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Square Enix earnings tumble by 75% - FFXIV blamed.Follow

#1 Nov 05 2010 at 6:56 AM Rating: Good
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http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2010-11-05-square-enix-earnings-tumble-by-75-percent

So you guys don't need to register to see it, I'll copy and paste:

Japanese publisher Square Enix has seen its first half net income drop to ¥1723 million ($21 million) - a 75 per cent decline from ¥6826 million ($85 million) in the second half of 2009.

Results for the six months ending September 30 saw net sales decrease by 30 per cent, down to ¥68 billion ($843 million) from the last half's ¥101.7 billion ($1.26 billion).

Forecasts for the fiscal year ending March 2011 put net income at ¥12000 million against last year's ¥9509 million, and revenues at ¥160 billion (¥192 billion in FY09).

Sales did not meet the publisher's forecasts, but higher than expected profits came in due to catalogue sales of titles including Just Cause 2 and Final Fantasy XIII.

During its fiscal half, the company sold 8.17 million software units - 2.84 million in Japan, 2.71 million in Europe and 2.48 million in the US.

The biggest seller over the six months was Japanese-only title Dragon Quest Monsters Joker 2, at 1.28 million units.

Kane & Lynch 2 racked up 1.12 million sales globally, while Just Cause 2 added 0.56 million units over the last six months, to reach a lifetime total of 1.48 million.

Much of the decline was laid at the feet of MMO Final Fantasy XIV's disappointing performance. The PC game mustered global sales of 630,000 - although a PS3 version due in March may improve its fortunes.

"We're quickly working on reforms. We'd like to put our full power into regaining trust," CEO Yoichi Wada told investors.

"If we satisfy our users, they will return. On the other hand, once the users say, 'forget this,' there's no turning back. We can only recover our trust so far."
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#2 Nov 05 2010 at 7:04 AM Rating: Decent
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Wow... Some Head will get fired at SE. Thats what happen when you release an MMORPG too early.
#3 Nov 05 2010 at 7:08 AM Rating: Good
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Zorvan wrote:

Much of the decline was laid at the feet of MMO Final Fantasy XIV's disappointing performance. The PC game mustered global sales of 630,000 - although a PS3 version due in March may improve its fortunes.

"We're quickly working on reforms. We'd like to put our full power into regaining trust," CEO Yoichi Wada told investors.

"If we satisfy our users, they will return. On the other hand, once the users say, 'forget this,' there's no turning back. We can only recover our trust so far."


Sounds like they might be willing to really try to fix the game. But the CEO is right. They need to do it fast enough before everyone says "forget this". I'd just be happy to see simpler menus and an auction house. I spent 2 hours looking for a sheepskin subligar the other day...

Edited, Nov 5th 2010 9:09am by haydyn323
#4 Nov 05 2010 at 7:13 AM Rating: Good
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haydyn323 wrote:
Zorvan wrote:

Much of the decline was laid at the feet of MMO Final Fantasy XIV's disappointing performance. The PC game mustered global sales of 630,000 - although a PS3 version due in March may improve its fortunes.

"We're quickly working on reforms. We'd like to put our full power into regaining trust," CEO Yoichi Wada told investors.

"If we satisfy our users, they will return. On the other hand, once the users say, 'forget this,' there's no turning back. We can only recover our trust so far."


Sounds like they might be willing to really try to fix the game. But the CEO is right. They need to do it fast enough before everyone says "forget this". I'd just be happy to see simpler menus and an auction house. I spent 2 hours looking for a sheepskin subligar the other day...


The part that worries me is he says "We'd like to..." rather than "We will..." or "We are...".
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#5 Nov 05 2010 at 7:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Zorvan wrote:
The part that worries me is he says "We'd like to..." rather than "We will..." or "We are...".


While I agree with you, reading into the semantics of a Japanese to English translation can be very misleading. Besides, actions speak louder than words, so only time will tell how much they're willing to work to regain our trust.
#6 Nov 05 2010 at 8:00 AM Rating: Good
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It's never going to have a simpler menu structure as long as they insist on making this a PS3 game you can play on a PC rather than a PC game you can play on a PS3.
#7 Nov 05 2010 at 8:01 AM Rating: Decent
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It is a very difficulty situation they are in now. I wouldn't just blame FFXIV but many projects in the last few years.
Not even exactly the projects but the people behind it.

I am very interested in seeing what FFXIV will turn into in the near future and i am also interested in seeing if SE will change something in their company.
#8 Nov 05 2010 at 8:07 AM Rating: Decent
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You have to look at what else they released as publishers...

Front Mission: Evolved while not a horrible game, failed on 2 fronts. If it hadn't had Front Mission on the title or had SE written on the box, it would have been a C+ or B- title. It's fun, but ultimately it fails so bad for not using even decent voice acting, script writing, or even the tons of pre-existing lore from the FM series. Had it been some startup that released it, it could be excusable and make people look forward to future titles. However it isn't.

Then we have Supreme Commander 2. It's so handicapped and user friendly compared to the original that it might as well be a different game. It too suffers from crap plot and acting. While I enjoyed it about as much as I've enjoyed FM:E so far, it just doesn't feel like a title that Square would publish and brings my expectations of the brand down.

I personally didn't enjoy Just Cause 2, but some people have. So I'll only mention it as a not so succesful PC release.

They also released the Call of Duty games for PC in Japan, I'd assume the PC version of MW2 was reagarded even less than it was in the US.

As a whole, at least on PC, SE is publishing (and some would say making, even though they didn't develop any of the games I mentioned) subpar PC experiences. I don't know if the same holds true on console as I've only played FF titles and Nier on PS3, and I really enjoyed both.
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#9 Nov 05 2010 at 8:11 AM Rating: Decent
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PerrinofSylph wrote:
You have to look at what else they released as publishers...

Front Mission: Evolved while not a horrible game, failed on 2 fronts. If it hadn't had Front Mission on the title or had SE written on the box, it would have been a C+ or B- title. It's fun, but ultimately it fails so bad for not using even decent voice acting, script writing, or even the tons of pre-existing lore from the FM series. Had it been some startup that released it, it could be excusable and make people look forward to future titles. However it isn't.

Then we have Supreme Commander 2. It's so handicapped and user friendly compared to the original that it might as well be a different game. It too suffers from crap plot and acting. While I enjoyed it about as much as I've enjoyed FM:E so far, it just doesn't feel like a title that Square would publish and brings my expectations of the brand down.

I personally didn't enjoy Just Cause 2, but some people have. So I'll only mention it as a not so succesful PC release.

They also released the Call of Duty games for PC in Japan, I'd assume the PC version of MW2 was reagarded even less than it was in the US.

As a whole, at least on PC, SE is publishing (and some would say making, even though they didn't develop any of the games I mentioned) subpar PC experiences. I don't know if the same holds true on console as I've only played FF titles and Nier on PS3, and I really enjoyed both.


^ Yeah, it's silly to blame SE's tumble in earnings on a single game.
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#10 Nov 05 2010 at 8:17 AM Rating: Excellent
Wow. This explains the financial pressure to release the game early. Also makes me wonder if SE will throw together an AH by the end of the year in a drastic attempt to get back customers.
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#11 Nov 05 2010 at 8:22 AM Rating: Excellent
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I will assume it is the net profit that was dropped by 75% not gross income. If it is gross income that was dropped by 75%, then all that is missing is a tomb stone on the company's grave. As for blaming FF14, well...it is an easy target :P I hope this is a wake up call, not only to SE but to all JP game companies. They've been mostly stuck their collective head in the dirt still celebrating the glorious days of the late 1990s while the rest of the world pass them by.
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#12 Nov 05 2010 at 8:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Wonder how low their earnings would have been without box sales for 14.
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#13 Nov 05 2010 at 8:29 AM Rating: Good
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Thayos wrote:
Wow. This explains the financial pressure to release the game early. Also makes me wonder if SE will throw together an AH by the end of the year in a drastic attempt to get back customers.


I'm thinking they will have no choice but to change the game further and faster than they had originally planned. They probably felt all along that they had until the the PS3 release...but now they know the game may die before they have a chance. And this is all assuming the PS3 version will be ready in March 2011. Assuming they have put extra manpower and hours into fixing the core game issues...that may push back the PS3 release, if those changes also affect the PS3 timeline.

Hopefully, someday, we will hear the whole story as to why they released it too early. We more or less know why...but the exact details behind the poor decision would be interesting.
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#14 Nov 05 2010 at 8:29 AM Rating: Default
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Thayos wrote:
Wow. This explains the financial pressure to release the game early. Also makes me wonder if SE will throw together an AH by the end of the year in a drastic attempt to get back customers.


That's the one thing with MMOs, anything's possible... unlike them going back and fixing The Last Remnant which I so badly wanted to enjoy except for some extremely major errors with the game. I suppose at least PC didn't get as much of an unplayable copy as XBox did (from what I've read). I didn't get more than half way in the game, but I plan to return to it on my next deployment. Otherwise I just have way too many titles to play through while I'm at home that won't make me want to hurt people.... Though I suppose playing The Last Remnant with an M4 in your room might not be the best idea... Might have to scrub it off my laptop >.>
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#15 Nov 05 2010 at 8:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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MajidahSihaam wrote:
PerrinofSylph wrote:
You have to look at what else they released as publishers...

Front Mission: Evolved while not a horrible game, failed on 2 fronts. If it hadn't had Front Mission on the title or had SE written on the box, it would have been a C+ or B- title. It's fun, but ultimately it fails so bad for not using even decent voice acting, script writing, or even the tons of pre-existing lore from the FM series. Had it been some startup that released it, it could be excusable and make people look forward to future titles. However it isn't.

Then we have Supreme Commander 2. It's so handicapped and user friendly compared to the original that it might as well be a different game. It too suffers from crap plot and acting. While I enjoyed it about as much as I've enjoyed FM:E so far, it just doesn't feel like a title that Square would publish and brings my expectations of the brand down.

I personally didn't enjoy Just Cause 2, but some people have. So I'll only mention it as a not so succesful PC release.

They also released the Call of Duty games for PC in Japan, I'd assume the PC version of MW2 was reagarded even less than it was in the US.

As a whole, at least on PC, SE is publishing (and some would say making, even though they didn't develop any of the games I mentioned) subpar PC experiences. I don't know if the same holds true on console as I've only played FF titles and Nier on PS3, and I really enjoyed both.


^ Yeah, it's silly to blame SE's tumble in earnings on a single game.


Well, it's SE themselves that's blaming it, so I'm just taking their word for it.

Personally, I'm still ****** they turned Tomb Raider into a Diablo clone.

Edited, Nov 5th 2010 10:44am by Zorvan
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#16 Nov 05 2010 at 9:03 AM Rating: Excellent
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630k is a realy low number for a global sale. I thought it would be higher then that. It probably would have been higher had they not been slaughtered by every gaming site out there and rightfully so. They have a very short window to get certain game dynamic in place which i don't think they can. There is just so many issues they need to address that I'm not sure Nov and Dec patch can address these things. To give people an AH would mean abadoning the retainer/ward system which would mean re-writting core game design. Then there is the UI, chat, mail, adding content, the list goes on and on. They spent 5 years working on this and are now going to do a complete 180% in just a month. Good luck SE!

As for the PS3, it may save Japan market but NA market maybe to late by then.
#17 Nov 05 2010 at 9:08 AM Rating: Good
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doubleax wrote:
630k is a realy low number for a global sale. I thought it would be higher then that. It probably would have been higher had they not been slaughtered by every gaming site out there and rightfully so. They have a very short window to get certain game dynamic in place which i don't think they can. There is just so many issues they need to address that I'm not sure Nov and Dec patch can address these things. To give people an AH would mean abadoning the retainer/ward system which would mean re-writting core game design. Then there is the UI, chat, mail, adding content, the list goes on and on. They spent 5 years working on this and are now going to do a complete 180% in just a month. Good luck SE!

As for the PS3, it may save Japan market but NA market maybe to late by then.


The interesting part is the sales were higher in NA and EU than in Japan. ANd 630k is a low number for an anticipated "AAA" mmo. But then you have to think how many people canceled pre-orders or didn't buy the game at release because of what they seen in beta.

Edited, Nov 5th 2010 11:10am by Zorvan
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#18 Nov 05 2010 at 10:06 AM Rating: Decent
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I have mixed feelings about all of this. It's not exactly a surprise. It wasn't a surprise yesterday when I first read about Wada's comments. It's not like he was going to be able to get away with standing in front of investors and tell them everything was fine ad proceeding according to plan. It's helpful to see that he understands the scope of the situation and isn't dismissive of the feedback SE has received. We'll still get people posting here about how SE doesn't listen and SE doesn't care and blah blah blah and they'll be wrong like they always have been and even pointing to Wada's comments won't appease them because you can cure ignorance but you can't cure stupid.

Ironically, my concern is that if they push too hard to change to much, they run the risk of breaking the game. You can only push so much updated content without extensive testing beforehand, and from what I've been reading, people don't eve have the patience to wait through the initial development of the fixes, much less any kind of testing to make sure everything works as intended and is stable.

Less than month before one of the deadlines for a big patch that's supposed to correct several issues with the game. Here's to hoping it goes smoothly whether it's enough to appease me or not.
#19 Nov 05 2010 at 10:28 AM Rating: Decent
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Zorvan wrote:
doubleax wrote:
630k is a realy low number for a global sale. I thought it would be higher then that. It probably would have been higher had they not been slaughtered by every gaming site out there and rightfully so. They have a very short window to get certain game dynamic in place which i don't think they can. There is just so many issues they need to address that I'm not sure Nov and Dec patch can address these things. To give people an AH would mean abadoning the retainer/ward system which would mean re-writting core game design. Then there is the UI, chat, mail, adding content, the list goes on and on. They spent 5 years working on this and are now going to do a complete 180% in just a month. Good luck SE!

As for the PS3, it may save Japan market but NA market maybe to late by then.


The interesting part is the sales were higher in NA and EU than in Japan. ANd 630k is a low number for an anticipated "AAA" mmo. But then you have to think how many people canceled pre-orders or didn't buy the game at release because of what they seen in beta.

Edited, Nov 5th 2010 11:10am by Zorvan


Basing what you see in beta is a poor excuse for not buying a game.

Anything could of happened on release that beta members wouldn't have known about or had access to knowing about that could of been deemed worthy patch on release, seen it happen on many MMO's before.
#20 Nov 05 2010 at 10:28 AM Rating: Good
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Aurelius wrote:
I have mixed feelings about all of this. It's not exactly a surprise. It wasn't a surprise yesterday when I first read about Wada's comments. It's not like he was going to be able to get away with standing in front of investors and tell them everything was fine ad proceeding according to plan. It's helpful to see that he understands the scope of the situation and isn't dismissive of the feedback SE has received. We'll still get people posting here about how SE doesn't listen and SE doesn't care and blah blah blah and they'll be wrong like they always have been and even pointing to Wada's comments won't appease them because you can cure ignorance but you can't cure stupid.

Ironically, my concern is that if they push too hard to change to much, they run the risk of breaking the game. You can only push so much updated content without extensive testing beforehand, and from what I've been reading, people don't eve have the patience to wait through the initial development of the fixes, much less any kind of testing to make sure everything works as intended and is stable.

Less than month before one of the deadlines for a big patch that's supposed to correct several issues with the game. Here's to hoping it goes smoothly whether it's enough to appease me or not.


This is what bugs me with SE...it takes investors to get a statement from them. IMO a statement like this should have been made the week after Standard Edition release. To me this shows that SE does listen, to money. and they do care, about money. This was a statement made to investors, not to the paying and playing customers which it should have been addressed to.
#21 Nov 05 2010 at 10:30 AM Rating: Good
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burtonsnow wrote:

This is what bugs me with SE...it takes investors to get a statement from them. IMO a statement like this should have been made the week after Standard Edition release. To me this shows that SE does listen, to money. and they do care, about money. This was a statement made to investors, not to the paying and playing customers which it should have been addressed to.


Komoto's statement about what they had planned for the November/December patches (including his apology) didn't count with you?

#22 Nov 05 2010 at 10:41 AM Rating: Excellent
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Taemek wrote:
Zorvan wrote:
doubleax wrote:
630k is a realy low number for a global sale. I thought it would be higher then that. It probably would have been higher had they not been slaughtered by every gaming site out there and rightfully so. They have a very short window to get certain game dynamic in place which i don't think they can. There is just so many issues they need to address that I'm not sure Nov and Dec patch can address these things. To give people an AH would mean abadoning the retainer/ward system which would mean re-writting core game design. Then there is the UI, chat, mail, adding content, the list goes on and on. They spent 5 years working on this and are now going to do a complete 180% in just a month. Good luck SE!

As for the PS3, it may save Japan market but NA market maybe to late by then.


The interesting part is the sales were higher in NA and EU than in Japan. ANd 630k is a low number for an anticipated "AAA" mmo. But then you have to think how many people canceled pre-orders or didn't buy the game at release because of what they seen in beta.

Edited, Nov 5th 2010 11:10am by Zorvan


Basing what you see in beta is a poor excuse for not buying a game.

Anything could of happened on release that beta members wouldn't have known about or had access to knowing about that could of been deemed worthy patch on release, seen it happen on many MMO's before.


i dunno it seems reasonable. If you don't like beta, cancel your pre-order and see if reviews say anythings changed.

I was someone during beta who hated the game, told myself that couldn't be it, there'd be tons more stuff in release. Nope, a week after buying the game, I couldn't tell the difference.
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#23 Nov 05 2010 at 10:44 AM Rating: Excellent
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Aurelius wrote:

Komoto's statement about what they had planned for the November/December patches (including his apology) didn't count with you?



I'm re-reading his statements now, I just hear plans, no formal apology although I could be missing it while skimming. So although there is no formal apology I will give it to you, they have given us a free extension which can be taken as one.
#24 Nov 05 2010 at 10:48 AM Rating: Decent
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burtonsnow wrote:
This is what bugs me with SE...it takes investors to get a statement from them. IMO a statement like this should have been made the week after Standard Edition release. To me this shows that SE does listen, to money. and they do care, about money. This was a statement made to investors, not to the paying and playing customers which it should have been addressed to.


Any for-profit company who makes you think they don't only care about the money is very good at deceiving you. Of course SE only cares about money, why are you surprised? They don't make video games for the feel-good feeling of putting smiles on our faces. And of course it was a statement to investors, they need investors right now just as much as players. And they've already given their statement to us players via the announcement on the Lodestone several weeks ago. How many times exactly do you want SE to apologize and say they're going to try to fix it until you're happy? Honestly I don't think some people will be happy until this game goes offline no matter how well SE fixes it.
#25 Nov 05 2010 at 10:56 AM Rating: Default
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How is this FFXIV's fault?

600,000 is quite a healthy number of sales for an MMO released for just 2 months.
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#26 Nov 05 2010 at 10:58 AM Rating: Decent
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ditx wrote:
How is this FFXIV's fault?

600,000 is quite a healthy number of sales for an MMO released for just 2 months.



I believe the number was actually 630,000 units shipped, not sold.
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#27 Nov 05 2010 at 11:00 AM Rating: Excellent
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robywar wrote:
It's never going to have a simpler menu structure as long as they insist on making this a PS3 game you can play on a PC rather than a PC game you can play on a PS3.


Well even FFXI's menus -- a PS2 game ported to the PC -- would be a huge improvement!
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#28 Nov 05 2010 at 11:03 AM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
ditx wrote:
How is this FFXIV's fault?

600,000 is quite a healthy number of sales for an MMO released for just 2 months.



I believe the number was actually 630,000 units shipped, not sold.


Units shipped =/= Units sold

You are correct : )
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#29 Nov 05 2010 at 11:04 AM Rating: Decent
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they need to keep extending that trial period till its a satisfactory game, like maybe when the ps3 version is released. this way we can help them procure the buggs. unlike there short beta sessions. sad thing is im starting to forget about this game already, i ws craving a good mmo and this one just is so bad im afraid i cant return, im waiting to see if the updates coming this year are going make it any better, if not....probably going to give wow a try since ive yet to try it.
#30 Nov 05 2010 at 12:01 PM Rating: Default
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KujaKoF wrote:

i dunno it seems reasonable. If you don't like beta, cancel your pre-order and see if reviews say anythings changed.

I was someone during beta who hated the game, told myself that couldn't be it, there'd be tons more stuff in release. Nope, a week after buying the game, I couldn't tell the difference.


Never base your decision to buy a game of a review. Well, I never do.

I do extensive research about the title using its home website, if any, if not read the back of the box, sound interesting? Give it a shot. Don't like it? In the drawer it goes with the other flops, which like a review, is based off your opinion. 8- )
#31 Nov 05 2010 at 12:30 PM Rating: Good
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http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/quote?ticker=9684:JP
Anything of note released at the end of sept other than ff14?

Pretty sure looks like they could have used that first month of ff14 subscriptions, had things gone swimmingly. Of course they can keep their heads in the sand and carry on but players seem to be much less tolerant of poopy game design decisions.

Or they can start making some real changes and make the player base (and reviewers) happy.
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#32 Nov 05 2010 at 12:47 PM Rating: Excellent
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Aurelius wrote:
I have mixed feelings about all of this. It's not exactly a surprise. It wasn't a surprise yesterday when I first read about Wada's comments. It's not like he was going to be able to get away with standing in front of investors and tell them everything was fine ad proceeding according to plan. It's helpful to see that he understands the scope of the situation and isn't dismissive of the feedback SE has received. We'll still get people posting here about how SE doesn't listen and SE doesn't care and blah blah blah and they'll be wrong like they always have been and even pointing to Wada's comments won't appease them because you can cure ignorance but you can't cure stupid.

Ironically, my concern is that if they push too hard to change to much, they run the risk of breaking the game. You can only push so much updated content without extensive testing beforehand, and from what I've been reading, people don't eve have the patience to wait through the initial development of the fixes, much less any kind of testing to make sure everything works as intended and is stable.

Less than month before one of the deadlines for a big patch that's supposed to correct several issues with the game. Here's to hoping it goes smoothly whether it's enough to appease me or not.



It was tested and tested and tried and tried, they showed no real listening power at that time and passed up the pressing problems just to make little fixes in my books. The beta and this play the same. They had time to fix, now we have paid and will react to the time spent testing that didnt add a whole lot of large fixes.
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#33 Nov 05 2010 at 1:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Taemek wrote:
Zorvan wrote:
The interesting part is the sales were higher in NA and EU than in Japan. ANd 630k is a low number for an anticipated "AAA" mmo. But then you have to think how many people canceled pre-orders or didn't buy the game at release because of what they seen in beta.
Basing what you see in beta is a poor excuse for not buying a game.

Anything could of happened on release that beta members wouldn't have known about or had access to knowing about that could of been deemed worthy patch on release, seen it happen on many MMO's before.
Turned out to be a good idea for this game, though.
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#34 Nov 05 2010 at 2:56 PM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Basing what you see in beta is a poor excuse for not buying a game.


I agree with Bsphil - in this instance we were right on the mark. Maybe it had something to do with the fact that beta ended days before the CE shipped (which means that the final version was already printed and in warehouses soon after beta was closed), but this game in its beta form is what we got in retail.

Quote:
Of course SE only cares about money, why are you surprised? They don't make video games for the feel-good feeling of putting smiles on our faces.


They used to.

There is always the almighty dollar - but all of these gaming companies started out as guys in basements writing programs for the love of the technology and a vision for the future of entertainment.

Here's a link to the wiki page about the founder of Square -

Masafumi Miyamoto

One thing stands out to me -
Quote:
His philosophy with regard to developing video games was to hire a team of people fully dedicated to develop only one game
.

It seems that somewhere the vision was lost, and the company is just going in too many different directions now. They developed this mmo with the same team that developed FFXI while FFXI was still running, then they moved that team to the new game and put someone else on the old game, meanwhile they are shipping separate FF titles and a slew of other little things....

Instead of making one thing perfect, they are making many things flawed. This is what happens when companies get too big and lose focus. If they would keep the team focused on one project at a time, we'd see better quality. Sadly, they lost the vision and we pay the price.
#35 Nov 05 2010 at 3:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Torrence wrote:
It seems that somewhere the vision was lost, and the company is just going in too many different directions now. They developed this mmo with the same team that developed FFXI while FFXI was still running, then they moved that team to the new game and put someone else on the old game, meanwhile they are shipping separate FF titles and a slew of other little things....

Instead of making one thing perfect, they are making many things flawed. This is what happens when companies get too big and lose focus. If they would keep the team focused on one project at a time, we'd see better quality. Sadly, they lost the vision and we pay the price.


The whole industry seems to be going through similar growing pains.

What used to be the pursuit of self-motivated individuals and small teams is now dominated by the corporate machine. MMORPG's are released woefully incomplete due to corporate intervention. Mega-companies like Activision and EA are gobbling up promising franchises. Gamestop owns the rights to exclusive preorders on just about every game that comes out nowadays, all of which are gimmicky, throw-in additions. Games, like blockbuster movies, aren't deemed financially successful unless they can be tapped for greater revenue, here in the form of DLC and sequels. Look at the guitar games, and how quickly their market was oversaturated. Look what they're doing with Call of Duty.

I don't think the big developers, SE included, can help themselves anymore. It's a particular problem for the Japanese developers, for some reason. I think that they're caught in a self-perpetuating cycle that will ultimately be their own undoing. They grew complacent with a passive audience, that until recently contented itself with the same-old thing. They're becoming too bloated...too slow to adapt to an industry that's still rapidly changing. The old methodologies don't cut it anymore, and instead of rising to the occasion, they've kept themselves afloat with cash-grabs. But that just results in stagnation.

I think things will change for the better, one way or the other. The rise of indy gaming is promising, and a clear reaction against the industry's new issues. I just wonder if companies like SE will survive it all intact. To me, they seem like dinosaurs, with extinction looming on the horizon.

You know what I've gotten the most mileage out of lately? Virtual NES. Go figure.


EDIT: What a rant! That was almost therapeutic. Smiley: tongue


Edited, Nov 5th 2010 5:24pm by Eske
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#36 Nov 05 2010 at 4:05 PM Rating: Good
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That's actually pretty scary. I just hope Final Fantasy XIV isn't the FINAL Final Fantasy. They've released some top-quality games over the years. It'd be criminal for them to go under over one MMO.
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#37 Nov 05 2010 at 4:12 PM Rating: Decent
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I dont think this is a big deal. FFXIV only came out at the very end of that time period, so the majority of money earned from their hard*coughcoughpuke*work will be from december onwards or maybe even as late as march, when subscriptions are paid for and the console launch arrives. This is a game that will continue to bring in money for them for years so their investment will pay off, just not yet.
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#38 Nov 05 2010 at 4:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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I think SE with FFXIV has lent credence to Capcom's Keiji Inafune's statement that Japanese game development is 5 years behind the rest of the world.
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#39 Nov 05 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Good
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Zorvan wrote:
I think SE with FFXIV has lent credence to Capcom's Keiji Inafune's statement that Japanese game development is 5 years behind the rest of the world.


FFXIV is more like 15 years behind the rest of the world.

It's behind FFXI even.
#40 Nov 05 2010 at 5:33 PM Rating: Default
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TheRealLusent wrote:

It was tested and tested and tried and tried, they showed no real listening power at that time and passed up the pressing problems just to make little fixes in my books. The beta and this play the same. They had time to fix, now we have paid and will react to the time spent testing that didnt add a whole lot of large fixes.


I don't really care what did or didn't happen in the beta at this point because it's done. It did or didn't happen. Now we've got what we've got and going forward (aka: the opposite of backwards) I'd rather not see them push a bunch of changes that result in weeks/months of heavy instability because they're trying too hard to revamp the game on the deadline that should have been set for release, not fixes.
#41 Nov 05 2010 at 7:35 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
The PC game mustered global sales of 630,000 - although a PS3 version due in March may improve its fortunes


This is sad global numbers considering they releases a beta and we all bought it...WHAT makes them think their PS3 numbers will get better???
#42 Nov 05 2010 at 7:55 PM Rating: Excellent
Personally I see this as a good thing with respect to FFXIV. Nothing a company listens to like money, and that's a lot of money. They should be pulling all the stops to make things right for this game, and that makes me happy. I want this game to end up good!
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#43 Nov 05 2010 at 8:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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Taemek wrote:

Never base your decision to buy a game of a review. Well, I never do.

I do extensive research about the title using its home website, if any, if not read the back of the box, sound interesting? Give it a shot. Don't like it? In the drawer it goes with the other flops, which like a review, is based off your opinion. 8- )



1. when the beta ends a week or two before the game goes live, the beta is the live game. i can't believe people are still arguing against this for this game.

2. you must be very frivolous with your money if you drop 50-60 bucks on a game based solely on the back of the box...
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#44 Nov 05 2010 at 8:05 PM Rating: Excellent
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This is sad global numbers considering they releases a beta and we all bought it...WHAT makes them think their PS3 numbers will get better???


March is still a long ways away. We know what SE has told us they plan to do by the end of the year, but we don't know what will actually happen. For all we know, these fixes may never materialize, and the game may bottom out. Or, SE may go above and beyond with these version updates, and players may flock back to the game in droves.

This is why I remain optimistic. If SE wasn't listening to us during the beta testing, then we certainly have their attention now. I wouldn't be surprised to see SE go all out for its players during the next couple of months. And if that happens, then I think the PS3 numbers will be quite good.
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#45 Nov 05 2010 at 8:05 PM Rating: Good
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digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally I see this as a good thing with respect to FFXIV. Nothing a company listens to like money, and that's a lot of money. They should be pulling all the stops to make things right for this game, and that makes me happy. I want this game to end up good!


Exactly. I don't think people realize that if FFXIV fails SE loses money. Obviously SE doesn't want FFXIV to fail but I keep seeing people here claim some ridiculous conspiracy theory that SE is secretly hoping FFXIV fails, or SE is being lazy about nonchalant about fixing FFXIV. As if SE wants to make less money, that makes so much sense. /sarcasm
#46 Nov 05 2010 at 8:13 PM Rating: Good
Hydragyrum wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally I see this as a good thing with respect to FFXIV. Nothing a company listens to like money, and that's a lot of money. They should be pulling all the stops to make things right for this game, and that makes me happy. I want this game to end up good!


Exactly. I don't think people realize that if FFXIV fails SE loses money. Obviously SE doesn't want FFXIV to fail but I keep seeing people here claim some ridiculous conspiracy theory that SE is secretly hoping FFXIV fails, or SE is being lazy about nonchalant about fixing FFXIV. As if SE wants to make less money, that makes so much sense. /sarcasm


The thing I worry about is if the team itself working on FFXI is basically incompetent they will 'fix' things, but what they think is 'fix' other people do not, i.e. the current game compared to what people want in an MMO.

So that leaves lots of room for failure still.

They might move a few people around and things will go well, or actually look at what people want, and things might go well, or maybe they won't at all, they'll do some weird thing nobody asked for and the came will crash.

So I still have a little pensiveness, but at least I know the incentive to make a game that the fans like is there, I just worry if they actually know what that means.
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#47 Nov 05 2010 at 8:36 PM Rating: Excellent
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The patch date, like the release date, seems like it was a management decision where they pulled it out of our *** to quiet the mob with little impute from the dev team. It is also pretty frightening that they are going to reverse engineer some major game mechanic in such a short time while also finishing up the PS3 coding. This leaves very little room for error with such a short window for a thorough testing of the new codes. Don’t think it can’t get worst cause it can and it usually happens from poor code testing

The best thing for them to do is let people play free (test) till March. It’s a tough spot they are in but it is a position they created themselves.
#48 Nov 05 2010 at 8:51 PM Rating: Good
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Hydragyrum wrote:
digitalcraft, Goblin in Disguise wrote:
Personally I see this as a good thing with respect to FFXIV. Nothing a company listens to like money, and that's a lot of money. They should be pulling all the stops to make things right for this game, and that makes me happy. I want this game to end up good!


Exactly. I don't think people realize that if FFXIV fails SE loses money. Obviously SE doesn't want FFXIV to fail but I keep seeing people here claim some ridiculous conspiracy theory that SE is secretly hoping FFXIV fails, or SE is being lazy about nonchalant about fixing FFXIV. As if SE wants to make less money, that makes so much sense. /sarcasm


FFXIV already cost them a 75% drop in profit. How much more can it cost them if they killed it now compared to if they try to keep it afloat while continuing their current way of doing things? At least if they kill it now, it's a write off and they can recoup a bit through other upcoming game releases.

(And no, I'm not saying they should kill it, although I'd definitely understand if they did.)
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#49 Nov 05 2010 at 8:56 PM Rating: Good
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Taemek wrote:


Basing what you see in beta is a poor excuse for not buying a game.

Anything could of happened on release that beta members wouldn't have known about or had access to knowing about that could of been deemed worthy patch on release, seen it happen on many MMO's before.


Many MMOs eh? I've been in half a dozen MMO betas and I've never seen it happen. Can you name one of these many MMOs?
#50 Nov 05 2010 at 9:10 PM Rating: Good
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How much more of a hit do you think SE would have taken in sales if they didn't offer the Open Beta for FF14? I really didn't do any net-searching for folks sneaking out info during the closed Beta, but armed with the knowledge from the Open Beta many decided to cancel their pre-orders. Do you think the complaints would be louder and more cancelled user accounts than we are currently seeing?
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#51 Nov 05 2010 at 9:15 PM Rating: Excellent
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Zorvan wrote:

FFXIV already cost them a 75% drop in profit. How much more can it cost them if they killed it now compared to if they try to keep it afloat while continuing their current way of doing things? At least if they kill it now, it's a write off and they can recoup a bit through other upcoming game releases.


The drop in profits is not year over year, and it doesn't include the period of time where FF14 was actually released. Not to mention that generally speaking, profits are always higher in the second half of the year than the first half, usually by a wide margin. Some thing about the holidays or some thing. It's all a bit fuzzy to me.

There's absolutely no correlation between S-Es first half profits and the viability of FF14 going forward. Frankly it's not even worth discussing whether they would cancel the game until the PS-3 version has been released for several months at least.
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