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Is Final Fantasy XIV following Final Fantasy lore?Follow

#1 Nov 30 2010 at 3:47 PM Rating: Good
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Just wondering from the people who know more about the game if SE is turning away from it's usual staple final fantasy stuff? For example I do not remember any of these classes in the old final fantasy's, the only thing that reminds me of the series are Chocobo's and a few mobs that were in the old ones (Cactuar's come to mind). So for the people who know more than me or do data mining on the game, is it going to have the old Gods/summons in the game like Shiva and Ifrit and maybe bosses like Cerberus etc? The lore of this series is what always had me coming back and it would make me sad if this game wasn't going to have any of it! Thanks for any replies!
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#2 Nov 30 2010 at 3:53 PM Rating: Good
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Without data mining i can say yes to your question TC and with data mining I once posted pics of summons on here that are in the game, lemme see if i can find em... here they are:

Screenshot

Screenshot

...and in all reality apart from chocobos, mobs, summons and cid what IS FF lore? i'm sure these all make an appearance in game.
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#3 Nov 30 2010 at 3:53 PM Rating: Decent
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Tifa<3 (FF7) was a pugilist.
And from what I can remember I think in FF2 any character could use any weapon type at any time and earned proficiency the more they used a weapon type. Classless class system.

Edited, Nov 30th 2010 4:57pm by GoGoStarsfall
#4 Nov 30 2010 at 3:54 PM Rating: Decent
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SolidMack wrote:
Without data mining i can say yes to your question TC and with data mining I once posted pics of summons on here that are in the game, lemme see if i can find em... here they are:

Screenshot

Screenshot

...and in all reality apart from chocobos, mobs, summons and cid what IS FF lore? i'm sure these all make an appearance in game.



Holy crap those look amazing, thanks so much for posting those pics!
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#5 Nov 30 2010 at 3:56 PM Rating: Decent
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no problemo!
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#6 Nov 30 2010 at 3:58 PM Rating: Good
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In my opinion, to be a Final Fantasy game, only needs to start with things:

1. Chocobos, moogles, cactuars and tonberries.
2. 4 main classes: A weapon fighter, a mage in black arts, a mage in white arts, and a barehand fighter.
3. A character named Cid.

The rest of the game can be totally different from each game to game, with less or more things, but still a Final Fantasy.
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#7 Nov 30 2010 at 3:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Won't Arcanists be the Summoners? That was my impression from visiting the guild.
#8 Nov 30 2010 at 3:59 PM Rating: Good
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My impression of final fantasy was that the lore is dynamic. The games rarely even took place on the same worlds and almost never with the same characters - but the glue that held them together was as you said, the summons, the classes, the monsters, the spells, names of items, combat mechanics, etc.

It seems difficult for such a franchise to depart from its own lore because that lore isnt the history of a planet or a country or even a single character. FF lore is more like a series of naming conventions, ones that seem to have been pretty faithfully followed this far.
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#9 Nov 30 2010 at 3:59 PM Rating: Default
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RdeLeo wrote:
In my opinion, to be a Final Fantasy game, only needs to start with things:

1. Chocobos, moogles, cactuars and tonberries.
2. 4 main classes: A weapon fighter, a mage in black arts, a mage in white arts, and a barehand fighter.
3. A character named Cid.

The rest of the game can be totally different from each game to game, with less or more things, but still a Final Fantasy.


it is really sad that a character named cid is required for the game to be FF
but its so **** true
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#10 Nov 30 2010 at 4:04 PM Rating: Good
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There's the Matsuno line (the one who designed FFXII, Tactics etc. very political in theme). The Kitase line (produces and directs the more flamboyant titles) and Sakaguchi/Tanaka I would suggest the more serious as well as jovial (gallow's humor) titles.

XVI seems to be a mix, but mostly it seems like it pays homage to Matsuno, with a hint of Tanaka (well obviously).

There's a lot of politics here but also in art style and job classes seem to both borrow heavily from the more medieval stylings of the Tactics series. Heck, tell me Balthier wouldn't fit in, in FFXIV.

So, in short, yeah it does fit in with the 'lore' or as much as a 'style' if there was one in FF.


EDIT: And of course as other's have mentioned, devices like Chocobos, airships, big swords and the like.

Edited, Nov 30th 2010 5:05pm by Kierk
#11 Nov 30 2010 at 4:04 PM Rating: Decent
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OHOHOH and....
the Bad Guy is not the REAL Bad Guy. Fake Bad Guy dies and then Real Bad Guy, who is a demon destroys you're family, then the world! (this is fun lol :P)
#12 Nov 30 2010 at 4:09 PM Rating: Decent
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oh, and forgot to mention, it has something to do with crystals or orbs.
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#13 Nov 30 2010 at 4:13 PM Rating: Decent
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SolidMack wrote:
Without data mining i can say yes to your question TC and with data mining I once posted pics of summons on here that are in the game, lemme see if i can find em... here they are:

[img=177614]

[img=177615]

...and in all reality apart from chocobos, mobs, summons and cid what IS FF lore? i'm sure these all make an appearance in game.

WHERE the heck did you find those !? O.O WOAH! I wanna see them on my own eyes, i hope they are still in game D:
#14 Nov 30 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Decent
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EmiyaShirou wrote:
WHERE the heck did you find those !? O.O WOAH! I wanna see them on my own eyes, i hope they are still in game D:


The big fat guy in the bottom pic can be seen in the Making-of video. I think in the chapter about character creations.
#15 Nov 30 2010 at 4:20 PM Rating: Decent
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I found the images, not the summons...someone during beta data mined those so they are def. in game just not implemented yet...most likely they are either bosses or maybe we are getting a summoner at some point in time....which would be awesomeee.
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#16 Nov 30 2010 at 4:28 PM Rating: Decent
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GoGoStarsfall wrote:
The big fat guy in the bottom pic can be seen in the Making-of video. I think in the chapter about character creations.
Looks like Titan to me.

SolidMack wrote:
they are def. in game just not implemented yet...most likely they are either bosses or maybe we are getting a summoner at some point in time....which would be awesomeee.
Ifrit is already ingame in several cutscenes.
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#17 Nov 30 2010 at 4:37 PM Rating: Good
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How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...
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#18 Nov 30 2010 at 4:45 PM Rating: Good
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TwistedOwl wrote:
How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...


As in.....FFXII?:D I absolutely loved that game, I wish they had made FFXIV in Ivalice universe, would've been the perfect game for me.
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#19 Nov 30 2010 at 4:50 PM Rating: Good
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TwistedOwl wrote:
How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...


"Big bad empire" reminds me also that there's also big overall themes of saving the world in 'other' ways; ecology. And of course obvious themes of love and a 'conservative' notion of retaining culture, and 'looking to the past' for answers.

Also a "crazy" evil villain.

And androgynous lead character. lol.
#20 Nov 30 2010 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...


As in.....FFXII?:D I absolutely loved that game, I wish they had made FFXIV in Ivalice universe, would've been the perfect game for me.


I absolutely agree with that. We could have had a much larger range of races as well, Nu Mou's and Bangaa? Yes please! And hey to compete with cute cat girls you could have cute bunny girls (Viera).

I'm still hoping we can see a cid somewhere in here. The game feels like a final fantasy to me (for the most part, it is odd not seeing the typical jobs in game), but dammit where is my cid! We need more spiked hairdos and oversized swords for people, also a demonic main villian with a wicked laugh would be nice as well (looking at you kefka).


Edited, Nov 30th 2010 4:54pm by Ipwnrice
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#21 Nov 30 2010 at 4:53 PM Rating: Good
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SolidMack wrote:
I found the images, not the summons...someone during beta data mined those so they are def. in game just not implemented yet...most likely they are either bosses or maybe we are getting a summoner at some point in time....which would be awesomeee.



Ifrit is in game.... just not what you think yet

main story is all i'm saying
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#22 Nov 30 2010 at 4:55 PM Rating: Good
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TwistedOwl wrote:
How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...




we have one of them too that may learn about
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#23 Nov 30 2010 at 4:58 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Also a "crazy" evil villain.

Quote:
also a demonic main villian with a wicked laugh would be nice as well (looking at you kefka)


That would be awesome

And yea...despite all the ******** I can do about the game...it does make me smile knowing there's an empire and wondering what's to come...

Edited, Nov 30th 2010 6:00pm by TwistedOwl
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#24 Nov 30 2010 at 4:58 PM Rating: Decent
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Ipwnrice wrote:
SolidMack wrote:
TwistedOwl wrote:
How bout the big bad empire with its superior technology. We don't know a ton about 'em, but know they're up to somethin'...

Not necessarily a running theme in all FFs, but present in some of my favorites...


As in.....FFXII?:D I absolutely loved that game, I wish they had made FFXIV in Ivalice universe, would've been the perfect game for me.


I absolutely agree with that. We could have had a much larger range of races as well, Nu Mou's and Bangaa? Yes please! And hey to compete with cute cat girls you could have cute bunny girls (Viera).

I'm still hoping we can see a cid somewhere in here. The game feels like a final fantasy to me (for the most part, it is odd not seeing the typical jobs in game), but dammit where is my cid! We need more spiked hairdos and oversized swords for people, also a demonic main villian with a wicked laugh would be nice as well (looking at you kefka).


Edited, Nov 30th 2010 4:54pm by Ipwnrice


IIRC in FFXI the story never really took off 'til rank 5 and by then for you to progress any further you needed atleast a level 50 character and a party of them at that - so soon as they break the level cap for FFXIV I think the story will flesh out more and we'll get into the "epic" portions of it and i'm sureee Cid will show up in some way.
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#25 Nov 30 2010 at 5:56 PM Rating: Default
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There are no set classes in the Final Fantasy series. Every character ever created in Final Fantasy basically just fits into certain archetypes. FFXI just happened to follow in the FFV formula.

As an example, what would you classify Squall as, with his Gunblade being able to shoot? Same with Lightning and her Gunblade? I wouldn't call them Warriors. They were closer to a kind of elite Soldier, yet there isn't a specific Soldier class in the series.
#26 Nov 30 2010 at 6:06 PM Rating: Good
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Most FF games have classes... whether they be commando, ravager, summoner, bard, dark knight, dragoon... most are reoccuring with a few exceptions. Every FF has its own archetype class with few exceptions.

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#27 Nov 30 2010 at 6:12 PM Rating: Decent
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Vedis wrote:

it is really sad that a character named cid is required for the game to be FF
but its so **** true


ZOMG! Final Fantasy I is not a Final Fantasy!
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#28 Nov 30 2010 at 6:18 PM Rating: Good
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KaneKitty wrote:
Vedis wrote:

it is really sad that a character named cid is required for the game to be FF
but its so **** true


ZOMG! Final Fantasy I is not a Final Fantasy!


Well, Cid was added in FF1 for the remake of the 20th anniversary, but yeah, in the original one wasn't there.
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#29 Nov 30 2010 at 6:24 PM Rating: Good
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SoumaKyou wrote:
There are no set classes in the Final Fantasy series. Every character ever created in Final Fantasy basically just fits into certain archetypes. FFXI just happened to follow in the FFV formula.

As an example, what would you classify Squall as, with his Gunblade being able to shoot? Same with Lightning and her Gunblade? I wouldn't call them Warriors. They were closer to a kind of elite Soldier, yet there isn't a specific Soldier class in the series.


Not that I care but there is a soldier class in tactics advance. They don't use gunblades however.
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#30 Nov 30 2010 at 7:26 PM Rating: Excellent
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Baron von Gonzi wrote:
So for the people who know more than me or do data mining on the game, is it going to have the old Gods/summons in the game like Shiva and Ifrit and maybe bosses like Cerberus etc?

Isn't Leviathan seen in a beginning cut scene when you choose Limsa Lominsa as your starter city? You also see Bahamut in one of the trailer videos, you know, the one where he uses his signature Mega Flare to destroy that dragon-airship looking thing.

I mean, I have no idea if you fight them at some point, or if you can summon them directly or something, but at least you know they have some role in the story.

Edited, Nov 30th 2010 8:27pm by KingKon

Edited, Nov 30th 2010 8:32pm by KingKon
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#31 Nov 30 2010 at 7:31 PM Rating: Good
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Lore-wise, there really is no set lore.

Similarities between FF games only go as far as class archetypes, recurring characters, and modes of transportation.
Over time, class/job names have even changed. Many of the games in the series didn't even bother to use them.
#32 Nov 30 2010 at 7:59 PM Rating: Good
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What FFXIV has :


Chocbos -check
moogles -check
summons -check
naming conventions ( cure cure II etc) -check
crystals -check
famous monsters -check
airships -check
evil empire -check

unknown or not in game yet:

cid - T_T


All we need is Cid and it will be a true FF game ;P




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#33 Nov 30 2010 at 8:09 PM Rating: Decent
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I agree that FFXI did take past rank 5 for the story to start getting good, so most likely some good story content awaits us!
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#34 Nov 30 2010 at 9:42 PM Rating: Decent
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It's a bit sad if fans regard the aesthetical elements, such as airships and chocobos, to be the only things that comprise Final Fantasy "lore".

To me, those have always just been the building blocks of a franchise; the rules set and templates that are used to create a much larger game.

In a more tongue-in-cheek fashion, I think GoGoStarsfall hits closer to the mark, regarding Final Fantasy lore. The stories typically follow this pattern:

GoGoStarsfall wrote:
OHOHOH and....
the Bad Guy is not the REAL Bad Guy. Fake Bad Guy dies and then Real Bad Guy, who is a demon destroys you're family, then the world! (this is fun lol :P)


It's a very familiar storyline that is present in a great deal of anime and manga, which is probably where a lot of the story inspirations come from originally, and is also, to me, a great part of Final Fantasy's lasting appeal. It offers a different approach to storytelling that I don't usually get from Western RPGs, which are typically make sharper distinctions between good and evil.

Most of my favourite Final Fantasies eschew the simplistic moral divide that pervades so much of Western, Christian-inspired fantasy and RPGs. Final Fantasy villains (except for the odd few like FFVI's Kefka, who was the very definition of "chaotic evil", and FFVIII's Sorceress), while typically megalomaniacs, tend also to have greyer, more human motivations. Also, in typically Japanese fashion, the ultimate evil facing most of Final Fantasy's heroes is not some demon-inspired Armageddon, but rather usually some deluded attempt to take all life and reality to a higher, evolved plane of existence (which was the case in FFIX, for example, and very definitely for the Zilart in FFXI).

All the above, to me, is what truly makes Final Fantasy "unique" in the JRPG genre. All the other major franchises in JRPG have their own distinctive features as well.
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#35 Dec 01 2010 at 12:02 AM Rating: Good
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I like Undeads that can be hurt with Cure and Revive spells. In my mind, all games should do this, but most don't.

...errr sorry maybe off-topic lol. Just getting nostalgic now ^ ^;

Edited, Dec 1st 2010 1:04am by GoGoStarsfall
#36 Dec 01 2010 at 12:14 AM Rating: Default
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lol.. Final Fantasy .. lore.. what planet are you from?
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#37 Dec 01 2010 at 12:48 AM Rating: Excellent
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GusMorgan wrote:
What FFXIV has :


Chocbos -check
moogles -check
summons -check
naming conventions ( cure cure II etc) -check
crystals -check
famous monsters -check
airships -check
evil empire -check

unknown or not in game yet:

cid - T_T


All we need is Cid and it will be a true FF game ;P






What about Biggs and Wedge??! O.O
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#38 Dec 01 2010 at 3:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Now we have Final Fantasy LORE!?
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#39 Dec 01 2010 at 5:37 AM Rating: Decent
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wait itll end up cid is either over the empire or over its technology and **** have a huge sword ....that summons spiked hair black mage creatures
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#40 Dec 01 2010 at 7:24 AM Rating: Good
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One key point from all other FF games that is missing in FFXIV....

1000 Needles... yes is present but if i recall, the 1k dmg has always been divided by number of party members.
(ie... 2 members 500 dmg each, 3 members should be 333 dmg each, 4 members 250 dmg each)

In XIV.... you could have 15 members... everyone of them take 1k dmg... NOT COOL! This destroys mages with lower HP.
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#41 Dec 01 2010 at 8:50 AM Rating: Good
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Cid is in FFXIV.

He was crafting next to me yesterday.
#42 Dec 01 2010 at 10:17 AM Rating: Decent
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The job classes were technically featured in the original Final Fantasy 2, some in 3 and 5, and the Tactics Advances as well. Kindly waiting for Epistlist and Assassin myself :D if they do add them. As for the leve system, I believe the idea was generated from Tactics Advance and XII as well.
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#43 Dec 01 2010 at 3:08 PM Rating: Decent
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edge1006 wrote:
One key point from all other FF games that is missing in FFXIV....

1000 Needles... yes is present but if i recall, the 1k dmg has always been divided by number of party members.
(ie... 2 members 500 dmg each, 3 members should be 333 dmg each, 4 members 250 dmg each)

In XIV.... you could have 15 members... everyone of them take 1k dmg... NOT COOL! This destroys mages with lower HP.


This does suck, I barely survive it on my Marauder and usually the person healing me is dead after :(
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#44 Dec 01 2010 at 3:14 PM Rating: Good
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Baron von Gonzi wrote:
edge1006 wrote:
One key point from all other FF games that is missing in FFXIV....

1000 Needles... yes is present but if i recall, the 1k dmg has always been divided by number of party members.
(ie... 2 members 500 dmg each, 3 members should be 333 dmg each, 4 members 250 dmg each)

In XIV.... you could have 15 members... everyone of them take 1k dmg... NOT COOL! This destroys mages with lower HP.


This does suck, I barely survive it on my Marauder and usually the person healing me is dead after :(


I always wonder how does 1000 needles hits you if the cactuar shoots it all around...are the needles heat seeking needles?
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#45 Dec 01 2010 at 3:22 PM Rating: Good
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1000 needles talk reminds me of the types of spells/weapons in FF:

Level 5 death

Demi

Cure, cura; Cure, Cure II...

Ultima

X-warp

Then weapons like Masamune, etc...

Also FF usually has innovative weapons and systems for leveling up; gunblade, Edgar's Tools, materia system, job system, grid sphere etc...

#46 Dec 01 2010 at 3:23 PM Rating: Decent
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In regards to the needle-talk:
Actually, only FFXI had the division rule for 1000 Needles, other games had division rules for 10,000 or 100,000, due to it being above the maximum HP pools of a single player character. FFXI has 1k needles due to the lower hp pools.

Edited, Dec 1st 2010 3:25pm by Uryuu
#47 Dec 01 2010 at 6:02 PM Rating: Decent
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SolidMack wrote:


What about Biggs and Wedge??! O.O


I was going to mention them too! They havent been in all the games, but they've been in quite a few (and I love the Star Wars shout as well :)
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#48 Dec 02 2010 at 6:28 AM Rating: Good
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I know we didn't have them in all FF games but I'm still hoping that sometime in the future we'll see the iconic White Mage white & red triangles patterns somewhere, and the Black Mage clothes patterns respectively, even as a tapestry in a building :x
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