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Conversations: The Disappointment of Final Fantasy XIV (14)Follow

#1 Oct 09 2010 at 8:54 AM Rating: Decent
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A well written review of FF14

http://jp.learnoutlive.com/conversations-the-disappointment-of-final-fantasy-xiv-14/
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#2 Oct 09 2010 at 9:04 AM Rating: Default
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HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Are you friggin' serious?!!!!

It seems like some RMT are ****** they don't have a leg up yet in this game.
#3 Oct 09 2010 at 9:12 AM Rating: Default
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That is the most terrible "review" for anything I have ever seen. It's not even a review, it's a comparison interview. If you compare an MMORPG to it's predecessor that is a completely different game and has been out for years it probably won't go well with any game. Also it doesn't help that the person being interviewed is obviously in love with FFXI and wanted XIV to be FFXI 2, same game with better graphics. Which SE said they didn't want to do, though I do see similarities in them.

At any rate, just a bad bad "review" thing.
#4 Oct 09 2010 at 9:17 AM Rating: Decent
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This guy thought the same thing I did. Bastardized zones that need to be reworked, and lifeless cities that need...well life. My thoughts exactly and I could not agree anymore.

I would bet you all the money in the world that if SE would have taken their time with the zones and the cities, the game would actually become a lot better. Just like the guy mentions, you don't feel like you're part of the world.
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#5 Oct 09 2010 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
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Just in case you guys didn't know, XIV means 14. I just wanted to make that clear.
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#6 Oct 09 2010 at 9:34 AM Rating: Good
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We can call anything a "review" now.

I'm' willing to bet 75% of the people hanging around forums for this game week after week talking about how horrible the game is will still be here a year from now, defending the game tooth and nail. Yeah, it has issues and some questionable decisions. But more importantly it is a lot of fun and has potential when certain issues are finally adressed. If it wasn't fun, I wouldn't be here and I don't believe most of the people hanging around the forums aren't having fun either.

Don't give me this "I have to play my 30 days out". Regardless if you spent money or not, if you hate the game, its not worth your time.

Edited, Oct 9th 2010 11:40am by Vawn43
#7 Oct 09 2010 at 9:37 AM Rating: Decent
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ff11 this, ff11 that, ff11 is everything. Ok now i'am playing ffxiv, wtf it's not ff11? What a $%#@^ game.

This guy "Andrius" must be a genius.

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#8 Oct 09 2010 at 9:41 AM Rating: Decent
Eh, he just stated what 99% of us already know.
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#9 Oct 09 2010 at 9:43 AM Rating: Decent
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grazypanda wrote:
ff11 this, ff11 that, ff11 is everything. Ok now i'am playing ffxiv, wtf it's not ff11? What a $%#@^ game.

This guy "Andrius" must be a genius.



I know, everyone seems to want XIV to just be FFXI. Maybe someday SE will reopen those FFXI servers so all these XI players can play the game they want to again.

What? FFXI is still going? Well what are these people doing here?
#10 Oct 09 2010 at 9:47 AM Rating: Good
Vawn43 wrote:
We can call anything a "review" now.


[offtopic]
This is my review about a quick snack I made. Heating up two sausage patties from the freezer I put two muffins in the toaster, thinly cut two slices of cheese, and then combined them together and heated that up to melt the cheese. It was good. Overall I'd say the cheese may have been melted a little too long and the muffins could have been toasted longer. In comparison I'd have to say they're really not much different from McDonald's Sausage McMuffins in the morning. I'd have to give it a 6/10 and a full belly. *BELCH*
[/offtopic]

[ontopic]
I didn't bother reading the review of FFXIV the OP added and don't think I will. The ones that probably really matter are your own opinions of the game and some of the actual reviews made by real gaming sites, not fan sites. So here's my own review of FFXI:

The game is good, has bad flaws, and is unfinished. SE dropped the ball on this one but I still like the game. I wouldn't recommend the game to anyone until the flaws in FFXIV are fixed. The end.
[/ontopic]

Edited, Oct 9th 2010 8:48am by SamusKnight
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#11 Oct 09 2010 at 10:14 AM Rating: Good
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The names that have been around since the first final fantasy were all tossed out in favor of new ones.

I don’t see why you’d rename a monk a pugilist, a black mage a conjurer, a dragoon a lancer, and so on.

Every single job was renamed. And remade.

Dragoons don’t jump anymore. They don’t have cute little dragon pets like in ff 11. A lancer is just what it says, a guy with a lance.


I found this part funniest. Why rename the jobs from FFXI? Possibly because they mixed them together? Pugilist is MNK/THF, Conjurer is BLM/WHM, Lancer is more like a SAM with a polearm, "and so on".

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Conjurer is now a combination of white and black mage, a combination that absolutelly baffles me. To do well you need to pay your full attention to just one of those jobs, and in a party there’s no doubt they’ll be whining for healing full time.

And if you don’t like the whm (J Sensei: “White Mage,” designated healer) aspect of the job, being in a party will be very miserable very fast.

All the enfeebles were tossed into one job, now named thaumaturge instead of red mage.


He must not have played much if he didn't realize that you can equip other class abilities on every class.

I really wish people who don't know anything would stop talking like they're experts.
#12 Oct 09 2010 at 10:16 AM Rating: Decent
Vawn43 wrote:
I know, everyone seems to want XIV to just be FFXI. Maybe someday SE will reopen those FFXI servers so all these XI players can play the game they want to again.

What? FFXI is still going? Well what are these people doing here?


People don't want this to be FFXIv2, they just want certain things that worked for FFXI (and other MMO's), to be functional here. A non laggy UI, maps that aren't copy and pasted, certain job names, etc. We don't want the same combat system, crafting system, travel system, story, quests, etc. But we do want a functional game with some thought invested into it.

Just because you're making a new MMO, it doesn't mean abandon absolutely everything that was done in the previous version, nor does it mean copy everything that was successful from that MMO. Games like WoW took on things from previous games, did some things as a first, you need a good mix.
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#13 Oct 09 2010 at 10:18 AM Rating: Good
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Well I was going to go have a nap... till I read this. Now let me throw out my counter argument and pick out the flaws of this review much as a buzzard would pick the brains out of a dead cow.

Now to start this off let me restate that this FFXIV is not FFXI, SE stated they wanted to create a different game with a familiar feeling to get old FFXI players to hop on board with the new game. This person who created a review might as well go about reviewing an orange and a banana because that is what he has done here. He pretty much said well this orange isn't yellow, it's not long or curved, the taste is way off for a banana, geez this orange is the worst banana I have ever had.

I do agree with some points of the reviewer namely the auction house and about the bazaars. SE also stated in previous interviews that they are considering the implantation of an AH later in date.

Quote:
Andrius: Well, FF 14 is new, so obviously there’s less of the world out there, but even just comparing what does exist to its FF 11 counterpart has 14 coming up short.
The cities in 11 felt real, they felt alive, like they had a soul. They were built like real cities would be, they had residential districts, houses, people out walking around…In 14 the city I started in, Gridania has none of that. It feels like it was made for a game.

I think if you looked at both worlds at release they would have roughly been the same size. In XIV though each zone is the equivalent of a region in XI. So has it come up short... I don't think so. In time more will be added and new areas open up, it is very naive to attempt to compare an 8 year old game to a brand new game. Here is another analogy you wouldn't expect a new born baby to be able to ride a bike, would you?

As for the cities not having life, he hasn't been to limsa. I remember going there seeing fishermen casting lines, the cooks adding spices to the meals they were cooking. There are also tons of NPCs, I haven't even talked to all of them yet.

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Gridania is needlessly large. The areas that have things between them are separated by long tunnels that have no purpose.
This is just like windurst... except windurst was worse. In Gridania it does not take me 30 minutes to run from one side of town to the other as in did in windurst. Also there were a lot of tunnels that had nothing to them or the planking over the water in windurst. So really what point is he attempting to make here?

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It’s just so disapointing. Copied and pasted tunnel sections.

Really? Ever been to the jungle in XI, that place was a lot of copy and pasted tunnels. As has been said by other posters here it is economical to use the copy paste approach in game within reasons. The amount of time and programming it would require to make each and every little inch unique would make this game even more un-playable on today's systems.

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Well, are the other zones any better? Or do they stand out at least?

Andrius: Actually I haven’t gotten to them.
Well then you can't really make an educated opinion can you? Here he is talking about how the zones in this game are horrible. Yet he has not even explored 10% of it. If some one had taken the time to explore the world then I would take their point more seriously.

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The world map (If ff 14 has this, it hides it very well, I haven’t found it yet) showed a city called Bastok far to the south of our starting city, so we set out to find it.
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In ff 11 I wanted to explore. I met a player in Sandoria and we just decided to go explore the world.
Well actually the world map is quite easy to find, as long as you can find the (M) key on your keyboard you should be ok. All you have to do once your map is open is go over to the little blue box and then click world map. That wasn't very hard now was it. Now what's keeping you from exploring FFXIV, many of my friends have be able to travel to the other cities with nothing but knowing the general direction of the cities, and have noticed a wide variety of zones.

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Andrius: The jobs were remade for no apparent reason.

The names that have been around since the first final fantasy were all tossed out in favor of new ones.

I don’t see why you’d rename a monk a pugilist, a black mage a conjurer, a dragoon a lancer, and so on.
It's because this is not FFXI-2, SE has right off the beginning said they wanted to create a new game, with a new feel. Now I don't know about you but I think a lot of people would have complained if it was the exact same job list in XI they would scream "WTF this is FFXI-2, we wanted a new game". I like the variety of classes, and as in XI there are hidden classes that we have yet to discover.

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To do well you need to pay your full attention to just one of those jobs, and in a party there’s no doubt they’ll be whining for healing full time.
Every class has there own heal action or skill. There is no need to have a dedicated healer, and if you want one combine skills from other classes to make your healer. I don't feel like quoting this one part but the reason there is no red mage class with refresh is because both CON and THU have there own MP regain spell.


The rest of the "review" hold some merit so I won't counter to much on it. But it is painfully obvious that this is a very biased review. This reviewer is a die-hard FFXI player having spent a year and a bit of his life playing this game. As such he came in to XIV expecting to get his "fix" and found out that this is a very different game, and left him craving and in withdrawal of his beloved FFXI so much so that he forget to see the same problems that plague both games. Now there is one part of the review I really do like and hope SE actually listen to. Since there has been some much hate and negativity the only logically answer would be to attempt to make amends and appease the player base so two thumbs up for this.
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I think the best thing SE could do right now is apologize for the game being very rough on release, give another free month to everyone and start making some major changes fast.


That is all I think I will have my nap now.


Edited, Oct 9th 2010 1:46pm by crazyorc
#14 Oct 09 2010 at 10:33 AM Rating: Good
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I like how he presented it as this exclusive "interview" he got with his friend who played a lot of FFXI and a little bit of FFXIV.
#15 Oct 09 2010 at 10:38 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only SamusKnight wrote:

I didn't bother reading the review of FFXIV the OP added and don't think I will. The ones that probably really matter are your own opinions of the game and some of the actual reviews made by real gaming sites, not fan sites. So here's my own review of FFXI:


Actually, MMO's are a sphere where no major website or magazine have any real influence or interaction with. Information is created and shared by the userbase of the games. It's essentially crowdsourced coverage.
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#16 Oct 09 2010 at 11:06 AM Rating: Good
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I got as far as "there is no auto-run" then proceeded to /facepalm....I use auto-run all the time and never had to set up a macro for it. IT'S RIGHT THERE IN THE DAMNED CONTROLLER SETUP! This so called "review" is nothing more than a rant Q&A and nothing more. Next time find someone who's actually progressed a bit further in the game as asking someone who is only level/rank 10 means they have put little time into the game.
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#17 Oct 09 2010 at 11:44 AM Rating: Decent
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I liked it. A few spelling errors, but I think that it did a good job of summarising FFXIV's major flaws from teh perspective of a FFXI player (i.e., more than half of FFXIV's playerbase).

Quote:
In general the game needs to regain some of the soul that ff11 has.

Add some more npcs in town, add some quests to them too.

I haven’t been asked to run to the store and buy a gallon of milk for an npc, no lost kitties needed finding, nothing. Those quests are cliche, no doubt about it, but without them the towns feel empty.

You can do them better, and it gives people something to do.


I think these were the best points.
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#18 Oct 09 2010 at 11:56 AM Rating: Good
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crazyorc wrote:
This person who created a review might as well go about reviewing an orange and a banana because that is what he has done here. He pretty much said well this orange isn't yellow, it's not long or curved, the taste is way off for a banana, geez this orange is the worst banana I have ever had.


Except he was comparing the strengths of FFXI with the weaknesses of FFXIV, not just their superficial characteristics. For example, he did not simply say that "towns are different," he said that "in FFXIV, towns feel very empty, NPCs do not feel as though they actually do anything, it feels very fake, and there is a lack of quests."

crazyorc wrote:
I do agree with some points of the reviewer namely the auction house and about the bazaars. SE also stated in previous interviews that they are considering the implantation of an AH later in date.


No, they didn't. Go back and read the quote, or read one of the several forums that have been made in the past actually analysing what SE said.

crazyorc wrote:
Ever been to the jungle in XI, that place was a lot of copy and pasted tunnels.


Nothing is as copy-pasted as Gridania; it is impossible to defend that zone -- just look at it! It's nothing but little squares connected by the same tunnel! XD

crazyorc wrote:
it is painfully obvious that this is a very biased review. This reviewer is a die-hard FFXI player having spent a year and a bit of his life playing this game.


It's not like he was trying to hide it... the first few sentences only says
The Article wrote:
I went to a close personal friend of mine, known as Andrius, which was also his username during very exhaustive playing time (9600 hours)...in Final Fantasy XI


In conclusion, I think your review of the review is biased.
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#19 Oct 09 2010 at 12:09 PM Rating: Decent
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In conclusion, I think your review of the review is biased.


Agree to disagree than?

Quote:
Except he was comparing the strengths of FFXI with the weaknesses of FFXIV, not just their superficial characteristics. For example, he did not simply say that "towns are different," he said that "in FFXIV, towns feel very empty, NPCs do not feel as though they actually do anything, it feels very fake, and there is a lack of quests."


Also I still find it difficult to find the difference of how the town's feel empty in XIV compared to XI. Since most of the town actually have a lot more NPC having actions than in XI where they just stood around. If you look at XIV vs. XI I could say that XIV is more alive than XI due to the text of NPC actually making you feel that you are within a certain region that has it's own accent.

Quote:
Nothing is as copy-pasted as Gridania; it is impossible to defend that zone -- just look at it! It's nothing but little squares connected by the same tunnel! XD
What I was trying to get at was the fact that XI made extensive use of copy and pasting as well, to the same degree as XIV.

Quote:
No, they didn't. Go back and read the quote, or read one of the several forums that have been made in the past actually analysing what SE said.
I have been following this game since it was announced and have read every interview SE put out. I will attempt to find the one I read but they DID state they were considering it. That doesn't mean they will put it in place, but they are at least thinking of it(or at least were thinking of it).

Enlighten me to how my review is biased. I simple took the facts that I knew and used them to show how the reviewer didn't use the best examples or have the correct knowledge of the game to explain his opinion.

Edited, Oct 9th 2010 2:12pm by crazyorc
#20 Oct 09 2010 at 12:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Debuffs for mobs. unfortunately the two red mages actually used in ff 11 are gone. Refresh and dispel are gone. Those two are the only reasons red mages were used endgame.
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#21 Oct 09 2010 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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This was less a review, and more of what one dude thought, which is fine, cause thats what your thread title says it is. The only thing I had an issue with, was that there is actually an auto run button.
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#22 Oct 09 2010 at 2:50 PM Rating: Good
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This review made me want to cry. I actually feel sick in my stomach over it, because I know many points are so true. What really stressed me out was:

"The Black Shroud is the worst forest zone I’ve ever seen. Even calling a forest zone stretches the term beyond all reason.

The zone is in reality a series of tunnels and a few open areas.

The tunnels are literally just right angles and straight piece that it looks like someone just plopped down in a world builder. Most of it is in basically grid patterns, almost like someone drew it on graph paper and thought the lines on the paper had to be put into the final plan.

It’s just so disapointing. Copied and pasted tunnel sections."


I didn't even play FF14 today. I had no interest to. I'm afraid my honeymoon period is over. I am so saddened by that. I wanted so much for this game to be great and I'm just plain sick. I am at the point now, where I am counting my days until my free time period is up;;. I hope, I hope beyond hope, that SE will fix this mess, but I can't see how. There is just sooo much to fix.
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#23 Oct 09 2010 at 3:22 PM Rating: Decent
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I was reading it and agreeing with half what he said, then he really seemed to yack off far too much and going off topic. Just simply answering the questions would help... maybe he really loves the sound of his voice.

As for the NPC's? the main city's in FFXI have far too many NPC's who are not usefull in anyway. In fact some of them became useful/added later on.

As for the size of the city's, doesnt FFXI have citys with multiple zones? Like Sandy, North/South/Port. perhaps these were far too big as well. The run from Ronf to airship on Port sandy was probably more of a run then zoning in to gridania and runing from one end to the other end twice?

It only seems BIG because theres no Loading. As for the running, isnt running from Sandy to bastok a LARGE treck. In fact people had to earn the right to use chocobo's/tele crystals/airships.

At least here we get Anima STRAIGHT UP.
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#24 Oct 09 2010 at 3:35 PM Rating: Excellent
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We should get this out in the open. FFXIV is a sequel. As such there is no reason at all a sequel should end up with less features or overall perform worse then it's predecessor. It doesn't matter if FFXI has been out for years. Through FFXI SE knew what worked and what didn't. They knew what players wanted and required. They knew what players didn't like and didn't want. They ignored all of that. Basic user interface features that were apart of FFXI and all other **** Final Fantasy games are not present in FFXIV. How is this defensible? These aren't simple bugs that FFIXV has but actually design issues. It's as if this game was made by people that had no knowledge of the MMORPG industry or even of the normal RPG genre.

Edited, Oct 9th 2010 5:39pm by NeoStar9
#25 Oct 09 2010 at 3:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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Well to be fair, it was the OP that stated it was a review of FFXIV. The post itself clearly states that it's a conversation about XIV with a long time fan of XI.

That being said, many of his points are valid on their face value. Even without the comparison to FFXI, alot of what he says is true. The Black Shroud is a copy/pasted maze, the cities do lack the feel of 'life', and the lack of any personal interaction with npcs beyond the main storyline is disappointing to say the least. There's nothing about this game that is personalized to individual players, no space to call your own. And without that personal feel, the game will struggle to draw players into Eorzea.
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#27 Oct 09 2010 at 4:20 PM Rating: Good
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Every class has there own heal action or skill. There is no need to have a dedicated healer, and if you want one combine skills from other classes to make your healer. I don't feel like quoting this one part but the reason there is no red mage class with refresh is because both CON and THU have there own MP regain spell.


I'm sure that later in the game you will need a dedicated healer. If not at any other point then in endgame for sure.
#28 Oct 09 2010 at 5:36 PM Rating: Good
I see when they start to talk about The Black Forest and i couldn't agree more.
Quote:
The tunnels are literally just right angles and straight piece that it looks like someone just plopped down in a world builder. Most of it is in basically grid patterns, almost like someone drew it on graph paper and thought the lines on the paper had to be put into the final plan.

The the area is gorgeous and rich but I thought the same thing when i saw the design on the map and took a closer look.
It almost looked embarrassingly created with a old simple world builder program. The same repeated model landscapes is laughable and why would the open areas all have to be squares and rectangles instead of naturally dynamic like in ffxi?
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#29 Oct 13 2010 at 6:31 PM Rating: Default
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I just finished reading the interview with Andrius and entire time I was so shocked to see that he wrote EXACTLY what I had in mind about FF14. In every way possible. from the jobs to auction house or the entire game itself how lame it is. After so many years of experience Squareenix got from FF11 and trying to implement what the fans really wanted why would you make another game with same topic but missing so much. missing the point, making it far from fun with taking away simple things like auto attack, follow, when you about to check someone you can’t move anymore, like they say “Talk about fly-by-night merchants…!” .. Why can’t you just right click someone rather than another window opens with small fonts at the right side of your screen , you trying to click on browse or something quick quick before he runs away in all the LAG. ..AndI got 3x 24inch screens and trust me it’s a pain…right click and menu right there in your face, that’s how its suppose to be! And yes, yes it is indeed true how are you suppose to find something specific when you just don’t know who the **** has it >.> when you need something you go to that specific store that has it not go in every single store to find it!!!! What Andrius means in my opinion is SE took away the simple things that made the game more convenient! Another thing, why isn’t there any mobs around??! you can run for hours in the map and you will find a few mobs here and there. with such huge areas why not more mobs? Anyways I did quit the game and I won’t be going back to it until a lot of things are fixed. from my part I know 6 of my friends quit as well. I personally had bought 2 collector’s edition copy and when I saw this disaster I was so disappointed that I quit the game 1 week later. I have played a lot of games to make the different between a good one and a bad one. these are things that didn’t even need to be fixed, they are common sense. just sucks and frustrating to pay and play miserably while these issues are fixed. it feels SE just makes it on purpose to waste a good 6months or more of players time and collect money then you start playing. IMO SE is aware of what they made and errors but too confident that people are desperate to play their games. well I hope people will wake up like I did and move on so they don’t take people for fools. Star wars coming out, we all moving to that game. see you all there..

P.S Disappointing
and for sure we keep comparing 11 with 14 if not why they made same looking characters, abilities look alike and everything else look alike??? for those who did not realize that then wake up...SE pulling your tales man. and for character creations thats all we get a few options for face, body and all???? 7 billion of ppl on earth and guys guess what!!!! we all look alike with only our eyebrows diffrentO_O

him being a fan or what not its the experience that counts nothing else. the interview says in other words how i felt and i did not play thousands of hours of ff11. one more thing all this time and effort all we get is same type of looking characters, same type of jobs but instead of many they just put all of them in a huge mixer and handed over you few little jobs…Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, Disappointing, ….
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