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Sp Gain Tests - Max hp reduced after Patch !Follow

#1 Nov 26 2010 at 3:25 AM Rating: Decent
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My Rank 28 Gladiator had 1620HP before the patch, after the update my MAX hp now is 1390....... i did not change any equipment :/

Also about the current SP gain system after testing for hours (did 16 Guildleves) and killed random none leve monsters !

During Guildleves my SP gain was 130-150 for Blue and 220-300 for Red all leves were done with Guardian aspect
During solo play low Green/high blue targets where giving me 80-95 SP and killing Low RED targets grant me 125-140 SP

Killing Red targets seems silly now just find mobs that is High blue/low green and chain them seems to be the best way atm.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 4:27am by SephNex
#2 Nov 26 2010 at 3:27 AM Rating: Good
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SP gain is now pretty much like FFXI's XP gain which is so much better imo.
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#3 Nov 26 2010 at 3:28 AM Rating: Default
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It is still in the balancing phase, by the time they are done Hp Maxes will be very close (if not exact) to that of XI.
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#4 Nov 26 2010 at 3:32 AM Rating: Good
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You're not the only one feeling the pain. A few mages in my ls lost 300 mana also. But whats done is done.
#5 Nov 26 2010 at 3:35 AM Rating: Decent
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dethbysnusnu wrote:
You're not the only one feeling the pain. A few mages in my ls lost 300 mana also. But whats done is done.


wow that's a lot :o I'm not complaining about my hp but i was just puzzled about what happened, i didn't read any note about HP reduction in the update notes
#6 Nov 26 2010 at 3:46 AM Rating: Good
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SephNex wrote:
dethbysnusnu wrote:
You're not the only one feeling the pain. A few mages in my ls lost 300 mana also. But whats done is done.


wow that's a lot :o I'm not complaining about my hp but i was just puzzled about what happened, i didn't read any note about HP reduction in the update notes


The influence of the VIT attribute on HP and the MND attribute on MP has been adjusted.

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com/pl/topics/detail?id=159e4a58b58fd0214620ec8d64ddd138d5ab599e

In the battle section under the chart showing the decrease in SP per rank...

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 4:47am by TwistedOwl
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#7 Nov 26 2010 at 5:18 AM Rating: Good
*sulks* Yea, my poor ARC lost over 100HP from the patch. But I DO think I gained some MP, strange...
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#8 Nov 26 2010 at 5:25 AM Rating: Decent
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What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...
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#9 Nov 26 2010 at 5:45 AM Rating: Default
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Balancing is the key. Tanks are able to hit just as hard as DD and still keep their huge hp pools. I think it is good that they now have to lower their str and dex in order to get their hp back to where it was.
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#10 Nov 26 2010 at 5:56 AM Rating: Excellent
Sir SamusKnight wrote:
*sulks* Yea, my poor ARC lost over 100HP from the patch. But I DO think I gained some MP, strange...


I'd probably say that those who lost HP during this patch, particularly those who lost a LOT of HP should think about re-assigning those VIT points into something else.
#11 Nov 26 2010 at 6:03 AM Rating: Good
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For me my THM lost 62 hp and I forget the exact amount of my mp now, but it was lower than before. I'll just tack this as a balancing issue that will either be fixed or we will just get used to the lower than before amounts of hp and mp.

Although I do miss my hp and mp that I lost!
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#12Inboundwar, Posted: Nov 26 2010 at 6:34 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) While the updates may be great it pretty much leaded to pros and cons. The balancing system for the status points seems questionable and unethical since the game was meant to be improved and not moving backwards. Vit is the soul essence needs for main tanking damage and health survival. It's also going to be an issue for all mages as well becoming into a Lalafell lacking the health needed for survival, now they're likely to get one shot k.o.'d and leaving SE's "adjustment": to be questionable of stats.
#13 Nov 26 2010 at 6:38 AM Rating: Good
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Inboundwar wrote:
While the updates may be great it pretty much leaded to pros and cons. The balancing system for the status points seems questionable and unethical since the game was meant to be improved and not moving backwards. Vit is the soul essence needs for main tanking damage and health survival. It's also going to be an issue for all mages as well becoming into a Lalafell lacking the health needed for survival, now they're likely to get one shot k.o.'d and leaving SE's "adjustment": to be questionable of stats.

The point is however HP is a survival base both for parties and solo'ing, and it can be a life safer. It made a difference when I was main tanking on pugilist and made a difference adventuring about alone.

SP is another story but have shocked across all linkshells when found out that shell was nerfed and punishing barbs to be only at 20 seconds into being useless. Shell is the abundance of importance against those pesky monsters using elemental attacks (eft thunder cone move anyone?) causing CON to be looked down on it's usefulness.

The next they'll be doing which I'm not looking forward, is nerfing jobs. If they start nerfing jobs, I am leaving the game. I don't like the idea of working on something and then having to switch something else because it got downgraded. I picked my job, and I picked my corresponding craft for that job as main crafter and main job career that I looked forward for many on coming gaming years to come.


I understand, but with almost any game, there will be nerfs to follow. Companies tend to make classes/jobs/disciplines stronger than they need to be at first, so the game won't completely own players. Then, they'll find out what they consider to be a bit too powerful and shift it all.
#14 Nov 26 2010 at 6:40 AM Rating: Good
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100? Hehe, I lost 300 hp from my Pgl. But honestly I don't mind a little salt in a scratch when we got a tourniquet to stop the bleeding flow of everything else. We'll adapt and move on because we can for the most part now.

Things have gotten better :)
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#15Inboundwar, Posted: Nov 26 2010 at 6:44 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) That's absurd. A job is powerful on how you build your character. That was the main controversy issue with the jobs on XI (and even abilities that were shockingly influenced by the activities of ballista) was balancing every other job so that others wouldn't get jealous. This is different. They can't nerf something you worked on FFXIV compared to XI. That's another dedication change you'll have to go into.
#16 Nov 26 2010 at 7:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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Really? Is it that bad that they changed the HP/MP formula when at the same time reduced monsters accuracy? It's just a Balance to make combat act as they intended. I lost 200hp on my PGL and I couldn't care less. Everything feels more challenging and at the same time much more rewarding. Which is what games are all about. Challenge and reward.

The change to SP just means we have to rethink how we pick our mobs and how we fight them. Maybe 15 man groups mindlessly beating on a lizard for 2 minutes isn't what SE had in mind. I for one love the new SP system and find it alot less frustrating than before.
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#17 Nov 26 2010 at 7:26 AM Rating: Default
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GusMorgan wrote:
Really? Is it that bad that they changed the HP/MP formula when at the same time reduced monsters accuracy? It's just a Balance to make combat act as they intended. I lost 200hp on my PGL and I couldn't care less. Everything feels more challenging and at the same time much more rewarding. Which is what games are all about. Challenge and reward.

The change to SP just means we have to rethink how we pick our mobs and how we fight them. Maybe 15 man groups mindlessly beating on a lizard for 2 minutes isn't what SE had in mind. I for one love the new SP system and find it alot less frustrating than before.


The point is there is no point whatsoever to fight anything that is not "very easy" on FFXI standards
for solo fighting easy stuff is the way to go so what is this "challenge" you speak off?
Same thing with Pts people fighting Rank 50 monsters 4min fight getting 120sp each or fighting easy stuff 20sec fight each getting 100
#18 Nov 26 2010 at 8:50 AM Rating: Good
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Inboundwar wrote:
That's absurd. A job is powerful on how you build your character. That was the main controversy issue with the jobs on XI (and even abilities that were shockingly influenced by the activities of ballista) was balancing every other job so that others wouldn't get jealous. This is different. They can't nerf something you worked on FFXIV compared to XI. That's another dedication change you'll have to go into.

Say for example you're a Maurder and you're supporting craft job to repair and make your own weapons is black smith. You find out that maurder gets nerfed on certain performances or attributes that makes you no longer wanting to play it anymore. Then you decide wanting to go onto archer with the supporting crafting of carpentering to do the very same recycling method as maurder.

Would you want that happening? I sure as **** don't.


Either you're being bias on purpose or you don't understand MMORPGs and how they work. Although the word Nerf has natural negative conotations this is usually used instead of balanced when the changes caused the class in question to perform in an inferior way to other simillar classes.

If you have two calsses that only do damage and one of them is changed so that it now does the same damage as the lower class, this is not Nerfing, this is balancing. Nerfing would be if playing each class at their best you werent able to do as much damage with one as with the other.

Although I can't understand what you mean by your exemple I'll try and put my own forward:

By reducing the ammount of of VIT HP gained from VIT SE is lowering the benefit of VIT to all classes but the ones that actually tank, since they are the ones supposed to be taking damage and Phisical defense and Magic defense were increased.

This way, classes that arent supposed to be hit get less benefit from VIT (from HP increase) while tanking classes still got an increase in defense.
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#19 Nov 26 2010 at 9:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Well I think the the VIT/MND balancing they also need to lower the cooldown of point re-allotment.
#20 Nov 26 2010 at 10:34 AM Rating: Default
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Hugus wrote:
What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...


But if this was correct then no one would have an issue with the new SP system, however party play is clearly not working correctly.

Before the update in a good eft party, my 35 lancer could easily earn 18K an hour. I can barely make 7-8k an hour in the same party at eft. I can make a very similar figure to this soloing crappy mobs like doe squirrel and puk in coerthas. This is clearly not right. I am encouraged to fight silly weak mobs but chain them really quick to maximise sp per hour, rather than being rewarded for fighter higher level and harder mobs in a balanced party.

OK I no longer have the mobs giving 0 sp, I also no longer have the mobs giving 500 sp
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#21 Nov 26 2010 at 11:13 AM Rating: Default
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/YAWWWWWWWWWWWWNNNNN a lot of people QQing each time something new comes, the vit/mnd balance does not hurt much, stop whining , you got accuracy problems fixed for all mobs, and mages now hit like a truck, dex and pie now works like it should be, don't expect everything to be the same as first release, shut up. the only problem now is the low sp gain that is still on balance attempts
#22 Nov 26 2010 at 12:08 PM Rating: Good
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SP was overpower before now that it fix u won't be making 18k an hour but idk you guys must be doing something wrong if u can't make 7k an hour with a good pt killing the RIGHT MOB since we get SP bonus
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#23 Nov 26 2010 at 12:45 PM Rating: Excellent
MisterGaribaldi wrote:
Hugus wrote:
What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...

in the same party at eft.

Efts were party targets pre-update because of their high HP and AOEs, allowing for people to hit them more to get the randomized sp gains and mages to get more cures in for SP. There are other mobs that have much lower HP but still give the same SP/kill post update. Party targets are going to have to change, just as sp gains changed. In small parties fighting stuff we used to gloss over because of their low HP and lack of AOEs I have seen pretty decent increases in SP/time. Try experimenting with new targets because now you are looking for the opposite qualities as those efts you are still apparently trying to kill, despite all the qualities that made them good pre-patch grind mobs make them undesirable post patch grind mobs.
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#24 Nov 26 2010 at 12:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Manosuke the Irrelevant wrote:
MisterGaribaldi wrote:
Hugus wrote:
What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...

in the same party at eft.

Efts were party targets pre-update because of their high HP and AOEs, allowing for people to hit them more to get the randomized sp gains and mages to get more cures in for SP. There are other mobs that have much lower HP but still give the same SP/kill post update. Party targets are going to have to change, just as sp gains changed. In small parties fighting stuff we used to gloss over because of their low HP and lack of AOEs I have seen pretty decent increases in SP/time. Try experimenting with new targets because now you are looking for the opposite qualities as those efts you are still apparently trying to kill, despite all the qualities that made them good pre-patch grind mobs make them undesirable post patch grind mobs.



But I have yet to find a party mob capable of giving people 35+ anywhere close to 500 sp.

I am sure they exist, maybe those uber lvl doblyn spiders that die in 3 hits.

But then we have the situation where multiple warriors group together to in effect steal candy from babies.

I'm just not down with being rewarded for killing weak squishy mobs, and penalised for having tougher harder fights.

Seriously, you know of a mob that a party of 35 + can fight and get 500 sp per mob, pls do let us know.
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#25 Nov 26 2010 at 12:59 PM Rating: Good
MisterGaribaldi wrote:
But I have yet to find a party mob capable of giving people 35+ anywhere close to 500 sp.


SP/time is far more important than SP/mob. You may not like killing squishier things that are relatively easy by comparison to efts, but it will be your best method for gaining SP.
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#26 Nov 26 2010 at 1:04 PM Rating: Decent
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SephNex wrote:
GusMorgan wrote:
Really? Is it that bad that they changed the HP/MP formula when at the same time reduced monsters accuracy? It's just a Balance to make combat act as they intended. I lost 200hp on my PGL and I couldn't care less. Everything feels more challenging and at the same time much more rewarding. Which is what games are all about. Challenge and reward.

The change to SP just means we have to rethink how we pick our mobs and how we fight them. Maybe 15 man groups mindlessly beating on a lizard for 2 minutes isn't what SE had in mind. I for one love the new SP system and find it alot less frustrating than before.


The point is there is no point whatsoever to fight anything that is not "very easy" on FFXI standards
for solo fighting easy stuff is the way to go so what is this "challenge" you speak off?
Same thing with Pts people fighting Rank 50 monsters 4min fight getting 120sp each or fighting easy stuff 20sec fight each getting 100


Relax man, its not the first game to change things around and it wont be the last, especially in MMOs. FFXI had the exact same system in place but it was more balanced, and i'm sure the same will happen here.
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#27 Nov 26 2010 at 1:06 PM Rating: Good
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@ Manosuke - sorry forgot to quote

But surely you see how ridiculous that is!

You are rewarded for killing trash that has no chance of killing you and not for the more dangerous fights.

How is that logical, all I am asking

I understand how the new system works, all I am saying is that I do not agree with it and find it strange.

I can slo make similar if not slightly better sp soloing trash mobs in coerthas than I can partying on the mobs we tried, even lemur. It cannot be right that people earn the same if not more sp soloing.

Don't get me wrong, I think the solo side of this game is now fantastic, but I am not sure that the party mechanism is even working correctly. Or if it is, to reward people for killing trash and not tough fights is bizarre....at best.

With a bit of tweaking i am sure they will get the system better, but at the moment it feels wrong and I feel like a bully beating up the weak furry animals.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 2:09pm by MisterGaribaldi
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#28 Nov 26 2010 at 1:16 PM Rating: Good
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MisterGaribaldi wrote:
at the moment it feels wrong and I feel like a bully beating up the weak furry animals.


Maybe that's why they added diremites: giant scorpions certainly seem like more appropriate targets than seven-inch-tall squirrels.
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#29 Nov 26 2010 at 1:19 PM Rating: Good
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KaneKitty wrote:
MisterGaribaldi wrote:
at the moment it feels wrong and I feel like a bully beating up the weak furry animals.


Maybe that's why they added diremites: giant scorpions certainly seem like more appropriate targets than seven-inch-tall squirrels.


Yup you would think wouldn;t you.

But sadly the squirrel army are still better sp/hour than the diremites. tested on the ones close to the Quartz Doblyn in Ul'dah.

Although per mob the diremites are nice sp - will post exact values later as I am at work at the moment, they hit like a truck and there is loads of downtime after each one.

I have tried a small pt on them and the solo sp in coerthas is still comparable. Only when you take into account that by soloing I am getting all drops myself and many more shards, there is even less incentive.


Edited, Nov 26th 2010 2:21pm by MisterGaribaldi
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#30 Nov 26 2010 at 1:20 PM Rating: Decent
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Seems like Zam is the only FFXIV forum that defends the new sp change killing parties. As it stands there is no point to even group up since solo is faster than grouping. This update didn't make solo better than grouping pre nerf so its harder to level now. Cause of this nerf its very easy to see players getting to level 30 and getting discouraged and leaving the game. Players who do Solo there way to 50 will be unexperienced in group and some may just quit due to discouragement therefore killing the player base.

TL;DR This needs to be fixed, I play MMOs to play with other people not to get to max level solo just so I can "start playing the game"
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#31Inboundwar, Posted: Nov 26 2010 at 1:20 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Nope just being honest seems like you're being a **** sucker to SE on purpose. I mean, how hard was it for you to understand my example? Oh hey, let's make the explanation deeper:
#32 Nov 26 2010 at 1:43 PM Rating: Decent
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Ggrab wrote:
SP was overpower before now that it fix u won't be making 18k an hour but idk you guys must be doing something wrong if u can't make 7k an hour with a good pt killing the RIGHT MOB since we get SP bonus



You're clearly not a high enough rank to be making statements like that and expecting them to have any merit. Try getting into the 40's where your TNL is 75-100k and then say 18K/HR is OP with a straight face.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 2:43pm by Furia
#33 Nov 26 2010 at 1:50 PM Rating: Decent
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In FFXI you were rewarded for making a party and chaining Incredibly Tough mobs (yes I know anything above Tough would chain). You were not rewarded for killing hundreds of easy prey mobs for hours on end.

I do not understand the current thinking.

It would be like a party of 70+ not fighting Imp, but going to the Kuftal Tunnel to fight robber crabs, but making more SP/XP per hour than if they did fight Imp

Why do you also think 18K sp per hour is excessive.

Did you ever experience a quality Merit Party in FFXI. Red Mage went from 72-75 in a matter of hours in merit parties where u could easily make 20K xp an hour and required less xp to level up.

As the post above me says, you clearly are not having to get anywhere close to 70k or 100k to level up.

You are correct, I am not either. But I do have a 32 Marauder and a 35 Lancer and getting 18K an hour at 35 was a nice rate of progress, not too quick not too slow. To have that reduced to 7 or 8k an hour means it now takes almost 7 hours to level, where it was taking just under 3. It will only get slower as I rank up as well

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 2:54pm by MisterGaribaldi
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#34 Nov 26 2010 at 1:59 PM Rating: Excellent
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Inboundwar wrote:
[
Nope just being honest seems like you're being a **** sucker to SE on purpose. I mean, how hard was it for you to understand my example? Oh hey, let's make the explanation deeper:

I am Archer & with a craft of carpenter. My carpenter job covers the repairs made on my bow and happy to make weapons I need for it rather than seeking repairs from others or going through retainers to buy expensive weapons. I am rank 25 and have heard SE is going to decrease the stamina and defense because such of that nature they shouldn't be tanking. Because of this change, I no longer want to play archer, so instead, I pick gladiator with a crafting job black smith to cover weapon needs and repairs.

I was right about the arrow capacity for archers and I will be right about this. My argument is sustainable against yours. I really can't stand posts that players follow on every word of SE's decision. You're going to find disagreements, and you're going to find people upset, and you're going to find people that don't want to go back to rank one because their job got downgraded.

How are people going to have multiple jobs on here when people choose to have one job at hand and one craft to support it along the way? Huh? Tell me. What are they going to do? "Move on" and go onto another craft and job? Have you seen how costly crystals are for craft grinding? And seriously, pugilist had the right to have hp as means to tank. It's a matter of principle and logically that people don't want to go into another job after they worked so hard on it. SE's even sponsored that the game was to maintain of having one job to play casually.



its hard for people to understanding your examples becauses you CAN'T ******* WRITE COHERENT SENTENCES.
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#35 Nov 26 2010 at 2:04 PM Rating: Good
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MisterGaribaldi wrote:
In FFXI you were rewarded for making a party and chaining Incredibly Tough mobs (yes I know anything above Tough would chain). You were not rewarded for killing hundreds of easy prey mobs for hours on end.

I do not understand the current thinking.

It would be like a party of 70+ not fighting Imp, but going to the Kuftal Tunnel to fight robber crabs, but making more SP/XP per hour than if they did fight Imp

Why do you also think 18K sp per hour is excessive.

Did you ever experience a quality Merit Party in FFXI. Red Mage went from 72-75 in a matter of hours in merit parties where u could easily make 20K xp an hour and required less xp to level up.

As the post above me says, you clearly are not having to get anywhere close to 70k or 100k to level up.

You are correct, I am not either. But I do have a 32 Marauder and a 35 Lancer and getting 18K an hour at 35 was a nice rate of progress, not too quick not too slow. To have that reduced to 7 or 8k an hour means it now takes almost 7 hours to level, where it was taking just under 3. It will only get slower as I rank up as well

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 2:54pm by MisterGaribaldi


actually the best exp pre-merit was not on IT mobs. chaining T-VT was a better way to go. post-merit, everyone had good gear and of course merits. and then imps and colibri were introduced, and chaining IT became even easier.

this isn't FFXI. they are clearly still balancing the game. and since this isn't FFXI, they're doing it from scratch.

"but they should have learned from ffxi"

this isn't FFXI. new game new system new mechanics new problems.

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#36Inboundwar, Posted: Nov 26 2010 at 2:09 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Go read a book if you want to see coherent grammar, fan boy SE toy. My explanation example was detailed enough for a 1st grader to comprehend.
#37 Nov 26 2010 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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"This isn't FFXI. new game new system new mechanics new problems. "

Actually this is now our second SP system. They tried something new with the random approach, people ******* and hated it, under that system at least you were rewarded for killing harder mobs. But at least under that random sp system I could earn an acceptable level of sp per hour

The system changes and you are now rewarded for killing easy prey mobs.

The difference between chaning t/vt and IT is splitting hairs mighty fine. But this still proves my point. You were not rewarded for dominating the spawn of easy prey mobs, instead t/vt. Currently blue (easy prey) mobs are the best for parties, how is this right?

The main point is you were NOT rewarded for killing easy prey mobs which we currently are and partying was more beneficial than solo.

To have solo play more beneficial is just lunacy.

Yes I know there are balance issues, that is all I am trying to say. Solo is now awesome please leave it alone, please direct your attention to party play as it is not being rewarded enough.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 3:25pm by MisterGaribaldi

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 3:26pm by MisterGaribaldi
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#38 Nov 26 2010 at 5:18 PM Rating: Decent
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Fact is they need to boost the SP gains given by stronger enemies, and enhance the effects/damage of Battle Regimen to make them more appealing. Good parties should be parties that fight tougher enemies, thus challenging the player. An hour long party of fighting enemies that are challenging should be equivalent to a 2-3 hour party of fighting weak mobs mindlessly, at least. For players of FFXI, old ones, who remember the before days, the partying was actually enjoyable back when people fought VT/IT+, the EXP was just not balanced well. Tougher enemies should yield noticeably better experience, just like tougher crafts do, people push to the edge, if they're dieing 1/3 fights, or breaking the finished product, go to something slightly weaker.

I'm not worried about them balancing HP and MP out, as long as they adjust some of the absolutely asinine moves like Impish Incantation and 1000 Needles soon. Too many mobs have horribly inconsistent damage, hitting you for 1% of your health then suddenly for 110%, one thing that was frustrating in FFXI was fighting anything that used magic without someone to cast Shell IV on you, generally resulted in you being 1 shot. I don't mind needing shell/protect for tougher enemies, but enemies that would otherwise be extraordinarily easy, should not suddenly 1 shot me. HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.
#39 Nov 26 2010 at 6:53 PM Rating: Excellent
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RamseySylph wrote:
HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.

They nerfed the ratio that PUG and GLA were having on VIT compared to other jobs (and MP from MND for mages), but don't seem to have affected the already weak (or low MP) jobs.

Basically, the gap just diminished between the HP of a tank and a squishy.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 7:53pm by Docent42
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#40 Nov 26 2010 at 6:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Docent42 wrote:
RamseySylph wrote:
HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.

They nerfed the ratio that PUG and GLA were having on VIT compared to other jobs (and MP from MND for mages), but don't seem to have affected the already weak (or low MP) jobs.

Basically, the gap just diminished between the HP of a tank and a squishy.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 7:53pm by Docent42


This makes me happy, I think I was winging about this exact thing in LS before - nothing is more frustrating than mobs barely chipping away at tanks and one-shotting anyone else. Not sure if they ought to have boosted their effect (I.E. done the inverse of what they did in this patch) but I guess we'll find that out with time. As long as they don't pull anything like 1000 needles on us again, it should be okay!!!! (...)
#41 Nov 26 2010 at 7:06 PM Rating: Good
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RamseySylph wrote:
As long as they don't pull anything like 1000 needles on us again, it should be okay!!!! (...)

Let's see...
Zantetsuken
Everyone's Grudge/Rancor
10,000 Needles
Mega Flare

Yeah, I can see a lot more one-shot kills in the future :P
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#42 Nov 26 2010 at 8:12 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't mind being 1 shotted by Odin, or Bahamut, or even on some occasions a tonberry (I miss the old creepy slowly approach you and doink you're dead Tonberries) but come on, a Cactuar on a lv20 leve? :P
#43 Nov 26 2010 at 10:57 PM Rating: Decent
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the sp system is broke there is literally no rank range you can have a r50 in a party power leveling r1-20s and getting nice sp since the r50 is one shotting everything while the low ranks are getting 100+ sp. there is no party bonus either, in fact the more people you have in party decreases the amount of sp gained
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#44 Nov 26 2010 at 11:09 PM Rating: Good
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Docent42 wrote:
RamseySylph wrote:
HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.

They nerfed the ratio that PUG and GLA were having on VIT compared to other jobs (and MP from MND for mages), but don't seem to have affected the already weak (or low MP) jobs.

Basically, the gap just diminished between the HP of a tank and a squishy.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 7:53pm by Docent42


Not really, I've gone from 1713 HP (R32) -> 1478 HP (R33) LNC. LNC has the LOWEST HP for all DoW btw.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 12:10am by Khornette
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#45 Nov 26 2010 at 11:38 PM Rating: Decent
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MisterGaribaldi wrote:
"This isn't FFXI. new game new system new mechanics new problems. "

Actually this is now our second SP system. They tried something new with the random approach, people ******* and hated it, under that system at least you were rewarded for killing harder mobs. But at least under that random sp system I could earn an acceptable level of sp per hour

The system changes and you are now rewarded for killing easy prey mobs.

The difference between chaning t/vt and IT is splitting hairs mighty fine. But this still proves my point. You were not rewarded for dominating the spawn of easy prey mobs, instead t/vt. Currently blue (easy prey) mobs are the best for parties, how is this right?

The main point is you were NOT rewarded for killing easy prey mobs which we currently are and partying was more beneficial than solo.

To have solo play more beneficial is just lunacy.

Yes I know there are balance issues, that is all I am trying to say. Solo is now awesome please leave it alone, please direct your attention to party play as it is not being rewarded enough.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 3:25pm by MisterGaribaldi

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 3:26pm by MisterGaribaldi


shady113 wrote:
the sp system is broke there is literally no rank range you can have a r50 in a party power leveling r1-20s and getting nice sp since the r50 is one shotting everything while the low ranks are getting 100+ sp. there is no party bonus either, in fact the more people you have in party decreases the amount of sp gained


Except that if you are really one shotting everything, you have to wait for spawns or travel far away for another group of mobs. The SP/hr might not be as good as killing something harder.
#46 Nov 26 2010 at 11:53 PM Rating: Decent
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my friend was in a group with a r50 power leveling just a few hours ago 840 sp/min fighting giant crabs never ran out of spawns got r11-20 24 in 10-30 mins

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 12:54am by shady113
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#47 Nov 27 2010 at 12:55 AM Rating: Good
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Hugus wrote:
What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...


How dare you put logical and rational thinking in the one post!!!!!

STONE HIM TO DEATH!!!!
#48 Nov 27 2010 at 1:44 AM Rating: Decent
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Khornette wrote:
Docent42 wrote:
RamseySylph wrote:
HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.

They nerfed the ratio that PUG and GLA were having on VIT compared to other jobs (and MP from MND for mages), but don't seem to have affected the already weak (or low MP) jobs.

Basically, the gap just diminished between the HP of a tank and a squishy.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 7:53pm by Docent42


Not really, I've gone from 1713 HP (R32) -> 1478 HP (R33) LNC. LNC has the LOWEST HP for all DoW btw.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 12:10am by Khornette


Archer. capped in the 1200s at 30(was 1400s). LNC has more health by quite a bit.
#49 Nov 27 2010 at 1:48 AM Rating: Decent
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Taemek wrote:
Hugus wrote:
What you need to remember tis that although you might get less SP per mob, you now have the possibility of killing them much quicker for the same SP gain.

As such you should be able to kill mobs quicker and gain more SP per hour as oposed per mob...


How dare you put logical and rational thinking in the one post!!!!!

STONE HIM TO DEATH!!!!


Pre-patch, a good 10-15 man PT would kill 300-500 SP mobs in ~1 minute and potentially average ~20k/HR. Post-patch, it is physically impossible for weak mob slaughter fests to match that because you can only claim 1 mob at a time, and it simply takes too long for multiple players to switch targets at the speeds that would be required to hit that SP/HR goal. That is even assuming you were able to find some Utopia camp with 20 mobs clustered together on a 1 minute respawn.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 2:59am by Furia
#50 Nov 27 2010 at 2:09 AM Rating: Good
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zoltanrs wrote:
Khornette wrote:
Docent42 wrote:
RamseySylph wrote:
HP going down doesn't help that, especially for classes that are not tanks, unless the nerf was non-lienar.

They nerfed the ratio that PUG and GLA were having on VIT compared to other jobs (and MP from MND for mages), but don't seem to have affected the already weak (or low MP) jobs.

Basically, the gap just diminished between the HP of a tank and a squishy.

Edited, Nov 26th 2010 7:53pm by Docent42


Not really, I've gone from 1713 HP (R32) -> 1478 HP (R33) LNC. LNC has the LOWEST HP for all DoW btw.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 12:10am by Khornette


Archer. capped in the 1200s at 30(was 1400s). LNC has more health by quite a bit.


Nope, base HP Archer > Lancer, I have both. The difference is that the Cuirass/Sabatons/Gauntlets etc. for LNC give well over 100 HP.

And just so you know my r20 ARC has ~1100 HP.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 3:10am by Khornette

Here, 1124 to be exact

http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/84/53232306.jpg

Either you're not capped or you don't wear anything that give HP.

Edited, Nov 27th 2010 3:14am by Khornette
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#51 Nov 27 2010 at 7:55 AM Rating: Default
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shady113 wrote:
the sp system is broke there is literally no rank range you can have a r50 in a party power leveling r1-20s and getting nice sp since the r50 is one shotting everything while the low ranks are getting 100+ sp. there is no party bonus either, in fact the more people you have in party decreases the amount of sp gained


Rank1->20 are getting crazy SP right now, Current sp system is really perfect it's just SE gotta boost the SP earned Vs harder monsters because there is no balance atm (kill 2 blue 100sp each in 1min total or kill 1 red in 2min for 140sp)
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