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Why doesn't anyone in this game talk, or want to party?Follow

#1 Oct 03 2010 at 10:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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For a bunch of players willing to dole out so much dough in order to play with other people, they don't seem very interested in socializing.

I went around looking for a party for 2 hours today and I couldn't find a single person who wanted to party for anything other than their guildleves, which is utterly pointless, considering you kill things so quickly you get almost no skill points. FFXI wasn't like this at all, this community is pretty terrible so far.
#2 Oct 03 2010 at 10:28 PM Rating: Good
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Yeah it sucks. It is hard to level up if you can't party after a certain level. I am THM which IMO kills slower then melees so it takes awhile to kill things. I wish people would group more. They need a better invite system.
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#3 Oct 03 2010 at 10:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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Partly due to full parties have no real benefit right now. All those people hitting the same mob doesn't give much sp and the game just isn't streamlined for mages to heal specific party members. Partly because apparently everyone is anti-social in this game cause no one answers questions or responds to shouts. Basically find a buddy who compliments you (A melee for a mage, mage for a melee) and go duo some enemies. Thats what a CNJ buddy and I do.
#4 Oct 03 2010 at 10:33 PM Rating: Good
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it's simple. They made solo too good. Of course, anywhere past 14 it is better to duo (and parties will be good when they fix them) but if people are able to solo, that is what they will do. I love duo'ing with my friend atm, but I dont usually pick up a random and would rather just solo when he isnt on
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#5 Oct 03 2010 at 10:42 PM Rating: Good
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Talking in game is a pain. If I didnt have Vent at my disposal I probably wouldn't talk to any one.
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#6 Oct 03 2010 at 10:43 PM Rating: Good
I say try and find a linkshell in the same server, that way you'll have others who will play with you...or ask some buddies to play with you.

I agree that party mobbing is ridiculously dumb, since whoever heals/does the most DPS will get all the SP, and its far faster to kill a Dodo solo who will give you more EXP and SP than a 5-8 person party whacking Aldegoats. On the flipside, groups and parties can be very fun and social.
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#7 Oct 03 2010 at 10:43 PM Rating: Excellent
It also doesn't help that

you can only type so many

characters before you have

to hit enter and start type

typing a new line Smiley: banghead
#8 Oct 03 2010 at 10:50 PM Rating: Good
Reiterpallasch the Flawless Victor wrote:
It also doesn't help that

you can only type so many

characters before you have

to hit enter and start type

typing a new line Smiley: banghead


+1 to you sir.

Yes, typing is a constant annoyance, and has been covered many times. The fact that most people DON'T put up party notices (in my server anyway) unless they're Japanese is also a factor.

Linkshells are probably the only way you'll get decent - excellent social interaction with the current in-game system at least.
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#9 Oct 03 2010 at 11:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mykha wrote:
For a bunch of players willing to dole out so much dough in order to play with other people, they don't seem very interested in socializing...FFXI wasn't like this at all, this community is pretty terrible so far.


FFXI Playerbase: "I hate seeking a party all day long, I wish this was solo-friendly!"

FFXIV Playerbase: "I hate how nobody talks anymore, I wish this was less solo-friendly!"

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#10 Oct 03 2010 at 11:48 PM Rating: Good
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I'm not sure where you were going with that Kane. It's easy to have a median between the two. XIV just went WAY too far with the soloing. Not only that...all the jobs are exactly the same. Every single job its for the same amount. 15 Thaum hits for 100. Lancer hits for 100. The game needs some drastic changes. Fast.
#11 Oct 04 2010 at 12:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Join a linkshell. Best advice i can give you. On my server there are many LS shouts to join. If not, i believe there are forums here with LS's looking for members. Also people may not be helping you with ur shouts because maybe a lot of people dont know the answer. Then again who knows
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#12 Oct 04 2010 at 12:39 AM Rating: Default
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Solo XP: 0-30 per mob
Party XP for same mob: 0-400
#13 Oct 04 2010 at 1:17 AM Rating: Excellent
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there's no real equivalent of /sea and LFG flags.

The current search tool is worthless. Don't expect people to group up when they can't invite, they can't search, and they can't even put up a LFG flag.

So, what I'm saying is that this isn't an issue with people being 'less' social or willing to group than compared to FFXI, it's an issue of S-E not providing a viable means to allow it.

FFXI's system worked fine, but they're insistent on innovating where innovation was not needed, or just flat-out disregarding basic functions of the game that should've been there on the release version. They've had years of experience with FFXI, how could they not foresee this?


Edited, Oct 4th 2010 3:18am by ghosthacked
#14 Oct 04 2010 at 1:20 AM Rating: Good
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Sssshhh. Be Vewy vewy quiet, I'm hunting wabbits
#15 Oct 04 2010 at 1:22 AM Rating: Default
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people are stupid they think you have no choice but to play solo and they tell me this in game "this game if for soloing not partys", but partying is so much faster see people in there 30's already from it. SE need to bring back the ffxi party system meaning /sea all, and flag searching menu for us who like to exp with people.
#16 Oct 04 2010 at 1:33 AM Rating: Default
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Tanstalas1 wrote:
Sssshhh. Be Vewy vewy quiet, I'm hunting wabbits


lol ^^V
#17 Oct 04 2010 at 3:07 AM Rating: Excellent
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Chat box is rubbish especially when your doing something and it closes your chat box....
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#18 Oct 04 2010 at 3:26 AM Rating: Good
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How many MMO's have you played that had really amazing welcoming communities?

Just cause it's made by a company who's previous game had an awesome community does not follow it will break the norm. Also FFXI payers got a lot more linkshell orientated near the end, that will also follow through onto here. Would rather chat on the LS than to random people to bolster the whole community ideal.

I think FFXI was as it was honestly cause well, you had to be sociable. The game made you rely on others to such a huge extent if you just kept to yourself you might as well just quit the game, on here it doesnt matter its more like WoW in that regard. FFXI forced the the community to blossom, if you don't do that people and MMO players in particular will keep to themselves or the small clique they have.

Oh yeah and ofc the chat box problems and the fact you have to button mash don't help either. On FFXI I could happily chat away while I was leveling for hours on end, not so easy to do that on here.

Edited, Oct 4th 2010 5:28am by preludes
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#19 Oct 04 2010 at 3:26 AM Rating: Decent
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but they put in the away flag for soloing... great job SE.
#20 Oct 04 2010 at 8:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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There's no auto attack. Chatting while fighting quite literally means standing there doing nothing while a mob wails on you.
#21 Oct 04 2010 at 9:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Yodabunny wrote:
There's no auto attack. Chatting while fighting quite literally means standing there doing nothing while a mob wails on you.


o.O

I've run into the chat window close issue trying to chat while crafting/harvesting but have not tried to chat while fighting.

This is a good example of where a bad decision in combat design can really influence player social activity - or lack thereof.
#22 Oct 04 2010 at 9:56 AM Rating: Default
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Yodabunny wrote:
There's no auto attack. Chatting while fighting quite literally means standing there doing nothing while a mob wails on you.


On the contrary, typing while fighting lets me regenerate a little stamina to spam with.
#23 Oct 04 2010 at 11:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Slapaho wrote:
I'm not sure where you were going with that Kane. It's easy to have a median between the two. XIV just went WAY too far with the soloing. Not only that...all the jobs are exactly the same. Every single job its for the same amount. 15 Thaum hits for 100. Lancer hits for 100. The game needs some drastic changes. Fast.


I just meant to humorously point out sometimes capricious playerbase -- many people wished that their job could solo, but if anyone can solo well, they usually don't party. Personally, I think that FFXI post-Field of Valour found a proper median: I could get decent exp soloing at my own pace, but a huge amount in a good party.

I agree with what you said about FFXIV, I think that they really made things too easy with regard to soloing; or maybe not too easy, but at least too rewarding. Additionally, I've actually said before what you're saying about the jobs' similarities; I tried a few levels of every class in beta and finished thinking, "It feels like I played only one class."

As you said at the end of your post, so do I echo. FFXIV does need drastic changes, and it certainly does need them quickly.

(SE needs to realise that they have an eight-year-old blueprint called FFXI that they can use to help them straighten things out, things like class uniqueness, menu construction, and economy, to name a few.)
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"Thus opium is pleasing... on account of the agreeable delirium it produces." (Burke para.6)

"I could only read so much for this paper and the syphilis poem had to go."
#24 Oct 04 2010 at 12:18 PM Rating: Good
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KaneKitty wrote:

I just meant to humorously point out sometimes capricious playerbase -- many people wished that their job could solo, but if anyone can solo well, they usually don't party. Personally, I think that FFXI post-Field of Valour found a proper median: I could get decent exp soloing at my own pace, but a huge amount in a good party.

I agree with what you said about FFXIV, I think that they really made things too easy with regard to soloing; or maybe not too easy, but at least too rewarding. Additionally, I've actually said before what you're saying about the jobs' similarities; I tried a few levels of every class in beta and finished thinking, "It feels like I played only one class."

As you said at the end of your post, so do I echo. FFXIV does need drastic changes, and it certainly does need them quickly.

(SE needs to realise that they have an eight-year-old blueprint called FFXI that they can use to help them straighten things out, things like class uniqueness, menu construction, and economy, to name a few.)



I agree.

If there was content that couldn't be done solo, well duh, the player base would get together and group up.

Those were the best parts of FFXI.

Guildleves are killing that.

IF Guildleves provided awesome armor/weapons and showed that in the description, for each star ranking then people would group like nobody's business...5 star leve that gives some Poison Cesti, sign me up!

Plus if the story or "Rank" missions required a group you'd see more of that too.

I'm sure endgame will be grouping, but even now I really don't even know.

---

In FFXI I started with no real responsibilities (well, college) in life and had time to LFG and party all day. When I started working and had a fiancé as well as other hobbies I solo'ed mostly with a DRG and grouped when I could. Then the grind was too much even with FoVs. Yet it was still light years ahead from release.

Like you I was assuming that SE would use all of what they learned from FFXI and apply that toward FFXIV. SE had an AWESOME basis for a party system and search, and yet they throw all that out the window for what it a very very broken party search system.

All SE had to do was use FFXI party system and make soloing an actual viable choice. OR just make parting easier by being lax on the level and class restrictions.

When you take that into consideration it looks as though that's what SE is thinking about doing but just haven't got around to it yet.

Lastly, if FFXIV doesn't fix the party system, then I guess SE was looking for a WoW clone after all. Solo, maybe Duo all the way to cap, then grind dungeons and gear at endgame.

Either way, SE really is the rubik's cube of developers, and I suck at trying to figure out rubik's cubes.

#25 Oct 04 2010 at 12:38 PM Rating: Good
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They really "botched" this game up. The /say function is flat out broken. It just doesn't work.
While I can type short /say messages, the command line often resets itself based on what you are typing.

The fatigue system is messed up too. I levelled to gladiator level 9, switched to pugilist and was getting crap XP.

No auction house? Seriously? Do you really expect players to struggle through targetting an npc, clicking browse to check for materials of armor sold at prices that no one has enough money to pay for?

Do they really expect you to make all of your own armor and weapons? What happenned to signing gear that you made? That was a nice feature in FFXI.

There is no feature to search for players? That's really anti-social.
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#26 Oct 04 2010 at 12:55 PM Rating: Good
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the fact that the chat system is so cruddy makes me not talk much except to the LS...

I hate when people send me tells because then i have to /t first last... and some of you clever bastids use weird spellings for a "typical name" (Ex. Fredrick, you use: Frederik) and it wreaks havoc on my dyslexic brain
#27 Oct 04 2010 at 12:57 PM Rating: Good
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I find people talk a lot in my server. I find say gets more response than shout though. I find shouting to be rude - especially multiple shouts.

Want a group? Hang out by the Aethyrite and respond to people looking for group or members. When the leves are done see if anyone wants to hang out and duo/trio/party.

Getting an LS helps.

But saying people don't talk is rubbish. I was wheeling and dealing at the Blacksmith/Armorer guild yesterday, made a lot of cash - a bunch of hatchets for my LS mates, and managed to grab a level 12 saw and a level 12 alembic.

You gotta be saying something worth responding to/realistic in a polite way though. There was someone shouting that they would pay 500 gil for iron spikes over and over and over again, eventually getting hysterical about it. No one responded until a friend of mine was like “dude, those are R21 armorer craft, if anyone here can make it they probably won’t do it for 500 gil, you gotta offer them something worthwhile or at least have the mats.”

And they got all ***** about it - and I don’t think anyone ever made them anything but they were being mega annoying. I find that if people are reasonable and polite they don’t have any problems getting what they want.

I haven’t had problems anyway. If I want someone to make something complex I have all the mats on me – hand them over and pay them money. Bam. I get what I want. I don’t scream from the middle of limsa about what I want or stand in amongst a bunch of crafters who are trying to get their leves done at a camp whining about how I can’t find what I want.

Want a weapon – go to the guild that makes it and check bazaars. If no one has one for sale try to get the components yourself and bring it to them to make. Most of the time there are crafters who are more than happy to put your stuff together for you even if it takes awhile. But don’t expect to get something for nothing.

Also if you are low on cash and don’t craft you may have good luck offering to trade shards for mats/products. Shards can be a pain to track down so I know for myself I am happy to do deals like a maple shield for 40 shards and 2K.
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#28 Oct 04 2010 at 1:01 PM Rating: Good
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Kierk wrote:

Guildleves are killing that.

IF Guildleves provided awesome armor/weapons and showed that in the description, for each star ranking then people would group like nobody's business...5 star leve that gives some Poison Cesti, sign me up!



yeah the rewards for doing higher stars suck. They need to fix that because there really is no incentive to do 5 star leves... leves either are so easy you get no skill or they rape you for huge repair costs and no real increased reward. Sucks.
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When it comes to sitting around not doing anything for long periods of time, only being active for short windows, and marginal changes and sidegrades I'd say FFXI players were the perfect choice for politicians.


#29 Oct 04 2010 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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KaneKitty wrote:
FFXI Playerbase: "I hate seeking a party all day long, I wish this was solo-friendly!"

FFXIV Playerbase: "I hate how nobody talks anymore, I wish this was less solo-friendly!"
This is pretty much the case. Feel pathetic that I actually miss FFXI in that respect.
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#30 Oct 04 2010 at 4:06 PM Rating: Good
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I think the major reasons for lack of chatting and partying:

1) The current interface for chat and parties is just plain terrible. The party search system from FFXI for some reason was replaced with the clunky interface we have now that hardly anyone bothers using because it's so unintuitive. Chatting is annoying - you can't use ctrl-r to reply until you've actually typed the other person's full name first - made even worse now that you have to type both a first and last name. Even worse when the person has a long/weird name. How do you invite someone to your party if they're not right next to you? - has anyone figured this out? The only real partying I see going on is at camps with people doing says/shouts for leves and exp groups - this limits partying to whatever people happen to be at the camp at that time. It was quite easy to put together a party of your choice in FFXI - tank, bard/rdm, healer, dd - whatever you want, just use the /sea function and put your party together (aside from the difficulty of actually finding an available brd/rdm lol..).


2) Over emphasis on crafting. Have you noticed how many people are involved in crafting instead of partying/grinding-exp? I personally like the crafting system but the current system almost makes it seem like if you don't start doing several crafts now, you'll be gimped. Repair costs become noticably higher even as you get into the teens. There is very little gear sold by NPCs (what's there is very overpriced) or given by quests at this point - another reason to craft. Also, most useful armor/weapons require mats from *several* different crafting disciplines, and the current broken market/retainer system makes it exceedingly frustrating to try and find parts that you can't make yourself - again, this seems to imply you need to level up *several* crafting professions. And of course, you can't chat while you're crafting either...
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#31 Oct 04 2010 at 4:12 PM Rating: Excellent
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As said the chat system, **** the entire UI, doesn't make communication ease. It's just horrible in that regard. Better to deal with it by yourself then to have someone else rushing you when you are trying to figure things out or deal with the system.
#32 Oct 04 2010 at 4:13 PM Rating: Decent
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I figure it's because most of the players are WoW kiddies. They only know how to level up solo, and rush to end-game, like everything else before end-game isn't part of the game.
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#33 Oct 04 2010 at 4:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Corthaemus wrote:
I figure it's because most of the players are WoW kiddies. They only know how to level up solo, and rush to end-game, like everything else before end-game isn't part of the game.


Because real men like to play games with horrible interface and a bad chat system?
#34 Oct 04 2010 at 4:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Corthaemus wrote:
I figure it's because most of the players are WoW kiddies. They only know how to level up solo, and rush to end-game, like everything else before end-game isn't part of the game.


Does not matter which game people came from. WoW or EQ or PSO. Truth is, most of its players are FFXI players, who feel the need to elevate themselves above the competition by levelling a craft early on.

Friends can come later. People just don't want to be poor like they were in FFXI.
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#35 Oct 04 2010 at 4:45 PM Rating: Good
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zpanda wrote:

2) Over emphasis on crafting. Have you noticed how many people are involved in crafting instead of partying/grinding-exp?


I agree with your first idea, but not so much this second one. Just doing a quick search on Lodestone right now, there is a total of ~4300 crafters and gatherers and well over 7000 (that is, some amount more than 1000 in every class!) disciples of war and magic. Plus, it's not in FFXI, just because I was on a Bard I was available to party as a Bard... I could have been (as I often was) Mazurk-ing around Bastok, skilling up my Alchemy.

That being said, it would be nice if an Alchemist could seek as a Thaumaturge (or if we could just seek to begin with!)... but seeking on a different job than the one you're currently playing is something people have wanted since FFXI, and since SE seems determined to start one step back from everything they already figured out in the course of their first MMO, I have a feeling it won't ever be addressed. (._. ;)

Edited, Oct 4th 2010 8:31pm by KaneKitty
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#36 Oct 04 2010 at 5:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mentoc wrote:
Because real men like to play games with horrible interface and a bad chat system?
The interface and chat systems are definitely horrible, but I don't think that's why players aren't grouping in the game.
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