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Retainer/AH System Poll Take TwoFollow

#1 Dec 09 2010 at 3:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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The game has changed a lot within the past few months and it occurs to me that my data in the older poll may not be as accurate as it was at the time, so I ask you kind folks:

What do you think is the best direction for FFXIV's economy?
Leave the Market Wards exactly as they are now. I don't want an Auction House.:1 (0.5%)
Leave the Market Wards exactly as they are now and add an Auction House.:7 (3.3%)
The Market wards need some improvement, but I do not want an Auction House.:27 (12.7%)
The Market Wards need some improvement, and I don't care if there is an AH or not.:20 (9.4%)
The Market Wards need some improvement, but I want to see an AH added in addition to the Wards.:89 (42.0%)
Ditch the Market Wards completely and add an Auction House instead.:66 (31.1%)
Ditch the Market Wards completely, but I don't want an Auction House either. I have a better alternative to either system.:2 (0.9%)
Total:212
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#2 Dec 09 2010 at 3:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
The game has changed a lot within the past few months and it occurs to me that my data in the older poll may not be as accurate as it was at the time, so I ask you kind folks:


What has changed in regards to the marketplace?

If you could have waited a week or two, this poll would make much more sense =/.
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#3 Dec 09 2010 at 3:46 PM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
The game has changed a lot within the past few months and it occurs to me that my data in the older poll may not be as accurate as it was at the time, so I ask you kind folks:


What has changed in regards to the marketplace?

If you could have waited a week or two, this poll would make much more sense =/.


People have played the game more and used the Market Wards more, plus the division of the Market Wards.

After the next update, I can always post a "Did the changes to the market wards change your opinion on them?" poll.
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#4 Dec 09 2010 at 3:46 PM Rating: Good
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HAH first AH vote is mine!!! Viva la AH movement!!!!
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#5Hyanmen, Posted: Dec 09 2010 at 3:47 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Three polls in a short succession about the same subject?
#6 Dec 09 2010 at 3:51 PM Rating: Good
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Hyanmen wrote:
Quote:
After the next update, I can always post a "Did the changes to the market wards change your opinion on them?" poll.


Three polls in a short succession about the same subject?

I'll just skip this one, then.


My other poll was three months old and necrobumped.
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#7Hyanmen, Posted: Dec 09 2010 at 3:54 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Even more the reason to wait just a week longer when some substantial changes will be implemented to the system.
#8 Dec 09 2010 at 4:10 PM Rating: Excellent
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I will be surprised if there are any changes to the Wards system in the December update.

Surprise me, please!

Edited, Dec 9th 2010 5:11pm by RufuSwho
#9 Dec 09 2010 at 4:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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RufuSwho wrote:
I will be surprised if there are any changes to the Wards system in the December update.

Surprise me, please!


The only change that I know of is the search function.
#10 Dec 09 2010 at 4:37 PM Rating: Good
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I would love to keep the wards as a structed place to bazaar when logged off, yet have an AH. I truly believe in a perfect world the current system could work amazingly... however people aren't perfect and some enjoy ruining others' play experience and intentionally sell the wrong items in wards, others have broken down and realised people now mostly sell items in the first ward and so they shop there, which in the end caused the honest people to break down and sell the wrong items in the first wards so they could actually move inventory. It's an endless cycle and as much as I love the idea... I agree with everyone else finally, we need AH.

HAving said that the Market wards would be very nice to park your offline bazaar in instead of clogging up various zones and leaving your PC running 24/7 hoping to sell a few stacks of whatever.
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#11 Dec 09 2010 at 4:44 PM Rating: Decent
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Needs an add a simple search to the market wards option. Other than that is good.
#12 Dec 09 2010 at 5:00 PM Rating: Good
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I really want a AH. But, I don't mind retainers if they put A LOT of work into making them more hassle free.
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#13 Dec 09 2010 at 6:33 PM Rating: Decent
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I don't think that having both would work out very well. It would be very superfluous and some people would use wards, while other used AH, and eventually you would need to utilize both systems to view the entire market.

I for one, voted to ditch the wards and go straight to an AH. I don't like the idea of running around to find a single item or 2. Even worse, if i go on a buying binge, I would so much rather go to one place where i can buy everything. It's a matter of convenience, and just show's SE trying to make things more complicated than necessary.

I wish SE could view this, i think if they saw the players are almost overwhelmingly in favor of an AH, they may be more likely to sway our direction.
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#14 Dec 09 2010 at 7:11 PM Rating: Good
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FF11 AH was so good it can't remember playing without it.I've played online games years ago the would send a tell to you anywhere in game when a AH item sold.Getting a tell saying my crystal sheild worth 300k sold for 1.5mil Is one my best tell ever recieved while grinding in the middle of nowhere. A tell system like that would've been insane in FF11.
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#15klepp6761, Posted: Dec 10 2010 at 3:37 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) LOL this poll goes to show how many brain children we have playing FFXIV. That aside, anyone care to explain to me how an AH and the market wards together would do anything other than be a waste of time, space, resources and.. well just about everything?
#16 Dec 10 2010 at 10:55 AM Rating: Good
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When I first heard about the market wards I thought they were a good idea...to replace individual's bazaars which would nicely compliment a full service AH. I'm convinced the ward system will never stand on its own because there is no reliable way to find items you want. That is extremely important in an MMO, I also miss being able to scout new equipment that I want for my character in one place instead of having to look things up on third party websites. Even if you add a search function it will be absurdly laborious when essentially it would be the same as an AH with more walking/zoning needed.
#17 Dec 10 2010 at 10:58 AM Rating: Excellent
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I sincerely hope your 10k title is Pollinator Smiley: tongue
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#18 Dec 10 2010 at 11:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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Wint wrote:
I sincerely hope your 10k title is Pollinator Smiley: tongue


That will just make him sound like some kind of bee.
#19 Dec 10 2010 at 11:13 AM Rating: Excellent
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Geffe the Meaningless wrote:
Wint wrote:
I sincerely hope your 10k title is Pollinator Smiley: tongue


That will just make him sound like some kind of bee.


I know. It would be an appropriate punishment Smiley: nod
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#20Vindrax, Posted: Dec 10 2010 at 11:25 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) lol @ the people who want to keep the wards, who the **** is going to use them when the AH arrives?
#21 Dec 10 2010 at 12:08 PM Rating: Decent
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Vindrax wrote:
lol @ the people who want to keep the wards, who the **** is going to use them when the AH arrives?


I would. I don't mind leaving my PC on 24/7 but I wouldn't want to more or less dedicate it to Bazaaring when I'm off. The wards are an excellent method to bazaar while not logged into the game... ie: Not taxing server or personal PC resources.

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#22Vindrax, Posted: Dec 10 2010 at 12:21 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Do you understand what an AH is? We wont need bazaars or wards any more, they well be entirely redundant.
#23 Dec 10 2010 at 12:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Vindrax wrote:
PerrinofSylph wrote:
Vindrax wrote:
lol @ the people who want to keep the wards, who the **** is going to use them when the AH arrives?


I would. I don't mind leaving my PC on 24/7 but I wouldn't want to more or less dedicate it to Bazaaring when I'm off. The wards are an excellent method to bazaar while not logged into the game... ie: Not taxing server or personal PC resources.




Do you understand what an AH is? We wont need bazaars or wards any more, they well be entirely redundant.


Yeah, thanks to FFXI's AH, we didn't need Bazaars either.

Fortunately the AH saved us from having a couple dozen people AFK bazaaring goods just outside of Jeuno.

Oh wait.

Edited, Dec 10th 2010 1:27pm by Mikhalia
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#24 Dec 10 2010 at 12:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
Yeah, thanks to FFXI's AH, we didn't need Bazaars either.

Fortunately the AH saved us from having a couple dozen people AFK bazaaring goods just outside of Jeuno.

Oh wait.


Thanks Mikhalia, I didn't want to type all that anyway ^.~
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#25 Dec 10 2010 at 1:02 PM Rating: Good
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Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
Vindrax wrote:
PerrinofSylph wrote:
Vindrax wrote:
lol @ the people who want to keep the wards, who the **** is going to use them when the AH arrives?


I would. I don't mind leaving my PC on 24/7 but I wouldn't want to more or less dedicate it to Bazaaring when I'm off. The wards are an excellent method to bazaar while not logged into the game... ie: Not taxing server or personal PC resources.




Do you understand what an AH is? We wont need bazaars or wards any more, they well be entirely redundant.


Yeah, thanks to FFXI's AH, we didn't need Bazaars either.

Fortunately the AH saved us from having a couple dozen people AFK bazaaring goods just outside of Jeuno.

Oh wait.

Edited, Dec 10th 2010 1:27pm by Mikhalia

Didn't a lot of that start off because of the crappy 7 slots on the AH and stuff that wasn't able to be sold on the AH?
I would've liked to see what their version of a search function before I chose and I would've chosen to have both but at this point in time I have to go with dropping it and going with an AH. If they get an AH up and running and they still want to have a place to AFK bazaar than that's fine but they are going to be spread thin on whatever changes they are planning to make so I'd rather they only concentrate on one for now. Besides, wasn't much of the way the wards are set up to give players incentive to spend IRL money to get additional retainers? I've little doubt that's why they drag their feet the way they do about the wards in general.
#26 Dec 10 2010 at 1:13 PM Rating: Good
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I chose "improve wards/add AH"...

But I don't want a flat-out import of the FFXI-style AH. I actually would rather see something that works in conjunction with the market wards and retainer system... perhaps adding the option of "auction" to sell/buy/seek repairs for your retainer's bazaar.

Just a thought, hopefully they'll come up with something good.
#27 Dec 10 2010 at 1:49 PM Rating: Good
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I chose this "The Market Wards need some improvement, but I want to see an AH added in addition to the Wards" because I think if SE could make these compliment each other in a good way then that would be great. I don't want the same so having both would be different and interesting to me if they could link them in some effective manner.
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#28 Dec 10 2010 at 1:57 PM Rating: Good
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MrTalos wrote:
Mikhalia the Picky wrote:
Vindrax wrote:
PerrinofSylph wrote:
Vindrax wrote:
lol @ the people who want to keep the wards, who the **** is going to use them when the AH arrives?


I would. I don't mind leaving my PC on 24/7 but I wouldn't want to more or less dedicate it to Bazaaring when I'm off. The wards are an excellent method to bazaar while not logged into the game... ie: Not taxing server or personal PC resources.




Do you understand what an AH is? We wont need bazaars or wards any more, they well be entirely redundant.


Yeah, thanks to FFXI's AH, we didn't need Bazaars either.

Fortunately the AH saved us from having a couple dozen people AFK bazaaring goods just outside of Jeuno.

Oh wait.

Edited, Dec 10th 2010 1:27pm by Mikhalia

Didn't a lot of that start off because of the crappy 7 slots on the AH and stuff that wasn't able to be sold on the AH?


Bazaars in FFXI were more for luxury items that would cost a boatload to list on AH due to auction fees, and stuff that couldn't be listed period (dynamis currency is one that comes to mind, but probably outdated now). The 7 slot thing had some to do with it too, but that was mostly what I saw outside Jeuno.
#29 Dec 10 2010 at 4:41 PM Rating: Decent
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BlueDolphin wrote:
Bazaars in FFXI were more for luxury items that would cost a boatload to list on AH due to auction fees, and stuff that couldn't be listed period (dynamis currency is one that comes to mind, but probably outdated now). The 7 slot thing had some to do with it too, but that was mostly what I saw outside Jeuno.


While it goes against the benefit I mentioned in my earlier post about Market Wards substituting for AFK Bazaaring... in XI I often farmed specifice mats and then sat outside of popular crafting areas with relevent materials at a slightly inflated price. Sometimes I'd wake up to an empty bazaar and sometimes player would have been thrifty and gone to the AH instead of paying my 10ish% higher prices for the convenience.

It would be nice IMO if we had retainer Bazaars only, the only bag icon on players would indicate Repairs requested, and then left an AH for the majority of sales.

Granted I still feel the MRetainer system wouldn't be that bad at all if people actually sold stuff in the correct locations.
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#30 Dec 10 2010 at 6:12 PM Rating: Good
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The Market wards need some improvement, but I do not want an Auction House:

That sums it up the best. I really hate FF11 AH PH should not be there or replaced by Mean. The fact that older items never sold and constantly dumped back into DB and loss of tax gil. RMT price gouge items. Gil is hard to get in FF11 drop rates are horrid and there is tons of gil sinks.

FF14 econ is so different then 11 its much quicker to get gil, drop rates are much better. having rets , seek item, trade item for item and repairs makes 14's econ much better then 11 can ever be.


An alternate viewing mode for Wards is needed. I would suggest a interface like the Char select screen. list of names on the right panel with search options. search @ top, under that playable chars bazaars (the current people looking for stuff in that ward) under that rets that have payed for the stands, last in just a load order (not alpha) rest of rets.
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#31 Dec 11 2010 at 8:11 AM Rating: Good
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I'd change to being good with an AH if they implemented an option similar to what I just posted in Feedback:

Quote:
Ok, so I've been a supporter of what the wards could be since day 1. But I think I have come up with something that would be rather interesting.

What if instead of copying an AH from XI they implemented an Ebay system to work alongside a normal AH, as a selectable option? Let me explain how it'd work:

Crafter make sword of awesome. Puts sword of awesome up on AH-Ebay for a minimum amount, something reasonable. Sword of awesome is, well, awesome, but also pretty rare because ZOMG hard to find ore is hard to find. So lots of people would love to get this and are willing to pay well for it. But instead of the sword going to the first person to bid at/above the minimum, there's actually a timer on the item. There's 1 day before the sword of awesome is distributed and other people are free to bid on it as well, making bids a minimum of a certain amount above the current bid. At the end of the bidding, the sword goes to the highest bidder, assuming the highest bidder is at/above the minimum price. The sword will then immediately be put in a PO box where the highest bidder can pick it up from the AH-Ebay, unless they have a good delivery system in place.

Now I say that this is selectable because it would only be helpful in certain types of items, mainly gear or rare items. No one wants a bidding war on crystals or low level gear. But it does create an option that makes an AH more entertaining/profitable for crafters. Think of it this way, you have your item up on the AH-Ebay, you'd want to make sure people know and are bidding for it, right?


This seemed like the most reasonable thread to put this in in General :)
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#32 Dec 11 2010 at 8:23 AM Rating: Good
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Gadhelyn wrote:
I'd change to being good with an AH if they implemented an option similar to what I just posted in Feedback:

Quote:
Ok, so I've been a supporter of what the wards could be since day 1. But I think I have come up with something that would be rather interesting.

What if instead of copying an AH from XI they implemented an Ebay system to work alongside a normal AH, as a selectable option? Let me explain how it'd work:

Crafter make sword of awesome. Puts sword of awesome up on AH-Ebay for a minimum amount, something reasonable. Sword of awesome is, well, awesome, but also pretty rare because ZOMG hard to find ore is hard to find. So lots of people would love to get this and are willing to pay well for it. But instead of the sword going to the first person to bid at/above the minimum, there's actually a timer on the item. There's 1 day before the sword of awesome is distributed and other people are free to bid on it as well, making bids a minimum of a certain amount above the current bid. At the end of the bidding, the sword goes to the highest bidder, assuming the highest bidder is at/above the minimum price. The sword will then immediately be put in a PO box where the highest bidder can pick it up from the AH-Ebay, unless they have a good delivery system in place.

Now I say that this is selectable because it would only be helpful in certain types of items, mainly gear or rare items. No one wants a bidding war on crystals or low level gear. But it does create an option that makes an AH more entertaining/profitable for crafters. Think of it this way, you have your item up on the AH-Ebay, you'd want to make sure people know and are bidding for it, right?


This seemed like the most reasonable thread to put this in in General :)


wow tried that with their AH. let you run a proper auction, or have a buyout (presumably for common items). really only a few items ever get put up without having a buyout, people like receiving items when they are shopping.
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#33 Dec 11 2010 at 8:35 AM Rating: Good
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KujaKoF wrote:
wow tried that with their AH. let you run a proper auction, or have a buyout (presumably for common items). really only a few items ever get put up without having a buyout, people like receiving items when they are shopping.


Ahh, didn't know that. So in theory it works, but the instant gratification button spoils a nice theory once again!
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#34 Dec 11 2010 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
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The way I see it a searchable market ward is a direct replacement for the classic MMO auction house, and is exactly the way to fight that nasty "deflation" seen in FFXI. This doesn't mean an auction house is redundant, just that the classic MMO model is. An AH that isn't redundant would be absolutely fine. It just needs a different model.

The one kind of auction house I haven't seen in an MMO is the traditional one. You know, where you go to buy truckloads of tobacco or a rare painting by some guy with a funny name. The kind where the micro machines guy stands up and gives people in the room a chance to bid on an item, and when the last bid has been in place for a few seconds, it gets sold. This would be a neat way for endgame shells and companies to sell extremely valuable items, or perhaps for a max level crafter to sell large amounts of high level refined components or expensive equipment. The kind of stuff you don't just go into a bazaar to find.

Of course if even after search is added the market wards fail, it will be time for a classic MMO auction house. Just please not the FFXI one.
#35 Dec 11 2010 at 9:40 AM Rating: Decent
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My need for auction house is really simple, the need to find what I want EFFICIENTLY, click buy and be done, so I can move on and actually play the game.

AH doesn't have to be life-like or be model after e-bay, etc. Everyone that keeps quoting the deflation/inflation problem with FFXI's AH is ignoring the law of Supply-n-Demand. XI's AH is simply a transaction tool, an efficient one. It's the players that are causing the fluctuation in prices not the tool itself. >.>
#36 Dec 11 2010 at 10:54 AM Rating: Good
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Gadhelyn wrote:
KujaKoF wrote:
wow tried that with their AH. let you run a proper auction, or have a buyout (presumably for common items). really only a few items ever get put up without having a buyout, people like receiving items when they are shopping.


Ahh, didn't know that. So in theory it works, but the instant gratification button spoils a nice theory once again!


See its not really an instant gratification thing (I hate that term, its so derogatory and almost never used correctly), its a human nature thing. With the exception of occasionally houses, and other luxury items every purchase we make is simply giving money, and receiving something, or in the case of online shopping and ordering, we receive the transfer arrangements. Sellers also like to receive money quicker rather than later. The style of auction you had suggested really only work out properly when items are unique, and in an MMO, nothing is.

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#37 Dec 11 2010 at 12:18 PM Rating: Decent
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I would like to have an AH that is similar to the real AH. I would love it if there even had a live auction works something like a mini game (I remember there was a AH mini game in FFIX) and i think it would be fun. lol

Apart from that the market ward should be kept and improved. Provide more retainers and higher tax rate for sales registered in inappropriate ward to make it organized. Might as well considered the placement of retainers in the market ward since they will block the path especially one that is too crowded.
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#38 Dec 11 2010 at 12:43 PM Rating: Good
Hmmmm, not trying to change anyone's mind or criticise, just wanting to say this... I like the market wards now and don't need an AH personally. AH wouldn't bother me but I like the market wards and hope they stay.
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