with so many items they will need a lot of wards... Plus it won't stop people from filling their bazaars with a bunch of insanely overpriced garbage. So we will still have to look through a bunch of items priced at 10k each and a bunch of "seeking" slots offering a pittance for large amounts of valuable items, which is just salt in the wound imo. You will finally find that thing you want priced at about 50x the cost of materials, but since it has been several hours of searching already, you will say **** it and buy it anyway, or you will go shout for another long while to get 10 types of materials to make 10 different things that you need to make 5 different things that are all used in one synth... It's way to much, seriously, we need an AH for all that interdependency. Period.

Market wards would work much better if crafts were more self reliant... i.e. woodworking uses wood mats, made with lower lvl woodworking.. Instead you need cloth, blacksmithing, armorer, leather, alchemy, and random rare drops all in the same synth... And all the pieces from those crafts are the same story.. What's that? you want to cook some carrot broth? Well don't forget to use plenty of brass nails and sheep leather, oh and toss in ceder planks for that freshly hammered taste! And don't even think about trying to make apple pie... It will take days.

Now don't get me wrong, I do love this game, and I'm going to keep playing it for sure. Best mmo ever made imo, it just needs more work before it can live up to it's potential, and I think SE will do that work, they just need more time... So until then, I'll make do with what we have and mainly focus on enjoying the leveling and testing out SE's "improvements". But breaking the mmo AH addiction cold turkey is just not easy lol.

/vent lol
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#3 Oct 02 2010 at 10:46 AM Rating: Good
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Tiger228 wrote:
really, it's just an arbitrarily broken apart AH that would be cumbersome and time consuming to navigate.


Yep, and this applies to anything having to do with the wards.
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#4 Oct 02 2010 at 10:48 AM Rating: Decent
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86 posts
I must be one of the few players who actually enjoy looking through each and every players bazaar as well as the wards. I will look for hours - and finding just that on great deal will drive me on. I think that's what SE was hoping for - but I guess it's a bargain shopping thing, or an addiction to shopping over-all...who knows.
#5 Oct 02 2010 at 10:54 AM Rating: Good
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183 posts
Quote:
I must be one of the few players who actually enjoy looking through each and every players bazaar as well as the wards. I will look for hours - and finding just that on great deal will drive me on. I think that's what SE was hoping for - but I guess it's a bargain shopping thing, or an addiction to shopping over-all...who knows.


If you find any dyes while looking, let me know.


Seriously, no one make em, and the ones who do sell em for 10,000 gil a piece.
#6 Oct 02 2010 at 10:55 AM Rating: Good
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211 posts
I gotta admit, I'd be a lot more enthusiastic about the player driven market if the players weren't so bad at driving the market, lol... ;/

Maybe it will get better over time, once people get an idea about what is and isn't worth bazaaring, and what a reasonable price to sell/buy things for is. But really, I'm not buying maple logs, moko grass and salt leeks for 20,000g, and I'm not selling you 30 wind crystals and 500 wind shards for 100g... It's just irritating searching through like 100 bazaars and seeing the same exact crap in all them.

Great, you made a gazillion copper earrings and now want 5k a piece for them, so did like everyone else. Welcome to the world of crafting, that is what we call skilling up, and those are what we call npc foods. Sell them! xD
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#7 Oct 02 2010 at 11:00 AM Rating: Good
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121 posts
withyouforyou wrote:
I must be one of the few players who actually enjoy looking through each and every players bazaar as well as the wards.


Yes, you are in the minority. Menu's are laggy(especially in towns), it lets you inspect out of purchase distance, and no ability to move while browsing. I'm going to completely negate the AH garbage and say the bazzar system is broken because of the above points. If they don't want to do a full on AH, we should at least have the ability to search all bazzars in a specific region/area at the same time - I didn't mind going through a few bazzars out in Rollanberry on occasion, and I could have probably very well bought all of my items from rollanberry/other bazzars in XI - but the AH is much, much, much more convenient.
#8 Oct 02 2010 at 11:03 AM Rating: Good
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86 posts
I haven't found any dye yet. I am however an Alchemist and I have found several people selling the moss for 500-1k each. I bought it up and used all the dye today XD

PS: I found these specific sales in Camp Beared Rock

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 1:03pm by withyouforyou
#9 Oct 02 2010 at 11:09 AM Rating: Excellent
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73 posts
I really don't like browsing all the retainers, for hours, for probably nothing. I somewhat enjoyed it in RO, nearly 10 years ago, when you kinda knew what each merchant was selling thanks to a player generated message above their heads. It's like SE remade some random game from pre 2000 and gave it awesome graphics. In this case at least. I've done the retainer browsing two or three times, and just can't do it anymore. I'm pretty much on a break until they implement the change, and see how it goes from there. It still could be much better though, and yes I do wish for an AH at some point. Hopefully sooner than later, but it's probably going to be never. *sigh*

About the tons of copper earrings stuff...I only sell HQ stuff, the normal stuff gets thrown at some poor random NPC. Because yea...everybody is selling the same junk, for too much in many cases. And just the other day while randomly standing around somewhere a nice kitty bought half of my crafted +1 and +2 stuff, and yea. I was happy about it and felt like I've helped somebody by concentrating on HQ for a bit, and still keeping prices reasonable. If everybody did that Eorzea would be a better world maybe (and with an AH).

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 1:11pm by FanciatheDragonkeeper
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#10 Oct 02 2010 at 11:15 AM Rating: Good
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2,010 posts
There is nothing wrong with the Market Ward system - when it's limited to what we used Bazaars for in FFXI. I enjoyed looking around to find the best price on Dyna currency, or pop items for Sky. That **** made sense. Rare things that can't be sold on AH because it was tagged special.

I would have quit the game if I had to find all my basic armor, weapons, and food in those same bazaars. It just doesn't work, and every single suggestion that people make to *improve* the system is just an effing auction house function. It just is. Period.

I finally figured out how to sell things on my retainer, but I only have ten slots, and who the **** knows when someone might make it to *my* npc to see what she has, and it's just a crap shoot they will even want any of my junk at the prices I have them up for. Now if I had access to an AH, I could sell all these ores and other cool crafting materials to people who were looking for those items, for the price that everyone has agreed is fair.

I mean, this isn't rocket science here.
#11 Oct 02 2010 at 11:20 AM Rating: Good
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73 posts
Torrence wrote:
There is nothing wrong with the Market Ward system - when it's limited to what we used Bazaars for in FFXI. I enjoyed looking around to find the best price on Dyna currency, or pop items for Sky. That sh*t made sense. Rare things that can't be sold on AH because it was tagged special.

I would have quit the game if I had to find all my basic armor, weapons, and food in those same bazaars. It just doesn't work, and every single suggestion that people make to *improve* the system is just an effing auction house function. It just is. Period.

I finally figured out how to sell things on my retainer, but I only have ten slots, and who the **** knows when someone might make it to *my* npc to see what she has, and it's just a crap shoot they will even want any of my junk at the prices I have them up for. Now if I had access to an AH, I could sell all these ores and other cool crafting materials to people who were looking for those items, for the price that everyone has agreed is fair.

I mean, this isn't rocket science here.



Couldn't agree any more. Sadly logic is still to be invented in the land of the rising sun. Really no idea what they were thinking. In all honesty, if the retainer system, the way it is right now, would aways remain the same....yea, I'd totally quit too and never come back. Sadly.
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#12 Oct 02 2010 at 12:47 PM Rating: Good
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65 posts
EklmForever wrote:
With the information released about having a market ward specifically geared for each type of item I believe SE is taking a small step in the right direction. However, this does not solve the problem of consolidating these type of items to each specific ward.

Now I fully love the look of the market wards and the concept behind them, but believe one major change could please both people who prefer the look of the market ward and those who want an AH.

I believe SE should keep the idea of market wards, but instead of having it filled with retainers we hire it should be filled with NPC's. Have one NPC at each stand (no more retainers cluttered wherever they can fit making the wards look like crap). Instead of us having our retainers carry our goods we should upload all the good we want to sell to a centralized location (just like any AH). The big change is instead of accessing one major AH, we would go to each market ward and access a NPC who would access only certain gear from a central AH. Here is an example using the Hatters Ward (which will be geared towards head gear):

In this ward you have something like 10 stands. What SE could do is have each stand segmented for a specific level range. Say one NPC would carry all level 1-10 head gear. The next would carry the level 10-15 head gear and so on. When you talk to each npc they would only access this section of the central AH on which all our items are listed.

I feel this change would keep the look of the market ward alot of us love as well as give us the ease of use so many of use desire. Also, this would allow possibly for a FFXIVAH.com to be set up (I assume) since it will be NPC driven and not PC retainer driven. Let me know what everyone thinks of this idea.

In short - Have NPCs in each ward that lets us view a central AH for gear only specific to that ward and divided between each NPC (either by each NPC having a specific level range or type of that specific gear).

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 10:45am by EklmForever


Hilarious, Lets make an AH, but lets complicate the process and add an even bigger time sink by making players go to 15 different NPC's to get there gear sets and crafting supplies.

Here's an idea, lets just stop rationalizing this market ward fiasco and install an Auction House. I don't like paying 14$ a month for a video game that I literally do MORE work in then RL. Seriously people, Take off those Square Enix issued glasses and see the game for what it is... An unfinished mess that is pretty to look at.

How is it that the ONLY thing that they brought from FFXI was the **** character models.. Of all things, I wanted NEW character models.. I mean come on, if it's not broke, don't fix it.. Upgrade it sure.. but don't try to reinvent the only things that worked in FFXI.
#13 Oct 02 2010 at 12:55 PM Rating: Decent
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I'm not saying the retainer system isn't a pain, but do you guys remember how crafting eventually and quickly got in FFXI? It was incredibly difficult to make gil efficently in it. The competition was so high amongst crafters, they would sell at the smallest profits, just to cut out the other guys (AH, the cheapest item always goes first).

That's what "SE is thinking" with this retainer system and no AH. Crafting is huge in XIV, and if crafters cannot make gil, or could make gil 10 times more efficiently just farming, crafting in the game will not be rewarding. That's at least what they are hoping for here, but right now they are still a long way from making the system work in a way where everyone is happy.

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 2:55pm by Vawn43
#14 Oct 02 2010 at 1:20 PM Rating: Excellent
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107 posts
i have searched the wards for hours at a time looking for undyed canvas and iron nails. <in sweeps checking each retainer in each ward until i get to wards that are empty> <i have to admit finding something else useful i wasn't really looking for is kinda fun, but that doesn't even come close to offsetting the misery incurred by having to spend hours not finding what i am actually searching for>

i still haven't even seen either of those items, and i probably won't find them until an ah is implemented, or at least i can quickly find out that those items are not being sold and go do something more enjoyable than checking every **** retainer hoping to find what i'm looking for and still not find it.

then again maybe my particular problem is more with crafting than the wards <i shouldn't need lvl 20 materials to make lvl 6 gear>
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#15 Oct 02 2010 at 1:56 PM Rating: Good
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For now, I refuse to enter the Market Wards until there is a search function. The time I will spend looking through each retainer's goods and comparing prices is better spent on leveling my own crafting ranks IMO.

Not to mention rendering all those retainers on screen will probably cause my poor computer to self-destruct.

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 3:57pm by uomaru
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#16 Oct 02 2010 at 2:11 PM Rating: Default
Edited by bsphil
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EklmForever wrote:
Possible Solution to Market Wards / Auction House
www.ffxivpro.com

More promising than any alternative as of now.
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#17 Oct 02 2010 at 3:40 PM Rating: Decent
35 posts
Tiger228 wrote:
The whole point of the market wards is to have a system where the prices don't stabilize, and the instant you connect everyone's bazaars together, that's exactly what would happen.


market wards is a bad idea to my eye, if only you didnt have to move from wards to wards to find a good price for your ****. and btw prize has to stabilize somewhere, everything need a ****** price, everyone is just sellin everything overpriced or underpriced. and with all the +0 +1 +2 +3 item we get, the prob is that with our litle 80 space in bag and 80 space in retainer, it fills up very quick, so quick that we dont even have the time to sell everythings, and i dont think people wanna just discard or sell to NPC everything cause theres no **** price set for anything, we dont wanna drop something that MAIBY we could sell for some good money. just imagine over time after a month or 2 all the item a player can loot. people will need alot of retainers lol. with an ah and fixed price at least we can sell everything we want at a price we know so we dont get fooled all the time cause nothing as price and we could clear our bag of the crap we get as loot that no one wants cause we know theres not a big demand at ah for that specific item. all i can see is that this retainers idea is all about making money. everyone will need least an extra retainers, some will need even more, and what .. extra retainers are 1$ if im not wrong ? they just want the money from that. you shouldnt have to pay for those extra thing in a P2P mmorpg. ok pay for an extra char i can understand cause you dont need a new char to try a new class, but not a **** retainers.

1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.
#18 Oct 02 2010 at 4:00 PM Rating: Decent
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1,636 posts
Quote:
1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.


I don't think they are greedy, the game is already $2 lower than the 'going rate' of 14.99 on mmos.
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#19 Oct 02 2010 at 4:10 PM Rating: Good
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Why pay for extra retainers?
Why pay for extra characters?

In this day and age in gaming, you should pay for an account as a service fee.

Anything other then that is a rip off. The reason why Blizzard is so successful is because they are user friendly. You can utilize 3rd party mods to customize your gameplay to your liking, they provide feedback from dev's on dedicated forum's, They allow multiple characters on multiple servers, basically they try to and succesfully provide a gaming experience for all age/skill levels. You could be 10 years old and have a blast and even make it to max level with a time investment, you could be 65 and retired and play to max level in due time, or you could be a hardcore gamer and max level in a week and then compete in Normal -> Hardcore raiding along with competitive PvP arena or BG's.

WoW gets blasted for the community, but the community is fine in wow. You just have to be social enough to find your niche where you fit in. Wether it be an end game guild, a casual leveling guild, or a 10 man Guild. The community is vast and different just based on the amount of players on the server (11 million+ accounts).

Fanboys will disagree and state that the community in FF games (referring to XI) is the best evah! In actuality though, its the same scenario.. different people from different parts of the world, playing an mmo together.

The basics of FFXIV is what will cause a massive reduction in subscriptions after the free 30 days.

*No Ah
*cumbersome and repetitive UI
*no bank
*no mail system
*lack of high level content
*server crashing and guildleve drop
*Crafting being a necessity for serious players
*crafting being an absolute nightmare due to interdependance between crafts
*Gear repair system

and i could go on for hours here into specifics.....

Point is, SE needs to put out a major update before October 22-30. If not, I'm pretty sure that nobody will have server que's when attempting to log on, because most people will be playing Cataclysm.




#20 Oct 02 2010 at 4:33 PM Rating: Decent
35 posts
KujaKoF wrote:
Quote:
1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.


I don't think they are greedy, the game is already $2 lower than the 'going rate' of 14.99 on mmos.


LOL 2$ Lower ? thats cause they know they will catch up with the 3$ extra char. Retainers 1$ wont be to cath up but i see that as an greedy extra for them.
#21 Oct 02 2010 at 4:36 PM Rating: Good
35 posts
BTW i think the game is very fun, yeah more content would be nice. but it sad to see that they are looking to make a MMOMG (Massively Multiplayer Market Game) instead of a MMORPG (Massively multiplayer online role-playing gameItalic Text)

[i]Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 6:37pm by Sycko


Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 6:44pm by Sycko
#22 Oct 02 2010 at 4:48 PM Rating: Default
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Add a search function for items:
- Brings up a list of sellers and/or seekers.
- Brings up the ward they're in.
- Does NOT list the price.

Additional:
- Add a "favourite retainer" list to allow people to remember who sells cheaply, or who sells the items they need often.
- Add a /seacom like function for your retainer via a notice board at the entrance to each ward.

You don't NEED an auction house.

There are ways round it.

My ideas aren't perfect - they might not even work with thousands of people using them - but it can be done. And if implemented well, it could make the old, tired, "every MMO has to have one" Auction House a thing of the past. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, does not wash with this game. MMO's are all the same. Someone needed to diversify to attract customers... SE are trying. Give them a chance.

Let's face it, having our own personal shoppers is kind of cool. And if they level up... even cooler. Not sure what the leveling will do, but it's intriguing.

But... we need houses. Or rooms of our own. Sharpish. I hate not having anywhere quiet and lag free.

EDIT:

Something's tickling my brain about linking retainers, messages and personal houses but it's late and I can't put it into words... and I think it'd be really good... any ideas, anyone?

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 10:50pm by Likibiki
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#23 Oct 02 2010 at 4:54 PM Rating: Good
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1,636 posts
Sycko wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
Quote:
1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.


I don't think they are greedy, the game is already $2 lower than the 'going rate' of 14.99 on mmos.


LOL 2$ Lower ? thats cause they know they will catch up with the 3$ extra char. Retainers 1$ wont be to cath up but i see that as an greedy extra for them.


I guess thats fair. If for some reason you feel you need to have another character you will have to pay for it. The game is centered around doing eveything on the same character. In fact their mule system is a bit better, because it doesnt involve logging in and or, you just use retainers. If you're using it for 2 people playing on the same account, unless that person is a minor, its against the TOS. But at that point you're paying $1 above whats expected, instead of 10.
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#24 Oct 02 2010 at 5:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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3,530 posts
Likibiki wrote:
Add a search function for items:
- Brings up a list of sellers and/or seekers.
- Brings up the ward they're in.
- Does NOT list the price.


"Oh cool, there's the sword I was looking for... Now to just zone a couple times... a quick locating of the seller, and... oh, I can't afford it; what a waste of time."

Note that there was never a time in FFXI when people looked at the Auction House and said, "Sigh. I really wish I had to walk around Jeuno looking for prices and NPCs rather than just being able to buy what I need here, on this organised list."

In fact, the one thing most people complained about was the fact that the Auction Houses were disconnected from city to city -- with retainers it's like they aren't even connected from person to person!

-Retainers will always be worse than a simple Auction House.
-Retainers need many implementations just to make them an inferior Auction House.
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#25 Oct 02 2010 at 5:07 PM Rating: Excellent
Edited by bsphil
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Likibiki wrote:
You don't NEED an auction house.
I can't speak for everyone but for me, wanting an AH is more of a symbol of wanting some sort of centralized, searchable system, whether that is an actual auction house (or something along those lines), or a manifestation of that same concept using retainers. People are just saying AH because it's what FFXI used and it was incredibly useful and popular, but STILL didn't remove the value of the bazaar.

You definitely do need to show prices though. Kinda pointless if you don't.

Edited, Oct 2nd 2010 6:08pm by bsphil
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#26 Oct 02 2010 at 5:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sycko wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
Quote:
1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.


I don't think they are greedy, the game is already $2 lower than the 'going rate' of 14.99 on mmos.


LOL 2$ Lower ? thats cause they know they will catch up with the 3$ extra char. Retainers 1$ wont be to cath up but i see that as an greedy extra for them.


Did you not play FFXI or are you not paying attention in XIV - you don't need extra characters in either MMO. Unlike other MMOs, in both FF online games, your single character can play any class, people just don't often do the multiple character thing. The one reason you may want an extra character is as a mule, but players would use a retainer in that case, which we established is $1, not $3.
#27 Oct 02 2010 at 5:19 PM Rating: Decent
Edited by bsphil
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Vawn43 wrote:
Sycko wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
Quote:
1$ per extra retainers, everyone with at least 1 extra retainers, 1 Millions player, 1 extra Millions every month.
SE= greedy company, but i like the game anyway lol.


I don't think they are greedy, the game is already $2 lower than the 'going rate' of 14.99 on mmos.


LOL 2$ Lower ? thats cause they know they will catch up with the 3$ extra char. Retainers 1$ wont be to cath up but i see that as an greedy extra for them.


Did you not play FFXI or are you not paying attention in XIV - you don't need extra characters in either MMO. Unlike other MMOs, in both FF online games, your single character can play any class, people just don't often do the multiple character thing. The one reason you may want an extra character is as a mule, but players would use a retainer in that case, which we established is $1, not $3.
Of the MMOs I've played, all allowed you to make many characters under a standard account fee, with the exception of FFXI and FFXIV. In FFXI you absolutely did need mules, and that was even with 80 inventory, mog house, storage, mog locker, and mog satchel slots. It just was not enough.

I also did run into a fair chunk of people that played multiple characters in FFXI, mainly just to have a different race for different jobs. Never really understood that myself, but it happened.
____________________________
His Excellency Aethien wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
If no one debated with me, then I wouldn't post here anymore.
Take the hint guys, please take the hint.
gbaji wrote:
I'm not getting my news from anywhere Joph.
#28 Oct 03 2010 at 3:09 AM Rating: Decent
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9,043 posts
KaneKitty wrote:
Likibiki wrote:
Add a search function for items:
- Brings up a list of sellers and/or seekers.
- Brings up the ward they're in.
- Does NOT list the price.


"Oh cool, there's the sword I was looking for... Now to just zone a couple times... a quick locating of the seller, and... oh, I can't afford it; what a waste of time."

Note that there was never a time in FFXI when people looked at the Auction House and said, "Sigh. I really wish I had to walk around Jeuno looking for prices and NPCs rather than just being able to buy what I need here, on this organised list."

In fact, the one thing most people complained about was the fact that the Auction Houses were disconnected from city to city -- with retainers it's like they aren't even connected from person to person!

-Retainers will always be worse than a simple Auction House.
-Retainers need many implementations just to make them an inferior Auction House.


- Tell people what ward they're in.
- /target "Retainer Name"

Or, when your retainer levels up enough, it shows the price. And when it gets even higher, you get it cheaper (the seller still gets the original amount) Or something. It could work. Just stop crying "auction house" and try to think of something different...
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Likibiki ~ 75 WHM ~ 75 SAM ~ 75 THF ~ 75 SMN ~ 74 NIN
Pandemonium Server, FFXI. Retired. Gone but not forgotten.
Cailey ~ 90 DNC ~ 90 RDM ~ 90 BLM
Asura Server, FFXI. Adventurer Extraordinaire.
#29 Oct 03 2010 at 3:54 AM Rating: Default
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696 posts
If they offered a $3 auction house fee that would let me go to 1 place and access any item up for sale I would pay it. I'm a fan of a lot of the things they are doing with this game but this retainer thing is just a **** poor AH anyways. once they add searches and organize it they might as well have just made an AH because it would do the same thing require less bs time and just overall work better. We'll skip over the book that could be written about how this system just encourages RMT to do whatever they want and not have it in a centralized log or location where it could be controlled. That in itself is just poor thinking. 40% or more probably of your players now have a retainer full of crap. 5-10%+ have that crap way too expensive. It's like RMT heaven. No need to hide transactions if done right because half the player base is already masking it. GG.

Now I would be ok with going to say different places that were guaranteed to sell whatever item I wanted if it was up. More than one location like it was a weapon store or whatever would be ok methinks. More than 1 location of endless searching through droves of retainers... not so much. Still retarded but not THIS retarded.
#30 Oct 03 2010 at 4:17 AM Rating: Good
33 posts
Ok as for a slight fix to the market wards first off Limit the ammount of retainers that are able to be placed in the wards, make it so that there are more stalls accessable (easy enough to put more stalls in or more wards). Give different options as to how long you would like to rent the stall for with the max being say 1 day but renewable at a rolling percentage say 1000 for day one 1500 for day two 2000 for day three ect..

Lastly add in something similar to the bazars in xi, how you could put a small note. The only thing is that as you select the retainer before browsing the goods it tells you the note.
#31 Oct 03 2010 at 4:41 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
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481 posts
Vawn43 wrote:
I'm not saying the retainer system isn't a pain, but do you guys remember how crafting eventually and quickly got in FFXI? It was incredibly difficult to make gil efficently in it. The competition was so high amongst crafters, they would sell at the smallest profits, just to cut out the other guys (AH, the cheapest item always goes first).


Um, that's the whole point of an efficient market. If a craft is easy, then of course it is going to sell for only a small profit.

I made 10s of millions of gil in FFXI on very small margins in cooking. There was plenty of profit in the crafting system of FFXI if you knew what you were doing and where to get the raw materials cheaply.
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FFXIV WHM/SCH/PLD 50 All DoH/DoL 50
FFXI (retired) WHM75 BLM37 NIN37 Kujata
#32 Oct 03 2010 at 5:16 AM Rating: Good
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2,535 posts
Let me preface this by saying that I totally understand SE's intentions with the retainer system, even if I do have serious doubts about it's suitability for a game of this scale. (IMO it would work much better in a much smaller game.)

That being said, if SE is truly married to the idea of making the retainer system work, what they should do is minimize the amount of needless checking that it requires. I believe it would be much more usable if, instead of going into a ward an having to check all the retainers to find what you want, when you enter the ward you are presented with a categorized list, much like an AH interface, that indexes every item for sale or request to purchase in that ward, and allows you to conduct said business through that interface. Combine this with the themed wards and differential taxes they're planning on adding, and you have a system that makes it easier to find what you want while still providing players the opportunity to engage in arbitrage. (Though I suspect that even then, most arbitrage opportunities will be taken by RMT.)

Another option would be, when inside a ward, you have the option of defining what type of item you're looking for (e.g. sword, around rank 24), and then visually indicating which retainers have items that meet that specification. That way, instead of having to search every retainer in the ward hoping to find what you're looking for, you are able to get by with simply checking the ones you know have something like what you want.

#33 Oct 03 2010 at 5:33 AM Rating: Good
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2,535 posts
Zandev wrote:
Vawn43 wrote:
I'm not saying the retainer system isn't a pain, but do you guys remember how crafting eventually and quickly got in FFXI? It was incredibly difficult to make gil efficently in it. The competition was so high amongst crafters, they would sell at the smallest profits, just to cut out the other guys (AH, the cheapest item always goes first).


Um, that's the whole point of an efficient market. If a craft is easy, then of course it is going to sell for only a small profit.


Precisely.

In perfect competition, long-term profitability is not possible. So the more closely a given market approximates perfect competition, the less room there is for consistent long-term profitability.

And FFXI's consumables markets in particular were remarkably similar to perfect competition, thus providing for razor-thin long-term profit margins.
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