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#52 Nov 25 2010 at 11:43 PM Rating: Default
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Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.
#53 Nov 25 2010 at 11:49 PM Rating: Default
Sethern79 wrote:
Technolust wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Technolust wrote:

The game is less then 3 months old...lmao it's not going to have tons of content right away.


Why not? WoW shiped with tons of content. CoH shiped with tons of content. LoRO EQ2 L2 D&D online all shiped with tons of content. most mmo's fail becuse of bugs not lack of content. They fail becuse of bugs.

I am going to give FFXIV another chance when I get home. But I have a feeling its the same game. Bug/bad ui I can live with. No real story to an RPG world I can't!



Did you actually play any of those games when they launched? Because they didn't have much for content when they launched.

I think people just like to complain because it gets them attention.


Really? WoW did not ship with tons of content? Are you sure on this? Can you back this up? Becuse I know you can't. WoW Shiped with thousands of quest. dungens for just about every 10 lvls. and Raids! all of witch also had there own quest lines. EQ2 Shiped with a veary large amount of quest and story arcs. COH D&D L2 LoRO the same maby not as many as WoW but still tuns of content.

Did you play any of the games on that list? or are you just stating what you think to be true to defend FFXIV?

Edited, Nov 25th 2010 10:06pm by Sethern79


I remember WoW back in the day, you are right WoW did have a lot of quests, but how many of them were really story driven quests? Most WoW quests back in the day were mostly; Kill X mob for Y part, etc... WoW also had a pretty bad launch, took them sometime to fix the problems to the classes.

All-in-all, WoW may of had more quests, but a good handful were the same quest, just dressed differently. Before you say, yes WoW had dungeons, but FFXIV is not that type of MMO. I really think WoW has clouded most gamers eyes, it took WoW years to get to the point were it is now.

How many quests in vanilla WoW had text worth reading, short for mob type or general location.
#54 Nov 25 2010 at 11:58 PM Rating: Decent
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HonestlyPlease wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Technolust wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Technolust wrote:

The game is less then 3 months old...lmao it's not going to have tons of content right away.


Why not? WoW shiped with tons of content. CoH shiped with tons of content. LoRO EQ2 L2 D&D online all shiped with tons of content. most mmo's fail becuse of bugs not lack of content. They fail becuse of bugs.

I am going to give FFXIV another chance when I get home. But I have a feeling its the same game. Bug/bad ui I can live with. No real story to an RPG world I can't!



Did you actually play any of those games when they launched? Because they didn't have much for content when they launched.

I think people just like to complain because it gets them attention.


Really? WoW did not ship with tons of content? Are you sure on this? Can you back this up? Becuse I know you can't. WoW Shiped with thousands of quest. dungens for just about every 10 lvls. and Raids! all of witch also had there own quest lines. EQ2 Shiped with a veary large amount of quest and story arcs. COH D&D L2 LoRO the same maby not as many as WoW but still tuns of content.

Did you play any of the games on that list? or are you just stating what you think to be true to defend FFXIV?

Edited, Nov 25th 2010 10:06pm by Sethern79


I remember WoW back in the day, you are right WoW did have a lot of quests, but how many of them were really story driven quests? Most WoW quests back in the day were mostly; Kill X mob for Y part, etc... WoW also had a pretty bad launch, took them sometime to fix the problems to the classes.

All-in-all, WoW may of had more quests, but a good handful were the same quest, just dressed differently. Before you say, yes WoW had dungeons, but FFXIV is not that type of MMO. I really think WoW has clouded most gamers eyes, it took WoW years to get to the point were it is now.

How many quests in vanilla WoW had text worth reading, short for mob type or general location.

I loved most of the Story offed in the quest. The raptor line alone in barens was prity **** good. You see the quest really do not need to all drive the games story forword. A good bit of them could be a simple story about the raptors jumping some guys wife. He then sends you out to kill said raptors becuse he is mad! This gives you a reason, a story behind why your out there grinding. Quest like this help to flesh out the world you are playing in. They make you feel a part of it.

That I feel is what FFXIV is missing. The flesh. The lil side storys that bring the world alive. That make you feel liuke you are a part of that world. WoW did this veary well.
#55 Nov 26 2010 at 12:01 AM Rating: Decent
3 posts
Wow had epic quests at launch,


Everytime i play in the first day of a new mmorpg,someone always spams "LFG HOGGER" jokes.

WoW quests had nice stories,,next time try to read the quest log.

The dead guard in eastvale loggin camp,those dam goblins!

Princes must die,the *** pig!

And what about the quest with the invisible potion for Maybell,she really loved Tommy Joe :(


Seriously,wow quest are better than any campaign quest of ffxiv (fedex + 45 boring cutscenes with no voice acting).

#56 Nov 26 2010 at 12:02 AM Rating: Decent
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821 posts
Sethern79 wrote:
Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.


Well...it has done something right...marketing. Just think of CoD Black Ops? Everyone who played most of the CoD games confirmed...Black Ops is not better then MW2, nor is MW2 better then MW1...still MW2 sold better then MW1 and Black Ops seems to reach more sold units then MW2 does...its just "publicity" used in the right way. Back in the day strategy games were among the top genres on PC...imagine the fanbase Warcraft had when WoW launched. It simply became the MMORPG with the biggest fanbase due to the Warcraft franchise. And it went on from there.

But simple fact, you are right about the lore and quest thing. FFXIV easily could pile up a ******** of quests getting you more involved nito the world of Eorzea and Hydealen...in fact the lore is there...there is so much you could read about the lore, BEFORE FFXIV was released, that I myself already know more about the world, then the content is showing right now. Just think of Ala Mihgo and the Garlean Empire...this whole thing is not even nearly scratched in the game so far. Not to mention, when you check up the map of Eorzea...there are 3 areas west of Coerthas and North and North east of Mor Dhona with the size of Black Shroud, Thanalan and La Noscea...what are these places? Nothing is mentioned about them...sure there are not available now...but at least let some NPCs say anything about it. Then ala Mihgo itself...at some point we will be able to reach that place in person. Ishgard is not openend up yet. Then the other city that is shown on the map to the far west...we don't even know what this city is like right now. Then the whole thing about the twelve, the beastmen tribe etc etc etc.....there is so much I would think of that I could tell, that I just don't get it why SE is not using this possibilities at all. It doesn't have to be there from Rank 1-50...but seriously at least some story basic quests from Rank 1-20 would have been doable(aside from the Main Story Quest)
#57 Nov 26 2010 at 12:10 AM Rating: Decent
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283 posts
Shezard wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.


Well...it has done something right...marketing. Just think of CoD Black Ops? Everyone who played most of the CoD games confirmed...Black Ops is not better then MW2, nor is MW2 better then MW1...still MW2 sold better then MW1 and Black Ops seems to reach more sold units then MW2 does...its just "publicity" used in the right way. Back in the day strategy games were among the top genres on PC...imagine the fanbase Warcraft had when WoW launched. It simply became the MMORPG with the biggest fanbase due to the Warcraft franchise. And it went on from there.

But simple fact, you are right about the lore and quest thing. FFXIV easily could pile up a sh*tload of quests getting you more involved nito the world of Eorzea and Hydealen...in fact the lore is there...there is so much you could read about the lore, BEFORE FFXIV was released, that I myself already know more about the world, then the content is showing right now. Just think of Ala Mihgo and the Garlean Empire...this whole thing is not even nearly scratched in the game so far. Not to mention, when you check up the map of Eorzea...there are 3 areas west of Coerthas and North and North east of Mor Dhona with the size of Black Shroud, Thanalan and La Noscea...what are these places? Nothing is mentioned about them...sure there are not available now...but at least let some NPCs say anything about it. Then ala Mihgo itself...at some point we will be able to reach that place in person. Ishgard is not openend up yet. Then the other city that is shown on the map to the far west...we don't even know what this city is like right now. Then the whole thing about the twelve, the beastmen tribe etc etc etc.....there is so much I would think of that I could tell, that I just don't get it why SE is not using this possibilities at all. It doesn't have to be there from Rank 1-50...but seriously at least some story basic quests from Rank 1-20 would have been doable(aside from the Main Story Quest)


OMG I know. All the reading I did of the lore before the game came out is probly one of the reasons I got so disapointed! I was so excited for all the side quest that would tell at the veary least that story! Or hint at where it all was going. But what I got was just small snipets of the lore I already knew and nothing that showed it in more depth.

It is probly more my fault than anything that this game has let me down as bad as it has. And don't get me wrong. This is a game I will keep my eyes on for some time. I want to see it all unfold and I want to see it become a good game. But I also like to state my opinion on the game. I am sorry that its not what others want to hear but I still feel the needt to talk about it.
#58 Nov 26 2010 at 12:15 AM Rating: Excellent
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349 posts
Sethern79 wrote:
Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.


I do agree with most of the post here, but I am gonna reply with my opinion on this:

I always been a fan to the whole Warcraft lore. Even though some stuff just comes out of nowhere, I do feel like Blizzard have really put efforts on making players to be part of something they build over almost 2 decades. I am a big fan of BC myself, as I was a enjoying WC II : BtDP back when I was a teenager. Overall, Blizzard worked with a base of 3-4 games' lores before doing WoW.

SE had good inspiration from most of their offlines RPGs. But nonetheless, there was no lore to be based on, except cameos of the franchise characters and stuff.

That's where the different lies in lore-depth. WoW uses a 3-4 games/expansions worth of Lore and is able to base content from it while SE builds another World from scratch.

I mean, everyone here could discuss and share opinions about which wins: LOTS of small parts of Lore or distanced big part of storyline ? Both are good in my opinion. Like I said before, it's apples and oranges again.

Like you said, there's a reason why WoW is #1 on the market, but I don't think it's about the lore or the history. I could say that I have a lot of friends that played and couldn't tell me most of the history behind some of the dungeons/raids or about some of the bosses stories, but I could answer some people also cared.

I am not interested about the #1 reasons, actually. My best MMO moments were with CoP back in FF XI and when I played in Outland in WoW. I think that's what it is more important. People just need to stop ******** about who got what better than the other and realize that you won't necesserly get the same things or feelings. Fanboism, on both side, is just childish attitude and put oil in the fire of absurdity.

Don't forget, it's all about apples and oranges. It is, was and will always be what rules about how the world works. Live with it.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 1:17am by MisterRandy
#59 Nov 26 2010 at 12:32 AM Rating: Decent
Scholar
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283 posts
MisterRandy wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.


I do agree with most of the post here, but I am gonna reply with my opinion on this:

I always been a fan to the whole Warcraft lore. Even though some stuff just comes out of nowhere, I do feel like Blizzard have really put efforts on making players to be part of something they build over almost 2 decades. I am a big fan of BC myself, as I was a enjoying WC II : BtDP back when I was a teenager. Overall, Blizzard worked with a base of 3-4 games' lores before doing WoW.

SE had good inspiration from most of their offlines RPGs. But nonetheless, there was no lore to be based on, except cameos of the franchise characters and stuff.

That's where the different lies in lore-depth. WoW uses a 3-4 games/expansions worth of Lore and is able to base content from it while SE builds another World from scratch.

I mean, everyone here could discuss and share opinions about which wins: LOTS of small parts of Lore or distanced big part of storyline ? Both are good in my opinion. Like I said before, it's apples and oranges again.

Like you said, there's a reason why WoW is #1 on the market, but I don't think it's about the lore or the history. I could say that I have a lot of friends that played and couldn't tell me most of the history behind some of the dungeons/raids or about some of the bosses stories, but I could answer some people also cared.

I am not interested about the #1 reasons, actually. My best MMO moments were with CoP back in FF XI and when I played in Outland in WoW. I think that's what it is more important. People just need to stop ******** about who got what better than the other and realize that you won't necesserly get the same things or feelings. Fanboism, on both side, is just childish attitude and put oil in the fire of absurdity.

Don't forget, it's all about apples and oranges. It is, was and will always be what rules about how the world works. Live with it.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 1:17am by MisterRandy

I use WoW becuse for me it was the game that got it right! I know the are difrent games. I just wish SE would have stoped and taken a page out of Blizzards/SoE and to a lesser extent cryptics Play books. No matter what people think SE is not reinventing the MMO here. there is nothing wrong with taking what other games did right and building off that.

SE is veary good when it comes to making new lore from scratch. Look at FFVII/IX. To me 2 of the best FF games made. The storys they made with them games still to this day I think about. Setheroth killing Aries to this day ****** me off. I remeber standing in frunt of my TV shouting profanity at Setheroth during the final fight. No other bad guy in the history of games invoked so much emotion in me. Look at vagrent story! The family death seen is burnt into my mind! SE is great when it comes to lore. I just feel they droped the ball this time. And really the lore is there to me it is just not presented in the game.
#60 Nov 26 2010 at 12:46 AM Rating: Excellent
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4,146 posts
The problem with the 'content' in this game is that it isn't really accessible to everyone. Sure there are quests that open up if you level all your classes and crafts, but people don't want to be forced to do that. Also, for as much work as you have to put in, it's still not enough. There should be more general quests available in the game. Things that challenge you from the very beginning up through the rank caps. This is the content that everyone speaks about that is missing.

I'm not comparing FFXIV to FFXI in terms of content available, but you have to consider how the quests that are available make the game more immersive. Consider things like missions that had level caps. Consider things like eco-warrior or the candle making quest; garrisons... **** like this was epic low level content and sadly it's missing from XIV. This is why people are bored within an hour of logging in.
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Its personal preference and all, but yes we need to educate WoW players that this is OUR game, these are Characters and not Toons. Time to beat that into them one at a time.
#61 Nov 26 2010 at 1:05 AM Rating: Good
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Sethern79 wrote:
MisterRandy wrote:
Sethern79 wrote:
Shezard wrote:
Well...I'm not here to defend FFXIV at all...but seriously, stop using WoW as a "shiny" knight who made everything right. The game launched with a sh*tload of quests...who were all completely soulless! I could count on one hand of quests who were actually telling you something worthwhile listening to. The list of Ungoro Quests you posted...half of them is "kill 10 of these, bring me 5 of those"...WoW did a massively terrible job when "bringing lore to the player"...and ffs they still do. WotLK introduced pretty much the first real story driven quests in the history of WoW...and that took them 5 years...not to mention that still 3/4 of all quests are "kill x of these, bring me Y of those"...the game had a sh*tload of bugs too btw...

2nd 2 whole raids from day one? Are you just ignoring the past? Molten Core and Onyxias Lair were just unplayable at launch...hence it took months for Blizzard to patch everything that it was at least playable to a degree where ppl were not quitting raids after a few mins. Molten Core was a no go until Decursive was made.
Not to mention Molten Core and Onys Lair were the only raids for almost a year...

Class balance of WoW was horrible and it stayed horrible until BC came out. Most talent trees were just completely useless in vanilla WoW...each class had like one spec to go...all other specs were inferior by a ton.

So...all I'm trying to say is...FFXIV launched terribly...nobody can't deny that...but ffs WoW was not doing better in any way, so stop bringin it up as the "positive" example.

edit: And what everyones seems to forget as well is...WoW is based on a world and lore that was created and build up for several years before WoW launched. They had a ton of lorewise things to add and the worls was pretty much completed before they even started developing WoW...so "content" is not that hard to implement, when you have an existing world right from the start...FFXIV is based of nothing, it started from scratch and everything that is build in, needs to be build first at all...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 5:33am by Shezard

It must have done something good. it is still the #1 mmo on the market and will be for some time to come. And here is the thing about them "soulless quest" They gave you a reason to be out there killing all the mobs you had to kill to lvl. They took the sting out of the grind! Sure not every one of them where epic story chain quest. But quite a bit of them where **** good side storys that fleshed out the world. And yes the 2 raids that where in where broken to all ****. But they where there. They could be atempted. And I was there for the first full run on MC. (Sethern troll hunter of Ascent first rag kill) We did not have decursive when we first started making our way threw MC. in fact we where at Baron Geddon befor it came out

WoW had its bugs but they where not as game braking as everyone trys to make them out to be. And they sure as **** where no 2 year old game braking bugs. Again Ask your self why WoW became the top mmo on the market!

And yess WoW was built off an world that was fleshed out a long time befor the mmo was made. But SE has years of EXP making RPG's. You can not tell me they can't make up good lore for a world that would suport the kind of quest content games like WoW offerd.


I do agree with most of the post here, but I am gonna reply with my opinion on this:

I always been a fan to the whole Warcraft lore. Even though some stuff just comes out of nowhere, I do feel like Blizzard have really put efforts on making players to be part of something they build over almost 2 decades. I am a big fan of BC myself, as I was a enjoying WC II : BtDP back when I was a teenager. Overall, Blizzard worked with a base of 3-4 games' lores before doing WoW.

SE had good inspiration from most of their offlines RPGs. But nonetheless, there was no lore to be based on, except cameos of the franchise characters and stuff.

That's where the different lies in lore-depth. WoW uses a 3-4 games/expansions worth of Lore and is able to base content from it while SE builds another World from scratch.

I mean, everyone here could discuss and share opinions about which wins: LOTS of small parts of Lore or distanced big part of storyline ? Both are good in my opinion. Like I said before, it's apples and oranges again.

Like you said, there's a reason why WoW is #1 on the market, but I don't think it's about the lore or the history. I could say that I have a lot of friends that played and couldn't tell me most of the history behind some of the dungeons/raids or about some of the bosses stories, but I could answer some people also cared.

I am not interested about the #1 reasons, actually. My best MMO moments were with CoP back in FF XI and when I played in Outland in WoW. I think that's what it is more important. People just need to stop ******** about who got what better than the other and realize that you won't necesserly get the same things or feelings. Fanboism, on both side, is just childish attitude and put oil in the fire of absurdity.

Don't forget, it's all about apples and oranges. It is, was and will always be what rules about how the world works. Live with it.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 1:17am by MisterRandy

I use WoW becuse for me it was the game that got it right! I know the are difrent games. I just wish SE would have stoped and taken a page out of Blizzards/SoE and to a lesser extent cryptics Play books. No matter what people think SE is not reinventing the MMO here. there is nothing wrong with taking what other games did right and building off that.

SE is veary good when it comes to making new lore from scratch. Look at FFVII/IX. To me 2 of the best FF games made. The storys they made with them games still to this day I think about. Setheroth killing Aries to this day ****** me off. I remeber standing in frunt of my TV shouting profanity at Setheroth during the final fight. No other bad guy in the history of games invoked so much emotion in me. Look at vagrent story! The family death seen is burnt into my mind! SE is great when it comes to lore. I just feel they droped the ball this time. And really the lore is there to me it is just not presented in the game.



Just wanted to say I wasn't pointing out anything bad from your post. I used your post to point out to everyone ******** around about the differences between "fruits" and how an orange should taste like an apple.

I do agree that some part to learn the lore and to participate in more stuff is missing. But the storyline is pretty much good right now. I am kind of late on everyone but the Gridania storyline seems a pretty good one after what I saw tonight.
#62 Nov 26 2010 at 1:19 AM Rating: Good
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3,416 posts
Eh, this update was great, but I still don't see a reason to join back before March.

It's not too little, too late.. it's just too little for the time being.
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#63 Nov 26 2010 at 2:10 AM Rating: Default
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So you're telling me I have to kill 50000000000 mobs which take 500000000000000 hours to enjoy 500 minutes of content? Liek Oh My gawd I need to uninstall now. I logged on for an hour with some RL friends after my thanksgiving meal and we went back to HoN afterwards with rage on our minds. It's already sad to see someone on a forum make an plea to get people to come back to an free game. As much as I want to like the game it's just an pretty game that plays like an f2p game minus the content.
#64 Nov 26 2010 at 3:04 AM Rating: Good
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1,608 posts
Please come back so you can quit again. (this will make them do more, no?)
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