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The grind after 15 starts to become just a little bit Follow

#1 Oct 10 2010 at 9:43 PM Rating: Good
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ridiculous.

Ever since rank 20, it takes me pretty much my entire day to rank up one time. Not fun. I'd have much more fun if it took less SP per rank to rank up, and I could go and level multiple classes. It just feels like there's absolutely no incentive to rank up, and it's mindless repetitive grinding, hour after hour, after hour. I played since the NA launch of FFXI, and I never remember it being THIS much of a grind. I remember having fun leveling with people in that game, and reaching the cap with ease, within 4-5 weeks of release. At 4-5 weeks after release, I'll be lucky to be even halfway to cap in this game.
#2 Oct 10 2010 at 9:48 PM Rating: Decent
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That's because this game has no "chain exp" so there is no way to level up at a rate above ordinary. It all comes down to individual actions done vs mob rather than party vs mob.
#3 Oct 10 2010 at 9:49 PM Rating: Good
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I am half expecting that it is because SE doesn't want the PC players to get too great of an advantage on PS3 players, and when the PS3 release hits we'll see the sp/exp curve reduced as well.

You think it's hard for leveling up a fighting class, try it with a crafting job. Stupidly ridiculous.
#4 Oct 10 2010 at 9:53 PM Rating: Good
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Leveling slow sucks, but do you honestly want to hit cap a month into the game? With as little content as there is at present what would you end up doing?
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#5 Oct 10 2010 at 9:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Leskura wrote:
Leveling slow sucks, but do you honestly want to hit cap a month into the game? With as little content as there is at present what would you end up doing?


Leveling other classes I guess.
#6 Oct 10 2010 at 10:04 PM Rating: Decent
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like FFXI after level 10 before FoV etc you where forced to party, the 1st 10 levels where great exp solo but then it slowed down.

i'm assuming this is the same, SE is simply saying grab a group. Problem is its more of a gind trying to with the current system. easiest option i guess would to be, head to a camp and ask people if they would like to join you i'm sure they would be willing
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#7 Oct 10 2010 at 10:07 PM Rating: Good
Mykha wrote:
ridiculous.

Ever since rank 20, it takes me pretty much my entire day to rank up one time. Not fun. I'd have much more fun if it took less SP per rank to rank up, and I could go and level multiple classes. It just feels like there's absolutely no incentive to rank up, and it's mindless repetitive grinding, hour after hour, after hour. I played since the NA launch of FFXI, and I never remember it being THIS much of a grind. I remember having fun leveling with people in that game, and reaching the cap with ease, within 4-5 weeks of release. At 4-5 weeks after release, I'll be lucky to be even halfway to cap in this game.

Although I don't doubt the exp curve rises drastically after rank 20 (I'm not there yet), I have a different memory of FFXI. I didn't play at release, but I played after the exp/level was reduced. And it took me months to get to cap. It took me months to get to the first limit-break, with subjob in tow. And I don't remember there being anything but grind. There wasn't anything like levequests, that's for sure.

There was the bonus exp from chains, though, as someone already mentioned. But it still felt painfully slower than XIV has so far, especially considering I'm not required to find 5 other people to party with to get good exp.
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#8 Oct 10 2010 at 10:12 PM Rating: Good
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Mykha wrote:
ridiculous.

I played since the NA launch of FFXI, and I never remember it being THIS much of a grind. I remember having fun leveling with people in that game, and reaching the cap with ease, within 4-5 weeks of release.


two things

1: what FFXI where you playing where there was no grind? Hi2u grinding crabs in Kuftal, Boyada, zone outside kuftal, than raptors, than crows, than......you get my point. FFXI leveling was a major ******* grind. It took forever, especially before all the XP+ rings, and ppl figured out power leveling....jesus after i saw it once i never wanted to go back.

2: SE is making this game as "grindtastic" as they can. They are trying to slow us down at every turn. My highest rank is 18 right now and i don't understand how some ppl are 30, or more so, some crafters are 30+....dude that's like weeks of mini games and SP wise i bet they not even a 1/3 of the way there......

Enjoy the suck fest while it lasts.....craft, **** around, make gil, the real game is coming soon.
#9 Oct 10 2010 at 10:16 PM Rating: Good
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Some of these points like the exp grind and the crafting system are still similar to XI, yet better imo. A lot of people like to use the rose-tinted glasses comment on people like me who enjoy the game, but I think that can be turned around to how people are remembering XI too. Lately no one seems to recall how painful some of the progression in that game was even years after its existence.

They reel ya in with a nice, easy-going rush to rank10-15 or so and then the real grind begins. It's gonna take some time. Along with these discussions, a lot of people seem to not know what they want. I see a lot of people saying things like "We don't want easy mode in FFXIV, that's for WoW!" While also wanting the game to be easier...
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#11 Oct 10 2010 at 10:31 PM Rating: Decent
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Leskura wrote:
Leveling slow sucks, but do you honestly want to hit cap a month into the game? With as little content as there is at present what would you end up doing?



In a game where we're expected to level several classes, this curve is a bit steep.
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#12 Oct 10 2010 at 10:35 PM Rating: Good
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My PUG is at rank 17 right now and it's pretty painful.

There are a few reasons for this.

Level 20 leves range from pretty easy to very hard on solo setting. Meaning I can breeze through 1 or 2 leves, but failing the other 3 or 4.

So I'd go to another city and do their leves, but I don't want to run to LL or Gridania. I can't teleport because, well, I'm all out of anima. And I thought I was being smart about conserving it.

So go grind you say? Well I would, but there are virtually no mobs to grind on, one after another. They took the grind out of the grind.

And when you do find mobs to grind, you better hope your equipment is at top shape and that you aren't at fatigue. Even with those requirements you'd be lucky to get 200sp per mob. Right now I'm averaging about 145sp per mob.

So go party you say? I would love to, but the party search and seek system is virtually non-existent.




Sure all of these "problems" could be rectified if I powered through it. However this tells me two things: SE forgot those in the middle and they're holding us back.

If you're very casual, you'll have plenty of anima, and plenty of leves to go at any given time.

If you're hardcore (and like the game enough) you'll power through it; you'll forgo the lack of a party seek, and/or grind on the mobs that there are.

If you're in the middle (and have strong doubts about the game) you'll get stuck.

And that's where I'm at.


So what did I do with an entire day off today?

Ran to Coerthas. It was beautiful...

But empty.
#13 Oct 10 2010 at 10:48 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yeah I kinda kill a few then browse the web and talk to people on chat for a few then go back. Honestly I am just tired of looking at the same thing over and over again. I don't care what you call the thing, it's still in the desert and it's still the same thing I was killing at level 1. I really wish there were more zones, even if they were smaller, that were different looking.

Tried the Limsa area, it was okay, but then I got bored of mindlessly killing things. So I pretty much just decided to try and visit ever Node and Gate and have all those in my list for later.

Tried the area outside Gridania, Black Shroud or something. I would rather die a million deaths than even go back there ever again. I refuse to even recall it back into my memory of that place which is dark in my heart.

Honestly if you are getting bored I would just suggest to explore and see how far you can make it without dying, it is pretty amazing how hard that is.
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#14 Oct 10 2010 at 10:50 PM Rating: Good
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Me and my friends are finding this out. The Grind is really mean, if we were getting a steady 200+ Skillpoints a mob, it would be one thing, but you fight for like an hour and get like 50-150 a mob or nothing. Or its like hey I (GLA) got like 180, THM got like 200ish and PUG got 40. And its like this for an hour is discouraging then my friend doesn't want to grind cause hes getting crappy skillpoints.
#15 Oct 11 2010 at 12:29 AM Rating: Good
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You weren't playing FFXI at NA release if you think this grind is worse. Unless you were out of work back then there is no way you did 1-75 in 4-5 weeks. It took 2 months to go from 60-75 for the most dedicated players, not to mention time it took to find a party because you absolutely could not solo in FFXI.

Get a party, you will pull 400-500 SP a battle and breeze through your twenties. You see those dungeon's scattered around the starting zone? They are a lot like the exp dungeons of FFXI. put together a party and dive in.

Please don't come crying when you hit the cap and you have "no more incentive to play".
#16 Oct 11 2010 at 12:31 AM Rating: Decent
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Wloire wrote:


Get a party, you will pull 400-500 SP a battle and breeze through your twenties. You see those dungeon's scattered around the starting zone? They are a lot like the exp dungeons of FFXI. put together a party and dive in.


This is where I realized that you haven't played this game.
#17 Oct 11 2010 at 12:47 AM Rating: Decent
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Mykha wrote:
Wloire wrote:


Get a party, you will pull 400-500 SP a battle and breeze through your twenties. You see those dungeon's scattered around the starting zone? They are a lot like the exp dungeons of FFXI. put together a party and dive in.


This is where I realized that you haven't played this game.


Clearly I haven't. Give it a try. Do you know where Mistbeard Cove is, have you ever been inside Copperbell? I have an even easier *Protip* for you: Get 2 healers to join you (I cannot guarantee their SP gain unfortunately) and have them heal you as you do Revenge of the Dodo's five star. You will receive 500 SP long before each battle is over.

Or maybe stop QQing and slow yourself down. Chances are highly likely there is nothing at the endgame anyways. Level all your crafts to 10, level some "subjobs". Explore. Have you seen a Kobold yet? They are kinda cool. Have you gathered every Aetheryte Node telepoint yet? There's some cool stuff to see especially in Coerthas. Go exploring, have you seen the dragon carcass yet? How about Ishgard in the distance? Maybe try crafting for profit instead of skill points.

There I just gave you something to do for the next 9 days until your subscription runs out. You don't seem to be the type to last longer than that.
#18 Oct 11 2010 at 12:52 AM Rating: Decent
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Wloire wrote:
Mykha wrote:
Wloire wrote:


Get a party, you will pull 400-500 SP a battle and breeze through your twenties. You see those dungeon's scattered around the starting zone? They are a lot like the exp dungeons of FFXI. put together a party and dive in.


This is where I realized that you haven't played this game.


Clearly I haven't. Give it a try. Do you know where Mistbeard Cove is, have you ever been inside Copperbell? I have an even easier *Protip* for you: Get 2 healers to join you (I cannot guarantee their SP gain unfortunately) and have them heal you as you do Revenge of the Dodo's five star. You will receive 500 SP long before each battle is over.

Or maybe stop QQing and slow yourself down. Chances are highly likely there is nothing at the endgame anyways. Level all your crafts to 10, level some "subjobs". Explore. Have you seen a Kobold yet? They are kinda cool. Have you gathered every Aetheryte Node telepoint yet? There's some cool stuff to see especially in Coerthas. Go exploring, have you seen the dragon carcass yet? How about Ishgard in the distance? Maybe try crafting for profit instead of skill points.

There I just gave you something to do for the next 9 days until your subscription runs out. You don't seem to be the type to last longer than that.


So your options are to do levequests for 500 SP that are on a 36H CD, but also force 2 healers to spam heal you for sh*tty SP?

Wow you're @#%^ing a tool.

Edited, Oct 11th 2010 2:53am by ShivThrice
#19 Oct 11 2010 at 12:59 AM Rating: Decent
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I got called a tool by someone with less then 10 posts, who's never met me, would probably like me in real life, but was jilted by a game he once thought we be the be-all end-all of his MMO gaming career and felt the need to sign up to ZAM just to air his grievances instead of moving on.

I'm sorry I forgot to put [/sarcasm] into my post. Even though you do get 500 per 5 star dodo, that is no way to make good exp. I thought the *Protip* was more than enough indication I was joking.

Thank you for ignoring the rest of the post, also you'll notice I gave a much better option of EXPing the old fashioned way, Mykha was having none of that though.

eidt: Wait a minute. I AM ******* a tool?

Edited, Oct 11th 2010 2:59am by Wloire
#20 Oct 11 2010 at 1:19 AM Rating: Default
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*Warning the post above me is a tool post*


There did I meet your posting qualifications, tool?
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#21 Oct 11 2010 at 1:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Wloire wrote:
I got called a tool by someone with less then 10 posts? I have 82 posts so I am clearly not a tool.
If higher postcount makes you less likely to be a tool, then I'm some sort of superhero.

I'd have to imagine that I'm not.



Edited, Oct 11th 2010 2:27am by bsphil
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#22 Oct 11 2010 at 1:31 AM Rating: Default
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Om-nom-nom-nom. Foiled again! You will notice I never said I was not a tool but did make sure to point out that Moxley's sock-puppet was calling me one. Bsphil I respect your post count man, but you're more the arch-villain then a superhero.
#23 Oct 11 2010 at 1:33 AM Rating: Good
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Wloire wrote:
Bsphil I respect your post count man
You really shouldn't though. It has nothing to do with the content of the post. It's just a number.

That it has any weight is the fallacious logic I was eluding at previously.
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#24Wloire, Posted: Oct 11 2010 at 1:34 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I keep forgetting my [sarcasm] tags don't I?
#25 Oct 11 2010 at 1:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Wloire wrote:
I keep forgetting my [sarcasm] tags don't I?

Tool

I hope now that my post count is to your standards.
#26 Oct 11 2010 at 2:40 AM Rating: Decent
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You're really vehement aren't you? Your method of singling out the weakest point in an argument, while ignoring the rest, is also outstanding. Did you buy a new computer for this game? Is that why you're so angry? Don't worry I did too, we can be best friends.
#27 Oct 11 2010 at 3:38 AM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
In a game where we're expected to level several classes, this curve is a bit steep.
That's my main complaint about the leveling speed as well.

If we were only playing a single class, than it would be understandable. But leveling up a single class takes longer than in many other pay-to-play MMO's, yet we're expected to not just level a single class, but to mix and match skills from multiple classes.

If it were up to me, all mobs would come with a base amount of SP. If you kill the mob, you get that base SP. It's just like XP, it is guaranteed. Then you can earn additional SP through your actions in the fight, but not like right now. Right now SP gains are completely random and plain stupid.

I can get better SP from killing a weakling mob that dies in 30seconds than I do from soloing a mob 5+ ranks above me that take several minutes to kill. That makes zero sense.

Earlier today I was killing some yellow enemies and getting between 150-250SP each one. They died very fast, and had virtually no chance of killing me. Then I got into a group where we were fighting mobs a full 10 ranks above us, and my SP gain took a total nosedive. Why would I not gain more skill from fighting more difficult enemies? I'm not talking about over time, I'm talking about each individual fight. It's like SE has diminishing SP gains the higher the enemy you're killing.
#28 Oct 11 2010 at 3:43 AM Rating: Good
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That's my main complaint about the leveling speed as well.

If we were only playing a single class, than it would be understandable. But leveling up a single class takes longer than in many other pay-to-play MMO's, yet we're expected to not just level a single class, but to mix and match skills from multiple classes.

If it were up to me, all mobs would come with a base amount of SP. If you kill the mob, you get that base SP. It's just like XP, it is guaranteed. Then you can earn additional SP through your actions in the fight, but not like right now. Right now SP gains are completely random and plain stupid.

I can get better SP from killing a weakling mob that dies in 30seconds than I do from soloing a mob 5+ ranks above me that take several minutes to kill. That makes zero sense.

Earlier today I was killing some yellow enemies and getting between 150-250SP each one. They died very fast, and had virtually no chance of killing me. Then I got into a group where we were fighting mobs a full 10 ranks above us, and my SP gain took a total nosedive. Why would I not gain more skill from fighting more difficult enemies? I'm not talking about over time, I'm talking about each individual fight. It's like SE has diminishing SP gains the higher the enemy you're killing.


I think this should be added to the feedback forum as its own thread.

Edited, Oct 11th 2010 5:43am by RattyBatty
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#29 Oct 11 2010 at 7:54 AM Rating: Decent
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I can get better SP from killing a weakling mob that dies in 30seconds than I do from soloing a mob 5+ ranks above me that take several minutes to kill. That makes zero sense.


QFT. Last night I was on my lvl 15 CON, grinding away on Moles (Yellow / Green, quick respawn, TP move is easy to avoid = good grind mob) in a cave outside of LL. My gf was sitting next to me on the couch and said something to the effect of "why the $#@% are you still fighting those stupid looking moles in that cave; weren't you fighting them like 2 weeks ago?"

I then launched into a lengthy diatribe about my painstaking journey to find a more efficient or more enjoyable way to grind SP, which ultimately ended up bringing me back to a mole cave outside of LL. On an SP per hour basis, the quote above is absolutely, 100% spot-on accurate (@ least up until rank 15 from my experience, and from what I've heard, until rank 20).

It's just as efficient and a helluva lot easier and less stressful to solo Yellow / Green Moles then it is to solo Orange / Red sheep. For the same amount of SP, I can either kill Moles with my eyes closed while watching TV or chatting w/ GF or I can use all of my buffs and cooldowns and barely kill Orange / Red Sheep in a stressful time consuming fight. Choice is easy for me at least...

So far the optimal leveling path I've discovered from level 1-15 involves grinding in different mole caves outside of LL.

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#30 Oct 11 2010 at 8:09 AM Rating: Good
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of all the problems with the game, slow leveling isnt one of them.

You can't have an mmo where you level from 1-max in like a week.

The mature mmos that have been out for several years are easier than they were at first, so we forget how long it took to lvl something. in ffxi after the NA launch it took me liek 6 months or more,maybe closer to a year to get to 75, towards the end of my time there, when i had 6 lvl 75's it took more like a month and a half, maybe. In WoW it took several months to get to 60, now I can literally go from 1-80 in less than a month.

slow leveling doesnt bother me really. Boring leveling does though, and well, I wont start on the interface >.> and all the other abominations which for the mass if ffxiv.
#31 Oct 11 2010 at 8:13 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
My gf was sitting next to me on the couch and said something to the effect of "why the $#@% are you still fighting those stupid looking moles in that cave; weren't you fighting them like 2 weeks ago?"


If that was my gf, my response would be "why the $#@% are you still looking at those stupid shoes in that catalogue; didn't I say 'no you cant have them' like 2 weeks ago?... now shut your mole... err I mean hole"
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