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Guildleve are boringFollow

#1 Nov 28 2010 at 10:27 AM Rating: Good
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Guildleve are boring, there I said it. Let's be honest, they are nothing but glorified daily's. They lack any kind of substance and the only reason to do them is because there isn't anything else in the game. Maybe it's time we think about redesign.
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#2 Nov 28 2010 at 10:36 AM Rating: Good
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They already are, Notorious monsters are coming in the December patch and are being added to Levequests.
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#3 Nov 28 2010 at 10:40 AM Rating: Excellent
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I agree the battlecraft leves and local leves do lack story and for the most part are boring. I miss the quests in FFXI which were good at having different things to do and at least some dialogue with npcs. It brought the game some nice story elements to it.

On a positive note, more guildleves are coming so hopefully they will have more story attached to them. As for now I do like the main story questline and think they did that well. Faction leves aren't that bad either.
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#4 Nov 28 2010 at 10:40 AM Rating: Good
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Go form a party?

Rank up your classes to 20 to start their guild quests?

Start crafting and doing crafting leves (which IMO is the thing that makes crafting fun for me since I don't have to hunt down mats for casual crafting).

Farm up stuff and charge ridiculous prices for it in the incorrect ward... but Baazar the same items for a bit cheaper right next to your retainer to give the illusion of a sale...
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#5 Nov 28 2010 at 10:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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PerrinofSylph wrote:
Farm up stuff and charge ridiculous prices for it in the incorrect ward... but Baazar the same items for a bit cheaper right next to your retainer to give the illusion of a sale...


That made me chuckle. :)
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#6 Nov 28 2010 at 10:51 AM Rating: Excellent
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I always hated how formulaic the leves were. first tier was go kill X dudes. R10 was go kill X dudes, but then one runs away, you chase him and kill Y more dudes. R20 leves was go kill X dudes, but you have to kill more because they shapechange and aren't what you thought they were. The gimmicks stopped being interesting when they happened every single time.
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#7 Nov 28 2010 at 11:39 AM Rating: Decent
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KujaKoF wrote:
I always hated how formulaic the leves were.


R30 leves just annhialate you solo ^.~
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#8namasy, Posted: Nov 28 2010 at 11:41 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) noobs always a noob!!
#9 Nov 28 2010 at 11:55 AM Rating: Excellent
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Maybe we should go more in line with how the "movies" portray:
http://www.youtube.com/user/FINALFANTASYXIV#p/u/90/iu3k1uJ-T-4

If you notice guildleve start in the Adventure Guild, not at the camp. So why not have us do the same?

Form up your party at the Adventure Guild, the guildleve assign difficulty based on the number of members in your party, then offer free port to camp. When at camp you use the Aeth to either lower difficulty and start the timer.

Example: You start a party of 3 in the adventure hall, the party leader goes to the NPC and picks 3 battlecraft leve at Dry Bone. You head to the teleport NPC and he then transports the party to Dry Bone. From there you interact with Aeth which ask you select difficult from 1 to 3 (based on party size remember) and then standard leve stuff. When you finish the leve it offers to port you back to camp or region town. Since you have two more leve you chose camp but one member decides to leave. Well you simply chose difficult 2 for the next leve and push on.

Also introduce story based guildleve. You get the guildleve in which the timer is started at an NPC after they explains the problem. This fixes the problem of lack of story based content and continues with the lore of adventurers.

Example: You select the Lore Guildleve and the starting NPC is placed on the map. Jane is ask you to find their lost friend on the street of Ul'dah. When you find him he is being attacks by two thieves (instance battle). After you find him you return to woman and claim reward.
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#10 Nov 28 2010 at 12:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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It's kinda funny; for a while now, people have been playing games that have quests like the following:

Quote:
Oh dear, rats have broken into my pantry and eaten all of my food! Whatever will I do? I keep buying new food but they keep coming back! Please, please help me! The rats live out in the field behind my house. Could you please kill ten of them for me? That would thin out their numbers enough to keep my food safe. I'd be glad to give you 10 dollars to help me out!

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


Usually, this is what 90% of people do:

Quote:
Oh de-{skip}

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


So now we get guildleves, which is basically just this:

Quote:
Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


And people complain that there is no story behind them and no reason to do them.

I mean, I don't necessarily disagree that the game needs more story, it really does. But at the same time, it's funny that people ultimately just boil quests down to "Go to X place and do Y for Z reward" and now that SE has done that, people don't like it.
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#11 Nov 28 2010 at 12:41 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
Mikhalia

Well I'm no writing and hopefully quest won't be written by people like me lol. Just the kill was easy to write quickly. Must be why so many MMO have them....

I'm one of the people who skipped through most of WoW's text quest because it was just kill or gather. Now FFXI which had the CS quest, I loved to read those.

All the CS quest in FFXI started with a single NPC and it could be used the same way in guildleve.
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#12 Nov 28 2010 at 12:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
It's kinda funny; for a while now, people have been playing games that have quests like the following:

[quote]Oh dear, rats have broken into my pantry and eaten all of my food! Whatever will I do? I keep buying new food but they keep coming back! Please, please help me! The rats live out in the field behind my house. Could you please kill ten of them for me? That would thin out their numbers enough to keep my food safe. I'd be glad to give you 10 dollars to help me out!

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


I would like it better if guildleve quests went like this. I am the type of gamer that likes to read what's going on, not click to skip the dialogue. Although there is a few paragraphs before a guildleve explaining what's happening, I just like NPC interaction better.

Call me crazy or whatever, it's just how I've always been. I would welcome NPCs like the rat person you mentioned into FFXIV. :)
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#13 Nov 28 2010 at 1:01 PM Rating: Default
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
It's kinda funny; for a while now, people have been playing games that have quests like the following:

Quote:
Oh dear, rats have broken into my pantry and eaten all of my food! Whatever will I do? I keep buying new food but they keep coming back! Please, please help me! The rats live out in the field behind my house. Could you please kill ten of them for me? That would thin out their numbers enough to keep my food safe. I'd be glad to give you 10 dollars to help me out!

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


Usually, this is what 90% of people do:

Quote:
Oh de-{skip}

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


So now we get guildleves, which is basically just this:

Quote:
Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


And people complain that there is no story behind them and no reason to do them.

I mean, I don't necessarily disagree that the game needs more story, it really does. But at the same time, it's funny that people ultimately just boil quests down to "Go to X place and do Y for Z reward" and now that SE has done that, people don't like it.


Quests without story is like *** without foreplay.
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#14 Nov 28 2010 at 1:01 PM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
It's kinda funny; for a while now, people have been playing games that have quests like the following:

Quote:
Oh dear, rats have broken into my pantry and eaten all of my food! Whatever will I do? I keep buying new food but they keep coming back! Please, please help me! The rats live out in the field behind my house. Could you please kill ten of them for me? That would thin out their numbers enough to keep my food safe. I'd be glad to give you 10 dollars to help me out!

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


Usually, this is what 90% of people do:

Quote:
Oh de-{skip}

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


So now we get guildleves, which is basically just this:

Quote:
Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


And people complain that there is no story behind them and no reason to do them.

I mean, I don't necessarily disagree that the game needs more story, it really does. But at the same time, it's funny that people ultimately just boil quests down to "Go to X place and do Y for Z reward" and now that SE has done that, people don't like it.
I don't really like it when that's all there is to questing in any MMO. The problem is in any repeatable quest, the story is meaningless. It's the unrepeatable story quests from FFXI that I'm missing, like the Mannequin quest line for example. Unfortunately, designing a one-time use quest for a MMO is a lot of involved work relative to how much it'll be used.
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#15 Nov 28 2010 at 1:08 PM Rating: Good
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Guildleves are very boring. They should have just removed them and it would be just like FFXI. The guildleves have stories to them, its just when you are constantly repeating the same **** thing every day for 3 months straight it gets really stupid. This game needs better progression. More guildleve areas then the same 3 places for 10 levels. Good god it will take so long to level through 30's and 40's you will be doing the same quests for months....

Square-Enix needs to add a better way for progression. Cause frankly just NMs aren't going to cut it. Killing the same giant mob for weeks isn't going to fix it.

Edited, Nov 28th 2010 12:10pm by Zalim
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#16 Nov 28 2010 at 2:05 PM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
It's kinda funny; for a while now, people have been playing games that have quests like the following:

Quote:
Oh dear, rats have broken into my pantry and eaten all of my food! Whatever will I do? I keep buying new food but they keep coming back! Please, please help me! The rats live out in the field behind my house. Could you please kill ten of them for me? That would thin out their numbers enough to keep my food safe. I'd be glad to give you 10 dollars to help me out!

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


Usually, this is what 90% of people do:

Quote:
Oh de-{skip}

Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


So now we get guildleves, which is basically just this:

Quote:
Objective: Kill 10 rats
Reward: 10 dollars


And people complain that there is no story behind them and no reason to do them.

I mean, I don't necessarily disagree that the game needs more story, it really does. But at the same time, it's funny that people ultimately just boil quests down to "Go to X place and do Y for Z reward" and now that SE has done that, people don't like it.


Apparently SE hoped to target the types that say "Oh no! Another **** cutscene!" or "Damnit! Quit talking and lemme go kill!" and skip it all then ask for help.Smiley: lol Their effort to attract everyone has backfired in some areas. So far, one of the biggest letdowns to me is the content. Leves are boring, but I get very little out of the story & class quests too. Looking back, I can see that one thing that made older FFs so awesome was that the story made me care about the people and setting involved. The care and attention to detail they put into the work clearly came out when playing the games. They did manage to pull that off in XI, but I'm not feeling in it in this game. Like I mentioned in the old farts thread, some of that may be me getting older & jaded. Though I also think it's the result of catering to that easy-mode crowd.

Edited, Nov 28th 2010 3:06pm by TwistedOwl
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#17 Nov 28 2010 at 2:11 PM Rating: Good
I am not really sure what people want from Guild Leves. They are really there just so the casual gamer can get big chunks of SP in the few times they are able to log on. Pretty sure they aren't meant to satisfy someone who is just going to stand at the desk waiting for the leve timer to reset. I agree with other posters, go craft, start a party, hang out with your LS, and quit griping...The game just started for crying out loud, people want too much. I am sure the game will evolve, if you don't want to wait for that, quit?
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#18 Nov 28 2010 at 2:13 PM Rating: Decent
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I couldn't agree more. They are very boring, and yes I read them all lol. If you haven't already, get a group together. Yesterday I was invited to join a LS and 5-6 of us hooked up and did several leve's each. It was by far the most fun I have had in game thus far.

#19 Nov 28 2010 at 2:17 PM Rating: Decent
agreed with jhariya! I did some Leves with LS members and it made it wayyyyyy more fun
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#20 Nov 28 2010 at 2:23 PM Rating: Good
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One of the things I loved about the FF series is the story content.

This game, hints at a good story at the beginning, but then drops the ball. The first few main story quests were nice, but subsequent ones have progressivly gotten worse, and the time sink between them is very frustrating.

Most MMOs give you quests, and let you interact and learn about the various NPCs in the game, something SE seems to have felt wasn't needed in this game.

Bottom line, this game is a BORE FEST, not only with combat but story as well.

#21 Nov 28 2010 at 2:40 PM Rating: Good
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IF you have hit rank 50 you know the storyline quests got progressively worse towards higher levels.

The best storyline quest i saw was at rank 38. Then the rank 42 storyline quest took 10minutes. Not spoiling any points but it seems like such a waste. You barely actually ... physically fight in any of the storyline quests...

Feels like such a letdown. Thought i was playing Final Fantasty[u]Underlined Text[/u]. guess i was wrong.
#22 Nov 28 2010 at 3:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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I seriously don't want them to add more leves in any shape or form. Please please SE use that development time to make that content in the form of NPC-quests.

It's a completely different thing to do favors for people rather than faceless rocks.

I want to know what's going on in this world. I want the NPCs to have a purpose. I want conversations with them lead into surprising adventures.

I want mini quest-lines like in XIV that had their own stories.

Most importantly the goals of the quests need to be included in the dialogue itself so that I want to pay attention to what they are saying.

I realize most players are retards who want blinking arrows to everything and every action automated so they barely lift a finger while playing a game. But we MMO players are investing a lot of time to inhabit this world. Let us feel immersed in it.
#23 Nov 28 2010 at 3:14 PM Rating: Default
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MajidahSihaam wrote:
Quests without story is like *** without foreplay.


Depending on the couples you brought this up to, I have a feeling at least one person in the majority of couples would say that's a good thing... >.>
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#24 Nov 28 2010 at 3:39 PM Rating: Good
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I'm sort of...fine with it. Honestly I'm doing the Guidleve's just to level. If it DID have story and talking to NPC's involved with it I'd just be skipping it.

I mean even in FFXI I would be saying to myself "how many of these **** NPC's do I have to talk to before I get my reward? oh crap...now I have to go to Giddeus then Ghelsba Outpost...then Zeruhn Mines! and then back to Jeuno!! this is going to take like 3 days!"

Some story based quest are nice (kind of like the rank 20 class quest) but I like guildleve's for what they are, bite sized experience quest.
#25 Nov 28 2010 at 6:14 PM Rating: Good
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Well if maybe guildleves had more diversity then just . the exact same type of quest... Exact same type. from rank 10. 20. 30. 40 when it boiles down to it.

Honestly. The faction quests dont have you do much different from the ones i have done besides talk to a person that makes you kill someone. However, that is a breathe of fresh air. The world seems so.. souless .. :((((((((

SQUALL bring your EMO feelings back !..

oops

Edited, Nov 28th 2010 7:15pm by geotrick
#26 Nov 28 2010 at 7:05 PM Rating: Good
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leves are basically pages in ffxi. both are reoccuring kill x to get y tasks and both are boring. mmorpgs are boring. Let's be honest, you get out what you put in.
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#27 Nov 28 2010 at 11:13 PM Rating: Good
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I view leves purely as means to gain quick SPs and (sometimes) nice rewards. They are basically "Help Wanted" ads if you read the descriptions, so I doubt they could be made any more "fun" even if there were NPCs to talk to or have cutscenes. I do agree it gets boring after a while, but honestly it doesn't bother me all that much, since the fun lies in doing them with your LS. :)

However I do wish SE would implement NPC side-quests like those in FFXI in the future. I mean, there are all these NPCs living and working in the three cities. What are their stories? Like the street kids you see in the alleys of Ul'dah. Why are they there? Where are their parents? Or the NPCs you encounter during the main story quest. There must be more to their lives than standing there all day long repeating the same dialogues to the next adventurer. I still have fond memories of some really touching scenes from some of the NPC quests in FFXI. Short as they may be, the quality of writing was right up there with the main story line.
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#28 Nov 28 2010 at 11:41 PM Rating: Good
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I guess the difference between real quests and Fields of Valor tasklists isn't that the former is that much more fun but it's more meaningful.

When you complete those quests you feel more connected to the goal and have a sense of progression since you're not grinding the same thing endlessly.

When you complete a leve NOTHING changes. The need to make those pies/daggers/kills is still there so naturally you don't get that sense of accomplishment from it. You don't hear that the situation on the Ice Princess has changed nor do you see Baderon wearing any of stuff you've made for him. Nobody is thankful after you've done the leve quite the opposite you're expected to do the same thing again when the leve reset kicks in.
#29 Dec 02 2010 at 1:31 AM Rating: Good
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Just read the Guildleve Sand Yarzon Sweep and it just annoys me more:
"A recent increase of sand yarzon attacks on merchant caravans along the Drybone leg of the Royal Sunway has prompted the sultana's Brass Blades to put out a petition to all those who would assist in culling the troublesome vilekin."

What caravans are they talking about?! I have never see any NPCs outside the city ofter than camps. Wouldn't this have been more interesting after starting the Leve you find an actual caravan under attack and have to defend them?
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#30 Dec 02 2010 at 1:43 AM Rating: Good
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@Mikhalia

It's funny cause in another thread (or was it this one??) I said if SE had pitched me they were going to gather up all the quests in an MMO and make them conveniently located behind a desk in each city - where I can read the fluff of all 8 then head out to the camps to gather the materials and kill the mobs - in a certain light this sounds fantastic!

No more running all over the **** place talking to 15 different people just to find out I need to kill an army of rabbits until some rare drop finds its way into my inventory. (XI, I'm looking at you)

It sounds so good!!!

...but it is pretty friggin boring.
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#31 Dec 02 2010 at 11:05 AM Rating: Decent
seiferdincht wrote:
I seriously don't want them to add more leves in any shape or form. Please please SE use that development time to make that content in the form of NPC-quests.

It's a completely different thing to do favors for people rather than faceless rocks.

I want to know what's going on in this world. I want the NPCs to have a purpose. I want conversations with them lead into surprising adventures.

I want mini quest-lines like in XI that had their own stories.

Most importantly the goals of the quests need to be included in the dialogue itself so that I want to pay attention to what they are saying.

I realize most players are retards who want blinking arrows to everything and every action automated so they barely lift a finger while playing a game. But we MMO players are investing a lot of time to inhabit this world. Let us feel immersed in it.



Couldn't say it better myself!
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#32 Dec 02 2010 at 11:31 AM Rating: Good
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dyvidd wrote:
Guildleve are boring, there I said it. Let's be honest, they are nothing but glorified daily's. They lack any kind of substance and the only reason to do them is because there isn't anything else in the game. Maybe it's time we think about redesign.


I do agree, it is getting boring, but I am sure that guildleves are designed to be repeatable quests which you have in most MMO's except this time there is a central hub for it. And it's not different from the quest in FFXI where you can kill Bubbly Bernie in the lighthouse in FFXI over and over gain for 600 gil I think.

SE has yet to implement a bulk of non-repeating quests, we only get to taste a few of them on the class related quests. I have the feeling that non-levequests originating from town NPC's will be implemented on the March or PS3 update.

Redesign is not the answer, the design is already good, all they have to do is to put more quests that is triggered on a different NPC with cutscenes you used to enjoy in FFXI.

I would also think that if they have added cutscenes to quests you initally do for the first time it could make a better impact on players.
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#33 Dec 02 2010 at 11:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Leves don't need 'redesign'. SE can already do whatever they want with the system.

They've prepared the very basic foundation for the system, from now on it is time to expand on it. I can't think of anything they couldn't do with the system really.
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#34 Dec 02 2010 at 12:06 PM Rating: Decent
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Apparently you are all skipping the stories for guildleves, the text comes up every time you start one. Just because the text isn't displayed while an npc is standing there, doesn't mean there is no story.
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#35 Dec 02 2010 at 12:15 PM Rating: Good
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Some of them give good background too of which the faction leves go on to do. Its not just go kill X and its over, its why you need to kill or in some cases assassinate X. This B'hrenna Phoenixfire is one and everybody thinks its just a rat pack quest, but the person actually turns into a rat and since you fail you have to do it again at r40. The criminal organization one will hopefully be expanded on more, I think only 2 of the big 5 are given leves right now and a few associates.

If you think about how the leves tie into the story some leves are actually beneficial or detrimental based on your nationality to do, but I guess that's another matter. A lot of leves opened up at 30 for me so I am enjoying testing them out, even though they crush me.
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